Bitcoin Forum

The reason for starting a new bitcoin is simple:
We can assume that 50% of all bitcoins mined are either held by wrong persons, or are lost.
A lot of people are burned by the MtGox theft, therefore they have nothing to lose on switching to a new coin.

If we start to use a new coin the miners can use their hardware to switch over as well, and effectively abandoning Old Bitcoin.
The value of Old Bitcoin will drop to zero which will punish preminers, thieves and FBI.

Bitcoin holders that will be punished most:
FBI: 10%
Satoshi: 10%
Thieves (from MtGox and other sites): 20%
Lost coins: 10%
Total = 50%

New Bitcoins are started every day.
Can we create a new, successful, Bitcoin... only if the majority agree with your beliefs. ;)

My argument for a new bitcoin is simple: Most people has lost bitcoin due theft or data loss, or missed the boat.
So most coins in circulation are held by thieves, oligarchs and .gov.
Therefore we don't have anything to lose by voting with our feet and go over to a new coin.

the problem is not the number of bitcoin ... but his value on real market.

we need new hopes yes...

I bought a new car earlier in the year, gonna make the car salesman pay and create a new US Dollar!!!

I'm sure all of those coins could be coded out of circulation, but the point of bitcoin is this exact thing. Non reversible there are many red flags, and warning signs everywhere about bitcoin safety, and infancy.

We don't need to change the rules and ban the stolen coins. We can simply forget Old Bitcoin and start New Bitcoin, with exactly the same rules, mining hardware and same infrastructure.
If more than 51% of the current bitcoin users do that, the Old Bitcoin will simply fade away...

Go ahead, nothing is stopping you. When will you be removing the "BitCoin" address from your signature and replacing it with a GollumCoin address?

It has already been done multiple times both exact copies of Bitcoin and modified version (commonly called altcoins).  You are free to do it again at anytime but people are also free to ignore such attempts.

So let me know when you launch "newBitcoin".

I'm sure you are not holding  much bitcoins..!
You mentioned most of coins in circulation are held by thieves, oligarchs and .gov. I agree with you to some extent but not all bitcoins are held by them.. not everyone lost there all bitcoins in mt-gox..! many of us were smart enough to know that how vulnerable  it can be  having bitcoins in an online exchange. so You got a thought but i don't think it has much substance in it..! You forgot about all the members who are still holding their  BTC's and are very optimistic about it
Ohh btw there are altcoins launching every day... why don't try those may be someone will take place of BTC on day..!  

Yes of course, hoarders like you will not leave the ship, only rats like me and other poor fellows ;)

BTW i'm not holding anything :p but can understand the pain of holders , I mean com'on man they deserve some reward for surviving and suffering daily heart attacks..! Up and Down , Rise And Fall...

No, it would punish everyone equally.  

You will never remove theft from one currency.
Where there is currency, there will always be theft.

I just say what poor fellows can do: either give up on crypto currencies completely, or jump on a new bitcoin-clone.
IMO ripple got the best prospects to replace old bitcoin, IF they make it 100% open source.

I'm totally on board with a New Bitcoin. Old Bitcoin is too corrupted.

In case you're also tired of the current Bitcoin we have, then send me your Bitcoin to this address:  1MYpNKj25HRBFpv22YpuZsuz2zZHKBLUur

I'll collect all the Bitcoin and change the password to my wallet to a random set of numbers while being blindfolded, thereby losing all current Bitcoin forever.

Send to here: 1MYpNKj25HRBFpv22YpuZsuz2zZHKBLUur

In fiat currencies inflation will inflate away the injustice, but in bitcoin the deflation does the exact opposite, rewards the thieves.

A concerted effort into forking the network because some people feel the past has been too "unjust" for their liking would be detrimental to the value of both the 'new' Bitcoin and the 'old'.

This. OP stop talking nonsense. This was tried before, this didn't result in anything.
Who can guarantee that the same won't eventually happen with the coins of Bitcoin 2.0? No-one.

Then we start bitcoin 3.0

After each iteration, the technology and the usage of it will mature in a way that will make the risk of a new "MtGox" less probable.

Or you can secure yourself , spending time in keeping them secure is as important as getting them..! even spending few bucks in securing them is worth it , instead of using any service which is easily exploitable

There's nothing you can do about that.  You can't accurately separate the thieves from everyone else.  As soon as a thief transfers coins from one address to another, you have to assume that the recipient is not a thief, and it's a legitimate transaction.

reward the stupid and punish the wise is never a good idea.  

FIFY

Here i think OP is trying to punish Both Stupids and Wise. which is not good either..!

What about the people and businesses that still hold bitcoins from legitimate purposes?  Just because you personally got burned by Gox doesn't make BTC useless to everyone.  Many of us still have skin in the game.  If you would like to move another currency, feel free.  But you're going to have difficulty rallying everyone else to abandon the investments they hold just because YOU got burned entrusting your coins under the control of someone else.

Instead of moving to a new currency, how about practicing some of the security precautions that are posted in abundance all over the internet?

I can't punish anyone, but if many bitcoiners choose to give up bitcoin the effect will be punishing the thieves and hoarders.

There is new crypto everyday.

I assume by hoarders you mean investors - the ones responsible for bitcoin having value? 

Be sure to include a list of who you believe the "right people" are. We may have to recreate bitcoins many times until we are sure that none of the wrong people have them. Perhaps an alt coin that redistributes all the coins each time there is a spend? That way nobody has more coins than anyone else, which would be unfair to the lazy.

Right now preminers, early miners and hackers are the ones who owns most.
I'm not a communist, but the the current distribution of bitcoins is unsustainable.

That will punish everyone who ever trusted in Bitcoins..!  I can understand you want to punish Thieves but I don't understand why you forget what will happen to those who left every thing to contribute to bitcoin community , some of members in this community i know who left there jobs after Indulged in love with BTC why punish those..!

I have thought about make a thread like this actually!

I would advise against starting a new "Bitcoin", we are already flooded with altcoins as it is!

I would recommend switching to Litecoin, it was also developed by Satoshi and large portions of it are not in the hands of criminals (public or private sector) yet. The implementation of litecoin is not too far removed from the original Bitcoin and it is still actively developed by known developers. Just as with bitcoin, the supply of Litcoins is strictly limited, unlike Dogecoin for example which, though popular, inflates infinitely and is therefore unsuitable as a store of value.

As the second biggest market (by far!) it might be our best bet!

disclosure: if have a ~15% position in LTC.

feel free to send me all ur 'old bitcoin', you can be happy with ur gox coins

You don't like Bitcoin, I say switch to Nxt, after all it's 800 times more cost efficient and 3000 more energy efficient due to proof of stake, not to mention having many other services built on top of it, which will allow the coin to basically be sent around with practically zero transaction fees, and the forgers will be paid via people using the Nxt messaging service, decentralized computing, and other services.  Not to mention anyone can forge, there is no incentive to buy heavy duty equipment that can be used to mine Bitcoin and is good for absolutely nothing other than mining Bitcoin.

http://www.nxtcrypto.org/

So switch to Ripple? With essentially everything premined?????

By the way, if you don't like bitcoin, why the "BitCoin" address begging?

Love this.

+1. Yes NXT is great

There are no closed source and no non-free software parts about Ripple since September 2013.

I don't think it would be in any position to replace Bitcoin though, it is far more of a threat to BitPay than to Bitcoin.

Anything closed source would be a mistake.

It all pays the same.   ;)

NXT I agree is great but why are people negative in Bitcoin cause of MtGox, stop being soft minded media suckers.

At which rate should we "poor rats" abandon the old bitcoin ship?

When the hackers and oligarchs holds:
60%
70%
80%
90%
99%
of all bitcoins mined.

Feel free to start a new cryptocurrency, plenty of folks have.

It won't affect bitcoin one bit.

Edit: You "poor rats" - abandoning cryptocurrency won't solve your problems because cryptocurrency didn't create your problems (poverty, inequality).

Capitalism did that, and it is capitalism that you need to abandon. Much harder, I know.

Premining and Stealing (hacking) is not part of capitalism.

lmao! thanks for the laugh. my favorite comment of the day

now if only nxt is hack-free id jump ship now. all these news about stealing BTC left and right is making me worried, i could be nxt you neva know

Promoting NXT in Bitcoin discussion, smart.

I remember listening to the hearings on Bitcoin in the US Congress. The "experts" that were speaking in front of the House were suggesting that a coin derived off of some of the innovative features of Bitcoin could be used to replace the current system. That probably means that they are talking about a centralized coin, which most of the people here who currently support Bitcoin would not want to be a part of. There are plenty of new "Bitcoins" started everyday and they are pretty much mostly useless and very cloneish. If you can come up with unique features that actually add something not thought of before and innovative, then starting a new Bitcoin might be a good idea.

I know, there exists 100+ altcoins.

The Old Bitcoin has been a wild west and many have been burned since it's inception, both noobs and early adaptors.
Therefore the burned users have incentive to jump on a new bitcoin-clone from scratch without premined coins, and be part of it from day 1 and with all experience they now have gained by MtGox. If many users and miners do switch over to New Bitcoin (by free will), the Old Bitcoin will fade away.

The mythical Satoshi figure holding 10% of all bitcoins should be enough as argument why we should let Old Bitcoin die.
Abandoning Old Bitcoin would of course be much easier to justify if the dollar value of Old Bitcoin was in millions instead of billions.

been done. see bytecoin.

bitcoin is bitcoin.. thats what its for.. no take backs.. no indian givers.. you wanna sell drugs.. guns.. or even uproot fiat.. i dont care... thats why bitcoin was created. if you're a damn fool and dont follow the protocol then you deserve to be robbed.. ie.. hold coins in our own wallets and dont let greed take over by trusting your coins to someone else (it says so right when you download bitcoin client !!! DONT TRUST OTHERS WITH YOUR COIN)

The point wasn't to spam and promote an altcoin but to tell that there are many innovative altcoins that have the potential to replace Bitcoin. Even if the name isn't Bitcoin 2.0 it goal is to replace Bitcoin by providing a "better" technology and fixing some flaws of Bitcoin.

No cryptocurrency is perfect but you are not forced to use one or an other. It is the choice of everyone.

I can understand why some people think thieves (eg. hackers, FBI, fraudsters, etc) deserve to be punished but why punish Satoshi? Without him, neither Bitcoin nor altcoins would exist.

I agree.

Whoever Satoshi is, he gave us new coin world. Without him we might not have cryptocurrencies until now.

You want to destroy all BTC forever, why?

No!
I can rescue what he will throw away.



Simply wrong, and enough people know that.

++  ;D

I'll give you this: you're sincere and you do have an eye for the downsides in the Bitcoin system [which, to remind everyone, was started off as a "Proof of Concept."]

But, you're trying to put the genie back into the bottle. What any cyber has going for it is the network effect, and Bitcoin's towers above any other cyber. I don't mean to deflate your dream, but you'd have about as much luck starting a "new eBay" with lower final value fees or a "new Paypal" with less choplogicy fraud-prevention algorithms. Many have tried; none prevailed.

Had you implemented this idea in 2010, it would have had a fighting chance. Not to mention instigated a blood feud that would be the stuff of legends now  ;)

I love the technology of cryptos, but I can also see the problems that needs to be solved.
Most bitcoiners are like fanatical religious people, they cannot accept anyone criticizing bitcoin.

I wish there wasnt a need to abandon the old bitcoin, but when so many coins are in wrong hands, I dont see any incentive for guys like me to stay on this ship instead of jumping on a better alt-coin.

I lost most my BTC in 2012. You don't here me crying about it. Man up Gollum and move on (BTC is here to stay).

Please also send unwanted BTC to 18UiYvAQ62U2t8oJKyMu2py9D2egvBNChM

The MTGox business was unfortunate, however I saw it coming.

You're now four pages in to a topic where you have basically managed to convince no one except people who are already pumping their favourite altcoin.

Can I suggest that you either

• Persevere with bitcoin
• Give up on bitcoin and cash out to an existing altcoin
• Go over to the altcoin forum and start laying out the plans for your new killer altcoin

There is no future in which continuing to post about how terribly upset you are with bitcoin achieves anything useful. If that was my genuinely held opinion then I would do one of the above.

Bitcoin is like the gold of fiat money, but digital. If you burn the gold, what does the value derive from?

I think no matter what currency or how it is manifested, will always have to have a top dog and a few little dogs like silver and copper for instance in fiat. So unless someone think they can overthrow the gold of digital currency then it appears to be on track for the same value tendencies as fiat. Kinda counter productive of the whole digital currency movement though eh but hey that is the way a value is formed so just embrace it and look for the silver and copper

Nxt is not an innovative one.
Nor do I see really anything 'innovative' around, just a few new features, that some have.

NXT=BitCoin2.0

FTFY.

If we created a new official Bitcoin, it would diminish the value of the old one and would discourage investors and miners. Why invest in a coin that someone will just replace with a 'fresh start' version every few years.

Lost coins due to forgotten wallet passwords, etc. make them even even rarer to the rest of us... and coins lost to theft are still in circulation.

They're called Alt Coins.

This would be a very bad idea for the crypto community.

NXT is crap. HoboNickels would be a better coin.

Its not an idea, its a natural consequence of unequal wealth distribution.
In real life we get revolutions, in cryptos we get alt-coins since there is no government to revolt against

Even communism is unequal, for the hard working individuals.

No man-made political/economical system is optimal, all systems will eventually change when a critical mass revolts against it.

In the beginning I believed bitcoin somehow would be more fair-play than our corrupt market economy where the wealth is concentrated in a few pockets based on their influence over politics.
Now I realize the speculation and wealth concentration in bitcoin is even worse than the real economy.
The more wealth is concentrated, the harder most people need to work to be part of that economy.

My dream is ultimately a contract-based alt-coin that will enable everyone to participate in the economy.
Inspiration: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BerkShares

They aren't needed, most of them.

1. There are already hundreds of altcoins, pick one that floats your boat.
2. There will be problems, minor and major, in any project, and "new Bitcoin" is no exception.
3. You can't "start over" because a couple people you don't like happened to get rich. You remind me of the kind of child that would do this:
turns off console
The game never finished, it doesn't count!

Terracoin has differences from Bitcoin. Twice as many coins and two minute block target, for starters.

 Okay OP, let me get this straight: Since you and some others lost their stash on Mt. Gox suddenly you want to start all over?

 So in effect you (the OP) want to reward failure, just exactly like the Banksters and all the wealthy elite were rewarded with bailouts, backstops and guarantees correct? (of course everyone else that had any savings, stocks, bonds or assets of almost any other kind, or pensions, were also all beneficiaries of the bailouts, etc., but nothing like the degree of the wealthy elite). But of course everyone got broke in 2008. Fully wiped out. Then instantly bailed out in secret, all while the deversion of the joke called TARP was passed in public view to the chumps. Fast forward to today and over 50 TRILLION in loans, backstops, and guarentees have bailed out the world since 2008 alone. With China alone spending 23 Trillion since then in loans/debts, a world record in such a short time frame. Runner up USA isn't far behind. And Europe is an utter disaster today for not doing so, oddly enough, or not, since Goldman and Co. made certain to fuck them all royally with one financial con after another (ripoff derivatives and swindles called interest rate swaps).

 Side note: I was one of the Shorts, for 20 months, during 2008-2009, that was short squeezed to near death by one illegal market intervention/manipulation after another, and finally hit by margin calls which I promptly covered, and lastly by a dead margin call that didn't give any option to cover, but instead instantly closed every position without the chance to make the margin call at all by way of a fast bank wire or ACH as is done in normal times.

 (read the fine print...that's the brokers option to utilize, all so they can fuck us/protect themselves, is their excuse. And btw just like Coinbase now uses in another fashion that reeks of criminal fraud and thief).

 Effectively one of my brokers, and wall street, and the banksters, and the US Treasury, plus the defective drugs peddled by Big Pharma all finally ended up royally screwing me into severe heart failure. So see OP, I won, but lost, in more than a few ways, much worse than merely losing my stash. Get a grip, all you lost was money and time. Your still young, and can start over. Many can't hope to do that since their not young anymore, nor in good health either. But still some of us fight like the devil himself, and refuse to give up, or give in. And will win by sheer will, or die trying.

 Back in the Fall of 2007 myself and a tiny few others knew it all was coming down starting right then and there, and we called it, and started preparing to make bank, but the little guy like myself didn't wager on the the very things that Goldman wagered on, who ended up getting 100% whole by way of bailing out AIG, etc.
Nope, we the little guys all got short squeezed until our balls turned blue when they wouldn't dare allow us to cover the margin calls because by then even the clueless brokers knew they too would be fucked if they allowed us to cover since the walls were indeed starting to tumble all down at that point (finally, early Sept. 2008).

 In effect all the Losers were made into Winners, and the real Winners were in effect made into Losers.

 So see here:

  Myself: I have little to no respect for anyone that didn't call it correctly way back in April/May 2000. And long before that back in 1981. Much less the very moment Nixon (Rep.) (the Commie Democrat) took us all off the Gold Standard and started this insane madness.

 We're all on borrowed time and money. The Powers that Be are extending and pretending, demanding the future pay for their sins and everyone elses that is at the top of the pyramid scheme, much less the rest of us still enjoying their sins of kicking the can just a little bit more forward, until financial armagetton, or N-Day *WW3.

 And now the OP wants to reward Failure too. O dear. Not a chance OP. NO WAY.

 As for your opening statement here goes (But in a different order of things to my liking):


1. Thieves = Central Banks and their Gold Bullion Reserves that they effectively stole from everyone else by way of Usury rates of Interest (btw: that are fundamentally impossible to ever pay back) on monies the central bank (in the case of the USA it's the "FED") created out of thin air and then "loan" to their client nation state (USA, etc.) into perpetuity (forever and ever, never ending as in FOREVER), and in the case of the USA since 1913.

 FED ie: Federal Reserve Bank, a Private, Criminal Banking Cartel owned by it's member banks and their shareholders through the issue of privately held stock that no one else can ever own).

 Western Central Banks = demand to completely dominate and control every last countries currency on this earth, and especially the 7 axis of evil countries noted by Bush Co. that were the sole holdouts. Of course two of those countries leaders were executed, one for not being receptive anymore for taking petro dollars for oil, and the other for daring to create a gold backed dinar currency. Not to mention the bought and paid for new government of Afghanistan. Toss in Syria, Iran, North Korea and Cuba and suddenly we find which countries left still have the balls to create their own debt free currencies, while the rest of the world is enslaved by debt based fiat currency with usury rates of unpayable interest into perpetuity (forever and ever) that cannot possibly ever be paid back due to the very nature of debt based fiat interest (as soon as the 1st dollar is loaned out there are suddenly more debts than dollars, Euros, etc.). Thus assuring to enslave the world to these criminal gangster central banksters. Hell, anyone but a fool or someone believing in the nonsense rightly termed propaganda in the mainstream news all knows these facts. But I lay them out again here for those that don't know THE REAL FACTS OF LIFE.

 Compare that to Hacker/Cracker thieves: Well, at least the hackers/crackers wont be enslaving the world into pepertuity with any interest fees at all, much less one's impossible to pay back and that keep eating up larger and larger percentages of national GDP. Much less not into perpetuity.


 No, I don't condone that behavor. There should be a death penalty for doing such a thing. Of course same for the Central Bank Banksters that have enslaved the world, counterfeited to the extreme, and committed crimes against humanity, as well as the highest of treason's. But back to hackers: the only effective way to stop it currently (slow them down) is to have the death penalty for such a crime, nothing less will prove effective, not even life in prison imo. Much the same for the Banksters.


2. FBI = regulatory body (like them or not, their merely doing their job) that shutdown and seized the funds of an outright illegal operation that everyone knew was highly risky, or at least should have damn well known it was. And congrats, now all those that did business at the Silk Road are likely known by the FBI and DEA too. Not good for their future unless they dump their illegal drugs and clean up their acts before their sought out so they don't get caught in the act at a later date, if ever, or merely partake in cannabis in legal jurisdictions. Pray the statute of limitations and or a long list of potential better criminal candidates to go after end up saving the better ones from the hell of the injustice system, etc.


3. Satoshi = 100% Earned his/her/their wealth. Nothing more to say here. At least Satoshi fully deserves whatever the market is willing to bare, and from the looks of things the market is fully willing to bare and trust in Satoshi.


4. Lost Coins = the very fundamentals of Digital cryptocurrency in their infancy, or due to various factors. For a long time to come coins will continue to be lost. Making surviving coins that much more valuable. Only improvements in technology and user habits can hope to minimize coin loss, and various other technical reasons involving coin loss. Think people. Adopt best habits for wallets and whom you trust, if anyone at all.
Best concept: One can trust people to a point! And that point is MONEY. We can't trust others with our money. Their going to disappoint us time after time unless their are assurances/insurance, etc. As for unregulated markets. Well that's what happened to Mt. Gox customers funds; an unregulated, uninsured marketplace. That's why Ron Paul isn't 100% of the solution, same for Austrian Economic Theory. Deregulation and Privatization are the two tragic flaws in Ron Paul's beliefs. And in Alan Greenspan's beliefs. I should now. I beat those two clowns too, hands down. Of course one is a consummate politician telling you exactly what you want to here. And the other is a Bankster that baffled you with pure bullshit. Get used to that. Or learn to outplay them.

 Yes, Ron Paul gets about 90% perfect. But blows it to hell and back on the topics of Deregulating everything, and Privatizing everything. Only a complete dimwitt or fool could think such schemes could ever work out to benefit anyone but those at the top. Ron Paul is the Billionaire Koch Brothers wet dream, a Tyrants wet dream come true. The rest would merely be at their mercy. A remake of the midevil age. A modern neo-midevil age is what is looming unless younger generations get their acts fully together and demand a whole lot better for themselves and everyone else. Otherwise their going to be enslaved worse than past generations by a factor of at least 2, if not 10, within a decade or two from today.

 Ron Paul is just a fool that believes in fairy tales, or incorrect theory, or is a Neo-Fascist of a different stripe much to the shock and horror of those that don't understand this terrible set of facts. No Western Economic theory isn't accurate either. And neither is Austrian Economic theory. Their both horribly flawed, on purpose.

 Measure out the 22,000,000.0000 0000 bitcoins and one comes up with effectively 100 trillion dollars if the last two digits are left for cents as I recall. Already I dismiss the decimal point since it's not at all relative in the scheme of things. So I read 0.00020000 as 20,000 satoshi's myself, and nothing else.

 Lastly: As for the OP and his term for Savers: Hoarders. = How fucking dare you. (please pardon me, I am currently in a very bad mood thinking of how I earned millions during the 2008-2009 crash but got royally screwed by the very thieves running everything straight into the abyss. Too bad I didn't know to invest in certain derivitives that would be made 100% whole like Goldman Sachs was made. Of course they even were allowed to retroactively change into a commercial bank so they could qualify for their very own personal bailout and backstops too. How quaint for them.

 So the OP wants to mention Rewarding Failure. Well what we already have is criminals enslaving almost the entire world today by way of usury rates of interest payments into perpetuity, not to mention all their other evil ways.

 And now the OP asks to abandon Bitcoin for Bitcoin 2.0 because he trusted some other party with his bitcoins while he played the role of a day trader, (or whatever), and unwittingly trusted they were safe parked there while he himself traded them there for profit.

 So no, you took the risk called being a Capitalist. And lost. Fair and Square.
================================================

 I and many others Won Fair and Square. But we wont ever be paid or made even half whole.
==========================================================


 And that is exactly why I am here; because Satoshi offered us all a way to avoid the same enslavement and capture we have all suffered from our entire lives. Satoshi is way smarter than any of us. He proved it. He won. And is getting paid when and if he wants to be paid as long as many keep supporting Bitcoin.

 Myself: I recently liquidated 3 dozen types of alternatives to Bitcoin over the last three months. I had a lot of alternative cryptos. Now I own almost exclusively Bitcoin because the alternatives can't and don't realize that this is a race into the marketplace, but they cannot pull their own heads out of their butts and see what their all doing so poorly. So Bitcoin it is, 98% Bitcoin is now my Portfolio. P.S. I sensed a crypto market top back in December 2013, confirmed in January 2014. The rest is what it is. A real free and true marketplace that some what to to reset, and start over, much like the OP. No thanks.


 I for one REFUSE to Reward Failure.
=======================

Capitalism NEVER rewards failure.
=====================


Only Fascists, Socialists and Communists reward Failure.
---------------------------------------------------------------


P.S. That's why I sign my posts the way I do!
 


Caveat emptor - let the buyer beware
========================

Benjamins is basically Bitcoin. Same numbers and everything I think. Just that asic slammed it at launch. Difficulty is like 1.4 million or some shit

Communism is centrally planned.
And modern day capitalism is also partially centrally planned since too much resources is concentrated in the hands of a few banks, corporations and the oligarchs.

We people can create a fair economy if we have the right tool to do so - digital bartering.
I believe in decentralized economy where everyone has the potential to be part of the economy without the need to have money from the beginning.
Money should be free, just like air.
Instead contributing your time or your assets would create value.

Crypto currencies will lead to a renaissance for bartering, since you won't need to physically barter, until time for settlement.

It will make local economies flourish, and will make it harder for wall street to parasite on the economy. But the local community that knows and trusts me will accept my contracts, and I accept theirs so we will have a local barter market.

 It's not Capitalism anymore.
==================

 This is Corporate Neo-Fasicsm.


But the term 'Corporatism' is the polite word to use in public since no one in polite company can stand to hear or utter the term fascism.


 Well if it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, and flies like a duck it's Fascism.


 Either it's State Fascist much like China where the STATE controls the country and even the corporations when and if it so desires, or Corporate controlled Fascism much like the USSA and EUROPA where the corporations and the wealthy elite are in firm control of everything and calling the shots from behind the scenes.


BUT:

 Capitalism, REAL capitalism, NEVER, EVER, rewards failure.
======================================

 And that is precisely how one can know for a fact that this is no longer real Capitalism.

 Some refer to it as 'Crony Capitalism', yet another polite phrase for public consumption that stands far and clear of the real fact that it's really and truly Fascism.


Call it whatever you care to, but I call it for what I see it as; Fascism.

 There is State Fascists such as so called Communist Red China.

 And Corporate Neo-Fascism which is the USA and Europe.

 Fascism came to Amerika in Nikes and Polo shirts, while everyone was sleepwalking. And it's way past time to wake up young men and women!



 Fascism - the marriage of corporations and government, where one or the other, controls the other.

 Today the largest and most powerful corporations write the bills and laws, and then stuff them down their bought and paid for government representatives throats. And past the Oval Office if need be. And they all do exactly what their corporate masters demand, or pay the price of not being loyal to their elite masters if they dare to get too far out of line. Of course their are exceptions and exclusions. But that's the general rule. And for those that don't play ball in the halls of Congress, or even the Oval Office. Well, ask assassinated presidents/future assured presidents ( JFK and his son JFK Jr.) what happens if and when they step or stand in the way of others that demand more, or much different things.

 The present day Coup de ta started in slow motion with the assassination of JFK decades ago. And with the assassination of his son JFK Jr in 1999 the Fascist takeover was completed in what some of us now term as "Amerika". Get used to it. Grow up. Smell the Fascism. It's everywhere.

 And seriously consider not watching and listening to the propaganda on the mainstream news channels on TV, and get the real news elsewhere instead. After all TV programming is called 'programming' for a very good reason people. Their brainwashing the public with today's flavor of what's obviously Corporate Controlled Propaganda News. Merely 6 corporations now own and control the mainstream news media today. Where as just recently about 200 corporations defused the news media that we all used to rely on for at least half honest news.

 Read the news instead, and not from those very same sources if at all possible. After a few years you will be amazed how far you will have come from breaking away and reversing the brainwashing that has kept oneself in a corporate propaganda stranglehold.


RIP  JFK & JFK Jr.


 Class dismissed.


Caveat emptor - let the buyer beware

Brilliant! ;D

What about a coin with a concept like this?:

Easy Vanity Voting
Abstract:

A simple, trustless, decentralized (p2p), proof-of-stake voting system achieved through voter generated vanity Bitcoin addresses.


Characteristics:
 
· Decentralized (p2p)
· Zero-trust (users retain complete control over 100% of their coins)
· Anyone can create a poll, vote and audit results.
· Theoretically, anyone could even implement the vote results (so long as any modified code was released open-source with binaries compiled using verifiable gitian builds).
· Based on Bitcoin blockchain
· Psuedo-anonymous
· Transparent
· Non-binding
· Auditable
· Adjustable to resist double-spends (double-votes)
· One-bitcoin-one-vote (as opposed to one-person-one-vote)
· Compatible with proxy voting pools
· Possibly, compatible with cumulative voting (to protect minority voting rights)
· Possibly, compatible with a modified form of instant run-offs
· Easy Vanity Voting functionality could be added to the client if this idea took hold
· Utilizes open-source command-line vanity address generator
o https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Vanitygen
 
Summary of System:

Easy Vanity Voting is a decentralized voting system that allows anyone to propose, cast and audit votes using end-user generated vanity addresses, where total votes cast equals total coins sent to each voter's self-controlled "vanity-voting address."
 
1. Any member from the community can propose a question along with possible answer choices.
2. Each answer choice is associated with a unique 6-letter “voting-address prefix.”
3. The question, possible answer choices (w/ corresponding “voting-address prefixes) and a blockheight-deadline (+ n confirmations) are publicly posted.
4. Before voting, each voting coinholder creates a unique, self-controlled “vanity-voting address” where the first 6-bits of said generated address match the posted 6-letter “voting-address prefix” corresponding to their desired vote choice.
5. During the voting period, each voting coinholder sends as many coins as they can/want to their self-controlled “vanity-voting address” until the blockheight-deadline (+ n confirmations) has passed.
6. One-Bitcoin equals one-vote.
7. At the blockheight-deadline (+ n confirmations), address balances for all addresses matching the applicable “voting-address prefixes” and meeting confirmation requirements are tallied and compared.
8. The answer choice with address balances exceeding 50% of total coins cast as votes is deemed the winner.
9. In the event no answer choice has address balances exceeding 50% of total coins cast as votes, a subsequent run-off election can be held between the top two vote choices.
 
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Proof-of-Concept:
Easy Vanity Voting Example
 
· An Easy Vanity Voting question has 3 parts: (1) the question, (2) potential answer choices and (3) Blockheight deadline (+ n confirmation).
· In this example we have 31 users using 100 coins to vote on a question 11 with 6 possible answers (100 coins were used to have round numbers).



http://bitcoinscrypt.org/ (http://bitcoinscrypt.org/)

http://theotherbitcoin.com/ (http://theotherbitcoin.com/)