Bitcoin Forum

Hi

anyone have hear about this?

is this for the first avalon chip?

or else?

The boxes are of a different dimension from the Avalon batch 1,2,3 miners, so, i think it's their next gen.
Pretty pics incoming.

However let's not forget how much he screwed us and don't buy overpriced hardware in an auction.

Yifu calls in next gen. KNC en Bitfury call it Gen -2  ;D

Yifu and BFL both down the drain

he may be auctioning, but whos bidding?  ???

naive guys, greedy guys, noobs..

NO fucking way am I depositing coins to that dodgy tradehill mob just to be able to BID on a avalon
you have got to be kidding me

Link?

https://tradehill.com/auctions

Whats the word on tradehill graet ??

It appears that you have to upload photo ID and utility bill, and then deposit bitcoins before you can even see the specs of the avalons that you are supposed to be bidding on....that's if they ever show you the specs at all...?

What's more is it appears to be a blind auction (ie you don't see any other bids).

Think I'll steer well clear of this...

Awfully similar to what Redhash is doing.   :o :o

Does Tradehill, by chance, insure the Bitcoins placed in their 'deposit accounts' ... caveat emptor ...

What a bunch of BS this is. After screwing almost everyone (except batch1) over they come up with this "exclusive" auction nonsense with TradeHill. I was going to get upgraded modules for my avalon units but after seeing this there is no way I am depositing btc with tradehill just to have the "privilege' of bidding on their most likely overpriced and poorly supported hardware.

Tradehill version one was a failed exchange, the current "tradehill" bought the name as it was "trusted" in btcworld then aimed for large traders only, haven't heard much from them until this auction

I would have thought that nobody would buy from Yifu ever again after the chip fiasco. I guess people have short memories.

I think reaction is reinforcing that view, I wasnt planning to, but not impressed at latest "efforts"

Legit ?   ???

i think the same guy, jared reopened tradehill with a different aim.

Trololo! What utter garbage! YiFuck, you manage to surprise us every time -- and not in any positive way  ;D

Anyone with an account there have any info on the specs? / going price?

he dosent have the balls to auction here no more ?  ::) ;D

Yifu made it pretty clear during the chip fiasco that:

1) He was not in control
2) He had zero influence over whether or not the guys in China shipped parts

Basically he is a glorified reseller only, and reseller with no control or influence over anything at that.

Why people would give him any more money is beyond me. He has no ability to get parts, influence pricing or specs, or anything. Worst he completely oversold who he is and what he could do. No one should ever trust him.

I thought there were no "pre-orders" anymore from YiFu? Does that mean his 2nd gens are ready and shipping? Or is he just breaking his promises again?

Yes but he seems to be the guy with access to the private key that holds Avalon's BTC.  So in that sense he who has the money has a big stick... now how much his counterparts listen to him of course can be debated.

He delivered the first REAL ASIC when other people were just selling pre-orders ...you should have a little respect.
You all talk about BFL but you still order from them!!! WTF!!! Have some balls!!! Bitcoin mining is all about balls and taking the decision and the risk when it should be taken...
In my case, i got my chips with 4 weeks delay, but i got them ....

                           https://i.imgur.com/mhDiLIj.jpg

Are you sure?

Heres my respect for Y I FU,

http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h148/Bigblock462/flipit.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/Bigblock462/media/flipit.jpg.html)

He fucked over THOUSANDS of custmers in the group buys of his chips due to his greed & incompitence!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I still have yet to recieve my $2500 worth of worthless chips!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sell your shit in China,Y I FU you piece of shit,backstabbing,asshole!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BFL at least is shipping,extremely late & slow as hell,but they are shipping product  ::)

Have any of you considered his chi?

Is this true?

Short answer: Who cares?

Long answer: Even if he was not, he presented himself as if he is. I remember in his Youtube interview he talked about the moment he held more than 50% of network hashrate in his one hand, in the form of chips in the bottle. You shouldn't talk like god if you are not in full control of your own company. Also, he seemed to be in charge of refunds, so he probably held the wallet. Enough to blame him for Avalon disaster.

Respect is earned, not demanded, kiddo. In this case, all the early bird "respect" went out the window after his multiple delays, lies, omissions and outright arrogance. He dug his own hole by not respecting his customers. You might want to check your nose in the mirror, it looks a bit brown :P

Grats on (useless by now) chips, tho ;D

Of course it's true, YiFuck said it himself! 8) ::) :P

how can you guys tell its Yifu?

Because instead of escrow he's using escrew.  E-Screw, The newest way to screw customers over.

No e-condom nor e-lube either, there... :o

Agreed.  He has batch 1, 2 and upgrade customers who say they have not received product.  I had a lot of respect for Tradehill before (they closed but they paid their customers out) but am disappointed they have taken on Yifu without at least making sure he cleared up past business. 

This thread is pure magic.

Yifu name on tradehill website is where? Connect the dots for me here.

Seems like it's just old units, someone just told me that so far the only thing up for auction are old 4 module units and the mythical 2 module ones. Apparently the min bids are 16 and 9 BTC, can anyone else confirm?

that's probably the only thing that would make sense.

Copied from Tradehill

Avalon 4 Module Unit (90 GH/s) Auction320 Chips, 90GH/s (typical), Overclocked Freq: 282MHz, Power: 750W - The minimum price is 16.000 BTC per unit.

Avalon 2 Module Unit (60 GH/s) Auction160 Chips, 60GH/s (typical), Overclocked Freq: 375MHz, Power: 595W - The minimum price is 9.000 BTC per unit.

Auctions will end on Monday, October 7th, 2013 at 12pm EST.

So a negative ROI of: 60% (that's probably being generous considering the difficulty explosion that is about to happen with KNC shipping)

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/61a37a21ee

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/589421cb3a

yay, definitely worth the ID verification to lose 60% of my money.

There are currently no bids yet for this product.

I WONDER WHY?!?! ;D ::)

About the only thing remotely similar between Yifu/tradehill and TAV Redhash is the word "Auction".

Redhash didn't require any ID or pre-deposited bitcoins and did their auction open to all on this site and put forth all necessary info and full specs. The unit are also brand new.

The most important difference TAV have not screwed, lied, misled and cheated anyone like Yifu.

They are also one of the many business Yifu's bad business practices have hurt.

So to even compare them is laughable  :D

Yes the minimum bids are 9btc and 16btc for 60gh and 90gh
no one is bidding, what a load of rubbish. I just saw a 86gh avalon go for $2200 on ebay yesterday.  Why buy on this shady tradehill crap then?

These tradehill auctions are completely over priced and rubbish. Msg them twice now asking if this 9/16 btc price includes shipping no response! Good luck getting anything off these clowns. Please boycott this crap guys

btw tradehill of full !@$#@$,  they had the dates all wrong for a few days...complete amateur hour

there is one bidder for the avalon 60gh unit.. but it should be much cheaper. all prices on avalon-asic.com is including shipping, so i think these are aswell. do not know for sure though.

Avalon 2 Module Unit (60 GH/s) Auction
160 Chips, 60GH/s (typical), Overclocked Freq: 375MHz, Power: 595W
This auction will close in 3 days on Thursday, October 10th, 2013 at 12pm EST.
Winning Bids
The minimum price is 9.000 BTC per unit. The current winning price is 9.000 BTC per unit. There are 500 units available for sale in this auction.
1 bidder

Avalon 4 Module Unit (90 GH/s) Auction
320 Chips, 90GH/s (typical), Overclocked Freq: 282MHz, Power: 750W
This auction will close in 3 days on Thursday, October 10th, 2013 at 12pm EST.
Winning Bids
The minimum price is 16.000 BTC per unit. There are 200 units available for sale in this auction.

There are currently no bids yet for this product.

Does BFL give you that warm and fuzzy feel as well or are you still hawking their shit as well?

Completely turning me off ever buying from these clowns!! The 4-module unit was suppose to be 9btc? made a mistake? Then correct it! probably greedy idiots at tradehill training to take a 7btc cut. Who knows. Anyway, no one bid on these until prices are revised...in fact no one bid at all.

I love it how their site has a comment button but it is disabled. I wonder why...

I signed up for Tradehill and can see the auctions.... Its hilarious, bids are public so you can see that only one person has placed a bid on the 700 units Yifu is trying to sell. Minimum prices are way too high.

actually 16BTC doesn't seem like a mistake at all, goes perfectly with the 4.20BTC they are asking for a single module in their new store.

To them they are a mistake as noone is bidding.  To us they aren't a mistake as they thought people would sell their firstborns to buy g1 hardware .... g2 will probably have same problem of being overpriced.

But yea.  The modules do suggest the pricing is absolutely not a mistake and that they overvalue their own product.

I doubt anyone in their sane mind is willing to give someone their personal info and bitcoins.  I'd be fine with just bitcoins but a government issued id?  Absolutely not.  One of the reasons bitcoin is great is because once you have the coins you have them.  What's the need for ids?

Mini-machine is gen1 chips

http://avalon-asics.com/product/avalon-mini-60ghs/

I bought a 4th module for my Batch #2 Avalon yesterday.  I have a DHL tracking number at this time.

$18 a GH at current exchange rates.

Funny!

And its a minimum bid of BTC9!

Takes up a huge amount of space and electricity and as loud as a jet engine.

BTC5!

Hopefully....you may be one of the few to buy from Avalon...they're not overloaded by the sales...only by refunds.

What a mess...

They could return to the front of the stage, with great price/product but no...
Instead they sold via Tradehill (Id card ??? really ??!) overpriced old tech when competitors are all around...what a disaster...

was thinking of upgrading, but to what use rly.. wont make it back for sure.

how did you manage that?

Edit: Never mind :) its on their site 4.2BTC ? hmmm.

Not speaking for ProfMac, but you can order them here, apparently:

http://avalon-asics.com/shop/ (http://avalon-asics.com/shop/)

Yes, there, at BTC 4.2.

I am assuming that the 55 nm chips will directly replace the 110 nm chips, at significantly less power draw and significantly more hashing power.  I don't know if it is feasible to swap the chips out on the existing miners,
but that is influencing my decision. 

This calculator says I will not make breakeven.  (http://btcinvest.net/en/bitcoin-mining-profit-calculator.php?diff=189281249.28103&dcosts=0&diff_mincrease=25&blpbtc=25&dhsmhs=27500&diff_mincreasedecrease=0.5&btcusd=120.61&dpowcon=275&btcusd_mincrease=0&pcost=0.085&calcweeks=75&dleadtime=1&action=calc)  I don't really know what parameters are realistic to put into it.

The fact that these units are being auctioned off is a red flag as well as alarming.

Why sell something that actually makes money? This is why I never and still do not understand people to trust preorder vendors as the vendor would be more inclined to just secretly mine with customer units until they were not profitable and then ship them out.

Seems to be BFLs business model as well as some other vendors.

Now that Avalon has released the specifications for the new chip we know that it is not pin compatible.
No chance of directly replacing the old chips with the new ones. I don't understand why they didn't make it pin compatible.
   

I haven't audited the pin-outs.  I do note that one of the voltages is 0.9 V, and I assume that can be handled rather easily with the specification of a few resistors in a voltage divider.  Is there a pin with a deeper incompatibility?

Yes some of the pins are shifted power and ground changes are needed so basically a new PCB board will be required.
I don't think it would be much effort to make the required changes though.
Also with the reduced voltage you might need 2oz copper on the power and ground planes.

i feel that the pricing is over the ROI...cannot afford it

 :D  I can't believe someone with the "vision" of Y I FU would bother with 55nm  ???  These will be obsolete by next month  ::)

2 watts per GH  ??? Bitmine & others will be down to 1/2 watt per GH by December!!!!!

Have fun promoting Avalon ProfMac  ::)  I can only wish & hope for the Triad to find Bitsyncom & do some "Dirty Deeds" to him  :P

he probably sold them some obsolete hardware...they never made their promised profit, let alone ROI and decided he was not going to make his next bday...fair play i say!

module price has been lowered to 3,8 and they are selling 4 module avalons for 15 BTC each in the store. So the price of the modules is going down quicker than it mines BTC and their own store pricing of the 4 module devices makes the tradehill auction pointless.

Tradehill auction IS pointless.

Why not put an auction here on Bitcointalk ?
Avalon don't care about community ? No problem bro'....look how much bids are currently put at Tradehill...

1 bids for a 4 modules unit...and now you can found this unit for 15 BTC on avalon shop.
What a joke.

Price lowered because they sell anything....

"Something Big is About to Happen" they say...

A big joke...

Not a joke. There is big income happening to Yifu again.
Let's see if he does create something even more bigger of it.
The biggest thing to expect has already be done, the redistribution
of our asicmining-targeted money.

To make some room on avalons warehouse for their next gen machines?
 ;D

Just got this from Tradehill:


Looks like Avalon is now selling the 4 module units directly on their website (http://avalon-asics.com/) for 15BTC and they lowered the price of the upgrade modules to 3.8BTC. It showed only 2 in stock earlier today but now just says "in stock". The only way these would be worth the BTC is if you bought a new PSU and overclocked them which would still be cutting it close IMO. I have no idea where Yifu got the minimum bids for those initial auctions but at least 6BTC for 60GHASH is more realistic. Guess he had to see how many suckers were out there first OOPS...

Bet he hasn't auctioned off a single unit.

As it should be.

If they come down to BTC3 before the next diff I may consider it

Has to be free shipping!!

LOL

I assume these are all of the second hand rigs that YIFU used to mine himself ...

The FAIL is strong with this one !!

+1

Yifu is such a fuckwad.

I said exactly that in the TAV thread and I was told off by some members.... (before the BitCoinTalk shutdown)

There are people who don't agree that "math" is good for the soul. (and the pocketbook)

No, thats insulting the fuckwads. How about <unprintable> ?

add one avalon to your basket then you get this message

This is EXACTLY why i will not be bidding on these. They'll keep "extending" the auction indefinitely to get the price they want for these.

They shouldn't be auctioning these, just sell the damn things and ship immediately. Everyone knows that the rigs lose potential value daily.

even with the modules at 3.80 it is still cheaper to buy a minirig!!

and they still wont make a return!!

this guy must have lost his marbles!

these modules should be sent out to anyone who has a 3 module rig as a weak apology before they become WORTHLESS!

i tried to leave comments explaining as such on the store but my comments dont seem to have been approved yet...

Oh my god! The pain!
LOL!

Ente

now avalon mini 60gh oc'd is 6btc on tradehill. 4 bidders and 496 units left.. auction end next tuesday.. useless again. to long auctions.

We all knew Avalon's ASIC chip design & fab process technology would be poor compared to current state of the art, but people (including me) were interested in their chips due to the time to market advantage.

What was not understood was just how poor and low performing Avalon's design was compared to Gen2 ASICs from other strong design teams. KnC, Cointerra and other groups are now coming out with designs that render anything Avalon is offering completely obsolete, even Avalon's gen2 is behind by a wide margin.

I think Avalon might be out of the game soon, it makes little sense to buy an Avalon based system at any price due to their higher Watts/GH requirements. Avalon self mining with their own gen2 might not be very profitable either. If that is the case where does that leave them? Sure they made a ton of money in the past year, but did they blew the money on a Gen2 design that they can not recoup?

Too many people lost too much money. What is the word on a class action lawsuit?
There must be a few in the works.

IAS

I actually agree with this statement with one major caveat.

Avalon catched up to BFL (performance per watt wise) in gen 2. So if you make the argument that Avalons second generation is now obsolete....then the case is also made for BFL hardware.

Good thing Yifu is already working on gen 3 and 4 in parallel.

Question what is the $$$ to GH/s ratio for Avalon in gen 2? How does it compare to BFL hardware or current 28nm designs?

He has beyond the pale burnt his bridges ...nobody will trust him with anything

He better hope that what he produces is a the friken solution to the fusion reactor of an ASIC chip.... as the guy is a scammer and a dog and is not welcome

To be honest If i had 1 spare life jacket and both Yifu & Josh where drowning ...I would give it to Josh ..lolz

Why the eff would I bid on something that is probably made from boards from batch II that should have been shipped to batch II customers instead of mined with for their personal gain?

BFL hardware WILL BE obsolete in a matter of weeks,my 30GH'er consumes 130+ watts & earns .08BTC perday= 4.3 watts per GH  ::) 

Some new ASIC's consume(theoretically) .5 watt per GH,no way for 110nm, 65nm or 55 nm to compete with 28nm tech.You HAVE to go with the lower watt per GH solution for longevity,unless you have free power  :D

I think Avalon hurt more folks than BFL with thier delay in chips,no communication & his trust factor was ALOT higher than BFL.....ALOT more.At least BFL IS shipping,albeit VERY slowly(no better than Avalon,basically).

Plus all Y I FU had to do was order chips,recieve chips & pack & ship chips,how the fuck do you fuck up something SOO easy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  >:(

Maybe 16 weeks at a 90% per month difficulty increase with no slowdown.  But looks like that is starting to level out giving more time of profitability. 

Yeah,any amount is profit right ??? Sorry,but NO,to me its already a loss,due to diff rise,after only 2 months.It will only work with 90GH of Drillbit & Avalon 30GH of 5GH'ers I got coming  ::)

I guess it is time to shutdown my ModMiner   :D     I saw that it jumped my PC psu 40 watts when running at its ~800Mh !!

but it looks so cool inside my pc case

Maybe,I just sold 3 BFL FPGA's  :(  Hated too but the power consumption is too much vs hashrate....even sold my 8 BE's  :(

While I could still get some cash out of em  ;)

sad times, but new era is here

I might sell 7 of my Bees that are on crappy hubs... leave the 9 Bees on a nice 10 port with fan... shutdown the old ModMiner

makes it easier since my two jupiters are hashing over 500 Gh each  ;D

Now who's interested?

I would be interested if tradehill wasnt involved, but screw waiting a week for bids

I'd rather you throw it into the sea. (save the dolphins or sharks instead)

I would be interested if I did not believe that I would just be buying my own batch II boards which I already paid for and someone withheld for months.

This exact same scenario will happen with Cointerra and Hashfast @ 28nm. It will only take a while longer to get there.

Eventually the economics of mining will be so skewed towards "zero" that even 28nm devices won't be viable. Even lowering the price of a 28nm miner to almost production cost won't really help the matter.

As for those who think that it will level out, they are right, but it won't level off and taper off, it will just stay at a perpetual plateau where people who invested too much into mining will struggle against math to get their money back out of hardware. Selling to each other is one viable option.

Another option is to buy into FPGA's that can be programmed to mine coins not based on SHA256. But again it is a major gamble...who would use coins beyond the Scrypt and SHA256 variety? The money in an exchange just wouldn't be there. At best speculators with remaining cash reserves would put their cash into the exchanges.

Word to the wise, find out where the third generation Alt-Coin is going to be and when it is very cheap pump your money into it and hold.

==========================

Or

You could always build up a fortune of Bitcoins and speculate lightly and live/supplement your income from that for a pretty long time. Although that presumes that Bitcoin will still remain money pot on the exchanges in the next 2 years.

I am just waiting until someone ruins the alt coins by saying very unnecessary things.

<Puts away the crystal ball>

Auction will not be over until 10/15/2013 (Tuesday)
This means it will probably not ship until 2-3 days later minimum.   On top of that you will have to wait another 2 days minimum to receive the item.

So you probably will not receive item until at the very least 10/19/13 (Saturday) or 10/21/2013 (Monday)

BTC difficulty is projected to jump at the very least 23.47% in 7.31 days which lands it on 10/17/2013.
Being in this business a while I have learned its always best to assume higher than 25% jump.   The average the past few months has been about 33% every 10.x days so I used 35% difficulty increase in my calculations.
So to be conservative lets say difficulty will jump 35% every 10.x days and power / cooling power will run 1000 watts/hour at 15 cents kwh (fees, taxes, etc averaged per kwh).

This means units will arrive when difficulty hits at least 255,281, 249.     The absolute most this thing will make before power costs more than it produces is 3-4 BTC.
Power costs will be more than it makes after December-March 2013.  

Historically, Yifu has always been 3 months late minimum on his delivery quotes.  I'd say this device is worth 2-3 BTC tops.  To add more questionability:  If you get a bad power supply or no PSU at all...then that will set you back another $60-75 USD minimum



jump   difficulty       usd/btc   ฿ revenue (excl. power)   ฿ total   $ total   $ revenue (incl. power)
1 (on 2013/10/11)   255,281,249   + 35 %   121   1.41843 ฿   0   0   127.88 $
2 (on 2013/10/23)   344,185,167   + 34.8 %   121   1.05204 ฿   1.05204   83.69   83.69 $
3 (on 2013/11/03)   463,454,302   + 34.7 %   121   0.7813 ฿   1.83335   134.72   51.03 $
4 (on 2013/11/15)   623,254,303   + 34.5 %   121   0.58098 ฿   2.41433   161.59   26.87 $
5 (on 2013/11/27)   837,084,523   + 34.3 %   121   0.43257 ฿   2.8469   170.56   8.97 $
6 (on 2013/12/09)   1,122,848,215   + 34.1 %   121   0.32248 ฿   3.16938   166.25   -4.31 $
7 (on 2013/12/21)   1,504,258,787   + 34 %   121   0.24072 ฿   3.4101   152.08   -14.17 $
8 (on 2014/01/02)   2,012,685,276   + 33.8 %   121   0.17991 ฿   3.59   130.58   -21.5 $
9 (on 2014/01/14)   2,689,571,101   + 33.6 %   121   0.13463 ฿   3.72463   103.62   -26.96 $
10 (on 2014/01/26)   3,589,600,133   + 33.5 %   121   0.10087 ฿   3.82551   72.59   -31.03 $
11 (on 2014/02/07)   4,784,835,676   + 33.3 %   121   0.07568 ฿   3.90118   38.52   -34.07 $
12 (on 2014/02/19)   6,370,124,480   + 33.1 %   121   0.05684 ฿   3.95803   2.18   -36.34 $
13 (on 2014/03/03)   8,470,143,472   + 33 %   121   0.04275 ฿   4.00078   -35.86   -38.04 $
14 (on 2014/03/15)   11,248,576,982   + 32.8 %   121   0.03219 ฿   4.03297   -75.18   -39.32 $
15 (on 2014/03/27)   14,920,053,582   + 32.6 %   121   0.02427 ฿   4.05724   -115.45   -40.27 $
16 (on 2014/04/09)   19,765,652,915   + 32.5 %   121   0.01832 ฿   4.07556   -156.44   -40.99 $
17 (on 2014/04/21)   26,153,025,076   + 32.3 %   121   0.01385 ฿   4.0894   -197.97   -41.53 $
18 (on 2014/05/03)   34,562,462,140   + 32.2 %   121   0.01048 ฿   4.09988   -239.91   -41.94 $
19 (on 2014/05/15)   45,620,640,886   + 32 %   121   0.00794 ฿   4.10782   -282.15   -42.24 $
20 (on 2014/05/27)   60,144,240,006   + 31.8 %   121   0.00602 ฿   4.11384   -324.62   -42.47 $
21 (on 2014/06/08)   79,196,252,193   + 31.7 %   121   0.00457 ฿   4.11841   -367.27   -42.65 $
22 (on 2014/06/20)   104,158,596,975   + 31.5 %   121   0.00348 ฿   4.12189   -410.05   -42.78 $
23 (on 2014/07/02)   136,825,638,680   + 31.4 %   121   0.00265 ฿   4.12453   -452.93   -42.88 $
24 (on 2014/07/14)   179,524,481,757   + 31.2 %   121   0.00202 ฿   4.12655   -495.89   -42.96 $
25 (on 2014/07/26)   235,269,523,357   + 31.1 %   121   0.00154 ฿   4.12809   -538.9   -43.01 $

I like your analysis, but I don't get this. Can you elaborate a bit?

Not bad if you can pick them up for 2-2.5btc. I am planning on picking up 2. Hopefully I don't get screwed.

my analysis shows bidding anything  over 2.5 btc per unit is a significant risk.  Hashrate extrapolation shows difficulty will now jump by at least 30% (probably 33+% as thats about the average for reach interval jump.


This does not even factor BitSyncom's "clearing price" and if you have to buy your own power supply, etc.  To be conservative its best to assume there will be no power supply and BitSyncom will try and charge other fees that are not disclosed.


2-2.5 btc max.  3 btc you stand a chance to lose money.

I would not buy anything from YIFU. He name in English mean "yes I fucked you".

And you are what is wrong in this scenario.

Then you pay a few coins and don't get what you paid for or when you paid for it. and then you bitch and complain. Why put another penny in this assholes pocket for what he has done and all the businesses he has ruined??!?!

Let him shove them up his ass.

All 500 units have been bid on now.  The price is starting to rise above 2.000 BTC.

Why? You are going to go through a huge amount of risk and hassle to spend 2 BTC and maybe receive 2.5 BTC back, only if everything goes correctly. If anything goes wrong you will lose BTC on the entire transaction.

Why not just go to coinbase.com or some other site and purchase 0.5 BTC today. Zero risk and bother, and you end up with the same amount of BTC in the end (2 BTC that you did not spend plus 0.5 BTC that you bought).

My point is these devices are barely going to return a few BTC before it makes economical sense to turn them off. That is so little I just can not see how it is worth the time and effort at this point.

I would've had a go at 2 or 2.1 say, but too late now to start the docs process. 
Bitsyncom must have been stuck with a lot of chips for it to be worth their while to assemble these & ship worldwide for 2btc, unless there is something I'm missing?

most of us are missing the BTC that yifu 'didnt premine' with all our rigs...

i imagine the buyer of the 500 rigs thinks they are going to be a good investment.

much more likely is that yifu or his crew just placed 500 x 2btc bids to make it look like they are popular/selling out fast...

i certainly wouldnt put it past him

next diff adjust will be very close to 40%

2 btc is very expensive price for these units.

currently projected@30.5% difficulty jump right now.  was at 28% this morning.  Its most likely gonna hit 35-55% by the 10 day mark.

well if they do manage to turn a positive ROI (they most likely will if they are sent within 48h as auction states, good luck!) you have a lot of alu scrap you can sell for added profit! ;D

are these units held in USA by tradehill or will they be shipped out of Avalons warehouse from China? I sent an email to tradehill but got no reply as I want to make sure shipping to Australia wont be a problem

Unfortunately, I do not totally understand what happened with Tradehill and the forum members. All I know is that these units with sell for more than quadruple their cost on eBay. That is much greater than every worrying about ROI. I could even mine with them for a month and still manage to sell them and make a profit. Additionally, I have no grounds for complains as bitcoin and mining is a fun hobby for me since I am an engineer geek.

It is expensive if you are expecting an ROI. 30GH BFL devices are still selling for over $1k on eBay. Tell me that is not ridiculous!?

Its got to the point where it is costing him more to store them than it costs to send them around the world which is more than they're worth in purchase price to us.

How sad :(

if they actually had all of these units ready and made for shipping when they first announced the auction they would probably have made 2x as much (if not more) by just selling them directly for immediate shipping, this Tradehill auction is just silly.

With the auction ending at 12PM EST, here are the current bids:

https://i.imgur.com/mdqpsEH.png

So what happened previously with this YIFU guy? He held back all the chip shipments until they were worthless and then didn't refund the buyers money or offer a discount on Gen II chips? Meanwhile, Avalon developers were stuck with bare PCB's?

He offered refunds on ALL chips, including non delayed chips. Buyers took him up on that, leaving avalon developers with bare PCBs.

That's messed up. Has there been any confirmation that the Gen II chips will be compatible with the original footprint?

Which Gen II chips? I don't believe Yifu is able to produce anything worth buying in the 28nm era. Even if he does accomplish that, nobody will preorder anything from him, ever. He maybe alive and well, but business-wise he is dead.

if they are coming from China then who knows how long the will take...you need to factor that into the equation too...they are very noisy as well

Here is the spec for the A3255 chip: https://github.com/BitSyncom/avalon-ref/blob/master/SPEC/A3255Q48-130929-V03-EN.pdf (https://github.com/BitSyncom/avalon-ref/blob/master/SPEC/A3255Q48-130929-V03-EN.pdf)

Wow, spec published two weeks ago, announcing the chip with 2.05Ws/GHash power consumption. That is an electricity waster, burning 3x more electricity than the current generation of chips. Now they only have to tape-out and manufacture it while the difficulty skyrockets. Good luck to them finding the suckers to buy these things.

The only place left for Avalon gen 2 is if they sell it at such a bargain that 1-2 month positive ROI is pretty much guaranteed no matter what happens to diff, or just sell them dirt cheap to people who got screwed by their delays as compensation.
 

I see the latter happening ...

anyone managed to find out if they come with a psu or not yet?

Does anyone even has seen a proof of the existing units ?
Are there any proofs at all ?
What about the "stuck in customs" things ?

I'm betting on no PSU. 

Something like that.

Claimed they were confiscated in customs,
didn't refund, didn't ship,
caused terrahash to go out of business caused millions in loses

Source?

He must be all done mining with them... time to sell!

Probably why there was no rush to sell them indeed, any delay and they just mine some more BTC anyway ;P

YiFuck himself stated that. Go check his posting history, cba to search through his garbage myself.

Professor, I sense you are having difficulty coming to grips with the reality that that man is an unprincipled slug who deserves no further business, nor even any further recognition as a contributing member of the bitcoin community.  

After all, it's not like the case of BFL, where one can at least argue that there are no innocent victims, and that the customers were greedy followers of an illusion of free money and learned the lesson of that.  

The failure on the part of Avalon destroyed many in the open source community who expended time and treasure in the belief that the chips would be delivered.  

For example, the Klonkike developer, BKKcoins, has completely disappeared.  While one might hope that he got a great job out of the effort and left bitcoin behind, I fear that that is not the true outcome.  

I think he actually claimed the chips were held up in customs - not confiscated.

He asked a specific question and didn't look for a lecture.  Whatever someone does with their money is their business, not yours.

The confiscation idea might stem from the chips "being held at customs" and them (Avalon) receiving "real life threats".  Therefore, the "confiscation" is more of a theory than backed by supporting evidence.  The only thing we know is that 1) Yifu stated chips were held at customs 2) Yifu stated team members were receiving real life threats.  Anything else beyond that is a theory (One can even argue that #1 and #2 are lies - it's basically a mess as their answers to the community answer nothing).

I'm absolutely not defending Avalon.  I'm just reiterating what was stated.  Anything beyond that is a theory that may/may not be true.  Also, I'm leaning towards not doing business with Avalon in the future.

I wonder, where did Yifu get the refund money? I get the feeling they sold those chips (in part) to the highest bidder.
What ever came about with the threats story? Any police reports or the like?
Lawsuits in the works?

Auction OVER!

Tradehill lagged at the end.  Almost was unable to re-bid.  But got a few for cheap!

Thanks.  I remember reading the "held at customs" news that Yifu posted.

The auction is over, I lost, and now my coins are stuck in limbo.  Nice touch!   ???

I got outbid, and lagged out.

i bid 2.2btc per unit and lost by .01 btc.    the site lagged out.  if anyone wants to sell me one to five for cheap i'd be happy.  just pm me or post.

they are holding 22 of my btc still too.

I was outbit but I still haven't see the 2BTC's either return to my Tradehill account or to my wallet. Is there something that I am missing?

Lagged out in the final minutes, couldn't even rebid. Very frustrating.

and the question remains, do they come with a PSU?

Why would they not?  THEY BETTER ITS IN THE PICTURE and it was never mentioned as "not included" right?

Their withdrawal page states:
so maybe the same is true with failed bid refunds as well.



That's the risk you take when you try to snipe. Since I had a feeling their site wouldn't handle the last minute sniping I put up my max bid 30 minutes before end of auction to be safe and got 3 units for 2.29BTC ea. Curious if Yufi is happy with the results considering the previous minimum bid was 6BTC...

If you read the auction details you would know they come with PSU's. :)

You are absolutely right.  And if you reread my "lecture," and check my posting history, you'll see I have rarely, if ever, stated that anyone should not deal with anyone.  Pointing out evident corruption, or the probability of total loss, is different than falsely assuming the right to invoke en loco parentis.

On the other hand, the taste in my mouth that comes from a quite general willingness among bitcoin miners to deal with devils if they offer a possibility of hashing hardware is one of the reasons I'm still around here only to see the (hopefully) successful implementation of BFL's bare chips on DIY enablements.

Cheers.

Yep I called it right also.  Had a bid up since yesterday but at the last 7 minutes moved it up by .1 BTC per unit and that saved me!  I figured TradeHill would lag.  I had enough trouble trying to do bids when the site was "nomal" (IE vs Chrome showed very different data).

I am out a bunch of BTC from Batch 3.  This will hopefully make up for some of that.  I had tossed around the idea trying to get Yifu's attention for <3BTC minis previously as a compensation for B3 owners, well that wish came true in a round-about way!

Now a new problem, how to run 8600W of Avalons... thank goodness its winter!

I automatically assumed there was NO power supply, especially for 2BTC. I am happy getting a few for 2.3 and I have a box of PSU's left over from my GPU days :)

Long, long time ago I used 6000W electric heater to successfully heat 3-room apartment in continental climate. Good luck with cooling all that equipment.

Easy, crack a window ;)

Anything over 6-7kw is a lot for even a house.  I am not sure if your house will be able to handle 8600 watts in the circuits.  If you want to sell a few let me know :).


On a side note..yeah it sucks i lost the auction by .01; but i still have btc to use toward cashout or re-investing.

Cheers to you gents who won. :)

I did not try to snipe.  I was consistently ahead of several hundred bidders and my bid seemed safe.  I monitored the auction on an ongoing basis.  Their site failed to respond with several minutes remaining.  I did not find a mechanism to increase my bid, only to cancel and re-open.  

I was not able to express my intent to bid on their auction site.  I am sure that this was true of others as well.  Not only that, the site does not show the bidding results anymore, they were taken down when the auction was over.  I think that an essential aspect of an auction is transparency, and the final results are not transparent.

I think there is a wide open field for anyone else to compete at auctioneering.

You can vent the hot air back into your HVAC return register to brings some free warm air into the house. You can get a 300CFM inline 6" duct blower on eBay for less than $100. We used to do this to some of the network racks at my old job years ago. (small office)

Yeah unfortunately you could not increase a bid. You had to cancel your existing bid and make a new one. What browser where you using because in Chrome the page dynamically updated for me (no need to refresh) which was nice. Right up to the end I saw the minimum price creeping up towards my bid amount and I believe it ended at 2.21BTC. Their site does leave much to be desired but I'd still give it a B+.

No transparency and losing bid bitcoins NOT returned.  F-

Confirmed, my 6kw heater needed special three-phase installation just for it self, with enhanced fuses on each phase. I suggest anyone ordered that amount of Avalons call's an electrician before plugging all that in the wall, otherwise some interesting side-effects may occur  :D

And Furthermore ...

Some of you may remember that I held an auction on the blockchain.  It was a multi winner auction, and it ended at a certain block number.  All bids included in or before that block were valid.  I have had an interest in auctions for a very long time.  It was trivial to increase a bid.  It was less trivial to see standings during the auction, but that is an opportunity for someone to develop software to interpret a known auction address on the blockchain.

What is missing from my auction, and from this auction, is a mechanism similar to eBay where a maximum bid can be entered and the little bump bids are made automatically.  That is also a feature that an auction companion could implement on the individual bitcoiner's machine.


In contrast to this auction, my auction results are still visible, as the bids and refunds are in the blockchain.  The entirety of "approvals" to move payments within the TradeHill system seems to be a pointless labor cost to me.  I need help to see the motivation or utility of it.

There is supposed to be some additional benefit for bidders following the auction.  I don't really understand the announcement, but if I am locked out of that because I had to cancel then re-bid, I will view it as a source of frustration.

I feel a growing enthusiasm about working on auction software...

(I was using Chrome.  I should have made some screenshots)

It's not just what to do with all the heat, though, right?  The typical standard for US single family homes is 100 amp service, and less for apartments.  With those machines running 24/7, it should leave around 25 amps for all the rest of the appliances and environmental uses in the house.  

My plan in Minnesota was to distribute them to the nearby apartments of students and elderly, and pay for the increased electricity.

I suspect that would have worked, and would have been good on a number of levels.

I have also considered developing such a service, had a very similar idea like yours, but there are two problems I don't know how to solve:

1) block finding times can oscillate for serious amount of minutes, so there can not be fixed ending time of auction, feature people like and may be essential for successful auction

2) some bids may fail to be included in the current block because:
a) it depends on which nodes broadcasted individual transaction (bid),
b) it is discretionary to the mining pool which finds the block if it will include any individual transaction or not, especially the ones close to the actual block finding time.

If you have any ideas how to solve these two issues I would very much like to hear them.

The auction has been over for a little over an hour. I'm sure they will return your BTC and I'll bet they publish the auction results eventually...

That really would be an amazing auction system IMO.

It sounds like you tried to change your bid in the final minutes which I personally consider "sniping" since you are withholding your true "max bid" until the very end. I do agree that a properly done auction should support sniping but I personally didn't feel safe attempting that on Tradehill. Your idea of using the blockchain would solve that problem perfectly...

Yep, I take 2 legs off a 3-phase bus at work, running though independent AB breakers :)

I think people mainly want the rules to be the same for everyone. So fixed number of blocks might be better than fixed time.

It only goes against sniping but, in my view, that's a huge plus!
 

Yes that is true but I was only replying to his statement "Good luck with cooling all that equipment". Having the power to run them all is definitely the real problem :P


I personally like the ambiguity that this system would introduce. A good auction system would produce a winning bid as close to "true market value" as possible and IMO sniping undermines that goal. This "blockchain" system would have a lot of unknowns that would be hard to game and thus encourage people to place their "max bid" well before the end of the auction.

Also, in many auctions there is no "end time". The auction continues until nobody is willing to beat the highest bid (aka "going once going twice SOLD!!!"). Perhaps another option would be to end the auction after X blocks have passed since the last highest bid?

That's an excellent point.  The timed auction is the source of sniping in the first place.  

In a live auction, the highest rate of bid arrival is at the beginning as the true floor value is being set.  It ends only when, in the auctioneer's opinion (or in the signals of the last active bidders), there are no more bids.

So, you would be interested in auction that may and in 5 mins or 20 mins, and nobody knows when? My hunch is that sellers would not like this, they love when bids jump high in the last seconds of the auction. Deny them that profit and they would not want to bring their goods to such an auction system.

This is a nice idea. For instance: Auction lasts as long there are blocks with higher bids than the previous high. This may also solve "bids to close to the wire to be included" problem. In your opinion, should the system show the bids from the current (Edit: unsolved) block or publish them after the block is found?

1.  I saw disagreements in many auctions over the exact ending time.  The use of block inclusion does not reduce the uncertainty of when to bid, but it does make after the fact auditing completely transparent.
I also had an extension mechanism, when a valid bid transaction was confirmed, the auction was auto-extended 10 more blocks past that block.  I think any software would want to let this be an auctioneer decided option.

2.  My instructions to bidders was to bid early, or pay a premium miner's fee.  Many of my rules are a philosophically antagonistic toward sniping.  In the event that many people bid at the last minute, the bid extension also helps mitigate any odd behavior from the miners.

I think that a good auction client would pay attention to any unconfirmed transactions paid to the auction's bid address.  This would give notice of bids that could be included in the blocks.  It should be possible for the auction client to pre-fill the auction amount to a winning value plus a safety amount, and the bidder could  either click "Bid" or edit the value.

Isn't 'house heating' what he wanted though? :D

Maybe.  It could be the typical outcome would be the same; there are often flurries in end bidding in live auctions as well, particularly in items where there is no well-defined value (artwork, animals, bitcoin miners).  

ProfMac might know of this man:  an economist named Vernon Smith, who won a Nobel prize for his work in experimental economics.  Smith would conduct experiments, replicating markets, with students and others, with incentives of real money gains, and obtained insights into those areas of econ where theory could not tread: those areas where "there were people in them."  

Someone of Smith's school of thought would try auctions of both forms, and see if there really was a consistent expected difference.

The input output delay at tradehill is huge. Deposited funds do not show up instantly. Lets see how long they take to release the held funds.

IMO that sound perfect!

I would say only bids included in solved blocks to avoid shenanigans.

Regarding the 10 more blocks extension I think that is bit too much. It's an hour and a half, nobody has that much time to waste bidding, IMHO even extending one block at a time my lead to too long auctions and bidders losing interest, but it sure may be configurable and left to auctioneer to decide.

I'm not so antagonistic towards sniping because it saves bidders much time and effort, and people tend to like it. You leave your maximum bid and system is responsible to apply it but not disclose it to others, and off you go just checking latter if you won or not. It's a feature actually IMHO.

Thanks everyone for the input. Sorry for this off-topic chat. I may just decided on project to work in my spare time next few months. If anyone else is interested in this please PM me and we can discuss things off this thread.

Yeah that could be an option at the discretion of the seller. If I was selling a house I would want 144 blocks (24 hours).

Bidders love sniping because it allows them to win at lower prices which is not good for sellers. There could just be many options for the seller to choose from since every auction will have different needs depending on what's being sold.

my bid for 2.20 btc per unit now says it was successful...

Interesting because the winning bid was 2.2 when the auction ended and about 15 seconds after I saw it jump up to 2.21 which I found odd. I wonder if somebody got a bid in after the auction closed which they reversed.

I did not notice this was going on, lol, if anyone wants 1 less that they won in the auction I would pay 2.5 Btc for it, plus shipping and escrow services.

they are only projected to make .8 to 1.0 btc profit before going negative.

I thought it was my web browser, but yeah for me it said 2.2 was winning bid and auction closed.
Then it said 2.21 and auction closed.   Which irritated the crap out of me at first.

I would give the same, especially if bought from a canadian resident :)

Or 144 blocks with time minimum. Something like 32 block extension if 144+extension*(blocks per extension) blocks are hit before 24 hours have passed. A detail but you get the idea :P

Good luck to itod/profMac and/or whoever else gets into this. Would be nice to see.  :)

Sorry for the offtopic also.

I do prefer shenanigan free auctions.

What sort of shenanigan can you envision if non-confirmed bids are presented in the dashboard?

you got fucked by yifu. it's a normal thing

mine for 2.2 says the same.

Can anyone else confirm they have received this.  Does anyone else have unsuccessful still?

While I think it is on topic, I have started another thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=311143.msg3344194#msg3344194) to support a needs analysis for blockchain auctions.

Got my funds back as well. My max bid was 2.1BTC per unit. These were good room heaters though :)

You guys are soo funny.  Sure a single 6KW heater would one big circuit, but these minis can be spread all over.  My house has 200A at 220V service (400A @ 110V) so no worries there.  Temps are 35F night 65F daytime average right now, and I heated last year with 14 GPUs spread over 4 rigs with no issues, but this will be over 2x that load!

8600W includes two 4-module Avalons that are in my laundry room today, and I ran two 20A 110V circuits in there to juice those bad boys.

I will just add a few circuits in the garage and keep the door open 4" or so all winter with some box fans going, and relocate units inside as heaters as it gets colder.

Now to break the news to the wife   :o

Buy her a new earplugs for next anniversary!  ::)

Yeah for many people this will not be a problem but not everybody has that capacity. The server room I am currently using is now at capacity so I will have to run my new mini's from home where I already have a lot of things running so I have to place them strategically to avoid popping any breakers :P. Luckily my AC will be off so won't be a problem until summer...

I guess you don't have a basement?

If you have enough land you could build a under ground place to store your Avalon's and just have fan push all the hot air out! :)

someone sell me a avalon mini or two :)

I will pay 2.75 Btc for a unit or two if anyone wants to unload some at a gain?

I don't think anyone will sell you a mini Avalon for cost, if they did they wouldn't be in the business of making money or bitcoins for that matter. I am saving up for a 4 module Avalon next.

Guys look at the next Diff jump 40%+

I think these are looking more and more shaky on ROI

I was going to get 20 ... I sent an email to the support re cost to ship to australia and heard nothing as per usual for avaalon. Imediately stopped the whole idea as TOO much RISK

As per the site Tradehill does not have the units and they are with yifu mining (in china probably) ...so good luck to see how long it takes to get your units

Avalon have used up any goodwill that is left ... :'(

Well I ordered a B1 and B2 module and they were shipped on Saturday, today they are in the US likely still being processed and going through customs. So that's not too bad for two full business days. :)

If anyone wants hosting for any of these new minis, Ill offer half off for the first month! :P
I wish I got a few. But BTC was tied up :(

I just sold a BFL 60Gh Single on BitMit for 10.4BTC Friday, cost me $112 for Fedex to get it to the guy Monday, so I could have the coins in hand and turn that into 4 Avalon Minis.

I would be buying more if I could.

Perhaps YiFu could be convinced to drop the price of the 4 module Avalons to match the Minis that would be a good thing for him to do.

At this point though, I think he is probably pretty disappointed about the price on these?  Who knows.  I am disappointed my B3 is going to LOSE over 30BTC from original cost so flipping his Minis to help make up for that is at least one way to turn a YiFu fail to a YiFu win for me (more or less).

Tradehill site is offline now.
https://www.tradehill.com

Up for me:


Avalon 2 Module Unit (60 GH/s) Auction
160 Chips, 60GH/s (typical), Overclocked Freq: 375MHz, Power: 595W
Thank you for your interest in this auction; the auction has now closed. The Clearing Price for this product was 2.21 Bitcoin. Bidders will be contacted within 24 hours, from the close, to be notified of their status. Products will be shipped within 72 hours of the close of the auction.

i was told mine was successfull, clearing price of 2.21btc. these are good if you have no power cost.... ;)

I second that!

I'm interested in a 'in-hand' device at a sane price - PM me with offers

Tradehill has returned my unused BTC back to my account today, I was worried it would of somehow disappeared YiFU style....

received my BTC back as well.

I managed to get a few  ;D

No word yet on shipping. I wonder where they are coming from US or China.
Let's see if they can deal with shipping out  500 units in a matter of days.

Can someone take pictures of the ASIC chips and post them here so that chip dates can be determined?  Also, if someone could do the same for the AVALON-ASICS store that'd be greatly appreciated.

Curious, you feel this info matters how?

He would have enough chips from cancelled group buys alone to build these...

SOMEONE. Who? :o it's just Yifu (not here anymore) and Chinese workers losing job because .... u know  ::)

I paid 3BTC each, so I don't think you will have much luck at that price. I am still waiting to see if they try to charge extra for shipping.

I thought the final price was 2.21 or something like that?

everyone made their own bid. Every bid 2.21 or higher won. If you bid 3btc, it's your own fault. basically there was everything between 2.1 and 3.05

Oh I see, well if someone is interested in getting rid of a couple, please let me know and we can work a price out.

Let's get them first! LOL...anyone been contacted today? It says emails will be sent within 24 hours and shipment within 48 hours...hmmm  :-\

Yeah, it is my fault for bidding so high. I was thinking Yifu would have a higher cut off price since they were originally listed for 6btc each. O, well. I just hope shipping is included.

Anyone hear back from Tradehill?

youll be lucky if receive this before the next adjustment =P

also all signs of avalon already hashing with gen2 -- protecting the network as they say

Anybody keep the shipping details regarding these sales upto date for the community ...I really want to see how well this turns out

If Units are not recieved b y next diff change looking like another 40-50+% spike and all profit from these units will be gone if not recieved by next change  :o

Shocked anyone would buy from him.. Good Luck you need it!

Damn, those actually are good prices for people with low/zero electricity costs.

There are always greedy guys which will buy over and over again - like preordering Monarch from BFL.) endless stupidity..

To be fair it ended up being a decent price and one of the best if not the best "shipping right now" option. Now it's up to the avalon guys if they want to try and polish their tarnished reputation by delivering these to the winners in a timely fashion.

Task which is Yifu's stronger side, he is famous for doing exactly that.

i got my extra back also, funds i didnt place inside bids.

lets see about shipping. i calculate on it being included for sure. as yifu website, all is shipping included. and he mentioned this is his first test. and if its a success he will do more.
he had orders of more than 650 units at times, so for sure, with 500 instock, its a success. Price is ok, not GREAT.. I mean, if they launch an auction on gen 2 within a week or two, maybe we are all sorry here for going all in on the mini's when we could have faster/more efficient gen2's in a few weeks time.
Time will tell. i'm sure here to find out.

Good luck, you'll need it.

I know Avalon has burnt a few bridges, but frankly, at ~2.2 BTC, thats a steal. Yes you will need cheap electricity, but if you do, these are possibly the only available miners that stand a real good chance of turning a profit.

Also for the record, these mini's have 160 ASIC's right? 2.2 BTC x $150 / 160 < $2 per asic and you get the case, PCB, PSU; fans etc for free.
Now Im the one who always keeps harping on how cheap asics are to produce, but at that price, he must have made a loss IMO. Wonder if thats the first bitcoin asic vendor ever to be forced to sell at a loss.

Understatement of the year...



I might shed a little tear for poor YiFuck.



Nah, I lied.

The marginal cost of their ASIC chip is likely a good portion less than $1.

THats pretty extreme IMO. Die size is 4x4 mm.  Using a 200mm wafer that would yield ~1600 chip candidates per wafer.
110nm wafers may be cheap, but I doubt a fully processed wafer goes for less than $1500 and that leaves you virtually no margin for dicing, testing, packaging or even less than perfect yields.

you are also neglecting the fact that they managed to sell some modules (80chips) way beyond 2btc

What loss? Is everyone forgetting Yifu has been mining with these boxes since Winter 2013?

The BTC he is getting after auction costs is just the cherry on the sundae.

i won't but from them

I dunno.  I got a Batch 3 box, and saw right away the Eligius address associated with it...  When I did the math though the "earned" BTC/hashrate was equal to an average of 2-3 days of pre-mining per box, and my B3 was clean as a whistle, so while its a valid complaint I think its overblown.  Especially compared to the other Avalon antics...

Wow 60 G/H for 2.2 BTC shipped. I kind of feeling borked for lay 21 BTC on a 105 G/H TAV Redhash unit.

I'll just wait and see if Yifu actually delivers the units then I'll shed a tear or two.

There's no doubt that this is a stellar deal. $300 shipped for a ready to plug in 60GH/s machine that ships in 72 hours cannot be beat, regardless of the power consumption. The real question is are you ever going to see it.

I had to think twice for sure but honestly I've made a decent profit from my batch #2 Avalon's despite the explainable delays so felt like giving Yufi a second chance. I am curious of what his true intent is and feel there still is a chance that he is sincere but got in over his head but it's really hard to say with all the FUD. If these miners pan out as advertised he will have repaired some of the damage to my opinion of his business for sure.

Unfortunately it's now been 26 hours since the auction closed with no word from Tradehill who stated that "Bidders will be contacted within 24 hours, from the close, to be notified of their status". I also still have not received the unspent BTC change I withdrew yesterday which is also supposed to "require one business day to process". Minor problems as long as they can ship within 72 hours but not a good sign so far IMO...

Edit: AAAAND I just got a notification from Tradehill:


*fingers crossed*

jup, just got email aswell. order confirmed, shipping soon.

so on a 2.x order placed.. how much will these payback really until electricity is too much..
if i put on btcinvest, 1 jump and 60GH, its lifetime when starting to hash on next increase (20% increase, with a 3% lower) its lifetime is 8 btc..
Month of February (1100MM diff), it will barely make 1btc. i believe thats the month it gets sold or powered off? pending on value of btc, if its $300, it can be kept another month or 2 maybe..

Right now it's almost impossible to predict future difficulty jumps but here is what I based my decision on:

http://btcinvest.net/en/bitcoin-mining-profit-calculator.php?diff=267731249.48242&dcosts=300&diff_mincrease=30&blpbtc=25&dhsmhs=60000&diff_mincreasedecrease=3&btcusd=140&dpowcon=600&btcusd_mincrease=0&pcost=0.15&calcweeks=40&dleadtime=0&action=calc#

nonsense; difficulty has been jumping on average ~33% over the last 10 intervals.  last jump was almost 30% increase in difficulty.
Although extrapolation is less accurate as you go out; 33-35% increase every interval is a very good rate of difficulty increase to use if you are an investor simply because you are betting things will be that # or worse.  As an investor I would use 35% increase.

I was under the impression that today's difficulty increase was 41.45%, from 189,281,249 to 267,731,249. Next one is more probably to go over 50% than fall to 35%.

Congrats!

9 of those give more power than a Jupiter for less than half the price. Yey for pre-orders!

Well let's hope these devices are stored with Tradehill so Yifu won't be mining with them for a while to make up for the cheap price like with batch 2/3.

Congrats!

9 of those give more power than a Jupiter for less than half the price. Yey for pre-orders!


[/quote]

9 of those will also have over 5000 watts of hungry power supplies. Hope you live at the north pole.

9 of those will stop making a profit based on power usage around late december / early january when most, if not all, G1 Avalons should be turned off unless BTC price increases.  Oddly, KNC machine will follow that pretty fast.

I'm looking forwards to that, when I can buy nice space heaters for pennies. Even if they don't make their running costs in electricity, they'll convert _some_ of that energy to "money", instead of ordinary space heaters that are just waste heat.

now the 60mh/s machines are in the yifo onlineshop for 6BTC  :-[
4 module machines are now 12 BTC


no more word about tradehill relationship ;)

far overpriced!

Poor Yifu, he didn't get a fraction of what he expected from tradehill auctions. Wonder how's his chi doing.

Serves that cocksucker right, trying to fleece even now as much as he can from ppl with auction.

Very true with the power consumption. Of course KNC beats these units by far and they over-delivered in power consumption. I have to say that, as a small residential miner in a cold place, I also tend to neglect power consumption.

If market forces stay at the same level, a few decades from now most people will use computers as space heaters. Why dissipate heat without processing information? What a waste!

I would actually have bid for a couple of these for an extra room if it wasn't for Avalon's reputation.

Avalon chips for sale on www.avalon-asics.com.

10,000 chips for 100 BTC.

If you get them up and running by:

October 17, 2013 you're bound to make ~345 btc or ~245 after power costs. 245btc*$140 -> $34,300
October 24, 2013 you're bound to make ~313 btc or ~223 after power costs. 223btc*$140 -> $31,220
October 31, 2013 you're bound to make ~284 btc or ~204 after power costs. 203btc*$140 -> $28,560

The components, for 10,000 chips, are for about 31 4 module miners.  The cost is around ~30k (following avalon design).  Assembly would be another 20-30k.

This will not make ROI unless BTC price increases significantly.  Best not to buy/bother with it.  The only way this will make a ROI is if you pay for electricity out-of-pocket and hope for a btc price increase.  Might as well just buy BTC then, though, in which case you're bound to make more with less of a hassle (see below).  That's about $700-$1,000 /week for 31 4 module Avalons in electricity @ $0.15 / Kw.

If you invest 100BTC + 30k + 20k into just BTC you'll have:  100BTC + $50,000/140= ~457 BTC.  Would seriously just buy the BTC ...

Caveat emptor ...

These chips, imho, should be priced at <50 BTC and then it would still be questionable but less questionable of an investment.  If Bitmine.ch (That's an if, no idea whether the 'if' is valid or not) delivers their chips on December 13th all Avalon stock of chips becomes valueless. 42.5 btc / TH vs Avalon's 32.26 btc / TH whereas the Bitmine.ch chips have a WAY longer lifespan than Avalon's chips.  Avalon G1 end-of-life is around late December through late January.

I had a dream that I bought 100x @ 2.2btc. Thank fuck it wasn't real.

I wonder how many they got sitting around, can't have been many of the chip orders who took delivery in the end.

24 hours left to ship :P

Also still have not received the BTC I withdrew 48 hours ago...

Yifu is shipping them, not tradehill.  So it seems they will ship from China.  When and if they ship are two concerns of mine.

As far as the chips on Yifu's website,   10,000 MLF 110nm chips should cost 10,000 * $0.01 - 10,000* $0.04.  = $100-$400.

100btc = rip off.


I'd also like to note BitSyncom still has 18 btc + worth of my icarus assets from the Trade-in.  he has still not compensated for it.

Check my sig before you buy. I never received any compensation for my Icarus trade-ins. In total I estimate 33 BTC was lost between shipping costs, lost trade-in value, and ~4 months of mining I could have otherwise done with the Icarus devices I shipped to him. I'll never do business with him again. I could see him not being responsible for the lost mining, but he still owes me 15 BTC for the hardware.

LOL... Good luck with that. I'd be interested if you could show a single example of a QFN48 chip available through any supplier for US$0.01 in QTY 10,000.

shows what you know. 


At high volume in the hundreds of thousands chips cost a few cents.   Why would Bitsyncom only buy at 10k per batch?

Lol at yourself.

This is exactly why the chips won't sell.  There is too much price disagreement already on top of the distrust placed on Avalon.

The chips are clearly overpriced as is, though, irrelevant of how much they cost to produce.  These chips are valueless as their ROI does not exist at current price point.

You said qty 10,000 should cost $0.01 to $0.04. Show me an example of a vendor selling any IC in a QFN48 (preferably with a thermal pad on the bottom) for a couple cents. I don't care what it does.

Edit: In fact, even showing someone selling unpackaged 4mm x 4mm dies at any process node for a couple pennies would be acceptable.

If for arguments sake we say a chip costs $0.20, that's still only 15btc of cost.

If you had any common sense  in relation to chip packaging sales:  You would know that vendor/pricing/volume information is almost always confidential.  I suggest you contact a sales representative that handles QFN chip packaging and ask.

I just received tracking numbers.

trademill email


DHL says:

That's in relation to their costs. You said those chips should cost $0.01 - $0.04 if you buy in QTY 10,000. Please show an example of any QFN48 IC being sold for that kind of price.

Even if you want to change tracks and go from what the chips should cost us to what the cost for Yifu is, perhaps you could use your vast knowledge to enlighten people here as to what kind of volume you would need to hit the $0.01/chip price point. If math isn't your strong suit, I can help you out by letting you know that they would get at most around 4400 Avalon dies out of a 300mm wafer, so to reach the $0.01 mark they would need a per wafer cost of US$44 for the blank 300mm wafer, wafer processing, sawing and packaging.

I got my tracking notice a few minutes ago as well.

Thursday, October 17, 2013   Location   Time   
1   Shipment information received    BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC   21:21

Same. Kudo's to Yufi, he's scored back some of his lost points with me. Will definitely consider his next auction or store when the prices are competitive...

Does this interpret to we have DHL express shipping? That's sweet.

got tracking too! jeah im impressed.. surely a loss biz for him this time. why didnt i order 100pcs! heh, bcus i dont have enough power.

best thing, they fly weekends.. expecting monday/tuesday delivery..

Wow people forget pretty easy here. He screws the chip group buys then he goes back on his promise to never sell hardware. Now seems all is forgiven? Seems like he is getting people warmed up for the next screw job.

iirc he said they wanted to focus on selling chips and never again doing preorders, I don't think he has ever said they would stop selling assembled hardware completely.


edit: If they end up coming with power supplies I'll actually start regretting I didn't have my friend who got himself verified to bid on a few for me.

You won't regret buying these............trust me  ;D

The power consumption alone will kill these in a few months,unless you have free power,same goes for BFL units  :D

Thanks again Y I FU !!!!!!!!!!!!!! Where's that "compensation" for us Group Buy guys  ???  Thats what I thought.................................... ::)

You could of made a few BTC reselling them on ebay. I just don't trust him so I ignored the auction


hindsight 20/20

DHL just called me. Need copy of paid invoice. Parcels shall arrive on Monday.
Now the problem starts. I am in EU. And surely, i won't get any kind of invoice by today.
To be continued..

First email sent to Tradehill & Avalon support 13:12 CET. Automated Reply (only avalon so far):
Hello,

We got your ticket request! One of our agents will respond to you as soon as possible.

Thanks!

---
To be continued.

show them the blockchain invoice, aka TX, it works.

Why would they want copy of invoice, they shd just deliver?

DHL do all customs declarations. Thus 30% tax applies.

Avalon changed their store pricing and added the mini to the store as well@6BTC, guess they didn't like the auction pricing and decided to sell the rest themselves.

Its 20 in u.k. from what I know

Alright, things are actually moving! This is better than expected for such a shady auction.  ;D

where did they get your phone number?

It definitely seems like Avalon didn't like the price they got from the auctions.  I wonder if after the first unsuccessful auction TradeHill suggested they start the next auction low to possibly create some "frenzy" and actually get much higher than the original ask, this seems to be one tactic live auction house's sometimes use (sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't!).

Lolz   u is fucked ... I asked a shipping question 7 days ago and I am still waiting on the avalon-support team :D

My guess is the tradehill registration/verification included a phone number, also I think DHL requires a phone number for international deliveries, weren't there some people who had to wait for ages for their avalons due to no phone number on their orders?



That would probably have worked had the batch not been so large and bar of entry into the auction so high, there were simply to few people who bothered/wanted to get themselves verified. Had they done smaller batches of something like 50-100 units every few days I think they could have gotten a higher price. Anyway congrats to those who grabbed some units, you might actually make some money out of these if you get them early next week.

in the auction from tradehill. i beileve its put on the airwaybill.

yupp fucked, I waiting since 120 days for my trade-in answer

For sure. its a test. On gen2 devices, if properly priced.. they should get better movement. I mean, they just want to rid all stock of gen1 chips. they are even selling the 10k chips for 100btc..

yes, uk is 20, i believe some other eastern european countries have 18%, sweden has 25%.. so all eu, have different vat on imports (and exports).

between 15-27% in the EU

That's not a discount at all ... what you wrote suggests a discount.

had a few texts from dhl , current location and last one customs and duty for 32 miners came t0 1200gbp, just about liveable takes price up tp 2.8btc a unit.

I emailed Avalon and suggested that they start the auction at 0 with a smaller number of units to start some buzz.  I also referred to my block chain auction as evidence that I had done the same thing last March.  They lowered the price from 6 to 2 the next day.  Of course, I have no way to know if they even saw my message.

I wish we knew how an auction would have gone with 100 units with no minimum bid.

I personally think a lot of potential buyers were turned off by Avalon's bad rep as well as Tradehill's requirements to create an account. I'll bet these cheap units will help with that problem in their gen2 auction...

the units are estimated to make .62 btc to 1btc profit max.

Thats at 35% difficulty jump.  Last jump was ~40%.

Its quite a risk.

High risk, low reward. A classic ASIC investment.

I prefer on the shelf ready to ship risk as opposed to Pre-order whenever you get is when you get it risk.

explain the 2.2 BTC 60 G/h Avalon miners being delivered to all those 60 g/h BFL units still undelivered.

 

it feels different orded... delivery started within a day, an asic???  amazing :o

+1

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/fad2d0c57f      ;)

based on what invoice? blockchain payment?

When I phone dhl express they said invoice was with consignment so its about right at 20%
70btcx88/100x20. = 1230

Question now is if you are gonna end up having to buy 32 power supplies or if they actually come with the units.

they come with psu. do i sense a tone of envy in your post?

A tiny bit!

I hope the come with psu. Dnt worry ive been ripped for grands in this dogs game, bfl first then some bulgarian pratt and then belgium wierdo and then some. :(

btw, customs did not demand any invoice. I called them and they demanded some explanation that I bought it private, they needed to know whats inside and thats it. I called it special network hardware with SHA-256 encryption. Let's see if it passes.

edit:
i'm in germany

Are you in the u.k

Anyone received a invoice? Anyone knows what the price DHL was told is? Would be nice to know what I need to pay when the package shows up.

dhl has asked me for invoice. Tradehill answered right away. avalon not at all.
When tradehill answered and cc'd avalon support. Then avalon support answered that they could send a pdf invoice.
I said, send whatever is attached to parcels. Now around 24 hours ago.
lets see if it ever arrives before monday.
Would be smart to attach the pdf when they said they could..

Envy is a strong force. Make sure to use it with care.

does anybody know details about Avalon2 55nm chips? Will they also be auctioned on Tradehill?

Mines held up at LAX customs for an undisclosed delay.

What is at LAX, 55 nm chips?

Why would you think that? I guess he has his avalon minis at LAX..

IATA --> Los Angeles International Airport

Yep. Nine of them.

any instructions on setting up theses avalons? threads to see im sure they are similar to the other units

I talked with german customs today, because it is stuck right now. They need something that shows the value of the package. I only have thos stupid tradehill emails that anyone could have written. Also I don't know if they are able to look at the btc price on wednesday. I don't feel like paying todays course  :(

I spoke to dhl and they gave me a customs bill according to value declared by sender.

Did you call the DHL stadnard hotline, not the import department? What exactly did you ask them and what did they give you? Please clarify a bit, I'll call them tomorrow (they closed for today), thanks!

So, anyone received their miners ?

Dawn...i lose the bid at 0.01BTC...

Simply safe an ebay site auctioning an Avalon and then edit the price, print, send to customs.
They just want some paper to file, that's all.

is the auctions still going or is it over

Over last tuesday

Isn't that illegal?

Yes.

i got mine!

It says the weight is 0.5kg?!? that can't be right!

13   Delivered - Signed for by : MS LEE    SHEUNG SHUI   11:44   
 
12   With delivery courier    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   08:01   
 
Sunday, October 20, 2013   Location   Time   
11   Arrived at Delivery Facility in HONG KONG - HONG KONG    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   02:50   
 
10   Departed Facility in HONG KONG - HONG KONG    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   00:35   
 
9   Processed at HONG KONG - HONG KONG    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   00:34   
 
Saturday, October 19, 2013   Location   Time   
8   Clearance processing complete at HONG KONG - HONG KONG    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   23:47   
 
7   Arrived at Sort Facility HONG KONG - HONG KONG    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   23:42   
 
6   Customs status updated    HONG KONG - HONG KONG   16:41   
 
5   Clearance processing complete at BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC    BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC   05:41   
 
4   Departed Facility in BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC    BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC   03:38   
 
3   Processed at BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC    BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC   03:38   
 
2   Arrived at Sort Facility BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC    BEIJING & SURROUNDING AREA - CHINA, PEOPLES REPUBLIC   00:03   
 

Rough dimensions would be useful please

A friend told me his exchange with DHL went about the same, they called him this morning and wanted to know what they contained and if he bought them for private use. The declared value on his 10 avalons was about 3500 usd (he paid 2,26 per unit) for anyone wondering what they might end up having to pay for VAT etc.

Ok,

So i opened the box today and they are missing the power cables, and the little wifi aerial thingy that sticks out the back end of the rig. Need to pop out now and see if i can pick a cable up quickly to make sure the unit itself actually works.

I only bought two and the other i shipped out ASAP to a friend so can't confirm if this is the case for everyone or not. It is possible that the cables and wifi aerials were in the second box? You don't actually need the wifi aerial, it should still be able to pick up signal...there is just a little gold screw where you could fix one onto the rig.

Other people confirm if these things are missing as you get yours in too please... WIFI AERIAL + POWER CABLE


Dimensions of box
20 in x 14 in x 17 in

Actual weight of 1 box
11.2 kg

Dimensions of rig
16 x 9 x 6

Packaging was good with double ply boxes used. and lots of padding. The units themselves are black and have an industrial look and feel. A lot heavier than the Butterfly lab 60 gh units. I hear these Avalon ones can be overclocked to 85 gh/s so i am going to do that tonight.
No instructions or manual included in the box....

Instructions to use:

Connect your laptop to the eithernet port of the Avalon
Setup your laptop IP address 192.168.0.101
Open http://192.168.0.100
Make sure WR703N can access Internet, Configure WiFi: Network -> WIFI -> Scan(select your WIFI network) -> Join Network -> WPA passphrase -> Submit -> Save & Apply for connect to WIFI Internet
setup your mining worker: Status -> Cgminer Configuration.
Restart the cgminer service: System -> Startup,
Check your avalon status: Status -> Cgminer Status
Setup password/using ssh

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Avalon#User_Guide

Thanks for headsup

Just called DHL, mine came without any kind of invoice on the packages (thus held in customs)
Still waiting for pdf from avalon. this is great. one day of mining gone, thank you avalon!
"Want your money all gone, why not go a va lon"!

Same here.

wtf....the firmware on these things is bloody shit! It is ridiculously slow...is that normal?? Like i click one page and sometimes it only loads halfway or takes at least 1 min.

what does the first step mean as well?
Setup your laptop IP address 192.168.0.101????
how to do that?

It's not normal.

Also your question indicates that it might be the time to ask a friend to help you.

what if i don't have any friends! lol
It was running slow because i was using chrome browser...seems faster now...set my ip as required but get this error when i reset cgminer

Bad Gateway
The process did not produce any response

Starting with batch #2, the WiFi antenna and the power cable are customer supplied items.

Got mine this morning. It had an invoice attached with a customs declaration of $500/unit. They came very nicely packaged and did not include power cable or antenna. The small case design and bolt holes allows for secure stacking if you haven't already realized that.

Just got mine from the depot , now power leads and antennas! !!

stable at 60GH/s :)

11 units stuck in customs on US side due to incomplete paperwork.  "Custom hardware" was enough for single Batch 2/3 shipments, but I guess not good enough for multiple Minis.

Thanks Avalon!

So they declared them higher than what they were sold for? Don't they realize this will result in extra costs for their customers who has to pay VAT on these units.

Like Yifu gives a rats ass about customer satisfaction

congrats man!   so 60gh/s stable?

you stand to make some roi provided btc stays about $130/btc.  :)

Received my single order today. Packed well. Commercial invoice included had a value of $21.00 on it ;D

Stable around 58 GH/s currently.

have some for sale if any ones interested, in the box, tested one stable at 58 to 60ghs. in e.u., 3.2btc (mtgox average)plus carriage, escrow can be done, at buyers expense, sebastion ju is good. ive put it here first since it was a helpful thread. sorry couldnt figure out pic upload. the ebay prices are for outsiders.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=181244003757

thanks

dont think so, highest bid was 3.x btc..

tradehill came through. invoice received. however in btc.
i changed the btc to the usd conversion for that day. let's see what dhl says.

So far ... running 2 days now at 60GH with no problems. Went straight for the Ethernet configuration instead of the wireless.

They assumed they'd sell much higher, maybe they prefilled paperwork.

I doubt it. highest offer was 3.x btc.. which is around $500 at the time..

using tradehills proof of payment, i translated it to the btc usd conversion at the time. it has been taxed in, and will be delivered by tomorrow.
good 2.5 days of hashing gone..

Someone who lives locally to me sold me one of his auctioned units; I know he's on this site and is likely reading this, so far so good with the 60GH/s unit he sold me but I noticed in the cgminer log that it only uses 16 of the 24 work counters, I wonder if because he's said he's updated the firmware on this thing (I think) if it's reset the minercount to 24 from 16?

Anyone has thoughts on this?

I am mining using the wireless, no real issues. Looking forward though to getting a second one, hopefully. :)

hashing at 58-60gh too all good  ;D

Can the mini be overclocked? It is surprisingly quiet

The mini is over clocked to 375MHz.

Its using the --quite

called in some favors and got my hands on 5 units at 2,36 btc + vat.

PSU: Enermax 850w 80+gold modular.

Controller board and power distribution boards seems to be the same/very similar to my batch 3, you could potentially Frankenstein 2 of these into a 4 module one if you wanted to for some reason.

Got two of them and have to say they are fucking loud.

People please is there any option to reduce the fan noise ?
This really drives me horrible crazy.
--avalon-fan 20 for example does not work. the fan is at min around 2560RPM and still loud as shit. Temps are inside 46 - 49 °C Radius.

regards

 ;D its funtime!!

You must have fans from the B1 avy's! :)

My mini's fan is the same that is in the my B2 avy which is more quiet.

Is the weight on this post corrrect???? It's like 25 lbs.  Are they made from iron?

Most of the weight is due to the heatsinks.

That case is pretty thick aluminum too. Just the top plate you could whack someone pretty good with.

As an engineer, I can confirm that is the primary criteria for material selection on any project.

wtf is with people buying Avalon shit after what Yifu has done?

My mini's were delivered to US 6 days after close of auction and are running at around 58GH, pulling a little less than 1800w, and are just as loud as my overclocked batch #2's.  A+ will definitely try their next auction.

These chips are already overlocked. The batch 1-3 Avalon's came with factory clock of 282mhz I believe. I was able to overclock my Batch #2's to 355mhz. These mini's are running at 375mhz. Yufi said 475mhz was the chip's limit but you might need a better board and definitely a better PSU to go past 375mhz.

well most likely they sold these at a loss/no profit so you could call it revenge I guess?



They barely pull 600w at the wall so there should be plenty of headroom with the psu that is already inside in them.

There is no such thing as Yifu selling used Avalon Asic Miners at a loss.

Yifu mined back the cost of the units and a shit load more BTC before these dust busters found there way on Tradehill.

Pretty pristine condition for "dust busters"!

Actually yeah I guess they have an 850w PSU so the limiting factor will probably be the boards. Will wait to see what the experts figure out :P

Has anyone tried OCing a mini yet?

Strictly business, its all about GH/s, price and delivery time.

So why not  ???

Yup, buying ASIC miners is like betting on horses. No matter how much research you do, your gunna win some and lose some...

Yifu screws you this time, you think he won't do it again? -ev long term to continue to support scammers like this.

Ye the guy who offers full refunds when shit gets delayed is clearly out to screw everyone intentionally. Besides most people already got their minis so unless they are loaded with c4 and set to explode I guess people got exactly what they ordered.

redemption?
i was part of 2 chip gbs, both refunded. now i got complete miners with psu and delivery for way less.. no brainer imo..
will for sure jump on gen2 first auction. feel free not to! more for me.
screw hatred, give ppl as many chances as you can afford.. mine are even 2 days in customs at dhl with avalon at fault..
i'll live.

 Yifu did not refund everyone and he certainly did not refund people on time.   Even after some people asked for a refund, Yifu shipped the item late, with no refund.

I have yet to get my refund for my 18btc of trade-in assets

avalon have my trade-in FPGA since 6 months, ignoring PM, mail, support tickets

part of the 850w is devoted to the 5v and 3.3v lines (likely 150 and 30w respectively)

Which would mean the ASIC chips are only using 420w since the PSU itself is pulling under 600w total leaving an extra 150w capacity.

single rail 70 amps 12V, it's not some 20 buck psu in them.

Greedy bastards, they would sell their own mother for a buck.

Put more money in Yifus pocket and then flip them on Ebay.

11.2 kg is the weight in the box with all the packaging etc. Got it from the post office when i sent one off ;)
The unit itself does feel quite heavy regardless though...

HEY! a mans got to make a living right?

I wouldn't sell my own mother for a buck will definitely take an opportunity to make 200%+ profit in 3 months while helping secure the bitcoin network...

Not if you make a criminal more money while you do it.

I'm pretty sure Yufi sold these at a loss. The declared value on mine were $500 each so I'm wondering if that was his cost but regardless I'm sure he didn't make them for the $300 I bought them for...

In other news, my wife just used my "MINI ASIC heaters" to rise some yeast for some cinnamon bread she's making for dessert :P

I have no history with Avalon. All I know is there was an auction last week. I paid very low sum and have a bunch of miners in my office.
Given the weight of these things, it cost him more to ship them than I paid.

I guess I have been sleeping under a rock, but how did he (Yifu) screw us?

He may not have "screwed" you,but almost every group buy for his 110nm chips got fucked...not screwed,big difference...by him not shipping in time or not at all & slow on the refunds for those chip buys & the batch 3 rig buyers got fucked too for the same reason................

Go ahead,send Y I FU BTC,he just made a nice little chunk on the price rise off your BTC  ::)

Read this:    https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=269950.0

Y I FU,YOU ARE A PIECE OF SHIT!!!!!!!!!!

Ha Ha Ha You reap what you sow

They were a loss until you bought them, then he got to right off the rest.

If he didn't sell the BTC at the close of the auction then it was his choice to hold them as an investment which could have also caused a loss if the market had crashed instead. Yes I was not happy with the unexplained delays with my batch #2 but they still turned a profit so I must give him some credit since it's far easier to risk money in a preorder than to bring an ASIC miner to market. I followed that thread I agree Yufi really fucked up batch 3 and bulk chips and has almost zero customer service but getting all worked up because people bought his very cheap and promptly delivered mini's is irrational. We decided to take a risk based on his past performance and the new terms of this in-hand auction via third-party and it paid off, simple as that.

WUT?

What Yifu did was dishonorable and shameful. If you choose to do business with him, you are bringing shame on yourself for financially supporting such a person, regardless of how good of a deal you get.

Yufi would have done better mining with these himself so buying these did not support him financially.

I do not shop at Walmart because of their business practices but I dot not feel people that do bring shame on themselves. I also do not approve of how the oil industry operates but I must buy gas which I also feel does not bring shame upon myself. It is a free market which cares little of emotions and morals unfortunately.

Anybody that is pre-ordering magic money making machines must really realize there is a huge risk. Really think about what you are buying. If you are not ready to take the risk then you should not participate.

wow, yes, there was an invoice attached at $500 per piece! lucky they asked me for one.. however, got me almost a 3 day delay for them not finding it.. i guess its almost breakeven..

Just to confirm with everyone about the power cable and antenna missing; this is the response I got back from Avalon Support:

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Oct 23 8:38pm

Avalon Support replied
minis do not ship with antennas due to more issues with customs, power cables are not included.
---

I say no worries as you can get a decent Wifi 8dBi antenna if you shop around for very little. $8 CAD.

It's accounting you wouldn't understand.

O RLY? So then I assume by "right off the rest" you actually mean "write off (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Write-off)"? Yes please explain to me this complicated accounting thingy where getting to deduct this loss against his income means it is not a loss. You must be one of those that thinks when somebody "writes off" a business lunch then it is somehow free (it's not).

cba with wifi when they have a Ethernet port that works just fine.

He probably mined them for months before selling... No way he sold for a loss.

Considering how unstable they were with the stock firmware I doubt it, had several units that kept locking up and had to be hard reset, issues with hashrate dropping over time and web interface going unresponsive. This was all in the first 24h before I had time to reflash them with ckolivas latest firmware, after that they have been rock solid for 30h so far.

edit: Also, these things actually seems to have a bit of headroom. Been running 2 units at 390 for 2 hours without issues atm, next step 400!

ditto, pretty stable at 61.5 GH/s for about 2 hours now.

I am running mine at 400Mhz, 63GH/s for over a day HW% 0.8251

What firmware do you have on them? I have one that does just that, even at a lowered speed and in 0C ambient.

ckolivas 08/21

I've been running with this firmware for a week at 400 with no problems.

Well, that works a lot better. I'll have to play with it some more, 400 seems to be no issue but 425 is a no-go.

Has anyone use their Avalon to act as a WiFi to Wired bridge, and if so how did that work for running the rest of your mining hardware on it?

I have used my Avalon as a bridge.  I connected my laptop via cable to the Avalon while in the basement, the Avalon via WiFi to the router upstairs.  It worked fine, but I had to review netmasks and gateways a bit.  I was able to Google for questions that bothered me so while setting up the lab.

I have not tried to run a second Avalon through the 1st.

Thanks, I'll look into it. I'm thinking about running a couple rPis off the Avalon running some BFL gear.

I got the cheapest atheros chip tplink wifi n router for €28. set it up as on dd-wrt (new firmware).
then you connect this as a client bridge connecting to your main router.
That way you can connect 5 avalons using tp-cable to the wifi-router, who in turn connects over wifi..
Sadly the wifi's on the avalons are not very stable when enabled.

With BTC near or over $300

Congratz on all those that risked 2.1 BTC per Avalon 60 GH ($125 per btc at the time of auction)

You have attained ROI and now making good returns.

Too bad I have too much risk aversion when dealing with known criminals.

Mining has nothing to do with the price of BTC (except for electricity costs, if you have any) but with difficulty

Those who did not buy the Avalon but kept their BTC can go ahead and sell BTC today at over $300. Those with the Avalon will have to wait a few months and see if they can ever recover their BTC 2.1 and with a bit of luck they can sell it next year August at whatever price is valid then.

For those who bought a mini, how much BTC have you made back until now?