Are you calculating delivery into your Miners power consumption?

[WoodCollector]

I just wanted to get a quick show of hands and some feedback from some of you guys. How many of you that live in states where electricity has been deregulated are calculating in the actual total cost of your electricity not just what your supplier charges you?

For example, my on grid power is $0.06.54 / Kw, that is the price listed on the bills, but when i add in the "delivery / transmission" fees to the total bill paid every month it actually calculates out to over $0.1756 / Kw. calculated by dividing the total bill by the total usage.

I see people all the time talking about their uber cheap electric, which may be the case for the supply, but after some homework find out that 90% of those states and regions that have cheap supply have high cost for delivery so it really does not matter where you live you are not going to get power in the USA for less than $0.10 kw when you do the math and some places its over $0.22 when you calculate delivery.

In short, i just want a show of hands on those who actually did the full equation when they started speculating their profits, and any who are truly under $0.10 with the delivery included i would like to see some proof as i would be interested in acquiring some property in your neck of the woods.

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[sidehack]

The only added fees on my bill are a 5.4% tax. The price is the price, all in.

[adaseb]

I have nothing to say on this topic except that you probably have the highest negative feedback rating i've seen.


JESUS!

[notlist3d]

I factor everything.   All from shipping to fees in electricity.  

Only thing I do not include is if I have to get a PSU.  I will use these in multiple generations of miners.

At 0.1756 / Kw i recommend looking at a hosting center or you though.

[sidehack]

Yeah that's a bit less than twice what I charge for hosting.

[WoodCollector]

I factor everything.   All from shipping to fees in electricity.  

Only thing I do not include is if I have to get a PSU.  I will use these in multiple generations of miners.

At 0.1756 / Kw i recommend looking at a hosting center or you though.

I just had wind turbines installed, there is no way i would mine on the on grid cost of electricity here.

I have nothing to say on this topic except that you probably have the highest negative feedback rating i've seen.


JESUS!

Yep, that's what happens when kids need attention and the grown ups dont have time to sit and argue with them. Also what happens when the kids are allowed to have weighted feedback. CITM's childish feedback alone set me back -800 or better if you use the default trust list which i quit using after i figured out how the system works. I still have far more positive feedback then negative and not a one of my clients have had anything but good things to say, none of which is relevant to the discussion at hand about calculating electricity costs.

Yeah that's a bit less than twice what I charge for hosting.

Not calling you out or anything but after a month long intensive search wherever you are getting your power from is not listed or does not exist as far as the U.S. Energy Information Administration is concerned. Would you mind taking a picture of a bill? You can black out EVERYTHING except the XXXX Kw used, and the "pay this amount" line. Also if you do that would you mind telling me what power district you are on? You dont have to divulge your city or specific location or anything, just the power company as i may be interested in buying some real estate in that vicinity. When i called the USEIA last month they said that the cheapest electric prices including delivery or transmission as some companies call it was $0.10858 / Kw and was in Washington State and that was the data published in January of this year for the annual survey. Not saying you are wrong, i would just like to see it for my own eyes if you know what i mean. Before i start digging through Zillow.com like a mad man looking for real estate.

[Jamphone]

Not calling you out or anything but after a month long intensive search wherever you are getting your power from is not listed or does not exist as far as the U.S. Energy Information Administration is concerned. Would you mind taking a picture of a bill? You can black out EVERYTHING except the XXXX Kw used, and the "pay this amount" line. Also if you do that would you mind telling me what power district you are on? You dont have to divulge your city or specific location or anything, just the power company as i may be interested in buying some real estate in that vicinity. When i called the USEIA last month they said that the cheapest electric prices including delivery or transmission as some companies call it was $0.10858 / Kw and was in Washington State and that was the data published in January of this year for the annual survey. Not saying you are wrong, i would just like to see it for my own eyes if you know what i mean. Before i start digging through Zillow.com like a mad man looking for real estate.

He's not lying. You've got to look county by county. There are a handful of places where you can get energy prices low enough to host. I host too, and also charge my clients a fraction what you pay the power man.

That being said, bitcoin miners have used up the spare cheap capacity in most of these jurisdictions already.

[WoodCollector]

Not calling you out or anything but after a month long intensive search wherever you are getting your power from is not listed or does not exist as far as the U.S. Energy Information Administration is concerned. Would you mind taking a picture of a bill? You can black out EVERYTHING except the XXXX Kw used, and the "pay this amount" line. Also if you do that would you mind telling me what power district you are on? You dont have to divulge your city or specific location or anything, just the power company as i may be interested in buying some real estate in that vicinity. When i called the USEIA last month they said that the cheapest electric prices including delivery or transmission as some companies call it was $0.10858 / Kw and was in Washington State and that was the data published in January of this year for the annual survey. Not saying you are wrong, i would just like to see it for my own eyes if you know what i mean. Before i start digging through Zillow.com like a mad man looking for real estate.

He's not lying. You've got to look county by county. There are a handful of places where you can get energy prices low enough to host. I host too, and also charge my clients a fraction what you pay the power man.

That being said, bitcoin miners have used up the spare cheap capacity in most of these jurisdictions already.

I'm not saying he is lying at all, just that i would like to see it documented and if he would, to know the county / power district that it is for before i go hog wild on looking for real estate in that region. I already wasted a handful of days calling around to providers in Washington to find the "sweet spot", some of them had electric as low as $0.08 Kw, but the transmission fees included it averaged out to $0.10 or higher. I just want to see the documentation before i go through the motions, and to know where that sweet spot is. I can run a fair amount of miners on my 250's but i could only put up 2 of them. Solar is not an option for me and i want to expand a little after i have had the farm up and running for a few weeks as all things considered i will break even in about 6 months on the first farm. Beyond that, its not really about turning profit so much as it is as i think that letting mining go purely commercial destroys everything that bitcoin is. It is no longer a decentralized currency when a dozen companies control 80% of the network, and we are quickly approaching that point. By the time the halving hits, if efficiency, hash rates, and current MFG. trends continue, you will not be able to break even on your investment with less than a $30k-$100k investment and even then only if you have self sustaining power that has already paid for itself or dirt cheap electric. At that point i can easily see 70%-80% of mining gone commercial and with that, i could no longer support the cause or movement of bitcoin as it would not be a decentralized alternative to fiat any longer. Long story short, rather than bitch about how bogus mining bitcoin has become, and how corporate asic mfg's are getting in their B2B only sales, i have taken some extra cash i had left over from wood buying this past year and invested it in doing something about the problem that is quickly coming upon us.

[Jamphone]

It is no longer a decentralized currency when a dozen companies control 80% of the network, and we are quickly approaching that point. By the time the halving hits, if efficiency, hash rates, and current MFG. trends continue, you will not be able to break even on your investment with less than a $30k-$100k investment and even then only if you have self sustaining power that has already paid for itself or dirt cheap electric. At that point i can easily see 70%-80% of mining gone commercial and with that, i could no longer support the cause or movement of bitcoin as it would not be a decentralized alternative to fiat any longer.

Bitcoin was never intended to be mined by everyone, that was known right off the bat. There was a great time for home mining, but it is long gone. I would say 99% of bitcoin mining takes place in data centres, probably more. For bitcoin to scale and actually be efficient enough, it has to be through low-cost large scale mining. In a system that handles the transaction sizes of the worlds largest payment systems, everyone mining at home would be a colossal waste of resources, as it would be extremely inefficient and achieve virtually no additional security of the blockchain. If a bunch of bad actors got together and they had 51% of the SHA256 hashing power there would be nothing home miners could do. (Not that I think that will happen.)

Also, I don't think the network has 12 companies controlling 80%.

[sidehack]

I actually glanced at my latest bill to verify the tax rate so I could tell you exactly what the added fees were. I'm on the local rural coop, and we're a little over 8.4 cents per KWh. Once we complete our expansion and shift up a power bracket (our building is limited to 72KW but we'll double that) it'll be more load-dependent but around 6.5c/KWh when we hit our targets. Even in town the municipal residential rate was below 9c/KWh. I'm in Missouri.

[WoodCollector]

I actually glanced at my latest bill to verify the tax rate so I could tell you exactly what the added fees were. I'm on the local rural coop, and we're a little over 8.4 cents per KWh. Once we complete our expansion and shift up a power bracket (our building is limited to 72KW but we'll double that) it'll be more load-dependent but around 6.5c/KWh when we hit our targets. Even in town the municipal residential rate was below 9c/KWh. I'm in Missouri.

So just to be clear, if you take your bill total, as in the amount you pay, and divide it by your total usage, as in the difference between last month and this month when they read the meter it comes out around $0.084? If thats the case, would you mind pm'ing me the name of the electric company and maybe helping me out on my search for a warehouse in that neck of the woods?

[sidehack]

Yeah, 8.4 cents plus 5.44% tax. If you're on the high-power schedule over 100KW it's use-based but around 6.5 cents per KWh averaged across the month.

[WoodCollector]

Yeah, 8.4 cents plus 5.44% tax. If you're on the high-power schedule over 100KW it's use-based but around 6.5 cents per KWh averaged across the month.

Awesome, would you mind sharing the name of the power company and maybe if i paid you to check out a spot or two if i find one going and inspecting a warehouse or two on that power grid for leaks and building faults? That way i know if its worth my flying out to come check out myself or if its so bad off i dont need to bother looking at it?

[sidehack]

I dunno. Maybe.