Bitcoin Forum

The last time I did this analysis, gold was a thousand times more expensive than Bitcoin, if we compare the same proportions of total supply.  By now, Bitcoin has risen 30-fold, and so gold is only 30 times more expensive.

Of course, I was roundly dismissed for speculating Bitcoin could get anywhere near a six-figure price in dollars.  If I was criticized for being too bullish on Bitcoin, today I might be seen as too bullish on gold.

How to answer the question -- where to from here?  As I wrote recently, gold is objectively a better money (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2243396.0) for securing savers' freedom from governments and central banks.  So, if the long-term price ratio is 10 to 1 in favor of gold, Bitcoin can still go up 3 times.  It'd still be a great return by the standards of any asset, but Bitcoin is not quite as compelling as it used to be.

Especially, many early owners of Bitcoin, now flush with capital, who are also sympathetic to gold, might decide to sell some Bitcoin and buy gold at these prices.

We have to be careful here.  This entire analysis was based on the (pretty common) assumption that governments and central banks have nothing to do with gold and Bitcoin prices, and that the future of Bitcoin is to be another limited-supply monetary asset like gold, but at an appropriate relative price.  (The reality, at least with gold prices, is of course the opposite.)

So, the real question is what the Western elites want (and what China and Russia want, if they're able to counter the West in the field of monetary engineering.)  If Western debt levels and resulting economic/social/political problems are so bad that the elites have decided to use cryptocurrency to effect a reset of the entire system, to effectively wipe out their debt and start afresh, as just after World War II, then the sky is the limit for Bitcoin and cryptos.

If, on the other hand, the Western elites are only preparing for such a reset by taking advantage of cheap crypto prices so far, then we have to watch the relative price to gold.  The rise of Bitcoin, so far, is consistent with this scenario too.  From here on, our thinking might have to change.

For the answer to that question, watch the news closely for the signs!

It seems to me that if bitcoin is used for debt forgiveness it can do only Americans. I doubt that they will ever be able to give 20 trillion of its foreign debt. But for this they need a capitalization of bitcoin is still very much to increase. We have time to get rich. After the capitalization of bitcoin will reach the debt America I will sell your coins.

Steve Wozniak (apple co founder) said something interesting in an interview recently. He said humanity will invent better and more efficient methods to harvest gold from the earth's crust. Bitcoin's algorithmic method of limiting its own production has superior chances of maintaining a constant rate of supply.

The real test of gold is whether society can realistically revert to a gold standard in cases of emergency. If a zombie apocalypse occurred tomorrow, would gold emerge as a preferred coin of exchange across remnants of civilization? There are clips on youtube where people walk the streets attempting to sell $1,000 of gold or silver for $50. No one takes them up on it. The concept of gold and its value as a currency may be too neglected within the public eye to be an emergent currency in times of distress. Not only is support for gold exchange non-existent, its utility as a means of exchange may be a lost lore similar to the recipe for making roman concrete or damascus steel.

Golds best hope may be a form of gold renaissance, a resurgence of interest driven by fears relating to fiat hyperinflation. This is occurring in some circles. Preppers, doomsdayers and post apocalyptic planners are all stocking up on precious metals. What gold lacks in bling power and excitement it could more than make up for in endurance.

From my posts on this forum, it might be obvious I favor bitcoin over gold. But even I don't forget gold was here millennia before anyone knew what bitcoin was, and may be around millennia after bitcoin is lost and forgotten.

Gold is better for most "securing savers" but the reasons are not only to be safe from governments and central banks. it's also to secure the funds against the currency losing value.

See this chart https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=1xM3 and notice the difference between Clinton economy and the Bush Jr debt disaster.( I am not a US citizens so can be wrong but Clinton made the US economy far better to what it used to be before, he helped a lot.)
See after 2001 (Bush) a long 15 years growing period for gold while the US debt started to become a nightmare (oh it was already but Bush just helped to be sure lol)

No matter if the countries are from West or East, the national debt has a worldwide citizenship lol. A financial reset is totally possible

If a reset is coming, what they have in mind is not debt forgiveness.  It's inflation.  If a dollar can only buy 1/3 of what it used to, then, effectively 2/3 of all debt in dollars has been wiped out.

After cryptos go sky high, there are many ways to get inflation.  One simple example is to have the central bank own a lot of crypto (most likely CBs have been buying so far,) so the dollar-crypto exchange rate can be kept stable (at that rate) by CB selling of crypto when necessary.  With this in place, the CB can print a lot of money and still keep the system stable, just as under the 'gold standard.'

Any way they do it, the simple math is that when there's so much more money in the economy (by way of newly valuable cryptos,) inflation is bound to happen.

Now they don't like to do this often, if they can help it, since it's bad for the dollar's reputation.  The last time this happened was the 1970s.  Also, in the past, gold had to go up a lot during these times -- making it doubly bad for the dollar's good name.  The magic of cryptos is that the elites can claim people are just running to a brand new type of money, and not necessarily away from dollars and euro.  (The truth is that the top Western elites have been responsible for the rise of cryptos.)

So the whole thing can be seen as a transfer of wealth from creditors to debtors.  The modern world system, run by the state-bank alliance, is essentially a 'promise machine' where promises are doomed to be broken from day one.  While the values of the promises last, the elites benefit by issuing a lot of them.  When it becomes clear they can't be kept, the elites might try to keep up appearances for now, but eventually, one way or another, the breaking of promises has to be acknowledged, just so the world can get back to normal business.

Bitcoin price movement is more significant than the price of gold which is an investment commodity that has existed since long. But in this increasingly modern era investors are turning to bitcoin where these commodities are based on blockchain technology and gold is now beginning to be abandoned by some investors.

I saw a news clip just yesterday where they were discussing the future of Bitcoin. One person on the panel stated that he doesn’t see a reason why Bitcoin can’t achieve a market cap similar to gold. He admitted that the big increases in value of Bitcoin make him nervous for a correction but he said that there is plenty of room for growth if people view Bitcoin as digital gold.

Thats the answer to your question and the ambiguous situation where you whether bitcoin is better than gold or not. Yes in general that what I think you speculating here and I think bitcoin will surpass all its limits in the next year and so on. It has already ended all the bullish trend of the government securing the prices on gold and/or anything that is centralised really. This is because we have the option now, who crypto currencies!


So people will now understand the importance of bitcoin and other currencies which are decentralised and will start making the positive assumptions about it in the future and now. We have already seen the exclusive performance of the bitcoin and this has led us to experience the greater prices now a days.


Now is the time we should escape the centralised investment and store assets, because we have completely secure and proven decentralised system in the form of bitcoin.

This question becomes my concern a few months ago when bitcoin started to gain a tremendous value within weeks.
Whoever invests Million of dollars into crypto-world at the cheaper price could harm its price after it reaches the peak, especially at this point, due to bitcoin price increase rapidly like $1000 per day. It won't stop soon imo as bitcoin futures still not activated, but when the correction comes, it may hit the market so hard. The only thing that may hold bitcoin price is people who believe in bitcoin as an asset, commodity, currency, or a better monetary system compare to fiat currency. At least, Million of dollars have been spent in this market, people don't want to lose their investment, especially for miners and exchanges.

Gold ! What's that ? This is what is going to happen soon when people will actually stop talking about gold and will just talk about Bitcoin. Even newspapers will stop printing prices of gold and start printing the daily prices of Bitcoin. This day is not far as I can see Bitcoin is growing alot . Infact alot more than what was expected this year.

My assumption is usually that we might have a systemic crisis or collapse, but not an apocalyptic scenario.  Sorry if I didn't make it clear.  (That is, property and contractual rights are still enforced, but confidence is lost in fiat money.)  In fact, here I'm assuming we either won't reach crisis point for now, or the elites are engineering a preventive inflation (using cryptos) so we'll never get there for the foreseeable future.

As Jim Rickards always says, the elites can always have a gold standard that's stable (and indeed prosperous IMO); it's just a matter of what price of gold.  (All of the gold-as-deflationary-monster talk from economists are based on cases of trying to maintain an old price of gold that is too low for the new circumstances.)

If I walked around trying to sell 1 ounce gold coins for $50, I doubt anyone would trust me.

But I agree that you never know when society will simply 'forget' a money.  Money is just a standard, even if certain basic properties are required before something can become money.  I don't however think we're at that point with gold and silver, especially since they're the only monies secured by physics.

A lot of what you would think of as supply and demand based on what people want is actually heavily manipulated by the elites, over the long term.  For example, when it suited the global imperial elites to promote gold and demote silver, starting in the 1870s, silver has been outshone by gold ever since.  This, knowing that silver is actually a better form of money (since gold would have to move around in tiny quantities for everyday use.)

I still think a lot of crypto geeks are in for a big wake up call.

Countries, the elite, central banks and mega rich all back gold not bitcoin.  When bitcoin becomes any more than a minor irritation to them they will come down on it hard. 

Banks run the world not governments, if they see crypto as a tangible threat to their power and control they will have an orchestrated clamp down across borders killing the price overnight.

I also think we are getting closer to this tipping point, my estimate is 1-2 years max.

Time will tell.

With any other asset class, I would agree with you.  The fast rise would be a problem.

With Bitcoin, which claims to be money and occupy the central part of the system, I think things are different.  If the elites promote it to be their new monetary base (which I think has a good chance of being true at this point,) it will have lots of room to go further.

As I mentioned, this is not a sure thing yet, but at these price levels, I believe Bitcoin is still a good bet.

Gold was used in the old days to earn money now we have bitcoin and it has more potential to give its investor huge and secondly gold investors are not now in huge amount everyone here is now wanting to earn money in smaller time span and this desire of people is giving bitcoin use a push and those who heard about it are now investing into it after seeing the practical results of bitcoin and gold is now an ancient way.

One of the major points I want to bring across is, don't be fooled: key financial assets, including cryptos and other forms of money, are heavily controlled by the elites.  Bitcoin is doing well because it's in the elites' interest.  Has always been this way, and will always be.

That is, until the public truly wakes up.

For example, it's been circulating in the media that Bitcoin's rise is helped by conditions in Venezuela and Zimbabwe.  Their state money is so heavily abused by the government-bank system that the citizens look for a decentralized store of value -- hence the appeal of Bitcoin.  The trouble with this narrative is that, gold and silver are equally decentralized (and arguably much easier to use for poor people.)  Why aren't they going up?  Ah, you see, the elites want to promote Bitcoin, but not gold and silver, at this point.

simple answer bitcoin better because you can save 1M with smimple hardware wallet but need to pay 1000$ to save 1M gold

That's a good assessment. I think that if modern markets supported gold as a legal method of buying/selling goods and services, its price would rise. The value of precious metals would increase if they had additional utility and greater support.

What might be cool is if someone started a service where gold could be deposited at a physical location in exchange for something similar to a debit card. I think the value of precious metals might skyrocket if they had that type of modern infrastructure which made them functional and a valid means of executing transactions.

The overall practice of identifying precious metals, purifying them, weighing them and chipping bits away to get a precise amount required to make a transaction could all be digitized and standardized which would allow them to be more competitive against fiat/crypto.

It may not be viable in a large country like the united states but a small island nation like vanatu might be able to implement the practice. In a way I'm surprised no one has done this before (that I know of) it seems like a logical area to tap.

The recent i think bitcoin is higher price than gold. Gold is like old money investment that can hide tax from government.
With bitcoin we can do the same because bitcoin is not legalized yet.
And bitcoin has bigger potential for investors to get high return.

i agree with you, my opinion bitcoin price is higher than gold, and i am invest in bitcoin will more profitable and and the price rise up quickly.

bitcoin compared to the current price of gold is really very different, bitcoin price reached nearly $ 13k times more than the current price.

I think Bitcoin is clearly has already showing its best side on the history of its price developments, as well as its popularity that reaches many enthusiasts from different countries to connected with bitcoin and makes every efforts to gain various profits such as investing in particular.
I'm sure, bitcoin will still continue to outperform the gold prices even more higher again and again.

if in my opinion, bitcoin gold will not exceed BITCOIN. Why ? because bitcoin is the first originator in a digital currency .

Bitcoin has shown developments and prices this year so that almost everyone is interested in investing in bitcoin, and this will continue to increase year by year, and I can be sure bitcoin prices will outperform gold prices.

Any country that attempts to promote gold or silver is poking the eyes of the dollar and the US.  It's a no-no if you want to survive as a regime.  The US 'regime-changed' countries for much lesser offenses.

For example, this happened in the 70s and 80s to poor countries like Panama and Guatemala who refused to borrow dollars and/or allow US companies to take their natural resources.  Read 'Confesssions of An Economic Hit Man' for an insider account, and you'll understand what this world is really made of.

As I wrote, money and other key financial assets have never been a free market, and can never be, as long as the imperial elites run this world.

I actually agree with you on that, greed runs the world too thats why these imperial elites have something others dont have with regard to financial assessment. And well never know bitcoin could also be one of their targets pretty soon because of the attention it brought worldwide in the  financial aspect.

Well I think if we compare the value of bitcoin in to gold the gold is more expensive rather than bitcoin because the value of bitcoin was volatile while the value of gold is stable. As of now the value of bitcoin is still rising and growing rapidly that can be a little bit expensive than gold but as we know we cannot guarantee that the value of the bitcoin will remain as is because we cannot predict the events that happenings in the market. That is why I think that gold is more expensive than gold if we consider some factors.

as i know really gold price is higher than bitcoin but now bitcoin is getting higher than gold thats why i choose bitcoin price,before you should have to choose one because gold is gold but now gold change to bitcoin.

Gold has lost its importance in the 2k17 and this year show the real power of bitcoin that how much it can go high and bitcoin has a lot to give to the investor as well not only gold investment is affected bitcoin has taken over all the investments like real estate and stocks as well people are withdrawing their money and are investing into bitcoin to earn huge as compared to before and this decision is quite right for everyone,

Bitcoin and gold both are highly expensive to keep their 1 kg gold or 1 BTC. But if somehow you could afford anyone one of them, then why not try Bitcoin which has proved to me more efficient- in terms of giving returns. The difference in their rate of intersect is so much that i f you buy 1 BTC you can buy 1 kg gold easily after few months, because bitcoin has proven to increase its basic investment into 2x-3x and so on over the time. Still bitcoin has a lot of potential to raise your funds, so try catching bitcoin train rather jumping on gold.

For now bitcoin is at its high pitch value for us. Bitcoin has the obvious bigger value over gold. Although even if you Hold gold for a reall really long time even for a 100 years it is still going to be valuable. Bitcoin on the other couldnt go that far i think but bitcoin has i think doubled the price of gold for every grams of it.

I don't think you can do the math like that. If you want to compare bitcoin and gold prices you need to look to their marketcap. If you do that, you will see that gold is much more expensive than bitcoin right now because it's marketcap is somewhere around $6 tln and bitcoin is just sitting at $300 bln. Bitcoin price needs to go up a lot, before it becomes as valuable as gold, so this means that if BTC really manages to become gold 2.0, then it's still incredibly cheap.

obviously, bitcoin price surpass this gold price in terms of value. these are both good for saving money, investing in gold is profitable like what you can get in bitcoin, but if ever the time comes that bitcoin resets, then the value of bitcoin is nothing, so practically, much better to own/buy/hold gold too like you saving/hold your bitcoin to earn profits.

Bitcoin has a higher price than gold. Right now but the past year gold has higher price. But now even if we double the price of gold than btc, btc has a higher price. But the advantage of gold is even if you hold it fo to long it has still a high value while bitcoin has no stable price we dont if the price of btc right now will be always.

If the calculated 1 kg gold is also very expensive both have their respective advantages, correct bitcoin according to you more efficient than gold that must have a certificate to keep it legitimate maybe.

I think the bitcoin is better than the gold I see it from
- easy storage
- the price is much more expensive and most importantly
- not taxed
 

Let's see.

Correct.

Nope. You shouldn't pay attention to articles comparing Bitcoin's whole unit (1BTC) value with Gold's troy ounce unit (31.1GR) value. It's an unfair comparison all the way through. If you want to see the main difference, then compare Bitcoin's market with Gold's market cap -> Bitcoin's market cap $295 billion. Gold's market cap $7630 billion. What a difference, right?

Bitcoin does get taxed, just like any other asset. However, it's your obligation to declare your holdings and gains in a completely honest manner. People not being willing to do so doesn't mean that you don't have to pay tax. Bitcoin also doesn't need to be legalized in whatever country to pay tax over your holdings and gains.

The only one reason gold is somehow better than bitcoin is, its stable price. If you consider bitcoin of year 2010 and then consider price of gold at that time, you come to know that gold have same price as it has now. Maybe some thousands higher but now that much. But now, bitcoins have crossed gold even they are unstable. Gold is second best investment source.

for the purpose of diversification of investment this is must to keep something in hard form of assets. Bitcoin is riskier than keeping gold but the quality of gold is that it can be used in like ornaments and such the use of gold is more than the use of bitcoin which makes gold less risky. However bitcoin has made its investors richer.

Bitcoin and gold are both good to invest at, I myself was investing in both of them especially gold jewelries where I can sell in case of emergency, but over all I prefer bitcoin over gold as  we all agreed that bitcoin will really make you rich depending on how much we will take risk on it.

I personally do not believe in sustainability of BTC. It's likely that other crypto will overcome it.

Both Bitcoin and Gold are very profitable nowadays and their prices keep going up fastly. But currently Bitcoin's price is a lot higher than Gold's price, and it is predicted that it will keep rising for the future too. But Gold is still more stable and trusted by people more than BTC.

Since the price of a bitcoin is getting higher and higher, it probably defeat the price of gold after a long time.

I think gold will be forgotten in a long time. Unless there are major wars in the world, or major changes in the world pattern. At this time, it is clear that bitcoin has a greater growth advantage than gold.

Gold is an ancient tradition of storing wealth throughout the world. Therefore, it will take quite long time for bitcoin to be on that place but the edge of bitcoin will always keep it on top from the gold now. Investors of gold don’t earn rapidly as the investors of bitcoin. Bitcoin since it has started has made its investors earn hundred and thousands percentage of a single bitcoin they invested, on the other side the profit percentage of gold is extremely slow.

If for me, I see Bitcoin and Gold as an investment tool only. I do not really care about their prices, you should know that Bitcoin is an object in digital form, while Gold is a physical thing. Of course both have significantly different prices. Bitcoin's price will depend on the development of the digital world and the digital currency, while the Gold price will depend on the difficulty and development of the mining world. The more drained, the more resources will be depleted. And in this case, the digital world has an edge, I think.

Gold seems to not be as valuable as bitcoin is, this is just amazing... how does BTC came to be as valuable as it is ? that's what everyone around is saying, it might be the future gold.

If I understand you correctly, you're saying Bitcoin has a better return than gold because Bitcoin is more risky (i.e. less stable than gold.)

This would be a case of 'risk premium.'  For example, stocks on average have to do better than government bonds over the long term, to compensate for the fact that their values are less stable than the bonds.

While this might be true, I still think there's more at play here than risk premium.  As I pointed out, Bitcoin is still cheaper than gold (and was much cheaper not long ago,) so it's more attractive.

But the factor that might be more important than all others is that the Western elites probably favor Bitcoin (and cryptos) over gold as a potential tool for a reset of the entire system, for a variety of reasons (one of which is that it would be very embarrassing to them if gold becomes a thousand times higher than the $35/ounce price that they last tried to defend.)

for now bitcoin is gold in the digital world because of the increasingly high price and sought after by many people. so I agree that bitcoin is better than gold

Looking ahead, bitcoin prices will not be as high as the gold price.
Westerners certainly will not give the debt that they themselves know will be limited later in Bitcoin conditions.
What the russian and chinese want is inversely proportional, this can make inflation for small countries if Bitcoin becomes the official currency. The existence of Bitcoin is certainly a poignant hunting manpower.

If the price rise of Bitcoin comes mainly from people who want to ride the wave but don't really understand Bitcoin, then it becomes a short-term speculative bubble.  The elites can easily deflate it, especially now with two Chicago exchanges open to trade Bitcoin futures...

even before there is a time that bitcoin will be lower than gold but do you know that the price of bitcoin now is higher and higher than gold no one can stop bitcoin now for the highest rate ever...

bitcoin versus gold?

now even bitcoin is hunted rather than gold. from the data google trends just bitcoin more sought than gold, and this is what makes the interest to buy gold down 30% and of course this bothered gold investors.

What kind of risk you are talking about mate there is not that much loss in bitcoin as compared to any other investment coming toward gold, gold has stable values and profit is also stabilized whereas bitcoin has volatile nature (as pf now) prices goes up and down to give people chance to buy and sell to make money and I think in coming year people will forget about gold because bitcoin will delist gold from the safe-heaven investment list.

Bitcoin also will join gold for stable prices at some point of time but we can be sure that time may arrive after 100+ years alone and definitely not in near future.

i can understand this along with other points in this thread.
I think a lot of people are blind to the fact that like other aspects of wealth the elite are involved in crypto and have a certain degree of control.
i am also of the mindset that as we all benefit from the growth of crypto it would make sense to move some of the benefits to gold for instance.

Gold has never really been a trending search option. We also have to take into consideration that the stock markets have been performing rather well this year, so there basically isn't a need to use it as hedge.

I think this entire year there hasn't been anything in the mainstream news that was gold related, or I have missed it accidentally. It shows that there is nothing to gain for them by covering that subject.

Bitcoin on the other hand was almost a daily guest in every news episode. It's just a matter of hype riding, and that's what the media is doing. Last year there was barely any Bitcoin coverage, which should say enough.

Gold's price is relatively high and also no chance to depreciate so it is safe to have golds as investment as per bitcoin


I think with the way bitcoin now it can still go up higher than 3 fold. Because there are still alot of improvement, investors coming this 2018 due to popularity of bitcoin is pumping. So We cant assume what will be the peak price of bitcoin.

for me i fully support bitcoin than gold.

Bitcoin and Gold? I think is still more expensive than Bitcoin. Gold has been bought and invested in for years, but Bitcoin is just for a decade. I know Bitcoin is being hunted more seriously this time, but I’m n sure if there’s more Investment going into Bitcoin than Gold, cause I can’t really tell how many people are Investing in Gold and how many that are into Bitcoin.

There are tons of gold out there. And there is not much Bitcoin left for you to mining. The limited amount helps Bitcoin beat gold in price.

With gold, it is pretty easy to predict prices. Unlike Bitcoin, gold value doesn't change much over time. It is its dollar price that changes. So if dollar is going to hyperinflate in the next few years, gold will definitely surge in that currency, but in respect to the value of goods it will likely remain the same give or take a few hundred dollars. Whether dollar is going to crash would depend on the economic policies of the US government as well as the economic situation in countries which aim to replace the American dollar. I mostly refer to China here.

I am very optimistic that the sky is the limit for bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies especially the ten top most popular cryptocurrencies and if the Russian and Chinese will come to terms in driving cryptocurrencies as it is from the beginning then I think the western elite has no option than to embrace cryptocurrencies in other to reset their economic generally.

Gold? no more talking about gold. In this modern era, bitcoin is more needed by people. Bitcoin makes investors really sure it's safe to invest their money into it. Bitcoin price also increases fast for years and that's really good for investors too.

if gold or bitcoin, for the short term fast profit earned bitcoin but in use trading not in save
if for the long term yes gold can be used for jewelry and liquid of liquid every time it takes will quickly liquid it and small pieces if the price rise sduah certainly come up
but if for a good investment, ANTAM gold is not gold jewelry

The thing is, they were both profitable it is just that bitcoin price really varies from time to time unlike in gold which is controlled by the national government. But if you will both invest to them make an 80:20 80% for bitcoin and just allot 20% of your money to gold, since bitcoin is more profitable than it.

Bitcoin I think will overtake gold in many aspects, and will become a lot more valuable in society.


Haha, very much true. However, we don't want bitcoin to suddenly drop because of all the growth. Its got the future, I just don't know if this is healthy growth or not.

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Gold has been a stable investment for many years, though for sure it will grow outdated in the years to come.

Maybe you are right as a certain degree. Gold is very old school form of investment. LOL. And bitcoin already surpasses Gold's prices so many times now that its really hard to compare both of them, although they have some similarities. That's why you will hear people saying that Bitcoin is Gold 2.0, because it dawn a new era in terms of investment. But we all know that Gold will be here to stay because it can ask as hedge during crisis like World War. But bitcoin lately have shown it can do it as well, just like in the Venezuelan and Zimbabwe economic crisis. And as far as prices, Bitcoin has been the most valuable assets or investment platform right now overtaking Gold already by miles.

Gold has become old fashion of saving your wealth. The market of gold is going down gradually because of the immense popularity of crypto currencies.

Gold investors have withdrawn their much investments form the industry and investing them into bitcoin because of high returns bitcoin give them. Bitcoin is never ever going to lose its volatility which means investors are all the time going to have some profit.

Gold price is completely stable. It's market cap is very high and it's very popular among laymen and stock trader's too. Btc is mainly fluctuating due to less market cap but this leads to it's price Increasing which makes it profitable to invest into. Btc is much more valuable than gold but gold is used much more widely.

the U.S debt is almost reaching ~ $21 Trillion, and Bitcoin supply is 21 million .. don't know what that means,  just something to interesting think about.

80 /20 would be a good ratio because bitcoin today is getting more profitable in terms of trading how fast the price varies is also signifies that in a short period of time you can earn profit.however gold also is a good investment because as we all know how stable is the price  is and certainty and security is good compare to bitcoin.

I think if you invest in bitcoin at a cheap price, and sell a higher price again. You will get more profit, if you invest in gold with the sale price with the purchase price you will lose profits, because the selling price of gold decreased, or gold only in the form of jewelry only.

Gold and bitcoin do not have to be at odds with one another and do not serve as substitutes. Gold and bitcoin work well as compliments to any portfolio that wishes to balance speculative growth with a proven inflation hedge.

Gold takes long term process for you to earn, you will only lose profit if you really sell it in short term then you know the price is not yet earn x5. In order for you to earn more than x5 you must hold it for a years about 10-20 years but bitcoin will really become one of the top helper to help someone to become millionaire in just a months or a year. We know that butcoin is more better now than gold because it's easy to earn more than x10-x50 in just a year not like gold you must wait in about 10 years to 20 years.

Yes i agree on that gold really need a decade to earn because its price  is almost same  as  stable becaus it really takes a long time to change .While in bitcoin we can really have a profit in a   small period of time because its price is unstable  and  it is really rising each day becaus emany people believe and experience  the advantages of holding it in a short period of time and it is really profitable that is why if i have to choose among the two i really choose bitcoin than gold.

Gold is one of the traditional way on keeping wealth and it takes time for the value of your gold to be higher. Unlike in bitcoin if you invest now, you can see the growth of your money after a couple of months.

Now bitcoin prices far past the price of gold. No wonder some people start switching to bitcoin investments. But the legality problem of the government is still a major problem, especially for businessmen or big companies who will invest in bitcoin.

Yes i strongly agree  bacause bitcoin price is really better than gold because it is true we cant really gain profit in gold in a short period of time because its price is slowly moving and it is really risky because we need a big capital to make an investment in gold while in bitcoin we can really earn even if  we really dot have a big capital because its price is really unstable and it really change any time anywhere so then i also choose btc.

I don't think that that will be problem since there is a lot of exchanges that can quickly change or let you sell your bitcoin into fiat or commonly USD. I think the most common problem that big business mans think in investing on bitcoin is that the idea of it being a bubble. We do not know that for sure but they are thinking that bitcoin really is a high risk investment.

Nice analysis, thank you.  They say, an ounce of gold has been buying 500 loaves of bread since Greek and Roman times.

The only thing I wanted to add is that today we have a situation that has not been seen since at least the 1500s, when massive amounts of silver were discovered in South America by Spain.  This is an increase in non-state-issued, decentralized money.  The 1500s episode resulted in a long inflation and the loss of purchasing power of gold and silver.  We may see the same thing over the next decades.

That is, assuming the elites don't screw up the public's trust in cryptos by promoting too many altcoins!

In fact, gold is already somewhat losing its purchasing power with time. If we look at inflation-adjusted gold prices, gold has been underperforming against dollar inflation since early 1980s. Yes, its has risen a lot in nominal terms but it looks like people are losing interest in precious metals at large. It may be just a slow-oozing and long-lasting effect of gold being stripped of any monetary value after it seized to be a dollar backup.

Both of two things are totally different by their nature and people of all over the world uses them as different way. Bitcoin is not any type of physical thing and gold uses physically at many kind of different way. Both of these things are very expensive and we can not advance a thing by any reason.

Gold is very expensive material and it changes its value at a regular interval and most of the time it increases its price so if you buy some gold at past and sell it at future then you have 99% of chance to have some profit. On the other hand, bitcoin was almost priceless only some months ago and now its price is almost touching the sky. There are many people who can not afford to invest into that because of its high level of price even they want to deal with it.

I'm not sure what you mean by underperforming against dollar inflation.  Since the postwar Bretton Woods period, an ounce of gold has gone from $35 to $1300, whereas $35 is still $35.  If you mean something else, the early 80s were a bad place as a starting point, since gold dropped more than 50% immediately at the start of that period.

We have to remember that the dollar price of gold has always been manipulated by the elites.  During the gold standard period, gold's value in state currency was fixed, because central banks had enough gold to sell at the fixed price to any buyer.  After the elites lost the last bit of control via that method, in 1971, they have been trying to pretend gold is a free market.  But serious books have come out with evidence of gold price manipulation by the elites.  Plus, the incentives are strong that the elites will do everything in their power to attract people to the currency they issue and not to gold, to preserve their savings.

But Bitcoin is not the only cryptocurrency in which you can invest. There is a full range of other worthy coins which are less pricey than Bitcoin, and you are likely to make more profits via them if this is what you are looking for. Some of them have a lot of growth potential like, for example, LTC which shot nicely during the last year. On the other hand, gold is expensive too, and it is hard to buy it in small chunks without paying hefty premiums. You can buy tiny gold bars as small as 1g, though it is not economically viable to do so. But they are still pretty good as gifts.

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This is one of the most famous and trending topic about Bitcoin. What is more valuable Bitcoin or Gold? but the answer always from me and many other people in the world in Bitcoin. As bitcoin as a very fast growth rate more than gold it will give you more returns than gold in very less time.

I think that gold is still more important than some kind of crypto currency, so gold will always stay afloat, and no one will replace it.

There is also a saying That whatever comes fast will disappear fast. Well, bitcoin has been in existence for only few years but the value surged high so fast but gold has been proven even from the old days till now and still good in value. We dont know until when will be the fame of bitcoin but gold i believe will never disappear. May not be equal in value but more stable.

Even if bitcoin price would be x100 bigger than gold price, gold would still remain a lot safer and no one can contradict that because gold was one of the first things that people used to pay for food and different stuffs. Gold price is increasing every year and it is one of the best investments for a lot of people. I dont think we can consider Bitcoin better than gold right now because of the volatility and because it is not recognized in all the world. You can exchange gold absolutely everywhere for money but you cant say the same thing about bitcoin

We can then take 1971 as a starting point.

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I mean inflation adjusted prices, of course. So $35 back in 1934, the last year when gold had actually been backing up the dollar en masse, is not the same $35 as today. If we strip dollar of its inflation, we will see that gold didn't rise much in real prices. And if we take time period from 1981 till nowadays, the US government bonds, for example, have been performing better that gold. The treasuries are considered a hedge against against dollar inflation, that's what I mean by gold underperforming against it. That is, the treasuries were a better hedge than gold.

I think the price of bitcoin is more unstable than that of gold also the price is way more than that of gold and you can actually buy gold with bitcoins that is something you could not do earlier.

actually this issue is done already some years ago. the bitcoin beats the price of the Gold in just per piece because we all know that bitcoin as of today is really indemand and also at very high price. gold is manipulated by the government so it is not increasing as of today.

Price of bitcoin has surpassed the value of gold year ago, but in terms of security bitcoin lacks behind gold. Gold too is not that manipulated, but the centralized circulation makes it more secure than bitcoin. The decentralized functioning makes bitcoin highly profitable and popular and highly potential.

Some years ago we can say that bitcoin price really beats gold, but that time still gold was more safe than bitcoin but for now we are confident that bitcoin really beats gold in terms of profitability and stability and of course you money can be doubled in bitcoin unlike in gold wherein it is not stable as well/

The biggest difference between gold and bitcoin is that Bitcoin was invented 2009. Gold has been around since eternity. A currency is valuable because we think it's valuable. We have faith/confidence in it. And gold has more faith than any currency because it has survived more economic disasters than bitcoin. Bitcoin is yet to survive one. All these limitations with bitcoin and the unethical manipulation that happens in bitcoin undermine its standing as a currency if any mishap is to be occur. But it's the popular one now. Hence, all the bullish trend. But gold is the one if you're looking for stability.

True, but you can argue that is only because Bitcoin is still much cheaper than gold.  (When comparing same proportions of total supply.)

Gold has a big supply. This is the reality, bitcoin is very lmiited, that's why bitcoin could become 15 times more valuable than gold that was considered as the asset of the years.

But this is all relative up to a point of being completely irrelevant. For example, you can take satoshis and you will get something like 21 trillions of them (or whatever, I didn't count). Is 21 trillions more than approximately 200,000 tonnes of gold extracted since the dawn of humanity? Such comparisons are meaningless because you can easily change units of measurement and then claim the contrary. Also, how can you ever say that bitcoin is more valuable or expensive than gold?

You can't even weigh a bitcoin to stake it against a nugget of gold.

Exactly! There is no connection in between bitcoin and gold prices. In fact, there is no way that both of them are effecting the market price of one another in any way. Bitcoin is a separate entity and there are certain principles on the basis of which the market value of bitcoin increases and decreases. Same is the case when it comes to that of gold. However, bitcoin is having far more market value than that of gold.

It is all about the good news coming from the bitcoin world. You will be hearing this very soon that either they are increasing the number of bitcoins or the price will be increased so much. Like in the last year, when the demand was too high bitcoin’s price had been jumped from $7k to $19k within a course of 2 weeks probably. Same will be happening now, wait and watch the story.

At present, Bitcoin is at the best level in the world . Which is more valuable than the current market gold . The price of gold was very much in antiquity . But now Bitcoin has earned a great name .

I also believed in that saying that is why i maximized on earning with crypto currency, and now i see that investing in virtual currency is much profitable than gold because gold raise its value too slow and our capital would be stack for long period of time and generate small amount of profit. Then i conclude that much better to put money in crypto than gold.

Yes i agree on that gold is really risky than cryptocurrency because if we  speak about gold the big expensis is there and it is really risky to have an investment if you put up a big amount as a capital.Whilr in btc we can really buy it during its low price  to avoid   risky investment maybe the  difference of the two is the price crypto change in a verry short peeriod of time while in gold it really counts a  year or a decade before it change price.

Bitcoin is the best because of its value the chance to increase high in the market. Actually we couldnt compare gold in terms of its prices because of the more volatility happen in bitcoin always than gold. Although I can say gold is important in our economy impact.

No matter what, even if the price rate for Gold is $100,000 for each, that wouldn’t make it better than Bitcoin when it comes to investment, because Gold has a stable price , so I don’t see any way one would expect to earn from that. But as for Bitcoin, it can either go down or up… so expect to lose or win.

Exactly! The market price of gold is very much stable since a long period of time. There is no significant increase in its market value since long and that is the reason most of the people ho were previously investing in gold are now withdrawing their money out of it.

Bitcoin market value on the other hand has increased and is continuously increasing quite significantly since the time this world has seen bitcoin.

I think Gold has a higher price than Bitcoin and its price is very stable. As of Bitcoin, its price is no where near the price of Gold, but you will gain profit from it than you will do from Gold cause Bitcoin is still growing and volatile. But I believe maybe one day it will achieve the level of gold.

Bitcoin until now still more profitable more than gold. For me, for invest I will choose bitcoin and the second gold.
I invest bitcoin and gold, but I see bitcoin increase faster than gold. We can also get bitcoin from campaign.

Bitcoin is more profitable indeed, but it is equally risky compared to Gold where prices hover on relatively the same levels and sometimes would even rise higher depending on situations around the world. Bitcoin may make you rich, but the already rich use Gold for safety.

As mate mentioned that BTC is more profitable then Gold because price of BTC is more high then gold while also i clear you that when you buy gold from goldsmith and then after sometime when you want to sale then gold smith will cut some commission due to which you will will always face loss if you are normal customer not a goldsmith. While there is no such issue in BTC and price of BTC is almost increasing with time due to which people can earn more and more profit.

Strictly speaking, the demand for physical gold is pretty resilient but let's remember that over 50% of all gold is used in jewelry today, not for investment purposes. So even if interest for gold as investment is on the wane overall, the lack of interest might not heavily affect the prices at the end of the day. On the other hand, there is a huge market of gold derivatives, which are sometimes called paper gold. Paper gold allows to increase the volatility of gold price, and those who are not looking into long-term or even life-time investments in gold can do pretty well with paper gold.

Gold is no more an investment tool. People are investing more into crypto currencies, especially Bitcoin because this way they increase their capital within a short span of time and that increase is also a noticeable one. Gold is better to be used in jewelry, the purpose for which it really exists.

There were many problems with gold and crypto currencies are solution to those problems. Definitely investors are going to choose the easy way of doing matters.

       Bitcoin is no temporary difference. Gold could also rise high as gold demand in the market began to fall and weaken, there gold entrepreneurs will be anxious if reduced sales of gold. So the gold entrepreneurs make a way for gold to be smooth to be reproduced. Price is an option for buyers where buyers can calculate the price of gold for the future. All have been determined gold and bitcoin are engaged in the field of trade. But cripto money never knows when he will go back for a very high price. Why these different looks are all clearly the same has its own price. For my savings, I chose to save with Bitcoin money than I chose gold.

So, you're saying that gold doesn't beat inflation, not that gold doesn't beat the dollar.  (Remember, a dollar is a dollar.)  That is possible, but I would still maintain it's arguably a better inflation hedge than US government bonds, or anything else, over the long term.

US Treasury yields went steadily up over 35 years from the end of the war to about 1980.  From that (high) peak they came steadily down for another 35 years to close to zero today.  (This is one of the simplest but most telling and interesting charts, BTW.)  If you bought long-duration bonds in 1981, certainly you would have beaten inflation, at this point.

But in general, the system is designed so that you don't have any safe protection against inflation.  The entire system is designed so inflation pushes savers into risky assets like stocks, real estate and corporate debt, assets that keep the entire system afloat so the elites can continue to enjoy their wealth and power.  Thus, if US government bonds provide a shelter from inflation, it's only temporary.  (This includes gold too: gold is manipulated down most of the time so people don't use it as a safe store of value -- only when the elites lose control that gold shoots up.  So gold protects against inflation only over the long term.)

It is a possibility, for the bitcoin to be the primary means of exchange through out the whole modern world. If that happens, it would be worth more than gold in terms of price. Bitcoin is currently more valuable because it has more profitable uses(also more interesting).

Well, that is the primary difference between the two. Gold is quite useful, when you want to keep your wealth stable. On the other hand, Bitcoin comes to picture, when you want to get rich. That doesn't mean that investing in gold is not profitable. If you look at the charts, then it can be found that during the last 20 years gold has given more returns than the DOW JONES.

If bitcoin vs gold for long term investment. I choose gold, because bitcoin have much risk compared gold ( price still stable ) , not like bitcoin, price not stable and very fast to going up and down. But if you want to got a lot profit, you must try invest in bitcoin and then you trade bitcoin in market. I believe if you can trade, you can got a lot of profit

Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency while gold is an assest.Bitcoin's price is very volatile while gold is stable.Investing in bitcoin is more profitable as there is a lot of fluctuation in its price.On the other hand,fluctuations in gold is very less or nil.So the profits from gold is also very less.Price of these commodities depend on the forces of demand and supply.Since demand of bitcoin is much more than gold,the prices of bitcoin is very much high than the gold.I think investing in bitcoin is for short term purposes while investing in gold is for long term purposes.

I am very much against paper gold.

In the short term, if you want to play the game against sharp, experienced professionals with deep pockets who are implicitly backed by the state-bank elites, ie bullion banks and investment banks, you're free to lose your money!

In the long run, paper gold is not worth the same amount of toilet paper (since the latter has a good use,) since there's a lot more paper than the physical gold that the paper claims it reserves for you.  Of course, this is all legal, since I'm sure the elites make sure of that.  The fine print basically says, when it comes time to win big, you don't get to win.  (That is, when conditions are such that gold really goes crazy up.)

This is like playing poker, where you invest some money in a hand that, although having only a small chance to win, will win big when things do work out.  But in the case of paper gold, it's precisely this scenario that you can't collect (or at least not collect nearly enough to justify the bet.)

Gold is a thing that  you can hold and keep and also you can used it and it's price is becoming higher but sometimes also it fall just like Bitcoin but the difference between them is bitcoin is a crypto currency that can be kept or hold you can also trade and invest to gain more profit.

Bitcoin is your future gold mine. Gold is a thing of the past. Trade is now much faster and more dynamic.

These Gold vs Bitcoin topics get so bloated over time that I always neglect to look into them.

At large, I agree that with US Treasury bonds you are as safe as the government which issues them. If it gets kicked out for whatever reason, these bonds won't be worth the paper they are printed on, metaphorically speaking. Nevertheless, if we care about inflation only discarding the possibility of default by the government on their "promises", we can buy Treasury inflation-protected securities, also known as TIPS. Their principal is tied to the inflation rate, more specifically the Consumer Price Index, so with these securities you are sort of protected from inflation. It is just that most people want more than that.

We don't need to compare bitcoin and the gold price because they are on the different market and it means that the bitcoin and gold is also different because bitcoin is a digital cryptocurrency or asset so we don't need to mess things up in order to look smart because if you are smart then you know that both are different but both are good asset.

All paper will burn.

Actually, in most cases you can't even have gold derivatives long term because they typically expire after a certain period of time. Here I refer to gold futures as well as options and likely gold ETFs too, though I'm not sure about the latter. With futures, for example, you can of course roll over the contracts for the next month, but you will have to pay a price difference which is about a few percent, so-called contango. This may not look like a big deal at first, but in real life you will be losing constantly, each month. It is like house edge in gambling if you know what I mean. This is not so much about playing against experienced professionals with deep pockets as playing against the system itself.

Bitcoin gave almost 15x returns in 2017, while gold gave less than 10% returns to those who invested in it. But then, in 2018 (till now) bitcoin is having negative returns (30% to 40%), while gold is having a positive return.

Bitcoin's soaring price has earned him the status of digital gold. However, the price determined by market speculation makes it an investment that is not risk-free.
While gold, this glorious Metal spread all over the world, applies and can be traded in any country, although not created by a real figure. Gold is available in limited quantities, and this is what causes price increases over time.

Gold is a very expensive material at this moment but it was not as much expensive at some years ago but nowadays it is so much expensive and many people buy this thing for only secure their money because they know that it will bring profit at future and it is not a damaging thing so that there is no chance to loose anything from this thing.
On the other hand bitcoin is a online electric data and no one can use it physically. When it starts its way that time people call it shitcoin because of its facilities and price but now a days it is so much expensive and people can earn more money from it that gold and its price is going higher and higher day by day. Forasmuch both of them are fully different thing and people chooses them with different ways so that it is good to not mix them with one another but we can say without any problem that both of them are so much valuable.

There's a big grey area between a store of value and outright default.  Certainly, the nature of the government has a lot to do with the performance of its debt.  What applies universally is that the incentives for the elites are to maximize the debt issuance and to inflate away their debt over the long term.

The consumer price index is known to be manipulated to show lower figures over the decades.  Even if it was accurate, it would only reflect consumer price inflation, not asset price inflation which is much higher.  Consumer prices are artificially suppressed by various financial-repression measures jointly put in by the elites of the US and developing countries to prop up the dollar.  Among all the paper wealth created by central banks, governments and 'markets', eventually at least a large proportion will go into consumer price inflation, one way or another (otherwise, there would be a complete financial meltdown by debt default.)

I do think gold and Bitcoin serve similar purposes -- for savers to hedge against central bank issued money and assets based on that money.

Since the incentives for the elites are to issue a lot of fiat money, debt, and other assets, and then to inflate them away, the thesis is that non-state-issued monies like gold and Bitcoin become the store of value, over the long term.

For long-term play, there are gold ETFs, and also gold accounts in state-owned banks (such as China offers its citizens.)

The latter are really a minor form of gold standard (except that state-issued claims on gold are denominated in weight rather than currency units.)  The history of all gold standards is that they collapse as the authorities run out of the physical stuff to redeem paper claims.  And gold ETFs don't even have the state behind them!

Well comparing gold to bitcoin can teach us another thing about the so called Bitcoin 'bubble'. A currency is just something what we attach value to. Your shopkeeper accepts a dollar because he can further use for his own purposes; it is 'valuable' to him. This is the subjective value of a dollar. Similarly, gold has been the oldest currency since forever, making it is safe and stable. Therefore it has subjective value but no real intrinsic value as it has very few credible uses. Similarly people saying bitcoin has no intrinsic value need to realize if bitcoin stays afloat after a few years and surviving some financial crisis, it won't need any intrinsic value.

Honestly, I don't think there should be significant difference between asset price inflation and consumer price inflation, at least not in the long term. It may be so that CPI is somewhat lagging behind PPI but on long enough timeframes they should follow each other pretty close. Besides, the inflation reports can be rigged year in and year out, but you simply can't rig them year after year since the cumulative discrepancy would be too obvious for everyone to notice and point a finger at the government.

Bitcoin is worth a lot. Currently bitcoin is a low price. But the demand of the current market is widespread. So it is currently the best. And the price of gold is very high. Since then, the demand has remained the same as before. But gold is weaker than Bitcoin. So Bitcoin is worth more .

I think the difference bitcoin gold and bitcoin is the price the unstable price of bitcoin makes bitcoin a  berry popular asset of gaining because everyday we  can really have an opportunity of gaining through buy  selling process i believe that bitcoin is more profitable than gold on investing process of gaining because gold is always in a high price status and it is almost stable.

Gold prices are a lot more stable than Bitcoin's prices. Bitcoin (and crypto) prices are known by volatility, while gold is trusted by a large community of people and then its price is somehow stable. But in the other hand , Bitcoin's price is going up faster than gold and the similar physical assets.

If you think that gold price has decreased by 33% within a week, I think the world economy was experiencing great chaos. We are living the same chaos now, Bitcoin will come to its former value. Just buying is not enough We need to believe in Bitcoin's power.

Well I believe that bitcoin is really profitable than gold in terms of investing or maybe trading because the price of the bitcoin can really go down and it is really a great opportunity to buy and sell in the near future to earn a lot of  profit while in gold we really need a huge amount of capital because it is really almost at the high status of price which makes it so expensive in terms of gaining process.So then i believe that bitcoin is better than gold.

Yes I agree on that I also reffer in bitcoin than gold because we can really have many more opportunity in bitcoin due to the unstable price which is really good for buy and selling process of gaining  because we are really need to have more extra income thus time around and gold may not have the opportunity that we need because gold may count a year before its price change and it is really expensive because it is  almost always at the high price status.So then I believe that bitcoin is more amazing than gold.

To be sincere, Gold is more expensive that Bitcoin. Although I don’t know the market cap of Gold, but I believe that the market cap of gold is worth more than the market cap of Bitcoin, so Gold is worth more than Bitcoin. And you shouldn’t compare them, cause the world has known Gold for a long time now, while Bitcoin is just for a few years. So people trusts Gold more than they do Bitcoin and they also believe that Gold will earn them more than Bitcoin, because they don’t anything about Bitcoin. But that doesn’t make me go for Gold, Bitcoin is still my number one.

in my opinion bitcoin is still a champion and very profitable than gold, the total supply that bitcoin possesses is definitely less than gold and it will definitely make bitcoin prices very easy to rise and fall in contrast to the gold that its availability is unlimited.

If the size is a profit then bitcoin is better than anything, we all know that bitcoin increase reaches more than 1500% and bitcoin is the most profitable thing, and if we want to get the same thing then buy now will be profitable in the next few months.

This was basically the point I was making.  But over the last two decades plus, rich-world consumer price inflation has been seriously and continuously below asset price inflation.  What do you think has been happening?  And what will happen when the cumulative effect of the difference must eventually be cleared out?  (That is, we have much more asset wealth than the wealth in products and services, at current prices -- these must somehow equalize eventually.)


This seems reasonable, but I'll give you an example.  I've calculated that the price of a basic, cheap, clean motel room in the US over the last 20 years has really risen on average 6% per year, compounded.  Yet the CPI over this period has been 2% in the worst years.  Granted, motel rooms aren't part of the CPI 'basket,' the conclusion I had to draw was that, the public don't really hold the CPI accountable over the long term, since few people carry out and publish calculations like this.  On a year to year basis, the CPI may be a little on the low side.  Over the decades, the cumulative difference is big.

But how is it possible? Or rather, what do you mean by asset price inflation? If you mean something like Producers Price Index (PPI), it should in fact be somewhat preceding the consumer price inflation. Consumer prices depend on the costs of production but today's prices of goods are determined by the past prices of raw materials. This is likely the reason why it may look like the PPI is higher than the CPI at a given moment since it lags behind the PPI.


If I'm not mistaken, this type of inflation is called Personal Inflation Rate.

So it seems we have a misunderstanding...  Asset price inflation refers to the rising values of financial assets -- stocks, bonds, real estate, what have you.  What really matters is the total amount of paper wealth in the economy, so we must also consider the creation of money in the (shadow) banking system as well (under generally low policy interest rates during this period.)  This is as opposed to the price of goods and service, things we can actually use (ie consumer prices.)

In the modern world system, what often happens is that there is a lot more total paper wealth than real wealth (goods and services), due to the incentives for the elites to issue paper wealth and use state power to support their values artificially.  Over the last two decades, this problem became extreme, and the only other period of modern history that compares with it was the period before the Great Depression.

So I was referring to how this problem came about on the ground, that is, asset price inflation was much higher than consumer price inflation over the last 20 years.

So I think it is safe to assume that the safest strategy is to hold both bitcoin and gold that way no matter what happens you will be a winner, not as big of a winner if you were to put all your money only in bitcoin or gold but still a big winner at the end, I do not see anything wrong with that strategy except that you will need a bigger capital to perform it effectively.

I don't really care about prices atm , but i think gold is gonna lose popularity with the years. Maybe to bitcoin or an other new asset.

I agree with your general philosophy, but we also have to decide the ratio of the holdings.  Right now, the total market cap of all cryptos is less than 10% of the market cap of gold.  If the Western elites want to promote cryptos as another fall-back money like gold, they'll have to raise the market cap.  So IMO we should be heavier on Bitcoin/cryptos than gold.

And the price of gold itself is heavily suppressed by the elites (without which their system couldn't possibly survive -- see books 'The Gold Wars' and 'The Gold Cartel' for serious evidence.)  But they lose control and/or allow gold to go up during the worst of times (see my post The Real Reason to Hold Gold and Bitcoin (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1858027.0).)  So if you're young enough and have a long-term horizon, you should at least get even with inflation, but only over the long haul.

Also, it's funny how the centuries-long gold/silver standard period was a time when the elites successfully suppressed the price of gold (to a fixed currency value), while today that has failed and the elites are forced to (effectively) devalue currency against gold on a continuous basis, so that gold went from $35/ounce in 1971 to 30 times that today.  But if you listen to the media, economists, etc., you hear the opposite of the truth -- that gold was blessed by officialdom as money during the gold standard, and it's just a barbarous relic today.  The entire system is deceptive.

Got it. But what you call asset price inflation may be another way of injecting money into the real economy. Look, you can inject money via banks by lowering interest rates, as you duly noted, so that banks give out more credit to companies. But if companies don't want to borrow, you can give them money via financial markets. For example, when the Fed ran its QE's, money went to the financial markets, which caused what you call asset price inflation, but this didn't trigger inflation in the prices of goods and services.

I'll understand if you prefer not to call asset price appreciation 'inflation'.  It's just terminology.  (The Economist magazine uses the term asset price inflation, so I thought it must be pretty common.)

In any case, we have a lot more financial wealth than real wealth (the stock and future stream of goods and services) at current prices.  In the longer term, one way or another, goods and services prices must eventually come up to match the financial wealth, or, even worse, asset values collapse and we get another depression.

My thesis has been that, in the relatively good scenario, asset price inflation will eventually become consumer price inflation.  So it's not really enough just to measure the latter.

In many ways, what we have is worse than old-fashioned consumer price inflation due to printing and borrowing money by the elites.  A small minority of people hold a lot of wealth on paper, thinking they can live so many years with their wealth, but that is all based on today's prices, which are a result of various schemes by the global elites.  (E.g. developing countries holding down their exchange rates with implicit agreement by the Fed and the ECB.)  So we have a combination of a financial bubble and a social time-bomb from the inequality and unfairness of this system (which brings down working class people in rich countries too.)  Future inflation is the best possible outcome from this mix.

As an investor I would choose bitcoin instead of gold although gold investment is stable and less risky. The value of a bitcoin is much larger than an ounce of gold and I also choose to invest in bitcoin because it gives me more profit despite the risk but I accept this, because the risk is the most interesting thing in business.

I think if we reffer on  business bitcoin is really has an advantages than gold because bitcoin has the unstable price that is really fit for buy and selling process of gaining.But if we talk about price stability I think gold is better than bitcoin well the decision is our the choices is always to be work upon.

Gold and silver have the unique attribute that their scarcity is secured by physics rather than code and data, so I think there will always be a special role for them.

And it also helps that you can't create alt-precious-metals everyday!

This is not entirely true, yes gold and silver are uncommon due to being heavy elements created only when a star goes supernova but the universe is huge, once humans are able to get out of earth and begin to populate other planets natural resources will stop being a limitation, this is why we will need something like bitcoin because no matter what you do there is a limit in the amount of coins.

If you will just make an analysis, bitcoin and gold really do have that same attribute of becoming an asset iminvestment for trading. But aa you can see, the entirw features of the two are directly different.
Gold, after a very long time, has been eyed by many people, those who are seeki ng for monetary richness. Bitcoin is on trend and people are excited to earn for bitcoin

But I don't understand how the former (asset price inflation) is going to translate into the latter (consumer price inflation). It would be nice if you explained in short the transfer mechanism if there is any. Look, when the Fed poured trillions into the financial markets in late 2000's and early 2010's, it didn't turn around as consumer price inflation. The Fed had managed to keep the inflation rates on a tight rein. So why should today or tomorrow be different?

Yes your truly correct!Gold is nice because when I start to born in this planet we considered the value of gold and how expensive it is but the fact is I'll never experience to earned gold.Unlike Bitcoin even if I'm newly know it but the impact and the changes of my life was very big as in truly amazing apparatus to create my future shining like a star.

True, and in fact you don't even need to go that far.  Science has already succeeded in using radioactive reactions to create gold (so alchemy has succeeded!)  So the currently very high cost of such lab work will become an upper bound of gold prices.

But all of these ventures are today expensive (or speculative,) so gold holders need not worry at this point.

The important thing is that the special commodity of money arises naturally from economic activities, since barter is so inconvenient.  If and when all monies have lost trust in one way or another, the economy will use a commodity, if it has to (tobacco, sea shells, etc. have all been used in the past.)  The state will of course always try to issue its currency, but due to the inherently perverse incentives for the issuers of state currency, there will always be a role for non-state money.

There are many possible pathways, and the current financial inflation hasn't yet gone into consumer price inflation, so predictions are hard.  (Further complicating the scene is that developing countries often end up absorbing a lot of the financial inflation -- a consequence of the imperial system we have in this world which is arguably a much bigger problem than simple inflation.)

The reasoning is, when you have sold many more tickets than there are seats in the concert hall, one way or another, there will be a problem.  And inflation (where maybe 4 people squeeze into 3 seats) is the best possible outcome, since the pain is gradual and spread around.

For example, for all the printing of money in Germany during World War I, there was no immediate postwar consumer inflation.  People just preferred to hold onto their money, for whatever reason.  When confidence in that money was lost, inflation happened like a tidal wave.  When a bubble in money bursts, and how, is one of the classic problems of investing -- you never know for sure since the bubble is supported by the most powerful people in society.  Given the incentives for the elites to destabilize their own system, you know it will burst in some way, at some point.

Also, there are even more powerful arguments you could have used.  The British Empire issued much more paper money than it had gold, over most of the 19th century, under an official gold standard, and there was little inflation in Britain and the West over that period.

So that particular bubble in money (supported by British acquisition of colonies which were 'happy' to hold paper pound sterling as reserves, and other mechanisms) arguably took 100 years to burst.

But that time came too (the precise mechanism being very complex, again, involving world wars and transitioning the imperial seat to America, etc.)  A paper pound note is today worth less than 3% of its 'equivalent' in gold under the British gold standard -- 3% being the amount of gold Britain owned relative to the amount of paper money it had issued, on the eve of World War I.

So you are basically saying that even if we have somehow postponed consumer price inflation now, it will inevitably kick in later because the printed trillions will sooner or later trickle into the real economy pushing consumer prices higher. It may be like that in many cases as it happened in the past with Germany after World War I. But even with Germany that in fact remains to be seen. Germany lost war in 1918 when the Versailles peace treaty was signed, while hyperinflation started there only 3 years after, in 1921. And it was an obvious outcome of excessive money printing back then, not due to paper money having been stashed for 4-7 years. 

today, people are always looking at bitcoin and gold prices, both of which are excellent investment tools for the future. however, bitcoin prices tend to accrue more quickly, so many people choose to invest in bitcoins rather than gold. but, gold has an advantage, that is physical form, and its value always increases even if it is a little longer.

My opinion is equally good but it's better if we choose both. If there is more money we save gold and bitcoin because gold is also a good price but more with the increase in bitcoin may be a great one. so it's good to take a 50% / 50% investment.

Bitcoin and Gold are both good investments. But value wise i go for Bitcoin because it is more profitable compare to Gold and more people are getting interested to invest in bitcoin.

THIS is so wise if you are preferring bitcoin over gold because investing into gold for earning some decent profit has become old fashion and it is very slow method of increasing your capital whereas bitcoin is having the potential of making you rich in very short time span.

I think if you invest in Gold you will not make more profit and the price is almost stable at any time. very rarely the price will increase high so be making more profit chances are less in Gold but your investment will be. You invest in Bitcoin you can make big profit but risk is also high

Between 1919 and 1920, a loaf of bread went up about 5 times in Germany.  This was before the hyperinflation and was due to money printing to finance the war, with the money being hoarded immediately after the war, but for some reason flooded into the market a year or so afterwards.

As I mentioned again and again, I think focusing narrowly on consumer price inflation in the West really misses the important issues due to the modern system of central bank created money.  And these include severe economic and social pain outside the West, terrorism, wars, pollution, etc.

That is, when the Western elites choose not to inflate enough but try to continue to prop up confidence in their currency, is the time when the worst suffering occurs.  (It's also not one or the other: usually it's a combination of inflation, deflation, financial repression, etc.  I'm simplifying here to refer to the effects of deflation vs. inflation.)

yeah you are telling truth bitcoin can give much more than gold investment and due to its volatility the ratio of high profit is more in bitcoin and now gold investors are also coming toward bitcoin because bitcoin is attracting each investors of any kind of investment,

With the two commodities now in roughly the same price range, it's worth putting aside some of bitcoin's short-term volatility and liquidity concerns to compare them as long-term stores of value side by side.If we think about the qualities that make gold a respected 'money' or store of value, bitcoin is actually superior in many regards.

But I feel confused. What you say comes down to asserting that asset inflation, for example, due to 3 rounds of quantitative easing and money poured into stock markets, will ultimately turn into consumer price inflation. In other words, it is just deferred inflation and a matter of time when shit hist the fan. If so, I want to know how it will get transferred to goods and services. It is not like people are hoarding money as they did in Germany according to you, though even that sounds dubious if you ask me. You are talking in broad and vague terms (like terrorism, wars, pollution, whatever) which don't make a lot of sense to me.

QE was only the tip of the iceberg.  The vast majority of money is created in the banking sector as new deposits (or equivalent in investment banks.)  QE was merely a symbol of the ultra-low-interest environment after the crisis 10 years ago, that created a ton of money through the banking system.

Anything I say about how this will turn into goods and services inflation is by definition speculative, as it hasn't happened yet in this case.  If you want to read this kind of narrative, there's plenty right now in investment literature, since reflation is one of the major bets (if not the major bet) in financial circles right now.  Suffice it to say, there are many pathways possible.

In fact, for all we know, it may never turn into inflation in our lifetime.  (It's just that that scenario would be far worse from a humanitarian point of view.)  But inflation is still a good bet (at least inflation as part of the tools used to reset the system.)

As I pointed out before, even if it doesn't turn into inflation in our lifetime, even if it takes 100+ years (as the paper-pound bubble lasted,) history is that it always turn into inflation (or worse -- as in the Dutch case, where Dutch public debt was simply defaulted on by the French occupation government, long after the decline of the Dutch empire.)


Try reading 'Lords of Finance' by Liaquat Ahamed, in the relevant chapter, about post-WWI Germany.


The point I was making was big enough that, if I didn't talk in very generic terms, it would take too long to write.

Final thing I'd like to say is, if you're looking for cut and dry answers, I'm afraid there's no such thing in this field.  There are multiple possible pathways for each case of financial inflation to evolve, but what we do know is that things won't be good.

The difference in between the market value of bitcoin and that of gold is very much obvious and there is no way that we can deny this fact that the market value as well as the increase in the market value in case of bitcoin is far more than that of gold and bitcoin is the best way of investing money as it really helps you in making of more money in less time. Gold is only good for keeping your money safe, nothing more than this.

But how do we know that inflation we are likely (not) to see in a hundred years is the consequence of the QE's that the Fed had run some ten years ago? I'm not questioning that we will see plenty of inflation in the future, I'm just dubious about its causes lying that far in the past. The point is that deferred inflation can be gradually eaten away by the subsequent economic growth, so it may in fact have been a good idea to pour money into the financial sector (including stock markets) to extinguish the consequences of the subprime mortgage crisis back then and deal with inflation later if required.

Early in the week of August, Bitcoin set a record: for the first time, the price of 1 Bitcoin is more expensive than 1 ounce of gold. It was the US $ 4.

When viewed more backward, folding is more bombastic. In 2012, the price of 1 BTC (unit Bitcoin) about US $ 15, now? The price is more than the US $ 15 thousand, was predicted to touch the US $ 60 thousand in 2018

You're right, gold is objectively better when it comes to hiding your money for now. Considering that it's guaranteed that it would keep its value for years to come. The only way gold would lose its value is if that a meteor made of gold crashes to earth. But you bitcoin does have its simple advantages over gold. It's easier to keep bitcoins. You can hide it in a piece of paper. Gold cant beat that.

Bitcoin for investment now and save the wealth. If anyone buys gold why? Because he can just like to cancel or want to make a spaceship because gold is one of the materials that heat resistant.

People buy gold why? Because they believe that they have a good golden future. So if you talk Bitcoin, do not talk Bitcoin on a currency scale. Because if you talk Bitcoin in the context of currency, later our mindset will be limited, our mindset will be hard to think of Bitcoin as currency.

Later thoughts will arise, then who is the responsible part of the state? Then who is the central bank in charge? Then inflating how? Then the rules how? That's if we think of it as a currency. Now if you love Bitcoin as digital gold. All those questions will be gone. Bitcoin.co.id always considers Bitcoin as a commodity. Since the first interview in 2013, I always say Bitcoin is digital gold.

In terms of form, bitcoin and gold are exploited and used for human needs. However, the nature of the bitcoin meets the needs of modern and high, while the gold meets the needs of daily life. Gold is accepted or actively traded, exploited and used by the government. Bitcoins may need time to be seen in the future. All said, the value of gold is safe and will not be comparable to bitcoin in the long run.

Bitcoin is actually for modern world while gold has been with us for hundreds of years. Bitcoin is generated through the internet while gold is tangible. When it comes to price, gold's is volatile and sometimes stabilized while bitcoin's price has never been stabilized. It keeps fluctuating.

the bitcoin price is higher depends on gold but for the popularity, I think gold is more famous than bitcoin because people know gold for the first time and they still use gold as a long-term investment. but in this new era, I think bitcoin will replace gold and will be the next best of investment in the future so right now, there are many people which start to buy bitcoin although they can only buy for small part of bitcoin, they think that with this small part of bitcoin, they can make a lot of money in the future.

QE was only a small part of the systemic problem that we allow governments and central banks to create 'money' in various forms and prop it up with state power.  As I wrote, most money is created outside QE, but QE was big news because it was a sign that things were so bad that the authorities had run out of their considerable conventional power to manipulate financial markets and still pretend we have a free market economy.  QE was significant as a symbol, but it was never a major part of the problem, in itself.

That the 'systemic problem' always causes inflation is evident in the long term decline of the purchasing power of even the top currencies like the pound and dollar.  Over the last 100 years the dollar has lost its power to purchase Western labor at very roughly the same rate as its loss of value against gold.  Most, if not the vast majority of state-issued currencies on this earth have died by abuse.

Economic growth does 'bail out' the issuing of money from the problems it creates.  It's a classic scenario and happens all the time.  The problem is that the entire credit and economic cycle is dictated by central planning rather than the free market.  Central planning is designed to benefit the elites at the expense of everyone else.  Economic growth would happen anyway, due to market incentives, but centralized money creation artificially quickens it and distorts everything else.  Most of the suffering from the instability lands on the people at the bottom of the world system.

This is never specifically about the right or wrong of what the Western elites did after the 2007-8 crisis (QE, zero/negative interest, etc.)  That is a much smaller topic.

As you can probably guess I'm far from an admirer of Goldman Sachs, but Goldman did write a report recently comparing the relative merits of gold vs. Bitcoin, as money.  Gold wins on most measures.  The only advantage of Bitcoin is, as you point out, in storage and ease of transportation.

I don't deny that they often abuse their power of printing money but it seems to me that it is still rather a lopsided view to indiscriminately blame the government for every wrongdoing. After all, it was the financial (banking) sector that had created the subprime mortgage crisis in the first place, not the government itself. You could of course say that they should have interfered but it is free market, isn't it? Further, the fiat inflation is eventually offset by the growth in wages since otherwise there wouldn't be economic growth. I agree that inflation takes away from the purchasing power of a currency, but in the long run some balance gets established unless external factors such as wars are at play.

ahahah please forget tradational investment things..

yes you can lost easily but you can not earn good profit.

In this analysis, we have to view the state and the banks as an alliance to jointly benefit by issuing financial assets and propping them up.  E.g. the asset bubble that led to the mortgage crisis was inflated not just by banks, but by bankers working hand in hand with a coalition of political entities.  It's not just the narrow interests involved (such as those wanting an increase in home ownership by minority groups,) but asset inflation benefits all politicians because the 'free' wealth lifts the entire economy, job base, investor base for public debt, and tax base.  (At least until, hopefully, one leaves office!)  This is why the 2nd most popular narrative about that crisis is that Fannie and Freddie (the de-facto public lenders) had a major hand in the bubble too.

As I implied above, top bankers and politicians are generally in alliance, not in competition, unless assets values totally collapse.  'Free market' vs 'bank regulation' is just a story for the public, in the big picture.  The only honest way to regulate banks is, as Austrian economists maintain, either 'totally free banking' or '100% reserve banking.'


This is where things get so complicated that you can pretty much argue any position and no one can say you're definitely wrong.  The problem is with the complication in the first place (created by the state intervention in financial markets.)

The argument against socialism (either the Soviet type of economic socialism or the Western financial socialism) is always that, power corrupts, and the incentives of power are always to benefit those who hold it.  Complexity and the impossibility to analyze cause and effect are part of the power wielded by the state-bank elites.

The 'otherwise there would be no growth' part is not something I can agree with.  Growth comes naturally from the market economy simply because we all want better products and services.  What we have in the modern West is unnatural (perhaps too-quick) growth, which creates all sorts of problems, including environmental disaster and personal unhappiness.

So your point can be summarized like to each his own, everyone for himself and devil take the hindmost. To put it differently, you can't expect anyone to behave responsible, as in money printing, when they can easily get away with being completely irresponsible as is the case with virtually any government. But then it is not an economic question anymore. In other words, it makes no sense to deal with such issues from purely economic point of view. Otherwise we will always be missing the whole picture.

That is not what I mean.  We want good people, but people are good only if they see most others as being similarly good, i.e. all are following a set of rules designed to benefit the community.  But what should those rules be?  That is the key question.  When you have a set of rules that allow and reward predatory behavior (especially by the top elites,) not only do you reward every-man-for-himself behavior among the elites, the corruption also goes down to average people.  The entire society is worse off.

I submit that granting the power to create money to the elites is precisely one of those perverse rules.

Bitcoin is the new currency it is not the old investment but if you are talking about then it is right, today everything is gradually getting digital and people are using online shopping and they are saving a lot of digital currency for their future because they knows coming age is the going to be the digital era so for me as well bitcoin is much better than gold. It is save to hold and it is easy to carry without any risk of lose you will be able to make high amount of profit every month for free and you can increase the money with eh help of bitcoin investment, GOLD is now an old fashioned investment which is not very profitable anymore.

Both are having a good value in the market but they are totally different in terms of used and the way it grows. We've knew gold for so long and it's great image in the public until bitcoin's comes arrived and people Turing their heads for these.  Not exactly people forget gold but because if having a huge value of bitcoin recently they might get lost their attention into it. 

Charlie Wozniak (apple co founder) said something interesting within an interview recently. This individual said humanity will create better and more effective methods to harvest yellow metal from the earth's brown crust area. Bitcoin's algorithmic approach to constraining its own production has superior chances of retaining a regular rate of source.

The actual test of platinum is actually society can realistically revert to a gold standard in instances of emergency. If a zombie apocalypse occurred down the road, would gold emerge as a preferred coin of exchange across remnants of civilization? There are videos on youtube where people walk the streets trying to sell $1, 1000 of gold or metallic for $50. No one takes them up on it. The idea of gold and its value as a currency may be too neglected within the population eye to be an emergent currency in times of distress. Not really only is support for gold exchange non-existent, their utility as a means of exchange may be a lost lore similar to the recipe for making roman concrete or damascus steel.

Golds best hope may be a form of gold renaissance, a resurgence of interest driven by fears relating to fiat hyperinflation. This kind of is occurring in certain groups. Preppers, doomsdayers and post apocalyptic planners are inventory up on important mining harvests. What gold lacks in bling power and exhilaration it could more than replace in endurance.

Via my posts on this forum, it could be evident I actually favor bitcoin over platinum. But even I no longer forget gold was here millennia before anyone realized what bitcoin was, and may be around millennia after bitcoin is lost and forgotten.

but most of the world's population still likes to use gold as their investment because gold is seen as a safe place to save money without inflation and the like. bitcoin that comes with offering an investment with a quick profit will certainly be used as an option only because the fluctuating price makes people less interested? but for myself bitcoin is a great technology and for a long-term investment I never worry about it

Both of that is good on pricing but theres a big defferences of prices because bitcoin is moving a price and the price is moving theres big down of price or high of price and its nice to buy if the pricing of bitcoin will low because you will get a good profit if the bitcoin will rise again while the gold its very slowly to growth the price and its very expensive to buy but if you buy a gold we can sure the good profit.

We all know that bitcoin is the best than others so i choose bitcoin than gold because you will get more money in bitcoin than gold just invest in dip and then sell it when the value is too high because theres a chance that bitcoin will dump again bitcoin is our future money 100 percent.

I think bitcoins recent increase in price whilst the stock markets have declined will give people more confidence that it can act as a digital gold

These two things act different on their prices because they have a very different kind of market or environment so i think that we should not compare them two because if we will talk about profitability then it is very easy to say that bitcoin is the winner here because it is very profitable as its market's price is continue going up over the time because of its advanced technology and also very limited amount of supply.

well, both are good enough to be used as an investment tool, and both do have a very high price. but, for now, I just focus on bitcoin prices, and collect bitcoin, because I feel that the potential of bitcoin is still bigger than gold. besides, it's easier to get bitcoin than gold.

Gold has been in its niche for more than three thousand years. If bitcoin at least 100 years will grow by 1000% per year, it will be the best tool for investment. Bitcoins in the world are 23 million, capitalization is 200 billion dollars. Gold in the world for 7000 years. was extracted 161 million kilograms, and the total capitalization exceeds 9 trillion dollars. Bitkoinu need to increase in price at least 45 times to achieve gold capitalization

Okay, this is not what you meant to say but then this is what follows from your words. I don't really see why anyone would be good if they can be bad and being bad gives them a financial leverage. Am I the only one who smells utopian here? Rules are there to break, especially if breaking them doesn't entail any damages. And which rules do you talk about if we consider financial and monetary policies? Who is to set them and what metrics should be used? For example, there are competing economic theories like Keynesianism vs Monetarism vs everything else.

The fundamental case for gold and other non-state-issued monies is IMO a lot simpler and more mundane than apocalyptic visions.  It is that the incentives inherent in the modern world system will always cause the elites to destabilize their own system, over time.  They have all kinds of powers to prop up their system, yes, but eventually all that this support does is to buy them more time.

When the system is broken enough, one way or another, the elites will have to devalue their issued money against non-state money.  At that point, the pent-up appreciation of non-state money will all be released.

There's an important distinction between precious metals and cryptocurrencies.  The total supply of the latter is actually unlimited (as I pointed out in the article linked to by the OP.)  If the elites want to make cryptos a viable form of money, they will have to, somehow and eventually, put some form of limitation on the rate of the production of coins, before most people realize this fact.  (And yes, everything is controlled: the prices of gold, Bitcoin, altcoins, everything.  And yes, it's in the great interest of the Western imperial elites, at this point, to support cryptos as a viable money, in fact if not openly in name.)

The only way out is public awareness.  There are no shortcuts.  Most of the Western public are aware of the need for a free-market economy.  They're not yet aware of a similar need for a free financial market.  They're aware of the evils of a centrally planned economy (Soviet Union, socialist China, etc.)  They're not yet consciously aware of those of their own centrally planned financial system.  The two sets of problems are almost completely analogous, down to the need for propaganda.

Under the popular academic labels, I suppose you could call this Austrian economics.  (Although there are aspects of that school that sound strange to me.)  Keynesianism and monetarism were popularized in their day, because of their benefits to the establishment -- giving academic cover for a new type of state-driven financial inflation to support or renew the system that had been benefiting the elites.


This was precisely my point.  I don't see how we differ on this.

Yes both having a great respect and good response by the users but my choice is bitcoin because of it’s value and extraordinary growth in a short time when comparing to gold bitcoin has a huge development in short time that’s why I’m saying bitcoin is better than gold now a days.

But you just said that it wasn't what you meant. But never mind, I'm not nitpicking or whatever, I just want to say that it seems to be a dead-end from which there is no way out, no escape. The financial elites will never agree to accept crypto because they invented fiat not to go back to what can be called "digital gold" (in respect to controlled monetary supply). If this is the case, then we can't deal with these problems (e.g. inflation) and try to explain them on a purely economic basis. We will always have to consider the arbitrariness of the financial establishment actions.

Gold has a lo of limitations in comparison to bitcoins. Biggest problem with gold is storage. If you are having good amount of fold, you will have to spend additional money on its security like a locker. In case of bitcoins, you can store coins worth millions in your wallet and there are additional safety measures like physical wallet.

Also, in case of gold ornaments , whenever you sell them, the jeweler deducts some money in name of making charges. In case of bitcoins, you get more than the money invested if price has increased.

I'm sorry if there is any confusion.  What I distanced myself from was the (possible) suggestion that I wanted anarchy, or that I see the world as amoral.

When a lot of wealth and power are at stake, then rules are tossed aside, especially if they're unwritten.  This was 'precisely my point.'  I might have replied too fast.


(1) If you mean we're powerless, that is not true.  The entire system can be changed when the public have the awareness.  This goes far beyond Bitcoin, gold, etc. and is about the freedom of financial markets in the same way as the freedom of goods and services markets.  In addition, even while we have the status quo, every bit of extra awareness by the public will create a little bit more obstacles to the elites and a little more incentive for them to do the right things (e.g. leaning more on inflation rather than financial repression after a crisis -- as I mentioned inflation is the best of the bad choices at that point.)

(2) The elites are supportive of crypto, for their own reasons.  They're just not saying so openly.  I've pointed this out many times, and you can look up my writings under my profile, e.g. the thread 'Debt Does Matter, and Why Cryptocurrencies Have to Go Up' that I started, or the one linked from the OP.

(3) I would agree 'economics,' as currently defined and classified by mainstream academics, is too narrow a sphere to have a full debate on these subjects.  Economics treats the problem from a scientific angle only and doesn't consider the human problems of greed, deception, politics etc., when reality is the exact opposite.  All of the major drivers of modern events are directly or indirectly rooted in human deception via the money system.  The only world where economic science really applied would be one where truly free markets dominate -- in such a world, the field of economics would be much, much simpler (and more of a science) than it is today.

When we say bitcoin it is can not be touch and we can not see on it we only see a coin that sign of bitcoin, but we can earn a lot of money from it by making an account and started working on bitcoin just like posting all your answers regarding bitcoin.we can have a big profit from bitcoin and if you like to buy or invest on bitcoin you can buy and invest anytime you like,and when we say gold we can see it and touch it and so we can directly decide if its a right time to buy it and its price is very expensive and if you dont have to much money to buy it you can not buy on it and you can not have a profit from it if you can't buy the gold.bitcoin is still great compared to gold because we can still have an extra income or we can still earn a money from bitcoin without using money and only we can do is by working on it,unlike in gold that needed a money first just to have on it.

As for me, investing in gold now, you provide the stability for yourself. Dealing with Bitcoin, you risk your money, but the profit can be unreally huge.

the price of gold will run slowly and very little profit but very secure so make some people invest their in contrast to bitcoin which gives a lot of risk because of its fluctuating price

Honestly, I don't think they are "supportive" in the sense you mean it. They might consider and actually use crypto as a sort of economic weapon against other inimical elites and competing economies, but I can't ever imagine that they would voluntarily give up the power and control that fiat money gives them. In other words, they are supportive of crypto as long as it gives them more power and control, as simple as it gets. And then we are back to square one. If crypto is all about free market and laissez-faire economics, how can they genuinely support it?

you do not need to categorically approach the future of the crypto currency and gold. I am 100% sure that I have learned that there are many more prospects to remain the value of all times and peoples, unlike the crypto currency.

See:
The Real Reason to Hold Gold and Bitcoin (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1858027.msg18480086#msg18480086)
The Great Reflation Is Underway (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2213370.msg22301509#msg22301509)
Cryptocurrency as the Imperial End Game (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2437932.msg24974526#msg24974526)

It's not one way or the other (state or non-state money), but most of the time both, in modern history, ie using non-state money to bolster state money.  The classic example are the gold/silver standards that comprised about 90% of modern history.  The 45-year 'fiat' era (which is not really fiat but a rolling devaluation against gold) has been one of the most financially unstable periods in modern history.  The elites themselves, at the top, probably wish the gold standard would come back, but a return to gold would be highly embarrassing at this point.  Using crypto as the new gold is a perfect play.

The root issue in all of this is that, unlike ancient and other empires, the modern Western elites don't have enough hard power to impose their issued money onto the world.  (And it must be the entire world.  Shrinking back to the north Atlantic countries at this point would mean a financial crisis that made the Great Depression look good.)  They must use a combination of hard and soft power.  The latter consists of the fiction that the West has the best free-market institutions, so anyone who stores value in Western paper will keep their wealth.  If Western currencies maintain a stable exchange rate against a trusted/libertarian/anti-establishment money over a long time, it becomes a major fundamental boost to this soft power.

But, we have to expect the narrative won't be something like 'gold is money, and currency is debt' as under the gold standard.  The new narrative will be 'governments and central banks have to get their acts together, ie maintain fiscal/monetary discipline, in order to compete with cryptos.'

I don't really care about prices atm, but i think gold is gonna re-lose popularity with the years. Maybe to bitcoin or an other new asset.

But the time has changed and bitcoins have became much more expensive than even gold and platinum

although it's more expensive than gold, we could buy bitcoin at any portion, we can buy whole 1 bitcoin or some part of bitcoin and as long as we have money, we can buy at any price. and I think bitcoin price will increase and will getting high again so there is a big gap in the price of bitcoin and gold. but I still prefer to buy bitcoin right now and maybe I will buy gold later if I can make a big profit in bitcoin first.

Its upto the common sense of people. Clever people knows that gold may be less costly but has more validity than btcs

For me I am gonna support the investment in btcs because btcs can make us rich in a moment ;) and that's exactly what I want

No, for the same portion of total supply, gold is still a lot more expensive than BTC.  (See OP.)

One of the most striking differences between gold and bitcoin is that while the precious metal represents a physical object, bitcoin is entirely digital.

Past that, both the current and maximum supply of bitcoin are known entities. More specifically, the bitcoin protocol caps the total number of these digital currencies at 21 million, and interested parties can find out how many of these bitcoins have been mined by looking online.

Personally, I don't see any real links between gold and fiat these days. You say that fiat is a rolling devaluation against gold but I don't see how gold is particularly different from anything else, for example, crude oil. What about petrodollar after all, huh? Fiat is depreciating against everything which is anything in terms of value. Apart from that, I don't really feel you can so easily equal gold and crypto. The latter is more like fiat because they share the same trait or fault, lack of inherent value. The recent magnitude 10.0 cryptoquakes that shook the market unequivocally proved that thing, end of story.

obviously gold answer, because gold will not die, gold has been the standard since the beginning of time

Prices of both are very much different because bitcoin has a volatile value while gold has its stable value and it increasing every year. On my own, I will keep the gold for the long time as its value increasingly but if you hold bitcoin for that long we cannot say on that year is gonna be high or not.

Yeah yourw right and for me bitcoin was my choice because my friends and I were totally have an income on it.This ia also the best way in terms of helping my family.

Well it depends upon the situation , for my own opinion, bitcoin is now most expensive than gold, because bitcoin is very expensive and very securr unlike gold, it can be easily stole.

besides that, we don't have to worry how to safe bitcoin, as long as we can keep our private keys then we are safe. and now, bitcoin price increases higher although it is not as much higher in the last December, but it still more expensive than the gold. we have two type investment today which is bitcoin and gold and we can invest our money in both bitcoin and gold.

Yes, even Goldman Sachs agrees that Bitcoin holds advantages over gold for moving and storing.  But the same report puts gold at an advantage on basically everything else.

To me the biggest threat to Bitcoin is altcoins, since there can be an unlimited number of coins, among all altcoins.  Gold is secured by physics, not by code and data as cryptos are.

"Rolling devaluation" is different from simple inflation in the price of everything else, in that the price of gold is suppressed by the elites through derivative trading most of the time, but must be allowed to rise dramatically during times of financial stress.  This is in effect no different from the gold standard, but with frequent devaluations.  (Suppressing gold appreciation against state money was the real purpose of the gold standard.)  The visible difference between devaluation and inflation is that devaluations were always denied strongly beforehand and implemented overnight, and that the gold price would stay the same for a long time afterwards.

It's highly interesting that the official gold-standard rhetoric stated that gold was money, but that was the time when gold earned zero return for very long periods in the 'core' countries.  Today, the officials say gold is nothing, but it's during this period that gold went up 30+ times.

The petrodollar was just a scheme to ally with oil-rich dictatorships to prop up the value of the dollar by accepting only dollars for oil.  Needless to say, this particular market manipulation has had more than its fair share of side effects.

'Inherent value' is highly misleading, because even gold doesn't have enough 'real' use to justify its current value.  The monetary value of anything is always subject to convention and crowd psychology.  (Because money is ultimately just a protocol.)  The elites have a lot of power because of this, BTW, but that power has been spent by issuing money and debt to benefit previous elites.

The meaningful dividing line is not the physical form (or 'inherent value') of any money, but state-issued vs. state-free, today.  (You could argue there is also a bank-issued form.)  Natural monies (gold, silver, Bitcoin) don't carry the inherently destructive incentives built into human-issued money.  That is what makes the real difference.

Altcoins are indeed a threat for bitcoin because that is where the replacement for bitcoin will come in the future. Altcoins are having more and more better features and specifications and if the people really find an altcoin that is literally better than bitcoin then it will be just easy as pie for that altcoin to replace bitcoin.

Bitcoins are better if used tactically and if we could spend quality time on it. Otherwise go for gold investment both of them are good

If we make a comparison in between the market prices of bitcoin and that of gold only, then we will get to know that it is the market prices of bitcoin which are far more than that of gold and that they are also increasing at a very rapid rate. The price of gold is very much stable since long and that it is not helping its investors in making of any significant amount of money as well. You need to think well and make a smart decision.

may take advantage in terms of buying and selling, bitcoin still has a much better advantage than gold, because you can do it instantly and quickly. while gold, so much to think about before serving. but, in terms of price, gold might be better.

Bitcoin Prices and Gold Prices are certainly very different at all. If the price of Bitcoin up and down very quickly. While the price of Gold increment is not like Bitcoin, it must take a long time.

Every currency have their own importance and for us the bitcoin is important than Gold and with the bitcoin gold is not connected but the paper money is directly attached with the gold availability and the usage of this currency will high in the future. And the gold is good for the physically existed currency and those who have this currency they can better than those who have gold.

Altcoins are no doubt doing very well and that most of the traders are trading in these coins but still you can’t deny the importance of the bitcoin and the name which bitcoin has in the world of crypto currencies.

I don’t really think so that bitcoin can be beaten by any of the crypto currency in the future as well because the way it is performing is too good and above all, it is also helping its investors in making of more money as well.

Just think about the other altcoins that have a better project and target for their coin in the future and for me, that is enough to speculate if bitcoin will have a good future in the long term or it will get replace by another altcoin which can be better than bitcoin because people wants the best and they will not settle with bitcoin if there is better.

Yeah its true in terms of price makes me think that bitcoin was more in demand that gold.And yes bitcoin and gold was precoius but on how bitcoin can change us was so amazed of me.

This is an old story about gold being negatively affected by paper gold. There are enough perfectly viable arguments that support the view that paper gold actually props up the value of the real one. If anything, gold derivatives add to speculation, but speculation attracts people looking for easy money. Obviously, gold prices are set to rise under these circumstances. Just like it happens with Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies.


This is another point which has already been beaten to death many times. Obviously, nothing has intrinsic or inherent value since all value is subjective. The problem is gold is valued by people through generations, and this value is not susceptible to overnight devaluation, the thing which we have all learned too well with Bitcoin.

I think that bitcoin is more reliable than gold - you can transfer it from one country to another without any customs problems. Bitcoin, the heavyweight of the cryptocurrency world, has billed itself as digital gold. Bitcoin is, after all, far more volatile than gold, and still relatively unknown compared to other investment assets. Gold, on the other hand, is well established with institutional investors and has quite a bit of liquidity.

Yes, Bitcoin is by far more volatile than gold, and, to tell the truth, it is more volatile than any commodity out there. So I don't really think it, or any other cryptocurrency for that matter, can be billed as gold. In fact, it is anything but gold or digital gold because gold is the standard of value, a point of reference if you please. Bitcoin is at the other end of the range. It is amusing to see and hear when people male some analogies. I expected that after Bitcoin had lost half of its value within a month, there will be no more such nonsense, but to no avail.

no matter how I will still support bitcoin and will always play bitcoin because I believe the bitcoin price will be more expensive than gold.

Well for me they are not same at all, as bitcoin is much more better than GOLD now, people trust BITCOIN more than gold they want to invest in bitcoin as it is new technology and people know that BITCOIN will increase in future so they are investing happily on the other hand investing in GOLD is useless as it is now an old fashioned investment that only spoil your money, once you invest in gold you will realize what huge mistake you have done, so I am totally in favor of bitcoin for investment.

Do you really believe in that? People invest in gold specifically to save their money. How on Earth can investing in gold spoil it? So far it was Bitcoin that not only "spoiled" the money of him who invested at the top, but likely ruined their lives too. What are you going to tell all these people who lost thousands of dollars? That they should trust Bitcoin more than anything else? But trust is not built through words, so imagine how ludicrous and injuring your words would be to them.

I know bitcoin has gained a huge amount of popularity among the people throughout the world and its popularity is further increasing day by day. Also it has lead  to increase users throughout the world because of which bitcoins demand has increased a lot. Bitcoin has defeated gold in terms of prices but still I don’t think that bitcoin will be able to replace gold because firstly, gold is way more popular than bitcoin And gold is a stable form of currency where as bitcoin is not stable form of currency. The gold is excepted everywhere whereas between is not excepted everywhere.

gold is better than gold by holding for too long i think 5000 yers lol but in if you want in short time or 5 or 10 years go for bitcoin or do short trading because bitcoin is more good than goood if we talk about profit you can get more profit here by investing in bitcoin or some altcoins that gives to all a agood amount of btc or you can convert it into real money.

Far more than gold. So far, I am sure a lot of us have seen how bitcoin has really ushered in a lot of opportunity over the years and despite all attack from different angles, bitcoin has been doing pretty good.

None of us know what the future holds for anything, but investing in bitcoin so far is a risk worth taking than gold. Gold is not even that risky anyway considering it is an asset you can sleep and forget about, but still I prefer to go with a new technology that is changing a lot of things, which as a part of the early adopters, I stand to gain much.

It has been explained multiple times already but it is always worth repeating. People investing in Bitcoin and people investing in gold are two different groups of people, two very separate cohorts of investors. Folks investing in Bitcoin are looking for high profits and they are ready to accept the high risks inseparable from such investments. On the other hand, gold investors (so-called gold bugs) are not looking so much for profits as for saving their wealth and capital from depreciation and devaluation over time.

Bitcoin is now the most popular coin in all over the world because of the big profit returns . Gold is considered a good investment transaction that takes less risks but slight in value. Bitcoin is much better because we can earn good moneys without investing any value ,people are usually has an advantages on bitcoin because of the opprtunities they developed like signature campaign. Bitcoin is high in risk but eventually useful in everything. So far for now bitcoin has a good investment method than  gold.

Even in just few years, we all know the impact bitcoin has created for investors and which I am sure gold has not even been able to beat that at all since all the years it has been in existence. I would rather prefer putting my bet more on bitcoin than gold, not like I have any gold anyway.

Although, for security and for safety reasons or not bothering about having a problem with your investment, gold is more of an established asset, but early adopters in a great future, I would not miss that for anything.

bitcoin and gold have their respective weaknesses, I think bitcoin is faster to gain profit in investing,but bitcoin prices are also very difficult in the guess,compared to a more stable gold price..

Both the things are different. I'm not sure why this comparison even exist. I mean bitcoin is product of blockchain that exist as decentralised entity and thus works mostly based on public ledger and investor base. It's value comes from there and it also doesn't carry any sort of taxes to change its value at the end user point. While gold is differently mamaged.. it's value comes from the cost of investment that is done on the extraction process, it includes different government charges and taxes and thus it gets the value that we see for it. You guys really think they are comparable with the value they have got. It will be versatile always.

If this we prove that all this is almost the same only gold raw goods and bitcoin is digital money.

Between gold and bitcoin we can use to increase our income, bitcoin is also easy to invest digital gold money is also easy to invest the world.

Jaf price comparison of gold and bitcoin almost the same no 0.5 kg difference in the price of gold equivalent to 1 bitcoin so there is no effect of changes to gold in the development of cripto money.

So far I am also wrong to know the difference in the price of gold and bitcoin turns out these two places of investment are the same no different in the price of the exchange rate.

Although bitcoin prices are now down and have not gone up anyway, the bitcoin price is equivalent to gold, and so if bitcoin rises again it will not change the exchange rate of gold and bitcoin.

But there is one thing we must know that if we invest with bitcoin we can get a big advantage if we are lucky but could also we suffered huge losses if we do not see the statistical details of cripto money market price changes, this is the way we need to pay attention to invest money cripto not just indiscriminately medeposit then make withdrawal without seeing the value of cripto money exchange price in cripto money market.

so before investing cripto money, gold and cash we should see the first price before investing.

bitcoin price is very difficult to predict, but many people who feel the benefits of this type of investment. if we can compare the two types of investment of bitcoin and gold, they are both at risk of their respective advantages and disadvantages. gold has more stable value and the risk is not too high, but can be easily falsified. while bitcoin is obviously very profitable but has a very big risk and can not be falsified.

You can't say that Bitcoin is much better in itself. If anything, it had been better during the last two years, but these days (years) may already be over by now. But it is not even only that. You can't possibly say that some asset is better than another judging only by its profitability. You should also take into account the risks connected with it. Some people may be more risk-averse than others, while some other people may not even be looking for profits at all. They may just want to preserve the value of their wealth via risk-free assets such as gold.

Trump is pumping gold prices and this will help to bitcoin price soon.
we need btc-gold correction to pass 12000 usd for bitcoin

At present bitcoin prices are much higher than gold. I think this is reasonable because gold is under state management and bitcoin is not. Bitcoin is a target for high profit investors. I am also investing in bitcoin.

Yes, gold is not interested investors, bitcoin has attracted many investors. Its price fluctuates so much so many people invest in bitcoin. The return on investment in bitcoin will be more when investing in gold

If gold does not attract investors then why is bitcoin only about 0.1% of golds market cap?

Maybe, because most of gold, which is still included in its market cap, is used as jewelry and not for investment purposes? Besides, something like 20% of all gold is hoarded by central banks and organizations such as the IMF. On the other hand, we shouldn't forget about the huge gold derivatives market like gold futures, options, ETF's and whatnot, while Bitcoin's derivatives market is outright pathetic and unlikely to become very popular in the future.

Well, familiar question but indeed very common between peer at the bar.

If BTC is following the stock price, and gold do the opposite, how can we compare such a different things ?

I mean, they have a scarcity in common but one has been out there for thousends of years, and the other is brand new in comparison. BY comparing two thing you need a ground that at least has something in common , am I right ?

So what are we talking about ?

There is a prominent difference in between the prices of the gold and that of bitcoin. The market value of gold is somehow very much stable and that we haven’t experienced any significant change in the market value of the bitcoin since a long period of time. Bitcoin on the other hand has a very visible change in the market value and that its market value is increasing very much significantly.

All people want to earn money. People earn a lot of money, to earn money, a lot of trouble. Everyone wants to live their life beautifully. There is a lot of needs in everyone life, money needs to fill the needs. People invest a lot of money for the income. Talking about current time bitcoin and gold. So we have to worry, we will be benefitted a little longer in investment.

People are very much benefited by investing in gold. Gold is the best used for the decorator. Sometimes it's price decreases, but the price of most of the time increases.

Bitcoin investment is a family's extra income. Bitcoin can fulfill all kinds of dream of a man. It is price decreases. For example, bitcoin market is much lower now. Now we can invest. Maybe there will be less prices for a few more days. Bitcoin will be invested with patience. It is price increases. After 2-3 months, it is price will be very high. After many days the price will increase, the average of gold will be 3 times higher as the bitcoin investment. There is a risk to everything. So take your risk. You will benefit from investing in gold. However, you will get a lot of benefits in investing of bitcoin.

of course bitcoin prices will always increase if bitcoins have very limited availability if bitcoins have very much availability as gold is definitely a very stable price movement and will gain a little profit therefore I prefer the bitcoin that is proven to have a price movement can make you get a lot of profit.

People want to think of Bitcoin as a new gold. Really, everyone knows that gold is rock solid (and heart touching), so by comparing Bitcoin to gold (putting these two assets at the same level or in the same department), they feel more confident about the future of their favorite coin. In short, it gives them faith. Now that the prices of crypto have plunged dramatically, they desperately need that.

Sorry, but you simply can't be serious that paper gold props up and not suppresses the price of gold.

When you increase the effective supply of anything, you reduce the price.  Simple as that.  (Unfortunately, many gold investors are still blind enough to believe paper gold equals the real thing, thus the increase in effective supply.)  The trust in paper gold is propped up by the size of institutions behind the paper, so that market is in effect a microcosm of money itself -- an elite inflated bubble, if possibly a long-term one.

The stock market (anti-) correlation is interesting but a short term phenomenon IMO.  In this discussion we have to look at fundamental issues.

Both gold and Bitcoin are non-state-issued money (ie unless you subscribe to the theory that the Fed secretly created Bitcoin -- but even then you have to treat it as non-state money for now, since that is how the elites want to pretend it is, and the elites still have a lot of power in this area.)

They are not subject to the perverse incentives for the politicians and (central) bankers to issue more and more for short-term benefit, and to use state power to prop up the value of the money and the other financial assets resting on top of it.

They are both free from being a liability of any entity, and they both provide ways to get around capital controls by a government, by not using the electronic money transfer systems.

Most importantly, they both represent a store of value that is free from the long-term inflationary state money system that is designed to benefit the elites but erode the wealth of savers (and do even worse to small debtors and developing countries, long term.)

Thus, even on a societal level, they provide the benefits of a more stable financial system and economy, and help reduce the long-term problems of exploitation, inequality, wars and conflicts that spring inherently from a purely debt-based money system.

I liked the your vision, maybe people want to trust Bitcoin and imagine that it will protect its value in time. Bitcoin with power and durability is similar to gold. In addition; they are similar to Bitcoin because they are usually generable.

I would never buy paper gold.

The entire investment thesis for gold is that your government may (effectively) devalue currency against gold in a financial crisis by trying to inflate away the debt.

Unless you're a multi-decade holder, the probability of this coming true is low, on a day to day basis, especially in the developed world.  But when it does pay off, your gains are likely much better than standard investments like stocks, bonds, and deposits.

But that is the very time when your paper gold will be under the most stress and be most likely to default.

So, as I wrote before,  buying gold is like playing a hand of poker where you invest in a small chance of hitting a big hand and winning a lot.  But paper gold has a special clause that says, that is the very scenario where you can't collect!

And the same holds for Bitcoin.  But I'm willing to bet that paper Bitcoin will take off -- it's early days yet and the authorities are being careful since this new market is so full of shady dealings.

To me this is in the 'sad but true' category.  There is even less reason to buy paper Bitcoin than paper gold, since the safe storage and moving of Bitcoin is much easier, in addition to all the other, similar, issues.  But, people will pile into them.  The sad truth is that people almost seem to want to be taken by the elites, if not by swindlers as well.

Gold has more stable price which will in future go slowly up in the same time bitcoin has ups and downs but in future its price should be like 10x bigger than now so investing in it should bring big profit.

it seems that bitcoin prices are more profitable than the price of gold because the total supply of bitcoin is currently very limited and has experienced almost the maximum limit if gold seems to have a very large total supply that makes the price less movement and difficult to gain profits.

To tell the truth, I'm totally serious, and I heard all these arguments, like "when you increase the effective supply of anything, you reduce the price", many times already. The problem with your reasoning, and any such reasoning in general, is that you don't take into account the gory details, which turn everything upside down. Paper gold is gold which is created on demand. That means there is no such thing as first increasing the supply and then prices going down because specifically in this case the relationship is inverse. Besides, paper gold may in fact be effectively negative as in shorts, so things get really complicated from here to assert anything conclusively.

Purely, there is no harm in diversifying, but I have never really bothered myself about gold anyway and I would rather go for other investments than trying to store gold for value. It may be worth it in the long run, but I believe bitcoin and cryptocurrency investment in general have more opportunity for investors than gold. Nevertheless, this is just my own opinion and no one can absolutely know what the future holds. Now a days people prefer to diversify within cryptos rather than touching gold or shares.

Right! Both have their own pros and cons but in most of the comparisons, bitcoin is having a clear edge over bitcoin. Bitcoin is able to meet the fast and high monetary demands of the market and investors which is not possible for gold to cope with. Gold has been limited to ornamental uses after the invention of this technology.  People are leaving gold market for participating into crypto market for bitcoin.

In the current business trend, I would prefer bitcoin to gold.

total bitcoin supply in the world is indeed limited and certainly many also become frozen balance and it makes bitcoin increasingly rare later then for gold supplai is always made and it is in terms of price will be like that

In older days only people are invested in gold for their future. In this modern era bitcoin is famous than gold. So people are ready to invest in bitcoin. If we invest in gold it will take too long to gain profit. But in bitcoin it is not like that. You no need to wait for such long time. We can profit in short term itself. This is the main reason people would choose the bitcoin rather than gold.

Gold ! What's that ? This is what is going to happen soon when people will actually stop talking about gold and will just talk about Bitcoin. Even newspapers will stop printing prices of gold and start printing the daily prices of Bitcoin. This day is not far as I can see Bitcoin is growing alot . Infact alot more than what was expected this year.

While it is obvious that I prefer bitcoin over gold we will make a terrible mistake if we underestimated gold if the economy collapsed today people will run and get gold not bitcoin and the reason is simple gold has been around for thousands of years while bitcoin is still very new compared to that and the growth of gold at that point could be almost infinite so it is a good idea to still have some gold just in case something like that happens.

Gold investments, averaged out, weren't much better than all the common investment instruments you enumerated, not for the last +30 years. In fact, they were performing worse than, for example, so-called TIPS (treasury inflation-protected securities). Indeed, if you were speculating with gold in a smart way, you would fare much better, but absolutely the same can be said in respect to such assets as stocks and bonds (not sure about deposits, though). And I'm not the only one pointing this out, that gold has been underperforming for the last few decades. In simple terms, its real value has been slowly deteriorating.

The most major paradigm shift in, say the US, was arguably the founding of the Federal Reserve.  So I suggest taking the period 1913 to 2018.  Gold has gone up on the order of 50 times (from ~$22 to ~$1300 per oz.)  The Dow Jones Ind. Average went from very approximately 1000 to today's, say, 25000, so 25 times.

Gold has got good support from common people around the globe. This is all because of the increased usage of gold on different needs. Bitcoin as a technology has gained a different reputation from people around the world. This has lead to the growth and increased popularity of bitcoin.

But I don't deny that. For the record, I'm quite pro-gold myself. However, the point is gold has always been and still remains a safe haven into which people run when things like major wars and economic meltdowns happen. With that in mind, I'm almost 100% sure that most of gold price rise in the 20th century occurred within just a few years. I suspect these years would be around and after the two world wars, Great Depression, and most certainly after the dollar had been divorced from its gold backup in early 70's as well as during the years that followed the Nixon shock.

That is right, that is why we should keep bitcoin rather than gold, I don't condemn gold as it is also profitable but it will take a lot of time unlike in bitcoin wherein you have the potential to gain even within the day depends on the value of bitcoin which is a good thing.

Everything has its own charm and charismatic traits that can’t be compared with something else. Like in this case, both bitcoins and gold have enormous characteristics that need to be observed carefully and only then you can find out what best hidden profits are hidden within these two elements. So this comparison is just waste because this will be ending with nothing.

I think gold have more stable price because market on commodity already mature. Gold already known as investment for centuries. Compare with bitcoin or cryptomarket, its far enough to compare. I am believe cryptomarket will stable and market cap on crypto will increasing more than highest

bitcoin more can get big results but of course, risks exist at large will also be bitcoin on gold. volatile remains a difficult issue for investors bypassed bitcoin.

Gold also poses great risks if you consider the people who have invested since 2013 into gold, probably never got any returns but  in that same periods bitcoin must have produced some 1500% of returns. Now say, are you ready to take risk or want to go with traditional options ?

I personally do not think altcoins are threat, they are altcoins and that is what they are always going to be, bitcoin is not going to remain stagnant in development and I am sure would keep progressing. Altcoins on the other hand would be more useful for investments while some of them who are claiming to be stronger than bitcoin without any serious usage or product will only end up useless. Let's wait and see.

I may agree with you that bitcoin has a stable price compares to bitcoin, but it will take a lot of time before you can have the ROI in your life,, but if it is fine rather than nothing profit at all, with bitcoin it is much risky but since the price is unstable then there is a chance that you'll earn in just a couple of days/months.

As an investor I would choose bitcoin instead of gold although gold investment is stable and less risky. The value of a bitcoin is much larger than an ounce of gold and I also choose to invest in bitcoin because it gives me more profit despite the risk.

gold is only for people who do not want to profit quickly but prefer the safest investment
but for me bitcoin is better with bitcoin able to grow money quickly and it does not take long to grow

It's probably true that gold is going down or flat most of the time, but going up quickly during short periods.  This would be consistent with the manipulation of gold prices by the elites, who want people to watch gold prices stay flat, or worse, most of the time.  (And this theory is fundamentally not different from the known reality under an official gold standard -- the gold standard was just an elegant way of suppressing gold prices in currency terms.)

The rise of gold prices in dollar terms only happened during the official devaluation during the Great Depression, the default on gold under Nixon in 1971, the US 'malaise' period at the end of the 70s, and the last global financial crisis.

The two world wars actually helped 'stabilize' the currency price of gold, because the imperial elites won and were able to apply a greater degree of financial repression to prop up state-issued currency.  Too bad, so many people died, but if it stabilized the elites' system, it's all worth it, right?

The wider market for gold won't let the network fall in such a large margin. One of which is the fluctuations, with gold user gets a stability and trust. With bitcoin the fluctuation and functional platform seems advanced, but people haven't learned to accept the reality.

People didn't die because the elites wanted to suppress gold value. Yes, they died and yes, price may have been subdued as a side effect of that, but it is still kinda non sequitur here. Regarding manipulation of gold prices by the elites in other times, I think this theory doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Why would they need that if they can get there without doing anything at all? In other words, there is no particular interest in gold apart from speculative in "peaceful" times. To me, your assumption looks more like a conspiracy theory rather than reality. It makes no practical sense to suppress gold prices when you can just put people in debt slavery and then no one thinks about gold twice or at all.

Every higher building is more prone to be fell down by calamities. same as for bitcs who are far more higher than normal and may cause disaster of its own

If we ae to compare the btcs and gold prices it would be no doubt that bitcs at the moment are far more expensive than btcs

of course Bitcoin is more expensive than gold, but nevertheless in gold metal will be much more promising in the future. You just look into the past, the history of gold, and everything will become clear. Gold and jewelry were valued everywhere and always, unlike other values.

It is a conspiracy theory, but I have no doubt it's correct.

Just on the physical evidence of today's gold suppression, read a book like 'The Gold Cartel' and 'Gold Wars.'  What this proves is that today is really not different from the gold standard days, just that the public narrative has changed and gold prices are more flexible.  (The more things change, the more they stay the same!)  Certainly, you can't deny that the gold and silver standards were just a way to suppress precious metal prices.

The low prices of gold reflect not just this suppression, but the average investor's attitude that it's usually a losing battle to fight the elites, and/or that gold just seems to be dropping most of the time, so there's some truth to your suggestion as well.  There's a saying that no one has enough power to fight the entire market, so a combination of physical and psychological manipulation usually works best, in modern times.

That is why, a ban of gold, for example, would be in poor taste in today's world.  Much better to portray yourself as market-friendly and that markets don't want gold.  But a true marketplace?  That would be suicidal.  Just before WWI, if the British elites didn't vehemently declare their readiness to redeem gold for paper sterling at the fixed rate, when Britain had only 3% of the gold required to redeem all their issued paper, do you think the average saver would have trusted the paper?

We will have to give the elites the benefit of the doubt, as we're unable to overhear someone say, let them die for this money system.  But the link between the money system and death is only slightly more indirect, and surely an intelligent member of the top elites should have seen the connection.  (See my post Death Is the Price of Imperial Money (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1773312.msg17688552#msg17688552).)

The entire system is based on forcing governments around the world toe the party line that helps prop up state issued money at the center of the empire.  If this causes debt slavery, conflict, economic pain, and the rise of figures like Hitler, then so be it.

The central problem of the world is that the money system is deceptive, and it's deceptive because members of the elites want to continue to receive unearned power and wealth.  This is an infinitely powerful incubator of discontent of all kinds, and war is only the most extreme form.

Conspiracy or not, I can't really accept this idea. Ultimately, what's in gold really? It is just a shiny metal but that's pretty much all there's to it. Even in cases of severe disasters, in a Mad Max scenario of sorts, it is weapons, food, and shelter that will be valued most. Gold stands somewhere in between, I mean, in between the cases where paper money is still valued and when nothing is valued apart from real things like those I mentioned. Besides, power has the ultimate value in society, not gold or some other tangible asset, and it is the thing which most conspiracy theories fail to consider and put into its proper place, that is at the top of the list.

Gold mining requires lesser advanced technology and comaparatively cheaper than btcs mining and so gold is also chaeper than btcs. Simply EQUAL

I would concentrate on btcs because its a resources based on algorithm patch and will be supplied constantly till eternity than gold

Why not?

You seem to sail pretty close to the fiat central bank line for your self description of being 'pro-gold.'

Power is not the ultimate value.  Not in today's world.  See The Real Reason for Holding Gold and Bitcoin (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1858027.msg18480086#msg18480086).

obviously different, bitcoin and gold investment are also different, bitcoin prices are very volatile compared to gold is quite stable, but bitcoin is more advantageous when compared with gold ..

Bitcoin investors and holders might find it interesting to know that major precious metal retailers have started accepting Bitcoin payments for gold, silver, platinum and other products from various mints.

Bitcoin price goes up and down while gold values goes up. But still, i need bitcoin than golds.

The value of bitcoin is much larger than some gold pieces and I also choose to invest in bitcoin because it gives me more profit despite the risks, but I accept this, because risk is the most exciting thing in business. As an investor I will choose bitcoin rather than gold even though gold investment is stable and less risky

BTC prices are much higher than gold. But it can not be said so, the calculation of the comparison between the price of BTC and gold has not had a standard for comparison. But in general BTC is more unstable than gold, despite the high price but contains many risks. Gold is a measure of the world economy. They are more stable.

I'm pro-gold really, but I'm certainly not obsessed with it. It is a time-proven and well-tried asset for storing wealth even if its real value goes down somewhat over decades, primarily because there was no major economic wreck in the last 40 years (2008 doesn't count as a complete economic shutdown). But if there will be none in the future or it will be a little bit too hard for gold to keep up with, it is useless (apart from jewelry).

Also, could you explain in a few words why power is not the ultimate value as far as society is concerned?

Gold is far better than volatile btcs. The former is physical portfolio that assures investment benefits but not like thos virtual cryptoz

There are multiple scenarios where gold is a good investment.  2008 saw gold at least double.

If you have power, it sounds good on the surface.  But you're in effect fighting against all those who held power in the past.  The incentives of the modern world system encourages the powerful to kick all cans down the road (especially in the monetary and financial realm.)  Most of your power will be spent countering the effects of the actions of your predecessors.

Bitcoin and Gold are very expensive but still i believe gold is better than bitcoin because the price of gold is stable and it increases rapidly unlike bitcoin were the price is always fluctuating ups and down.

I still believe gold is better than bitcoin because bitcoin is always affected by price volatility unlike gold were the price is stable and it goes up always.

well, for 1 gr gold, I think the price is quite far from bitcoin. can be said that bitcoin price is much better for now. but we can not rule out gold, because gold is also the best investment that has existed since the first to the present.

This claim can be challenged. Just 2008 with its subprime mortgage crisis maelstrom hitting everywhere surprisingly didn't affect the value of gold much. It was the subsequent rounds of quantitative easings that actually doubled its value. But it was not real growth as this growth was primarily based on expectations and anticipation of future devaluation of the US dollar due to monetary policies of the Fed back in the day. But when the dollar devaluation didn't occur, the gold value quickly returned to its baseline levels. In a nutshell, it turned out an overall false expectation, and the only way you could earn money was through speculation, which meant selling gold at 2011 highs. Those who invested in gold for long term didn't get much (if we include dollar inflation into consideration).


And how does it take anything from what I said about power being the most valuable asset in society? Indeed, people will be fighting for it precisely because it has so much value. If it didn't, who would care?

it's because that gold has physical form and bitcoin is not and people really like to have gold than bitcoin but once bitcoin reaching more people and many countries accepting gold and gold can be like gold, then people will change their investment to bitcoin. there will be a time for bitcoin to be like gold and people in all the country accepting bitcoin so people don't have to be worry or afraid about something bad in out there. still, it is different between gold and bitcoin and we cannot compare both gold and bitcoin because it's different function too.

bitcoin is an investment medium in the future is increasingly in demand as its value grows faster and profitable, and slowly people start to leave gold as a place to invest, because the value of gold is more stable, making it less profitable.

You may find this useful -

“According to a 2013 report from Thompson Reuters GFMS, it was believed that 171,300 tons of gold had either been mined or was still in the ground. Since there are 32,000 ounces per ton, we're talking about 5.482 billion ounces of gold in the entire world, based on this report. If each ounce was worth about $1,290, the world's gold supply would have an implied market cap of $7.07 trillion dollars. That's more than 100 times the market cap of bitcoin at its all-time high!

It's also worth pointing out that numerous reports exist on the world's total gold supply, and some suggest as much as 2.5 million tons may be present (that's over 14 times what Thompson Reuters has predicted). This would imply a $103 trillion market value for gold, or nearly 1,500 times that of bitcoin. Long story short, bitcoin still has a very long way to go to truly catch gold.“

We have a long way to go with btc vs gold prices, however if the crypto market has even 1% or 2% of the gold market we will be in an amazing place.

That's just physical supply, dont forget the paper market on top with comex also leveraged over 250:1 paper to physical gold.

Thats a lot of paper promises for every oz of physical they hold :)

Gold is more stable in value than bitcoin, if you do not want to be dizzy, gold may be a savings for you in the future, but bitcoin has an advantage that will rise in price and down or unstable, I consider it an advantage because to gain profit, when the coin price fall, at that moment is your chance to earn profit. And bitcoin value does not take long enough to recover the price.

Now a days bitcoin price is again rising and it is very good because from start of this year bitcoin is not showing any good movement in the crypto market and many users have sole their bitcoin due to which the price badly  affected the privies are changing over time and now a days the gold price are also high in the world market and in our country both the bitcoin and gold prices are it's peak.

For me, I've always wanting to buy bitcoin ever since and making sure to secure our future by having it for a long time, I love how gold stabilize in the market too, but if I were to choose I'll still choose and stick with bitcoin and invest my time and money with it rather than in gold.

Although bitcoin price is more expensive than gold but gold in paired with bitcoin to make long-term investment, but now people prefer to measure because most people do not know full bitcoin and also about the price of more stable gold, so people choose gold

It’s true that bitcoin has defeated gold in the terms of price but still I don’t think that bitcoin is better than gold and it will be able to replace gold in the future. This is because firstly, gold is way more popular than bitcoin all over the world. Gold has many more users than bitcoin who are ready to invest in gold.Gold has a physical entity and it is also a precious metal whereas bitcoin is just a digital form of currency. Most of the people trust gold where as there are only limited people who trust bitcoin.

Bitcoin, the blockchain based digital currency, is often thought to be a global haven asset like gold. In a time of global turmoil, even gold has become unreliable, and could be expropriated like India's. BTC can replace a lot of people have come to believe gold, because of the currency in addition to gold reserves of the ability and the ability of some gold did not, such as low fees, transfer capacity, rapid decentralized nature, etc.

Anyway you look at it, 2008 resulted in a de facto devaluation of the dollar against gold.


Since we were talking about financial assets, power doesn't really belong in the mix.  It's like saying your job is your most valuable asset.  It is, but so what?

Also, the price of acquiring power is vastly different from one person to the next.  To the vast majority, power is simply not accessible.  Financial assets are.

Power is not all it's cracked up to be, because it's constantly being weakened by kicking cans down the road, as I mentioned.  This 'depreciating value of power' is the reason why, until a great reset happens, the caliber of the people in power will keep getting worse.

All of this goes to saying, at a certain point, a great reset is bound to happen, since the incentives in the system mean that power will slowly eat itself alive.

What is Bitcoin? Pros and cons of investing in Bitcoin, make a reliable long-term investment. Understand the difference of tangible Gold versus cryptocurrencies. Buy tangible Gold ...
Perhaps the most obvious difference between Gold and Bitcoin is this: Gold is a tangible physical Precious Metal, whereas Bitcoin is digital. Yet the distinctions between the two run much deeper. Today, APMEX accepts Bitcoin as a form of payment.
Physical Gold Metal is a Precious Metal used by mankind as a medium of exchange for millennia. It is also useful in technology and manufacturing, and is appreciated for its beauty in the form of jewelry, art and keepsakes. Physical Gold is widely regarded as a sound long-term investment and a hedge against market volatility.
Bitcoin, on the other hand, is a coded, crowdsourced currency that did not exist until 2009.

Yes, you should be content with 10-155 annual return with your gold while we make that much in a day. It is funny to see people still sticking to gold or other traditional investments.

Yes, but then you have to explain the revaluation of the dollar against gold soon thereafter. I don't deny that the dollar was losing to gold in 2009-2011, but it was based on the expectations of the likely (or not so likely) collapse of the dollar system in the coming years rather than on reality. For example, there was no price hyperinflation or anything close to what can be loosely called that. When these expectations didn't come true, the speculative rise of gold mostly retrieved back to the baseline. In other words, it turned out to be only a temporary devaluation.

Many financial specialists have another viewpoint. They say that Bitcoin is the better investment, and its prices are growing faster than the prices of gold. Here is an article that can be useful:
https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin-gold-usd/

Though they are both different in form, but they almost have the same market price. But eventually, bitcoin will or had surpassed gold's value already. With its volatility, we can say that bitcoin's price can be twice as expensive as gold's in the future.

Bitcoin is really good for long term investment and there are a lot of people who are keep on investing so we can expect that the price will increase even further more while gold is not obtainable by a normal person and not everyone can simply earn it.

Gold is considered as a good stable and profitable investment that has been doing by people since years or score years. While Bitcoin is a modern technology that has made everything easy for you and these days it is very responsive and the price yesterday was 9.1k dollar and now today the price is 9.3k dollar. Gold beside any other investment is still good but the profit is low as compared to Bitcoin.

Bitcoin and gold is both good, but i am confidet that bitcoin will surely have more bright future than gold, and the future price of bitcoin can rise even $30k or $40k so in that way many people can earn more money with bitcoin over than gold.

I think bitcoin price is hundred times better than gold price. Nowadays bitcoin price is more than gold price. But as people are connected with gold investment for a long time . They think it's more faithful than any other investment. But in modern time investors find more interest in bitcoin investment.

bitcoin and gold are different investments and have different futures, there are some people who think gold is more profitable because it has a more stable price and a smaller risk, but for me bitcoin has a greater advantage but it may indeed have a greater risk also than gold, so each has its own enthusiast

For me Bitcoin is the best because Bitcoin price move faster than gold and If you are holding gold its like 1%-20% yearly but If you are holding Bitcoin it should be 120% or more and you can use Bitcoin to buy other cryptocurrency.

The problem between bitcoin and gold is that, they are both profitable but not both obtainable, i can say that bitcoins is more profitable more than gold since everyone can easily invest and start trading in the market.

There is many differences between Bitcoin and Gold, so we cant compare between their prices since they are differents.
Bitcoin is firstly a digital currency, and also an asset. While gold is an physical asset and used mainly offline.
But usually Gold's prices are a lot more stables than Bitcoin which is known by its volatility.

That's right. I think Bitcoin or cryptocurrencies, in general, are still too young to be compared to gold, which is already an institution, especially amongst things of value. It has proven it's worth time and time again over the years, and that's why, gold is one of the most stable, but most expensive items as well. Much to the opposite of Bitcoin, that although it is expensive, it lacks that stability aspect that people look for.

Yes their are many differences because gold we can use this as a personal collection and we can use it offline, while bitcoin we need internet to mine and get bitcoin. The price are different too bitcoin price are very fast to go up and down and gold are so stable.

I agree that in bitcoin it is now possible to earn and not bad to increase profit. However, very long hold bitcoin, especially in those cases when it reaches very high its price values, I would not have risked, given the result of the last drop of bitcoin since December last year. Therefore, I would now prefer to earn in bitcoin, and keep the earnings already about half in gold.

Bitcoin for me is already surpassed the price value of Gold. This topic has been discussed so many time here in this forum in different thread section. Then also for me Bitcoin produce profit in just a matter short period of time while in Gold price is not that quick as like bitcoin does.

Bitcoin and Gold prices are very different. We can not equate between Bitcoin and Gold. Maybe everyone can believe in Gold but not everyone can believe in Bitcoin. Bitcoin still sounds very foreign while Gold is already very well known throughout the country. But if for me the most profitable is Bitcoin. This has been very proven.

it is obviously proven that bitcoin prices are far superior to gold, but these two species must have their respective weaknesses and advantages, so people can definitely tell which one is better to serve as an investment asset for a much more future promising its value.

For me bitcoin and gold is the same high in terms of our market value. But gold is established by a thing, we're in people used to wear. While bitcoin is known as a kind of money, through online transaction.

There is numerous contrasts amongst Bitcoin and Gold, so we cannot think about between their costs since they are differents.
Bitcoin is right off the bat an advanced money, and furthermore a benefit. While gold is a physical resource and utilized primarily disconnected.
Be that as it may, normally Gold's costs are significantly a larger number of stables than Bitcoin which is known by its unpredictability.

Perhaps the most obvious difference between Gold and Bitcoin is this: Gold is a tangible physical Precious Metal, whereas Bitcoin is digital. Yet the distinctions between the two run much deeper. Bitcoin is a digital coin. Like gold, it is made by mining, but the process is completely electronic. Gold has been used as a form of currency for more than 2,000 years. The supply of gold—as in, what we can access—increases when miners retrieve the precious metal from the ground. Which is wonderful to see.

                                      Bitcoin vs. Gold Prices
                                     ==============


<><><><>Gold and silver have the unique attribute that their scarcity is secured by physics rather than code and data,
so I think there will always be a special role for them.

And it also helps that you can't create alt-precious-metals everyday!<><><>

Bitcoin price can became more expensive over than the gold price, and i think a lot of people will surely choose to invest with bitcoin because even the the value of it is not stable, but the value of it can be very high in the future.

Well it relies on the circumstance , for my own sentiment, bitcoin is currently most costly than gold, in light of the fact that bitcoin is extremely costly and exceptionally secure not at all like gold, it can be effectively stole.

Bitcoin is believed to be the new gold of today. But the only difference between the prices of these two entities is that gold's prices are stable compared to bitcoin's volatile that rises and falls drastically any time of the day.

no one knows the price of bitcoin in the future. fluctuating bitcoin prices make many people afraid to invest bitcoin.
government recognition of bitcoin is also very influential.

Gold and bitcoin both are profitable things in different circumstances. Gold is old and more trustable then Bitcoin because it is use everywhere.  Bitcoin is a digital currency and highly volatile in comparison to gold. And gold has a stable price in most of the time. Another thing is gold has physical appearance which makes increase its market price higher than gold. Bitcoin price is not stable.  its price is more than gold only for a limited time but not always. Gold is more trustable then Bitcoin and it is usable every corner of earth due to this many investors invest in gold in comparison to Bitcoins  :)

If we comparing prices only, bitcoin is the winner already but at my opinion it's wrong because gold have value in real life for example. Also gold have stable price and more turst than bitcoin.

Obviously different like heaven and earth. Now the gold price is not the best hope to invest. But with the difference with bitcoin prices it may now be very far away to want it. Precisely now is the best day to join in bitcoin patiently selling next year you will get rich. And gold may also be rich, but the time ratio is 1:10.

the price of gold and bitcoin are very different. both in price turns are also different. gold tends to slow in price increases but bitcoin is faster. fluctuating properties in bitcoin make prices rise and fall quickly

Gold is better for most "securing savers" but the reasons are not only to be safe from governments and central banks. it's also to secure the funds against the currency losing value.

In my opinion, bitcoin is like gold in digital world. Bitcoin price more expensive than gold because bitcoin supply less than gold supply. Max supply bitcoin only 21million coin and gold always mined

If the price comparison is obviously gold lost by bitcoin, but gold has a more stable price than bitcoin. Bitcoin also has a recap of rising prices higher than gold, but bitcoin can also fall in price in just a matter of days, hours, minutes and seconds.

I try not to speculate on the precise cause of each price movement, at least in this kind of discussion.

In the 70s, gold went from $35/oz (a price set in 1934) to $800 around 1980, and then back down to the $300 level and basically stayed flat.  In the mid 2000s, gold went eventually to the $2000 level, and then back down to the $1000 level in early to mid-2010s, and basically stayed flat.

We see a pattern.  Gold basically holds flat most of the time, except for step-wise movements up ($35 to $300 to $1000.)  But each step up, or devaluation of the dollar, is accompanied by a big overshoot, followed by a big drop.  This overshoot-and-drop pattern also seems to hold with Bitcoin (and even more so with altcoins.)

Over the decades, we can formulate a theory *based on these numbers alone* that the dollar is essentially continuously devalued against gold, when the noise is taken out.   (And I won't explicitly speculate as to why the noise is there!)

(BTW, we have to look at the pure price of gold in dollars, not 'inflation adjusted dollars,' as you call them.  If there's such an asset as inflation adjusted dollars, please let me know and I would love to own it!)

I am a bit confused about the whole idea. Why would bitcoin be a part of the monetary engineering thing for any of these countries when it was not even made or invented to do this tasks? Is this just an analysis of yours trying to connect things or you do really have proofs for that statement. Or is this just all coincidence. This is not even under the government control so how can one country benefit from it?

When it comes to investments, bitcoin would still top over gold due to it high volatility wherein you can get more out of. Of course, with this high rewards there is also higher risks.

With the current market situation, many people are reluctant to invest in virtual currencies because it is time for the virtual currency to fall, suggesting that gold prices are rising, but with some uncertainty. In my opinion, investing in virtual money is a right way.

I think gold is an excellent place to invest but compared to bitcoin, both have different characteristics and are both profitable and risky. Bitcoin has the higher risk, but returns are higher than gold investment. There may be people who are at risk because they are still going.

however, both can be said to be the best investment for now. bitcoin is great for generating revenue retrieval tools, especially if it's in a short time. we can take advantage of trading. but, gold also has other advantages.

Sometimes, we need to explore things out and if we can find out that bitcoin is  better than gold by evaluating them both then we can just simply follow our instincts, that is why it is so important that we know personally what we are entering at.

The demand for gold is very diverse, and bidding with its participation is almost universal and regulated on many exchanges. Crypto currency is also widespread, but only in those countries that have recognized legal transactions with crypto currencies. However, gold differs very much from crypto-currency. Gold is less volatile and it has more liquidity on the market.

Well, everything has its own pros and cons. You can’t just compare any two things and then say one is better than other by only seeing some aspects. If you want to compare two things, you must compare them throughout. In this scenario, although bitcoins are doing amazing and in many aspects they are tremendous than gold but you can’t just deny the appraisal and strong hold of gold as well.

Bitcoin is the best because of its value the chance to increase high in the market. Actually we couldnt compare gold in terms of its prices because of the more volatility happen in bitcoin always than gold. Although I can say gold is important in our economy impact.

It is known that gold prices are now very stable but to invest in the gold can also face the risk of small when the price of gold always kept at a certain level while the virtual currency developed at a level Higher degrees, but people still choose gold.

Gold and bitcoin have many advantages. Of course gold is much more stable than Bitcoin. Gold will never lose its value, it was valuable from the beginning of mankind and will be here forever.This is a great reliable and stable investment. However, if you want to get big profits quickly, it's better to choose Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is profitable because of the demand in the market and everyone can earn cryptocurrency if they are just determined while gold cannot be obtained simply and it needs a lot of paper works in order to have it.

If you want the value of your money is not lost, I think you should buy gold, because the price of gold does not have much fluctuation. Bitcoin is different, if you want to get more of what you own, then bitcoin is a good choice.

Bitcoin now days is going very stable between few dollars and that is why the market is normal and all the processes are going normal we are observing  only little jumps and nothing more. It made easy for people to take their decisions to buy at this time, in other sense the coin is giving some more time to people that for investment the time is still available but soon it is going to fly. On the other hand gold has remained stable and this stability gets out one factor but the profit is low as compared to that from Bitcoin.

This two was totally different from each one but pointing out the possible profit that can we make no doubt its on bitcoins. Technically we didn't need to compare each of the properties or the advantages and disadvantage, as we are starting in the coming era it will both have some good values and whichever we can use as trading assets. Valuing any of this is much give importance and having a good mind towards any practices of having both of this.

I love cryptocoins, thats not only about its price or value, but the whole thing. Diffent altcoins have different features that changing the world.

With due respect to other opinions I do certainly believe that bitcoin is not really comparable to gold in many ways. Gold is physical and no matter how the market changes in price still gold is a precious thing. While bitcoin even with a very differences in ratio would change its value. It is volatile as it is also digital and non existent in the real physical world. But I don't dismiss the idea that it is not that good as an investment. It is just I do favor gold no matter what.

I second the motion here, bitcoin is subject to drastic price fluctuations and could not maintain it's peak price whereas gold demonstrated it's reliability and it will never lose its intrinsic value as precious metal with numerous practical applications.

That is totally understandable.  A country's government can benefit from Bitcoin by holding a lot of it and using its holdings to ensure its own currency doesn't drop too much in value against Bitcoin.  (This is assuming Bitcoin has gained widespread trust as a good store of value.)

State issued currency is being inflated all the time, because of the incentives for the elites to issue more money and debt.  From the elites' point of view, it's better to have a non-state money be the support for their issued money, in this way.  This is the entire reason for having hundreds of years of modern history under gold or silver standards.  (A stable gold/silver standard was the 'best' environment for the elites to skim off the cream of the economy by issuing money and debt.)

The reason 'top' economists have attacked gold since the 1960s and 70s is that, since 1914, every government has defaulted on gold and was forced to give up the gold standard, and the public's desire for gold would make it difficult for governments to run totally fiat currencies.

Bitcoin and cryptos provide a way for the elites to go back to the good old days of gold and silver standards, without an embarrassing devaluation of state money against gold/silver.  It's just that, for the project to succeed, they have to make us believe the entire crypto-space has risen up independently.

As a crime detective, before you know anything, if you simply ask 'who benefits?'  you will be more than halfway to your solution, if you find a reliable answer.  I don't of course have any direct evidence of the actual deed (which in this case would be the Fed or BOJ creation of Bitcoin in secret, for example,) but I have lots of indirect evidence.

The problem is that the vast majority of the educated public don't understand this benefit, and they have no evidence other than 'Satoshi disappeared.'

Bitcoin is more profitable indeed, but it is equally risky compared to Gold where prices hover on relatively the same levels and sometimes would even rise higher depending on situations around the world. Bitcoin may make you rich, but the already rich use Gold for safety.

Bitcoin price is at the top among all the other currencies due to its demand and love of people as they are tired of using the old payment systems and transacting systems that are costing them huge amount for they do not want to lose their money on banking systems. Gold is also a stable investment but people are doing it with great intentions. But today world is of Bitcoin.

Gold is far more valuable for me than Bitcoin at this point in time. Every grain of gold counts and is is far far higher than satochi's worth. so Gold is still higher than Bitcoin.

If you view both as competing currencies then determining which is best is not very productive is it? It will be very interesting to see how the exchange rate btc-gold will look like in the future, maybe when cryptos stabilize a bit more.

Bitcoin makes investors really sure it's safe to invest their money into it. Bitcoin price also increases fast for years and that's really good for investors too.

well, bitcoin will be our top choice in that choice. even more so when bitcoin prices really skyrocket. gold is very good to make investment tool, but for me, bitcoin is the number 1 for now. it is the best investment tool.

No doubt in these. I have different opinions than other people about bitcoins and gold. We can’t just compare them. Bitcoins aren’t the kind before gold and so is the gold before bitcoins. These both are kings in their own world. But here, if your priority is a safe hand gaming where you may get low but less risky profit, then gold is best. And in other case, for big profits with her risk, bitcoins are amazing.

Gold and Bitcoin (and cryptocurrencies in general) are two entirely different types of assets which serve completely different purposes. Crypto is for speculators, while gold (as well as other precious metals) is mostly for those who are looking to preserve their existing wealth. It could be said that gold is for those who already built their wealth while crypto for those who are yet building it. Indeed, it is possible to speculate with gold too as there are plenty of gold derivatives which offer you volatility (since this is what speculators are looking for) on par or even exceeding that of Bitcoin.

But in this thread, "paper" gold (that is gold derivatives) is heavily frowned upon, and the discussion is mostly about gold in its physical form (as opposed to paper gold), which you can touch with your fingers and stash away in the backyard of your home.

My opinion is equally good but it's better if we choose both. If there is more money we save gold and bitcoin because gold is also a good price but more with the increase in bitcoin may be a great one. so it's good to take a 50% / 50% investment.

Gold and Bitcoin are fundamentally similar in that they are both non-state-issued money, they both have more or less limited supply, and they both don't suffer from the destructive incentives of human-issued money.

So, as asset classes, they have fundamentally the same benefits and risks.  (Among the risks is that the elites have the incentives to suppress their value when possible, except possibly for Bitcoin, at this time, since Bitcoin needs to gain enough market capitalization to become a player at all.)  That said, Bitcoin's price is still a small fraction of gold, when comparing the same proportions of total supply.

Also, since much of the world's gold has likely moved from West to East, and Western central banks have likely drawn down their gold reserves during their decades of gold price suppression (remember the 1971 US default on gold was simply to avoid a total loss gold by the US government,) the West likely favors Bitcoin, while China and Russia favor gold, as non-state, reserve assets.

Another major difference is that gold is fundamentally a better safeguard of your savings against the long-term inflationary system set up by governments and central banks: if the elites want to suppress Bitcoin for whatever reason, all they have to do is to buy altcoins and sell bitcoins.  The only alt-gold is silver and new precious metals can't be created by writing code.

So take these factors into consideration when allocating your funds between gold and Bitcoin.  One thing is for sure: you need to diversify and own both.

Each type has a different value and has different advantages. Although their risk is very high, they are very profitable for us. Gold is an asset, and a measure of value for the entire world economy. They are safer and the profit they bring is lower than BTC.

Well, from my perspective, you make an erroneous assumption and draw conclusions based on wrong premises. Neither gold nor Bitcoin are money nowadays. Let's face it, money is defined by what functions it has in the economy. Gold has already lost most of these functions, while Bitcoin hasn't yet acquired them fully. Both gold and Bitcoin are just investment assets like many others out there, for example, real estate, land, stocks, etc. Each of these types of assets has limited supply, and they don't typically "suffer from the destructive incentives of human-issued money" (you can't print more land), but this is a prerequisite, a required quality for something to be a valuable asset.

In other words, this "fundamental similarity" is a shaky ground for comparison. It is way too general and broad.


That depends on what you are looking for. If you are a conservative, "value" investor like Warren Buffett and his sidekick Charlie Munger and want to preserve the value of your capital, gold is the way to go (if you were to choose between gold and Bitcoin).

There is a theory that western countries can lose their debt through bitcoin. Will they be able to control bitcoin in this situation? The only thing that elites can do is to allow and prohibit crypto-currencies. Bitcoin will definitely exceed the capitalization of gold with such development

Gold and bitcoin are very poorly compared to each other. Now it's very profitable to make money in bitcoin, but it's best to partially withdraw the profit and convert it into either ordinary currency or gold.
 We can not be sure that bitcoin will grow in price for a long time, and not only grow, we also can not be sure that bitcoin will not fall to its original value in the near future. As for gold, we can be sure that it will always be valuable. This is one of the most significant and undeniable advantages of gold.

This is not the case as I have already explained before. The rapid surge of gold prices (in terms of over the decades) is not actual dollar devaluation, depreciation, hyperinflation, and whatnot. It is an expectation of future events probably unfolding in that direction. So far these expectations didn't come true, and that accounts for the subsequent massive retreats of gold prices.


In my view, treasury inflation protected securities (so-called TIPS) cut it pretty close to being such an asset, at least as long as official inflation assessment is accurate. I know that you are going to argue over this point, but you can't fool everyone about inflation rates for any longer periods of time. If you mess with the numbers and cook the books, the errors would add up over the years until you can no longer hide real inflation numbers and then you are going to stand there tongue-tied making fool of yourself and your stats.

In expensive terms, bitcoin might win away from gold. But about the stability and value of gold goods I think is superior. Most people like bitcoin because the price can rise quite high in the not-too-distant future. While gold takes a very long time in the addition of value prices.

Bitcoin and gold differs in one another just because Bitcoin as an investment is done through internet access and when you invest in it it is a risk because you don't know what will happen to your money while gold as an investment is a material you can see it and hold it and you had no fear if loosing it .

Bitcoin won’t replace gold. They have a different purpose. Gold is used for ornamentation due to the inherent properties,  and it provides such as malleability and shine. While bitcoin does not offer ornamental advantage. However it might be true that the price of BTC is predicted to hit less than $100 in five year because  thebhigh volatility of bitcoin price. Bitcoin investments is more volatile than gold investments and the risks involved with gold investments are way less than those involved with bitcoin investments which is why gold appeals to people more. They know that even if the percentage of ROI is much smaller compared to that of bitcoin, their money are more safe because bitcoin price is obviously more volatile.

Two objects are equally implied because both are obtained by way of mining or mining. As we know, gold mining has been done for centuries and is derived from crops. While bitcoin mining is done digitally that is through solving a series of mathematical problems (puzzle) based on certain difficulty level.
But you need to know that gold trading and bitcoin trading is very different in terms of price transactions. Gold and bitcoin can both be traded online. Determining bitcoin prices tends to rely on speculation. While gold, there are fundamental factors that affect the movement of gold prices. But physical ownership, like physical gold, becomes one of the advantages for gold. This is what makes gold a valuable asset for centuries and its ever-growing value.

It is not about beliefs and personal preferences as such. Bitcoin is more like stock, any way you look at it. And it's not like blue chips where the stocks of IBM, Apple, Microsoft, and their likes truly belong to, but more like second-tier stocks where not so firmly established companies fit into. In this aspect, altcoins (well, most part of them) are just trash or junk stocks which are here today but gone tomorrow. Gold is a completely different animal which is entirely alien to these beasts, which lives in a completely different environment.

People should understand that most if not all comparisons between gold and crypto are meaningless because they are based on inconsistent criteria, for example, profitability and reliability.

If we compare the price of course I prefer bitcoin, bitcoin price can rise hundreds or even thousands of percent per year while the gold price only rose not more than 20% per year, but for security reasons then I will share my money for gold and bitcoin.

Yes, Bitcoin is supposed to be big money with many well-known investors, many of whom are involved in Bitcoin waiting for the price to rise in the bull market. At present, investment in the gold market is not as volatile as Bitcoin. Many people choose the gold investment.

By comparing it they have both own unique properties that we don't considered. In prices, bitcoins can make huge difference in inflation and it has a higher rate of risk of manipulation and prone in dumping so the volatility of price can chanhe from time to time. Gold was still on growing with a stable price rise movement that we can noticeably see the the big difference in both prices.

Bitcoin is the medium of modern trading. It's price increases and decreases. Investing at a lower price increased up to a few times.
Gold is more used used in decoration. It's price decreases, leads to if the price increases. It does not grow too much. I think, bitcoin investment can be of much benefit to gold.

This could hypothetically work out for smaller countries or countries in a dire economic situation such as Venezuela, Zimbabwe and other countries where local monetary systems have already failed (Zimbabwe) or are in the process of failing (Venezuela). Bigger and more powerful countries don't need that since they have enough power and economic as well as administrative muscle to force the use of a national currency onto the masses as long as they themselves pursue sane economic and monetary policies with inflation rates bridled.


This is not the real reason behind gold and silver being used as money back in the day. The true reason is that states were weak then, rulers were often overthrown as a result of warfare or intrigue, and thus nobody would use paper money when it was guaranteed to lose all purchasing power in a couple of years, not even the kings themselves. Paper money, and especially paper money not backed up by anything (aka fiat) is an attribute of a powerful state.

You seem to be overwhelmed (bordering on obsessed) with conspiracy theories.

If you will buy more than this even then you won’t earn high with bitcoin so it is the good to buy bitcoin instead of gold, People are not really aware of it that gold investment is now an old fashioned investment which consumes more investment but gives small profit; it is good to buy bitcoin only and earn high profit than any other investment.

But the time has changed and bitcoins have became much more expensive than even gold and platinum

Comparing Bitcoin price with the prices of gold, you can always visit the site that gives you the best information about it: https://goldprice.org/cryptocurrency-price/bitcoin-price

The price of gold and bitcoin prices may be equally valuable and equally valued, even though both are worth more of the price of bitcoin fluctuating than the relatively stable gold price and even so the bitcoin price is very rich more than the price of gold today still relatively cheap.

Gold is differnet than BTC, and also their prices and charts are differents as well. Gold is much older than Bitcoin and a lot more trusted by people, its price is more stable while BTC price is always volatile.
In the other side, Bitcoin price is going up actually faster than Gold's price.

Bitcoin is at the stable path these days and the price is moving around 9k dollar which is a biggest achievement because the price was very low last month and from the start of the year but suddenly the price started the increase trend and now the value is stable at this stage. Gold is better but you will get less profit as compared to Bitcoin profit.

There is no need discussion for this comparison due to bitcoin advantages.. bitcoin goes up again and again..

Gold will never give best profit as like bitcoin's profit because gold price is increase after many years but bitcoin price is increase very fast and its price also going to high, so that's why when you invest in bitcoin it will give you best profit and that's why you can everything in your life but if you invest in gold it will never huge profitable as like bitcoin and that's why you can never get benefits in gold's profit, so bitcoin is much better than gold.

Can be said so, the same as 100 years ago when everyone rely on the post office to send letters or documents, the presence of emails has replaced the post office function and I'm sure that the presence of bitcoin soon replaces gold someday.

Gold is a dead investment. We could not get good returns on Gold, while Bitcoin has given us highest return on investment. Better to invest in Bitcoin rather than Gold.

Yes. The gold market is stable, so investing in them will be profitable. BTC high risk and high profit. Anything has its value. so dare to take risks you will soon rich.

As compared to bitcoin, the bitcoin value is higher than gold, bitcoin is more difficult to store than gold, and a bitcoin is non-material, gold is the object

Gold price is amazing it is really always in a status of high price and it take a long time before its price change. While bitcoin price is said to be the more profitable because every small amount of capital that we maybe invest on it it can maybe give us a huge return back so then I believe that bitcoin price is more amazing.

It is dead until it is undead. If you don't know the history of gold, you'd better learn it. Then you would know when gold turns into a great investment, when you start to bless the stars for saving your wealth as gold. Whenever there is an expectation of future dollar devaluation, gold soars massively. And note that it is not required for the dollar to actually devalue, it is enough for people just to expect something like that in the near future. Now imagine what is going to happen to the price of gold if even some of these expectations turn true.

If you think that Bitcoin in these conditions and under such circumstances will soar too, then more power to you. Iit could be said with a good degree of certainty that it will behave more like stocks. Stocks and gold are typically well correlated. I mean, in the negative way, of course. Bitcoin is for speculation, but all speculation dies if situation becomes really dire.

I prefer bitcoins over gold because the growth in the market is very fast more than gold, another thing is that, gold is also profitable because of the markets volatility so you can always get profit when you trader or just sell your coins.

Actually i would choose bitcoin instead of gold although gold investment is stable and less risky. The value of a bitcoin is much larger than an ounce of gold and I also choose to invest in bitcoin because it gives me more profit.

There is an inherent contradiction between the two functions of money. A currency that is superior in storage, such as gold and bitcoin, is often not a good medium. Similarly, the use of fiat currencies, such as those used around the world, as a means of circulation is less reliable.

It is all about matter of choice. If someone wants a steady and reliable resource of income that is quite stable and less risky but low in profits than gold is best option. And in other case, when the things are quite reversed and you want to go for big profits in short time span then bitcoins are the only king here. So it depends on the needs. Nothing can be a perfect package for you.

The price of btcs are around 10k per btcs and which is certainly much higher than gold price.

Btcs are more advantageous. Gold will ultimately end up its resource content some day but about btcs, it will continue to thrive.

Objectively gold is the best asset but it does not mean that gold is a simple asset I mean that gold has the long positive trend but a typical investor is usually not be able to earn using this trend because this trend is on a very long time frame and a typical investor does not operate such long periods in the other hand bitcoin is more applicable to short and medium term investment.
Finally pay attention that gold is pretty overvalued comparing with silver. Gold market is quite difficult market.

This is what establishment commentators like to say.  Gold and Bitcoin are just investments.  They are not money.  My question is: if they're not money, what are they?  They don't allow you to live inside (like real estate.)  They don't claim a share of company profits and equity (like stocks,) and they don't claim a future stream of debt repayment (like bonds.)  Why do they have value?

You can slap whatever label you want on something, but the inner reality is always what really matters in the end.  Gold has value because of its monetary nature.  The elites suppress it but allow it to have some value, because it's one of their back-up plans if and when their system collapses.  Gold is not circulating only because the elites have so far been able to force poor countries to help prop up the value of Western state money, among other manipulations.

Bitcoin is a slightly more complicated picture, but there are broad similarities.  You could say the only major difference is that Bitcoin was designed from day one to play the role gold and silver are forced to play, ie to be a store of value only and not a means of exchange.

'Massives retreats' notwithstanding, the overall pattern from 1913 (the Federal Reserve's founding) to today is that the stable-over-long-period dollar price of gold went from $22, to $35, to around $300, to around $1000.  Call it whatever you like, we have never left the gold standard de facto, because we can't, and we have been continuously devaluing the dollar against gold to keep the system stable.

From $22 to $1000, the dollar lost 98% of its value against gold.  I'll let that speak for itself.

You are joking, right :)  Gold/silver backed currency was the backbone of the British Empire and the Dutch Empire before it. It was also the case for the US until 1971.  Were these 'weak states' which were apt to fall in 'a couple of years?'


The proof of the correctness of any idea must be by argument, not by labeling them as conspiracy theories or truths.  I only have to tell you that mainstream economists were totally in favor of the gold standard when the elites had enough gold, but are totally against the gold standard since all countries defaulted on gold (ie after 1971.)  With this alone, can you tell me there is no deception in either the system or the opinion of economists?

The problem with you is that you use your better knowledge in economics to overpower the average user, to push your elite-friendly agenda.  But you don't really understand money (and you still haven't responded to my point that deflationary pain, for which mainstream economists like to blame gold and the future use of Bitcoin, is only caused by elite-driven asset inflation and economic distortion in the first place.)  This lack of understanding is shown clearly by comments like the above, about the gold/silver standards.

But very few people really understand money (and I mean in practice, as opposed to what it 'should' be in theory.)  So you're far from being alone.

For me I dont know the Gold price but for for bitcoin price I'm surely that I will know it.I'm here not only for having a price of bitcoin but to know more about dealing crypto currency.

If comparing the price of bitcoin and gold then like comparing the river water with sea water, everything is very different, bitcoin can rise and fall hundreds or even thousands of percent per year while gold is very stable and never fluctuate.

I found true situation with your quote. It is really different that gold price may the same compared to bitcoin price. Because gold price may not fluctuates everyday but bitcoin may too. In regards to investment gold profits is stable always but bitcoin investment are very volatile and unpredictable but the great chances of earning a lot of profit is with bitcoin because it always doubled the price of gold when good market correction comes out.

I like Gold better than bitcoin, because of bitcoins volatility, it makes it harder to purchase and it needs time to increase its value. But otherwise it is also the thing I like in bitcoin, it has a low point and a peak value, I can invest on it on the time of its lowest point and earn in its highest peak.

Bitcoin is the clear winner.Gold prices are very stable and does not yield that much of profit.The users of gold receive very less or nil in terms of profits.Bitcoin's value is  very volatile and this is the main reason for the huge profit margin it gives.Bitcoin is a money earning opportunity for all of us.

Bitcoin always wins the race, around an year the speculation around the cryptocurrency network was completely related to gold price to the bitcoin price. Later in unexpected time span bitcoin overtook the value of gold. This growth continued for a longer time period making bitcoin the best.

In comparing with gold price in most countries, gold price is more or less stable, at the same time bitcoin prices are insane