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Author Topic: Belaraus (Re: Protests in Spain:)  (Read 6855 times)
hazek
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May 25, 2011, 08:31:12 PM
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even if babies have to starve and die in front me I will not do it [support welfare].

This needs to be nominated... for something. I know! I'm going to save a special place in my sig for the most unspooled quote from these fora. You are the first winnar!

Why thank you! And to show my appreciation of this special award, here's a song for you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHe4OQ4bY4o

My personality type: INTJ - please forgive my weaknesses (Not naturally in tune with others feelings; may be insensitive at times, tend to respond to conflict with logic and reason, tend to believe I'm always right)

If however you enjoyed my post: 15j781DjuJeVsZgYbDVt2NZsGrWKRWFHpp
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shady financier
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May 25, 2011, 09:11:43 PM
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Also, there's no unemployment when economic growth is unhinged. There's only people who don't have valuable skills. It's up to them to make themselves valuable. A man has to sustain himself. It's his only obligation as an organism.

You strike me as very young, so you've plenty of time to learn better than this^

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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
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May 25, 2011, 09:16:00 PM
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Technology is neutral and your little ideological beliefs aren't going to change a thing.

Technology is certainly not neutral.  The widespread adoption of Bitcoin doesn't imply any particular ideology with the code, but it does imply a sea change in the idealogies of those who will continue to use it.  Like any other disruptive technology, you cannot be unaffected by it's implications.  That's why we call it disruptive technology.  I've met many a person with enviromentalist and socialist leanings, but I've yet to meet one that refused to own or use a toilet.  Composting maybe, but they definately owned a toilet.

To paraphrase the Bible...

'Not all dissentors will become libertarians, but they will all be changed.'

I agree, I don't think a bitcoin-planet would be described as Libertarian. I shouldn't be too harsh on you guys, I beleive your fanatical zeal (though misguided in my opinion) will provide a sustaining core for this technology on the long road to wide adoption. Like the CIA funding the Mujahadeen in a way, yeah...

I doubt the result will be anything like what you expect however, though I do think it could be better than what we have now.

In nature everything has a use.

Onward to Kabul!

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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
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May 25, 2011, 09:20:00 PM
 #4

The goals of these discussions shouldn't be to change anybody. It should be about improving ourselves.

A mature thing to say.Smiley

My concern is for the newcomers, I don't want them to think bitcoin belongs only to Libertards and Rand-enjoyers.

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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
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May 25, 2011, 10:01:38 PM
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ITT: liberals who think government socialist policies benefit society.

What rights are they protesting? the right to receive other peoples money?

Wealth redistributing policies break the very market forces that produce wealth. You cry about the poor, etc, then advocate a socialist system which creates poverty and enables the likes of JP Morgan to suck our wealth.

grow a brain and join the dots. you make me sick!

Other peoples money... you fail to understand that the money they are protesting being handed to the bankers is their money, the taxes they paid to their agent their government to be spent on the society in which they live. Democracy is by no means perfect, it's flawed and messy and corruptible like people always have been, but it's better than rule by dictat or the divine-right you Austro-Schoolers effectively favor.

I didn't mention the poor, nor have I indicated that I am a socialist. Your rabid hatred of the poor and knee-jerk rejection of this thing called society has crowded-out your ability to reason.

Yeah, it's their money, which was stolen from them by the government.

You are in favor of government run healthcare and schools, therefore you are a socialist. Seems pretty straight forward.

You seem to be seriously deluded about the role that government plays in society. If you don't understand that government involvement in health and schooling decreases quality while raising costs and if you don't understand how government regulations and distortions of the market enable and encourage the corrupted and parasitic institutions we all despise, then I see this as you main failing. I could accuse you of hating the poor, as you advocate the system that condemns them, but I know you are just another righteous liberal who hasn't thought things through.

Many here appreciate bitcoin precisely because it takes away the power of the government to persist with it's wealth redistribution insanity.

Stop bashing Libertarianism until you can actually make an argument against it. you clearly don't understand it at all.
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May 25, 2011, 10:17:27 PM
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ITT: liberals who think government socialist policies benefit society.

What rights are they protesting? the right to receive other peoples money?

Wealth redistributing policies break the very market forces that produce wealth. You cry about the poor, etc, then advocate a socialist system which creates poverty and enables the likes of JP Morgan to suck our wealth.

grow a brain and join the dots. you make me sick!

Other peoples money... you fail to understand that the money they are protesting being handed to the bankers is their money, the taxes they paid to their agent their government to be spent on the society in which they live. Democracy is by no means perfect, it's flawed and messy and corruptible like people always have been, but it's better than rule by dictat or the divine-right you Austro-Schoolers effectively favor.

I didn't mention the poor, nor have I indicated that I am a socialist. Your rabid hatred of the poor and knee-jerk rejection of this thing called society has crowded-out your ability to reason.

Yeah, it's their money, which was stolen from them by the government.

You are in favor of government run healthcare and schools, therefore you are a socialist. Seems pretty straight forward.

You seem to be seriously deluded about the role that government plays in society. If you don't understand that government involvement in health and schooling decreases quality while raising costs and if you don't understand how government regulations and distortions of the market enable and encourage the corrupted and parasitic institutions we all despise, then I see this as you main failing. I could accuse you of hating the poor, as you advocate the system that condemns them, but I know you are just another righteous liberal who hasn't thought things through.

Many here appreciate bitcoin precisely because it takes away the power of the government to persist with it's wealth redistribution insanity.

Stop bashing Libertarianism until you can actually make an argument against it. you clearly don't understand it at all.

Actually I beleive in a mixed economy. Call me a socialist, I'm not one but I do not consider it an insult. Socialists are proud to be so, and I respect what they're trying to do. Socialism helped rebuild Europe.

Libertarianism is not hard to figure, it's embarrassingly easy to understand the mind-set of the movement...


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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
MoonShadow
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May 25, 2011, 10:18:45 PM
 #7

Talking about a childish response....

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
RonnieP
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May 25, 2011, 10:44:55 PM
 #8

The goals of these discussions shouldn't be to change anybody. It should be about improving ourselves.

A mature thing to say.Smiley

My concern is for the newcomers, I don't want them to think bitcoin belongs only to Libertards and Rand-enjoyers.

How can you compliment one on being mature in one sentence, then call someone a "libertard" in the next? The immediate next, no less.
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May 26, 2011, 04:59:56 AM
 #9

Hazek, that was way over the line.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
Cryptoman
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May 26, 2011, 05:02:48 AM
 #10

Threads like this are an example of why I don't discuss politics with people any more.  Roll Eyes

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Zerbie
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May 26, 2011, 06:39:32 AM
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Threads like this are an example of why I don't discuss politics with people any more.  Roll Eyes

Damn thread went AWOL.  Did anyone take me up on my offer?

hazek
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May 26, 2011, 11:21:42 AM
 #12

Hazek, that was way over the line.

I'm sorry but I lost it. Guy calls me inhumane while at the same time idiotically faithfully supporting ideas that have throughout our history always lead to the most inhumane consequences for a society that followed these same ideas.

I just couldn't help myself. Sorry again.

My personality type: INTJ - please forgive my weaknesses (Not naturally in tune with others feelings; may be insensitive at times, tend to respond to conflict with logic and reason, tend to believe I'm always right)

If however you enjoyed my post: 15j781DjuJeVsZgYbDVt2NZsGrWKRWFHpp
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May 26, 2011, 11:34:05 AM
 #13

Hazek, that was way over the line.

I'm sorry but I lost it. Guy calls me inhumane while at the same time idiotically faithfully supporting ideas that have throughout our history always lead to the most inhumane consequences for a society that followed these same ideas.

I just couldn't help myself. Sorry again.

My beleif is that you are deeply confused and angered by a complex world you do not understand and resentful that you must share said world with other human beings.

Mises cannot help you though, you should abandon that rubbish.Sad

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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
hazek
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May 26, 2011, 12:10:56 PM
 #14

See this? There's a whole country who followed his beliefs into a major crisis where people lost their savings over night and are now going to have to starve, because his ideal world does not work and yet he is unable to learn this lesson and instead will further parrot his moronic beliefs and tell me that it is me who doesn't understand.

How am I not suppose to lose it to a person like that?


Belarus devaluation spreads panic:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Belarus-devaluation-spreads-apf-3127812939.html?x=0&.v=4

Welcome To Hyperinflation Hell: Following Currency Devaluation, Belarus Economy Implodes, Sets Blueprint For Developed World Future:
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/welcome-hyperinflation-hell-following-currency-devaluation-belarus-economy-implodes-sets-blu

My personality type: INTJ - please forgive my weaknesses (Not naturally in tune with others feelings; may be insensitive at times, tend to respond to conflict with logic and reason, tend to believe I'm always right)

If however you enjoyed my post: 15j781DjuJeVsZgYbDVt2NZsGrWKRWFHpp
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May 26, 2011, 12:18:25 PM
 #15

See this? There's a whole country who followed his beliefs into a major crisis where people lost their savings over night and are now going to have to starve, because his ideal world does not work and yet he is unable to learn this lesson and instead will further parrot his moronic beliefs and tell me that it is me who doesn't understand.

How am I not suppose to lose it to a person like that?


Belarus devaluation spreads panic:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Belarus-devaluation-spreads-apf-3127812939.html?x=0&.v=4

Welcome To Hyperinflation Hell: Following Currency Devaluation, Belarus Economy Implodes, Sets Blueprint For Developed World Future:
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/welcome-hyperinflation-hell-following-currency-devaluation-belarus-economy-implodes-sets-blu


Deeply deeply confused. Sad

Perhaps you should start another thread in Economics or Off-topic asking what are the differences between left-wing politics and a dictatorship. I would be happy to assist you in any way I can there.

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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
hazek
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May 26, 2011, 12:32:53 PM
 #16

Saying and wishing I was the one who is confused does not make it so. I suggests you meet with reality.

Maybe watching this will help you: John A. Allison(BB&T CEO) "Leadership and Values"

My personality type: INTJ - please forgive my weaknesses (Not naturally in tune with others feelings; may be insensitive at times, tend to respond to conflict with logic and reason, tend to believe I'm always right)

If however you enjoyed my post: 15j781DjuJeVsZgYbDVt2NZsGrWKRWFHpp
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May 26, 2011, 12:37:28 PM
 #17

Hazek, that was way over the line.

I'm sorry but I lost it. Guy calls me inhumane while at the same time idiotically faithfully supporting ideas that have throughout our history always lead to the most inhumane consequences for a society that followed these same ideas.

I just couldn't help myself. Sorry again.

I understand the frustration of being talked down to about morals by someone who doesn't understand the logical conclusions of what he openly supports, and thinks himself educated enough to consider others to be irrational and uncaring while in reality he is the one who supports human suffering.  I really do.  But he knows not of what he speaks, while you do.  You must keep a cool head while using this forum.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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May 26, 2011, 12:48:55 PM
 #18

Hazek, that was way over the line.

I'm sorry but I lost it. Guy calls me inhumane while at the same time idiotically faithfully supporting ideas that have throughout our history always lead to the most inhumane consequences for a society that followed these same ideas.

I just couldn't help myself. Sorry again.

My beleif is that you are deeply confused and angered by a complex world you do not understand and resentful that you must share said world with other human beings.

Mises cannot help you though, you should abandon that rubbish.Sad

And as for you, you are pushing it.  Intentionally skirting the line so that I don't censor you as well.  I can tell that you are practiced at antagonizing your opposition, but do you have a rational argument to present?  I won't let you continue with your own style of insults for much longer.

And this thread needs to split...

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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May 26, 2011, 01:33:46 PM
 #19

Hazek, that was way over the line.

I'm sorry but I lost it. Guy calls me inhumane while at the same time idiotically faithfully supporting ideas that have throughout our history always lead to the most inhumane consequences for a society that followed these same ideas.

I just couldn't help myself. Sorry again.

My beleif is that you are deeply confused and angered by a complex world you do not understand and resentful that you must share said world with other human beings.

Mises cannot help you though, you should abandon that rubbish.Sad

And as for you, you are pushing it.  Intentionally skirting the line so that I don't censor you as well.  I can tell that you are practiced at antagonizing your opposition, but do you have a rational argument to present?  I won't let you continue with your own style of insults for much longer.

And this thread needs to split...

I feel I have presented my arguments well enough. To the denizens of a banckrupt, orwellian and immoral school-of-thought however, the fate of my arguments on this thread were to pass...


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The value of goods, expressed in money, is called “price”, while the value of money, expressed in goods, is called “value”. C. Quigley
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May 26, 2011, 01:37:22 PM
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Intentionally skirting the line so that I don't censor you as well.  I can tell that you are practiced at antagonizing your opposition, but do you have a rational argument to present?  I won't let you continue with your own style of insults for much longer.

G seems to be presenting a rational argument, albeit one to which you are not receptive. Unless I am mistaken (please correct me if I am, G), he is suggesting that the deeply contradictory beliefs (on many levels) being espoused here are the result of years of indoctrination and confusion. That indoctrination, by its very design, is meant to keep people scared and isolated. To keep them confused. It is difficult to free oneself from this confusion, without some outside perspective.

Let me quote one of the links posted by hazek:
Quote
Ah: "privatization" as Greece is about to learn, the lovely word that describes a fire sale of assets to one's creditors, courtesy of a "globalized" new world order.

This is interesting. Hazek furnished us with an article which I presume was meant to bolster his assertion that unbridled capitalism is good. Yet, this article specifically ridicules a banker who calls for privatization, which again is one of the basic canons of the anarcho-capitalist religion. This seems to be deeply incongruous, and supports the assertion that hazek is, in some way, struggling to reconcile what he accepts a priori (unrestricted privatization is good) and what he observes (economic devastation resulting from unrestricted privatization).

Quote
And this thread needs to split...

Not sure why. Just want to spread the topics around?

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