Bitcoin Forum
December 15, 2017, 01:57:26 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.15.1  [Torrent].
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4] 5 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: This rally is a pirate bubble  (Read 8419 times)
thebaron
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 434



View Profile
August 07, 2012, 11:47:00 PM
 #61

If he was going to default he'd just up and leave.

It would make much more sense, if he's really scamming people, to sell of a little at a time and stretch it out as long as possible. It doesn't crash the market and it doesn't look that suspicious.
1513346246
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1513346246

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1513346246
Reply with quote  #2

1513346246
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1513346246
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1513346246

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1513346246
Reply with quote  #2

1513346246
Report to moderator
1513346246
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1513346246

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1513346246
Reply with quote  #2

1513346246
Report to moderator
1513346246
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1513346246

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1513346246
Reply with quote  #2

1513346246
Report to moderator
thebaron
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 434



View Profile
August 07, 2012, 11:47:23 PM
 #62

I wonder if pirate is the US government trying to buy up as many BTC as possible. They can afford to pay out 7% with their fiat.

Let me be the first to have the honor to welcome you to the halls of this forum, kind Sir!

LOL...thanks...I think.
ArticMine
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2086


Monero Core Team


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 12:41:02 AM
 #63

i think if pirate returned everyones coins

Where would these coins come from? After interest payouts that already happened?

If he is short he would have to buy from the rest of us. Who knows I might even sell him just a few  Wink. The latter of course depends on the price. Of course there may be also those that are buying in order to profit from a Pirate short squeeze, so in that sense the rally could also be due to Pirate.
Why would he buy fresh coins to pay depositors back?
If he was going to default he'd just up and leave.

I am assuming this is not going to be a simple grab the cash and run or classic Ponzi type default. Pirate is a lot more sophisticated than many in the "anti-pirate" camp give him credit for. Something along the lines of what I mentioned in your other thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=98225.msg1084866#msg1084866 on the other hand may well be what happens.

Concerned that blockchain bloat will lead to centralization? Storing less than 4 GB of data once required the budget of a superpower and a warehouse full of punched cards. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/IBM_card_storage.NARA.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card
Frankie
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 206



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 01:01:18 AM
 #64

ArcticMine: Yeah, no. Honestly, if he's happy with pissing people off anyway, and contemplates a lawsuit, it's better to just squirrel the money away and blame default on "hackers" or thieving "business partners" that cannot be disproved.
ArticMine
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2086


Monero Core Team


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 01:13:11 AM
 #65

ArcticMine: Yeah, no. Honestly, if he's happy with pissing people off anyway, and contemplates a lawsuit, it's better to just squirrel the money away and blame default on "hackers" or thieving "business partners" that cannot be disproved.

The difference is between a very clear cut and dry liability and one that may take years and an army of lawyers to figure out if a liability even exists.

Concerned that blockchain bloat will lead to centralization? Storing less than 4 GB of data once required the budget of a superpower and a warehouse full of punched cards. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/IBM_card_storage.NARA.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card
Frankie
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 206



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 02:55:07 AM
 #66

There is no cut and dried liability if you can't prove wrongdoing. From a hypothetical Pirate's perspective, the outcomes are indistinguishable, so might as do the one that allows squirling away wealth.
TraderTimm
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2030



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 04:19:24 AM
 #67

So, in one moment Pirate is doomed above $10 - then he's just fine until we hit $13, or is it $20? Wait, I read on this forum that Pirate controls BTC prices, so there's no way they'd be trading so high... oh wait...

This stuff is so hilariously contradictory I can't even begin to laugh enough.

fortitudinem multis - catenum regit omnia
smoothie
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2072


LEALANA Monero Physical Silver Coins


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 04:34:23 AM
 #68

So, in one moment Pirate is doomed above $10 - then he's just fine until we hit $13, or is it $20? Wait, I read on this forum that Pirate controls BTC prices, so there's no way they'd be trading so high... oh wait...

This stuff is so hilariously contradictory I can't even begin to laugh enough.

You're getting the idea...it's all speculation.

███████████████████████████████████████

            ,╓p@@███████@╗╖,           
        ,p████████████████████N,       
      d█████████████████████████b     
    d██████████████████████████████æ   
  ,████²█████████████████████████████, 
 ,█████  ╙████████████████████╨  █████y
 ██████    `████████████████`    ██████
║██████       Ñ███████████`      ███████
███████         ╩██████Ñ         ███████
███████    ▐▄     ²██╩     a▌    ███████
╢██████    ▐▓█▄          ▄█▓▌    ███████
 ██████    ▐▓▓▓▓▌,     ▄█▓▓▓▌    ██████─
           ▐▓▓▓▓▓▓█,,▄▓▓▓▓▓▓▌          
           ▐▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▌          
    ▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓─  
     ²▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓╩    
        ▀▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▀       
           ²▀▀▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▀▀`          
                   ²²²                 
███████████████████████████████████████

. ★☆ WWW.LEALANA.COM        My PGP fingerprint is A764D833.        SMOOTHIE'S HEALTH AND FITNESS JOURNAL          History of Monero development Visualization ★☆ .
LEALANA  PHYSICAL MONERO COINS 999 FINE SILVER.
 
blazing
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 46



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 05:08:13 AM
 #69

So, in one moment Pirate is doomed above $10 - then he's just fine until we hit $13, or is it $20? Wait, I read on this forum that Pirate controls BTC prices, so there's no way they'd be trading so high... oh wait...

This stuff is so hilariously contradictory I can't even begin to laugh enough.

You're getting the idea...it's all speculation.

Actually it is paranoia.
EskimoBob
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 910


Quality Printing Services by Federal Reserve Bank


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 12:36:37 PM
 #70

The increase in price is not due to an increase in the exchange of goods and services for bitcoins or favorable news, the two traditional causes for rallies.

Everyone is buying BTC to get in on pirate's scheme, pirate passthroughs, and other pirate like "lending" schemes.

Obviously earning 3300% a year on BTC is more attractive than 0-10%/year with USD.

The entire bitcoin economy is shifting towards lending and various financial instruments.

If pirate were to default, would the price crash?  There would certainly be less incentive to buy BTC.  Of course, pirate might have all of the coins by then... so there might not be many sellers.

Do not forget, that USD has lost over 96% of its value in the last 100 years or so and only! 33% in last 12 years.
Is it possible, that BTC just holds value better than this green funny money form your dear Fed printer?

While reading what I wrote, use the most friendliest and relaxing voice in your head.
BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
CoinCidental
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1246


Si vis pacem, para bellum


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 04:04:17 PM
 #71

The increase in price is not due to an increase in the exchange of goods and services for bitcoins or favorable news, the two traditional causes for rallies.

Everyone is buying BTC to get in on pirate's scheme, pirate passthroughs, and other pirate like "lending" schemes.

Obviously earning 3300% a year on BTC is more attractive than 0-10%/year with USD.

The entire bitcoin economy is shifting towards lending and various financial instruments.

If pirate were to default, would the price crash?  There would certainly be less incentive to buy BTC.  Of course, pirate might have all of the coins by then... so there might not be many sellers.

Do not forget, that USD has lost over 96% of its value in the last 100 years or so and only! 33% in last 12 years.
Is it possible, that BTC just holds value better than this green funny money form your dear Fed printer?

no
,3400% interest on bitcoins can not be explained by fiat currency growing lower in value
not even at anywhere near those rates
just no
niko
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 742


There is more to Bitcoin than bitcoins.


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 04:48:00 PM
 #72

Alright- a question for those who think it's a pirate and pirate-like bubble: when will it pop? Just don't state the obvious.

They're there, in their room.
Your mining rig is on fire, yet you're very calm.
waspoza
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602


Firstbits: 1waspoza


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 05:14:43 PM
 #73

Alright- a question for those who think it's a pirate and pirate-like bubble: when will it pop? Just don't state the obvious.

2-4 weeks after reward drop.
fcmatt
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1204



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 05:16:34 PM
 #74

Alright- a question for those who think it's a pirate and pirate-like bubble: when will it pop? Just don't state the obvious.

Hard to say. If pirate is actually making real money it would be right after his first big screwup where he loses a large
percentage of the funds.

This is the way I see it. He has a way to make money (i guess). So he starts out using his own. He is making good money.
Instead of him digging up more resources himself or starting small and reinvesting his profits to grow to keep all the juicy
profits... he decides to borrow money from people.

Well I would not want to do this unless there was a large risk involved. Better to play/gamble/deal with other people's
money then for me to risk my own via a bank loan, savings, etc... That would be best for pirate. And the people borrowing
the money to him get ~8% interest per week because the risk is huge. Otherwise interest rate would be much smaller.

Thus there must be a large risk involved in his operations and eventually a string of losses, him getting scammed, or
what have you will cause the problem we are waiting for. Hard to put a time on this and I am making the assumption
that he is semi legit.

If a ponzi or some other type of scam... the math gives good info on an estimate.

██
█║█
║║║
║║║
█║█
██
'BTC MULTI-WALLET SOON'
▬▬▬▬ Download WHITEPAPER ▬▬▬▬

                    ▄██▄
                  ▄██████▄
                ▄██████████
              ▄██████████▀   ▄▄
            ▄██████████▀   ▄████▄
          ▄██████████▀    ████████▄
         ██████████▀      ▀████████
         ▀███████▀   ▄███▄  ▀████▀   ▄█▄
    ▄███▄  ▀███▀   ▄███████▄  ▀▀   ▄█████▄
  ▄███████▄      ▄██████████     ▄█████████
  █████████    ▄██████████▀    ▄██████████▀
   ▀█████▀   ▄██████████▀    ▄██████████▀
     ▀▀▀   ▄██████████▀    ▄██████████▀
          ██████████▀    ▄██████████▀
          ▀███████▀      █████████▀
            ▀███▀   ▄██▄  ▀█████▀
                  ▄██████▄  ▀▀▀
                  █████████
                   ▀█████▀
                     ▀▀▀
e i d o o
██

███▀▀
▐▐▌
▐▌
▐▌
▐▐▌
███▄▄
▀▀███
▐▌▌
▐▌
▐▌
▐▌▌
▄▄███
ArticMine
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2086


Monero Core Team


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 06:20:15 PM
 #75


no
,3400% interest on bitcoins can not be explained by fiat currency growing lower in value
not even at anywhere near those rates
just no

Absolutely. In fact appreciation of BTC with respect to USD as has been the case this year makes the situation a lot worse. On the other hand if BTC were depreciating with respect to USD at a rate over 7% per week as was the case between July 2011 and December 2011 then at that time the 7% per week interest rate made a lot of sense and was perfectly sustainable.

Concerned that blockchain bloat will lead to centralization? Storing less than 4 GB of data once required the budget of a superpower and a warehouse full of punched cards. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/IBM_card_storage.NARA.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card
dooglus
Legendary
*
Online Online

Activity: 2366



View Profile
August 08, 2012, 07:27:49 PM
 #76

at that time the 7% per week interest rate made a lot of sense and was perfectly sustainable.

In a finite universe exponential growth is never perfectly sustainable.

In a system with a hard limit of 21 million bitcoins exponential growth is especially unsustainable.

Just-Dice                 ██             
          ██████████         
      ██████████████████     
  ██████████████████████████ 
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
    ██████████████████████   
        ██████████████       
            ██████           
   Play or Invest                 ██             
          ██████████         
      ██████████████████     
  ██████████████████████████ 
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
██████████████████████████████
    ██████████████████████   
        ██████████████       
            ██████           
   1% House Edge
ArticMine
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2086


Monero Core Team


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 07:49:30 PM
 #77

at that time the 7% per week interest rate made a lot of sense and was perfectly sustainable.

In a finite universe exponential growth is never perfectly sustainable.

In a system with a hard limit of 21 million bitcoins exponential growth is especially unsustainable.

It is perfectly sustainable only as long as the BTC / USD rate keeps dropping at the faster rate than the BTC interest rate not for ever.

Concerned that blockchain bloat will lead to centralization? Storing less than 4 GB of data once required the budget of a superpower and a warehouse full of punched cards. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/87/IBM_card_storage.NARA.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card
MoneyIsDebt
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 656


DIMPAY: Invest for Tomorrow. Today.


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 09:06:46 PM
 #78

Please people, stop talking percentages. "It's impossible to pay 7% a week." No, it's not. Completely depends on how much you lent out , and how much money you're making.
If he's paying out 30k a week, discuss that figure. Is that possible to pay out? Yes, plenty businesses earn that much.
Is it suspiciously high though? Sure it is. But don't focus on the percentage figures, unless you have clear data on exactly how much his operations grows / shrinks / has grown / will grow over time.

bitcoinbear
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 518


View Profile
August 08, 2012, 09:19:54 PM
 #79

at that time the 7% per week interest rate made a lot of sense and was perfectly sustainable.

In a finite universe exponential growth is never perfectly sustainable.

In a system with a hard limit of 21 million bitcoins exponential growth is especially unsustainable.

You seem to be misunderstanding the velocity of money. Bitcoins can move multiple times, so a person can pay out more than the total number of bitcoins if they are also taking in bitcoins.

CryptoNote needs you! Join the elite merged mining forces right now here in Fantomcoin topic: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=598823.0
smoothie
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2072


LEALANA Monero Physical Silver Coins


View Profile
August 09, 2012, 02:07:26 AM
 #80

So, in one moment Pirate is doomed above $10 - then he's just fine until we hit $13, or is it $20? Wait, I read on this forum that Pirate controls BTC prices, so there's no way they'd be trading so high... oh wait...

This stuff is so hilariously contradictory I can't even begin to laugh enough.

You're getting the idea...it's all speculation.

Actually it is paranoia.

No it's specunoia!

███████████████████████████████████████

            ,╓p@@███████@╗╖,           
        ,p████████████████████N,       
      d█████████████████████████b     
    d██████████████████████████████æ   
  ,████²█████████████████████████████, 
 ,█████  ╙████████████████████╨  █████y
 ██████    `████████████████`    ██████
║██████       Ñ███████████`      ███████
███████         ╩██████Ñ         ███████
███████    ▐▄     ²██╩     a▌    ███████
╢██████    ▐▓█▄          ▄█▓▌    ███████
 ██████    ▐▓▓▓▓▌,     ▄█▓▓▓▌    ██████─
           ▐▓▓▓▓▓▓█,,▄▓▓▓▓▓▓▌          
           ▐▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▌          
    ▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓─  
     ²▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓╩    
        ▀▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▀       
           ²▀▀▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▓▀▀`          
                   ²²²                 
███████████████████████████████████████

. ★☆ WWW.LEALANA.COM        My PGP fingerprint is A764D833.        SMOOTHIE'S HEALTH AND FITNESS JOURNAL          History of Monero development Visualization ★☆ .
LEALANA  PHYSICAL MONERO COINS 999 FINE SILVER.
 
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4] 5 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!