Bitcoin Forum

I live in a country in the EU and i tried to get some information about how can i pay my taxes for my btc revenue.
Acording to my country`s legislation:
1.Bitcoin isn`t  digital money.
2.Bitcoin isn`t a digital asset.
Acording to the laws,bitcoin is nothing...BUT acording to the same legislation,i`m obligated to pay taxes for all my revenues,including the income from online trading.What if all my income comes from bitcoin trading?
Do i have to pay any taxes or no?Sorry,if this questions is asked here before.
Is this ridiculous?

Where are you from? We can only help if we know where you're from. The easiest way is to contact your tax authority for clarifications

Lucky you.

If you convert to fiat, pay regular income tax on that.

Done.

They're probably just really behind on the times and haven't made specific laws for cryptocurrencies yet. This is a very 2012 problem. To be safe, pay the taxes you believe you owe. If you don't you'll have to pay th later when they find out.

There is a absolutely nothing you can do about it at the moment but to stay away from trouble, you can pay an amount you willingly want to pay to the tax authority because the status of bitcoin in most countries will start to change from "nothing" to something in which they might want to go back and do tax investigation in which at this time might be difficult for you to meet with the amount levied.

In this case, you have to declare your income wherever they may come from Bitcoin or not so that you can pay the appropriate tax. Though your country is not yet recognizing Bitcoin whether as a currency or asset, the point here is that there is already a law which demands that anyone having an income must pay a tax percentage on that income. It does not matter then where is the source of the income. And your country is not alone with this kind of situation.

Interesting! In my country (in Southeast Asia), Bitcoin was recently just recognized by the country's central bank and according to the laws, its not necessarily "nothing". Bitcoin is not recognized as a digital/cryptocurrency or payment system but rather it is considered as property. Because of this, it said to be not having any legal tender - or in other words, it is not a medium of payment recognized by the legal system in our country. We also have income tax but I don't know how it would apply to Bitcoin earners because of this kind of recognition by the government.

Bitcoin is nothing according to the laws of most countries as the governments are reluctant to officially recognizing it as a form of money or currency or a digital asset even. But the problem is, you cannot buy your mother's medicine or pay your son's school fees with bitcoins.

So, you have to convert it to fiat at one point of time. And the moment you convert it, it will be treated as money earned, and the tax axe falls on you.

If Bitcoin gets more accepted globally as a convenient payment method, it is possible that governments around the world would lose out 'bigly' on VAT and other Taxes. Therefore, it is likely that many governments will try their best to make sure your bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies are taxable.

You don't have to but to fulfil demands of your early life , & Due to BitCoin isn't take for granted by your Government, you have to exchange BitCoin with money of your county,, thus you can use use BitCoin as legal and aslo pay taxes  ;D

It doesn't what it is classified as, the government will still want taxes.
Your best bet is to do the calculations and pay taxes; it will help you if the government suddenly changes its mind and starts digging out old records.

That's pretty freaking ridiculous. Maybe you could get away with not declaring it? I don't think they can straight up tax you for converting to fiat either, since they can't automatically assume that you're converting earnings.

Bitcoin isn't a digital money because unlike credit cards that you can use online which has a fiat account that
is associated with it bitcoin really don't have any value. But there are people who wants to have that coin in
exchange of their fiat so it has a value.

Reason why you are being asked by your country to pay for taxes was because you converted it to fiat, and fiat is subject for taxes.

I agree with this once you have your bitcoin converted to fiat this will be considered will be subject to taxes.
All income or any addition to your asset is subject to taxes even if it is from a donation or no matter what the sources are.
Bitcoin may not be considered as an asset but once you got an asset out of it then that is subject to taxes.

Looks like the author totally doesn't interested in founding a reply on his question, he didn't comment the thread for months!
Well, I think we all may realize our trading and other crypto activity in the same way as before, cause of no country called about Butcoin taxation yet. So, if it's not illegal it is legal by the logic :)

As long as you're making profit, it will be recorded in the country's GDP or GNP. Which makes it taxable.
Best thing to do is to coordinate and pay your taxes. Because once your government creates a regulatory framework on the taxation of cryptocurrencies, then they will also include investigations on past recorded transactions, and you might pay much much more when that happens.

I think it's better also to have another business in real life. To at least cover up revenues from bitcoin. Bitcoin according to your post is not illegal but it's just not recognized. If you have a business IRL and you get findingrom bitcoin, at least  you can declare income that you have business rather than online trading only.

It is hypocritical in its finest, they labelled it as “nothing” or “useless” but they want you to pay taxes for earning to it. That’s more of greedy to the same government who supposedly support you than taking in your advantage without them doing they’re mandated to do so.

In my country it’s not yet illegal and we don’t pay tax for it and that is just right for me.

In my country, you are not obliged to pay taxes on any of your online revenues, and when it comes on Bitcoin, i don't even know if my government is aware of the technology yet. I have never heard of any government authorities talking about or saying anything about bitcoin or things related to it. In fact, the people in my country doesn't mostly know a lot about Bitcoin. I can barely find someone knowing a few things about bitcoin that it is a digital currency with a very high price, other than this, they know almost nothing about it.

Well in my country, our local exchanges just this year have impost a more strict regulations in terms of KYC/AML compliant. However they are very friendly to bitcoin, and even have approved already two more exchanges to be operational soon, maybe in 2018. So our government is very active about cryptocurrency, but they are not strict. So I'm assuming in just a couple of years there will be a government rule specially imposing of taxing bitcoin. But I'm more willing to comply though as long as its within the boundaries, I guess all of us will need to follow and comply.

I think answers found here can be useful for people in a similar situation, even if the author hasn’t come back.

What he comments shows again how governments go behind events. Technology changes very fast but laws are slow, so it’s not surprising what you are talking about.

As some have commented, if you want to avoid paying taxes legally the best thing would be to exchange bitcoin for goods and services directly, although I also live in a EU country and it is discussed in local forums if government could claim tax for that. I think in theory they could, but they don’t have the means to track those transactions and make people pay and there is no clear legislation on the subject.

What I would advise anyone to do is to declare and pay all crypto transactions that go through your bank (like send a transfer to an exchange, make profits, and send funds back to your bank). Fiat profits are clearly taxed, crypto profits are not.

It takes time for states to deal with this

The state is always trying to deceive the citizens. You may have problems in order to prove that the amount you withdrew from the Bank accounts were used for profit, and may be excluded from your income. If you are a legal entity then you will have problems. The entire the amount you will receive at the expense of the state regards as income.

With all due respect, I don’t see much sense in what you are saying, and I don’t understand why you are saying it as a reply to what I wrote. Or maybe I know why. Therefore, I’m not going to argue with you.

If bitcoin still not legalized yet then I have no right to pay the tax for bitcoin.
It's reasonable ,right ?

I'm happy with current situation but in other side , bitcoin still less popular in my place so I'm seldom to see any public service accept bitcoin as their main transaction

As long as I don't cash out my bitcoins to the fiat currency in my country, I don't think I have to pay any kind of taxes. So the plan is to just keep everything into bitcoin until I can use bitcoin for my daily needs or my government has clearly made a statement on bitcoin and cryptocurrency in general.

Though many countries around the world has not recognized BITCOIN  so it is difficult to determine the income earned from it under the income tax law. As per my country tax law, BTC income is not considered as an income unless it is converted into fiat currency.

Money can only be taxed on the moment you exchange it to fiat and use a bank service, right? And depending the amount it can pass away from the government's radars, without need to pay taxes. And if you exchange your profit in BTCs to fiat in small packages, you don't need to pay any tax, right?

I say using the example Bitcoin is nothing according to country's laws.

It shouldn't matter. If you receive 1BTC today for whatever services that you provided, you'll have to pay tax over the fiat value at the moment of receiving it. Current rate is $5900, which means that you declare $5900 as income.

Quite often people just assume that because their government doesn't yet 'recognize' Bitcoin as asset or whatever, that they are exempt from paying tax, but that's nothing more than wishful thinking.

It basically means that even participating in a signature campaign can also be taxed. For us it's just 'earning' Bitcoin for something we're doing anyway, which is posting, but in reality it's a service that we provide.

If that what your law indicated then you have a choice to follow it or not. If your a law abiding citizen that would be easy to do. But honestly that is not worth the taxpayers money, they don’t recognized bitcoin as such and want a share from it. That absolutely not right in any aspect at all.

Then that would be your choice to be fooled by them and pay tax or get away with anonymity and be careful with it.

Well it seems that your country needs to classify what bitcoin really is so that they can have the proper law applied to a certain security or source of income. If you are earning revenue from bitcoin trading and you are obligated to pay from online trading then I think you should pay taxes because once they track you are earning from it and not paying then maybe they will have surcharges and interest charge in addition for your tax liability making you liable for more than the amount you should pay for when you reported and payed it at the right time.

I disagree with you. When it comes to participation in the company to collect signatures from the point of view of the state's income. But only after you exchange your coins for Fiat. But as for trading on the stock exchange here I have a question. How can the state consider how much money I spent on a failed transaction? Or how they take into account the money that I invested in buying bitcoin? This is only possible if I am registered as a legal entity and will use the special account. Otherwise, the state the entire amount is considered income.

That’s better idea I think, it’s long term holding at the same time. What a way to escape paying taxes, I think I’ve learned something today. I might to do the same when he situation in my country about bitcoin and cryptocurrency will be having this implementation in the future. Hoping it won’t but being prepared for the worst is the best thing a good bitcoiners must do.

Well, if they haven't find out. Then don't pay. There are no specific law regarding imposing tax to cryptocurrencies as far as i know. But if there is, then pay your taxes. But if you want everything to be clear. Then report your income statement to the government. From that, they will charge you tax for your trading activities and you are not going to have any troubles about taxes in the future. But for me, as long as there's no law regarding to that matter. I think i will not going to pay them. I will just wait until they find out. Anyway, i think government will implement this law in the future. So enjoy while government still not implementing that law.

The same with my country. In my country Bitcoin is not good, currency or money so there are a lot of people in my country earning Bitcoin everyday and of course they don't have to pay taxes for Bitcoin income cause it's nothing unless it's legalized in here and I'm not a exception :)). I'm earning Bitcoin everyday and I don't have to spend any pennies from my Bitcoin income for taxes. I think you'll be the same with me :D

This scenario you have here is strictly legal and has to be viewed in legal perspective.

Looking at your items one and two , it seems as if you didn't mention a confine for bitcoin - I mean, there is no "umbrella " for its coverage aforementioned. Therefore, I would just as you a rhetorically question maybe  - where does bitcoin belong to?

Then, the rule is , again according to you that taxes are to be collected or payed for income including those from online business or trading .

The argument therefore is that, since bitcoin is not mentioned in the class of activities to be taxed or if bitcoin is not classed as digital money or digital asset and you make your income from bitcoin (that we all know that it is digital in nature), it means you don't have to pay any tax or taxes accruing from bitcoin .

In conclusion , "you don't put something on nothing and expect it to stand".

This situation is truly paradoxical, because on the one hand the authorities refuse to recognize the bitcoin as a valid option to carry out financial transactions, nevertheless the fiscal laws force us as citizens of a nation to pay taxes for our profits. Given the lack of clarity of current regulations regarding the nature of bitcoin and its acceptability in today's economy, I believe that we should be kept out of paying taxes until the issue of crypto-coins is clearly regulated.

Country try to understand this type of technological currency which is so called as currency is something which is issued by the govt and regulated by them. This cypto currency is not credited and not governed by them. So its becomes difficult under what law they can accept it.

Yes, even my country also has the same problem after converting to local currency only government's will understand about Bitcoin transactions but I think we have to pay taxes on transacting Bitcoin into Fiat currency.

To be honest I find the legislative body of your country very confusing as they do not believe Bitcoin as an asset yet they still want to ask for tax. Income tax is probably what they are asking for if you gain money from it. But that just proves that Bitcoin is an asset.

Maybe it will only just take some time for your country to further understand Bitcoins. I am sure that as the Bitcoin continues to increase, the government will see it and will not let itself be left behind with the success.

yes bit coin is just online digital money it we can't see with our eyes. but has it great demand. suppose if we have paper money we have to submit our property details to the government. but we have bit coin no need to submit any one. it can not see with our eyes. so bit coin is having great demand. in my country bit coin has more value, my country's court's law says who are using bit coin just use it properly in legal way other wise don't use it.

Judging by the description you live in one of the countries of the former Soviet Union. There really is no regulation of the use of cryptocurrency. But that doesn't mean that you don't have to pay taxes. You must pay income tax on the amount which is exchanged for Fiat. If the amounts are very large then you have a chance to get into the field of view of law enforcement. All of them are corrupt in these countries and is used not thoroughness of legislation to extort money from you.

Well, you should know that every country has their rules to safeguard its citizens and that's not to say that it will not be accepted in the nearest future.
Relax and find a way about settling the taxes. Peace.

I think taxes should be paid when you transferring crypto into fiat.

Lucky...so jealous. For countries in the loop, they're trying to get everyone to pay double tax lol.

What a weird country that they wont acknowledge bitcoin but you must pay income tax of every income that you have earned from bitcoin. My question is how would they know that your money came from bitcoins if they did not acknowledge how bitcoin works? Maybe you are very honest people that you just voluntarily paying income tax by honestly declaring that you earned fiat that much for this month. The government cant able to trace our transactions so therefore you are paying honesty so its up to you if you want to pay all bitcoin taxes.

I agree. That is very confusing. I won't pay any taxes if the legislation itself doesn't recognize btc. On what category does btc belong to? It's not a money and not even an asset to them. If I were you, just find another country that won't make this tax laws for btc complicated.

People should try to understand their concerned rules and regulation about their country because without following those you will be in problems but i think if you do the transaction with Bitcoin definitely you have to pay taxes on it.

I totally agree with you friend, it seems like that's what to do in my opinion too, it doesn't wrong if it doesn't pay direct taxes with bitcoin, whatever the activities done in earning bitcoin.. because it was seems bitcoin not be recognized at all, and for the sake of being a good citizen.. we can still pay the tax with income earned from bitcoin after cashing it, and then pay taxes on the government with that money.

That’s insanely ridiculous,, it’s like don’t go there it’s trespassing but if you go there you find something give me a cut.. what?? That doesn’t make sense and I think how greedy were those that think and approved that policy is much crazier than the one who lives in a mental institution.. If that would be in my country that would be the stupidest political nightmare to one who made that happen..

I think that if it is in your country then no one will notice. You are too exaggerate the value of bitcoin. Very few people use in their lives cryptocurrencies. It seems to us that all interested in the fate of bitcoin because here on the forum is interested in all. Everything in life differently. People are looking at us like Martians.

Okay, I do not know if you already got your answer but i will also give my answer. You will not be taxed on your bitcoin but rather tax you on your profit from it (converting btc to fiat money). So technically they don't care how much you have bitcoins but they will surely take an action when you convert it to fiat money.

if its not illegal, then its legal.

It isn't according to the law!
They are asking you to pay income tax and they don't care what gave you this income, they just want the money. That's why the law states what it states.
According to the tax law, that is basically the same for every country, even if you get cash for mowing your neighbor's lawn, or find money lying on the side of the road, you are supposed to add it to your yearly income and deduct the tax. Nobody does that, but that's what they'd like you to do.

So, they don't have laws concerning Bitcoin and treat it like air, which allows them to ignore people who lost it or had it stolen, but when those people get income from exchanging it, the government wants a share.

My country still against bitcoin but there is still not have any legal law yet so I can still use bitcoin without breaking the law.
As my country forbid bitcoin that cause my people still not aware of bitcoin so our demand quite low

Well I guess you having to pay taxes from Bitcoin trading will put your government in a conflicting position because first and foremost, your government does not recognize Bitcoins per se so why will they require you to pay taxes that you derive from something they do not even acknowledge to begin with? Is that not a conflicting position? If Bitcoin is indeed nothing, why will they have to ask you to pay taxes out of it? I think you would have to clarify this with your government. I am afraid this is not the proper venue to air out such grievances.   

Yes it is blatantly ridiculous if you pay taxes from Bitcoin trading when your government does not even recognize the profitability or VALUE (for emphasis) of Bitcoins. I think it will put your government in a very obnoxious situation, hence, you would have to seriously consider asking your government officials as regards your concern.

Your laws are what control the locomotion of your countrymen, thus, you have to exert an effort to reconcile conflicting matters to your government.

In many countries the courts are completely controlled by the authorities. For them it does not matter that bitcoin does not have statutory status. They will convict. In addition, each user is forced to periodically exchange the bitcoin for Fiat. This is the weak link. Fiat fully falls under the jurisdiction of the state and anyone can be accused of tax evasion even without a law about bitcoin.

Bitcoin is nothing for those people that don't know what it is all about and don't have any single knowledge in it and we can't blame their innocence as that is a normal human nature of a human being when you don't know something on a specific thing you tend not to give an importance to it and just take for granted and when you get a chance to know more something on it and realize other people are getting inside on it then that's the time you will start to go inside the flow so don't mind other people insights in Bitcoin for as long as you know to yourself that you know what is the potential of it.

I think if I'm correct, your government oblige you to pay taxes when you convert those btc in fiat and encash them. That could really count if they want to tax you so I'll recommend that just don't convert your btc and hold them.

It isn't according to the law!
They are asking you to pay income tax and they don't care what gave you this income, they just want the money. That's why the law states what it states.
According to the tax law, that is basically the same for every country, even if you get cash for mowing your neighbor's lawn, or find money lying on the side of the road, you are supposed to add it to your yearly income and deduct the tax. Nobody does that, but that's what they'd like you to do.

The law clearly States that tax is levied only on income. If there is no official recognition of bitcoin currency that all of your earned bitcoins cannot be considered as income. If you get a Fiat from the conversion of bitcoin then it will be your income. Perhaps it would be profitable to open a company in an offshore zone and withdraw Fiat there. You will receive tax benefits and receive income which is not subject to double taxation.

This obviously creates a paradox, as you can't pay taxes on revenue generated by "nothing". I don't know which European country you're from, but I'm Norwegian.

Our tax authorities didn't recognize BTC as being VAT (value added tax) exempt until about three years ago (http://www.loc.gov/law/foreign-news/article/norway-bitcoins-are-capital-property-not-currency-says-norwegian-tax-authority/). For the time being you're in a legal limbo, and at the bare minimum I would advice you to report any BTC holdings on your tax returns.

However, I wouldn't start paying taxes on an unrealized gain (although I don't know what your intention is with the investment)..As soon as you exchange that money into fiat currency, the snowball starts moving though.

Best of luck regardless.

Virtually every country tax laws will want you to disclose all your income and pay tax on it but the same tax law will state what qualifies as income that would be taxed or otherwise. For example, income from loss of office or pension payment is exempted from tax which means you can derive income from such sources but tax will not arise an that does not mean its nothing.

In the case of bitcoin over here, the law has not been expressly stated which means that we are enjoying tax free income and I don't see that changing any time soon but there are discussions on how to ensure that this is captured but the concern is the moment they are looking at income from that end, then they are talking about legalizing it as well.