Bitcoin Forum

People buy bitcoin because they think they'll be worth millions some day, but who should be the fool buying for 1000$+?
Has this question been answered before?

A new user with a german nick, that translates into humans enemy. lol

It is simple economy, when the demand rises and the supply stays the same price goes up. The "fools" are the people who don't have bought BTC already or who didn't buy enough for their future use.

Mark Zuckerberg? LOL :D
maybe layman with more money will buying :D

The fool that just sold a loaf of bread for $1000+?

Well you do get the type of thinking that unless it's at least worth 1000 again, then it's maybe dying.... but if 1000 is possible then 5000 is nearby. So, yah, there could actually be some people out there that arbitrary figures will impress enough that they buy then, instead of now.

But if you really want to save people from themselves.... tell them to get in cheap! :D

Large investment firms can buy on the tops. In dec 2013 there have been million $ funds that moved into bitcoin at premium ($1,000 +).

I'm new because i like it. My nick shouldn't concern you - or are you a lover of humans? If you are no altruist you got no business with my name.

About content:
what 'demand'? From whom? Why?

So you think the others are like you thinking the train is leaving them and that's where bitcoin gets its value because evryone thinks the train is leaving them?
LMAO!

Does anyone have another explanation what the potential demand could be other than just some people who think the train is leaving them?



i just hope they did not educate themselves too much and do it again. What if they actually got loaded already and now have enough? Who's buying then? Yes, investement firms makes sense. But who do they think they can sell to for 1000$+ ?

I have to say: these days people can just launch their own coin or buy one of almost 1000 already exisitng altcoins for their specific usecase. Why should everyone be chasing bitcoin?

I will still be buying when the price is 1000+

Buying with dollars and selling with euros because it is the cheapest way to move money from my US bank to my german bank.

correct. Only the actual real usecases can make real demand. And they are few... or not strong enough to draw people in who aren't technically interested already. I think peoples expectations of another meteoric rise of 10x or more are too high.

Getting Average Joe in here will not be happening anytime soon. Especially with such a fucked up chart.

Maybe he is the real Mark Zuckerberg  ;D , but I'm not sure. However  I think the people will buy also bitcoin if it will raise to 1'000 dollars.

dude, when btc is 1000$ people will buy doge or litecoin then or some other (in relation) undervalued coin. Altcoins will be booming later, no doubt. But all that is aswell just speculation demand.

We already found out: merchant adoption does not help raise the price because merchants do not hold it. So there aren't that many usecases left which could create REAL demand.

Anyways, keep the answers coming. Who is buying that expensive coin later?

I will buy btc for $1,000 but not before it went to $5,500 first  :D

If we had 600 million users, a 10x rise would be too much to expect. But if we've got under 6 million, then 100x is easily possible.

Maximum potential is 1.23 Billion users if we say that everyone capable of using facebook can use bitcoin. And where is the starting point? Well those snippy snappy critics tell us we might only have 200,000 users right now, and we can hit $1000 with that many? Hokay, so that's only six hundred and fifteen thousand percent upside potential. 615,000%... or if you believe community estimates of around 2 million, a paltry 61 thousand percent instead.

Heh true, I may well be buying at 1500 even on the backside of the next big one.

So, in summary:

Bitcoin is going to $1000!!!

i think we are digging up an important point here: it's not so much about usecases as it is about users.

remark: will turn cult-like easily the more this is understood.

But then again: when it is about users and not even about application so much then i see an even brighter future for altcoins. It remains to be seen who will be the people to buy bitcoin for 2000$ or 5000$ other than the speculators.

We will certainly deal with a bubble within a bubble. This shit will pop later if it doesn't do it already.

The only thing that upholds the price are the believers and hoarders from my perspective. But most of them have no idea who they want to sell to later.

I see a problem with bitcoin not being able to be a good store of value (too high inflation). This could does cause communities of coins with similar emissionrate (and the original btc of course) to slow in growth because people can't hold the coin longterm (they can but it's not wise ... i know, i know everything will be good LATER because everyone believes very hard in it now).

If people can actually not use it to store wealth it'll be just a fad and makes essetially in its current form only little sense.

Summary:
-bitcoin can't hold value right now, is not suitable for saving money into it and hinders with it its own adoption
-what bitcoin needs most is users
-users need to be loyal and believe in it
-> one should take care to not let this become very fast a brainwashing cult if it isn't one already.
-a bubble within a bubble is a possibility and likely reality - once the loyal believers start to unbelieve it pops.

so much for location determination. I just hope it pumps to 1000$+ so i can sell ... get some sheep in here, quick! The last round is bled dry from altcoinscams and bounties to miners already. Need fresh meat.



^
lol. Classical example of permabulltard.
Thanks for holding the bag. We need people like you.  :)
Never sell. Always buy more.

Why shouldn't someone buy Bitcoin for $1000 in a year? Just because it is less than that today? Why should someone buy Bitcoin for $345 today, when it was $130 one and a half year ago?
There were always marks, were people said, that is the peak. I am not long enough in the game, but I think, there was one at $1 at $30 at $130 and now at $1000.
What exactly changed?

maybe 1000$ is still easily possible, agree. But we will run into serious issues above 10k$ to 20k$ i believe. I'd expect an epic, epic crash around that mark. Like doublecrash (if we do not actually see this right now already)

Why should someone buy btc for 345$ today? That is a good question and i think the answer is: they shouldn't because has good chance to hit 200$-range again. We have always more coins. Each and every day.

What changes from 1$ to 1000$ ?
The audience became bigger. So we are back to the only point we may agree on: it's about users

You porbably do know as good as i do: most who are here now are independant persons who came here because they educated themselves. But the average person does not educate themselves about anything at all. So possibly we hit a ceiling of possible users somewhere and bitcoin will become very depandant on advertising via the current institutions which in part it actually is designed to make obsolete. I do see a contradiction there too. That's a sociologic question now aswell as an existential one for btc.

haha. But even if the media would suddenly be on the side of bitcoin it'll still be very hard to convince the uneducated masses to buy a coin for 5000$ which was 5$ once.  Since media is not even looked at as any type of guide - not even by stupid people these days the whole task may very well be a fail.

I still don't know who's buying btc for 2k$ , 5k$, 10k$



edit: lool topic moved to speculation and no trace or remark of the move on the original place. lmao.
This is actually in the wrong subforum now because i did not want to discuss speculative pricedevelopement but the question "who is buying later for higher prices?" but apparently people are affraid they can't answer it.

Mrs. Ena Spadwick of 24 Frobisher Gardens, Surrey, UK.

Don't make her wait too long.

My feelings tell me that you are/will be one these people @OP :P :-*

People who don't understand Bitcoin today.

looks like a good answer, but i don't think they will invest later because you know. People don't have much money and they feel somehow odd doing that and probably will feel like fools and likely be fools if they did and that's why they won't because their 500$ doesn't even buy them a single coin.
I have doubts average joe wants to buy a lot later to get dust for his money only to make you rich.

I have a feeling someone in few years is going to bump this topic just for lolz.

Bitcoin is maturing, and is becomming stronger and stronger.

When Bitcoin was just $25 I was thinking why on earth should I buy at $55.. Guess what, I bought at $55.

When Bitcoin was $100 I was thinking why should I buy at $200.. Guess what, I bought at $200.

People who buy at $1000 aren't fools, if the market is mature enough and supply and demand is exactly right, then it's a good buy.

People will pay as much for 1 BTC (or for 1 mBTC) as they think it's worth when they buy it, this includes actual value (what can you buy with it?) as well as speculative value (how much will it be worth in a year?)
If at one point in time you can get a great smartphone for 25 mBTC then $10k for 1 BTC is not too much, so you will gladly pay $250 for 25mBTC to get your smartphone. If you want to buy a car that's offered for 2 BTC youll probably even buy 2 BTC for $20k.
You will just be a bit mad that you did not buy some BTC when they were less than $400.

Onkel Paul

first good answer and shows merchant adoption is actually still good for something. Well, maybe there is hope if the merchants are stupid enough to accept bitcoin as volatile as it is.

Those that are intelligent enough to not want to miss on the true technological revolution and not miss the train at cheap 1K when it will be 10K before this decade ends.

For the millionth time you dont need to buy an entire coin. We will be talking in terms of satoshi or mBTC by then.

ITT:  People daydream about 10k Bitcoin as the price keeps tanking.

Considering the explosive growth in price. One day we may all wish we could buy a whole bitcoin for only $1k. I am not aware of anything that has experienced as much growth.

 

Check out other penny stocks--happens all the time.

Did somebody see "Wolf of Wall Street" and thinks he is now a financial expert?

Why buying a full Bitcoin while one of the strongest part of crypto is ''smaller units'' Do ppl forget Satoshi/bits so fast?

Pizza guy with his 10k coins? think about it what you can do with that amounth today ore holding youre ''smameless'' 10 coins for 5 years?

Probably, though not I.  Interesting question tho.

the one who didn't buy when it was 340

Using bitcoin as an intermediary is not really buying it.

Fist bump for that!

The businesses I have helped LOVE bitcoin now. There is no reason to face any price swings. You could use a payment processor and give up 1% for the service. That's better than the 3% you give up to a credit card. Bitcoin also allows some businesses to capture new markets. Look at this place I know.
http://centraltexasgunworks.com/

They were just another tiny gun store in Texas. They had a website, but no traffic. Then they began taking bitcoin and their online business exploded. The website you see was paid for by profits from bitcoin and they are now primarily an online store. Eventually there will be a lot of online gun shops and they will be back to competing on price, but since they went first they have revenue from people who would have never heard of them.

You can call them stupid if you want. But they are crushing it in bitcoin sales.

If bitcoin's market price is $3000 anyone buying from you for $1000+ would hardly be a fool. You would be the fool for selling them that cheaply.

Does the nug store offer a discount for using Bitcoin?  (link pls)

If not, none of my CC charge me the 3% fee you claimed.  

Once again, Bitcoin is more expensive to use than CC :)

im pretty sure hes talking from the merchant perspective.

also i think in the end you as the consumer will have to pay the fee because it is already priced in

/edit

btw there are actually some good discounts from big merchants (overstock,dell what i remember right now, also im pretty sure that i saw advertisments of other merchants)

Gyft gives 3% back on all gift card purchases bought with bitcoin.

If gas stations ever sell fuel for bitcoin that will avoid the extra $ per gallon that they charge you for using a credit card instead of cash. Same with vending machines. I know that not all states charge the consumer more for using CC (as it is illegal in some states), but in california many places charge you more if you pay with CC (such as gasoline and vending machines). Usually if it's illegal or just against their corporate practice to charge more for CC, they give "cash" discounts or they just flat out raise their prices across the board.

Hopefully they will take bitcoin like cash, since they don't get hit with the CC fee.


Edit: this also applies to gun stores and dentist offices. Always ask for cash discounts even if they don't advertise it :)

If the retailer is not passing the savings on to me, I'm not interested.  I'm sure most consumers are not, either.  Dell offers no discount for using BTC.  Further, Dell redirects buyers to Coinbase.com, so Dell's not accepting Bitcoin--it is accepting fiat via Coinbase, a payment processor that does.

Not sure how Overstock does it, but I'm sure it's about the same--a cursory glance mentions Coinbase.com.  Overstock also offers its own plastic, giving you savings galore.  I'm sure substantially better than whatever promo they ran for Bitcoin.  If BTC discount is offered, it is certainly unadvertised :-\

So yeah, chalk up another win for CC :(

Most gas stations near me offer no cash discount--i stick my card in the pum & I'm done.
Also, see post above.  Major retailers accepting BTC do so through a payment processor.  Payment processors charge for their service, because not Communism :(

hehe nice. Once more confirmed:

bitcoin is:
-gambling
-scamming
-drugs
-guns
-[fill in here]


do sales of groceries explode too because of bitcoins? Is there interest from the economy beyond legal grey areas?


edit1:
now wait for overtocks-argument...

edit2:
shit i was right - that was fast  1minute 40 seconds.

@dell:
i think the clue was about where you would buy from. i think it was like a discount of 20-30% if you bought dell products via btc from china or similiar.

@overstock
overstock is actually holding some % of their btc earnings if i remember correct.

but you are right that both use a payment processor to exchange most of their btc to fiat.
but its still a long(?) way until you will get payed with btc or can pay taxes with it

Link pl0x.  I could find nothing.
For Overstock too, if possible.  "My uncle's friend heard it on IRC" doesn't cut it.

@overstock

http://www.coindesk.com/overstock-ceo-patrick-byrne-1-6m-bitcoin-sales/

@dell

they had an up to 15% discount promotion of alienware stuff.

and if you bought from china with bitcoins you would have saved around 45% because of their foreign exchange controls.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=701178.0


i have a favor good now, took me like 2030 minutes to dig that out --"

Thanks, I followed the 10% link in the article, which landed me here, (http://www.coindesk.com/overstock-ceo-holds-millions-bitcoin/) but couldn't find a ref. to him holding 10%.  Then I realized I misunderstood the intended meaning, which is:  At the time the article was written, "CEO Patrick Byrne ... now holds "several million dollars" in bitcoin, having recently invested in the currency."

TL:DR:  As I understand it, he is not keeping a percentage of the sales, he holds (owns) several mil$ worth of BTC, which constituted 10% of Overstock's BTC sales to date.  If this is unclear (my fault), I can try to explain it beterer.


Thanks for taking the time (no sarcasm).  Maybe it did take place, but this: "Andy, a Chinese, shared his experience on Weibo (Chinese Twitter). ... He saved 46%" is exactly what I meant by "my uncle's friend from IRC"-- unverifiable, anecdotal evidence.  This fora are full of stuff like this.

Regardless, thanks again for taking the time to find it.

Yes, what crazy fools to get fractions of currency worth 1000000 per unit which he can spend for the same real world value in goods and serviced...

All them fools getting USD's...

Wow you guys all sound like idiots who have no idea how companies work, especially in the investment field...

NOBODY WILL PAY THAT MUCH FOR BITCOIN EXCEPT YOU IDIOTS!!!

You'll keep buying and buying again even though we are down over 70%
This is why the slow bleed down will continue... nice and slow... extracting your "worthless" fiat every week

What a coincidence, that's exactly how you sound.

I don't know who will buy coins at $1000 or whether or not I will have the right to call them a fool.

My take is that btc will continue to gain acceptance, but I don't know when the price will 'turnaround'.

I think it will be something like a major economic shock that sees a run to bitcoin; there is plenty happening at the moment, noticed this today.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/12/10/uk-ecb-banks-idUKKBN0JO1PH20141210

people will still buy because a $1000 bitcoin still gets you $1000 worth of goods or services at that time

Yesterday I heard about a small bar, that just accepts cash and Bitcoins, because the fees for credit cards and ATM card is just too high for them.
In Austria a lot of merchants that accept credit cards charge extra for that.
I am really amazed how a lot of people just don't realize, that there are other countries, with other laws, fee structure and mentality. Credit Cards are not that widely used here in Austria.

Not every country adopts to modernity as quickly as USA.
Nothing wrong with that, you'll catch up.  There are other developing countries where CC use is even less prevalent.

^^^^ Says the advocate of bronze age money.

Are you trying to be funny or are you just an idiot? We don't need CC since we just use ATM cards = less fees, more secure, same convenience.
Calling CC modern is one of the stupidest things, I have heard in a long time.

^
Yes, ATM, a US Invention.  Enjoy using our hand-me-down technology :)

You still fail to explain why cc are better than atm cards.
I'd love to here that.

ATM cards are nothing but CC without the perks.  They also don't offer you a free month's worth of credit.
In America, we use both 8)

By perks you mean an extra intermediary, who also charges extra?
We also have a free month's worth credit, but we are not just that stupid to pay today with the money we might have in the future. Sure, we take credits, but not just as lightly as US-Americans, too.
Btw. speaking of old technology, you might be interested in that:
http://www.vienna-expats.at/articles/18-living-in-vienna/40-geocontrol-additional-security-bankomatkarten-abroad.html
USA is one of this countries, which has this problem with Skimming, since your ATM machines use an old technology.

Edit:
I just looked at the list of secure countries seeing that it is more secure to use your ATM card in Ukraine than in the USA. Do you still thing your country's technology is high sophisticated?

No, I mean frequent flier miles.  My credit card charges me exactly as much as my debit (ATM) card--zero.  If yours charges you, you must be a deadbeat with lousy credit rating :-\

Re. your link:  One of the advantages of credit/debit cards over Bitcoin is not having to worry about the technology getting hax0rd.  The bank/CC company carries all the risks :)
Re. your edit: Credit card fraud constitutes FIVE CENTS FOR EVERY $100 of transactions.  And the trend's downward :)

US Invention?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Shepherd-Barron & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Goodfellow

Get your facts right.

Onkel Paul

^My facts are right:
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_teller_machine

http://s24.postimg.org/hu7lns5f9/Capture.jpg

It is really hard to discuss with you, since you are even too stupid to understand, what people are telling you or you are misunderstanding it on purpose.
So, one more time: The credit card company charges the merchant extra, this extra costs eventually winds ab with the costumer. Do you really think, they just swallow it, because they are so altruistic? Secondly credit cards works exactly the same in Austria than in the USA(as far as I know)

Your last statement is misleading. Even when you get your money back(I don't think, that is always the case), there is still a lot of inconvenience involved, in contrary if your country just forbids old buggy technology.

We are discussing the difference between using cash & debit cards (your scenario) vs. using CC (mine).  Other than a few gas stations in podunk towns, I do not get cash discounts.
I do get CC perks.
Ergo, CC is less expensive for me to use than cash.  If you feel like subsidising my CC use by transacting with cash, you go right ahead.  Unless you recieve cash discounts, that's exactly what you are doing :)


Lol, when hax0ring happens:
-Worst case CC scenario:  I don't want to bother with "inconvenience" & lose all my money.  
-BEST case Bitcoin scenario:  Money gone, OKTHXBI! :D

and again: It is not the same in Austria, which is my whole point all along.
Do you want to go another round in this circle?

btw. I am pretty sure, there are also shops in USA, which generally don't accept credit cards and there for are generally cheaper. Maybe someone from the USA can confirm that.

No, you forgot already.  It's OK, I'll remind you:



Yes, as I said, there are gas stations in backwards backwaters in US that don't accept CC.  Progress takes time.

they weren't fool!

You are saying that everyone that buy some investiment at his top is a fool?? that's no sense

It's really sad, how the stereotype of stupid US-Americans  is true for so many people, who think, their country is superior to every other country in the world, because they are to ignorant and arrogant to look at other countries and their ways and just think for them self.
You are even to arrogant to just admit, that the USA is obviously behind when it comes to preventing skimming.
So, you get on my mental ignore-list, just with anonymimint(or whatever his nick is), since it is just to exhausting to argue with stupid people.

Stay angry, poor, paranoid and ignorant, my Australian friend!

http://s24.postimg.org/hu7lns5f9/Capture.jpg

https://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061028104223AAQanYO

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/__GTrSYoXlbY/SceVlc5f5LI/AAAAAAAABCc/QOfxiyJBteM/s400/no_kangaroos.gif

Anyone in this forum who thinks bitcoin will be worth $10,000 in the next couple years would.  Unfortunately there are not enough of them and they don't have a lot of money because they have been buying "cheap coins" for some time now.

"Famous Australians (sorry don't know too many of them)" :D
he forgot these d00ds:

http://s28.postimg.org/bfaliginx/Capture.jpg

:D

Tru, my money IS where my mouth is.

Oh my good how stupid are you?!
Austria and Australia are two completely different countries.But hey that fits perfect how much a typical american seem to know about the rest of the world.It's just a pitty.
But sure pray to your beloved warmonger Bush.

Brazilians. I don't actually plan to šell though.

Oh, THAT Austria!  Not a place you bulltards want to visit, trust me bro.

http://s18.postimg.org/rix6cv75l/Capture.jpg

So you are basically counting on poor people who are getting poorer & way more oppressed as the days pass... They will suddenly have money to buy your "$10,000" coins??? Or will they be happy to have a few satoshi's?! LMFAO what a joke bro

JayJuanGee ... Hey JJG... I'll sell you some coins for $1,000+

Hell, I'll give you a bargain and sell them to you for $1,000,000

Horrible pricing, I can easily do $300 cash each coin in NYC & $350 each coin out of the city. Many many people can beat my price, I am considered as "expensive", some people have coins in the hundreds easily

It's always the poor schmucks with less than 1 BTC that are trying to sell for expensive prices, as you have proven now. lmfao

Apparently he has 350 coins (lol)

That's nothing, I've got 2 million coins, even more than Satoshi himself.

Or don't I  :D

I think it's safe to assume he has nowhere near the amount he's claiming, he's probably confused by btc vs bits.

It's proven.

Oh and he has made millions trading. Hmm.

Somebody should explain fewcoins that importing "Watch Only" adresses on his Blockchain.info wallet doesn't mean he actually owns them.

 :D

Millions of satoshis?  ;D