Bitcoin Forum

When Bitcoin was going to its ATH in December, many people here assumed that Bitcoin price wouldn't go below 12k. And at first it looked exactly like that. Bitcoin rebounded strongly at a little below 13k and went all the way up to 15-16k. Those who didn't believe in that theory finally became convinced and bought in when the price plunged again. And then we all know what happened. Bitcoin went as low as 6k. Now it seems that 12k turned into an impenetrable selling wall which will be hard to crush because those who bought at that and higher levels will now be trying to close their positions at all costs. And the longer we stay at sub-10k levels, the more resistance will be building above 10k.

https://i.imgur.com/wT4YPrK.jpg

So we are kinda stuck in this range of 8-11k.

I would have to disagree that the resistance at 12k is "an impenetrable selling wall". There is a consolidation taking place which has found that resistance at 12k and also support around 8.3k. When that happens many traders will play the range and buy the bottom and sell the top repeatedly until it breaks out. That means if it does try and breakout upwards there will be many shorts trapped that will need to buy to cover, that will be the fuel for the next spurt upwards. Equally the opposite is true if it breaks down. Anyone who thinks they can predict which of those two things will happen is fooling themselves. Trading isn't about predicting which way it will breakout but rather recognising it when it happens and then reacting quickly to that.

I don’t believe 12k is a barrier either.


I rather believe technical analysis is more useful to understand the past. Trading predictions massively fail, and that’s why 95% of traders lose money, but when you say traders recognize a pattern and react, I think they contribute to the changes: they believe it will go up, thus, they buy, and price goes up. They believe it will go down, they start selling and more panic comes, dragging down the price.

The title itself it’s quite revealing “Why we may…” So, I think we may or may not.

People would be surprised how little technical analysis professional traders use. Often nothing more sophisticated than using horizontal lines to mark support and resistance levels, not that they are going to trade them, but just as an area of interest to start paying a bit more attention and see if they can see some clues in the order flow.

There is a massive industry in selling TA tools and education based on TA targetted entirely at retail traders. If you visit a prop trading (https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/proprietarytrading.asp) desk you will not see any of it in use.

Well, maybe I should have clarified it a little further in OP. I don't mean that 12k itself is impenetrable. It is what sits above this mark which may be quite hard to pass through. Look, people have been buying all the way down from like 15k. Now many of them will be eager to sell at or slightly above their entry points, that is anywhere in between 12-20k. In other words, it is not like you break out of the resistance at this price level and then there will be no more significant resistance. To the contrary, I'm strongly inclined to think that there will be even more resistance building when (if) we manage to get above that price somehow.

I also think bitcoin will be in range for a very long time. Bitcoin has done very well last year and I think it will take more time before we can actually see another great progress. I don't think the price will go down more than $6,000 this time around and we may also see the high it can go now is $12,000. If any positive things happen then  we may began to see some recovery.

Who was selling to them? A lot of people getting short because they believe it is going down further. There is the possibility of a serious short squeeze ahead that would just blow through all that resistance. As I already stated that isn't a prediction that it will happen but a recognition that either is equally likely in this situation.

Maybe that guy who is a trustee of the deceased Mt. Gox and who keeps the coins of their clients? He still has something like 160k bitcoins if I'm not mistaken, and this amount will be more than sufficient to satiate all demand that may (or may not) accumulate over time. If anything, with this amount of coins in his custody he can easily crash the Bitcoin price to triple digits. So I don't think we can seriously expect a "big squeeze" event any time soon.

Ignore the FUD, that's a tiny amount of coins and really doesn't affect the market. Look at LTC and what happened when Charlie Lee cashed out. Nobody even noticed until he announced after it was done.

It is just a truism of trading, for every buyer, there must be a seller. If you do what you are here and focus on what the buyers will do then you are missing half the picture. That half the picture is what will the shorts do if 12k gets seriously tested?

you can also say that the more we stay at sub 10k and above certain prices like for example above $9000 there is more buy support building up at $9000
that is why price keeps going back to that level again and bounces back up to test $12k again.

Fud or not. This rally is over. Prepare for the slumber.

Honestly, I think you are clutching at straws here. If you want to say that the price crash from 20k was due to massive shorts, they should be closed by now, in fact long ago when the price had hit sub-6k levels. It simply didn't make sense to keep them because the profit potential below 6k was minuscule. The price could of course have gone lower to 4-5k but that just wouldn't be worth the risk. 6k was an ideal price to get out of shorts. Personally, I'd say most shorts were closed exactly around 12k provided there were any in the first place. And that supported the price back in early January and gave false hope to some unwary traders.

I think the reason for the quiet market is that there is no big news, no reason to buy. None of the merchants that dropped bitcoin last year have changed their mind. But they continue to add other cryptocurrencies. That's a red flag for bitcoin.

You're welcome to think that. I've been a professional futures trader for over 12 years and that is how I read the situation. I didn't say that the drop from 20k was "due to massive shorts". That was naturally started by profit taking and that then induces the shorts to come in. I'm saying that there are a lot of traders short right now with an entry price of less than 12k. If that gets tested they'll panic and buy to cover. That then causes a pop that induces the longs to come back in and chase it. Rinse and repeat, that's how markets move.

- Longer we stay at sub 10k levels, we will also build some buy support on around 9k along with resistance over 10k.
- Weak hands might keep on dumping but whales will put buy orders on support levels to fill their bags.
- When all weak hands will finish dumping their coins, real rally will stat which will be big enough to broke every sell wall above.

This is just my speculation, not a trade advice...

 ;D Are you new here? I think I will be happy if it stucks in that range for less than a year. It has stucked below its ath from 2013 for approximately four years and you complain about it now.

If you want me to sell, jump the price to $100k. Then I will sell 10%.

Bitcoin is not a simple stock. And is not a fiat currency from a specific country, like in FOREX markets.

Bitcoin is a disruptive commodity which can change the entire financial system.

If you understand the implications of it, you will see that the price is cheap right now. And you know it is cheap because the guys from the old financial system are trying to manipulate it, be through Wall Street or the Mt.Gox trustee. They dont want bitcoin to succeed, so they want the price down. If you sell, you will be capitulating to their designs.

I also fear this. I'm afraid though that because of the lack of going up, more and more people lose interest and many might sell off, allowing a dump to $6000 or something. That better not happens.

i don't think the bottom is $8k. it is more like sitting at $9k.
but since this is bitcoin and bitcoin can be quite volatile thanks to the investors irrational behavior, we sometimes see lower numbers which never last long.

in any case i wish there was an easy way of knowing when we get out of this phase and get back to normal bitcoin with slow rises and sometimes big rallies.
i think at this point we may need a big news to get things started.

Agree, trading is not a matter of predicting where the graph is going, theory a, theory b, blah blah blah. If there are people who are always on target in the prediction, of course he will be very rich. There are even fools who consider themselves smart by making a trading bot. Well, I don't think a bot will say the price will drop to more than 50% of the last ATH.

It may be due many reasons,one among that is Full time trader.Some of the people in bitcoin trading are full time trader.If they need money means,they will sell at any price.So buy this the price of bitcoin will further decrease.

No resistance is absolute I agree.    It varies on volume of selling also.   (also demand subsequently to pass that ceiling later)  The chart in full candlestick would be more accurate in its conclusions but its more clear as a plain closing price line I guess.   Is it daily prices used ?
The double top is not exactly right as the second price is lower, so a declining trend in play there not as much a double top showing resistance to the same price twice.

I gave one of your posts merit as requested anyhow

Patterns : https://stockcharts.com/school/doku.php?id=chart_school:chart_analysis:chart_patterns:double_top_reversal
It should be like a M I think

Yeah but full time traders don't outright control the markets. If enough people are buying Bitcoin the price will surely go up, no matter how many shorters or full time traders are selling. Maybe I am being naive here and underestimating their power, but I don't believe they have that power.

I suspect we are going to have to cope with extreme volatility until a lot of major issues are resolved

Trump vs. Clinton
The reduction in power of the Rothschilds
The collapse of the EU
The establishment of the Petro-Yuan or Petro-Ruble
The release of the major world digital currencies released by Governments.

and so on..........

As the Chinese say - we are entering interesting times.

and don't forget Brexit. :)

wow this amazing coZ i thinking the same way, though im seeing a support level at 8.2k or 7.4k if 9k cant support the sell wall in still bullish on the trend right now overall, itll just take sometine to revisit the highs maybe july or august, i think were long way to go for consolidations as lot of shorters and bot are playing this time. just my sent. :)

As I've stated previously, don't expect a lot of price movement out of this year. Most likely we ain't going anywhere, just staying put between $7k-15k. I'd be surprised if bitcoin breaks that lower support or the resistance. And only if it does move below or above those figures will the markets start to become super volatile like last year, whether in the upwards or downwards direction.

Of course we've tried to break $12k two times now, with no success either time.

If we do break 5 figures again which I think we will soon, $12k will be the immediate resistance. If we can't break it a third time then we may be going lower. It's a huge resistance that has been building up, and actually strengthening due to psychological reason as well because of the failed attempts of breaching it, but it's not impossible or impenetrable.

Explain!

I am not watching news or TV. I thought Trump vs. Clinton is decided? Trump won.
When I hear Rothschild, I feel sick. What ya mean by reduction of power? Sounds good to me.

That’s better be the best strategy to go. Ignore negativity and continue to be positive whatever comes. Do encourage oneself to be not affected from such fuds that can’t even help on deciding about your assets. This range is stable or stuck after a big dip and lower increase as the investors is just observing movement and won’t just jump faster without analysing the market.

Based on what he said "and so on.........." it must be a timeline of events that affect traders' decisions.

But I don't think that Trump vs Clinton presidential election made a huge impact to the 2017 Q4's Bubble.
The ATH was brought by (in order) the Forks (more are buying BTC and withdrawing those out of exchanges to get more forked coins), News about being maintream and FUD brought by the crazy price surge.

.....and the uncontrollable spam in the Bitcoin Discussion Board,
for example: Will you still buy at 17k?/20k? - with 100 Replies like: bdsbx rberbYESbdbsajdsd snd!

Bitcoin trending around $10k is a healthy sign as per my knowledge, last year same period Bitcoin was trending around $1k and this years it is x10 times. Next year we can assume it would be trending around $50k. This is actually a good trend in fact, I agree with your data and graph but still I would say the peak is yet to come probably in July and my expectation is around $60k.

We've achieved a lot of great things last year , and now we would only see a correction that mostly considered as a normal situation that shows how healthy crypto market , is it what u mean? Great things would remain keep coming this year , Bitcoin has turned mainstream and we just need some breakthrough to completely change the 12k resistance to 12k as support and we move up again. What could make this breakthrough are A clear regulation from the biggest crypto market like China , or a superpower country like Russia officially legalize Bitcoin that could change the way common people look at investment and currency into how crypto could be the perfect option without fear to start get to know and use Bitcoin as investment or a payment tool. Did u know how big money build the resistance ? It's breach just like that , waiting for various trader around the world build this resistance wouldn't surprise me if we stuck at the current range for long time. We need something big and I think almost every year it's happened in crypto.

Now a few large investors are selling their bitcoins. For this reason, the price is kept at a stable level. This is a good sign. This means that the trend is positive and only large volumes of sales keep prices. As soon as the process of selling large sums will be completed prices will soar to the moon. I think it will be in 2-3 months.

It's going to be an interesting time for sure. If we look at last year, then we dipped slightly under $900 around March 25, where from that point the market kept going up like there is no tomorrow.

I don't say that we'll experience the same sort of market movement, and especially with how mtgox is playing an important role, but it just shows that even at current levels, we are doing excellent, even if some people don't feel it.

People are so much used to staring at $20,000, that they completely ignore how exactly one year ago we were hovering under the $1000 mark. In other words, back then below $1000, and now below $10,000. How bad can that be?

Do you guys even understand how much of an increase that is? And how ridiculously bad and fake that $20,000 peak looks? Speculative nonsense, nothing more.

Some of them sold their shares due to that MT.Gox shares dumping issues happened this past days. Those events really brought bitcoins go a huge hell dump which people afraid to handle with, But if things will became silent and certain good developments will came then provably we might gonna see a huge price pump comes on the bitcoins on the next following months.

No offense intended but it just doesn't feel right. You say that you've been a professional trader for a dozen of years, but how successful were you really? So many years of a successful trading career would make you into a multimillionaire who wouldn't give a fuck about posting here. Further, you didn't say that the fall from 20k was due to shorts. That's what you meant. Anyway, the price didn't get there overnight, someone had been buying all the way up and this necessitates someone else should have been selling. Besides, it seems to be universally recognized already and even confirmed (https://www.ccn.com/bitcoin-drops-8300-mt-gox-trustee-sell-off-continues-market-drops/) by the trustee himself that the recent price crash was exactly due to off-loading of the Gox coins in the open market.

Whatever, think what you want but I gave some good advice about trading there and you're welcome to learn from it or ignore it.

The market is in a consolidation which means that there are traders in long positions and traders in short positions and when it looks like it is going to break out one side will panic. That is what will decide the direction we go next.

Go back and read what I said again. All moves come to an end due to profit taking and that induces others to chase.

Oh, and professional traders are not all multi-millionaires. It's a tough job and most of grind out a living.


What the article actually says:

Hmmm...

I thought and stated that a carnage would start in January 2018 but I was wrong. This downturn started in February 2018 and will continue for a long time, maybe until end of 2019. We will see $2000 by then. Why? Because the fundamentals are weak, governments around the world have started to crack down, and investors have become wiser.

Well, somehow grinding out a living doesn't resonate quite well with being a professional futures trader for 12 years. At least, not in the sense you meant it.


Did you read the piece in its entirety? It is only one page long, and right after that WhalePanda citation, the Mt. Gox trustee himself says the following:


Moreover, he is going to sell more than $1.7 billion worth of Bitcoin in the upcoming months, so everyone should beware of more profound price declines. He still has 160k BTC against 40k already sold.

Thank you for demonstrating you have no idea what being a professional trader involves. I have made a living from trading for just over 12 years which is far more successful than most that have tried.


Yes, I did read it and that quote in no way says what you said it did. He says that he sold them, he does not say that the price drop was caused by that action.


Everyone in this case not including traders who will pay far more attention to order flow.

Then your reference to being a professional trader is meaningless.


It turns out there was no meaningful support at 9k. The price went down 2 thousand dollars to below 8k like nothing, and it doesn't look there is enough support building up there either. From my perspective, the price doesn't go lower simply because no one is actively selling at these prices, not because buying walls are springing up. If there is no volume, after some time Bitcoin will continue falling when last hopes for a massive breakout vanish. And then 12k will become a new 20k.

Your ignorance of what it takes to consistently make a living from trading in no way diminishes what I have pointed out. Go back to drawing pretty lines on your charts and see how far that gets you.

Serious question, does G20 meeting will have any effect towards bitcoin price?

1. forks: they may have affected bitcoin price but any effect would have been temporary, because if you believe that people bought bitcoin only to get those coins, then the same people would have dumped what they have bought + the profit they gained as soon as fork was done so price should have dropped bigger and as soon as forks were done. for example right after BCH fork, BTG fork and so on depending on their fork-size.

2. i don't think you know what FUD means. FUD is not something that brings price surge!

3. if you think spaming bullshit on bitcointalk can change anything about price then you know nothing of the price :D

The carnage started as early as December. But it took a month before people realized how deep in trouble they were. In February, the price crashed below 10k but just in January it went down half of its December highs. Though I don't think we will see prices below 3k, at least not for long. Other than that, I'm going to say there are no fundamentals in the stock market sense. This is all speculation, and we may be past its peak already.


That's pathetic. Someone who claims to be an allegedly successful "professional trader" for a dozen years is posting for money on a forum.

I went past the paid posts count this week ages ago. I've got time to kill until US markets open. I'm also a Bitcoin enthusiast and have been involved for a long time. I get a lot out of participating on this forum and the bit of extra coin I get for renting out my sig is inconsequential.

What is really pathetic is how you turned my disagreeing with your analysis into a personal attack on me.

You didn't disagree with my analysis in any constructive way, to begin with. You came up with contrived arguments like who was selling when the market was trading near December highs and ended up with references to your "professional trading career", as if it could give more substance and weight to your argument. And then it turned out that you have essentially nothing to be bragging about, either.

And now a scar-riddled and battle-hardened trader whines about some personal attacks. Now stop crying kiddie and get a life!

A reminder that it was a constructive counterargument.



After you just dismissed my reading of the situation with this.



When you chuck a well paying IT career in and start off with $50k trading capital you saved and then support yourself from the income. Then do that for at least 3 years you'll have something interesting to say on that. Until then you're just another wannabee playing with TA that is as reliable as astrology.


I'm not crying, I'm trying not to laugh at you as I'm actually starting to feel sorry for you.

It will be good to have some period of consolidation anyway after the market has been bared out. Over time, this could give time for accumulation, for the market to gather enough momentum and we can then see what happens next from there. I am still very optimistic the market will recover, but we cannot say when and we just have to wait for it anyway, so the little we have to play with now, that is good enough.

The 12k wall can be penetrable but that would be with some high volume and then we may have to need some good news to get that out of the way. I somehow agree with all that you have said, and I want to believe that we may actually end up consolidating for a while now until we are able to gather momentum. However, the more we consolidate, the more we still stand any chance of a 50:50 occurrence in the market of going lower or testing the hard resistances.

I think it might have infect on bitcoin pricing as there is always a negative reactions when bitcoin price goes down. Bitcoin has been having good days and has strive to remain relevant all over the world but many people especially those that failed to understand how it works keep saying that bitcoin need to be banned or regulated. The G20 meeting are part of the tools that are going to be used to regulate bitcoin price.

Unless we will have some positive news I doubt that bitcoin price will soar again - we are now entered a deep bear market.
I cannot remember what was a truly positive bitcoin news in mainstream media in 2018 - we only keep hearing about negative things related to BTC.
But honestly, the current price is still better than most people expected we could have prior to that manic rush in December 2017.

We are trapped because there is a third party who wants us trapped. Bitcoin prices are currently unpredictable because the market is not running properly (controlled by a third party). But i'm very sure bitcoin will not slip to the same place that is $ 6,000.

I think we will stuck for this price range for long if there will be no other investors are interested or attracted to bitcoins because other bitcoin investors already dump some of their bitcoin as they buy it for alt coins.

Personally for me, I got fed up with indicators a long time ago and I started playing price actions on trend lines, support and resistance with my stop loss intact. At least, the insanity of having to draw up so many conclusions with a lot of TA is no longer there and I just prefer trading those candles better. It is a complex and new market, so it seems, one will just have to accept that you have to be extra careful.

maybe. but the main factor of the decline due to several factors over the ban from some countries and follow by facebook and google. this is the domain of the decline. the current situation is so difficult to determine and predict. and right now bitcoin tends to be like what you say.

So you are just some random IT dude who claims to be a professional trader. Okay, I got it, now get over yourself and stop whining.


I'm not a clairvoyant and don't pretend to be the one but I think there is no real consolidation going on. We slipped past 9 and then 8k like there was no support at all. As stated above, people will get tired of waiting if things keep on moving or rather staying like now. That means there will be downward momentum constantly adding up until prices correct further to a new low. As I previously said too, 12k may then become a new 20k and turn into a literally impenetrable ceiling.

A professional trader is someone who makes their living from trading. I'm sorry if that is too complicated for you to understand. I was lucky enough to be working as an IT consultant for various investment banks and learned from many professionals back then. Knowledge passed on from those who do is far more valuable than all the random gurus that make a living selling trading education, they are mostly failed traders. If you don't want to pay any attention to the advice I gave that's your loss, not mine.

Enjoy your charts. /Quin out

Your advice has already been proven wrong and thus pointless. There was no support at 8.3k as you claimed. We easily went past it down to 7.6k the next day you wrote your "advice", and the chances are we will likely go lower in the coming days. So far things look bleak for Bitcoin and crypto as whole. There is neither support nor consolidation at current levels. I think you are way overestimating your predictive powers and understanding of the markets.

Anyway, good luck to you and your trading "career".

Good luck on learning to read.


Lol

Right, the banning news doesn't seem to end and this is is greatly affecting the market prices. I hate to admit it but I am getting worried about my investments and I know that I am not the only one. We really need some good news about bitcoin or cryptos and I hope that it will be this week. The market prices are going on red and I don't want to think that we may be staying at this state for a long time. I know that after dumps, bitcoin and other cryptos will regain their high prices.

This huge dump are totally creating a huge panic to majority on investor and I can't blame you to get worried for this current situation since the dump is so huge which is so awful to see. But I'm expecting this to be happen since mid year is totally a crazy months for bitcoin and we can expect that huge pump will came on next following days. Remember Crypto whales doesn't allow bitcoin to get dump and reach for its baddest price.

Then you are a scared badass, this is not new in here, and trust me, i am more that used to see this kind of thing in bitcoin, i have been in here for years.

Considering that your account is kinda new, if you are always going to be like this, then please, leave crypto,
you are gonna be useless.

Yeah, and that is a big may. Every reaction in the market today is cause generally by trader and basically whales. The general day trader are just there to respond to how the market is being perceived at that point in time which is one of the reasons I will always say it is still a controlled market anyway, since whales can decide to push it how they want since we are still in a speculative era. $12k may be a strong resistance but some fundamentals can throw it out of the way, but we have none of those for now.

You should trust the dude above who is a pro-trader (well, at least this is what he claims himself). And he says that we will soon see a sort of short squeeze due to shorters closing their positions in panic. That should give Bitcoin prices a phenomenal boost, according to him. Personally, I believe it is not gonna happen in the foreseeable future, but I'm not claiming to be a pro, so my opinion kind of lacks enough weight and self-righteousness.

One day you hopefully will learn to read.

I said that was one of two possible scenarios and ruling it out as you did in your OP was wrong.


This is what I disagree with. No support or resistance is impenetrable, it is simply the price the market changed direction before. It is a number traders will make a note of and see what happens if price revisits it. Will the sellers still be there or not? We have no way of knowing that. It is a very simple lesson in trading that I was trying to share. I'm sorry that it is beyond your comprehension skills to understand it. That should already have been obvious from the way you couldn't grasp what that CCN article said and failure to understand the definition of the word professional.

I am not sure you have checked the altcoins to see how bad most of them have been beaten as a result of bitcoin's drop in price and if anyone feels they cannot get from bitcoin what they could get from altcoins, then, they are free to go stick with their pump and dump coins. We cannot say what will be happen at any time, but we can only know what will happen when the time comes but I guess we will have to wait and see how stuck we are as time goes on.

Personally, I'm not interested in your postings here or anywhere. It feels like I'm talking to a 15 year old who is highly extremely insecure, overwhelmingly fixated on what people might think of him, and pathologically obsessed with proving his point at all costs, no matter how disconnected it is from reality. In short, try proving your point to the market first since this is what ultimately counts. There's no need to prove it here, which you seem to not understand.

Someone offers a different approach to reading the market so you set about telling them they are clutching at straws and then insulting them.

I had given up any hope of having a sensible conversation with you and was done with this thread. Then you post this.


If you are going to misrepresent what I said then I'm going to it point out.

---

Edit:
Bearing in mind your earlier statement you might want reading this: https://cointelegraph.com/news/breaking-trustee-of-infamous-mt-gox-denies-btc-bch-sales-affected-crypto-markets

This kind of situations is totally normal in this community and this is definitely because of the volatility of the coins. I maybe worry about my investments too because of the market prices but not that much because bitcoin and other cryptos will get higher prices in the future. Digital coins are being a center of interest when it comes to online earning and we know that people kind of like that way of earning because of its convenience. It helps those who can't go to companies, firms, and etc. for income and in fact, it also attracts those who are already in the companies and firms because of possible higher income.

We don't have to be that negative when it comes to cryptos because they will eventually recover from these dumps. Bad news are circulating over the net but it is up to us if we will let those affect us and our way of thinking in cryptos.

Do not be sure of anything yet in this market bro, it is unpredictable and anything can happen at any time. What we have is the chart and that is what we are looking at to give us the signals to buy back in or to just keep stretching our hands and dipping it in the popcorn bag while watching how everything turns out. I would love the scenario of a double bottom playing out though.

When it comes to cryptos, assurance is nowhere to be assured. Because of the volatile market, we have, people keeps on being interested and at the same time is the reason why people are giving up and selling what they have. There is the may be in the We may be stuck in the current range because people keep on selling even if the price is dumping. We cannot control them on what they are going to do with their coins, it is theirs anyway, but somehow we can help by not being as negative as the others are. Yes, the price is dumping and it is a good chance to buy, other than that let us not try to add with all the negativity already existing.

Maybe, maybe not. If it turns out to be positive and we get to see some huge interest from investors as a result of that, then we may see some positive improvement in the value of bitcoin, otherwise, I will decide to remain mute on what the outcome of a negative news can cause, but I really do not expect anything strange to happen anyway as I am sure there is a lot of enthusiasm by governments to regulate the space, so let's wait and see.

Positive news from G20 meeting may really be of great help right now but it just seems the market is just not ready to eve move from one spot but to just keep going down and maybe we may end up seeing a double bottom before a rise, no one knows but whichever way, let's see how the whole thing turns out. Negative news will be over when things start changing with regulation as most of them have actually been brewed from one government doing this or the other.

By definition, impenetrable means that it is conclusively not possible to breach... Even the biggest bear and disbelievers wouldn't put it beyond Bitcoin to at least make many more runs past 12k before its eventual fate is met.

We're all speculators in the end, regardless of our strongest beliefs in this thing that is Bitcoin. Every step of the way, it's been impossible to predict where the price would be in a week, month, year. I still harbour the highest hopes but I haven't been led away by the fact that Bitcoin can as easily arrive at 1 million as it can to zero.

Even if or when btc makes it past 12 k again, doesn't mean anyone's a genius or a fool, either. Just some of us get luckier.

I think that you can look at things from a different angle. I never took Bitcoin as a means of payment and could not predict such a fate for him. But to date, there is already information that many stores in Malaysia are accepting Bitcoin payments. This shows the real prospects of Bitcoin.

Hey, guys, that was just a figure of speech, no need to tell me to consult the dictionary really. I was just pointing out and emphasizing specifically that 12k could become a new ceiling like 20k before. Does anyone of us earnestly believe that we will be able to get there again within months? And 12k may become as unreachable. Right now people talk of 20k with kind of awe, but if we continue to stay below 10k for longer, 12k may soon become as mythical.

Hey OP, yeah, I think we knew, even though that's not really how figures of speech work ;)

Months is a short-term view, but sure, I think we could see 12k once or twice this spring season. It's still too recent in my memory to consider it elusive. All it takes right now is a 30% jump in price from today's value, and we've seen that happen easily with Bitcoin in a matter of days... for reasons we'll all scramble to find if/when it does happen.

But yeah, some segments of traders might have entered a siege mentality, and if they believe they have to dig in, they'll maintain sandbags around 10k, not daring to cross over until they're sure they've got enough strength to power another bull run.

It is not how words work, it is more how you perceive them. Of course, we could jump to 12k within a week or two and see that price once or twice the spring season. We can even break out of the resistance at that level a little. And then you can jump for joy and point a finger at me saying how wrong I was. But that's not the point. It is not like there's massive "impenetrable" resistance at 12k exactly and pure vacuum right after that. The resistance will likely surge exponentially past that figure. So, we could in fact end like seeing 12k once or twice but not much beyond that. Though I'd be glad to have myself proved wrong in a genuine way. Hope you now understand what I mean.

I completely agree with you, we will not see more than 12,000 dollars further this year. There are some considerations about stabilizing the market, with today's price for Bitcoin. Because earlier all look like a soap bubble.

Well, personally I don't believe in that stabilizing thing. So far the longer the price had been stable, the stronger was the next burst. Bitcoin and other cryptocoins are internally unstable because there is nothing that would make them stable. Major fiat currencies have whole economies backing up the value of a currency. Bitcoin's value, on the contrary, depends entirely on speculators interest. It is interesting that a couple years ago this thought would have met a strong opposition but by now oppositionists seem to gave died out already.

Bubble or not, it doesn't matter. Bitcoin really helps many people to earn big money so it has the right to exist. For me, Bitcoin is a tool that everyone uses for their own purposes. Speculators really constantly inflate and burst bubbles. But there are many people who buy bitcoin for long lasting hold. For them, bitcoin is not a bubble and without sterilizing so many coins, speculators would not have such opportunities.

understand the point. however we also cannot totally rules out that some percentage of the buyer are in for the quick profit. be it thru ico, or thru trading, and these people are the first one that will jump out of the ship when SHTF

It's the bearish pattern that's prolonging our agony may be a cause of corrections and events related to cryptocurrencies. Others who are also not good enough in hodling will eventually give in and will sell their crypto assets during crisis. If these will always continue, then we will expect to be stuck in this price range for long.

But it seems that you don't see the whole picture. No one is questioning Bitcoin's right to exist. With that said, however, we should keep in mind that while it may in fact help some people earn big money, this necessarily comes at the expense of others. As long as Bitcoin was growing, this didn't matter. But now when Bitcoin has retreated half of its former price, it is no longer the case. As Warren Buffett loves to say, only when the tide goes out do you discover who's been swimming naked.

too many negative news for crypto which makes the price seems stuck at those range because if the price has starting to rise up then we will see several bad news for crypto and the price back too dropped again however being stuck is more better rather than dropped to the bottom so i think the current price still high and nothing to worried

It is not the news. It is rampant and obsessive speculation finally tapering off and wearing out as it should have been as people lose their interest after Bitcoin peaked in December. No more milk today. You can think of it as Bitcoin's speculative bubble deflating to its real value which is determined by the coin's real use as a means of payment in the Internet. This is a bad thing for self-proclaimed "professional" traders blindly expecting short squeezes and new highs or whatever, but it may be a good thing after all for the long-term success of Bitcoin and crypto in general. As prices go down and stabilize a little, we may see real adoption expanding soon thereafter.

The bad thing is people that only read half of what is right in front of them. I never said I expected it, I said it was one of two things that could happen. Closing your eyes to one side of the market is equally dangerous as everything is possible and you need to weigh the probabilities.

Indeed you are now backing down on your previous claims, now that the price fell below $7k and has all the chances to crash even lower. If the price went to $14-15, you would be shouting at every corner something along the lines "go back to drawing pretty lines on your charts and see how far that gets you". But it doesn't really matter what you say or claim, you are just a loud mouth thinking too much of yourself, kinda "I am a professional trader and I see the future". You see nothing simply because $12k turned by now into what $20k had been a month or so ago, that is, an impenetrable ceiling at which lots of people will be happy to sell out and get off for good.

Now we shall see how $9k goes.

Really?


What previous claim am I backing down from?

You on the other hand.




The 'impenetrable wall' phrase in the OP was the only reason I replied and gave an example of how it could be breached. As you've already backed down from your claim and now refer to it as 'a figure' of speech you have accepted the argument I put forward.

Why you feel the need to repeatedly misrepresent the argument I put forward even after I've pointed out to you that I didn't make any prediction several times I find difficult to fathom. The only two possibilities I can think of are either you really don't understand what I said as it is too complicated for you or you are deliberately doing it to satisfy some purile need.

Go away. Finally.

I already did twice but you decided to lie about what I said so I had to come back and correct it.

it's very nice when a person blindly believes in a crypto currency and does not even suspect about possible risks. Everyone who decided to link their destiny with the crypto currency should understand that he will always be at risk of losing his money or on the contrary get a good profit .

Well it's not going to be like this forever. Though i'm also not the type to go all in on crypto, i also think that in time, this market will make big differences in the lives of holders and believers. It just depends on how long you can hold your ground in times like these.

As I see it, there is a vicious circle of sorts. For Bitcoin, or any other coin, for the record, to gain traction in the real world and commerce, it needs to be cheap both in terms of transactions and just cheap in terms of price. Otherwise, people will be hoarding it but that will obviously lead to higher prices. But higher prices of a coin don't match the requirement of being cheap. And we seem to get stuck forever in this negative feedback loop.

As i see the crypto markets today, it turned green from red and it looks promising as bitcoin started to rise. Would this be the start of an uptrend that will be a game changer for cryptocurrencies' status?

We have risen measly 10% or even less than that, given that we are still trading slightly above a long-time bottom. This could be construed as a dead cat's bounce, only it is a dead cat which has been dead for at least for 3 months already. We are well in a downward spiral by any metric. And if 3 months ago it had been a question of ever going back to $20k again, then 2 months ago it became a question of breaking out of $12k, while now it is more about trying to reach for $9-10k. The all-crushing ceiling goes lower and lower.

Traders won't be able to gain any profit without this circle of sorts. If the price doesn't go up, then it won't go down and vise versa. Some people seek for stability but if we go for this, it's not going to be as healthy and this might make bitcoin die. Others think that stability is better than experiencing frequent fluctuations of the price however the traders I able to profit from this volatility. It may seem bad for traders to blindly expect for the price to rise however this comes with the risk of trading.