Bitcoin Forum

After Jon Matonis' resignation, the new Executive Director, Patrick Murck, acknowledges the need to repair relationship between foundation and community.

He'll be doing AMA on Reddit on 5th November.

http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-foundations-new-head-patrick-murck-outlines-future-plans/ (http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-foundations-new-head-patrick-murck-outlines-future-plans/)

It's about time!
All they did was ruin the Bitcoin decentralisaton image.

Yeah, I think it's a bit late for that given the shit they've been trying to pull on us, they should just do themselves a favour and disband the foundation, it isn't needed, people like Andreas and Amir have done more for the Bitcoin community than the Bitcoin Foundation ever did, hell I'll admit, even the winklevoss twins are doing more with their Bitcoin ETF even though I don't approve of ETF's one bit.

I don't see how they can improve it. They have done absolutely well to demoralize our community, let's see what they can do to solve it.

They'll implement new improvements in their transparency issue for starters.

And probably talk about the team, give a lot of background information on every member, and give their reasons for their conduct in the past year(s).

I don't see how something like The Foundation could  ever represent the rest of the community. Being centralised and with members who have business interests in bitcoin they're obviously going to become biased or corrupt.

Lol.. that is just funny how reports/articles surface in this forum. Are they making things up again?

We hear things before the mainstream news does and are infinitely more informed ;)

Not to sound like a jerk, but who cares about the Bitcoin Foundation?  Isn't the whole point of bitcoin so we don't have to deal with bureaucratic bullshit?  In my eyes, they're 100% totally irrelevant, and just created themselves a bunch of good paying jobs.

Hell with it, I'm starting Bitcoin Foundation 2.0 -- who's in?  If we play our cards right, we can all be making 7 figures within the next 12 months for not doing much except talking.  Cool deal, eh?

Despite these half measures the true problem is they are trying to be the voice for a decentralized project with a centralized and hierarchical representation which is damaging in itself. The best thing they can do is fragment into multiple organizations not centrally managed and controlled by any one president. 

Well we should care a bit because they could do either damage or good to bitcoin. The general public may also think they are the offical front or face of bitcoin when obviously they're not.

They lost me the day they let Brock Pierce crawl his way in

They won't repair the relationship between the community even if they did they would just do some other idiotic thing once again.

Can't wait for the AMA :)

The foundation ruins the imagine image by its very existence.

Why? Doubt he'd answer any controversial questions or question we want asked. Someone should ask them to disband or put unnoficial in front of their name :D.

This.

Centalised foundation for a decentralised movement. Insane.

100% agree. I've always been against even when they were partially liked by the community.

Not necessarily looking for real answers but the uncertainties in how it will go on both the question and answer sides will make it entertaining to read.  ;)

I don't think he'll be able to avoid difficult questions as those will probably be the majority. So the question is, whether he'll provide honest answers or feed us with some bullshit.


That's for sure. Get your popcorn ready.

Sadly there are many people who like to sit on a board and feel important. To feel like an Illuminati and have the power over something, anything.
Sadly also, boards never accomplish anything.
I'd join your 2.0, except I ain't got no time to sip coffee and watch the hours go by!

Sadly also I'd have to agree, I find it hard to believe that the Bitcoin Foundation can do anything to dig themselves out of the hole they find themselves in. Some things are irreparable. And some organizations are useless. We don't need their "power". And we don't need for them to take out money.

I got an email a week ago from Snapcard. They are going to push to have San Francisco business accept bitcoin, giving tons of business free tablets and teaching them how to do this. These are people who are helping Bitcoin. Not the Foundation.

It's also sad that the wrong type  of people usually want to be on these boards for their own types of interest and investments.

When Andreas left the foundation, I requested a refund of my 0.3 BTC donation for lifetime membership. They denied my request.

Allowing refunds would be a great place to start building good will. Maybe if I like the new direction you take the foundation I'll donate again, but holding my donation hostage in an entity that has changed is not cool.

 8)

I don't think many/any foundation (or similar entity that accepts donations) is ever going to be willing to give refunds in the way that you request. When a foundation receives a donation they will plan their budget accordingly however if they were to honor requests to refund donations then they would have no way to make a budget.

What you are asking is also essentially that they buy people's trust

KnC's $100,000 USD Platinum Membership fee comes to mind that TBF never addressed.

I remember that ;D

AMA is going to be interesting...
Lets see which questions he decides to answer.  ::)

I will be getting the popcorn ready for sure  ;D

http://persephonemagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/kingofpopcorn1.gif




DOH!!!  :o

I find "traditional establishments would never do this" to be a particularly uncompelling argument within the bitcoin space. The whole point of bitcoin should be to NOT make the same mistakes of traditional institutions.

From this perspective, the foundation has failed so far. When their chief scientist abandoned them, and stated reasons like lack of transparency, that was a major red flag for me - and should be for any bitcoiner.

yes, new leader, please acknowledge all people at altcoin subforum.. all 30 of them.

What are the chances of Sam Cole running to fill the position?

I like the part where they say they can no longer rely on Bitcoin appreciation to fund the foundation. That's realistic.

https://bitcointa.lk/proxy.php?image=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgflip.com%2Fa88kd.jpg&hash=f7eb044082a84b5262c861c8b40f1c2a

I remember this one circulating on Bitcointalk.   Mark Karpeles used to be on the foundation and all the photoshops / images about him were hilarious.  I like the ones where Karpeles is working at McDonalds and the other where he is holding a samurai sword.

Any establishment/institution still needs to follow the basic principles of economics. It simply does not make any sense for TBF to refund any donation they have received as they have already budged for the money they have been given.

I am certainly not defending any of their actions, as I am not in any way a supporter of them, but I do think that to ask to have donations refunded would be something that is very unlikely.

They should drive development in P2Pool, safer and easier wallet, do not fork unless absolute consensus reached among miners, that's everything I can think of

Who do you mean by that?

Here's why I think TBF has been less than successful and how it can be improved:

A Bitcoin Technical Organization is not like IEEE, EFF, or Linux Foundation. It's also not like a for-profit corporation. It is a Think Tank. There are too many political and economic factors to consider and address. As a Think Tank, it must focus on projects that meet at least a general mission statement. Bitcoin itself is not a political statement because it is simply math. While some of it's properties can be argued to support some political agendas, Bitcoin itself has no political power whatsoever. It is a tool that can be used equally by any political entity simply by building clients that reflect the desired qualities. Bitcoin can be anonymous or it can be completely verified, depending on the infrastructure you develop for it. Bitcoin is what you want it to be.

A Bitcoin Think Tank will find solutions for developers that provide incentives. That means even central banks that want solutions and have the means, should be given the opportunity to have their needs addressed by the expertise a Bitcoin Think Tank can provide.

Up until now, these efforts have created a schism between developers over loyalties to financiers or ideologies. Developers have to put aside their differences and understand that we all benefit from thinking as a One Blockchain, than multiple competing chains. It was the evolution of Bitcoin 2.0 technologies that made us realize we could all use the same programming language and operating system, yet run completely different applications. Anyone that contributes to open source projects will benefit from new ideas flowing from the greatest minds in financial theory.

I propose that several Bitcoin Think Tanks are organized with whatever ideologies their leadership wants to offer. After all, volunteer organizations are only as good as the people that roll up their sleeves and work. They don't need elections. They don't need consensus. They offer results or they fail. Their financial futures can be dictated by particular interests, but somehow I don't think our best and brightest are all that motivated simply by money. This is a revolution. We need Generals, not Politicians. This isn't a popularity contest. If you believe in what we are doing and have invested in ourselves, then we all have not only the incentives, but also the moral compass to create the best new financial system possible.

To the Central Banks:
You have the opportunity to join us or die. If you join us, you can have access to the most powerful and efficient capital aggregation tools imaginable, and they can be designed to optimize your infrastructure. Bitcoin and its derivatives can offer unparalleled security, privacy, and flexibility to meet with your customers needs and compliance standards.

To the Venture Capitalist:
You have the opportunity to invest in the Next Big Thing and hold a stake in your investment simply by owning Bitcoins. Even if you invest in a project and somehow it fails, you still benefit from the successes of others.

To the People:
You have the opportunity to educate yourselves about the greatest business and career opportunities of a lifetime. Take advantage of learning about these technologies and become a member of these fine educational organizations.

BTC foundation seem to have gone off the wrong road, and I have not seen any evidence it is even trying to get back on the right track.

If someone is looking for focused, realistic individuals/groups of professional caliber, there are some already starting to move with real money backing them, few of them with backings greater than BTC Foundation.

Yes, greater then BTC foundation. In fact, greater by orders of magnitude. Big money does see the potential in this new technology, but official groundwork needs to be laid thoroughly before any real money starts trickling in from big hands. They see the scene currently for what it is, and are not amateurish enough to just throw money at this corrupt, chaotic scene.

Some are even active in these forums. Do a little digging, and you will find them. Most of the time, they are not marketing themselves out to the degree most profiteers do these days with their coins and projects - that's one good indicator.

There are gems in the sand, and overlooked voices of reality among all the pump and dumping profiteers.

I'll be waiting for that to see what he has to say

Lol.. was it destroyed?

One of the best thing to happen to Bitcoin is being detached from the foundation.

Really?

Much of the evidence shows that they (the board members) have simply sought to enrich themselves, often in very questionable ways.

If Bitcoin is the new paradigm in showing the world how a better system of things could improve their lives, and TBF has opted to be the governing body that speaks in behalf of that swift, then wouldn't it have been wiser of them to simply honor one refund, whereupon two to three more memberships would taken their place due to their kind gesture? The alternative is categorically state fuck you and the horse you came in on, thus amassing more discontent, then having to conduct an AMA on Reddit to save face after most its venerable members have flew the coop with the hope of future revenue flowing in to stay afloat.

Relationship with community? How can you destroy something you never had? Is the community in question the members of their little trade association? This thread should really be posted on their private forum. It doesn't effect us. We're only the users of Bitcoin. We don't really matter to them.

Precisely.  The Bitcoin Foundation is anything but a foundation but a little trade association which hides in their own little corner of the internet.  It's best for the Bitcoin developers to ignore them and continue relying on their own medium of communication.

Unless, that is, a dev rises to the top and is able to garner a six-figure salary.

So being "on message" is not being truthful and transparent? Cool story. Maybe that's your problem?

Adopting unpopular and controverial positions on some issues is why people loathe / don't give a shit about Bitcoin Foundation in the first place.


What propaganda is this? Stating something but meaning something else and separating messaging from mission = shitty foundation with alterior motives.

It isn't difficult. State your mission and then your roles within the organization is to exemplify the mission via action or clarify the mission to explain action.

There shouldn't be a disconnect with what you are stating and what you are doing.

Yeah, well, most boards don't have "lifetime memberships" either. Maybe that's a pretty horrible idea?

Most boards work hand-in-glove with members at smaller, budgetable paces. They donate yearly or quarterly for their seat on the board. They sever ties by severing business propositions.

Do you realize how ridiculous it would be to say "OK, I'm going to provide my [utility service] to you at a discount forever, but I get to steer your organization for eternity as well" and PAY UP FRONT? Silly.

The USPS seems to think it's an excellent model:

http://cdn.frugalcouponliving.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/forever-stamp-sale-frugal-coupon-living-1024x1024.jpg

If a centralized organization to put  a face on Bitcoin was a good idea, then Satoshi Nakamoto would have come out to promote it.

Well they kinda have to repair relationship with community since the community funds them, they cease to function without us.

Sociopaths and autocrats will always exist, create organizations, and be drawn to systems of power. Our goals should be on the constant struggle of questioning these forms of hierarchy and power and dismantling them as needed. Ignoring the threat does not stop them meeting with regulators and acting on behalf of Bitcoin. We would be better off appealing to their selfish interests by suggesting a more decentralized approach to the organization and how it could be an opportunity for growth. This doesn't mean I would respect or support any of the new fragments. Respect must be gained.

Well, maybe you expect to be able to claim a refund on every donation you make to a foundation, but I'd argue that you're misconstruing the concepts of "donation" and "foundation". Irrespective of where you stand on the Bitcoin Foundation (they're due their share of criticism, it seems), it is unreasonable to expect donations to be refundable in perpetuity.

(As an aside to Beliathon, I have often enjoyed reading your posts in the past - please don't take this as a personal attack.)

Andreas

He was never their *chief scientist* (that is Gavin's title).

Ah, my mistake.

http://cointelegraph.com/news/112042/andreas-m-antonopoulos-leaves-bitcoin-foundation-not-happy-with-management

Let's hope it is not too late yet...

Game on!

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/clttx4a

It's very hard for bitcoin foundation to repair relationship with community because you have to consider that some people which is in bitcoin foundation is in arrest state now.

Here's how to repair relationship: Disband the Foundation and distribute all funds to Core developers.

This Foundation is not needed for anything except as a centralized access gate for control by government. It is a waste of resources, contradicts the spirit of Bitcoin, and is a threat to the free development of the protocol.

ya.ya.yo!

personally my favourite ever.. ;D

http://dealbreaker.com/uploads/2014/02/markkarpeles-260x297.jpg


ps: f#ck em foundation.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/cltw3nv


http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/cltxn70


Ask for proof, and receive a non-proof reply.

The Bitcoin Foundation has no problem disclosing multitudes of tx exceeding $100K but have yet provide the $100K payment from KnC Miner. At the very least, it's now implied that the supposed payment was remitted via bitcoins and NOT via a check, et al.

Surely, TBF is not trying to keep the BWA used from being uncovered fearing another tipped can o' worms causing a stampede, are they?

Feel free to chime in on TBF's AMA over on Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/

Its difficult (impossible?) to repair a relationship with a community that doesn't want you to exist in the first place.

I personally believe the Bitcoin Foundation can, and already has, done things that were hugely important for Bitcoin's current level of success.

But many in this community think anything centralized is a breeding ground for corruption.
So they will waste insane amounts of energy looking for corruption.
Or simply pulling it out of their ass holes, if need be.

Given a situation like that, I don't know how worthwhile it would be to even try.  But I suppose its worth a shot.

-B-

Its too late to repair relations, i hate "bitcoin foundation". Only doing harm to bitcoin, dissapear evil monsta!

this is a joke. how does people even buy all this soft communication crap?


business model? lmao.

OK. Here's the link to the AMA session on reddit:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/ (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2ldjk7/hello_rbitcoin_im_patrick_murck_executive/)

it has already ended. Haven't had a chance to read through it yet, I'm just about to start.

Heres the PhinnaeusGage Q and A:
Q:

A:

PhinnaeusGage:

Don't bother, for this is all that need to be known: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=848276.0

Unless you're into...

http://activerain.trulia.com/image_store/uploads/2/9/8/9/0/ar12184753109892.jpg

I worked there for 3 months.  I wanted to be the change.  The Foundation is full of delusion, the memberships are at an all time low, and the majority of the funds are used for paychecks and to fly people around.   Got married, went on a pre-approved honeymoon then was promptly let go as a scapegoat by the affiliate director who has no idea how bitcoin works.  I can't manage people with no direction.

lol let's take something decentralized like Bitcoin and attach it to a "voice/spokesperson" (i.e. The Bitcoin Foundation), which is CENTRALIZED.

With all the scammers that exist it is a mistake to do that.

Especially if they are asking for funding from the community through "sponsorships".

The Bitcoin network is the REAL BITCOIN FOUNDATION.

+1000 these guys just want to twist it. basterdz.

Hard to understand why the bitcoin foundation exists really. 

Just another bitcoin scam.

Well there does need to be an available channel for people to be able to reliably learn about how Bitcoin works and to "sell" the features of bitcoin to potential adopters of bitcoin.

My major been with TBF is their lack of transparency. They are suppose to be promoting a currency that is very transparent however are not themselves transparent

From forward forecasting from their published financials, at current and projected BTC prices they are out of funds in less than two years.  Massive membership increases would be required to prevent this OR donations in the tune of millions of dollars.

So this is an attempt to broaden the base for survival of the paid employee base, eg the current business model.  Most non profits spend a considerable amount of time and effort fund raising, no particular reason to expect this one to be any different.

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/cody-wilson-plans-destroy-bitcoin-foundation/

What support should I expect if I also chose to run to fill the other vacant seat, especially running on the same exact platform as Cody?

~Bruno Kucinskas

Both have my vote. Disbanding or breaking up the foundation would be a great thing as long as we supported the 3 devs they currently employ.

Actually, it's TBF = The Big Farce

lol. Reading this. Nobody likes the foundation (myself included). How did they get there? Why do we have to honor them? If nobody likes them why does the community not distance itself from it? Are you not organised enough? Just start a campaign "i love bitcoin and i distance myself from the foundation" ... everyone will join that. Now what was that cake everyone got so excited about?

... just an idea ...

If you as a community are determined not to accept them, what can they do? Ignore you maybe? Can they? Are we that far yet?

basicaly its teh same shit with obama or whatever other politician. you dont have to care to be ruled.

If the foundation wants to repair relationships, try doing something for the bitcoin users, not just for the bitcoin businesses. They can kick out KnCminer tomorrow and animosity may change.

This is extremely dangerous thinking and comments.  It appears to indicate that Murck thinks he/the Foundation/Somebody should regulate the price of Bitcoin, instead of the market.
In turn in some fantasy world the community would appreciate this "service" that the BF has "provided."

To be fair to him, I interpret his statement to mean:


All he is suggesting is that they are blowing through the reserves paying for 3 devs and need to have a sustainable charity. I would like devs to be funded by projects like lighthouse, day jobs, and through tips instead. I would prefer the funding to come from users directly rather than primarily business insiders(some of which are thieves)

Bitcoin Foundation means nothing.

They accept world class scammers like MercadoBitcoin.net, those bastards stolen from me and from my family, about X,XXX.YY Bitcoins.

What Bitcoin Foundation did? They love MercadoBitcoin.

So, they support criminals.

It is a shame.

The bitcoin space is full of immoral/shady greedy fucks... it really is sad. No one that puts themselves in a centralized position of power can be trusted. TBF are corrupt and they will do whatever is best to serve their own (greedy) interests.

I can see other interpretations of the comment exist, along the lines you suggest.

However, aren't they "blowing through the reserves" with the approximate $400-500K USD administrative and lobbying expense level per year, a lot of travel expenses, etc.,  instead of on development?

Mm. Yeah, let's hope so.

Yes, I believe so, but these people think that lobbying and working with regulators is a good thing for our community just like supporting developers. I don't necessarily agree, but they should be free to talk and meet with whomever they want if a certain percentage of the community supports these actions and others should be free to try and shine some light on the organization in order to inform the community as well.

They have never reprimanded or kicked any industry member out to my knowledge.

Including Mt. Gox....

Yep, they are self-appointed rulers that were never elected and continue to subvert the law against their own citizenry for their own ends, despite this many people being against them they still claim control over us because they have access to the whitehouse and therefore a military/police force that can suppress us.