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Title: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: usagi on September 24, 2012, 07:01:04 PM closed by Maged.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Atlas on September 24, 2012, 07:04:13 PM I witnessed the above IRC log. I will testify to its honesty.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 24, 2012, 07:11:03 PM Usagi, you have completely lost it. This is borderline sad.
You did the trade, I received the coin and you got the shares. So what are you accusing me of? You told me I have 2 h, I asked you why not do it in minutes. blaa blaa blaa. Are you mad at me for posting the number of shares in your portfolios why you promised to start aggressive buyback? What exactly? EDIT: After reading 4 pages of usagis absurd accusations, I still can not find any evidence of me being a scammer. He thinks that his hysterical rants in IRC are some type of contracts. I personally do not think so. I also posted our chat log of him attempting to get me involve in something I consider disgusting - help usagi to spam the forum and troll his competitors. I told him "NO". He has also loaded the BMF portfolio with questionable investments like DMC, OBSI.HRPT and NYAN. Edit: 29.09.2012 I guess You do not have to read through 7 pages: Maged writes: (edit: emphasis by me) After much back and forth, I feel that I've come to a reasonable decision: EskimoBob will not be getting a scammer tag for this issue, at least from me. There are a few key reasons for this: 1) I feel that there are too many unknown in this case, in both the agreement and in usagi's actions. I cannot support giving someone the scammer tag if I'm not 100% sure. 2) I agree with this judgement: I side with Bob, simply because I find the literal idea of buying silence ... I don't know the words, but I do not like it. With the silence part not being absolutely clear, it's hard to know whether the difference in the market price vs what was offered was just a goodwill concession or not.If that part of the deal was fairly assigned value, then I think he should send that part back and be done with it. The issue with assigning a value to the silence part, would be assuming Bob took it as payment for that in the first place. Would I have been an observer in the live chat, I would have assumed Usagi was overpaying, and doing so to shut Bob up, but not in the literal sense of a scammer tag, more in the line of, "the customer is always right, heres your refund, get out of my store... I have better things to do" you know, like most retail places will "shut you up" should you be unhappy and loud. It is legal (though probably not constitutional) in the USA to pay off for silence (and it's done all of the time), but the contracts to do so are much more detailed and specific than the simple condition expressed in the forum. If you really wanted to buy his silence, you should have drafted a real contract and NDA, properly negotiated the terms, signed and notarized. Again, I agree with this.If you really wanted to stick it to him, you could file in small claims court against him. The likelihood of him showing up is small and you could probably get a default judgement in your favor without ever having to argue the details of the contract. But my recommendation, even though you didn't specifically ask it of me... just write it up to a life lesson, refuse his business in the future and move on. Maged, you made two important questions to EskimoBob and he was not able to answer either. Instead of EskimoBob providing a coherent answer explaining how much the shares should worth if the "absurd demands" were not included, EskimoBob decided to play the victim and write off misleading statements. EskimoBob sold back to Usagi the shares above the market price under certain conditions and now EskimoBob is afraid to return the difference. Thus, EskimoBob is trying to evade your judgement since you have already indicated that EskimoBob was overpaid by Usagi. No, he answered the questions very well, in my opinion.3) It is very clear that usagi has been posting misleading statements. It may not be enough for a scammer tag, but it's pretty damn close. Neither side in this case has been particularly blamless, but I don't feel that anybody has acted in a manner befitting of a scammer tag. I'd like to give my thanks for all of the people who gave their opinions I appologize if this post isn't up to my usual standards in it's explaination, but I was highly distracted while writing it. Rest assured, however, that I was not distracted when I made my decision. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Atlas on September 24, 2012, 07:25:26 PM So... you pay people to stop being mean to you, and you're surprised when it doesn't work? It's contract law. I'm sure this would hold up in court. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 24, 2012, 07:29:24 PM Today in IRC EskimoBob was being an especially annoying jerk to me, he wouldn't stop calling me a liar and a theif nor would he explain why he kept saying that. It eventually came out that it was over 10 shares of BMF which he bought for .52 BTC each losing value 2 or 3 days later. In order to get him to shut up, I offered to buy the shares back from him. he was a total jerk about it and refused to trust me, so Luceo was brought in as arbiter. Everyone on IRC at the time in #bitcoin-assets saw him agree to the terms. He would stop talking shit about me and my companies. You know, going on and on about how I am a liar, thief, scammer, that everything I run is a turd, and in general just being a jerk. People who witnessed this include Obsi, gigavps, luceo, MoneyIsDebt and others. I paid Luceo 2btc for the escrow. Everyone saw him agree to the terms. He was warned and agreed several times over that he would get a scammer tag if he broke his word. Almost immediately he posted some "where there's smoke there's fire" FUD on the "Enough is Enough" thread on the Securities forum. he continued to talk crap about me in IRC behind my back for hours while I was AFK. Now I hear this: <EskimoBob> so we have Diablo-D3 and usagi now jerking each other off? Wow, which one holds the biscuit? Did I understand it correctly, usagi got the asicminer shares form the fool Diablo-D3? <usagi> No <EskimoBob> what a clusterfuck is this going to be... <usagi> I got 4200 shares <usagi> Someone else got 14,500 <usagi> Anyways <EskimoBob> wow, the village idiot got ripped off? That's so sad ... lol <usagi> I'm going to report you as a scammer now <EskimoBob> be my guest asshat usagi <usagi> You were warned to stop talking shit about me <EskimoBob> are you going to blame me for your fuckups? <Doffx> I'm confused how would EskimoBob be a scammer did I miss a post? Well Doffx to answer your question, here's the post. This is very clear cut. Multiple witnesses. BTC involved on an OTC transaction. Ratings entered. Scammer agreed to get tag. I have full logs which will be provided to Theymos upon request. Please do something about this jerkoff. I am not an admin but honestly, I feel he deserves it. There. I've said my peace. Thank you for the opportunity. Here is the log, how all got started: Quote EskimoBob usagi: how did you manage to fuck up the DMC dividends so bad? just few days ago you told me you will have good news < THE QUESTION about 3 min later he knows exactly wtf I am talking about and makes me a offer to buy back BFMEskimoBob not DMC EskimoBob BFM usagi DMC? usagi You mean BMF EskimoBob yes BFM usagi Did you read the letter to shareholders? usagi Did you read the last 2 motions? usagi Cuz they were passed with like 99% usagi I also explained what was going on in the letter to shareholders usagi I wouldn't mind answering questions but there is published disclosure on all of this out there already. EskimoBob i am not talking about the letter. I am talking about you telling me how you have good news blaa blaa blaa and then you sold me some of that shit @assbot [GLBSE] [OBSI.HRPT] 25 @ 0.067 = 1.675 BTC [-] usagi ?????? usagi Not sure what you mean EskimoBob you are liar and a asshole usagi usagi Really... can you provide some context? usagi Stop being a fucktard usagi And explain what the fuck you're on about now, seriously EskimoBob read your own logs you miserable cunt usagi BZZT usagi I'm right here and I'm willing to answer your questions usagi And you're being a dick. usagi 1 eb 0 EskimoBob ? usagi Let's try this again. You ask me a question and I will answer it. (edit: really?) usagi I'm right here. Pitch me your question. (edit: really?) EskimoBob I did ask you a question. usagi But I do not understand what you are talking about. Are you saying I said there would be good news in the shareholder letter? I am not familiar with this$ (edit: really?) usagi You know not everyone is a fking mind reader dude... just a minute (about 5 min of yelling an calling me a scammer, because I called him a liar) Actually he wanted to buy back 100 shares because someone else had listened that same crap and bought shares. One more interesting bit of information. This "I have good news" and share selling was going on while usagi started the "aggressive buy back" Clusterfuck indeed. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 24, 2012, 08:20:23 PM Scammer label for being a jerk?
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x296/SpringLoaded12/commodusthumbsdown.jpg This is not the forum for personal drama. This here is serious business. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: MPOE-PR on September 24, 2012, 08:24:13 PM Lol what sort of immature bullshit is this?
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Luceo on September 24, 2012, 09:06:53 PM To those saying he shouldn't get a scammer label for being a jerk, the fact is that he sold his silence. An integral part of usagi's offer to rebuy these shares at way above market rate was that EskimoBob would stop talking shit about usagi and his businesses.
If EskimoBob didn't agree to those terms, he didn't have to accept the agreement. He sold his silence, and now he's not keeping to that. In essence he has failed to deliver a service he offered. I escrowed the BTC payment for this trade and saw the whole thing go down. EskimoBob agreed to keep quiet about usagi and usagi's companies as an integral part of this agreement, and has continued talking shit, thus is in violation of that contract. I think a scammer tag is warranted. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: El Cabron on September 24, 2012, 09:16:44 PM To those saying he shouldn't get a scammer label for being a jerk, the fact is that he sold his silence. An integral part of usagi's offer to rebuy these shares at way above market rate was that EskimoBob would stop talking shit about usagi and his businesses. If EskimoBob didn't agree to those terms, he didn't have to accept the agreement. He sold his silence, and now he's not keeping to that. In essence he has failed to deliver a service he offered. I escrowed the BTC payment for this trade and saw the whole thing go down. EskimoBob agreed to keep quiet about usagi and usagi's companies as an integral part of this agreement, and has continued talking shit, thus is in violation of that contract. I think a scammer tag is warranted. Oh, well that makes it at least interesting. Thanks for letting us know what was going on. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Akka on September 24, 2012, 09:17:43 PM LOL.
If this continues with that speed 50% of the forum members will be labelled scammers within the next 3 Month. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 24, 2012, 09:19:29 PM I'm not seeing a contract...
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 24, 2012, 09:40:19 PM LOL. If this continues with that speed 50% of the forum members will be labelled scammers within the next 3 Month. Akka, you're a ruddy git. Give me 10 btc or I'll... call you a ruddy git again. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 24, 2012, 09:47:13 PM I'm not seeing a contract... To be fair that is not really valid. Many people have been marked scammers when no contracts were involved. I'm not saying he should get a tag or not, but cuz of no contract is well kinda lame. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 24, 2012, 10:04:39 PM All I know is that I have not scammed him nor anyone else. Yes, Usagi scammed me, when he told me lies to sell me some of the shares.
I have no idea what is the contract my delusional friend Usagi is speaking about. But... can I have some of that stuff you guys are smoking? Sounds like a lot of fun. LOL BTW, usagi got really mad at me because I posted this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110350.msg1204234#msg1204234 ...contract you can really smoke ;) Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 24, 2012, 11:20:06 PM All I know is that I have not scammed him nor anyone else. Yes, Usagi scammed me, when he told me lies to sell me some of the shares. I have no idea what is the contract my delusional friend Usagi is speaking about. But... can I have some of that stuff you guys are smoking? Sounds like a lot of fun. LOL BTW, usagi got really mad at me because I posted this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110350.msg1204234#msg1204234 ...contract you can really smoke ;) You two need to get a room. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: repentance on September 25, 2012, 12:32:26 AM Nobody else's comments could possibly damage usagi's credibility and "reputation" as much as his own.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 02:44:04 PM I was waiting for this. A contract will now be provided in the form of an abridged & annotated IRC log, and a full IRC log. Let's move this along, thanks Maged. Everyone who was there is a witness. (Edit: Luceo spoke up here on the forums, gigavps and Diablo (who is also a forum mod) was there and saw everything and understood what the deal was about.) I don't see a breach of contract. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: guruvan on September 25, 2012, 02:47:52 PM Nobody else's comments could possibly damage usagi's credibility and "reputation" as much as his own. Oh yeah. this for sure. "reputation" reputation as con-artist and shell game operator? lol. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 02:48:11 PM Breach would be if he did not STFU? That should be easy to prove right? That isn't breach, anyone who thinks that he needs to STFU is very silly. Read the constitution, contracts cannot supersede any law. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 02:55:42 PM Just read the constitution (I assume you mean of Thailand cuz that is where I am) and I don't see what you are talking about... Section 29: Restriction of such rights and liberties as recognized by the Constitution shall not be imposed on a person except by virtue of provisions of the law which must not affect the essential substances of such rights and liberties. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 03:00:29 PM Just read the constitution (I assume you mean of Thailand cuz that is where I am) and I don't see what you are talking about... Section 29: Restriction of such rights and liberties as recognized by the Constitution shall not be imposed on a person except by virtue of provisions of the law which must not affect the essential substances of such rights and liberties. Nope... mine does not have that... Yes it does. Don't be silly Goat, you would have to learn by now that I am very well versed in such things. I quoted your constitution. http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Thailand_(2007)/Chapter_3 Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: greyhawk on September 25, 2012, 03:04:43 PM I thought that was just about being rude to the king?
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: greyhawk on September 25, 2012, 03:10:06 PM I thought that was just about being rude to the king? Pretty good rule of thumb, not a good idea to be rude to a King anywhere :) Well, being rude worked for the French and the Russians at least. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 25, 2012, 03:15:58 PM Usagi, if you really like to talk about contracts, go and take a look at your NYAN.A and B fk ups like investing in pirate-like crap called OBSI.HRPT.
You really like to talk about how much a contract (not some silly chat in IRC) is worth for you? Crawl back to your BS business ventures and start reading your own contracts. LOL Usagi, consider your imaginary contract invalid. You owe me a public apology Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 03:26:49 PM Thank you for providing direct proof that you violated your end of the contract. Note to vamp & others: No one said he was not free to talk; only that he agreed he'd get a scammer tag if he did. This is pretty cut and dried; he agreed seven times, there were multiple witnesses, escrow was requested by EskimoBob and I paid for the escrow. My suggested terms (to Maged) for the removal of the scammer tag is 5.3btc (the value of the transaction) + 2btc (the escrow fee) returned to me by EskimoBob. It doesn't matter what he agreed to. He cannot to agree to something that violates his basic rights (i.e. constitution). Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: deeplink on September 25, 2012, 03:35:45 PM Usagi, even if EskimoBob agreed to a contract with you to shut him up, which I am not saying he did, it only shows how dumb you are:
You cannot enforce a contract that violates the constitution of every free country in the world. Also, this forum should be about free speech and it should be kept that way. If you want to play dictator, go back to your great venture scams and go on playing your investors. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: BadBear on September 25, 2012, 04:20:30 PM Sorry but this is ridiculous and I'm against it. I'm not going to censor someone or scammer tag them just for expressing their right to free speech, no matter what games you play on IRC.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 25, 2012, 04:21:10 PM People aren't correct about the law. You can have a contract for silence, one example of which would be a non-disclosure agreement. You are mixing up the restriction of criminal law versus the voluntary restriction of civil law. You cannot be jailed for speaking out, but you are subject to damages due to breech of contract.
By all accounts above, EskimoBob did agree that he would stop commenting against usagi and transfer some shares for the consideration of 5.3 bitcoins. However, in this case I don't feel a scammer tag is appropriate. Contrary to popular belief, a breech in part of the contract does not dissolve the entire contract, and you can only seek direct remedies on the part of the contract that was in breech. From the pasted text, usagi valued the stock at .53 btc each and there were 10 shares. This means usagi valued the silence at 0 btc, and I'm satisfied that this has been repaid. In the future, if you are going to do this, then I suggest giving specific consideration for the silence portion of the contract. Most courts will not uphold any contract portion that does not have consideration. However, it could be seen (assuming you upheld a 0 consideration clause) that by contract usagi is entitled to sue EskimoBob for actual damages as a result of his statements. I think damages will be hard to prove though, because no one listens to what EskimoBob has to say anyway. See http://www.publishlawyer.com/contract.htm for a basic primer and look at the part about mutuality. My source is I was formerly married to a law student and she drove me crazy with contract law. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: exahash on September 25, 2012, 04:23:35 PM I feel compelled to contribute a little factual information to this conversation...
Non-disparagement is a fairly standard clause in many contracts in the US. Such clauses are especially common in stock/option sales contracts in which a stockholder, member, or partner is selling their interest in a business back to the company or to another partner. I've personally seen, signed, and/or paid for "lawyering" of a number of contracts with such terms, though never breached one. I'm not saying usagi and EskimoBob's contract is completely legit, in fact I have no opinion either way, and IANAL. I'm just saying that you can agree in a contract not to say bad things about someone, and if you do subsequently say bad things about them, then you are in breach of that agreement. Edit: Looks like Fjordbit was a little faster than me. :) He's also correct. Google "Non-disparagement clause" if you'd like to learn more. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 25, 2012, 06:15:46 PM Let me introduce you to a real Usagi, guy who looks for people to attack other securities
IRC 2012.09.25 Quote EskimoBob usagi: do you recall when you asked me to help you set up 20 sock puppet accounts and help you to find flaws in other securities? guruvan- that will come usagi EskimoBob you even wanted to pay me and I told you NO! usagi Nope. EskimoBob do you want me to post the log? guruvan- oh lolz usagi You THINK it will come, guruvan. Mayube you even want it to come. But it won't EskimoBob trust me, you do not want that guruvan- aw...c'mon EskimoBob usagi EskimoBob go ahead. You're a scammer. You lie about my companies and me, I am not suprised you would sink to making up fake logs guruvan- I'd love to see more scammy bullshit today usagi Post em right now, let me see :) EskimoBob LOL usagi usagi Come on EB usagi Post the logs. right now. EskimoBob really? usagi What's that.. no logs? EskimoBob are you sure? And this is what I posted to show what a scumbag Usagi actually is: Code: 2012-08-05 16:29:46 usagi We need someone to go attack competitors on bitcointalk.org Code: 2012-08-05 16:31:05 EskimoBob hand over your list of targets and what is in it for me ? So, your honest Usagi is actually a scumbag who is willing to pay for users to troll hes competition, while he wastes your hard earned coin on questionable "investments" Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: greyhawk on September 25, 2012, 06:41:22 PM Quote 0.1 per post is probably doable, maybe 0.2 Whoa, I'm being severely underpaid. :o Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 07:24:15 PM People aren't correct about the law. You can have a contract for silence, one example of which would be a non-disclosure agreement. You are mixing up the restriction of criminal law versus the voluntary restriction of civil law. You cannot be jailed for speaking out, but you are subject to damages due to breech of contract. You're mixing a lot of things. You CANNOT suppress opinions. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 25, 2012, 07:43:22 PM People aren't correct about the law. You can have a contract for silence, one example of which would be a non-disclosure agreement. You are mixing up the restriction of criminal law versus the voluntary restriction of civil law. You cannot be jailed for speaking out, but you are subject to damages due to breech of contract. You're mixing a lot of things. You CANNOT suppress opinions. Yes I can if you willingly agree to it. If I enter into a contract with you and pay you $10,000 to not express your opinion, and then you do express your opinion, I can sue you for damages that fall out as a result of the breech of contract, even if your opinions are truthful. If you don't enter into this contract, and you were to express those opinions, and those opinions were truthful, then I would have no recourse. I fyou express those opinions and those opinions are willfully false, then I do have recourse. The first amendment does not have anything to do with civil law. The first amendment a restriction on government enacting criminal laws against freedom of speech. It doesn't allow slander or libel or for people to breech contracts. Let me introduce you to a real Usagi, guy who looks for people to attack other securities Bob, no one cares. Stop wasting your time. This was literally all I read of that pastebin you call a comment. Go talk to a friend about it. We don't want your drama. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 07:57:38 PM Yes I can if you willingly agree to it. If I enter into a contract with you and pay you $10,000 to not express your opinion, and then you do express your opinion, I can sue you for damages that fall out as a result of the breech of contract, even if your opinions are truthful. If you don't enter into this contract, and you were to express those opinions, and those opinions were truthful, then I would have no recourse. I fyou express those opinions and those opinions are willfully false, then I do have recourse. The first amendment does not have anything to do with civil law. The first amendment a restriction on government enacting criminal laws against freedom of speech. It doesn't allow slander or libel or for people to breech contracts. Really. You don't know what you're talking about. The first amendment is ABOUT everything, there are very few exceptions to it. And a lot of NDAs are found illegal. BTW point me out where the NDA was signed, I am somewhat blind to see one. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 25, 2012, 08:11:14 PM Really. You don't know what you're talking about. The first amendment is ABOUT everything, there are very few exceptions to it. And a lot of NDAs are found illegal. BTW point me out where the NDA was signed, I am somewhat blind to see one. I don't know what country you're from, but here in America, we have soldiers rotting in jail for speaking the truth (http://www.bradleymanning.org/), televisions personalities sued by the beef industry for speaking her truthful opinion (http://www.prwatch.org/prwissues/1998Q1/oprah.html), and countless cases of agreements to alter speech to be civilly binding. I don't know where you're getting your information from, but I would check that source again. NDA was an example, a contract clause with no consideration was formed. I personally think it's thin because there was no consideration, but if it is allowable, it would allow usagi to sue for actual damages caused by the statements, even if the statements were truthful because he made a contract to now say them. However, that's one for the courts, and not worth of a scammer tag. Scammer tags are for people who misrepresent their willingness or ability to deliver a scarce good (e.g. a video card or a bitcoin) in order to gain control of another scarce good. This doesn't look anything like that. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 08:18:49 PM I don't know what country you're from, but here in America, we have soldiers rotting in jail for speaking the truth (http://www.bradleymanning.org/), televisions personalities sued by the beef industry for speaking her truthful opinion (http://www.prwatch.org/prwissues/1998Q1/oprah.html), and countless cases of agreements to alter speech to be civilly binding. I don't know where you're getting your information from, but I would check that source again. NDA was an example, a contract clause with no consideration was formed. I personally think it's thin because there was no consideration, but if it is allowable, it would allow usagi to sue for actual damages caused by the statements, even if the statements were truthful because he made a contract to now say them. However, that's one for the courts, and not worth of a scammer tag. Scammer tags are for people who misrepresent their willingness or ability to deliver a scarce good (e.g. a video card or a bitcoin) in order to gain control of another scarce good. This doesn't look anything like that. Bradley Manning wasn't expressing his opinion. Oprah won the lawsuit, and it was about libel. Let me remind people: Vampire is always right :-) Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 25, 2012, 08:29:15 PM Bradley Manning wasn't expressing his opinion. Oprah won the lawsuit, and it was about libel. Neither of those two statements contradicts what I said, and I notice the strategic dodge of the third. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 08:31:04 PM Neither of those two statements contradicts what I said, and I notice the strategic dodge of the third. What's the third? I think I covered it already. Really. You don't know what you're talking about. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 25, 2012, 08:33:16 PM Bob, no one cares. Stop wasting your time. This was literally all I read of that pastebin you call a comment. Go talk to a friend about it. We don't want your drama. Did I start this BS thread? No, I did not. Is this farce any way to related to anything you can actually call a contract? No, it is not. I still have not seen any proof of me being a scammer or a liar. I have not seen any proof of me cheating usagi or anyone in this forum. Show me a fkn post in this forum where I lie about the situation in any of his investment portfolios. Actually, show me a forum post where I lie or try to scam someone. PS! Usagi, fuck you for dragging me in to your neurotic shitstorm. I know you hate when someone starts to see the truth about your fucked up investment happenings. I am not the only one who can add and subtract. This is all it takes to see what you have done with your investors money (including my coin). I like to see it all turn around but... Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 25, 2012, 09:03:56 PM Bob, no one cares. Stop wasting your time. This was literally all I read of that pastebin you call a comment. Go talk to a friend about it. We don't want your drama. Did I start this BS thread? No, I did not. Is this farce any way to related to anything you can actually call a contract? No, it is not. I still have not seen any proof of me being a scammer or a liar. I have not seen any proof of me cheating usagi or anyone in this forum. In case you missed it, I'm already defending you against that (no consideration, no contract), but really your responses are a bit over the top and irrelevant. Sure defend yourself on what usagi's saying, but I don't see the point in trying to "expose" zher. It just looks ranty. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 09:05:33 PM In case you missed it, I'm already defending you against that (no consideration, no contract), but really your responses are a bit over the top and irrelevant. Sure defend yourself on what usagi's saying, but I don't see the point in trying to "expose" zher. It just looks ranty. It's possible. I am not a god. Though for you, I am a god.. Pray to me or I'll bite you ;-) Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 25, 2012, 11:39:17 PM Several people who were in the channel agree. Several people don't. However you agreed to the terms and then you fragrantly broke them. Channel? huh. Wake up. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: CJGoodings on September 26, 2012, 02:39:48 AM Several people who were in the channel agree. Several people don't. However you agreed to the terms and then you fragrantly broke them. Channel? huh. Wake up. I think hes mentioning IRC. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 26, 2012, 02:49:13 AM This is a very interesting case, indeed. Thus, I'll split my post into two parts: One regarding this individual agreement on its own, and the other based on a broader view of things.
Part one: Unless there is any objection to the log that was posted, it seems pretty clear that the original agreement should be considered void. Fjordbit has a good point, however, in that the silence portion should have its own value. Thus I would like to see one of the two following outcomes: 1) EskimoBob refunds 5.3 BTC and the shares are returned to him. No, he will not need to pay the original escrow fee. The reason he should not have to pay the escrow fee is because usagi agreed to pay the fee himself, instead of asking EskimoBob to split the fee with him or at least including the escrow fee as a penalty should the agreement be broken. Additionally, the escrow failed to follow the agreement all the way through by releasing the funds immediately instead of waiting an agreed upon amount of time to ensure that the agreement was kept by BOTH parties. This is besides the fact that it is not legal to indefinitely buy someone's silence. However, I think that we can all agree that EskimoBob did not stay silent long enough to be considered reasonable by anyone's standards. 2) EskimoBob refunds the difference between the market value of those shares at the time of the agreement and the value he sold them to usagi for (.53 BTC/share) and usagi provides nothing in return (other than the satisfaction that the agreement was successfully unwound). It's safe to assume that this difference was the agreed upon value of silence for EskimoBob. Part two: Here's where things get interesting. It is board policy that, in order to help scammer investigations, NDA's and other such agreements will not be honored for the purpose of the scammer tag when the agreements are broken in order to reveal a scam. Interestingly enough, this seems like it might be the case. I will absolutely need to do more reading into this. If anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. There's also the matter of where the funds used to pay EskimoBob came from. Did they come from a business that was in default? If so, that automatically makes usagi a scammer, placing EskimoBob off the hook. For these reasons, it will most likely take a few weeks to decide this case. If EskimoBob wants to make it easy on me, he can simply do one of the two options I laid out in part one. As always, the scammer tag decision does not have anything to do with the actual legal system, so keep that in mind when deciding what to do. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: macboy80 on September 26, 2012, 03:43:43 AM This is a very interesting case, indeed. Thus, I'll split my post into two parts: One regarding this individual agreement on its own, and the other based on a broader view of things. Part one: Unless there is any objection to the log that was posted, it seems pretty clear that the original agreement should be considered void. Fjordbit has a good point, however, in that the silence portion should have its own value. Thus I would like to see one of the two following outcomes: 1) EskimoBob refunds 5.3 BTC and the shares are returned to him. No, he will not need to pay the original escrow fee. The reason he should not have to pay the escrow fee is because usagi agreed to pay the fee himself, instead of asking EskimoBob to split the fee with him or at least including the escrow fee as a penalty should the agreement be broken. Additionally, the escrow failed to follow the agreement all the way through by releasing the funds immediately instead of waiting an agreed upon amount of time to ensure that the agreement was kept by BOTH parties. This is besides the fact that it is not legal to indefinitely buy someone's silence. However, I think that we can all agree that EskimoBob did not stay silent long enough to be considered reasonable by anyone's standards. 2) EskimoBob refunds the difference between the market value of those shares at the time of the agreement and the value he sold them to usagi for (.53 BTC/share) and usagi provides nothing in return (other than the satisfaction that the agreement was successfully unwound). It's safe to assume that this difference was the agreed upon value of silence for EskimoBob. Part two: Here's where things get interesting. It is board policy that, in order to help scammer investigations, NDA's and other such agreements will not be honored for the purpose of the scammer tag when the agreements are broken in order to reveal a scam. Interestingly enough, this seems like it might be the case. I will absolutely need to do more reading into this. If anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. There's also the matter of where the funds used to pay EskimoBob came from. Did they come from a business that was in default? If so, that automatically makes usagi a scammer, placing EskimoBob off the hook. For these reasons, it will most likely take a few weeks to decide this case. If EskimoBob wants to make it easy on me, he can simply do one of the two options I laid out in part one. As always, the scammer tag decision does not have anything to do with the actual legal system, so keep that in mind when deciding what to do. Well said! I think this is a fair outcome for everyone involved. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 08:57:26 AM This is a very interesting case, indeed. Thus, I'll split my post into two parts: One regarding this individual agreement on its own, and the other based on a broader view of things. Part one: Unless there is any objection to the log that was posted, it seems pretty clear that the original agreement should be considered void. Fjordbit has a good point, however, in that the silence portion should have its own value. Thus I would like to see one of the two following outcomes: 1) EskimoBob refunds 5.3 BTC and the shares are returned to him. No, he will not need to pay the original escrow fee. The reason he should not have to pay the escrow fee is because usagi agreed to pay the fee himself, instead of asking EskimoBob to split the fee with him or at least including the escrow fee as a penalty should the agreement be broken. Additionally, the escrow failed to follow the agreement all the way through by releasing the funds immediately instead of waiting an agreed upon amount of time to ensure that the agreement was kept by BOTH parties. This is besides the fact that it is not legal to indefinitely buy someone's silence. However, I think that we can all agree that EskimoBob did not stay silent long enough to be considered reasonable by anyone's standards. 2) EskimoBob refunds the difference between the market value of those shares at the time of the agreement and the value he sold them to usagi for (.53 BTC/share) and usagi provides nothing in return (other than the satisfaction that the agreement was successfully unwound). It's safe to assume that this difference was the agreed upon value of silence for EskimoBob. Part two: Here's where things get interesting. It is board policy that, in order to help scammer investigations, NDA's and other such agreements will not be honored for the purpose of the scammer tag when the agreements are broken in order to reveal a scam. Interestingly enough, this seems like it might be the case. I will absolutely need to do more reading into this. If anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. There's also the matter of where the funds used to pay EskimoBob came from. Did they come from a business that was in default? If so, that automatically makes usagi a scammer, placing EskimoBob off the hook. For these reasons, it will most likely take a few weeks to decide this case. If EskimoBob wants to make it easy on me, he can simply do one of the two options I laid out in part one. As always, the scammer tag decision does not have anything to do with the actual legal system, so keep that in mind when deciding what to do. Code:
Prices are from today, list of investments is from 20.09.2012 (at least this is the date on his page http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/) BMF contract: Quote 5. The fund is mandated to only invest in bitcoin mining companies listed on the GLBSE and to perform due diligence when investing in securities on the GLBSE. I also have a screenshot and those holdings are reported earlier in the forum post. I recommend reading complaints after the post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112734.msg1219645#msg1219645 So, who is scamming who? Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. I am not the only one here, who has shown what he has actually done with the investors coin. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 09:01:30 AM Thank you and I accept. Here is my response; 1. If EskimoBob returns the 5.3 BTC I will give him the 10 shares. 2. If EskimoBob refunds the difference (about 1 BTC at today's price) I will accept it. 3. I am willing to give you a signed statement from Nefario (if I can get one) on the holdings of BMF. BMF is not in default. 4. Please see this motion which authorizes me to invest up to 10% of BMF in non-mining assets. This motion was passed 3235 to 5 and is valid until Jan 1st, 2013. 5. I am willing to run a shareholder motion on whether or not my shareholders in BMF are satisfied. People like EskimoBob have no right to make up facts and figures. They're not shareholders. The entire point of this thread, Maged, is that people like Eskimobob are complete and total jerkoffs who are truly ruining it for people who are trying to operate an honest business. Personally I do not want to make it easy on EskimoBob. This has now gone far above and beyond a simple scammer tag. He has now insinuated that he is being paid to discredit me on the forums, and his posting style is, I believe similar to Puppet, who incidentally registered on the forums shortly after EskimoBob was approached to make posts on the forum discrediting people. I am sick of this. I will work with you and provide any information you want. I do not want this to be resolved by the simple payment of 1 btc from EskimoBob to myself. It is my position that the fact you are stating that he can return the approximately one BTC difference implies that the silence part did in fact have a value attached. I do not think it is fair to say that no value was stated, and then to assign a value solely for the purposes of refunding the money. But if that is your judgement I will accept it. Thank you. Get the logs and prove me puppet or whom ever you think it is me. My level of English is way too low to write like any of those guys. YOU, Usagi are the one who offered me this disgusting "job" and I told you NO! Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 10:31:42 AM Usagi, calm down. You act like a hysterical troll.
Those are "last price" from GLBSE and I had no reason to edit the numbers. I only posted that part of the portfolio, what was relevant to Maged post. You and I know you fucked up. Other investors are pissed off too. So, stop trolling and blaming me for your screwups and take the responsibility for your own actions. I quoted the contract from your own web page and I there is no reference to any "motion" that is passed or not passed. Your contract is called "Full Contract". I guess it's another small half truth of yours, similar to calling your own hysterical rants in IRC a contract. Maged, here is my account 1CvZLqdL5qpiE1wt9BLGC75yfV9Sg69WTj he transfered the via 3'rd party. I have no idea, did he use his or BMF's account for this. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: VeeMiner on September 26, 2012, 10:37:27 AM Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: MPOE-PR on September 26, 2012, 11:27:33 AM Also this ridiculous "job offer" is probably something mircea asked you to do. Notice the dates everyone -- right after EskimoBob got this "job offer" numerous sock puppet accounts such as puppet and deprived started following me around on the forums. Fucking mircea popescu. Sics his MPOE-PR agent on me too. Get a life people. http://lounge.moviecodec.com/images/attachment/darth-vader-vs-darth-reven-vs-darth-nihilus-153.jpg Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 11:32:21 AM I like to ask forum moderator to rename the this form thread to: "Usagi is a scammer, witness reports inside", close the thread and tag Usagi as a scammer.
I never planned to tag you Usagi, even after all this bull shit. Now, you left me no choice. Are you happy now? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Bitcoin Oz on September 26, 2012, 12:28:34 PM Days of our bitcoin lives.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 26, 2012, 01:24:53 PM f anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. Let me help; here is the contract: https://glbse.com/asset/view/BMF Here is BMFs portfolio: http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/ Note that obsi.hrpt has nothing to do with mining, and its hard to defend Nyan being a mining asset. One could even point out the contract doesnt allow for usagi to buy mining hardware. Now personally, I wouldnt give someone a scammer tag over something like this. However, if you are looking for a better reason, I would suggest you look at this post: Quote The NAV of BMF is approximately 0.50. We will be placing aggressive bids at .45 to .50. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112734.0Those are demonstrably lies. First of all, the highest bid is currently 0.4104. Secondly, if you calculate the NAV using usagi's published asset list here: http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/ After you correct the prices and you list the fpga and asics at actual list value and not 20% above BFLs listprice, I got to 0.262 BTC per share at the time it was posted: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112734.msg1219660#msg1219660 Meanwhile he has been buying up some of those shares causing the nav to rise to ~0.3, but it was never anywhere near 0.5 BTC and saying that was a big fat lie intended solely to mislead potential investors, and talk the price up because his Nyan bonds are heavily invested in BMF and in big trouble. I suspect the wannabee lawyers here will have an opinion on whether or not thats even criminal. FWIW, here is an up to date NAV: Code: Units Value (Market) Total (Market) % 1334 BTC worth of assets (even assuming obsi's ponzi is worth face value, its not like you can sell it) for 4585 bonds. Thats 0.29 BTC/bond Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 02:25:41 PM From 2012-09-25 in #bitcoin-assets
Code: .... Really? Even After I told you that Obsi is getting ready to drop the ball? Oh sorry, I forgot that from your IRC rant: Code:
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 26, 2012, 03:57:00 PM Part two: Here's where things get interesting. It is board policy that, in order to help scammer investigations, NDA's and other such agreements will not be honored for the purpose of the scammer tag when the agreements are broken in order to reveal a scam. Interestingly enough, this seems like it might be the case. I will absolutely need to do more reading into this. If anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. So BMF hold these non-mining shares: 1000 OBSI.HRPT 24 NYAN http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/ Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 05:26:58 PM Part two: Here's where things get interesting. It is board policy that, in order to help scammer investigations, NDA's and other such agreements will not be honored for the purpose of the scammer tag when the agreements are broken in order to reveal a scam. Interestingly enough, this seems like it might be the case. I will absolutely need to do more reading into this. If anybody can help shed some light on the issue of usagi allegedly investing BMF funds into non-mining operations, I would appreciate that. So BMF hold these non-mining shares: 1000 OBSI.HRPT 24 NYAN http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/ Why bother trying? Maged is not stupid, he can read, and he will read the post where this was approved by shareholders. As for the other accusations it's kind of obvious EskimoBob was actually approached by someone else considering the number of trolls that have been sic'd on this thread (and others) recently. Only someone as underhanded as eskimobob would try so hard to change the subject away from what this is really all about. And it looks like EB will have to refund the money and/or buy back the shares or he WILL get a scammer tag -- according to Maged. I am very happy to see that justice will be done here. Usagi, stop lying. You know that we had this conversation and you offered me that stupid troll job of yours to help you spam your competition. You also know, I told you No! I remembered another related conversation where you actually acknowledged our conversation: This was happening 2012-09-08 around noon UTC: Quote Chaang-Noi okay since i dont know anything im going to have a beer and smoke a cuban, best of luck with selling your secret info usagi EskimoBob usagi: For start I thought you are cool dude but after this priv chat we had and you offered ..., I am having really hard time trusting you. * usagi points out this is now the fourth time goat has been told that I don't have any info to sell and wouldn't sell it anyway :) mircea_popescu cigars and beer ? get out of the sticks. DeaDTerra YOU DON'T KNOW NOTHING MAN, YOUR A GOAT AND I AM SAILOR MOON. seriously guys go get a room, I am running out of funny comments here usagi EskimoBob I'm sorry Chaang-Noi <usagi> I'll sell you the info EskimoBob and this shit you have pulled today with "i have info but I can not tell" is childish and no wonder Chaang-Noi is crawling up your ares because of that :) EskimoBob bad time for jokes like that Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: finkleshnorts on September 26, 2012, 05:53:15 PM Nobody cares about scammer tags. Give this bob a scammer tag if it makes you feel better. There is nothing going on in this forum right now besides "scammer tag scammer tag theymos maged im angry" and it's getting really, really freaking old.
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Akka on September 26, 2012, 05:59:05 PM Nobody cares about scammer tags. Give this bob a scammer tag if it makes you feel better. There is nothing going on in this forum right now besides "scammer tag scammer tag theymos maged im angry" and it's getting really, really freaking old. +1 This scammer accusations are getting ridiculous. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 26, 2012, 06:18:00 PM Im guessing thats why usagi is doing it.
First it deflects from the much more important issues regarding his assets, as relevant posts with serious concerns and revealing numbers quickly get buried under these juvenile "liar - troll - scammer" discussions that no one cares about. And judging by BMF, Nyan.B and Nyan.C trades on GLSBE, that actually works. Secondly I imagine it also helps devalue the seriousness of a scammer tag or accusation for the day someone decides usagi's accounting is more than just "creative". Now you may say no one cares about these tags, but I only partially agree. It doesnt really matter if someone like pirate gets it after the fact, but it does matter for someone who still actively soliciting funds and/or running assets on GLBSE or elsewhere. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: finkleshnorts on September 26, 2012, 06:53:47 PM This isn't a court of public opinion. This isn't a court at all. This is a hobbyist internet forum specifically for the purpose of public opinion. Why are you always lobbying to have people banned? You have been doing that for as long as I can remember. No one ever listens to your unproductive whining, you silly silly goose. I'm not sure what you deem relevant, but that fact that you post here, and presumably read here, tends to point toward the fact that your comments are indeed relevant. You're worse than MPORXE or whatever the hell that vampire lady calls herself. You are constantly bullied around on this forum and your posts are nothing but whine. Please sprout a backbone or at least let your business speak for itself. If you're trying to employ people to smear your competitors, then I'm not sure you really have much going for you either way. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: greyhawk on September 26, 2012, 07:25:55 PM This isn't a court of public opinion. This isn't a court at all. This is a hobbyist internet forum This. Furthermore it is not IRC. Can you people not resolve your IRC drama on IRC? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Fjordbit on September 26, 2012, 07:48:27 PM This. Furthermore it is not IRC. Can you people not resolve your IRC drama on IRC? +1 Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 26, 2012, 07:50:33 PM This isn't a court of public opinion. This isn't a court at all. This is a hobbyist internet forum This. Furthermore it is not IRC. Can you people not resolve your IRC drama on IRC? Yea, let them figure out with OTC ratings. Maged: why are you trying to resolve a situation that happened on IRC? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 08:46:17 PM This isn't a court of public opinion. This isn't a court at all. This is a hobbyist internet forum This. Furthermore it is not IRC. Can you people not resolve your IRC drama on IRC? Yea, let them figure out with OTC ratings. Maged: why are you trying to resolve a situation that happened on IRC? Is OTC rating worth anything from a scammer like Usagi? After he bought back the crap he sold me, he and Luceo rated me: Code: 2012-09-24 13:43:24 usagi ;;rate EskimoBob 1 Keeps his word in a deal but you have to be patient with him because he likes to talk a lot of shit first. I guess this OTC system is just a joke for usagi and likes. Then he changed it to Code: 2012-09-24 18:51:24 -2 broke his word on a contract. untrustworthy and a bit of a jerk. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 26, 2012, 08:58:56 PM now this asshole usagi is using OTC rating and hes warped understanding of what is going on here:
read this: Code: usagi | https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112443.msg1221425#msg1221425 Relevant Quote: "1) EskimoBob refunds 5.3 BTC and the and Code:
Why is this lunatic allowed to abuse OTC and this forum like that? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 27, 2012, 12:39:18 AM Maged: Please include a sunset clause on any action EskimoBob should take. He has told me in IRC he will not refund any money. A sunset clause would put the final nail in the coffin of a scammer tag for EskimoBob. Thank you. Absolutely. As of this moment, however, the suggested actions are still just a recommendation until I've fully evaluated this.Thank you and I accept. Here is my response; Thanks! Agreeing to these recommendations is a start to getting this issue resolved.1. If EskimoBob returns the 5.3 BTC I will give him the 10 shares. 2. If EskimoBob refunds the difference (about 1 BTC at today's price) I will accept it. Going through the historic data, 1.1 BTC looks to be the correct amount.3. I am willing to give you a signed statement from Nefario (if I can get one) on the holdings of BMF. BMF is not in default. What would Nefario know that isn't already public?4. Please see this motion which authorizes me to invest up to 10% of BMF in non-mining assets. This motion was passed 3235 to 5 and is valid until Jan 1st, 2013. Thanks. I do admit that it is a little hidden, however. I'd like to see some more opinions from people on what that might mean for this case.5. I am willing to run a shareholder motion on whether or not my shareholders in BMF are satisfied. People like EskimoBob have no right to make up facts and figures. They're not shareholders. No, that's fine.The entire point of this thread, Maged, is that people like Eskimobob are complete and total jerkoffs who are truly ruining it for people who are trying to operate an honest business. In many ways I agree. However, they do serve a purpose in keeping the community on their toes.It is my position that the fact you are stating that he can return the approximately one BTC difference implies that the silence part did in fact have a value attached. I do not think it is fair to say that no value was stated, and then to assign a value solely for the purposes of refunding the money. But if that is your judgement I will accept it. Thank you. Keep in mind what my options on this decision were:1) Consider the silence to be worth 1.1 BTC, the difference between the market value at the time and your offer. 2) Since the silence was never given a value, it has zero value and you just overpaid him for the shares. I really didn't feel that option 2 was fair, so option 1 is a good compromise. I like to ask forum moderator to rename the this form thread to: "Usagi is a scammer, witness reports inside", close the thread and tag Usagi as a scammer. Sorry, but the scammer investigation on usagi started with my previous message since it is needed in order to decide on your case. Your message here means absolutely nothing.I never planned to tag you Usagi, even after all this bull shit. Now, you left me no choice. Are you happy now? However, if you are looking for a better reason, I would suggest you look at this post: Very interesting. usagi, what's your response to this?Quote The NAV of BMF is approximately 0.50. We will be placing aggressive bids at .45 to .50. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112734.0Those are demonstrably lies. First of all, the highest bid is currently 0.4104. Nobody cares about scammer tags. Give this bob a scammer tag if it makes you feel better. There is nothing going on in this forum right now besides "scammer tag scammer tag theymos maged im angry" and it's getting really, really freaking old. I'm well aware of this fact. That's why we do everything we can to resolve issues peacefully. In fact, I don't even really investigate cases that either don't involve high-profile people or aren't likely to see a resolution anymore.Maged: why are you trying to resolve a situation that happened on IRC? Because it involves people who use this forum. If someone from IRC is already mediating this dispute, let me know.usagi | ;;rate EskimoBob -4 broke a contract, refused to honor forum mod judgement usagi, no judgement has yet been made. However, I feel like I'm getting close to a decision.Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 12:47:39 AM Maged: why are you trying to resolve a situation that happened on IRC? Because it involves people who use this forum. If someone from IRC is already mediating this dispute, let me know.Fair enough. I just feel that you have better things to do. But that's your call. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 27, 2012, 12:51:50 AM Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. This seems like a valid concern. Could you elaborate on why you feel like usagi should have bought back your BMF shares above market value? Also, what value per share, exactly, do you think you deserved to be offered if these "absurd demands" weren't included?Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 27, 2012, 07:37:29 AM Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. This seems like a valid concern. Could you elaborate on why you feel like usagi should have bought back your BMF shares above market value? Also, what value per share, exactly, do you think you deserved to be offered if these "absurd demands" weren't included?I actually never asked him to sell me the shares back. He made that offer to me, after I told him I am not happy with the current situation and he sold me the shares under the false representation of current situation in BMF. If you read the log, I never really agreed to any of his rantings freely. He never mentioned, that his yelling of STFU, mixed with insults is some type of a contract. All I wanted now (because he made a unexpected offer) is get out of this crap called BMF and get my coin back. When he started counting seconds, I asked, "do I need to repeat that Yes?". I had lost all the trust I in this scumbag and a liar, who has obvious memory problems (selective memory?). I wanted to sell my shares back to him and that is what my Yes stands for - Yes, I am transferring you the shares. Nothing less, nothing more. I do not see contract here. I see just another rant of his, where he calls me with names and adds his "shut the fuck up..." or else. I do not sell my silence, my support to some bullshit, I do not write my opinions about incompetent "portfolio managers" for coin and so on. Usagi has lied in this thread multiple times. He even used your name to squeeze me for coin yesterday (see the log) and if this did not work out, Usagi used the OTC rating system to pressure me to give up. Who is the scammer here? If you look at the forum posts, every time someone writes down tyhe numbers adds simple math and demonstrates the flaws or lies in Usagis post, he starts do discredit the writer my writing insults and not calculations or proof. He has not shown me a single post where I lie about his "business" or misrepresent the situation. None. Yesterday he was telling everyone in IRC, that NYAN.A will hit 1.20 because of demand! WTF? Code: usagi price of NYAN.A is about to jump to 1.20 Is this how portfolio is managed? With BS "news" to manipulate the market? Telling everyone that BMF is worth .50 or more while its assets (mostly illiquid) are worth about 0.29 with UDN priced at 0.0349 while he knows it has It's all in the forum posts and this type of shit has to stop. We need a panel of honest people who can help exchanges to prescreen IPO's and keep an eye on self proclaimed fund managers. Lets not forget that most people here have 0 to none experience with investments and they are easily sucked in to shiny looking turds like that. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 27, 2012, 10:04:18 AM "We need a panel of honest people who can help exchanges to prescreen IPO's and keep an eye on self proclaimed fund managers" This has already been set up by Nefario. I know because I turned it down. Usagi is the one at the head of the group. Most of the members of the group are pretty solid. (this is getting a bit off-topic, but is probably not completely useless for the case) Usagi actually invited me to join the group before this BS hit the fan. :) I passed the "test" or what ever, giving solutions to the "problems" no one had thought before. But I guess his personal feelings are above the needs of the panel and the community. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: MPOE-PR on September 27, 2012, 11:15:07 AM Usagi is the one at the head of the group. Most of the members of the group are pretty solid. Usagi is the one at the head of the group. Most of the members of the group are pretty solid. Sense. Please make some. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: BadBear on September 27, 2012, 12:19:31 PM Usagi is the one at the head of the group. Most of the members of the group are pretty solid. Usagi is the one at the head of the group. Most of the members of the group are pretty solid. Sense. Please make some. All the members -1 (Usagi) = most. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 27, 2012, 03:29:23 PM Eskimobob has been lying and misrepresenting facts and figures about my company. In a previous post on this thread which I have responded to, he doctored the spreadsheet provided by my company. This was obvious; he changed the numbers to numbers which were unfair and inaccurate representations of the stock prices. Actually, I updated your numbers, and I used GLBSE numbers, but even your very own spreadsheet showed a NAV of 0.41, not 0.5. Even today, after your purchases to boost your stocks, and what I suspect was pure fraud regarding DMC (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=97178.msg1225216#msg1225216), it still shows only 0.43, not 0.5: http://tsukino.ca/bmf/holdings-nav/ And even those numbers can not be defended. Lets have a look at your hardware valuation: Bitforce Single 832 MH/s 2 62.6699 125.3398 Butterfly labs lists it for $599 or 49 BTC you list it 22% above listprice BitForce Jalapeno 3.5 GH/s 2 16.6921 33.3842 Butterfly labs lists it for $149 or 12.1 BTC you list it 28% above listprice BitForce 'SC' Single 40 GH/s 1 123.3251 123.3251 6.49% Butterfly labs lists it for $1299 or 106.1 BTC you list it 16 % above listprice This is hardly controversial stuff. Then lets check your shares, your stated values in bold: BITBOND 10 0.6567 5 day average is 0.352, you list at almost 100% above actual price and BITBOND hasnt traded that high since ages: https://glbse.com/asset/view/BITBOND BTC-BOND 4800 0.0100 5 day average is 0.008 highest bid 0.006 last trade 0.002. https://glbse.com/asset/view/BTC-BOND BMMO 3775 0.0820 5 day average is 0.065 highest bid 0.02 last trade 0.02 https://glbse.com/asset/view/BMMO Etc, etc, etc. But curiously, your skyrocketed DMC stats are quite up to date and showing the very last trade price, even though its 50% over its 5 day average (and over its own declared NAV). What a lucky coincidence, he? edit; I copy pasted Usagi's spreadsheet and added GBLSE API to fetch the data. Here is the current result: edit bis: updated with usagi's latest numbers. No significant difference. Older one still available here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112734.msg1225573#msg1225573 https://i.imgur.com/scks8.png A Nav of somewhere between 0.33-0.35, and thats after an increase in DMC shares and a spectacular (and spectacularly stupid) rise in its price. How this could be interpreted as "approximately 0.5" is ... unclear to me. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: deeplink on September 27, 2012, 04:04:49 PM Wow, the evidence keeps piling up.
scam (skm) Slang n. A fraudulent business scheme; a swindle. scammer [ˈskæmə], scamster n. Slang a person who perpetrates a scam; swindler In my opinion Usagi is the one who earns a scammer tag here and EskimoBob and others deserve a statue for warning the community about this. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 27, 2012, 04:35:21 PM The value of the hardware is what we paid for it, which includes shipping. Bitpay invoice numbers are listed. Not a scam. Shipping costs are an ASSET now? ROFL. Maybe you should put your electricity costs in there too to boost your NAV! Quote The spreadsheet uses a formula which uses the average of the 24h and 5 day averages* Not a scam. *=max(fetchTicker(concatenate(A13), "t5davg"), fetchTicker(concatenate(A13), "t24havg"))/100000000 How come it produces some prices that are way higher than even 3 month highs then? How come it produces results that are 20+% above mine? I checked my numbers against GLSBE website, and unlike yours, mine seem correct. Do you see anything wrong with them? Quote Sorry puppet, you lose. And for god's sake make your own thread. Maged specifically asked, Im happy to oblige. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: greyhawk on September 27, 2012, 06:03:33 PM In my opinion Usagi is the one who earns a Oh please... Both sides are doing an amazing show business. Let's be honest with the real nature of usagi and EskimoBob contest. Obs: quote corrected. Wait. What's the real nature? Is it a lover's quarrel? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 06:47:05 PM The value of the hardware is what we paid for it, which includes shipping. LOL? That's an expense. That's very creative accounting, i.e. scamming. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 06:52:28 PM https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113494.0 So you're pointing me to a thread where no one is supposed to accuse you, but you're allowed to accuse BAKEWELL? Awesome rules. /s Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 27, 2012, 07:13:49 PM ...obliged by providing doctored stats. The share count comes from your spreadsheet, the prices come from GLSBE API. Which of those numbers am I doctoring exactly? As for using "old" data, I used the latest one. I updated it now again with whats available on your site right now, and the nav went further down a notch. BTW, your shareprices are now so inflated, so way above anything on GLBSE site that you now show a NAV of 0.5 ROFL. Dont you think you are overdoing it a little bit ? Randomly multiplying GLBSE averages by 2x or more doesnt really reflect well on whats left of your credibility. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Puppet on September 27, 2012, 07:29:29 PM Again I ask,, is the share count correct for your BMF portfolio? I got them from your spreadsheet, so just asking. Yes or no please. If No, please point me to the correct data.
If yes, is the GLBSE pricing info or trading quantity wrong? If not, did I make a mistake multiplying them and adding them? If not, shut the fuck up. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 07:49:22 PM I accused bakewell of what? Quote please. You probably don't understand the English I used. Do you understand English? I am an English teacher. I'll help you for free. I actually have OTC ratings for helping people with their English, BTW. Would you like me to spell it out for you? You're an english teacher, not a financial genius. Thanks for pointing that out - you should teach people then and NOT pocket people's savings. Your English teacher would love to see how you can't express yourself without using foul language. Let's check BAKEWELL: Income is 6BTC/week, the valuation is 312BTC (I don't even bother to include difficulty adjustment). This is a standard industry valuation practice - 1x yearly revenue. So the valuation is 0.05 per share, and what did you say: So, what's BAKEWELL worth? Logic would tell you, it's worth .15. Why not, that's what he's selling shares at, and he does need to finish his IPO. If his shares were not worth .15, say... if they were worth .1343, why would anyone pay .15? They wouldn't. In fact, one might even accuse Ian Bakewell.... of scamming! https://glbse.com/api/quantity_trading/BAKEWELL - Total: 5928 shares. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 08:42:25 PM I should probably mention you did not account for the underlying assets in that valuation. I make all my financials available in the third post of my thread & I try to stay as current as possible. Assets are useless in 1x annual revenue valuation.. If you just take the assets from the 3rd post of your thread, though it's confusing: Cash: 4027.63CAD or 333.41 BTC Trust: 4BTC BTC: 124 (Total funds raised: 503.7 BTC - 375BTC converted to CAN and -4 BTC trust) Hardware: nothing Total: 461.41BTC Total: 0.078BTC per share, not that far from 0.05BTC valuation with 1x yearly revenue. It was usagi that brought you into the picture, personally I don't care about mining operations. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 08:44:07 PM Sorry, where do I accuse him of scamming? I don't see it. Apparently no one else does either, including Ian Bakewell. What are you, retarded? This is almost as dumb as when you accused me of lying because I used an alias on the forums instead of my real name. Sheesh You said if his shares aren't worth 0.15, one might accuse him of scamming? So did you say that? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 09:19:22 PM You have made many assumptions in those posts that are easily corrected / would not have been made, if the poster actually had knowledge of my asset. tldr; When in doubt, do not use others in a poor example. What are the assumptions? a) You sell shares at 0.15 b) Your current assets divided per share are 0.077 c) Your future evaluation is 0.05, since you dont fucking mine right now moron. d) Intelligent people would never invest into your company. edit: Now where da fuck 50% of the invested money went to? Why they aren't part of assets? edit2: I see: he basically takes 20% (founders stake) into his pocket and another 30% into his an another pocket (growth and maintenance). Growth and maintenance fund should be company owned and listed on assets. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 09:41:08 PM Do I get to call you a moron now? ;) Look at the share distribution part of the contract, it is up at the top. You already did. Or you don't know what moron means? Usagi may have brought me into it, but if you are going to make a comment, please do so intelligently and after actually reading the BAKEWELL thread. And read the edit2. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 10:14:53 PM They are listed as assets, they are not held in the company portfolio so that they show on the quantity trading. Who owns the growth and maintenance fund? You or the company. If the company then the fund should be listed in your post. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: vampire on September 27, 2012, 10:25:24 PM I will work to clarify this part, thank you for raising the concern. You can start by spelling M&G out, since I had no idea what was that. You contract says "growth and maintenance", so it would be G&M. Now lets update the current evaluation, I assume G&M owned by company: 0.10 / per share. Effective loss of 31% for investors. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 28, 2012, 02:27:46 AM I have to say, day 3 of this has been pretty intense. Several times, each side had me pretty well conviced that they were in the right, so I'd consider this to be a pretty lively discussion that I am proud to have directed, despite its unfortunate beginings.
Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. This seems like a valid concern. Could you elaborate on why you feel like usagi should have bought back your BMF shares above market value? Also, what value per share, exactly, do you think you deserved to be offered if these "absurd demands" weren't included?I actually never asked him to sell me the shares back. He made that offer to me, after I told him I am not happy with the current situation and he sold me the shares under the false representation of current situation in BMF. If you read the log, I never really agreed to any of his rantings freely. He never mentioned, that his yelling of STFU, mixed with insults is some type of a contract. All I wanted now (because he made a unexpected offer) is get out of this crap called BMF and get my coin back. When he started counting seconds, I asked, "do I need to repeat that Yes?". I had lost all the trust I in this scumbag and a liar, who has obvious memory problems (selective memory?). I wanted to sell my shares back to him and that is what my Yes stands for - Yes, I am transferring you the shares. Nothing less, nothing more. I do not see contract here. I see just another rant of his, where he calls me with names and adds his "shut the fuck up..." or else. I do not sell my silence, my support to some bullshit, I do not write my opinions about incompetent "portfolio managers" for coin and so on. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: deeplink on September 28, 2012, 10:17:07 AM Buying silence goes against everything I believe in. We wouldn't be were we are if it weren't for critical people.
This board was build on free speech and at present that is needed more than before: shady businesses are thriving here. People have to be warned for that any way possible. In this particular case: Bob is right for speaking up and warning people of Usagi and his "investment" funds. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: BadBear on September 28, 2012, 12:42:52 PM Buying silence goes against everything I believe in. We wouldn't be were we are if it weren't for critical people. This board was build on free speech and at present that is needed more than before: shady businesses are thriving here. People have to be warned for that any way possible. In this particular case: Bob is right for speaking up and warning people of Usagi and his "investment" funds. I agree. I don't think it's the forum's place to enforce such a contract, or punish based on them. Regardless of whatever agreement someone may have, I still feel that people have the fundamental right to express themselves, and I'm not going to take that away on the whims of Usagi or whoever the next person is that tries this. Personally, I will choose not to moderate such requests. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: deadserious on September 28, 2012, 01:26:32 PM I may not have any pull here, but based on my reading of this entire thread, my opinion is that yes, EskimoBob sold his silence and has broken the contract, but a contract like this should have been offered and probably can't be enforced.
It is legal (though probably not constitutional) in the USA to pay off for silence (and it's done all of the time), but the contracts to do so are much more detailed and specific than the simple condition expressed in the forum. If you really wanted to buy his silence, you should have drafted a real contract and NDA, properly negotiated the terms, signed and notarized. If you really wanted to stick it to him, you could file in small claims court against him. The likelihood of him showing up is small and you could probably get a default judgement in your favor without ever having to argue the details of the contract. But my recommendation, even though you didn't specifically ask it of me... just write it up to a life lesson, refuse his business in the future and move on. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: augustocroppo on September 28, 2012, 02:50:10 PM Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. This seems like a valid concern. Could you elaborate on why you feel like usagi should have bought back your BMF shares above market value? Also, what value per share, exactly, do you think you deserved to be offered if these "absurd demands" weren't included? I actually never asked him to sell me the shares back. He made that offer to me, after I told him I am not happy with the current situation and he sold me the shares under the false representation of current situation in BMF. Usagi did not offer to sell any BMF shares back to EskimoBob, but to buy the shares back from EskimoBob. This is a false statement. If you read the log, I never really agreed to any of his rantings freely. He never mentioned, that his yelling of STFU, mixed with insults is some type of a contract. All I wanted now (because he made a unexpected offer) is get out of this crap called BMF and get my coin back. Get out of what? Is EskimoBob not already out? Usagi already bought back all EskimoBob BMF shares. EskimoBob once again is making a contradictory statement. EskimoBob agreed several times with Usagi terms to sell back the BMF shares: Code: [21:53:54] <EskimoBob> yes, you can have that shit, you ling sack of shit When he started counting seconds, I asked, "do I need to repeat that Yes?". I had lost all the trust I in this scumbag and a liar, who has obvious memory problems (selective memory?). I wanted to sell my shares back to him and that is what my Yes stands for - Yes, I am transferring you the shares. Nothing less, nothing more. I do not see contract here. I see just another rant of his, where he calls me with names and adds his "shut the fuck up..." or else. I do not sell my silence, my support to some bullshit, I do not write my opinions about incompetent "portfolio managers" for coin and so on. Usagi did not ask EskimoBob to support his business. Usagi explicitly required EskimoBob to remain neutral about his business. At no moment was EskimoBob required to write anything about Usagi's business. This is a completely redundant statement. What are people's opinions of this specific statement? I want to hear what people think, regardless of your relation to the case. Yes, even you guys that are silently lurking in this thread. Maged, you made two important questions to EskimoBob and he was not able to answer either. Instead of EskimoBob providing a coherent answer explaining how much the shares should worth if the "absurd demands" were not included, EskimoBob decided to play the victim and write off misleading statements. EskimoBob sold back to Usagi the shares above the market price under certain conditions and now EskimoBob is afraid to return the difference. Thus, EskimoBob is trying to evade your judgement since you have already indicated that EskimoBob was overpaid by Usagi. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 28, 2012, 03:02:17 PM so now we are "EskimoBob seems to have..."?
This whole thread has grown lot bigger and wider. Now it's all about the scamm you are pulling. Only way I'll (and many others) will shut up is if you stop scamming your investors (including me, btw), manipulating share prices with fake news and promises "to do blaaah..." and stop lying in your absurdly inaccurate spreadsheets that are used to calculate the NAV and are published in your website and here in the forum for portfolios under your (mis)management. If you like to talk about who scammed who, then the real scammer here is actually you. anyone who has little time to dig in to your "News" and calculations can see, how you constantly lie to everyone in this from who read your BS. I think this is 3rd time I ask you to show me a post where I lie about your imaginary companies (investment portfolios). How can I stop doing something that I have never done? How can I "stop ling" if I have not lied? Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 28, 2012, 03:04:34 PM Quote I actually never asked him to sell me the shares back. He made that offer to me, after I told him I am not happy with the current situation and he sold me the shares under the false representation of current situation in BMF. Usagi did not offer to sell any BMF shares back to EskimoBob, but to buy the shares back from EskimoBob. This is a false statement. You are correct and I think this error from me was corrected by someone. Usagi offered to BUY the shares from me. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 28, 2012, 05:10:53 PM And here is something you really have to read to understand what is going on and why some of the forum members (including me) can not just STFU when ordered in IRC or anywhere else. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.0
Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: pyrkne on September 28, 2012, 05:24:57 PM I have to say, day 3 of this has been pretty intense. Several times, each side had me pretty well conviced that they were in the right, so I'd consider this to be a pretty lively discussion that I am proud to have directed, despite its unfortunate beginings. Usagi piggipacked his absurd demands on a buy back of BMF shares and now is accusing of a scam. He is mad at me because I and many others are not happy what is happening in BMF and in other portfolios under his management. This seems like a valid concern. Could you elaborate on why you feel like usagi should have bought back your BMF shares above market value? Also, what value per share, exactly, do you think you deserved to be offered if these "absurd demands" weren't included?I actually never asked him to sell me the shares back. He made that offer to me, after I told him I am not happy with the current situation and he sold me the shares under the false representation of current situation in BMF. If you read the log, I never really agreed to any of his rantings freely. He never mentioned, that his yelling of STFU, mixed with insults is some type of a contract. All I wanted now (because he made a unexpected offer) is get out of this crap called BMF and get my coin back. When he started counting seconds, I asked, "do I need to repeat that Yes?". I had lost all the trust I in this scumbag and a liar, who has obvious memory problems (selective memory?). I wanted to sell my shares back to him and that is what my Yes stands for - Yes, I am transferring you the shares. Nothing less, nothing more. I do not see contract here. I see just another rant of his, where he calls me with names and adds his "shut the fuck up..." or else. I do not sell my silence, my support to some bullshit, I do not write my opinions about incompetent "portfolio managers" for coin and so on. If that back-and-forth can be construed as a contract, I think we're in trouble. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: augustocroppo on September 28, 2012, 06:09:10 PM And here is something you really have to read to understand what is going on and why some of the forum members (including me) can not just STFU when ordered in IRC or anywhere else. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.0 Are you assuming that we, the readers of this thread, are not using our reading comprehension with appropriate discernment to review your case? Usagi inability to handle financial mathematics is not evidence to support your defense in this thread. You are not even the original claimant of that thread. So you do not have any evidence against Usagi here, except your own misleading statements. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: EskimoBob on September 28, 2012, 07:15:26 PM And here is something you really have to read to understand what is going on and why some of the forum members (including me) can not just STFU when ordered in IRC or anywhere else. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.0 Are you assuming that we, the readers of this thread, are not using our reading comprehension with appropriate discernment to review your case? Usagi inability to handle financial mathematics is not evidence to support your defense in this thread. You are not even the original claimant of that thread. So you do not have any evidence against Usagi here, except your own misleading statements. nice try augustocroppo. I am nor sure who is the "we" you represent. Never mind. This link has lots of background and shows what has been going on and why usagi hates me with passion. I guess if you know it by now anyways, the link is useless and really ads nothing. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: danieldaniel on September 28, 2012, 10:57:37 PM <stuff> I agree with this. I don't think it's necessarily right for him to break the "contract", but it wasn't a contract in the first place. I don't even think it was an agreement. If that back-and-forth can be construed as a contract, I think we're in trouble. If I'm missing anything, don't take any offense. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: Maged on September 29, 2012, 03:05:58 AM After much back and forth, I feel that I've come to a reasonable decision: EskimoBob will not be getting a scammer tag for this issue, at least from me. There are a few key reasons for this:
1) I feel that there are too many unknown in this case, in both the agreement and in usagi's actions. I cannot support giving someone the scammer tag if I'm not 100% sure. 2) I agree with this judgement: I side with Bob, simply because I find the literal idea of buying silence ... I don't know the words, but I do not like it. With the silence part not being absolutely clear, it's hard to know whether the difference in the market price vs what was offered was just a goodwill concession or not.If that part of the deal was fairly assigned value, then I think he should send that part back and be done with it. The issue with assigning a value to the silence part, would be assuming Bob took it as payment for that in the first place. Would I have been an observer in the live chat, I would have assumed Usagi was overpaying, and doing so to shut Bob up, but not in the literal sense of a scammer tag, more in the line of, "the customer is always right, heres your refund, get out of my store... I have better things to do" you know, like most retail places will "shut you up" should you be unhappy and loud. It is legal (though probably not constitutional) in the USA to pay off for silence (and it's done all of the time), but the contracts to do so are much more detailed and specific than the simple condition expressed in the forum. If you really wanted to buy his silence, you should have drafted a real contract and NDA, properly negotiated the terms, signed and notarized. Again, I agree with this.If you really wanted to stick it to him, you could file in small claims court against him. The likelihood of him showing up is small and you could probably get a default judgement in your favor without ever having to argue the details of the contract. But my recommendation, even though you didn't specifically ask it of me... just write it up to a life lesson, refuse his business in the future and move on. Maged, you made two important questions to EskimoBob and he was not able to answer either. Instead of EskimoBob providing a coherent answer explaining how much the shares should worth if the "absurd demands" were not included, EskimoBob decided to play the victim and write off misleading statements. EskimoBob sold back to Usagi the shares above the market price under certain conditions and now EskimoBob is afraid to return the difference. Thus, EskimoBob is trying to evade your judgement since you have already indicated that EskimoBob was overpaid by Usagi. No, he answered the questions very well, in my opinion.3) It is very clear that usagi has been posting misleading statements. It may not be enough for a scammer tag, but it's pretty damn close. Neither side in this case has been particularly blamless, but I don't feel that anybody has acted in a manner befitting of a scammer tag. I'd like to give my thanks for all of the people who gave their opinions I appologize if this post isn't up to my usual standards in it's explaination, but I was highly distracted while writing it. Rest assured, however, that I was not distracted when I made my decision. Title: Re: EskimoBob is a scammer, witness reports inside Post by: smoothie on September 29, 2012, 03:28:06 AM All I see here in the OP is two girls with their period and fighting over a tampon.
:D :D :D Title: Re: Usagi is a scammer. Post by: EskimoBob on September 29, 2012, 08:51:39 AM Motion (https://glbse.com/vote/view/148) passed by 100%. All of my shareholders are happy. Motion ID:148 Ticker symbol: BMF Expires:2012-09-28 Required to pass motion:0% Motion text This is an opinion poll with no actionable result. As a shareholder, are you satisfied with BMF's management style? Please carefully consider the performance of the fund, and the actions I have taken to protect shareholders including weekly letters to shareholders, full disclosure of assets and trading, motions 80 and 124, and the current daily dividends policy before answering. Thank you and have a nice day. Note: If you are at all unsatisfied with the performance of this fund, as a shareholder, please do not hesitate to contact us at bmf@tsukino.ca and maybe we can work together to resolve any problems you are experiencing. Thank you! Voting result % to pass motion: 0 Voted Yea:8148 Voted Nay:0 I am confused, because as of today, BMF only ha 4983 shares outstanding and staring from 2012.09.19, BMF never had more than 5347 shares outstanding. So, how did you manage to get 8148 "Yea's" is not clear but completely irrelevant to this thread. PS! Forum moderator, if I did not get the scammer tag, can you please change the topic to reflect your decision and please close this thread. Thank you. |
