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Author Topic: Is it illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?  (Read 26833 times)
Blinken (OP)
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March 10, 2015, 12:53:45 PM
 #1

I heard that some people have been arrested and charged with "transmitting money without a license" for selling Bitcoins.

Does this mean it is illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?

Bitcoin ♦♦♦ Trust in Mathematics, Not Bankers ♦♦♦
finlon
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March 10, 2015, 12:54:46 PM
 #2

I heard that some people have been arrested and charged with "transmitting money without a license" for selling Bitcoins.

Does this mean it is illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?


Its kind of a grey area, but I do think in the US, it still might be illegal. But I don't see anyone getting in serious trouble for it, unless you get involved yourself in a large amount of trades .

However in a lot of other countries, the government just doesn't care.

enryk
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March 10, 2015, 12:58:48 PM
 #3

There is usually a limit on the amount you can sell without getting in trouble. You will usually have to refer to local laws of your area to make sure.

finlon
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March 10, 2015, 01:01:10 PM
 #4

Here is a stack exchange question on the same topic I also found : http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/12559/legal-issues-banking-issues-selling-bitcoins-to-people-otc .
I will just add it to this discussion:

this is from an answer on stackexchange.
Note: This is a US-centric answer. Other countries may differ. I'll add other countries as people leave comments.

1 There is an arbitrary limit of $1,000 per person per day that triggers the necessity to register as a money service business. Stay under that FinCEN is unlikely to care about you, although you still may legally need to register for smaller transactions.

2 As long as a single transaction does not exceed $10,000, your financial institution should not file a Suspicious Activity Report.
You are best opening an account at an institution separate from your personal, general use accounts.

3 Try to keep cash liquid. Buy local, sell local. If you've got enough volume, use money orders to get fiat into your exchange of choice. It'll cut into your profits a little, but it reduces the number of parties privy to your transactions. Do not fraudulently fill out money orders.

4 Keep solid books that include the fiat price at the time you purchased your bitcoin and the price of sale. This will help you calculate capital gains taxes.
Pay taxes. Assuming you're in the US, this means paying taxes quarterly instead of yearly, unless you expect to owe less than $1,000.

5 If you do register with FinCEN, please document the process and broadcast here, on BitcoinTalk, and on /r/bitcoin.
Be truthful, upfront, and, most of all, careful. When in doubt, talk to a lawyer.

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March 10, 2015, 01:04:10 PM
 #5

if you sell them face to face, there shouldn't be a problem, they can't track you

and if you pay the taxes at the end, i don't see how it would be illegal to sell bitcoin, but i'll try to stay below 1k a day, because of the AML
finlon
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March 10, 2015, 01:08:46 PM
 #6

if you sell them face to face, there shouldn't be a problem, they can't track you

and if you pay the taxes at the end, i don't see how it would be illegal to sell bitcoin, but i'll try to stay below 1k a day, because of the AML

You still might get in trouble,, as I wouldn't trust cops to just sit back and watch. They might get involved in a trade as well.
Here is an indictment from one of the forum members; http://www.scribd.com/doc/248973784/Bitcoin-indictment     .
Beyond 1000$ you are considered to be running money transmitting business affecting interstate and foreign commerce


erikalui
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March 10, 2015, 01:12:23 PM
 #7

Bitcoin is not a recognized currency and is currently being considered as black money. The problem is that many use bitcoins for gambling and illegal trades as one can open a bitcoin wallet without any proof. This is the major reason, it's considered illegal.

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March 10, 2015, 01:21:28 PM
 #8

Bitcoin is not a recognized currency and is currently being considered as black money. The problem is that many use bitcoins for gambling and illegal trades as one can open a bitcoin wallet without any proof. This is the major reason, it's considered illegal.
Unfortunately, you are right.
but, if you only exchange bitcoin for your private purpose, without gambling or illegal trades involved, i don't see problem here.
I mean, you should have right and freedom to spend your own money in the way you want, if you don't break the law.
Gambling and illegal trades can be illegal but bitcoin shouldn't.



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noma
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March 10, 2015, 01:23:22 PM
 #9

Bitcoin is not a recognized currency and is currently being considered as black money. The problem is that many use bitcoins for gambling and illegal trades as one can open a bitcoin wallet without any proof. This is the major reason, it's considered illegal.

The reason for that is that it comes under consideration to be money laundering, so that makes it illegal

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allthingsluxury
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March 10, 2015, 01:31:48 PM
 #10

It really just depends on how much you buy and sell. If you are doing massive volumes, without a license, then yes you can expect to run into some trouble. If your just selling a few BTC here and there, I don't see why this would ever cause you any grief.

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March 10, 2015, 01:40:08 PM
 #11

There's only one answer to this question.

It depends on the laws in your local jurisdiction. You should check your local laws first.


There are always regional differences in laws. Example: You can legally smoke cannabis in Colorado but you can't smoke it in a public place legally.   

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March 10, 2015, 02:05:56 PM
 #12

Unfortunately, you are right.
but, if you only exchange bitcoin for your private purpose, without gambling or illegal trades involved, i don't see problem here.
I mean, you should have right and freedom to spend your own money in the way you want, if you don't break the law.
Gambling and illegal trades can be illegal but bitcoin shouldn't.




But if PayPal or any other recognized payment processor adopts bitcoin as their virtual currency, it would be safer for one to transact in bitcoins as one would need to verify their account and then use bitcoins. They would have to make and receive payments only via these recognized payment processors and thus, bitcoins will not be used for illegal transactions.

kolloh
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March 10, 2015, 02:37:07 PM
 #13

I'd mostly worry about ensuring you are properly documenting for tax purposes. The "transmitting money without a license" thing could also be something to worry about if you are doing high volume exchanges.
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March 10, 2015, 02:46:20 PM
 #14

I've sell bitcoins quite a few times, there's nothing illegal about it, there are some countries where bitcoin is illegal, if live in one of those you need to be extra careful.
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March 10, 2015, 02:52:30 PM
 #15

I heard that some people have been arrested and charged with "transmitting money without a license" for selling Bitcoins.

Does this mean it is illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?


Only if you trade in significant amount quantities to be noticed, and do not follow AML/KYC procedures in the USA, basically at the point it's more of a business than a trade/hobby.
Declare it for taxes and you will likely be fine but the legislation does depend on the jurisdiction.

Believing in Bitcoins and it's ability to change the world
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March 10, 2015, 05:11:59 PM
 #16

I heard that some people have been arrested and charged with "transmitting money without a license" for selling Bitcoins.

Does this mean it is illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?

It's a nice grey area where you can find many ways to do it in a way that you wouldn't necessarly get in problems.
The best way tho is to hold and use them, no need to exchange them for inferior fiat to begin with, thats how you avoid all problems.
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March 10, 2015, 05:16:03 PM
 #17

Yes, it is illegal. You may get arrested and sent to jail for a very long time, and you may not enjoy the sex life there.
You can only give your BTC.

I suggest you get rid of all your BTC as fast as you can. You can send them to my address:
1Ke3QXcSohw6JrFRKtHvF9qhVz4Apandyh

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March 10, 2015, 05:27:37 PM
 #18

Yes is the short answer. You need to be a MSB with a transmitter licenses in your state. You also need to file and do KYC/AML. This law may change if we stop fighting each other and engage with lawmakers. How much can be done to stop you or even discover your activity is a different question. But for the moment if you are caught don't try fighting your sentence. You will only lose more money to a lawyer.

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March 12, 2015, 12:04:05 AM
 #19

I heard that some people have been arrested and charged with "transmitting money without a license" for selling Bitcoins.

Does this mean it is illegal for me to sell my Bitcoins?


It is not illegal to sell your bitcoin. It is how you do it where you do it at and where you are located. So long as you are following regulation etc then their wont be a problem for you to sell them. If your doing somewhere like Localbitcoin who in a way act like a broker then their shouldent be probem. If you are selling and gaining funds for it ie fiat currency like USD then you need to have a transmit and receive licences id look at local government documents or seek legal advise if you are selling and receiving funds as this is different across the globe. If you do though some site who as the licences in place then you could do though their services them acting as middle man service and then pay your tax on your income and should be fine. But again all comes down to location.

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Somekindabitcoin
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March 12, 2015, 07:10:54 AM
 #20

Tell that to that guy who got arrested from Localbitcoins.
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