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Address 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU (https://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU), which appears to hold payments for Avalon bulk chip orders, now holds 67,185.1 BTC which is worth over $8 million @ $120/BTC. With the lack of info coming out of Bitsyncom, I'm very curious what exactly is going on over there. With the additional delays in batch 2 since the April 15th update, something obviously is not going according to plan and I am surprised the bulk chip funds have not been touched considering the first orders were made over 7 weeks ago with a supposed lead time of 9-10 weeks. If they have placed all of these chip orders with the foundry, I wonder how they are paying for them. Any theories out there?

Here's what we know as of today:

- Batch 1 Avalons still not all delivered, no response from Bitsyncom
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=157856.0

- Batch 1 badly damaged Avalon, Bitsyncom replied to say "that's unfortunate, we will work out a solution to ship this one back and send you another." and then no follow-up or response from Bitsyncom for over 50 days and counting.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178168.0

- Batch 2 Avalons significantly delayed and still not all delivered, no response from Bitsyncom
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=167726.1200

- Batch 3 Avalons not delivered at all, no updates from Bitsyncom
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=203745.60

- Avalon ASIC chip purchases started over 7 weeks ago and no sample chips in sight, no updates from Bitsyncom despite Avalon website stating "30 sample chips will be provided 4 weeks into ordering per 10,000 chips."
Of all the Avalon ASIC chip group buys, no one has heard a single word from Bitsyncom about the sample chips

- Zefir's Batch 8 Avalon ASIC chip purchase issue has not be resolved or even addressed by Bitsyncom, resulting in ~$93,000 of the community's money being received by Avalon but no confirmation of the order given by their order system. No response from Bitsyncom for over 6 weeks.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=177827.660


At this point, there is no good excuse for the lack of communication on his part, especially considering the amount of money this community has spent to purchase his goods. These aren't technical support issues, either.

For all the sensitivity there is now to potential scams whenever an ASIC company pops up, why isn't Avalon under the same scrutiny? They've shipped a small number of units, but so has BFL. Is there any way to confirm with TSMC that they are actually having chips made?? So many developers are awaiting those samples.

uhh very good and scary summary.  I already know about some avalon delays, but from this perspective it looks really bad..

Alarming.  He posted regularly right up until april 18th, then only two posts since then, but he was active on the forums the 28th..

The real Q is how to cash out 65K btc to pay for expenses. Even half of that is a lot to cash out. Look at the order book at Gox and you can see thats going to be difficult.

the latest update is from presentation that held place during foundation conference... it was third week of may, yifu said during next couple of weeks they're looking to setup new production line since the old one is only capable of delivering at the frame rate we have seen so far and that is roughly 10 per day including regular delays nye and mayday holidays ... which means do the math... new line should deploy 50 per day, yet no confirmation of the new facility....

both companies are capable of delivering only 10 units per day as it seems statistically so far, bfl with 5ghash and avalon with 65, and apparently neither one   lacks money, bfl is giving to charity and bitsyn still doesn't have to touch the 60k btcs... i wouldn't be surprised if that wallet with $8mil is their profit, on top of all production costs...

I don't know maybe because they don't use multiple accounts and point out the failings of BFL like you are... transparent much?

You can give Avalon some leeway whereas after a 11 months of pure unadulterated BS from BFL they deserve a lot more than the anger of the forum here they need to stop playing games here in the forums and start shipping product. The time for posturing and promotion is over. Avalon will or will not deliver but someone with 7 posts to his name up on every thread? Please. BFL playbook right there. Deflect the attention off their poor record? Think not.

Having said all that, yes Avalon is not really doing it's best to communicate and that is troubling but is it BFL level of BS? No. So stop equating them.

When are the Avalon chips suppose to be delivered? If the first order was 7 weeks ago then delivery should take place within 2-3 weeks right? If Avalon is delayed in sending out the chips then that will end up delaying all the assemblers waiting on the Avalon chips in order to get their miners made. I am a little worried as i have placed orders with assemblers waiting on Avalon chips.  :-\ :-\ :-\

Bicknellski, I assume you think I'm someone else who's already been posting on this forum, but no. I'm a noob who's been researching and reading through the posts on bitcointalk for a few months now. I haven't really participated in discussions, though, hence the low post count.

I wasn't equating BFL and Avalon, simply stating that they have both shipped a mere fraction of their stated goals. Ever since I first came into this forum and started reading all the horror stories about BFL, I've avoided BFL like the plague. I have no stake in the BFL game as I've not put any money into them, and have basically written them off.

This post from FCTaiChi is one I've been reading because I like the spreadsheet he's working on of miners in development: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=209750.0

He recently took BFL off the list completely, which is great for me because I was ignoring those rows anyway since BFL basically doesn't exist to me. Of course, FCTaiChi also extended the estimated shipping dates for any Avalon ASIC chip based projects, which I also tend to agree makes sense as Avalon's history says that shipping dates will not be met.

Bitsyncom sounds like he means what he says and is legit. I hope he is. I have taken some risk and purchased chips in various group buys. I would love to be wrong and see posts tomorrow from BKKCoins, burnin, etc saying they've received sample chips and can continue developing miners. But the silence is unnerving.


tl;dr i'm new on here, but getting into btc mining, so been lurking bitcointalk. For me, BFL = no. Avalon/Bitsyncom = maybe, shipping much later than stated, difficulty climbing, they've collected a mountain of BTC, I've preordered chips in some group buys, developers awaiting sample chips, but no one has heard from Bitsyncom. And we desperately want to!

In the video of him at the Bitcoin conference, Bitsyncom said something about not using online exchanges to cash out. That not all transactions happen on exchanges. He also said that they do it in batches, not all at once, as the orders come in. So, when the first order for 10,000 chips came in 7 weeks ago, this would mean that he only converted the money needed to order the chips from TSMC (or whoever is making the chips). Presumably, he could do that with BTC from a different source than the receiving address.

Something just feels a little "off" about Avalon these days.

Avalon has zero customer service but people are throwing money at them because they have delivered a bunch of boxes? Very few people actually own an Avalon box yet the number of chip orders is ridiculously high. They are interested in making a new generation of chips, why would they want to make hundreds of thousands of chips on a process that they want to retire? It doesn't make sense.

Yes i saw that too. But i find it hard to believe he can move that much bitcoin in quantity without using the exchanges. There really just isn't that much demand unless hes giving a huge discount. And if so private message me Yifu i'd buy a crapton at a discount.

It doesn't appear that they've been able to ship even 10 units/day since they announced they started shipping batch #2 in April. If they were producing 50 units/week using the old SMT line (assuming they work 5 days a week) then over half of batch #2 would be shipped by now. The new SMT line which was supposed to be up and running by the end of April would be able to produce all of batch #2 in a little over 2 weeks so obviously something is not going according to the plan in their last official update.

They haven't touched ANY of the coins on that address, regardless of how they plan to sell them. If they have already paid the foundry from another source then that implies most of this $8 million is profit since it can't cost that much to package and ship the chips. The sample chips are now officially late as they were supposed to ship by the end of last month so I would guess they aren't going to make their advertised 9-10 week lead time. Perhaps they plan to delay the shipment of bulk chips until batch #3 ships which would make sense but I would have guessed the sample chips would be out on time at least. Regardless, all of the people that invested in bulk chips really deserve an update. It looks like BigTimeCoin has already canceled his plans to bring his 10k chip order to market... :(

I just ordered a Jupiter from KNC and I really hope they break this trend of keeping ASIC customers in the dark.

Anybody know how many asic devices are actually in the wild?

I've received my batch #2 order finally, I was considering it was a scam also, but I'm and mining and happy.

That was your first post since March.  Would you mind updating everyone here:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=146451.0

They are keeping a tally of all orders received.  Might help with some of the hysteria going on...

When did you order?

About 3 weeks ago, Avalon was rumored to have sold roughly 20,000 BTC. It moved the market significantly and set off riots in #bitcoin-analysis until someone figured out it was Avalon selling. The evidence was circumstantial, but it would explain why there are no samples yet. I don't think 3 weeks is not enough time to turn around.

$8 Million, woof.

Maybe they lost the key :)

Yifu has telegraphed his thoughts loud and clear, which are basically that he could really care less about the emotions of a bunch of people with tens of thousands of dollars on the line in his venture. If you sent them money when they were starting out in hopes of riding their successes, well, you better get in line and realize you have no rights.

To some like myself, 100+ btc now represents a huge sum of money. Customers took on significant risk, no doubt about that. However, it is hard not to look at the carefully crafted Garzik-delivery-review followed by the Batch 2 release as the ultimate pump-and-dump by Avalon to funnel what, 60 thousand, 100 thousand bitcoins to their personal accounts? At which point they hold all the cards.

We agreed to their no bullshit Terms of Sale, but to be frank, the way they have conducted themselves given the amount of money on the line here is quite disturbing. I am not familiar with Eastern style of business, and really am trying to remain optimistic about the whole thing, but I can't help but feel that these two young men are sitting back sipping Martinis and have at this time said "Fuck it," taken on a few interns, and are letting the pieces fall as they may. No refunds, no questions, no communication.

I feel for anyone who has a serious amount of money tied up here. We are all real human beings with obligations, and in this case Avalon has a serious obligation to fulfill every single order they touched (including the poor Saps from Batch 1 who have STILL not received their orders). These types of sketchy "smuggle your ASIC through customs" dealings only further ingrain distrust in the community. Good for Avalon, that such meanderings are irrelevant when they hold all the coins.

I called it when the took pre-orders by the 10ks.

Too bad Asicminer hasn't lowered their prices. Their shipping track record seems to be the best from what I can tell.

Oh wow I had no idea things were this bad at Avalon!

ASICMiner does not have to lower their prices when this kind of stuff is going down (and they're mining).

Poor sap from Batch 1 checkin' in. 

plenty of bfl troll ..

Hrmph. Was about to pull the trigger on 288 chips and 18 K16's.

Guess I should wait for a bit after reading this thread... Ugh.

If you will look at this list http://blockexplorer.com/q/nethash/2016 (http://blockexplorer.com/q/nethash/2016) (difficulty history), you will find that on 5th of June there was difficulty increase for 3,452,220.98. That's new increase record, converted to terahashes - its equivalent to additional 25TH/s appeared in network.
And the previous increase record was two times less, only 1,848,179
Soo, I see only one explanation - most of Avalon 2nd batch ASICs are delivered

No there's another explanation. Avalon is mining with people's rigs instead of delivering them.

Without reporting it to the ASICMiner shareholders? I guess this is possible too.

True. I think a lot of Avalon#2 investors are forum members here, they should create thread to count how many of them have received their unit.

If this graphic is correct - http://asicminercharts.com/, then their average increase of total hashing power during last two weeks is only few TH/s

somebody called and woke me up in the middle of the night for this, so I'll keep it short.

1a. see the conference video, I thought that's an update; for the lazy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY1xgGiejIc
1b. also got cornered after the panel and somebody took this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtVx26LlNXA
2. an update incoming in < 1 week, pretty exciting.
3. we fully understand there is problems with orders ( no way?! )
- we can not address these issues IF WE DO NOT SOLVE OUR PRODUCTION ISSUE then we can not DELIVER at all.
- so until that happens, get all your information ready and bump the ticket if it makes you feel better, or just wish to complain and blow off some steam. ( please do not create new ones though, usually looking at the support system ticket insolvency merging at least 5-6 other ones first... ).
4. this forum is a giant waste of time, get back to coding, go outside, hug your mother, do something,

lastly, food for though:

who says we control that address in the first place?  ;)

Its official they lost the key ;D

Thank you for the update!

They went from ~20 TH/s to between 26 and 29 TH/s during this period. They have also delivered 4000 333 MH/s USBs, and hundreds (if not thousands) of 13 GH/s blades to customers. My third batch of blade orders has already arrived across the pacific.    :P

Wow, glad I only ordered one.

Oh, and I've got 10 of those USB miners here.... they are averaging 400 MH/s.

Oh Yifu great one, I never doubted thee! ;D

Seriously though, everyone needs to relax instead of spreading FUD, like the garbage that appeared on btcbible yesterday.

Not for nothing, but i was always under the impression that their units were shipped and in the wild. At least looking at their website, I saw no indication that they were't.

So it's true then, that ASCIMiner essentially controls ALL of the ASIC mining power at this point?

I would say yes... Except for the few BFL jallys in the wild. It is also possible there are other ASIC companies that just aren't public. No one can know for sure.

And paying out 1-3% weekly dividends on their stock ;).

This has potential to become the biggest scam in Bitcoin-history.

Ready the deadliest weapon in our arsenal - the SCAMMER-TAG!!

I've been mentioning this for a while - the marketplace is not ready to support the price in many circles (some webdev circles, sure)

be ready for a swoon/crash for the next rocky 6 months unless merchants step to the plate and start doing some heavy lifting and accepting bitcoin

from miners needing to get their ROI to ASIC builders having to deal with suppliers who don't take btc, you have an exodus waiting to happen or a flood to a few brave souls to fill in the next gaps

Sum that to the other 43k+ BTC from batch3 orders that are sitting in one wallet too. Its clear to me that is no more  avalons funds, but the payment processors cold wallet or something and maybe they lack a reason to cash out at this point. Let it be.

My thought from the beginning is that it is an investors wallet who already funded avalon. Why else would everything be setup the way it is. Why all the scam paranoia?

I have a contact in China which I use for sourcing inventory. Last week I asked her to look into getting ahold of the Avalon chips for less than the 0.085~ BTC rate the chips are typically going for in this forum's group buy threads. She contacted the TSMC foundry, which said that they aren't producing the chips anymore. At the time I brushed it off as maybe she had bad information or any other numbers of things could have happened, but with this new information this does not bode well.

So maybe they have a new chip they will substitute with a higher hash rate? I can hope right?

Is it not possible that TSMC would just deny producing Avalon chips due to security/insurance concerns?
Admitting it is pretty much saying "come on in guys, we produce money generating ICs!"

The key word here is "anymore". Also I doubt that the world's largest semiconductor foundry is worried about security.

I could see that counting as the exciting news they plan to announce.

Yifu speaks!  Excellent.  Great to hear at least a bit of an update.

LOLOLOLOL, right.

she and by extension, you; are full of shit, or have some serious brass in your pockets, getting information on which company is producing chips at the foundry, let's forget the NDAs. Oh let me guess you also know that foundry uses project numbers, nobody even know what's an Avalon Chip over there.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

also, parts came in, expect update this weekend.

^^^

I think you need to find a better source.

This is all I had to go on:

https://i.imgur.com/gpcFge8.png

I have money invested in Avalon chips, and the goal of my posts was to get a somewhat authoritative response debunking my info. I couldn't have asked for more than hearing from Yifu himself, so thanks for that.

It should prob be said here that even IF this would be true, they could very well have already produced enough to cover all current orders and more, and since moved on to producing a new chip design. Aka. This is not even at worst proof that the chips aren't being shipped.

Yeah, okay. That wasn't the goal of your posts. The goal of your post was to make people nervous, when most people that have been waiting for months already are. Otherwise, you wouldn't have said "but with this new information this does not bode well," you would have just stated what your misinformed source told you and left it at that.

balls, you got me. we've got a real sherlock over here folks

 :-*

Thanks for the reply, Yifu. It is definitely reassuring. Perhaps you could explain why Feb 2nd orders are being stonewalled and you are shipping Feb 18th orders beforehand? We paid 75 btc and they paid 55 btc, and we put a lot of faith in you, and the Feb 2nd orders still do not appear in the shop. Also, what about the Batch 1 sap who still hasn't gotten his ASIC?

Somebody woke his ass up in the middle of the night for this?

I hope you guys are proud of that. The guy has a life !

#4 is spot on. Stop watching the calendar, get away from the computer, and do something else for a few days. Go camping, unplug, go have a drink, whatever.

The chips will get here when they get here.  You can't affect it by posting on the forums. Just because you paid XX BTC does not mean you set the timetable.

And yes, I have quite a few BTC and $$ invested (probably more than you might think), so it's not like I don't have skin in the game.

Relax.

Huh why relax? Look at the BTC chart today. That's what happens when someone wants to cash out a modest amount of BTC at once.

If you had taken the time to read up n Avalon you would know that they don't sell their BTC over the open market. Also: price goes up and down daily, not a reaction to anything related to Avalon. Chill.

Based on the USD/BTC price at these dates you paid roughly the same amount for either batch. I can of course understand the frustration anyway.

Thank you for this response, BitSyncom. No doubt, hearing from you has made a lot of people feel a bit better. We know (and generally assume) that you're extremely busy, but just this quick post means something.

Looking forward to the forthcoming update. Again, thanks.

I don't check the forum that often, but a weekly newsletter with updates on where you guys are at would mean I'd have to check it even less. Just saying, a little communication goes a LONG way. You do realize those of us that sent in our Icarus devices have lost ~$120 per Icarus in mining revenues over the last month, right?


I'm not sure very many people here think you do, actually. It's probably the person doing the money conversion into Renminbi for you. I think most people probably realize/recognize that.

I appreciate the response, even if it means that all of those who are "in" with Avalon chips aren't going to bail. I see the "sky is falling" posts all the time on here and while some are genuinely informative and may save someone from a bad business decision; most are based on getting others to get out of the game so that they can make more BTC.
That is why it is best to live by your own convictions and investment ideas. There's a lot of good info here, but you have to sift through a lot to get the kernels.

In the end, talk is cheap; results matter.

I agree with you guys, but I can't pull myself away.  I want to go do other things, and then something happens and I miss it and then I can't stop refreshing my watchlist!

Damn you people and your awesomeness.

Bitsyncom thanks you read this thread but please please cant you hire at least one support person? There are so many questions that arent "when does my avalon batch 1 ship", even you payment provider claims he cant get in contact with you, there are order problems and no response. In fact your posts are the only things i heard from avalon since a long time. It really puts a burden of many customers that avalon isnt communicating while the solution is so easy.

Please consider!

Sebastian, you're just a customer, nothing more. Go outside and hug your mother, if you're into that thing. The tens of thousands of dollars you have on the line doesn't give you any right to anything, including but not limited to a response to your inquiries.

Can we all please feel bad for Yifu for a moment? He got woken up in the middle of the night, because people who have given him nearly 10 million dollars without a word of response are getting uneasy. I really feel sorry for Yifu, it must be tough.

Man, think about what you write. TSMC is a motherfuckin' business of $14 billion turnover per year. You just do not call them and ask to the operator, "hey, are you still doing those Avalon chips, yeah, those for that Yifu student in his 20s and his friend"?

Come on, how can you even dare to post something like this in a forum without feeling ridiculous?

Wake up, man: TSMC has more than 30,000 employees. Your "friend" is full of shit, and your crazy/dumb/whatever for even listening at her without laughing out loud.

wow ..  you really wrote that?

so as long as Avalon hands those btc to someone outside of an exchange for money, then those piles of btc will NEVER hit exchanges ever!!! 

brilliant!

1) This was all settled on the last page. You missed the bus bro.

2) As I mentioned before, I was told what I was told a week ago and I didn't bring it up. The only reason I brought it up now was because of some potentially troubling news in the OP. (I missed the post where Yifu said that he was woken up in the middle of the night and came to post)

3) This person represents a network of people in China that have previously been extremely good at sourcing anything we've possibly needed. In the case of the Avalons this is the first time they've ever been unable to find something for me. This isn't the case of someone who says he has an uncle that works at Nintendo.

But all of this is a moot point because it was settled on the last page.

I saw the videos of the conference, and was satisfied for 60 days.

I don't need a minute-by-minute update, and fully support Yifu, and DO feel sorry for him, for having to tolerate the BS from individual orders.  I don't want to be a pain in his side.  I'm just hoping that my polite silence moves my order higher up in the queue.

Yifu, you know who's supporting you!  We won't tell, if you slip that order to the top of the pile! :D

Man. It's so f**king obvious that nobody can "source" Avalon chips from TSMC that is ridiculous you even asked. Do you have a clue of how a company like TSMC works? They are producing chips for EVERYBODY, including Apple or Nvidia, their security standards are top-notch and applied to every customer by default. Probably they don't even know who "Avalon" is, very likely every customer is just a number for 99.9% of the employees, and there's no friggin' way you contact TSMC and somebody is able to tell you that they are not manufacturing for this or the other customer.

Sorry, I didn't read the other page, I was (and I am) too amazed that you dared to ask such a thing to your "contact", and even more amazed by the fact that you had the guts to post such a ridiculous nonsense in a public forum.

And BTW, you have the proof now that "this person" is at the "an uncle that works at Nintendo" level, because he laughed out loud at your face telling you that somebody told her that TSMC is not producing those chips anymore. Only two options here bro, either she is a clown, or she is clueless, otherwise you just do not say such thing because you would feel ashamed.

AND BTW: next time ask her to "source" you the prototypes for the next iPhone from Foxconn, and when she replies that "somebody told me Foxconn is not manufacturing Apple devices anymore" you tell us, ok?

LOL

I'm fully aware of what TSMC is and its position, I just asked her because I figured it'd be worth a shot as she's never failed me in the past. I got a peculiar response which I thought nothing of until I saw this thread.

quit gettin mad about posts on the internet

I guarantee you I'm not mad at all, just amazed and laughing hard, really.

You, my dear sir, should have realised that lots of people have invested in Avalon Asics and your "news" could at least cost 1 skipped heartbeat. What everyone is saying and what you need to understand, is that you should be very careful with wild accusations on the internet. What this community is looking for now is a simple apology and the promise you will show better wisdom next time.

Thanks for the quick update, much appreciated.

1. I'm sure you are extremely busy but IMO your customers who have collectively invested $millions in your bulk chips shouldn't have to dig up a 25 minute video for information on when they can expect their sample chips that I believe are now over 3 weeks late with no contact from Bitsyncom. A quick e-mail to your customers will go a LONG way in easing their concerns and reducing the conjecture/paranoia found on the forums.
2. Awesome, can't wait.
3. I personally have no glitched orders/tickets but I am curious why you have not hired a customer service rep or 2 to deal with us annoying customers. It seems pretty normal for people to worry when they get no response from a company's support system so I can't blame them. Even just a canned reply "We are looking into your issue!" goes a long way.
4. I know this sentiment is common but you have to realize that we have to come here because there is simply no official info about the delay and this is one of the few places people share what little info can be found. Some people have a LOT of money riding on you with very little information available. When I got the update that batch #2 was starting to ship in April I relaxed, hugged my mom, threw the ball with my kids etc etc. After a month passed with no tracking # or update I decided to check back here only to learn there wasn't much progress so far with batch #2 and the sample chips. Now that another three weeks have passed without any update, surly you can understand why a lot of us are curious about what is going on. Your update above is the first I've heard that you are having production issues that are not currently solved and the irony is I learned this on these forums, not from an official Bitsyncom update so you are training us to come to this cesspool of a forum :P. I'm telling you man just a quick update to your customers will go a loooooooong way. I have 2 boys in baseball so I get plenty of sun and don't have the time to dig up videos and random forums posts to find out why the miners I spent my hard-mined BTC on are now almost 2 months late. It's like I tell my daughter when she goes out. I don't mind if you are going to be late but just give me a quick call so I know what to expect and avoid losing any sleep needlessly worrying.

Again I deeply appreciate your efforts and I look forward the next "official update" :D

Re: This was the original point of my post (not to bring up batch #2 delays) and I find this ambiguous response "interesting". I didn't expect that you would directly address this post but while you're hear why not just clear the air and end the conjecture? The facts VERY strongly suggest these are the funds you have received for bulk chip orders. The transactions match bulk order amounts and began exactly when orders opened. I believe some people have tracked their coins to that address as well. I was planning to order 10k chips but backed out since there was very little info but have been watching with extreme curiosity especially now that the sample chips have been delayed with no official response.

One of the things I find interesting is that Yifu has very clearly stated that he's not trying to get rich with these chips.  He's passionate about bitcoin and believes in it as a viable alternative to traditional global banking.  Making these chips is an attempt to decentralize the network.  He's said specifically that none of the Avon employees (of which I've only heard about two) are even mining.  Maybe he is, maybe he isn't, but I don't think he's as interested in garnering your business or putting your mind at ease as he is at getting chips out to developers so there is more competition in the market.

I think it may be a little bit of a stretch to ask him to accommodate customers like he was trying to garner business.  Instead, expect that he's hard at work, and keep an eye out for new news.

I do admire Yifu, I really do, but if you think Bitsyncom and he are not profiting massively from this venture especially at the mark-up he's selling ASIC's for considering non-recurring engineering costs are already covered, you sir, are nuts!

Hey, in the nearby college town, most of the EE's it seems work at Gamestop.

Other than the discounts, do you know what it gives those kids?

A sense of the Free Market.
A sense of responsibility toward the people that are paying their bills.

Yifu, instead of being annoyed at being awakened to answer to your self-made FUD, consider the people that have placed monies into your wallet.
Some of these people have jammed an awful lot into that pocket.

You need a spokesperson, if you would rather not deal with the public yourself.

PM me, I will send you my resume for consideration of that part time position.
:-)

I'm an Avalon customer too, and I don't get how some of you can be so crazy upset.

We all know this is a high risk investment. More like a gamble. You need to factor delays among many other things when ordering, not factoring them is just delusional.

Avalon is not a customer friendly business. Their philosophy is pretty transparent, and they are not customer oriented at all. Their terms of sales say pretty much all. Caveat emptor.

I can understand a batch 1 customer bitterly complaining of not having received his unit, but opening a thread speculating on what they do with the chips money, while scrutinizing their BTC address and whining... Seriously? It's that necessary?

The business that offers you plug and play money-minting machines with guaranteed ROI will never exist. There are risks. You have to be informed at all times and look for the info yourself. The truth is that Avalon faced a delay for batch 1, you should have counted on a delay on the other batches and the chips too. Let's hope everything is delivered ASAP, but all this anger for things (delays, bad customer service, etc.) that were so obviously expected is beyond me.

Sure, but one would hope that even the most basic of human notions of what is equitable would exist in their business practices; ie, currently those of us with botched WalletBit Feb 2nd orders who paid 75+ BTC are being stonewalled and they are shipping the 55 BTC orders from Feb 18th and onward! That is just not fair, and very bad business practice. Yifu, once you've had your cup of coffee could you comment on this phenomenon? Why are Feb 2nd 75 BTC walletbit users being screwed?

So you dont understand when, for example zefir paid a full batch of 782.1BTC, there didnt happen a confirmation of payment because freshly mined coins were included and at the end the order and the bitcoins are gone. No chance to contact avalon. You can do what you want you wont get an answer. And zefir tried everything. I myself mentioned him in my contact tries too often. Nothing happened. No empathy for zefir?
Or iam. If i would spend my own bitcoins ok, but i have the burden to have responsibility for other peoples money. Its a high pressure on the shoulders when you think a batch felt over. Its finally solved now but still there are questions regarding the chips that should be answered before they arrive at customs and before i get them because i have to buy the needed packaging for shipment and so on.
Fine... no support for the chips was stated... but i have read it of course that they wont answer things like "my miner doesnt work, can you help me" and such things. But no contact at all? Thats not what i awaited.
What i wonder the most... avalon most probably has massive money now. Whats the problem that keeps them from hiring a support person?

I do somewhat agree with you, but consider that a support person must know A LOT of details about your company or the work flow. Maybe he doesn't want to do that because there are things he doesn't want to talk with anyone. Imagine what would happen if the support was a spy or maybe all orders details would be available on the internet. As a student (as i understood that he is...or someone with his young age) who would you trust with your multimillion $ business inside info?




How about sourcing yourself some ASICMiner chips? Think you can do it?

What I don't get is the lack of reading comprehension of these forums. Please quote anything I've said that implies I am "crazy upset".

Again, please quote where I am bitterly complaining and whining. What's the harm in speculating when there is almost no official information? You don't find it interesting that there are $8 million coins sitting untouched that perfectly match bulk chip orders? If not then move along and let those of us who are interested ponder what's going on instead of adding more worthless noise to this thread.

Once again, what anger are you talking about? Yes I counted on delays but when I get an email saying shipping has started and 7 weeks pass I'm sorry but I'm going to be curious about what happened. HOW CRAZY OF ME! I still have dreams of ordering custom chips and am watching to see what happens but nothing is happening. FUCK ME for asking questions right? SMH

The squeaky wheel gets oiled -- so Yifu, why ship the Feb 18th orders before the botched WalletBit Feb 2nd orders? After you've gotten your sleep and had your coffee, can you comment on why the 75 BTC orders from Feb 2nd are basically MIA, with no information or even inkling of having been received/processed by your company? That is A LOT of money for anyone, I think... although now you must think "Psh whats ten grand? Why would I bother to answer an email GEEZ. Can't you see I am trying to sleep?" Well that's great for you and I understand, but this attitude does not reflect well to any of us.

I dance with Joy.

You are smart to ignore all the drama in this thread, and only comment on the good news.

I don't want to play devil advocates or whatever, but I truly believe that no support person is expected. And it wasn't expected before they opened the chips order book. Unaswered tickets are an issue from day 1, and it was clear it was never going to be a priority.

I understand insisting in order to solve a specific problem. I'd do the same. What I do not understand well is the point on speculating about how many BTC Avalon is holding on X address, and yelling about how it is possible they don't have some sort of customer support. They don't, they will not. We knew that in January. There are batch 1 customers that did not receive their units yet. Delays are a real possibility. Ordering chips is a gamble in itself and no easy task to manage.

So, it's pointless to brag about the obvious, and its more useful to focus on solving specific problems.

What is this post? ahahah really funny.

Thanks for the update, BitSyncom. We all sure appreciate it.


Never stopped.


OK, just did that


Tomorrow I should have that sorted.


Um, OK, that's a pretty broad request, but I'm on it.

So as soon as I complete all those missions I get my Avalon? ;D

I dont think most batch 2 are delivered.. not so many have reported to have it in hand..

I'm still waiting for 2 batch 2 unit..

Wait for this weekend's communication from Avalon instead of going for hypothetic tought and histery..

Yes, I'm quite sad, as I beleived those 2 Avalon would be at my door step before mid april.  Goodbye ROI.. At least, I'll have some Gh/s soon !

AsicMiner had expand a little bit the total power, and many of those 10 Gh boards have been delivered, some Jalapenos too, some Avalon Batch 2.. Maybe a/some major private mining operation has started too..

  When hundreds or thousands of people rely on you it can get very stressful and he cant be bothered having to explain and i know how this feels, i think everyone should just chill its a gamble if you want quick results go to online casino..

Could it be they sold the BTC address to for example Zuckerberg and have a deal about extra BTC coming in ?

That is a reasonable interpretation of Yifu's comment "who says we control that address in the first place?", but honestly I think it's more likely that the TSMC order only cost them a couple million, and that they already had that cash on hand.

?

We have some users making heavy use of Silk Road in here

LOL

Sweet!

so some have speculated that the address 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU belongs to Avalon.  well 10000btc just came out of that wallet after it has been dormant for almost 2 months.  any ideas anyone?

I hope they moved these funds to a hot wallet to give out refunds. I hope I hope...

https://blockchain.info/address/158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v

Yifu once intimated that that wallet might not belong to Avalon, hence no BTC ever went out for foundry payments etc. Whether that's true or him blowing smoke up people's asses is another story tho.

Certainly they wouldn't need that order of BTC for their refunds though..

It might be that this address belonged to bitinstant and they collected the payments from one customer there. They paid out yifu from other addresses and now maybe the bitcoins were needed to pay out another person again.

That would require a hell of a lot of capital for bitinstant, rather pointlessly as well. There is something a bit more complicated going on here.

I'd wondered if it was a foundry address but that would present 2 difficulties:
1. finding a foundry which would invest in Bitcoin
2. asking that foundry to somehow refund the extra "profit" money (unless that money was received in extra chips or payment for development costs etc. - which would again be weird because they initially had no idea how many orders they'd receive)

Seems like there are some who cannot connect the dots here:

This address 1BxD2VLE95n7ZeVJSy3uoiJ5WdR72jWj5f (https://blockchain.info/address/1BxD2VLE95n7ZeVJSy3uoiJ5WdR72jWj5f)has been mining blocks since April 2013 to the tune of 40/month on average until the end of July. Rough estimate is about 100 Avalon units (68,000 GH/s) would be needed to accomplish this. Which is about 24,000 chips. How many of these addresses are there? Unknown.

However this address moved 3000BTC to this address 16ygEoTjg7P5GJwLKTQd1UgqAGuF8bKVRc (https://blockchain.info/address/16ygEoTjg7P5GJwLKTQd1UgqAGuF8bKVRc) which saw 43,500BTC move through it.

and yesterday 2000BTC was moved to 158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v (https://blockchain.info/address/158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v). Bookmark this address, you'll see why in just a second.

This address 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU (https://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU) has been widely believed to be the Avalon chip order payment address.

Zefir's 1st payment to YiFu is here: https://blockchain.info/tx/4865b6b925af6885f1f9b71428bb82c052d6f243d72373b8afd3dcc3b0331641

This chip payment address 14odFwJHi6S1Rpuu9CnqZHy49qjc6F2Zd9 (https://blockchain.info/address/14odFwJHi6S1Rpuu9CnqZHy49qjc6F2Zd9) has the bitcoins withdrawn to 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU (https://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU), confirming that this IS indeed Avalon's address. YiFu never said it wasn't his/Avalon's address only, "who says we control that address in the first place?" (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227103.msg2399090#msg2399090)

Jump to yesterday August 15th, 2013. 10,000BTC are moved to 16ygEoTjg7P5GJwLKTQd1UgqAGuF8bKVRc (https://blockchain.info/address/16ygEoTjg7P5GJwLKTQd1UgqAGuF8bKVRc), gee that 43,500 looks familiar.

Of which 2000BTC are sent to the address I told you to bookmark earlier 158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v (https://blockchain.info/address/158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v).

So how many 100 Avalon unit farms are there? At 24,000 chips per farm, it is easy to see where many chips have gone. Why send chips when it is easier to make BTC with them? Then, EVENTUALLY/Two weeksTM when the difficultly makes the chips rather meh, and you can stall no longer, you send them out. That is where we are. Played like a harp.

Yes, because it makes complete sense to assemble chips into units, mine for them for a month then remove and ship them.

Obviously not...unless you plan to refund.

no need to remove them or anything.

just order another batch of worthless asics for all the suckers from bitcointalk.

or refund, and keep the interests.

Hello McFly!

Other chips are being made to send to us (allegedly).

Best way to order any BitCoin chips seems to be CIH-ONS.

(Chips in Hand -- Or No Sale)

Just sayin'

The problem with that theory is that it would mean Avalon paid $0 to actually buy the chips.

Yifu said there were 1m chips, with 200k "stuck in customs"
If you assume there are 135 boxes, with three inner boxes each it comes to 1.05m chips  (you can only see 3 inner boxes in the photos)
The payments to that address are about the cost of 1m chips.

So all of the evidence is consistent with the existence of 1m chips.

Additionally, if there really were 2.1 million chips made those chips could not be hashing, since that would be over 700TH/s .

(edit: wrote 700PH/s initially, obviously meant 700Th/s, which is twice the current total network hashrate)

It would be 592,800 Gh, 593 Th, or 0.6Ph at 282mh/s a chip.

Why would they be running at 282mh/s?

I did mix up PH/s and TH/s, though. The current network hashrate is 370TH/s, so it would still be twice the current hashrate. Obviously, they could not currently be hashing.

There are "payments" out of 158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v (https://blockchain.info/address/158mVoizfU3xPxGGchGtnsKSixGs9XTo6v).

They won't necessarily, but that' Avalons standard clock speed. Some will OC, some won't. Some will OCoverdose, some will be DOA. Some will err go missing.

Not all of them no. However ,those chips have been available to orders in China for weeks now (no customs to go through). It is safe to assume that a lot of them have shown up in the hash rate.

What? Not BFL??!

The first payment out of 1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU didn't occur until yesterday. (8/5)

Since that's the address that collected payments for the chips, if there were 1 million chip orders, then how did they pay TSMC and other companies get paid?  

Do you think someone extend Bitsyncom a line of credit?

Another explanation:
Someone, or some group bought 100 B1 avalons.
That same entity bought the bitcoin used for the chip orders, and gave bitsyncom the money to pay for the chips.

Now, maybe this entity did get the chips first and a second batch is being run to give out to other orders. However, as I said if there were really 2.1 million chips then there would have to be at least 700 terahash on the network, and there's only about 380Th/s on the network. So either those chips don't exist, or they're not online.

I'm guessing whoever actually owns those addresses is getting priority access to chips though, ahead of other Avalon customers.


Pretty much everyone's been able to get them to run at 350, and 300 is actually the default speed.

People are selling chips on Alibaba, but those chips are not immediately available. Those sellers are waiting on chips themselves. Someone emailed and asked, they said they wouldn't be available until Aug 18th.

Also, remember he said only 200k chips were "stuck in customs."  800k chips were apparently shipped. Although that seems like b.s.

there is no way they could get 1 million or 2 million chips hashing with a small team in a few weeks, I bet what happened is they decided to use our chips to hash with and earn enough to re-order chips to be made, and then shipped to us I bet that is happening now since all of the transactions are happening now.  Probably some of those receiving addresses are TSMC or bitpay that you see, they are either making more gen 1 chips since they are using ours or making gen2 chips or its a TSMC address.  Either way were fucked and Avalon is profiting more off this situation since they have their own miners regardless of the situation.  I'd have to say if they do not prove that their customs delay is not true we could legitimately sue them for lying and misleading their customers and with good probability win damages calculating the hash rate lost and distribute all the funds to group buys then individual buyers.  If we can prove without a doubt that Avalon has mislead us we will win in court.

Yeah, this is the problem.  You hand your money to these companies. They pay for chips. But once they have the chips they actually have no incentive to distribute them in a timely manner - in fact, they have a lot of incentive to delay.

We got a quick-wit here fellas!  :D j/k

That's exactly what I'm saying. And all indicators show "them" moving BTC back into Avalon addresses.

Yes, Bitsyncom Split, and Yifu has been reportedly running around with dodgy Banksters according to an article in the WSJ everyone is so dismissive of.

We see both the mining proceeds and the chip sales flow into the same address. But so far it's a 1-way flow.  It could be a dividend payment to one of the members of bitsyncom, it could be money flowing into the wallet of a major client.  There's no way to say whether or not the wallet is "inside" or "outside" of bitsyncom.

But, if Bitsyncom still controls all those btc, how did they pay to produce the chips? I find it kind of doubtful that someone actually lent them millions of dollars.

Well exactly 1000 BTC are missing from the wallet which is roughly $1,000,000

Perhaps that was their total chip production costs and the rest is cream? - good business model  ;D

Maybe they paid their Gen 2 chip fab.