Bitcoin Forum

so I bought a SR member account couple months ago, from seller. than i get an email from some random person stating the person selling the account never paid the actual owner for the account and ran, I paid the seller, now this random person is stating that his friend wants the bitcoin paid to him or he will leave negative feedback. keep in mind the past owner never contacted me and let me know of this. so I decided  to pay him why would I pay double.  now that random person left a negative feedback stating it was a stolen account. and I am stuck with it. is there any thing i can do about this. like i said the original owner never once contacted me.

seller: Gumble99
person that sent pm randomly :Gambitv

Account in question
Jazkal

Gambitv = another user that should not be on the Trust list. Added via Canaryinthemine for apparently buying USB miners.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=891301.0

Contact the seller and ask him to confirm sale. Buying an account WILL subject said account to Negative feedback.

This situation again shows how having canaryinthemine on level one of he default trust tree is having severe negative repercussions on members of the community. Moving him down to level two trust would decrease the problems.

Considering Gumble disappeared when he was first accused of stealing the Jazkal account in August, I would say there is some merit to the feedback (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=624612.msg8206408#msg8206408).

Yes, this is a shitty situation for the OP, but selling stolen accounts is against the forum rules, so the account should be returned to the original owner. Seller also owes the OP whatever he paid, good luck finding him though. Also, I know people would love to turn this into another CanaryInTheMime witch-hunt, but the feedback just says the account was stolen and sold. People in default trust tag accounts like this all the time and no one cares, stop trying to make this a bigger issue.

There is probably some merit to the feedback however it is really the original owner's of Jazkal fault for most likely not using escrow. This essentially means that the owner gave gumball his password without first receiving any kind of meaningful assurance that he would receive payment.

okay here is the real situation,

between these parties

1:me the buyer
2:gumble the broker if he is a broker for this account
3:? the original owner
4: random guy leaving feedback gambitv

first of all we do not know if this is a stolen account because original owner never once did contact me nor did he made it public.

besides Gambitv sending me a PM stating it was stolen. if that was the case than why did the original owner contact me and verify some things with me. instead gambit was the one who contacted me.  for all we know gambit and gumble is the same person.


why should I pay double or even return the account when the original owner never contacted me. if he did and it was true and he could verify the account with me than of course it would of made sense.


Also, I know people would love to turn this into another CanaryInTheMime witch-hunt, but the feedback just says the account was stolen and sold.

but there is no proof the account was stolen. thats the issue.

How is there some merit to the feedback?  The original owner never contacted me.

The person who left you negative feedback and the original owner could be one and the same.

This is probably an example of someone being on default trust list who is an inexperienced trader (only participated in one transaction with a trustworthy person), tried to sell his account via gumble99, didn't use escrow so gubmle decided to run away and create a new account while stealing the account and the proceeds from the sale

Do signature campaigns not pay more for senior accounts anymore?

buying an account is spammy? but its allowed on the forum? and anything that happens because I bought an account is deserved?
your just a nice hero **** arnt you.
There is no legit reason to buy an account? besides signature campaigns right. or is that scammy too?

well i can say you are right about buying accounts. stupid mistake.

You might not agree with account sales but there are valid reasons for buying/selling them - signature campaigns being one of them. You can also buy one to get past the annoying newb restrictions or just to help your business selling things here. That being said, they can be bought to exploit all those things or just outright scam but those instances are usually rare and are swiftly dealt with by the community and/or staff.

How many accounts have you bought hilarious?

Or are you not comfortable answering that?

69. I'm perfectly comfortable with answering it. I honestly haven't bought a single one.

Thats not what I heard...

Well whatever you heard is obviously bs, so I wouldn't pay attention to 'what you heard' (that's if you even 'heard' anything at all and are likely just making crap up to troll which I suspect you are). And If you heard I'm satoshi would you believe it? No. Anyway, it's clear you have some sort of agenda signing up merely to ask this question.

BitMiningInvestments GTFO 8)

This is a 2012 account, I didn't just sign up. I saw messages from you trying to buy accounts from an account seller whos account was compromised. This was a long time ago before you were staff. Dosn't really matter anyways since almost every staff member here abuses their power, theymos snoops on PM's when he is bored.

When it was signed up is irrelevent but it's clear you solely hopped onto that account to post your thoughts on the matter. Did you hack that account or compromise the account sellers one? It's entirely possible many moons ago I may at some point have enquired about account sales or been offered to purchase them (likely unsolicited), but regardless, what I said is true and I haven't purchased a single one. Not that there would be anything wrong with that nor would it be an 'abuse of power' anyway.

But you do have more than one account right?

Yep. I have more than one.

I actually just went through all my sent messages and seemingly the only time I ever enquired about the possibility of buying one was this:


Which he PMd me because of this post in his thread:


Keyword might. And that was the end of my discussion with subud. I never really trusted him and he seemed pretty scammy. But yeah, never bought an account though I certainly had entertained or flirted with the idea at the time. 

If you are so trustworthy and don't have anything to hide then you won't have any problem posting the names of those account here.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument

I have my privacy, which I am entitled to, but I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

I don't think you really have any grounds to ask these types questions when you're clearly not using your main account.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

BitMiningInvestments has revealed his alt to me via PM. In the interests of transparency I will post the message here:


And also make good on my promise to reveal mine. My alt account is: hilariousetc (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=397737).

ROFL!

So what will it take to get you to expose your other alt accounts?

What's funny? And what other ones? What will it take me to get you to reveal all yours?

Why do you even want to reveal my accounts? Why do you even care?

I'll list all my accounts out here but you gotta list all of yours first. Thats what it'll take. I trusted you, now you have to trust me.

To quote your very own words:


 ::)

Seems to me that your refusal to list the names of your accounts by your own admission means you are either untrustworthy and/or have something to hide. Why don't you back your words up by acting in accordance with them instead of harassing others?

Ad hominem again.

It isn't my trustworthiness that is at question, it is hilariousandco's, who is a staff member here. If you want to question my trustworthiness go create your own topic. My trustworthiness is irrelevant, I'm just asking valid questions and pointing out facts that hilarious clearly doesn't like so he resorts to trying to attack me. I'm giving him a chance to be honest before I start posting everything I have found.

And I am not refusing to list my accounts, if he wants to know them he can, he just has to tell everyone all of his.

Haha. Are you actually being serious? Why do you care? I actually can't believe the irony and hypocrisy (aka stupidity) here as it was you that instigated this 'exposing' crusade and these things you are accusing me of are all things that all apply to you. You have yet to show any evidence of such 'scummy-scammer' behaviour from me yet have literally displayed the exact same yourself. I also don't have any kids by the way. Don't want any either. I don't want to live my entire life with the fear that they would grow up to be chavs or people like you.


My trustworthiness doesn't seem to be at question here either. Just hot air from a troll and scammer. I emplore you to post everything or anything you think you may have against me in the interest of transparency. I actually don't have anything to hide so I'm sure anything you think you may have against me can easily be refuted or squashed. I would never do anything nefarious or against the rules here and never have so please post the evidence.

And I don't care about your accounts, but you seem to care about mine for some personal reason.

I didn't say you were a scammer, I said you were a scammer-helper and that you have alts. You have already admitted in this thread that you have tried to buy accounts from an account seller in the past and there is other evidence to suggest you have sockpuppet accounts, which I might be posting (I don't want to unnecessarily expose my sources).


I care about yours because you are the one in a position of trust, I am not. And just because everything you do is by the rules doesn't mean it doesn't make you untrustworthy, I am aware you're allowed to have alts but many people do not like the idea of a staff member having secret alt accounts and possibly buying/selling accounts.

So while I was typing this you changed it from will be exposing to might be haha. And what's wrong with trying to buy an account (again, which I never actually did). It wasn't really much of a 'try' either but more that I flirted/considered the possibility of it). Two messages is quite a half-assed try, though I think the bigger question here is what were you doing in possession of - or had access to - the messages of a hacked account (not to mention the one you PMd me from with several scam accusations against it)?


Then you've best post the evidence of these nefarious socks ASAP for the benefit of the community and stop stalling. You don't have anything because there isn't anything for you to have. You just saw the messages from me ages ago to the account seller and assumed I had more and was fishing for me to willingly expose them and now you're just trying to spread fud.


Who are these many people? You and possibly some nosey curtain-twitchers? I think you will likely find that most of the staff here will have or admit to having at least one other 'secret' account and it's actually encouraged by theymos for certain situations. And you shouldn't really be bothered by how many accounts anyone has as long as they're not doing anything dodgy with them, but again, why are you so concerned with how many accounts you think I have? Did I say something you didn't like or bust one of your scams one time? Boo-hoo :'(.

It's not hard to imagine that a staff member could abuse his power to aid his alt accounts, which is what I believe you are doing. And signing up with multiple accounts to signature campaigns which only allow one account is considered scamming, which I believe you have done in the past. I also think that you are knowingly helping scammers though I'm not sure why yet but I suspect because you do business with them.

People care about unfair moderation, scamming and staff helping scammers.

And I don't scam people. Full disclosure, you do say things that I don't like from time to time but thats not why I am here.

Yes, that could happen, though it hasn't and wouldn't ever happen with me. All this other stuff you're accusing me of is complete fabrication so stop wasting everyone's time and actually voice your concerns and provide the evidence you think you have. I guarantee you're wrong here and the only thing you'll likely do is implicate innocent users so make sure you actually have evidence and not just half-assed and incorrect assumptions.


What business is that? I've barely done any trades here and the ones I have are all detailed in my feedback sent and recieved.


I agree wholeheartedly, so if you ever have any concerns with any staff you should post the evidence immediately as if there was a staff member doing this they should also be removed immediately.

I was going to say that BitMiningInvestments was an alt of TF or Blazr as TF had access to BTCTalkAccounts per this post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=810921.msg9163237#msg9163237) and Blazr was apparently an alt of BTCTalkAccounts (not 100% on this). However it appears that the account that hilariousandco sent a PM to regarding potentially buying an account is a different account selling account (although it is plausible that BTCTalkAccounts had more then one account selling account for a number of reasons, including the fact that they were apparently banned).

I am fairly certain that you are an alt of the person who hacked RiverBoatBTC as you gave me negative trust right around the time I revealed that the hacker was trying to sell the account. This post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=901324.msg9916296#msg9916296) promises "revenge" for my revealing that it was trying to be sold. Additionally my only communication with you is below:
Which you left me additional negative feedback for trying to blackmail you. I think it is reasonable to conclude the above message is not blackmail.

Since the account that Hilariousandco sent a PM to regarding buying an account dealt in hacked accounts, and BitMiningInvestments had it's password reset recently, I would believe that BitMiningInvestments is probably a hacked account.

I would also conclude that you are an alt of one of the many account sellers that has recently popped up on here and/or are otherwise involved in the sale of accounts (maybe via off forum trades). You appear to either think hilariousandco sells accounts (so you want to bash your competition) or do not like the fact that he often defends the sale of accounts (which would hurt off forum trades).

EDIT: the feedback that you left me is another indication that you are trying to harm your competition (if you are in fact selling accounts) and is an indication of you trolling

ROFL! and I thought that BTCTalkAccounts = You.

Guess I'll have to leave you another neg for spreading lies.

I am not sure what you are claiming to be a lie ??? It isn't like your trust isn't obvious trolling as there is 0 evidence attached to them, plus anytime someone leaves multiple negative trust reports their credibility declines.

For the record, no I am not BTCTalkAccounts. I try to avoid dealing with hacked accounts. As I am fairly certain you said to me (via RiverBoatBTC)

From the time you started trolling onward really should be split into another thread as your trolling has caused this to get very offtopic

This is probably the closest to the truth. He obviously deals in accounts in some capacity and is trying to cause a fuss around what he sees as competition. Though I think he may actually genuinely believe I'm involved in some business that I'm not, but he doesn't have anything other than incorrect suspicions and assumption.


Quite clearly you don't put too much effort into your 'thoughts' or accusations.

So you admit to hacking RiverBoadBTC?

::) What does bitpop have to do with this, and so you hack accounts to do what with them exactly? Troll for fun? How do you make money if you're not selling them? Scammers and trolls (which you are both) do more damage to this forum than 'sig spammers' ever will.

A scammer is someone who defrauds a victim by deception. I don't do that, I'm not a scammer. I may troll, but I'm not trolling about you and I will expose your accounts if I have to.

Stealing accounts via whatever deceptive methods you use isn't scamming?

He pissed off (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=901324.msg9910483#msg9910483)bitpop a lot when he opened a random scam accusation against him (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=901237.0) with zero validity.

This forum is awesome , but why don't put a simple email verification ( are we "talking" in a bitcointalk forum? bitcoin = security , but it doesn't give the security to the members community. I think it will more efficacy a simple email verification , and for theymos will be a relief not to have to receive all those PMs to "recovery"  the accounts)  ~  It will prevent all these types of problem (hacked account , etc...) .

Ok ROFL this has gone way off topic there is no point in me replying anymore as nobody will listen.

See this post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=831707.msg9956395#msg9956395) why that may actually be a step in the opposite direction in terms of protecting account security

Simple don't use that email (quickseller@live.com) , you can also use a gmail email address (with the 2FA).  The email verification will be a best option for this forum , I think it is right to add it .

If you actually knew anything you would just post it. The only reason you asked me to name my alleged hypothetical accounts is in the hope that I would just reveal them myself. I'm sure you would love to smugly revel in the kudos of bringing down a (non-existent) corrupt mod, but obviously you don't have anything other than incorrect assumptions at the very most (maybe you know of someone else's dodgy alts or something and if you do you should speak up and create a scam accusation. I guarantee it won't have anything to do with me.).


It is awesome. Never a day goes by without some sort of drama.


There was no point in you posting in the first place. You also don't need to post that you're not posting anymore. Just lead by example and disappear or at least move onto the next alt you can cowardly hide behind whilst you fling shit.

I think this person is probably Candystripes. Candy had made very vague threats against someone in the currency exchange forum, similar to the vague threats this person is making. I believe that he also was dealing in accounts as well

Possibly, but I don't think he's smart enough to hack accounts or cover his tracks. I have definitely pissed Candy off in the very recent past though, but it's not exactly hard to vex that childish scammer anyway.

Here is the conversation between gumble and myself, about the sale.

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Re: (No subject)
« Sent to: onewiseguy on: July 31, 2014, 05:57:14 AM »
« You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
Quote from: onewiseguy on July 28, 2014, 08:12:12 AM
what do you have for sell?

Hello onewiseguy, please check my account  list on my thread.
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 01, 2014, 06:35:09 AM »
« You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
Quote from: onewiseguy on July 31, 2014, 10:02:02 PM
Account #2 up coming when will you have this one ?
Account #5 (266 - 336 activity +, registered in 2011, with avatar) - 0.45 BTC will you take .4 for this one? I will buy straight no escrow.
also can you tell me what is the avatar ?

also for the accounts what will be coming with them?


Hello, currently I have a buyer for this account who is willing to pay 0.45 BTC for It, but if he wont respond soon I will sell It to you. Avatar is a serious man just staring, with dark green soldier clothes with dark green cap.

I will let you know when I have Hero Member #2

Also I can offer you these accounts :

Account #2 (266 - 280 activity +, registered in 2013) - 0.35 BTC

Account #4 (308 - 322 activity +, registered in 2013) - 0.45 BTC

for account #4 price is little negotiable, thanks.
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 06:14:11 AM »
Quote from: onewiseguy on August 01, 2014, 02:00:34 PM
Okay i can pay .45 for it right now

Hello, sorry for the wait, I can sell you the account now. Please let me know when you are ready. Thanks.
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 01:04:22 PM »
You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
Quote from: onewiseguy on August 01, 2014, 02:00:34 PM
Okay i can pay .45 for it right now

Also If I will not be online when you will be, here is my BTC address: 1Doa3kuCnNnBBZSpFrMsjdpe56mHotg258


Send  0.45 BTC to It and when I'll come online I will pm you account username and password, but hopefully I will be online.

this is the account:

Account #5 (266 - 336 activity +, registered in 2011, with avatar) - 0.45 BTC

Thanks
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Re: account
« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 04:28:15 PM »
Quote from: onewiseguy on August 02, 2014, 04:24:56 PM
Okay already sent for Account #5 (266 - 336 activity +, registered in 2011, with avatar) - 0.45 BTC

Hello, I will handle you the account in few minutes when transaction gets 1 confirmation, thanks.
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 04:32:14 PM »
The confirmation should come soon, also are you still interested in Hero member account?
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 04:33:19 PM »

username: Jazkal

password: nikito555
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« Sent to: onewiseguy on: August 02, 2014, 05:11:07 PM »
« You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
Hello, you were interested in Hero Member account before? Are you interested in this one?

Hero Member (910 activity +, registered in 2011, with avatar (some kind of symbols), neutral trust)  for 1.2 BTC

If you are, please send 1.2 BTC to this address: 1Doa3kuCnNnBBZSpFrMsjdpe56mHotg258

I will send you username and password via pm. Thanks.







And here is the conversation with gambit
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« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 03, 2014, 02:16:36 PM »
« You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
 You bought this account from gumble99... Gumble99 didn't payed the bitcoins for this account to the true owner. So, if gumble99 won't pay, your account get some negative trust. Please pm gumble99 to avoid this.

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Re: (No subject)
« Sent to: gambitv on: August 03, 2014, 07:17:22 PM »
can you explain to me why this is so  are you the original owner of this account?


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« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 03, 2014, 07:37:44 PM »
« You have forwarded or responded to this message. »
No, I am a friend of Jazkal.

The deal was that gumble99 sells the account of Jazkal for 0.35 Btc. Jazkal gave gumble99 the account details and gumble99 changed them ... Two days past and jazkal never received bitcoins from gumble99...
Please get in contact with gumble99 and tell him he should pay. Otherwise, Jazkals account and gumble99 account will get negative trust and your primedice campaign is finished before it started…



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« Sent to: gambitv on: August 04, 2014, 03:25:26 AM »
Thank you for the concern, I will need your friend to contact me directly.  I will try to get in contact with the seller. Your friend made the deal with gum not with me. trying to put a negative on the account I purchased. will be reported to admin. For there was no trade with you or your friend by this account and will be falsely done. 

As stated above I will need your friend the past (owner of this account).  Have your friend contact the seller no need for you to be threatening me.

Thank you.


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« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 04, 2014, 10:44:09 AM »
Reply with quoteQuote  ReplyReply  Remove this messageDelete 
My friend does not have an account anymore. To contact him use this mail address: jazkal@gmx.com.

However, 24 hours left and both accounts get negative trusted.



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Re: (No subject)
« Sent to: Gumble99 on: August 04, 2014, 02:51:20 PM »
Quote from: Gumble99 on August 01, 2014, 06:28:38 AM
Hello Jazkal, I found a buyer for your account, he is willing to buy for 0.4 BTC, do you have an escrow? because escrow.ms is not responding for days. If you have an escrow please pm his username so I can contact him or just simply give me your password and I sell It ,as buyer said he will go first to me without escrow. I would charge 0.015 BTC for this trade so you would get 0.385 BTC, let me know.

Hey man I see you sold the account to me for more than what was being sold. .4 BTC and you sold it for .45 BTC. also some dude keeps saying you never paid him for the account.



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« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 05, 2014, 11:22:15 PM »
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I don't care, this account is a stolen good. Believe me, no member wants do trade with someone who has negativ trust and/or a bought account... also, your enrolled sig-campaign will be flushed...

I will give you 18 hours to get in contact with gumble99 and ask him to pay jazkal. Otherwise, you can pay 0.35 BTC to 1DnYAd2WzGHyxNzxqmCcGV4CM6QHE2FBti.

I hate scams, and this will stop here...






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« Sent to: gambitv on: August 05, 2014, 01:02:07 AM »
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leaving this account with negative because Your friend and gum did not complete the transaction. is on them. Now as for me I paid. and well i have proof of this so if you leave a negative saying you dealt with me then we will have a problem.   you or your friend can contact gum. I don't need to do anything. threatening me and this account is a no go mate.



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« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 06, 2014, 12:24:11 AM »
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Done!!!






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« Sent to: gambitv on: August 06, 2014, 12:08:02 AM »
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yea sure ill pay you . so I get screwed and pay double  its okay I am not here for trading.  And I will report you to the admin for blackmail. The emails back and forth is enough. I am not responsible in trying to contact gum "seller".  I already sent him an email he didint respond.  your friend should of taken payment from seller. Why would he give the details first without payment from the seller? ether  your "friend" is stupid or its you. and your trying to pin it on me.   Seems scammy for what I see.  go right ahead leave a false negative comment that you traded with me. I will do the same.

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(No subject)
« Sent to: Jazkal on: August 06, 2014, 12:28:13 AM »
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Find Gumble99! We are also looking for this bastard….



and he is what was left on the account jackal from original owner i believe



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Selling my account
« Sent to: Gumble99 on: July 30, 2014, 05:28:06 PM »
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Hey Gumble99,

I want to sell my account for at least 0.35 BTC. Do you use escrow? Please pm me for more details.
PRIMEDICE   .
   PRIMEDICE 3 COMING 9TH AUGUST:
  Revolutionizing Gambling as you Know it!
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Re: Selling my account
« Sent to: Gumble99 on: July 30, 2014, 06:59:43 PM »
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Hi,

okay, that sounds good.

I want this deal with escrow.ms. Please list my account in your offers.

How long do you think it will take until my account is sold?
PRIMEDICE   .
   PRIMEDICE 3 COMING 9TH AUGUST:
  Revolutionizing Gambling as you Know it!
Jazkal
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Buying Stellars: 0.006 BTC = 5000 Stellars - PM me


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Re: (No subject)
« Sent to: Gumble99 on: August 01, 2014, 10:50:55 PM »
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thats nice, I will trust you:

Password: j4zkal007

Please send bitcoins to  1DnYAd2WzGHyxNzxqmCcGV4CM6QHE2FBti

Don't try to scam please, a negativ trust on this account wouldn't be nice...

For further communication: jazkal@gmx.com

Can I get an admin on here to read this.

They're away for the holidays. Wait till BadBear gets back and PM him, though I don't know what level he'll get involved in if at all.

What a unwise attitude from default trust

There a "bug" on default trust system  :-\
and must be revise immediately

Any solution to this yet? Onewiseguy has followed the rules and shouldn't be penalised. If the original user was really scammed its his fault, as he decided to hand over the account without an escrow or asking for payment first, he had a high trust rating to demand so. Even if he was scammed, he should have negatively marked the account to prevent it from getting sold again.

On the balance, it seems gambitv tried to make double on the same account and this is a case of blackmail and extortion. Yet another example of CanaryInTheMine's liberal trusted list.