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this man lost his life for selling loose cigarettes. it is illegal for officers to use a choke hold as a method to restrain citizens

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/03/justice/new-york-grand-jury-chokehold/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Pigs... they can do what ever they like whenever however then wonder why they are called pigs..

Rape, murder, torture... and nothing ever happens to them..

He should be hung.

Burn New York!

This shit is out of control in that side of the pond...

Not surprised there were no charges. It seems people are rarely inclined to hold a cop accountable for excessive force, and the Thin Blue Line will bend over backwards to protect their own from being equal under the law like the citizens they "protect and serve."

Let more riots ensue to give the police more job security. Win win for police.

The man was choked for only 10 seconds, blaming the chokehold is a convenient excuse to ignore he was 300 lbs. overweight and had asthma and diabetes....If the cops had tackled him to the ground he'd still probably died.

Btw I still think the police went overboard but i've seen pro wrestlers give better chokeholds than what that cop did.

blaming his health is a convenient excuse to ignore the fact that choke holding citizens is illegal.

the coroner ruled his death a homicide due to compression of the neck. that is the official cause of death.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/de-blasio-opposes-anti-choke-hold-law-article-1.2009254

With a City Councilman poised to introduce legislation that would criminalize police use of a choke hold, Mayor de Blasio reiterated his belief that existing NYPD policy is sufficient.

Choke holds, or any move that restricts a person’s windpipe, have been banned under the NYPD patrol guide since 1993.

It's banned under the NYPD patrol guide but not illegal in a court of law.

But even if he did illegally choke him, there is no nexus between the chokehold and his death. His infamous cry "I can't breathe!" occurred after the chokehold was no longer applied.

If you blame "compression of the neck" which is a euphemism for a pinched nerve, for his death then that means no 300 lb. man should ever be taken to the ground because a normal, healthy man would not have perished from such a simple manuever.

So what you are saying is choking someone has no affect on their ability to resperate and deliver oxygen to the brain? Additionally his frail health was his own doing therefore his family has no right to justice for his death even though it still wouldn't have happened if he want choked? I will remember this for the future, maybe I will hit an old man with my car and can get off because he was already really old and probably would have died anyway.

He was choked for only 10 seconds. I guarantee most people can hold their breath for 10 seconds and not die or go into a coma...

good find, another one slipped through the cracks. let's be honest though, even if it was "officially" illegal he still would have gotten away with it.

you better pray to your god that you don't ever have a group of cops on top of you cause zero fucks will be given about your cries for help.

Because violating police protocol is a different charge from murdering a man.

If Garner decided to run from the police and had a heart attack, is it murder 1 on the police for chasing him?

If he died he wasn't choked for 10 seconds and you're also forgetting that these cops have shit for brains they won't necessarily know properly about the windpipe and jugular vein or that there are certain pressure points along the neck you can actually kill someone with so if you're actually pinning someone down with enough force yes you could kill them in 10 seconds if you're being a jackass and not watching what you're doing.

we all know what ever cops do is not illegal in the eyes of the law.

here's another one for all you folks that defend cops. if she had a heart attack and died while getting punched in the face is that assault or murder?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6c3_1404544864

The video clearly shows they applied force on the neck for 10 seconds and then let go of that area.

Garner was just as much being a jackass for wildly throwing himself around and refusing arrest. Let's use this scenario, let's say a police officer tries to arrest a perp at the foot of a stairway, the perp resists, they tangle and wrestle around and fall down the stairs and the perp breaks his neck, is that the officer's fault?

Look i'm sympathetic to the police in this instance mainly because I have family who work in the medical industry. You won't believe how many idiots sue the hospital and the doctor because their 70 year-old 300 lb. grandmother goes in four a routine hip implant or something else and ends up dead on the operating table. Somehow it is the hospital's fault that their elderly overweight grandmother died, it is absurd. Unhealthy people die because they are unhealthy, not the actions of the world around them.

The same goes for this case, the police were no more "wild" with him than they could be with any other suspect but because the man was obese and probably near death as it is, it's a bit drastic to charge with murder because a normal healthy human being would have gotten up and dusted themselves off. Is it the job of the police now to evaluate a perpetrator's health before they decide to take action?

This shows your lack of understanding of human anatomy. A headlock usually cuts off the oxygen supply to the brain by stopping the blood flow DIRECTLY in the neck. Holding ones breath you still have all the oxygen in your lungs and in your blood flowing to the brain. Not the same thing AT ALL.


The difference is police are not medical professionals. They are not there to treat health conditions. They are there to collect revenue for the state via arrests. People VOLUNTEER for medical treatment, they don't volunteer to be arrested.

It would be manslaughter because murder must have intent to kill

Regardless most healthy human beings can survive a lenghty period of time in a chokehold, it wouldn't be taught as a basic martial arts or police maneuver all around the world if the expected outcome was death. And the chokehold applied to Garner was very brief and from the looks of it not very tight either. I'm just contending it's not murder because a normal healthy human being would not have been killed by this.

So now you can see with your eyes how much oxygen was going to his brain?

He has a uniform and is a good nazi.  The victim is to blame. 

always

Right, I'm a Nazi.  ::)

Trust me if there was a national mission by the police to murder young black men there would be alot more deaths.

Why didn't those racist kkk police in Ferguson kill any looters?

not you stupid, the police.

the real issue is not about killing any specific group or even this specific man. it's about cops killing and assaulting citizens with immunity. everybody is a potential target.

they even shot this little dog. they were in full riot gear with assault rifles and they said this little dog a threat. what's even more fucked up is they shot the dog as it turned around and was heading back in the house.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgJS8jMwlqo

https://i.imgur.com/RpcyHxU.jpg

Here is where the theory about the chokehold killing him falls apart.

If he was truly in a chokehold where his air supply was cut off...he wouldn't be able to speak while the police had his arm around his neck. At most he'd be able to make grunting and wheezing sounds and would be half asleep in such a state. If he can say multiple times "I can't breathe" then clearly he is breathing, even if it is panicked and short breaths.

It was the combination of police piling on him and probably the anxiety of wrestling around with them in his asthmatic state that drove his heart rate up and killed him, not the choke hold. Can you make a case that 6 police to arrest a guy for selling cigarettes is excessive? Sure, but to pin it on one cop as all his fault and label him a murderer, no.

If its not one cop abusing their power its another
Geez the police in the United States are militarized these days, on the other hand well at least he didn't shoot him this time got his hands dirty.
That said it was a minor crime the police need to pay.

i'm a fit man in his prime with no real health problems. but i do have occasional asthma problems. usually in the summer when it's hot and there is lots of pollen in the air. sometimes i have a hard time breathing for no reason. i just wake up with it. and let me tell you it sucks when you can't get a full breath. if somebody put me in a choke hold when having an asthma attack that can be deadly. so it's perfectly reasonable to see how this man died with an arm around his throat his face in the pavement and a bunch of cops on his back. choke holds are dangerous. that's why it's against police policy. this man was fine until they attacked him. it was their actions that killed him. that cop is partially responsible for his death. manslaughter is appropriate since it was an accident and using a choke hold is against police policy.

wow..

That always has been part of the job of the police.

That's the very reason that tasers shouldn't be used on the elderly.

It makes no difference to me if the cops subdue an individual in 10 minutes or 10 seconds, but if 10 seconds creates risk to life it certainly isn't advisable.

Cops are violent people.

Cops answer to no one and can do what they please.

Rape, Murder, Torture whatever they feel like.... your constitution was created for a reason.. however there are too many sheep now that support mass rape, murder and torture so...  things will not end well.

Rob Hustle - This is what happens when you call the cops

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlY9C6pzxKc

It doesn't matter what happens normally, it matters what actually happened this time. If I go fire a bullet into the air, 999 out of 1000 times it's not going to hit anyone when it falls back to the ground. That doesn't make it not manslaughter the 1 time it does hit and kill someone, even though that's not normal.

Agreed.  Charge him with manslaughter.  He was abusive and violent, resulting in the death of suspect.  But he didn't intend to kill him.

I'm not a fan of Bill Maher, but I did appreciate this sentiment:

https://i.imgur.com/pNb5uIw.png

Well we see police violence everyday now thanks to the internet, it's not like before it wasn't there, there wasn't just so much cameras around to tape everything. Sometimes it may be justified, but when it's not don't think whoever beated the crap out of you will be punished. The only thing you can do is either stay out of trouble or submit instantly without even discussing.

But the man who filmed it is indicted:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=365141.msg9739545#msg9739545

the music video and story about the man getting arrested for filming was good.

Yes, let's generalize all cops as being violent people based on the actions of a few. Cool story bro. Newsflash! Not all cops are violent rapists/murderers/torturers. There are actually quite a few I'm sure that are good people who generally care about other human beings.

I agree that his death was caused by several factors including his poor health (which was his own doing for being morbidly obese) and his own decision to resist arrest. He was being accused of selling loose cigarettes, which, apparently in ultra-liberal New York City, is a crime. It was also stated that he had a rather lengthy rap sheet with 46 charges.

While I do agree that any death that could have otherwise been avoided is a tragedy, to overlook the above stated facts and jump straight to condemnation of the cop who was doing his job of enforcing the law and clearly showed no intent to murder the man is just plain silly.

i love how cop lovers always mention the victims criminal history. newsflash! it doesn't matter what happened in the past. that's just a tactic to distract and discredit. smoke and mirrors / character assassination to justify the actions of the police.

I just love how cop haters like to generalize all cops as being corrupt.
So are we to just ignore the fact that he was a career
Criminal who would likely be alive right now had he just
Obeyed the law?

as much as i hate cops i am not one who believes every one is corrupt. they are people and therefore they have both good and bad. but my personal experiences are not good. and i do believe there are more bad than good. the military style training they go through and the power they have changes them. they may be good people to friends and family but when on the job they are two faced tyrants towards civilians. the dude was selling loose cigarettes. fuck you if you think this was justified. people like you are a bigger problem than people like him.

Not exactly sure where I mentioned that I thought it was justified. All I said was that it could have easily been prevented had he not been doing something illegal. I refuse to believe that the cop intentionally killed him. And how exactly am I a bigger problem than him? Because I'm a law abiding citizen?
And the obscenities are completely unnecessary.  I haven't cussed at you, so don't do it to me.

Everyone commits 3 felonies per day (http://www.amazon.com/Three-Felonies-Day-Target-Innocent/dp/1594035229/ref=sr_1_1). We will be sure to say the same about you when the global police state comes after you as the global economy heads into the abyss 2016 to 2024.


    First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Socialist.

    Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Jew.

    Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Please enlighten me as to what 3 felonies I committed today. Try as I might, I just can't think of any.

Why is this shocking? Lord Acton understood this more than 100 years ago. “Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men, even when they exercise influence and not authority."

The police are given absolute power over life and death while outfitted and instructed in the methods and given the tools of murder. This is news to people? What planet have you all been living on?

US police is brutal and act before arguing and selling cigarettes in the street should be legal anyway.

That being said, the officer were granted immunity for their testimony except the policeman who killed the man, there are 22 civil witnesses and a clear video with sound.
The grand jury had all latitude to know exactly what happened and make a correct decision. So the policeman probably did nothing illegal if they didn't induct him.
The man who died was probably in bad health and the policeman is suppose to act if the guy is resisting arrest which he was, the policeman doesn't seem to use the choke hold for more than a few seconds on the video, does it? I should add that what happened is a tragedy and that I didn't looked into the tragedy in great details.

Yup that is the point, you can't know which one of the 4,500 federal crimes (http://reason.com/archives/2009/10/19/were-all-felons-now) (not including 1000s more administrative regulations that are now increasingly punished as crimes by our Kangeroo courts) you committed. The average United States resident commits 3 felonies a day and doesn't even know it. And that includes you, whether you like to admit it to yourself or not.

Any USA citizen that is not already outside of the USA or making plans to get outside before the fucking thing collapses into hell by 2017 or so, is IMHO insane. The police are being trained to be military. Every local police is being armed with military gear and even tank-like vehicles and even hollow point bullets which are illegal in war by Hague convention because they are so gruesome (exit wound is humongous).

And I also hear they are going to cancel all the passports, so getting another citizenship is crucial.

Folks she's fully cooked, stick a fork in the Statue of Liberty. The shit coming is horrific. You got to be crazy to stay inside the USA when this shit hits the fan.

OTOH, it could get quite ugly every where, as the global economy will collapse every where. The plan appears to be to use Russia to squeeze Europe with its military. And China and Japan will fight in order to squeeze Asia. The globalists have their New World Order planned out.

And given the NDAA law, the USA can go after any person any where without any due process and according to Senator Lindsey Graham "shut you up without a lawyer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMfp1xbGpJs)".

most laws are ridiculous and are in place just to condition people to being submissive and follow orders or take your money and possessions. check out this site. http://www.dumblaws.com

one of my favorites is this one. "You may be arrested for vagrancy if you do not have at least one dollar bill on your person".

it's "the law" in illinois and some D-bag cop will arrest you for it if he actually knows about this law.

i'm definitely leaving this country. australia and new zealand looks the best to me.

Perhaps you are failing to realize that anybody in those places can also say "you need to have a picture of the queen on you at all times".  In the end, it is us who are idiots for paying attention to that garbage. 

They are members of the Five Eyes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes) along with USA, Canada, and the UK.

New Zealand didn't extradite Kim Dot Com, but Australia threw Assange under the bus. However, Australia is starting to shift back towards conservative as they were the first country to stop paying Al Gore's carbon tax fraud (global warming is fraud and not true).

I'd prefer the warmer climates and climates ranges of Australia, and there is more terrain to disappear into.

It looks like those two countries may be two of the best of the developed countries for weathering the coming global crisis.

Canada is closer and more realistic for many Americans to escape to. I suggest that to most. And get working on it now. Canada recently advised their citizens to be wary of the USA police state when traveling there. Canada is socialist in the cities, but Canada is still significantly a rural country and afaik the government doesn't mess with you as much as the USA does (e.g. the Bundy Ranch issue and the Feds fucking with for example ranchers near the Mexican border).

Reside far from any population center, no matter where you go. Try to be in a community that grows its own food. Giving up most carbohydrates is good for your health, so then you don't need grains except perhaps to feed your chickens if you can't hunt and fish for your meat.

The country is too far gone. It will fragment. It is more realistic to vote with your feet than stand disunited and get blown to bits by flying debris.

lmao: Grand Jury Does not Indict Cop Who Murdered Eric Garner — But the Man Who Filmed It


http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/12/04/grand-jury-does-not-indict-cop-who-murdered-eric-garners-but-the-man-who-filmed-it/

:D

He didn't intend to kill him, it may have been an accident. The question is : did he do something that he is not suppose to do? Something illegal?
The police is often too armed and violent and they would be more efficient if they didn't have to deal with the war on drugs

i hear this all started cause two guys were fighting outside the shop. the dude was trying to break them up and get them to leave. the cops were called. the guys who were fighting left. the guy who got killed stuck around cause that's his chill spot. cops showed up and he was the only one around so they started bothering him. dude was not involved and says he did nothing. by putting his hands in the air and taking a step back they considered that resisting and jumped on him. cops were called about a fight, had nobody to arrest, nobody to question, so they fucked with this guy. they found no evidence of a crime, no gun, no drugs, so they claim he was selling cigarettes illegally. i have heard nothing about any evidence that suggests this man did anything illegal. i think it's a wrong place wrong time situation.

See what I mean? You've got sheeple all over the country who don't understand that the same arseholes who gave us a false war on drugs (while the CIA was deep into drug running) are the same ones militarizing our police via the 9/11 false flag and Homelove Sescrewu Department.

Stick a fork in her, the USA is done. All that remains is the ransacking by the barbarians.

Why, that's the very point.

If you knew, then you'd know as much as the ones who would subject you knew.

It's the three felonies a day that you don't know and can't prevent doing which have merit.

Can't understand why the cop wasn't indicted given the video evidence. The guy was just selling cigarettes without a license and told the officers that he couldn't breathe. He hadn't just robbed a convenience store, wasn't under the influence of anything, didn't display a weapon, and hadn't tried to attack the officers. Minimum should be manslaughter.

US cops are out of control with no checks in place. Really disgraceful.
Curious to see what if anything Obama will do next

now all officers will  be wearing cameras in the us. will be interesting to see how they cover for each other now

Cops are people. You stand a much greater chance of being murdered by cops, or your own government in general, than by terrorists.

Cops are people, armed and trained people. But you can't train a cop to be a human being, while you can train just about anyone to be a good, armed peace officer.

Make it a law that everyone open carry while off his/her own living property. Train all people with general police training. Get rid of the cops. Get rid of the government in so much as they take your freedom to do anything away... except in one area. If you harm someone, or damage his property, then you are liable, up to and including the death penalty. Otherwise, 100% government hands off the people.

:)

Thugs and criminals are out of control too. Just last year in my city 4 women were executed mafia style in a dumpy section 8 apartment and left to rot. Where is the national outrage and the marches against gang tyranny in neighborhoods all across the US? Why is it when a black teenager is gunned down people only care when a white person is involved?

personally, i don't care if the person is white black young old saint or convicted felon. i care about corruption and abuse of power. i care about losing freedoms and lives to thugs with badges.

Personally, I would like to see the 14th Amendment amended in such a way that it expresses 100% total freedom for all citizens subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, except that anyone harming another person, or damaging his property, be held liable up to and including the death penalty, according to the harm or damage he did. Other than that, government hands off ALL the people in every way. And that government be required to warn the people of dangers it believed to be attributed to certain actions that the people might take in the exercise of their freedom.

For example. Everyone can drive without licensing, etc. And the speed limit signs are not restrictions. Rather, they are warnings. If you disobey the warning, and you kill someone by your neglect, execution for you.

Example 2: Government warns about the dangers of smoking marijuana. Smoke all you want. If you harm or kill someone while under the influence, you get executed, depending on the amount of harm or damage. If you turn yourself into a blubbering idiot by smoking it, your family better take care of you, otherwise you die on the street. Government is required to supply strong warnings or the government people are liable. You aren't required for anything in any way except if you harm or damage. (Some evident threats may be included in the harm or damage.)

:)

When I'm saying these problems such as gun violence etc. and racism are purely American problems I'm really not just being a British guy and just trying to tick the Americans off ( Although that part is fun :P ) I'm trying to remember which protest this was but there was an incident where a guy got shoved and struck with a baton by the police who was just walking by and had nothing to do with the protests, ended up dying apparently of a heart attack, there was a huge amount of rage over it.

Then there was also an incident which I think was over university loans etc. where a guy in a wheelchair got dragged off his chair by the police for 'resisting' a lot of anger about that as well, both white on white incidents and all in the UK, it really is only Americans where I see that level of hatred and ignorance, actually, there is the middle east, so maybe Americans aren't that much different from fanatical Muslims after all.

I wonder what real thing is going  on behind the curtains...
It looks like all those "accidents" are showing up to distract public opinion from something bigger.

+1000 shit is about to hit the fan. Big Time.

Europe generally just puts its head in the sand and pretends there are no problems, isn't it your country where Islamic gang rapes of both native white British and Pakistani girls was swept under the rug for a decade because civil servants were too afraid of being branded racist if they investigated?

If the police get out of hand, yes they should be called out and punished accordingly if found to have committed a crime, but go to any ghetto in America and it is not the cops who break out windows, bury bodies in crawl spaces of abandoned buildings, sling crack to kids on the street corner or play gun tag because your opponent is wearing a different colored bandana, like Charles Barkley said, if the police weren't around it would be 10x worse.

You got everything right except the being equal to fanatical Muslims. Americans are much worse than the Muslims. The Muslims will stay in their own region and leave you alone if you leave them alone. Americans search the globe for new people to fuck with and aren't happy until someone dies. You shouldn't disrespect fanatical Muslems by comparing them to Americans. 

Yeah, I guess we're all forgetting what a bastion of ethnic harmony Britain is: 





See, racism is an American problem.  ::)

Your high holy judgments aren't contributing anything meaningful to the conversation, and are rather ignorant of reality on top of it.

Maybe Ebola, Ukrain and Irak were distractions too. They want to hide that the end of the US Empire is near.

What happens when these cameras are all networked federally and hooked into the NSA with features like facial recognition or biometrics?
This is classic hegalian dialectic here.
Police brutality causes unrest > people demand action, the action taken is a federal police bodycam program > solution is now an army of NSA agents in every jurisdiction in the US

http://www.lawofficer.com/article/news/president-pushes-funding-polic

That's some scary shit but it sounds plausible.

The BIG problem isn't the NSA, etc. The big problem is that a whole bunch of common people like it this way, because they are making money off their fellow common people.

:)

The great beast is a stupid lot. We'd have a great country if it wasn't populated by right wing christian buffoons.

we cannot change the community, better we change ourselves :)

Ah yes, because the left wing atheist buffoon is so much better? How very typical of someone from the blind masses to lay the blame entirely on one single political/ideological group without acknowledging all the other political/ideological groups that have been every bit as instrumental in bringing this once great country to the shithole we have today.

There are many liars in this country, only a minority are christian. When Clinton says "corporations don't create jobs", she is lying. Her husband passed the laws that precipitated the US ruin.

Wrong. It is not illegal in the state. It was only a guideline in New York City that they don't use chokeholds, but state law trumps any city law or guideline. It would be nice to see someone check their facts and context before posting some bs spouted from the lamestream media ;)

somebody already mentioned this  ::)

Funny thing is, a cop dies, and everybody gets so sad and feels bad, not even caring who did it.

not me

Or Me

Acab ftw

Come on you guys. You are looking at this the wrong way. When a cop dies, we should feel happy. Why? Because a cop is a good guy, right? And knowing this, we know that he believes in God, right? So, we know that he went to Heaven, right? So shouldn't we feel happy when a cop dies because he is in Heaven where there is joy and happiness forever?

 ;D

i wonder if they get free donuts up there

It's the donuts that are messing the cops all up. If brains were gasoline, cops wouldn't have enough to drive an ant's go-cart around the inside of a cheerio. Cops don't even get a good start with a donut.

 ;D

Obviously you didn't play football as a small boned guy and end up at the bottom of a pile of 250lb linemen. You can speak (exhale) and you can't breath in sufficient air. You don't know if he was struggling and able to wiggle enough to shout. Also by shouting he may have depleted his air and hastened his suffocation.

If the guy says he can't breath and then dies on the spot, you got to be very good at delusion to convince yourself that unnecessary police brutality is not likely responsible for his death.


Note the strawman Barkalot erected.

We want police. We don't want paramilitary crazed powertrip maniacs with badges.


No the USA military does that, not the American people. The people voted Obama on his promise to end that shit. Americans have always been isolationists. The people who run our country are causing that problem. There is a conservative minority who supports that shit.

ISIS has explained their first priority was local, then next they will go global. They slice little girls arms and legs off while she is still alive. BTW, they may be coming to Europe. Eurofags have no guns (and perhaps insufficient young men, due to low fertility rates and rampant emasculation) to defend yourself.

Comparing that to the average American citizen is beyond delusional, it is insane. What happened to you?

No doubt that American culture is shallow, selfish, arrogant, etc.. but the French are doing a good job at that too, and I hear that the youth in Europe are just as fucked up in terms of smoking, drugs, encouraging females to try lesbian sex, etc.

Either way he was arresting arrest. Even though he was claiming not being able to breathe, that does not compel the officer to stop using force to arrest him....what would prevent someone from making this claim falsely only to delay/resist arrest?

Dude, we kill each other in the street. Americans are violent for fun. I was unfortunate enough to be on International Blvd when the Raiders lost some sort of sporting event. The fans were setting cars on fire and beating the shit out of bystanders. I lived in Texas as a kid. Fist fighting was a popular pastime at my school. You're wrong. Americans are violent assholes.

You need to head over to Burning Man sometime. How about the Fremont solstice bike rides?

:)

I've been to burning man and saw one argument there over a married girl that decided to pass herself around to a couple of guys while high. It was at the burn of a mock Wall Street. Two guys started to argue and the crowd got in between them quickly. Burning man is 50k unique people that should leave the U.S. quickly before they get hurt. The greater BA is a special place to live compared to the rest of the country and still I've seen altercations all the way from Golden Gate Park concerts to the Monterey Peninsula. I saw a guy get stabbed outside a club in Salinas. The only place or event in the last 20 years that I never saw any kind of problem was at the Folsom Street fair. I think that's because the guys are too busy sucking each other off in the middle of the street (I'm not joking and still there are violent undertones).

https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6096/6281665674_532cf976c0_z.jpg

I wasn't arguing that Americans aren't violent, I was arguing that it is insane to compare that sort of violent behavior to ISIS fundamentalists who cut off little girls' limbs while she is alive.

Note Latin America is even more violent than the USA overall, and the USA has a huge influx of Latin Americans. Also black Americans are statistically 20 times more likely to commit murder than European-descent Americans. So yes we are melting pot with races (Africans and Latinos) who are typically violent. There are also whites who are into the machismo crap and fighting.

I agree the USA is fucked up. It will disintegrate and violence will proliferate. The cohesiveness of the common language and common market is being lost because of the great disparity between the for example highly educated who work in Silicon valley or other high tech enclaves, and the lower and middle class trash. When the USA economy turns down from 2016 onwards, this disintegration will become more evident and accelerate. For example, this rioting is part of the demise of retailing in the USA. Kiss our strip malls good riddance. This is the end of that era and economic paradigm.

Most of Europe (but not for example Finland) appears to have the problem that they don't want to own personal guns, so this puts them in danger of being overrun by an invader such as ISIS or Russia. Also it appears the pacifism in Europe was bought with an elaborate social system. When that social system collapses (it is bankrupt), then we will see the true human nature rise again in Europe as it does every time they collapse economically. This time it might be an invader, since Europe's demographics are old (low birth rates) and its youth significantly emasculated. Buying off the population with debt is also a delayed megadeath paradigm.

Both Europe and the USA are examples of what rampant socialism has fostered.

Edit: the collapsing oil price is both evidence of a collapsing global economy and it will strengthen ISIS because economic hardship and anger will increase throughout the Middle East, East Asian, and north African oil producing region.

Why the fuck do we teach police to choke hold? It is a machismo maneuver to prove who is doing the ass kicking and demand humiliation submission. It doesn't serve any functional role and it puts the policeman in danger which requires them to body build and take steroids.

They could simply stand at a distance and warn the offender or suspect that if they don't voluntarily submit to arrest they will be clubbed in the leg if they try to vacate the scene. The point is to deescalate and give the offender a chance to think out the recourse and calm down. And one clubbing to the leg is sufficient, not multiple beatings. Or after a few moments if it is not sufficient, then more clubbings. And always on mandatory headcam worn by police and shown to the public on the internet so they know they must respect the people that they serve.

When I was 20 in college in San Fernando valley, California in 1985, I was sitting in my car outside a disco and I was beaten through the window by 250lb lineman bouncer from Arizona State U. I didn't know my passenger was talking to his gf, he punched me without me even knowing it and my head hit the stickshift. He broke my jaw (had to eat through a straw after that).

I got out of the car and asked him nicely what the hell he did that for? He punched me again. I got up and was moving towards him asking him if he felt like a tough guy for hitting innocent people, and an off duty police came over and put me in an arm lock then a choke hold and asked me if I wanted to die today. My friend begged him to let me go and I didn't resist, so he didn't kill me.

I proceeded to the police station to report the crime against me and they refused to talk to me. I called attorneys the next day and nobody would take my case.

From that point on, I knew that police are low-IQ power maniacs with badges given their power (and authority) by stupid white people who prefer the illusion of safety over freedom.

“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”—Ben Franklin