Bitcoin Forum

 qz.com  (https://qz.com/1600609/seasteading-cabin-could-bring-bitcoin-couple-death-penalty/)
American bitcoin trader and his girlfriend may face death penalty over Thailand 'sea home' (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/sea-home-thailand-bitcoin-us-american-couple-death-penalty-chad-elwartowski-nadia-supranee-thepdet-a8878511.html)

https://cms.qz.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/chad-seasteader.jpg?quality=75&strip=all&w=1600&h=900

 Elwar here in bitcointalk (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=554)
 his girlfriend Instagram  (https://www.instagram.com/bitcoingirlthailand)
his facebook  (https://www.facebook.com/chad.elwartowski/posts/10156120345716179)


A pirate’s life ain’t all that it’s cracked up to be: A bitcoin couple is sought by Thai authorities after trying to make a lawless, tax-free home on the sea outside Phuket island. If convicted, the duo face a potential death penalty for violating Thailand’s sovereignty.

SEASTEADING/YOUTUBE
Waterfront views
But Chad Elwartowski, a US citizen, and his Thai girlfriend, Supranee “Nadia Summergirl” Thepdet, had already fled the offshore cabin by the time Thai navy personnel arrived at it today (April 20).

“I was free for a moment. Probably the freest person in the world,” Elwartowski posted later on Facebook.

The duo said the cabin, built by an outfit called Ocean Builders, was floating in international waters and therefore without jurisdiction.


Thailand, however, said the structure threatened its sovereignty and plans to tow it to shore. It also revoked Elwartowski’s visa.

The cabin was situated within Thailand’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ), but not its territorial sea. (Here’s the location on Google Maps.) Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (pdf), to which Thailand is a party, an EEZ extends 200 nautical miles from a nation’s coastline. Within it, a state has exclusive rights to natural resources such as fish and oil but does not have full sovereignty. It does have the latter within its territorial waters, which extend out 12 nautical miles from the shore.

https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2019/04/19/17/screen-shot-2019-04-19-at-12.35.18-pm.png?w968

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First seastead is now in international waters. Only currencies accepted..฿ & BTC (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5106251.msg49590453#msg49590453)

The “freest person in the world” faces a possible death penalty in Thailand

A pirate’s life ain’t all that it’s cracked up to be: A bitcoin couple is sought by Thai authorities after trying to make a lawless, tax-free home on the sea outside Phuket island. If convicted, the duo face a potential death penalty for violating Thailand’s sovereignty.

SEASTEADING/YOUTUBE
Waterfront views
But Chad Elwartowski, a US citizen, and his Thai girlfriend, Supranee “Nadia Summergirl” Thepdet, had already fled the offshore cabin by the time Thai navy personnel arrived at it today (April 20).

“I was free for a moment. Probably the freest person in the world,” Elwartowski posted later on Facebook.

The duo said the cabin, built by an outfit called Ocean Builders, was floating in international waters and therefore without jurisdiction.


Thailand, however, said the structure threatened its sovereignty and plans to tow it to shore. It also revoked Elwartowski’s visa.

The cabin was situated within Thailand’s exclusive economic zone (EEZ), but not its territorial sea. (Here’s the location on Google Maps.) Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (pdf), to which Thailand is a party, an EEZ extends 200 nautical miles from a nation’s coastline. Within it, a state has exclusive rights to natural resources such as fish and oil but does not have full sovereignty. It does have the latter within its territorial waters, which extend out 12 nautical miles from the shore.

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First seastead is now in international waters. Only currencies accepted..฿ & BTC (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5106251.msg49590453#msg49590453)
   
Couple Uses Bitcoin Wealth to Build World’s First Seastead (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5115929.msg49982277#msg49982277)

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The Thai government was extremely authoritarian. Unfortunately, the first seastead did not work very well. But I hope this legal issue is resolved and he can continue with his dream.

Not that I am dismissing threats to their safety but we have a lot of death penalties for a lot of things, rarely carried out. Always take a stance not to provoke when in hot water. The govt has also said it will drop the charge (for which carries death penalty) and pursue far less severe charges.

This is news that's a week old, although yesterday (https://eu.freep.com/story/news/world/2019/04/22/thailand-michigan-seasteader-elwartowski/3536860002/) it was confirmed in Thai reports that the Navy has, in fact, destroyed Elwar's seastead. He was last online here a day before his last FB post, which suggests he really is trying to stay away.

I'm sure this will become much bigger news if/when some law firm picks up on it. A bit of a shame though. The way it sounded, it was like he'd done all his due diligence before going ahead. And seemingly, they were 20 others planned for construction. Probably what ticked the authorities off. I'm almost sure if everyone had been brought on board first, this wouldn't have happened.

Of course, still sad news for a Bitcoin early adopter. But all reports seem to indicate he's safe and will try return to US.

Doesn't look good
https://www.bangkokpost.com/news/security/1665816/hunted-seastead-couple-traced-to-tarutao-island


I've said it once that you shouldn't trust authorities in those countries, they want to picture theirs like welcoming home for everyone but once you do something they don't like the punishments are at least exaggerated if not crazy.

 

That's genuinely saddening.  It seems the governments of this world aren't willing to let people prove that not everyone needs them.  It doesn't serve their interests to allow people to live independently from the state, otherwise more might follow, which is why they'll fight it at every opportunity.

They are not going to let that one go.

This is usually same with these poor countries which rely on only tourism as a source of income. They are friendly and welcoming to the foreigners just because you spend your money there. Do not ever think you can mess with the Authorities just because you are rich and the locals like you. Elwar thought that the Thais are friendly to the foreigners and they won't mess with him but guess what, somebody carried out the word to the up highs.

"Some American guy is building a country here! He is a threat to our sovereignty!"

Bam! They can even accuse Elwar for being a spy now. These stuff ain't a joke.

Hopefully he already escaped from that place.

geez, that didn't last very long. :-\

i thought he was in legit international waters......it didn't even occur to me this might happen. my prayers go out to them, sounds like a really fucked up situation. hits close to home, elwar is a good dude, been seeing him for years on the spec forum.

Sad to see their current situation and hope Elwar do manage to settle it up.  Thai government might need some splash from Early Bitcoin adopter. lol

I'm reading elsewhere that Elwar claims the seastead is 14 nautical miles offshore and therefore in international waters. Some sources are saying Thai authorities are claiming it is only 12 nautical miles offshore and therefore under their jurisdiction, whereas others are saying they accept it is outwith the 12 mile zone, but anything within the 200 miles economic zone is fair game. Regardless of the legalities of it, this is a real shame and a massive overreaction by Thailand.

Here's hoping they both get out safely. There is zero chance Thailand tries to execute a US citizen for something like this, though.

I hope he gets the support of big international organizations and big firms specializing in such disputes. Having a clearer definition of the legality of this type of enterprise could be revolutionary. But unfortunately, without a country offering support, I find it unlikely that it will be able to get representation in the major international bodies.

Why did they chose Thailand with their strict laws and a total dictatorship for this experiment? I would have rather picked a country without the death penalty! <His girlfriends country of origin, might have been the motivating factor behind this... right?>

In any way, most countries will have an issue with tax-free homes in their territorial waters and also non-citizens doing this in their country. This was a huge gamble with their lives or a life long sentence in a Thailand jail.  :P

Just imagine what the environmental impact would be if 1000s of people did this in your country.  ::)  <Where will all the sewerage and grey water go?>

There were probably a number of factors that led them to there. First of all, they have to be close to a somewhere they can buy more supplies - food, toiletries, diesel/gas, etc. They can't just build in the middle of the sea, they've got to be near somewhere where they can easily land a small boat within easy reach of a supermarket. Climate would also have played a big part in selecting a location. They need somewhere with few storms or hurricanes. They need somewhere where the sea is usually relatively calm and waves are generally small. It would also have depended on various local prices of materials and labor to construct these steadings.

That doesn't really look that they're really "independent from the State". Even if they only went on shore to buy necessary goods and paid necessary services like medical emergency treatment with their own money, they are using a State's infrastructure, like roads, ports etc.

I'm sorry, I think seasteading doesn't have a future if it's not carried out with LOTs of planning, and preferably by a major group of people. Anarchy isn't only about "not paying taxes". It has also to do also with finding alternatives for the services states provide to you.

I hope the best for him, but his plan simply doesn't look sustainable.

This reads like a joke article. They built a big metal box in the sea and anchored it. It's similar to what ships are doing. They also filled in some paperwork so the government knew they were planning to live there and now they are hunted down like criminals.

If they stole a purse from an old lady the authorities wouldn't care but try to live in peace on a self made floating device and you're an enemy of the state. :-\

I agree with you. I think seasteading is a noble cause and a very interesting idea, but implementing it on a small scale of two people living in a single small cabin is not feasible. Their website states that they used a solar-powered purifier for their water needs, and solar power for the rest of their electricity. It also, however, states that they had a back up diesel generator. The diesel has to come from somewhere, and they are not drilling for it themselves. Their site also made no mention whatsoever of food or farming. If you want to live separate from any country or state then you need to be self-sustainable, and a huge part of that is being able to grow your own food year-round. That's simply not possible in such a small space, meaning they are still depending on a country for the bare necessities, regardless of whether they are living within its borders or not.

This has been all over the news of late.I would have to agree also that the idealistic lifestyle is a little floored.... It would be wonderful though to live free from all government jurisdictions but on their small scale certainly not feasible.You really have to admire their courage and ingenuity though. Wouldn't catch me living on that little thing.Hope the government can see some humour in it.

We cannot protect our own sovereignty without a military backing it. Be ready to die fighting for it. This is where the Libertarians do not get it.

In any case, agreed with vit05. I hope he resolves this legal issue and goes back home laughing at the crazy experience.

Yep. Probably it's an experiment they wanted to carry out to try, like a kind of holiday, for at most some months or a few years - hoping that other people could join them. However, I think there are better places to do that than military dictatorships.

And I believe even if they succeed[ed] (maybe they try it again, I don't think they really will get killed for that, even in Thailand!) that the subsequent steps, providing a "libertarian ecosystem" for essential services, is much more difficult than the first step they've started (building this "seasted house"). For example, take this Liberarian community in Chile with the name taken out of this famous Ayn Rand novel (I don't remember the exact name, something related to "John Galt" - Edit: found it, it was "Galt's Gulch"), where at the end they got into legal conflicts between themselves (not only with the State).

I however disagree with bbc.reporter - I think a Libertarian/Anarchist settlement (like a seastead) may be possible, but there is much work that has to be done for that.

the trouble with that mindset is that somebody has to do something first, even if it's one step in a series of incremental steps. if the Thai government hadn't acted this way, there was a possibility of taking further steps. Your criticism seems to be that Elwar didn't execute every possible detail from the beginning, that's unrealistic for many reasons. taking the simplest foundational steps first at least means something actually happened, instead of endless talking about it


Elwar was the first to try. Maybe we could argue that he should have seen this coming, but he deserves alot of respect for at least trying, and it was no insignificant attempt. He spent alot of money & time planning and contructing his seastead, which is more than most people in the seasteading bracket have done

Nobody should dispute the fact that a lot of planning went into the actual project and to build the actual structure. I think "Oceanbuilders" also had a huge contribution in this.  ???

I just think the location should have been given more consideration. Yes, any location will do, IF it is not within the territory of any nation, but it seems as though Thailand is disputing the location of his "house" and they are saying it is within their economic zone <EEZ>.   ::)

Also, doing this close to Thailand with their "dictatorship" government, might have been a poor choice. Kudos for them for trying this, because most people would not even challenge any government in this way.  ;)

From their website, it seems a lot of thought was put in to the location they chose, for many of the reasons I outlined in my post above. Ocean Builders have recently made a blog post (https://ocean.builders/ocean-builders-response-to-the-thai-navy-moving-our-seastead/) which states that they are keen to stay within the Andaman Sea due to its calm waters and lack of storms and hurricanes. They also state they have received offers from other countries who would be keen for them to set up near their coasts.

It very much looks like they are keen to push on despite this setback, so kudos to them. It also looks like they may not have to move very far from their current location to find a new and more welcoming home.

Yep, I actually agree here, as an experiment it's interesting.

However, the problem in my eyes is more the focus of the project - a solitary seastead home always will need a State or at least a community near for essential services. In this case, it becomes fundamental that this community accepts your presence, which was something that seems to have been lacking in their plans which focused more on physical geography (climate, water depth etc.).

This is a more general critique I have for several "libertarian" projects, not only for Elwar. As I wrote I don't consider libertarian communities without a State impossible, but a lot of factors are often not taken into account.

Any government is just a big protection racket gang, so from this point of view it totally makes sense that they would bully a private citizens who decided that it doesn't need them. One of the biggest criticism of seasteading is that they can't protect themselves because they wouldn't have a strong enough military, and this case clearly demonstrates it. Even if we imagine that other countries and organizations like UN will condemn such attacks, it would mean absolutely nothing, because no one would fight for a seastead.

Elwar did one mistake, in his quest for independence he didn't though what others think of it nor what he could possibly trigger.
And honestly, although I said it once that I'm wondering how happy the thai government is about this I've never thought it would come to this kind of reaction.

But now looking back, it is pretty easy to see why would they react like this, what if the project would have gain traction, a few thousands of those floating around in an untaxed region and slashing their tourism profits, that wouldn't look good in the books, especially for a country that would go bankrupt without it. Plus with all the mess China is doing with its artificial islands on the other side of the peninsula they decided to step in and...what we see now.

Elwar's profile is still not active, did he get away, any updates on this?

This is the newest photo that I could find. It was made yesterday and according to the article they still haven't found them. I hope they can get away and survive this witch hunt. https://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/1666424/seastead-lifted-ashore-at-phuket-port

https://static.bangkokpost.com/media/content/20190424/c1_1666424_190424193844_620x413.jpg


There's also an article saying that "couple’s claim that they are in international waters, and outside of Thai maritime territory, are untrue." Did they miscalculate?

What a mess. I support Elwar and Thailand reaction is exaggerated like any other fifth world random government...
Hopefully they didn't catch them yet and I hope they will escape easily!
Yes or maybe someone should call Trump and asks him to invade Thailand for threatening the live of a US citizen. The girl however could be in trouble if caught...

Then the government itself removed it from the sea. The company had already offered to withdraw and pay for all costs. Exactly because it is a complex operation. Unfortunately, the Thai government seems to be little open to dialogue. The ideal would be to remove in a peaceful manner and make clear the rules about any such action in the future.

This is the first time in my life that I hear such a story, how can the police be hunting them for something so small? it seems that they are some terrorists who will blow up the world, this is a great exaggeration of the government of thailand, years ago a person of my country was sentenced to death for a very small crime. I would not travel to a country like thailand

I feel the same. Thai government is trying to swat a fly with a grenade. They sent a warship to remove 2 unarmed people from a raft.

I read a couple articles about this and the government feels like they are in law because according to them the floating home was within their borders not on international waters like Elwar said. The authorities also claim the home was built without any permits and was built on the entry to the port and a danger to passing ships. I guess if you have something like that you need it to be well lit during the night to avoid being rammed. They also say that they tried to contact the seastead before going there to remove it.

On the other hand it looks like Thailand doesn't respect UN conventions and their waters are wherever they want them to be.


Elwar says the army came there to kill them and he's worried they will do it if they find him.

One thing is certain there will be no seastead in Thailand because they cancelled his visa.

It is not impossible, however, it would also need a type of protection that only a state can provide. Real military protection with soldiers willing to die to protect your liberty.

I am not here to side with any government but just because we belong to the Bitcoin community, and we have the idea of seasteading in our heart do not mean that we should not be working with the government to make sure that what we are doing can never trigger any governmental response. The government with all of its resources, might and influence can bring big hassle to any ordinary citizen that is why we have to avoid wrangling with it. Fighting the government for the sake of having the right to live in the sea may not be worth it in my opinion. I hope the two can find this problem resolved as soon as possible as being fugitives can be a big worry.

I think a big mistake was made by deciding to do something like this near Thailand, which has very strict laws for all possible offenses. What is officially listed as an offense here is : “Section 119: Intent to cause injury to the nation” states that, “Whoever does any act with intent to cause the country or any part thereof to descend under the sovereignty of any foreign state, or to deteriorate the independence of the state, shall be punished with death or imprisonment for life.”

What is also important here is fact that Elwartowski is send invitations to other people to join him, and 14 people show some interest to do that. This is something that can not work nowhere near countries like Thailand.

https://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/national/30367972

The funniest, or rather most striking part is that they are going to be prosecuted like invaders, like they were threatening the independence of Thailand! Give me a break!
Don't you guys find it borderline crazy that camping in the middle of the ocean can make you an enemy of the state? And I thought North Korea was detached from reality, but this country is almost on the same level.

I think it's less to do with tax, more about shipping lanes and sovereignty. As you point out SE Asia has its fair share of territorial tensions and before you know it you'd have thousands of Chinese people magically deciding seasteads are a great idea a few miles outside other countries if this was permitted to thrive.

It's little to do with these particular people, everything to do with shutting down potential problems before they get any traction. It was very naive of the builders to place it there, but the first person to do anything always get a bullet in the head.

As for the tenants, I guess no news is good news.

Their website was very clear that the seastead had been purposefully built in an area away from shipping lanes. If I recall correctly, it said it was in an area often used by small fishing boats, so the authorities can't use that as an excuse in this specific case without also arresting all those fishermen.

As you say though, even just a few hundred people deciding they were fed up and setting up shop all around a country could wreak havoc for their shipping routes. It's probably not in the best interests of the seasteaders either - one serious accident and a few hundred shipping containers spilled in to the ocean and you can guarantee that governments across the world would clamp down harshly on any future efforts.

People do have different interest and heck they do built up that seastead on international waters.Its already over 12 Nautical miles which isnt already enclosed into its territory but still
Thai government do treat this thing as a threat and seeing that image above which they do actually remove that seastead and they are just too exaggerated on this case and it seems that they do really hunt for
some terrorist.Hoping for the safety of the couple.

This is what I'm thinking, governments take even the slightest hints of violation of their territory very seriously, because it can set up a precedent or lead to actual territory grabs. For example, Russia says that their military personnel just happen to be on vacation in warzones, imagine if they start popping seasteads right near the borders of territorial waters of some countries, and then use them for some provocations. People who will build the next seasteads should consult with neighbouring countries first, or prepare to possible confrontations in some other ways.

Routes change over time. A route that might have been rammed 100 years ago is empty now due to economics, short cuts being built or new technologies. A few thousand people anchored to the sea bed some miles beyond the horizon may not be the most welcome development in that scenario.

People often point to places like Sealand, but that was built by the British government and hasn't gone anywhere since. They tolerate that for comedy value or for the sake of quiet life. It would be very different if it had turned up and dug in overnight like this.



Hmm. I reckon they should stick to boats. Unsexy, unoriginal, but far more peaceful. That said, I wonder what would happen if someone planted something in the vicinity of Point Nemo. It's 1000 miles to the nearest dot of land there. Finding somewhere shallow enough might be an issue. Along with remaining alive.

I do not understand either. There are so many other countries with much milder laws. In relation to sovereignty, in relation to taxes. Especially in small countries that are tax havens and tourist destinations.

Probably his girlfriend played a role in this, and besides people tend to look at exotic locations when looking at such projects.
A seastead in Thailand or Indonesia would sound a lot better that one in Spain, right?

Pus he needed waters that are calm most of the year, no hurricanes, no storms or high waves and acceptable climate throughout the years.
Unfortunately not many fit into that, add the fact that you don't want to be in a pirate and smugglers infected water like Somalia or Honduras and you're really low on options.

Still no news?

Has anyone seen a real legal analysis of this situation yet? Maritime law is definitely not my strong suit. Was the seastead technically in international waters or was it within the 12 nautical mile limit? The Independent article states this and not much else:



It sounds like that's what pissed the Thai government off -- not the seastead per se but the fact that they were trying to get others to join them:

News is that Chad Elwartowski and his girlfriend are still in Thailand, for now they are safe but they are hiding and live in fear. I guess he want to stay with his girlfriend (she is have son and family), otherwise US Embassy would most likely have pulled him out of the country.

https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/local/phoenix/2019/05/01/bitcoin-trader-chad-elwartowski-nadia-summergirl-seastead-still-running-from-thai-authorities/3643212002/

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Maritime law does not really matter in this case, the government of Thailand accused them by this law :

???
article doesn't say that
they aren't, thank god

I see no post from him but:

So at least he has some internet connection, any of the WOT members know more?

Do you think they would hide if they have left Thailand? That would not make any sense, unless they are in a country that can extradited them to Thailand. Article does not say explicitly that they still are, but it can be concluded by a few sentences that were published.

Oh, now that the article mentioned fb,I searched for his facebook and seems he did posts a few days ago:
https://www.facebook.com/chad.elwartowski

For those who don't want to open the link and go to fb:


Since he says that he doesn't want to reveal his location, probably he is still in Thailand...

But, and there is a big but here
If he returns to the US, could he face extradition back to Thailand, I really doubt it since the US probably won't send one of their citizens to face a death sentence? If yes, what choices he has?

Sending a US citizen to Thailand to face a death sentence will just give Democrats a nice reason to tackle the whole government and even Trump himself. It will not happen.
His best choice is to get out of Thailand and/or find a route to US embassy...

To be really safe, he really needs to get out of Thailand, period. He can go to near by South East Asian country as refuge and go to US embassy. You don't want to stay in a Thailand jail even for 24 hours, that region has one of the worst prison ever.

I just pity Elwar though, he seems to be enjoying all the fruits of his hard work and of course his freedom because of crypto, but just in a blink of an eye, he is now living in a night mare.

I don't think that US will easily gave up on an American citizen to fail death penalty in some countries.

I don't think the Thai govt would go out of their way to toe a vessel from the international waters to its shore just to prosecute two modern hippies. If that were legal then there would be no term for 'international water'.

Plus Thai officials are corrupt as hell. Just pay them a few dollars or satoshis and they'd go home to bed their ladyboys.





Yeah, but how is a sea vessel for 2 people constitute to become a threat to nation's sovereignty? Even if they were tried, it will not hold up in international court. Not to mention the slew of sanctions Thai gov will face.

Thailand is one of the countries who treats their death penalty seriously and Chad Elwartoski would be lucky if he gets away with a slap in the wrist. That's the bad thing of getting carried away with their ideal life they tend to forget  that they have certain responsibilities and obligations with the law before they even continue living the life they want. With Chad being a foreigner fishing food in Thailand's EEZ I think the Thai government would be easy to point fingers on him since he is really guilty of doing it.

You need to ask the Thai government about that, these are their laws and apply to everyone in that country. There is a case of some US citizen who get 2.5 years in prison just for insulting Thai king, so what can be expected for some serious offenses.

As mentioned before, it is not only about 2 people, but also for others who have plan to come there and become neighbors of Elwartowski&Nadia. International courts or sanctions have nothing to do with this, this is an internal matter of a country, and be sure that US will never impose sanctions on Thailand, even if they were to execute the death penalty on Elwartowski.

Who is interested in more about the relations of these countries : https://fas.org/sgp/crs/row/IF10253.pdf

Bumping this if anyone has news...

Elwar did make a post:


pretty weird one, in this situation.

His fb account has posted something according to this (https://www.theadvocates.org/2019/05/couple-could-be-imprisoned-or-executed-for-seasteading-off-of-thailand/) but it has now been taken down.

His girlfriend fb account seems also active but no details, just posting news clips.

@stompix. They might be waiting for their sentence. There might not be much for them to do except browse the internet for news and check social media to contact family and friends.

I reckon someone in the forum who is a friend to him should open a thread to make everyone in the community aware of this issue. Does he need donations?

^ we'd've heard if they'd been captured
we heard they were in a different country anyway
there are ~5 threads on different aspects
2 weeks ago he posted - and then deleted - that they were ok 'thanks to btc'

i get the impression he doesn't need too much noise, and is quite capable of asking if he needs anything

You want to close a potential source of information for the Thai secret intelligence agency?  :P
/serious : hope they are ok and indeed i respect their privacy as you said LOTV8s.

If he don't want to waste the remainder of his life in some dark Thai prison cell, he should seriously consider applying for a Royal pardon. There is no other option in front of him. His American passport can make things a lot easier, as this option is not open for the vast majority of the third world citizens. He should hire a local attorney and then press for a pardon.

His girlfriend instagram has posted 5 days ago this:

The funder behind Ocean.builders #seastead

In 2018, Rudiger Koch first created his prototype: He got plans for oil rigs and built a miniature version of them: XLII
..he founded a company he called "Ocean Builders"... A German restaurateur who emigrated to Thailand wanted to know if Koch could build an underwater restaurant for him.

For added stability, he wanted to grow a coral reef around the platform over time ... The American Bitcoin millionaire Chad Elwartowski and his Thai friend Supranee Thepdet were to live as guests on his platform. "They wanted to live there," says the engineer Koch
Rüdiger Koch...has written to the military attaché of the Thai embassy in Singapore and wants to negotiate with the government ... He wanted to bring investors to Thailand and promote tourism with floating platforms. "I'm sorry, I did not want to upset the Thais." Link 👇🏽👇🏽👇🏽 https://www.zeit.de/2019/20/ruediger-koch-seasteading-schwimmende-plattform-thailand-todesstrafe/komplettansicht

Do you Really Love My Planet.?.
Support (me) @bitcoingirlthailand
Thank you 🙏🏽 🙌🏽👌🏽😉....

https://www.instagram.com/bitcoingirlthailand/

Agree with this one!

The Thai government did this show of force in order to send a message, just like a propaganda machine.
Now that the hype has died down and less than 0.01% follow up they might tone done their enthusiasm and simple drop the charges when nobody cares about it anymore.
Politics at it's finest!!

If they simply desisted from any punishment, it would be a great show of weakness and imbecility. I believe that the best solution for everyone, is a negotiation through some world organization or with the help of another country that offers protection.

You can only dream that it is only about politics. However, some Asian governments can be very crazy also and make it a moral victory if they have a westerner imprisoned or given the death penalty.

This might require a Trump intervention, I reckon.

Lols, and who will know that?
In just a month probably 99% of the people have forgotten about the case, 99.9% will never hear the outcome.

But I'm willing to bet that if you bring up the discussion about building a seastead near Thailand the reaction of your friends is going to be ..you want to get hunted like that American guy?



Yeah, and that moral victory is not about politics?
They acting like crazy and trying to send a message is not about politics?
National pride is all about politics, about trying to show your citizens, neighbors, partners, and your enemies your resolve and your strength. Unfortunately, most only show how stupid they are.

Unfortunately you are right. Thailand is among the few countries in the world, where the death penalty still remains as a valid form of punishment. And worse still, it can be given to individuals accused of treason and Lèse-majesté. And another piece of bad news is that the new king (Maha Vajiralongkorn) is rumored to be very conservative as far as crime and punishment is concerned.

Agreed. However, this might not only be for politics for its own reason. The Thai government might also follow through and execute the American couple if Trump does not intervene.

NOT going to happen.
Even if I would be throwing aside the bias from the sympathy towards Elwar there is no F way they are going to do this.

From what I've searched they haven't executed an American citizen in their recent history and the only foreigners on the death row are for drug smuggling which will not gather support even in their own country.
But besides that, take into account the fallout if they would really dare.

What would be the message sent to their tourists, the main source of income which again is in huge percentage represented by Americans? Do they afford to lose this? No way in hell!

And is not about Trump telling them to do us a favor, with China's expansions and the strain relations between them they are basically already begging the US to keep a military presence there, USS JCS was just anchored there a few weeks ago. Too bad Elwar didn't make it to it  ;D ;D,.

Nope!
They will not even dare to convict him and then in a charade of mercy forgive him.
I'm willing to bet they are going to let this slide silently entirely.

The message has been sent, don't do that, there is no need for anything more!

@stompix. However, Thailand already put themselves in this position. But why? Only for politics? They do not need the problem.

Also, if they wanted more American military presence, the Thai government would not have threatened Elwar and his girlfriend of the death penalty. They might only reprimand them and deal with the American government directly.

As I said before, sent a strong message that you're willing to to do something extreme although you don't plan to continue to the end.
Think of children running after pets or scaring crows in the park, the birds get scared, run, the child is happy but if he had caught them he wouldn't have done anything. (probably).

Or think of all the bombers Russia send to the Baltic or to the coasts near Alaska, they don't plan on dropping a nuke, they are just sending a message we can do it.

Since the Us counterpart is also keeping quiet I also think they already know the outcome.



Because the deal is already done, this small case won't affect it at all as I suggested above probably they\ve already reassured the US that they are not really serious about it.

Now, I must add, if it would have an Albanian or a Haitian or some small poor country citizen..then yeah, the whole situation would probably be a lot different. But it wouldn't have made it in the news in this case.

Someone tries to make an honest leaving and spend it on something that makes their life comfortable and happy...the law says you doing something wrong and the Thai authorities don't waste time to move in while hardcore criminals are roaming freely.

Maybe people need to realise they are the government and have the power to reverse these harsh laws.

@stompix. However if they do not follow through or Trump does not intervene, I reckon it would not be that strong of a message.

In any case, you are right. They do not want to push the American government's hand. They might give them life sentence which might be shortened to 2 years when no one is looking hehehehe.