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Bitcoin => Bitcoin Discussion => Topic started by: Chilwell on September 25, 2022, 11:27:22 AM



Title: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Chilwell on September 25, 2022, 11:27:22 AM
INTRODUCTION

Cryptocurrency is essentially a digital currency exchange and digital payments platform that uses blockchain technology. The technological and digital revolution over the last few decades has meant that innovative payment systems have been created and utilised, and cryptocurrency is one of the major breakthrough payment systems for business and personal finance use.

Although there are over 2,000 cryptocurrencies on the market now, Bitcoin is probably still the most known form of cryptocurrency in the blockchain market, and was the first cryptocurrency coin to go mainstream but there are other cryptocurrencies entering the market.

For Muslims across the Islamic world, the question arises as to whether crypto payment platforms are deemed to be halal or haram in the eyes of Allah and in accordance with Shariah principles, and whether as a currency it prevents money laundering.

CRYPTOCURRENCY

One of the defining aspects of cryptocurrency is that there is no central authority such as a Government that authorises it or records it.

Ultimately, it is the duty of every Muslim to be seeking knowledge, and this guide will address the use of the cryptocurrency market and its intrinsic value. We will consider whether crypto currency is permissible as a form of actual money under Islamic laws and in the Islamic world. We will consider the views of Islamic jurists and scholars on this emergence of what is considered to be new money addressing the question of is cryptocurrency halal.

ISLAMIC SCHOLARS INTERPRETATION - IS CRYPTOCURRENCY HALAL?

A comprehensive Islamic law interpretation, one that sparked a massive rise in Muslim investment in Bitcoin and Ethereum in 2018, was provided by Sharia advisor Mufti Muhammad Abu-Bakar (former advisor to Blossom Finance) who looked at the question of is cryptocurrency halal as a money supply. He argued that Bitcoin is permissible under Islamic principles.

ISLAMIC SCHOLARS

Another reason Islamic jurists and scholars from Muslim countries argue that cryptocurrency is halal is that the concept of the blockchain and other cryptocurrencies are inherently anti-interest when looked at from a money generation source or perspective.

Islamic banking laws are also anti-interest so the technology, pricing, and buying and selling of cryptocurrency money is deemed halal by many Islamic scholars who rely on the teachings of Prophet Muhammad PBUH when seeking guidance about permissibility (ultimately, only Allah knows best).


Source: https://www.qardus.com/news/what-is-cryptocurrency-and-is-it-halal#:~:text=As%20cryptocurrency%20money%20is%20deemed,as%20a%20form%20of%20currency.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: _act_ on September 25, 2022, 11:37:52 AM
Bitcoin is now legal in some Muslim countries. If governments understand what bitcoin is, no country would ban it.

Although there are over 2,000 cryptocurrencies on the market now, Bitcoin is probably still the most known form of cryptocurrency in the blockchain market, and was the first cryptocurrency coin to go mainstream but there are other cryptocurrencies entering the market.
There are over 21000 cryptocurrencies that are existing.

One of the defining aspects of cryptocurrency is that there is no central authority such as a Government that authorises it or records it.
It was true when bitcoin was created, also bitcoin is still like that, but altcoins are centralized to an extent.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Chilwell on September 25, 2022, 11:45:08 AM
I make this research because I found myself in a Muslim community where I want to teach them about bitcoin and their were surprised. They started asking me questions, what is that? Is it money? I told them to carm down, I will knowledge them on it. One of them from the community stood up and throw me questions about is Islamic rules, that is What Islam said about bitcoin?


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: noorman0 on September 25, 2022, 11:50:44 AM
The stance on cryptocurrency in Islam cannot be generalized. Islam has 4 main guiding figures as a reference approach to making laws regarding new, more modern matters, especially in the field of finance, which they call "madzhab". Southeast Asian Islamic countries have different laws because of the above, for example cryptocurrency in Malaysia is halal (https://www.halaltimes.com/malaysia-announces-permissiblity-of-crypto-currency-as-halal/) while in Indonesia it is the opposite (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-11-11/crypto-is-forbidden-for-muslims-says-indonesia-s-ulema-council).


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: DARKASHY on September 25, 2022, 12:39:57 PM
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: NotATether on September 25, 2022, 01:01:28 PM
Generally, all the Arab banks follow these principles (there are no western bank branches to be found there), so when these countries ban cryptocurrencies for whatever reason, it's for political and not religious reasons e.g. in Turkey, Afghanistan.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: GreatArkansas on September 25, 2022, 01:01:52 PM
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
Yeah, depends on usage. As far as I know, there are lot of prohibited by their religion, especially gambling, so if you do gambling using Bitcoin, for sure it's not legal based on their religion.
I have a friend of mine that also mentioned I think about doubling your money or somehow joining non-legit platforms.

Basically, Bitcoin is like fiat that they are using daily, you can use it anywhere, legal or non legal.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: jrrsparkles on September 25, 2022, 01:20:53 PM
Many leaders and influencers uses Bitcoin also for their dirty political game but actually they don't know anything about Bitcoin at all still they debate its against the Islam, in 2018 period even many of my friends refused to invest in bitcoin because their leaders says its haram so its against their law but the reality is the current banking system is against their Islamic law and we need to know how many Muslim doesn't have the bank account...


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Lucius on September 25, 2022, 01:25:37 PM
Generally, all the Arab banks follow these principles (there are no western bank branches to be found there), so when these countries ban cryptocurrencies for whatever reason, it's for political and not religious reasons e.g. in Turkey, Afghanistan.

Turkey (like Thailand) banned the use of cryptocurrencies as a means of payment, but trading is still allowed. In addition, in the discussion, one member who was obviously from Turkey confirmed that many do not respect this ban and continue to accept cryptocurrencies (restaurants, shops...)



I respect all religions, but I have not yet read anywhere or found out in any way that any other religion expressly forbids cryptocurrencies, except of course Islam, with which this issue has been associated for years. I already wrote once before that I would seriously consider belonging to a religion that would limit me in what I would invest in or perhaps how I would dress.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: tbct_mt2 on September 25, 2022, 01:47:27 PM
Basically, Bitcoin is like fiat that they are using daily, you can use it anywhere, legal or non legal.
Bitcoin is permissionless, censorless and borderless. You can use Bitcoin everywhere if you want for transactions. However, if you want to use it for exchanging it to fiat currencies, goods, etc. you will have to care of local laws.

Even it is not legal yet in one nation, you can still use VPN or Peer to Peer trading to buy or sell it. I don't scare about it too much because I believe in future, the adoption for Bitcoin only becomes bigger.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Zanab247 on September 25, 2022, 02:07:50 PM
Quote
I make this research because I found myself in a Muslim community where I want to teach them about bitcoin and their were surprised. They started asking me questions, what is that?  Is it money? I told them to carm down, I will knowledge them on it. One of them from the community stood up and throw me questions about is Islamic rules, that is What Islam said about bitcoin?
I don't think, Islam is against any good thing in the land, just that the leaders of Islam don't know what Bitcoin is all about and what it can do to any region that will make it legal for their followers to enjoy. Other countries that rejected Bitcoin years ago Base on region in their land are now looking for way to make it legal for their citizens and to create a good environment for the bitcoiners in the land. I believe, with time  they will break the Islamic rules to allow their citizens to have access to Bitcoin and to acquire the knowledge of Bitcoin so that they can grow well like the way other countries that made it legal are growing in their land.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Coyster on September 25, 2022, 02:52:49 PM
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
Bitcoin is not governed by anyone, religion or group of people, bitcoin is decentralized and only the user who owns the funds governs controls their own personal funds, i don't know where you get that impression of Bitcoin being governed by muslims.
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Not only in Islam, but generally, and even from an ethical point of view, we all want Bitcoin to be used for legal activities, but just as fiat is used too, there's nothing we can do to stop some fraudulent people from using Bitcoin for the wrong reasons.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: taufik123 on September 25, 2022, 03:20:00 PM
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Not only in Islam, but generally, and even from an ethical point of view, we all want Bitcoin to be used for legal activities, but just as fiat is used too, there's nothing we can do to stop some fraudulent people from using Bitcoin for the wrong reasons.
like a knife that can be used for cooking and can be used to injure people. Just how to use it. Bitcoin is just a digital asset that can be used for anything. As you said, in general this is just a matter of ethical point of view, not fixated on any particular religion. Any religion will certainly forbid if it is used for illegal things.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: BIT-BENDER on September 25, 2022, 03:28:23 PM
This topic is one that fascinates me everytime I read it, and that's religion having laws on digital asset like crypto-currency. The origins of religions most of the times dates back to times before Christ and by this times no one would have Phantom an idea of digital asset or even bitcoin.

How come after its creation and it gain popularity religion started to be brought into it. It's sentimental to me to say the least, I feel if someone in power doesn't like the idea of a thing the person try hard to find out rules that they would use to stop it. And that's exactly what Bitcoin and Crypto-currency is going through in the hands of religion and some Government.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Little Mouse on September 25, 2022, 03:29:30 PM
Using bitcoin as a form of monetary transaction is the same as using any other form of currency. It can be traditional money, it can be gold or silver, or anything else. I really don't see a reason to have an argument here as some of the scholars did. Some even said that it's haram. I'm not a scholar, nor any expert in religion but I can surely say that if you are doing bad activities with any form of currency, it's bad while if you are not going to use it for bad activities, it's good regardless of whatever the currency is.

This topic is one that fascinates me everytime I read it, and that's religion having laws on digital asset like crypto-currency. The origins of religions most of the times dates back to times before Christ and by this times no one would have Phantom an idea of digital asset or even bitcoin.
That's something else. There are Quran and Hadith to live a peaceful life. Scholars use some references to define something halal or haram but some don't get the actual reference and which is why they make mistake on such issue.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: bitcampaign on September 25, 2022, 04:37:21 PM
I live in a place with the largest Muslim majority so many people also think that crypto is haram in my country, of course, that's probably because the religious leaders at my place don't learn a little technology about crypto and learn a little so it will be easier to interpret the Islamic rules. applies, unfortunately it doesn't happen in my place because the average forbids it, I will give this reference to my friends, thank you


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: hugeblack on September 25, 2022, 06:56:39 PM
I do not know what was said that it is (“halal-permitted”), but to issue such statements, you need a body of senior scholars, and these scholars need strong evidence, and then you can say that it is permissible.
It is just as if a scientist said that there is water in the planet Neptune, but it is not the same as saying that there is water in the moons of Jupiter, which is considered by the scientific community.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Vaskiy on September 25, 2022, 06:57:26 PM
Look at Nigeria. It have got around 55% Islam population, and the people are getting adopted to it. This have been happening as a result of technology advancement and people are interested to get used to it. Everyone are talking about its need and the goodness it can bring into the society. Different religions have different beliefs and this also doesn't mean majority of the people follow it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: OgNasty on September 25, 2022, 07:29:09 PM
Forgive me for my ignorance, but is Ethereum now frowned upon in the Islam community now that staking has become a part of their coin?  This also leads me to wonder, since the Lightning network uses routing fees built into the protocol, is that also frowned upon in the Islam community?  If Bitcoin were to implement on-chain staking, would this effect the acceptance of it by Islamic people?  I seem to remember back in the day the biggest lender here was Islamic and refused to participate in loans that had an interest rate or anything that had a direct return of dividends, etc.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: ChiBitCTy on September 25, 2022, 07:56:55 PM
Bitcoin is now legal in some Muslim countries. If governments understand what bitcoin is, no country would ban it.

Although there are over 2,000 cryptocurrencies on the market now, Bitcoin is probably still the most known form of cryptocurrency in the blockchain market, and was the first cryptocurrency coin to go mainstream but there are other cryptocurrencies entering the market.
There are over 21000 cryptocurrencies that are existing.

One of the defining aspects of cryptocurrency is that there is no central authority such as a Government that authorises it or records it.
It was true when bitcoin was created, also bitcoin is still like that, but altcoins are centralized to an extent.

Government’s absolutely without question know exactly what bitcoin is now and how it works and that’s exactly why so many of them don’t like it and it’s properties. They realize that it’s a better system than their current system and it threatens the strength of their own currency which is of course something no government wants or is okay with.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Chilwell on September 25, 2022, 08:44:26 PM
I heard a theory once that Allah might have been gay. Is that true?
We can joke with many things, but we shouldn't joke with Allah.
I don't blame you I assume you are ignorance of what you are saying. Please watch your tongue because the Allah has the power to do anything he want and no one will question him


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Moeda on September 25, 2022, 09:28:14 PM
Forgive me for my ignorance, but is Ethereum now frowned upon in the Islam community now that staking has become a part of their coin?  This also leads me to wonder, since the Lightning network uses routing fees built into the protocol, is that also frowned upon in the Islam community?  If Bitcoin were to implement on-chain staking, would this effect the acceptance of it by Islamic people?  I seem to remember back in the day the biggest lender here was Islamic and refused to participate in loans that had an interest rate or anything that had a direct return of dividends, etc.
Based on my knowledge. Staking is the activity of keeping money "Ethereum or any crypto" in exchange for an interest in a certain percentage amount each year or for a certain period of time.
Conventional banks are prohibited in Islam because of the interest system applied by both the borrower and the lender. This concept is also almost the same as that applied by some crypto platforms to store Ethereum and earn a certain percentage of interest every year. Automatically the concept of staking is the same as the concept of conventional banks.
The basis of bank interest is haram because the interest is set unilaterally, namely by the lender or the borrower.
Of course, the law is fair, if conventional banks are haram based on certain studies, then the staking system is also haram.

To avoid haram against bank interest is very easy. What must be applied is the initial agreement by both parties.
For example, a consumer borrows money from a bank, then the bank asks the consumer. The bank will give money to the consumer, the consumer must give 10% profit to the bank, can the consumer be able to?
Then the consumer said it was too high, what if 5%?
The bank said it was too low, what if it was 7%?
Then the consumer party answered agree.
After agreeing to both parties then a letter of agreement was made with the result of an agreement of 7%.
Indeed, this method looks difficult, but lenders and loan recipients both feel safe and comfortable with the results of the agreements they make.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: milewilda on September 25, 2022, 09:43:47 PM
I heard a theory once that Allah might have been gay. Is that true?
We can joke with many things, but we shouldn't joke with Allah.
I don't blame you I assume you are ignorance of what you are saying. Please watch your tongue because the Allah has the power to do anything he want and no one will question him
Just ignore these type of people who cant just simply respect others religion.We know that on this world there are people who are really dealing up these differences not only on religion but also in races
where people do always have something to say in relation to that, just let them be because there's nothing they could get on disrespecting other peoples beliefs.
I dont usually make out any comments nor objections on someones views specially if its pertaining to religion.Lets just respect one another, if we've seeing something
which is prohibited nor allowed on certain religions then so be it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: glendall on September 26, 2022, 08:34:20 AM
why bitcoin is always associated with religion, I think all religions will accept bitcoin.
the problem is,  the government is afraid that its currency/means of payment will be replaced by bitcoin
and it all goes back to the individual in dealing with this


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Hyphen(-) on September 26, 2022, 08:57:09 AM
I make this research because I found myself in a Muslim community where I want to teach them about bitcoin and their were surprised. They started asking me questions, what is that? Is it money? I told them to carm down, I will knowledge them on it. One of them from the community stood up and throw me questions about is Islamic rules, that is What Islam said about bitcoin?
Since there is no interest involved in trading, which consists only of buying and selling, as you stated earlier in the OP, and since interest is considered Ribahh in accordance with the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed, and Islamic banks are therefore opposed to interest, Bitcoin is now completely Halal.

My second concern right now is about cryptocurrency staking. Many people stake their coins in order to receive a percentage staking reward, which may be their interest in the staking. Is this practice also lawful or its Haram according to Islamic teaching?


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Yawa2020 on September 26, 2022, 09:36:16 AM
Islam forbids us in various scriptures from basing our financial decisions only on chance and good fortune. The fundamental idea of what is permitted and what is prohibited is mentioned in the Holy Quran, as Allah, the Almighty says:
"They ask you about alcohol and gambling. In each, there is significant sin and harm, as well as certain advantages for men; but, their sin and harm are larger than their advantage. (Sura al-Baqara, Ch. 2: V. 220)
Cryptocurrency is more or less like a gambling. Hence, some scholars consider it as haram.
One thing to also consider when it comes to finance in Islam is the source of money. "Any form of business whose source of funding is ambiguous or disguised is severely forbidden" for this very reason many scholars see it as haram. In this case, since there's no unanimous agreement that it's absolutely haram, we engage in it with extreme caution and try to avoid certain things that will certainly make it a complete haram.
Forgive me for my ignorance, but is Ethereum now frowned upon in the Islam community now that staking has become a part of their coin?  This also leads me to wonder, since the Lightning network uses routing fees built into the protocol, is that also frowned upon in the Islam community?  If Bitcoin were to implement on-chain staking, would this effect the acceptance of it by Islamic people?  I seem to remember back in the day the biggest lender here was Islamic and refused to participate in loans that had an interest rate or anything that had a direct return of dividends, etc.
As long as interest is involved, it it against Islam.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Fundamentals Of on September 26, 2022, 09:49:01 AM
Honestly speaking I don't understand why a supposed to be neutral technological invention has to be approved by organized religions. What is the sense of permitting or not permitting Bitcoin when it wasn't created to harm anybody. It was created to be a peer-to-peer currency and that is something that is not within the realm of organized religion to permit or not to permit. Are religious leaders even authorities when it comes to choosing which currency is the best to be used in financial transactions across the world?


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: knowngunman on September 26, 2022, 10:14:23 AM
Honestly speaking I don't understand why a supposed to be neutral technological invention has to be approved by organized religions. What is the sense of permitting or not permitting Bitcoin when it wasn't created to harm anybody. It was created to be a peer-to-peer currency and that is something that is not within the realm of organized religion to permit or not to permit. Are religious leaders even authorities when it comes to choosing which currency is the best to be used in financial transactions across the world?
Lol!  ;D you're right. But Islam and Muslims are being guided by principles  for their own good. Can you imagine even when it comes to eating and defecation, Islam has a rules guiding every bit of our affairs and we are fine with it. Religious leaders and authorities are meant to be followed and that's the essence of having them in the first place. However, for the purpose of clarity, Bitcoin usage has not been totally ruled out of Islam. It can be considered as illegal if has gambling features because Islam urge Muslims to stay away from gambling and it likes.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Leviathan.007 on September 26, 2022, 10:45:23 AM
Since I'm not a religious person I can't have exact information about Islam and bitcoin, but from what we can see there are many Islamic countries all over the world and you can use bitcoin there legally without any problem, so I guess Islam won't have any problem with bitcoin, however, if you ask me most of the Islam leaders don't have complete information about bitcoin and if start talking about bitcoin they will ask what is bitcoin, is this money, how created it, etc... because they mostly have no information about new technologies at all.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Jody.Drummer on September 26, 2022, 03:00:51 PM
This is not a realm that we really understand in depth. although actually as religious people must obey every command and prohibition of their respective religious guidelines. The Halal and Haram laws of Bitcoin have always been a separator and many ended up having disagreements. Therefore, I cannot comment further on the law. To me as long as we can put it to good use it's probably forgivable. I am not religiously clean from haram acts. I realize that the issue of Bitcoin law goes back to the opinions of scholars, the Qur'an, Hadist, Ijma, and Qiyash.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Fundamentals Of on September 26, 2022, 03:11:54 PM
Honestly speaking I don't understand why a supposed to be neutral technological invention has to be approved by organized religions. What is the sense of permitting or not permitting Bitcoin when it wasn't created to harm anybody. It was created to be a peer-to-peer currency and that is something that is not within the realm of organized religion to permit or not to permit. Are religious leaders even authorities when it comes to choosing which currency is the best to be used in financial transactions across the world?
Lol!  ;D you're right. But Islam and Muslims are being guided by principles  for their own good. Can you imagine even when it comes to eating and defecation, Islam has a rules guiding every bit of our affairs and we are fine with it. Religious leaders and authorities are meant to be followed and that's the essence of having them in the first place. However, for the purpose of clarity, Bitcoin usage has not been totally ruled out of Islam. It can be considered as illegal if has gambling features because Islam urge Muslims to stay away from gambling and it likes.

I actually don't have anything against people who are submitting themselves to religious authorities. It's their freedom and choice. I also have friends and families who are also religious themselves. But I am just expressing my opinion based also on my own free choices. After all we are all free to make our own path. And I don't agree when religious authorities seem to dictate on us on things that are no longer within their expertise and authority. I doubt of these religious leaders' understanding of Bitcoin for example.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: beerlover on September 26, 2022, 07:29:34 PM
Obviously religion is important for some people, it doesn't mean that bitcoin really cared about religion when it was first created, that wasn't the point for it but it is good that it doesn't. We wouldn't really further ourselves by hurting each other's feelings, if Islamic population is happy that it is not haram, then it's good, because we would prefer it this way and everyone to join us at all times, it's much better.

Doesn't mean that it would hurt bitcoin at all, and it would help bitcoin in the long run. The ones who join would not have the fear of doing something that is sinful, and that would allow a lot more people to join as well.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: DARKASHY on September 26, 2022, 08:09:18 PM
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
Bitcoin is not governed by anyone, religion or group of people, bitcoin is decentralized and only the user who owns the funds governs controls their own personal funds, i don't know where you get that impression of Bitcoin being governed by muslims.
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Not only in Islam, but generally, and even from an ethical point of view, we all want Bitcoin to be used for legal activities, but just as fiat is used too, there's nothing we can do to stop some fraudulent people from using Bitcoin for the wrong reasons.
Thanks for explaining a bit about Bitcoin.
Without ignoring what you have said, it is true that Bitcoin is not regulated by anyone and by any religion. The nature of Bitcoin can only be controlled by the user who owns the address. You also don't forget that the OP invites a discussion regarding the Bitcoin law in Islam and I try to interpret that in Islam, it has regulated the haram and halal provisions, including the halal and haram provisions on Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Zlantann on September 26, 2022, 08:14:42 PM
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
I totally agree that this topic of Bitcoin and Islam depends on the usage. Islam forbids interest on loans which is referred to as riba. Most Islamic bank in my country give out interest free loans to their customers after they have met with certain criteria. My country even took loan from an international Islamic bank without interest.

Bitcoin usage just like fiat can be a rightouse or sinful move according to Islamic law. Bitcoin just like fiat can be used for loans with or without interest. If I am running an investment company that give out Bitcoin loans with interest, then my actions have made Bitcoin sinful. But if my investment firm give out loans in the form of Bitcoin without interest, then it is not riba.

Just like commercial banks give out fiat interest backed loans and Islamic commercial banks give out interest free loans. It is not fiat that is sinful or holy but the actions of the two banks.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: TimeTeller on September 26, 2022, 08:19:36 PM
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
Bitcoin is not governed by anyone, religion or group of people, bitcoin is decentralized and only the user who owns the funds governs controls their own personal funds, i don't know where you get that impression of Bitcoin being governed by muslims.
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Not only in Islam, but generally, and even from an ethical point of view, we all want Bitcoin to be used for legal activities, but just as fiat is used too, there's nothing we can do to stop some fraudulent people from using Bitcoin for the wrong reasons.
Thanks for explaining a bit about Bitcoin.
Without ignoring what you have said, it is true that Bitcoin is not regulated by anyone and by any religion. The nature of Bitcoin can only be controlled by the user who owns the address. You also don't forget that the OP invites a discussion regarding the Bitcoin law in Islam and I try to interpret that in Islam, it has regulated the haram and halal provisions, including the halal and haram provisions on Bitcoin.

Though the OP invites discussion regarding bitcoin when it comes to Islamic way of life.
I believe, such laws and regulations depend on their people themselves.
Because they have their own understanding of what activities are to be categorized as halal or haram with respect to their teachings.
And because there is no defined laws towards bitcoin, it now depends on their leaders how to identify those activities in reference to their regulations.
But the good thing about here is that, everyone, no matter what religion you have, you can always btc at your own disposal.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: CryptoHeadlineNews on September 26, 2022, 08:23:17 PM
Cryptocurrency is essentially a digital currency exchange and digital payments platform that uses blockchain technology.
I don't know where you got this definition from, but I'm sure that's not the definition of what "Cryptocurrency" is, cryptocurrency is not "a digital currency exchange" but "Cryptocurrency are digital currencies which verified and records transactions on it's blockchain using cryptography. And there are over 2000 cryptocurrencies on the blockchain of which Bitcoin is the first decentralized digital currency, launched in 2009 by an anonymous fellow named ''Satoshi Nakamoto".. So O.P, you have a wrong concept about Cryptocurrency and i guess you need more time to DYOR.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: KennyR on September 26, 2022, 08:53:19 PM
Bitcoin is just an innovation. Based on its usage access some termed it to be against the Islam law. Just because it is virtual and mentioned non tangible it is considered not halal. Different muslim scholars have shared their views. There are people who find themselves wrong and stay away from using bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. Bitcoin is speculative from its beginning days and the same being connected to halal and haram seems unwanted.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: yudi09 on September 27, 2022, 06:21:17 AM
Don't limit your understanding since Bitcoin has been explicitly governed by Muslims.
Bitcoin is not governed by anyone, religion or group of people, bitcoin is decentralized and only the user who owns the funds governs controls their own personal funds, i don't know where you get that impression of Bitcoin being governed by muslims.
Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.
Not only in Islam, but generally, and even from an ethical point of view, we all want Bitcoin to be used for legal activities, but just as fiat is used too, there's nothing we can do to stop some fraudulent people from using Bitcoin for the wrong reasons.
Thanks for explaining a bit about Bitcoin.
Without ignoring what you have said, it is true that Bitcoin is not regulated by anyone and by any religion. The nature of Bitcoin can only be controlled by the user who owns the address. You also don't forget that the OP invites a discussion regarding the Bitcoin law in Islam and I try to interpret that in Islam, it has regulated the haram and halal provisions, including the halal and haram provisions on Bitcoin.
The use of bitcoin in Islam if used for transactions is allowed, such as Fiat currency transactions. When people who use bitcoin for other things that lead to negative things, are not allowed. Case examples such as loan interest from conventional banks. That is clearly not allowed. Why? the length of the explanation.
You seem to know the answer why it is prohibited.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Razmirraz on September 27, 2022, 09:26:10 AM
Op. based on some of the posts that I quote, you can conclude that Bitcoin is permissible in Islam or not.

Depending on usage. Bitcoin is legal if used as a medium of trade. For instance, utilizing Bitcoin for cash transactions similar to those using fiat currencies.

Bitcoin is now legal in some Muslim countries. If governments understand what bitcoin is, no country would ban it.

The stance on cryptocurrency in Islam cannot be generalized. Islam has 4 main guiding figures as a reference approach to making laws regarding new, more modern matters, especially in the field of finance, which they call "madzhab". Southeast Asian Islamic countries have different laws because of the above, for example cryptocurrency in Malaysia is halal (https://www.halaltimes.com/malaysia-announces-permissiblity-of-crypto-currency-as-halal/) while in Indonesia it is the opposite (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-11-11/crypto-is-forbidden-for-muslims-says-indonesia-s-ulema-council).

Yeah, depends on usage. As far as I know, there are lot of prohibited by their religion, especially gambling, so if you do gambling using Bitcoin, for sure it's not legal based on their religion.
I have a friend of mine that also mentioned I think about doubling your money or somehow joining non-legit platforms.

Basically, Bitcoin is like fiat that they are using daily, you can use it anywhere, legal or non legal.

like a knife that can be used for cooking and can be used to injure people. Just how to use it. Bitcoin is just a digital asset that can be used for anything. As you said, in general this is just a matter of ethical point of view, not fixated on any particular religion. Any religion will certainly forbid if it is used for illegal things.


I hope you can lock this thread soon to maintain the peace of the religious community and prevent posts like this from happening.
I heard a theory once that Allah might have been gay. Is that true?



Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: fadhilz123 on September 27, 2022, 11:45:21 AM
The use of bitcoin in Islam if used for transactions is allowed, such as Fiat currency transactions. When people who use bitcoin for other things that lead to negative things, are not allowed. Case examples such as loan interest from conventional banks. That is clearly not allowed. Why? the length of the explanation.
You seem to know the answer why it is prohibited.

I don't think the explanation is that long and let's just say it is "usury" and usury is something that is clearly forbidden in Islam so that until now there have been very many Islamic scholars who have issued fatwas on this matter and one of them is what the scholars say , both Salaf scholars (four schools) and contemporary scholars, all agree on the prohibition of usury. Even scholars who allow bank interest also forbid usury. (See: Al-Mabsut chapter 14 page 36, Al-Syarh al-Kabir chapter 3 page 226, Nihayatul Muhtaj chapter 4 page 230, Al-Mughni chapter 4 page 240, Al-Tafsir al-Wasit chapter 1 page 513). Source (https://islam.nu.or.id/fiqih-perbandingan/ragam-pendapat-ulama-tentang-hukum-bunga-bank-rDsVp)

Bitcoin in general is a digital currency that can only be used when there is internet and it is absolutely not wrong if Islamic people want to use it in good places and also for positive things. As in the example of donating Bitcoin to flood-stricken Pakistanis through organizations that know Bitcoin and how to cash it into fiat money.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: kryptqnick on September 27, 2022, 01:33:15 PM
I've just recently watched wonderful Oxford debates  (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n-zYRZy5NQ)of Islam vs Atheism, and I got the feeling that Islam is quite open to science, to technologies. While it's conservative in certain areas, IT is probably not among them because, given that there was no IT in the times of Quran, there are no restrictions on it either. I am happy that Islamic scholars investigated this matter and clarified that it's permissible to use cryptocurrencies. While I'm far from Islam, there are more than two billion Muslims worldwide, so it's a sort of decision and opinion that affects a huge number of people in the world.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: samuraijin on September 27, 2022, 02:02:49 PM
Islam does not prohibit someone from owning Bitcoin and the law is not in the Koran, unless someone uses it to gamble, sell people, buy alcohol, or lend bitcoins to people who need it, in order to make a profit, or what is called usury, it's actually simple if we compare it with real money sometimes it is also often used for extravagance, so back again it all depends on the person's use, if you use it wrong then it will be forbidden in Islam, but if it is used for charity or donating to an orphan then it will be a blessing for that person...


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Pandu Geddon on September 27, 2022, 02:38:36 PM
Islam does not prohibit someone from owning Bitcoin and the law is not in the Koran, unless someone uses it to gamble, sell people, buy alcohol, or lend bitcoins to people who need it, in order to make a profit, or what is called usury, it's actually simple if we compare it with real money sometimes it is also often used for extravagance, so back again it all depends on the person's use, if you use it wrong then it will be forbidden in Islam, but if it is used for charity or donating to an orphan then it will be a blessing for that person...
Of course, nothing in the Quran mentions Bitcoin. but I believe some Islamic authorities will consider Bitcoin and other Cryptocurrencies from a more positive or negative point of view to the ummah as halal and haram considerations.

Islam will not oppose technological developments. as long as they will provide convenience and positive value for everyone.

unless someone uses it to gamble,
I personally, use Bitcoin for something that is forbidden in Islam, (gambling).
I know it's my bad habit. but I consider Bitcoin halal for Muslims. all that is lawful eventually can also become unlawful as you said. It all depends on the use.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Asiska02 on September 27, 2022, 09:42:16 PM
Many opinions have been expressed on whether bitcoin is halal or haram to Muslims. Following the Islamic jurisprudence, it is permissible for Muslims to use bitcoin as long as it is used legally and not for any other harmful purpose. According to Islam, bitcoin is viewed as a currency that can be traded and utilized for transactions.

Another question is why people save their coins in order to double them later for sale. When people see this, they assume it is illegal. Again, this can be observed from another viewpoint. Assume you purchased a plot of land for $100; after 10 years, the plot of land cannot be sold for the same price because the value must have increased by then, and it will be sold at its current worth. When the price of bitcoin doubles, it is permissible to sell and utilize it at the existing price.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Mahanton on September 27, 2022, 09:49:56 PM
Many opinions have been expressed on whether bitcoin is halal or haram to Muslims. Following the Islamic jurisprudence, it is permissible for Muslims to use bitcoin as long as it is used legally and not for any other harmful purpose. According to Islam, bitcoin is viewed as a currency that can be traded and utilized for transactions.

Another question is why people save their coins in order to double them later for sale. When people see this, they assume it is illegal. Again, this can be observed from another viewpoint. Assume you purchased a plot of land for $100; after 10 years, the plot of land cannot be sold for the same price because the value must have increased by then, and it will be sold at its current worth. When the price of bitcoin doubles, it is permissible to sell and utilize it at the existing price.
There should really be reconsideration and not would really be making out absolute decision for it to be avoided specially on Religion like islam.I was aware it was halal
but i did make out some recent research that Bitcoin or crypto trading turns out to be haram.
https://aims.education/is-bitcoin-halal-or-bitcoin-haram/

So there are different perspective on here basing up on certain conditions but well its their religion and lets respect on that.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Mpamaegbu on September 27, 2022, 10:42:26 PM
I don't see why Bitcoin shouldn't be permissible in Islam. Those who want to make this case against it based on, "it depends on what Bitcoin is used for" should please spare us that loopsided opinion. If Bitcoin were (take note of my supposition as used in conditional term there) for illegal stuff, should that automatically rule out the other good side it has? Should that make Muslims reject using it? What about fiat? Don't we all know how criminals use fiat to perpetuate evil? Yet no one (no Muslim) has refused it. Why is that so?


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Rengga Jati on September 27, 2022, 11:03:43 PM
In my country, there are still some differences of opinion about whether Bitcoin or other crypto is haram or not. However, the Indonesian Ulema Council MUI) stated that this is haram for several reasons.

This may be almost the same as some of the debates as to why Bitcoin is legal and illegal. There are several positive and negative sides.

But for me personally, if we can control ourselves in Bitcoin, don't use it as money laundering or other negative activities, and be aware of what I'm doing so that I can control myself more so that I don't just invest at will and panic later, as long as I earn more. the positive side compared to the downside, why not?


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Razmirraz on September 28, 2022, 04:57:54 AM
But for me personally, if we can control ourselves in Bitcoin, don't use it as money laundering or other negative activities, and be aware of what I'm doing so that I can control myself more so that I don't just invest at will and panic later, as long as I earn more. the positive side compared to the downside, why not?
As long as it's used for positive things, I think it's understandable. All this depends on the intentions of each, what Bitcoin is used for. If Bitcoin is used for investment media or daily trading for profit (in the positive category) it is allowed, because there is no element of crime there. But if on the contrary, Bitcoin is used for money laundering as you mentioned above or finance the activities of a group to do evil things, of course Islam strictly forbids it.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: worle1bm on September 28, 2022, 05:20:22 AM
The islamic countries have negative viewpoints on it and maybe consider it as gambling as it's strictly prohibited in their religion but they are not putting a direct ban on it's usage and you can still see people trading in crypto over these Muslim countries.

There might be some who differentiate on the basis of Halal or Haram but it depends on our actual usage like you are the one who will decide how to use it sp come does it end up in bad situation? It's another form of money only and you can't deny the fact.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: AnotherAlt on September 28, 2022, 06:39:35 AM
Forgive me for my ignorance

I would love to answer you. I am not a scholar. Not a Religion expert either. If there is any religious expert, Feel free to correct me. I will answer the last question First.

I seem to remember back in the day, the biggest lender here was Islamic and refused to participate in loans with an interest rate or anything with a direct return of dividends, etc.

Most Muslims from Arab, Africa, and Asia are Muslim by Born. Arab countries tend to follow Islamic rules hardly. There are a lot of restrictions if you follow all the rules (A lot of freedom too). Nowadays, many Muslims don't care about the rules of Islam. They don't participate in prayers. If you follow the rules, You should pray five times a day which only real Muslims do right now. If you follow the rules, You cannot drink alcohol. You cannot look at girls for the 2nd time (It is okay to see once by mistake). You cannot steal people's money. You cannot gamble. You cannot promote gambling. But, Only a few percent of Muslims follow all the rules of Islam. The rest of us are Muslim by the name only. We don't follow the rules. I am a Muslim. I know I am promoting a casino to get paid, and it's Haram. I believe the same kind of people exists in every religion. So, I respect that guy who tried to follow the rules because of his belief.


is Ethereum now frowned upon in the Islam community that Staking has become a part of their coin?

Every POS coins are Haram in Islam. Because Staking interests you, you had to do nothing except stake it somewhere. But, I don't think All Muslims will ignore ETH.

This also leads me to wonder, since the Lightning Network uses routing fees built into the protocol, is that also frowned upon in the Islam community?

My Answer is no because to power up the Lightning network. You had to spend utility bills, and you had to invest in buying hardware. It's a kind of service. If someone uses your service, they must pay a few service fees, which is okay in Islam.

If Bitcoin were to implement on-chain staking, would this affect its acceptance of it by Islamic people?

The same Answer as ETH. Yeah, It would be Haram, but Not All Muslims care about it. But I believe Bitcoin wouldn't be there if it were a POS coin. POS would make it centralized. You are an early Bitcoiner. I think you know better than me.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Gallar on September 28, 2022, 07:19:29 AM
if you look at cryptocurrencies, especially bitcoin,
Is it an investment or can it also be interpreted as buying and selling?
and from my experience, the system of buying and selling or investing in crypto, it is very safe, without interest, and the transaction is also very transparent or clearly visible,
and many great scholars also allow or legalize crypto,


and those who say crypto is haram, maybe he hasn't studied it yet, what is crypto,

because if you deepen crypto, it's a very good buying and selling system and investment

Therefore, there are many scholars who forbid it
because it may not be studied seriously.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: tjtonmoy on September 28, 2022, 07:46:49 AM
There's nothing wrong using BTC as a Muslim, and this post shows exactly that. OP has done a great job making this post. I'm from a Muslim country and people say that in Islam, what you can't see, that can't be a currency for trade purpose which is halal. But all I can understand that it's not coming from interest or free. You are exchanging money to get BTC.
So it is true that this is ok to use BTC from the perspective of Islam. Again, as OP said. Only Allah know's the best.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: xzy887 on September 29, 2022, 10:05:48 AM
It will depend on the users of Bitcoin. All over the world everything is used in two ways 'good and bad'. Same with Bitcoin. Now if you use Bitcoin for good deeds then it is permissible in Islamic disti. And if someone does bad things with Bitcoin then Islam will never allow that user. Because no bad act is permissible in Islam.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Bobrox on September 29, 2022, 03:48:11 PM
The islamic countries have negative viewpoints on it and maybe consider it as gambling as it's strictly prohibited in their religion but they are not putting a direct ban on it's usage and you can still see people trading in crypto over these Muslim countries.
This vied problem claim about bitcoin as negative side consider gambling I think several of them not happy and agree with bitcoin become legal currency payment transaction or bitcoin as the way for investing assets. Less knowledge and not really understand yet about bitcoin seems several of them claimed bitcoin as kinds of gambling way, I don't know which one side of bitcoin have the same characteristic with gambling.

There might be some who differentiate on the basis of Halal or Haram but it depends on our actual usage like you are the one who will decide how to use it sp come does it end up in bad situation? It's another form of money only and you can't deny the fact.
In my country have final decision about Bitcoin Halal or Not depending kinds of transaction we used, our religion community have give final decision depend with government rule, using bitcoin as investment assets or used for trading still ability or halal, but when using bitcoin for legal currency transaction payment still not allowed because our government still not legal using bitcoin as payment currency.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Gayong88 on October 02, 2022, 04:06:25 AM
Bitcoins are not worth money. It is not something that has intrinsic value, or any value beyond what one would pay in it. It is a medium of exchange like any other cryptocurrency, and thus comes under the same rules as currencies.

Governments/Institutions that accept Bitcoin of course need to be careful with interest payment rules related to lending money to users. However, like anything else, Muslims must ensure that by using Bitcoin they do so in a lawful and permissible way to avoid mistakes in accordance with the terms and conditions of buying and selling in the context of Islamic law.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Gyfts on October 02, 2022, 05:16:32 AM
Gambling is haram according to the Quran and Bitcoin could be considered gambling by some interpretations of crypto currency and its instability. I don't believe this to be true, but you can cherry pick whatever Islamic scholars you want and go with their subjective interpretation of Islamic readings. The more you go further away from the literal meaning of the text, the more subjective the interpretation is.

Islamic banking laws are also anti-interest so the technology, pricing, and buying and selling of cryptocurrency money is deemed halal by many Islamic scholars who rely on the teachings of Prophet Muhammad PBUH when seeking guidance about permissibility (ultimately, only Allah knows best).

If you're buying and selling cryptocurrency for profit, then it wouldn't be halal anymore. If I'm being brutally honest, crypto will only thrive in western cultures that are more willing to accept modern technology. The majority muslim countries that are more on the progressive end might take up Bitcoin, it will just take a while. The extreme Muslim countries (Iran, Pakistan) won't be doing so any time soon.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: trendcoin on October 02, 2022, 06:45:10 PM
...
Most Muslims from Arab, Africa, and Asia are Muslim by Born. Arab countries tend to follow Islamic rules hardly. There are a lot of restrictions if you follow all the rules (A lot of freedom too). Nowadays, many Muslims don't care about the rules of Islam. They don't participate in prayers. If you follow the rules, You should pray five times a day which only real Muslims do right now. If you follow the rules, You cannot drink alcohol. You cannot look at girls for the 2nd time (It is okay to see once by mistake). You cannot steal people's money. You cannot gamble. You cannot promote gambling. But, Only a few percent of Muslims follow all the rules of Islam. The rest of us are Muslim by the name only. We don't follow the rules. I am a Muslim. I know I am promoting a casino to get paid, and it's Haram. I believe the same kind of people exists in every religion. So, I respect that guy who tried to follow the rules because of his belief.
...


While reading your message, I remembered an interview that Zinedine Zidane gave to The Guardian years ago. Hahahah I'm behaviorally similar to you too.

Quote
and he describes himself as 'a non-practising Muslim'.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2004/apr/04/sport.features



...
Turkey (like Thailand) banned the use of cryptocurrencies as a means of payment, but trading is still allowed. In addition, in the discussion, one member who was obviously from Turkey confirmed that many do not respect this ban and continue to accept cryptocurrencies (restaurants, shops...)
...

He may have tried to create an ideological target by keeping Türkiye and Afghanistan together, because the unsourced information he conveyed here is false data. Cryptocurrencies cannot be used only as a means of payment in Türkiye. Also, it is not a law subject to strict control.


...
I respect all religions, but I have not yet read anywhere or found out in any way that any other religion expressly forbids cryptocurrencies, except of course Islam, with which this issue has been associated for years.
...

Quote
Our possessions, he says, have two uses, proper and improper. Money too has a proper and an improper use; its proper use is to be exchanged for goods and services, not to be lent out at interest. Of all the methods of making money, “taking a breed from barren metal” is the most unnatural.
https://www.britannica.com/biography/Aristotle/Political-theory

In fact, dirty money (which is interest and its derivatives) is a humiliated behavior in other heavenly religions and in the ancient world. The ancient world was created by people of morality-virtue. There is no such thing as the concept of morality today. The best scammers are advertisers, the best thieves are banks; The system we call justice works for them.

Today, ordinary people like you and me, if we try to extort sovereign classes' money, we get an average of 20 years in prison.

Every year they take money from my bank account due to my credit card fee. They take money from my bank account without telling me. I say I want to cancel my debit card and after hours of discussion they send my money back. They do this every year. They take my money every year without informing me, but because they are sovereign class, the law does not accuse them of committing extortion. In the new world, justice works for the interests of the sovereigns.


...
I already wrote once before that I would seriously consider belonging to a religion that would limit me in what I would invest in or perhaps how I would dress.
...


The ancient world in the examples I listed above has lost all traces of it today. Maybe that's why Islam is somehow creating controversy about itself because, as you mentioned, there is a very strong system of cultural preservation.

Samuel Hutington also mentioned this in his book Clash of Civilizations. I partially agree with the criticism that "it supports the continuation of the West's colonial understanding of the East" about that book, but this religion is "a living civilization even though it is not breathing".

As Zygmunt Bauman said, if history does not have a linear flow, one day moral values will regain strength and the sovereign classes will not be able to oppress the poor as easily as they do today. We must accept that we do not live in a world created by morality-virtue people today. That's why it's so absurd to have such discussions, because they are civilizations that live without breathing. The debate about whether Bitcoin is haram or halal has no value today.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: len01 on October 02, 2022, 08:59:40 PM
Islam does not prohibit someone from owning Bitcoin and the law is not in the Koran, unless someone uses it to gamble, sell people, buy alcohol, or lend bitcoins to people who need it, in order to make a profit, or what is called usury, it's actually simple if we compare it with real money sometimes it is also often used for extravagance, so back again it all depends on the person's use, if you use it wrong then it will be forbidden in Islam, but if it is used for charity or donating to an orphan then it will be a blessing for that person...
Of course, nothing in the Quran mentions Bitcoin. but I believe some Islamic authorities will consider Bitcoin and other Cryptocurrencies from a more positive or negative point of view to the ummah as halal and haram considerations.

Islam will not oppose technological developments. as long as they will provide convenience and positive value for everyone.

unless someone uses it to gamble,
I personally, use Bitcoin for something that is forbidden in Islam, (gambling).
I know it's my bad habit. but I consider Bitcoin halal for Muslims. all that is lawful eventually can also become unlawful as you said. It all depends on the use.
for example i think of bitcoin or crypto as a knife.
if the knife is used to cut fruit, cut vegetables for cooking etc. that's fine there will be no problem.
but if the knife is used to kill people, it's obviously not good.
just like fiat money if we use it for something useful and help people who need it more we will get a blessing reward but if the money is used to buy drugs, buy alcohol, gamble and which includes violating Islamic religious rules it will clearly be haram.
so it's true what you say it all depends on us ourselves using crypto or bitcoin as a future stock asset or used for gambling. which is definitely more useful if used for future assets


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: lalabotax on October 02, 2022, 09:09:18 PM
why bitcoin is always associated with religion, I think all religions will accept bitcoin.
It is natural when people associate Bitcoin with religion because people don't want to do something against religious values. They are trying to ensure whether using Bitcoin is allowed in their religions. I think it is understandable, nothing wrong with this.

In my country, some people stated that Bitcoin isn't allowed to use because of religious reasons. So, I think Bitcoin is accepted by all religions, is still debatable.

the problem is,  the government is afraid that its currency/means of payment will be replaced by bitcoin
and it all goes back to the individual in dealing with this
In my country, Bitcoin isn't allowed to be a payment tool because it breaks the law.
So, it is not always about the fear of the government, but it is sometimes related to the regulation of the country itself.



Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: indah rezqi on October 02, 2022, 09:16:47 PM
>snip
Halal or haram basically requires serious study from scholars or religious leaders. I have heard that it is permissible or lawful as long as both parties agree to make a transaction, the agreement is ultimately called a contract even though it is actually an exchange that makes it easier for both parties (if the transaction is carried out on an exchange).

However I can assert that bitcoin is prohibited from being used as a legal tender as long as the government prohibits it by law. This prohibition still applies in Indonesian jurisdictions, but one can use it in another country. In the end you can think that bitcoin is a medium, it is forbidden to use it in forbidden things in religion and lawful when it is not forbidden in religion. I believe in my religion and its laws, and I would not say haram as halal and halal as haram.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: budi691 on October 03, 2022, 01:56:08 AM
although I'm not a religious expert but I think Islam will have no problem with bitcoin,
because many Muslims consider Bitcoin to be the same as fiat money, and in my opinion Bitcoin is not halal and haram but what goods are purchased, if Bitcoin is made to buy liquor, which is clearly forbidden by Muslims then liquor is haram not Bitcoin


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: AnotherAlt on October 03, 2022, 08:32:16 AM
There have been 4200 religions lived on this earth, religions can be our radar for morality, and spirituality.. apart from that our guiding principle should be well being of our family and society, in a moral way. So I guess pretty yes, you should go for bitcoin till you are earning it legitimately.

Bitcoin is a currency. People were questioning it because of its volatility. It's highly volatile. Every currency is volatile, and every currency faces inflation. A currency cannot be haram just because some people used to do haram things. You may know that alcohol is haram in Islam. But, When it comes to making medicine with alcohol, it is used to cure people. It's Halal. Sometimes you have to see the purpose. Even your Halal-earned money will be haram if you don't pay Jaka.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Raflesia on October 03, 2022, 04:30:20 PM
I may not discuss the perception of the proposition or anything related to a religion because indeed I have no capacity in that regard but what I do know is that bitcoin is something that I think is good and can be used as a part that I think can make my life changed.
On the other hand I live in an area where the spread of Muslims here can be said to be the majority but there are several other religions among my neighbors and they are currently in the same unit in Crypto.
As long as some Religions don't prohibit this, as long as the government still doesn't prohibit this then I think that's enough.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: noormcs5 on October 03, 2022, 04:33:36 PM
although I'm not a religious expert but I think Islam will have no problem with bitcoin,
because many Muslims consider Bitcoin to be the same as fiat money, and in my opinion Bitcoin is not halal and haram but what goods are purchased, if Bitcoin is made to buy liquor, which is clearly forbidden by Muslims then liquor is haram not Bitcoin

Bitcoin is money, so if dollars and pounds are legal in Islam, then of course bitcoin and cryptocurrencies should be legal in Islam too.

Do you know any religion that bans bitcoin or consider it wrong? I don't think so. It is governments that ban crypto and it should not be mixed with religions.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: GeorgeJohn on October 03, 2022, 04:46:15 PM
although I'm not a religious expert but I think Islam will have no problem with bitcoin,
because many Muslims consider Bitcoin to be the same as fiat money, and in my opinion Bitcoin is not halal and haram but what goods are purchased, if Bitcoin is made to buy liquor, which is clearly forbidden by Muslims then liquor is haram not Bitcoin
It's simple to comprehend this, many Muslims today are crypto trader because they seem bitcoin as a means of raising fund. Because it's not written in scripture that this set religious group are for Bitcoin and it never be enshrined in any way, provided that they have consider Fiat currency as a valuable currency, it's applicable with cryptocurrency, i believe that cryptocurrency has no segregation in value, it's a choice of government to adopt and legalize in a particular domain.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Moeda on October 03, 2022, 08:33:11 PM
The islamic countries have negative viewpoints on it and maybe consider it as gambling as it's strictly prohibited in their religion but they are not putting a direct ban on it's usage and you can still see people trading in crypto over these Muslim countries.

There might be some who differentiate on the basis of Halal or Haram but it depends on our actual usage like you are the one who will decide how to use it sp come does it end up in bad situation? It's another form of money only and you can't deny the fact.
Actually Islam does not prohibit the use of anything useful, including Bitcoin. Islam only prohibits actions that harm oneself and others.
Fiat money is something that can be used according to Islamic law, in other words it is halal. However, fiat money also becomes haram if it is used or obtained in the wrong way, such as gambling, selling intoxicating drinks, and others similar to it. If Bitcoin is used or obtained from gambling, then the law is also haram, just like fiat money. So, why do Islamic countries, or Muslims use Bitcoin? Because in Islam it is not haram. And Islam does not view Bitcoin as something negative.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: stomachgrowls on October 03, 2022, 09:45:06 PM
The islamic countries have negative viewpoints on it and maybe consider it as gambling as it's strictly prohibited in their religion but they are not putting a direct ban on it's usage and you can still see people trading in crypto over these Muslim countries.

There might be some who differentiate on the basis of Halal or Haram but it depends on our actual usage like you are the one who will decide how to use it sp come does it end up in bad situation? It's another form of money only and you can't deny the fact.
Actually Islam does not prohibit the use of anything useful, including Bitcoin. Islam only prohibits actions that harm oneself and others.
Fiat money is something that can be used according to Islamic law, in other words it is halal. However, fiat money also becomes haram if it is used or obtained in the wrong way, such as gambling, selling intoxicating drinks, and others similar to it. If Bitcoin is used or obtained from gambling, then the law is also haram, just like fiat money. So, why do Islamic countries, or Muslims use Bitcoin? Because in Islam it is not haram. And Islam does not view Bitcoin as something negative.
Any religion in the world would really be having on the same perspective when it comes to bad or good things.There are just some things which they do really differ on some things but on generally
we do aim for dealing on whats good and whats bad.Lets just respect if Islam does have this kind of beliefs then so be it.
Whether bitcoin is permissable or not then its their own choice whether these people would be following into their religion or would totally be that going opposite.
So it does depend on someone because not all people would really be that following on what their Religion told them to do so.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: taufik123 on October 03, 2022, 10:55:25 PM
Actually Islam does not prohibit the use of anything useful, including Bitcoin. Islam only prohibits actions that harm oneself and others.
Fiat money is something that can be used according to Islamic law, in other words, it is halal. However, fiat money also becomes haram if it is used or obtained in the wrong way, such as gambling, selling intoxicating drinks, and others similar to it. If Bitcoin is used or obtained from gambling, then the law is also haram, just like fiat money. So, why do Islamic countries, or Muslims use Bitcoin? Because in Islam it is not haram. And Islam does not view Bitcoin as something negative.
There will be some opinions stating that bitcoin is allowed or not in Islam, because every perspective has a different view. There are some scholars who argue that bitcoin is halal and permissible but with some conditions and there are also scholars who forbid it because it causes some losses. Regarding the legality of the use of cryptocurrencies and the law of their use in business transactions according to Islamic law, there are still pros and cons (khilafiyah) among economists and scholars.

And in essence, there are still many pros and cons and it is not absolutely illegal or haram to say. Those who like bitcoin, use it for positive things, of course, it will not bother others or themselves. As long as it doesn't hurt anyone, it won't be a problem.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: romero121 on October 03, 2022, 11:56:46 PM
There have been 4200 religions lived on this earth, religions can be our radar for morality, and spirituality.. apart from that our guiding principle should be well being of our family and society, in a moral way. So I guess pretty yes, you should go for bitcoin till you are earning it legitimately.
Agreed, and in some stance it is upto the user. Different people used to give different briefing based on the religious book, but we don't know which interpretation has got the real meaning. End of the day every religious book preach about love and how to give love. As said when it is all about morals and we're not against it, using bitcoin is right.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: NicNacCoin on November 27, 2022, 11:49:50 PM
although I'm not a religious expert but I think Islam will have no problem with bitcoin,
because many Muslims consider Bitcoin to be the same as fiat money, and in my opinion Bitcoin is not halal and haram but what goods are purchased, if Bitcoin is made to buy liquor, which is clearly forbidden by Muslims then liquor is haram not Bitcoin

Bitcoin is money, so if dollars and pounds are legal in Islam, then of course bitcoin and cryptocurrencies should be legal in Islam too.

Do you know any religion that bans bitcoin or consider it wrong? I don't think so. It is governments that ban crypto and it should not be mixed with religions.
It is not documented whether bitcoin is halal or haram in Islamic view. Bitcoin is legal in some Muslim countries.But they have started transactions through different banks. Indonesia, Turkey, all these countries also have the use of Bitcoin.But from my point of view I want to say from here as we earn our livelihood. But for us it is completely halal and permissible.Because we work hard to earn this money.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Vaskiy on November 27, 2022, 11:56:37 PM
although I'm not a religious expert but I think Islam will have no problem with bitcoin,
because many Muslims consider Bitcoin to be the same as fiat money, and in my opinion Bitcoin is not halal and haram but what goods are purchased, if Bitcoin is made to buy liquor, which is clearly forbidden by Muslims then liquor is haram not Bitcoin

Bitcoin is money, so if dollars and pounds are legal in Islam, then of course bitcoin and cryptocurrencies should be legal in Islam too.

Do you know any religion that bans bitcoin or consider it wrong? I don't think so. It is governments that ban crypto and it should not be mixed with religions.
It is not documented whether bitcoin is halal or haram in Islamic view. Bitcoin is legal in some Muslim countries.But they have started transactions through different banks. Indonesia, Turkey, all these countries also have the use of Bitcoin.But from my point of view I want to say from here as we earn our livelihood. But for us it is completely halal and permissible.Because we work hard to earn this money.
Nowhere it is mentioned, but some countries claim the based on the element that it is being created without any backing. Muslim countries have different banking rules, the banks never provide interest on our savings, but they have interest when we get loan and repay. There'll be controversy on such topics. It is one's personal choice whether to use it or not without thinking halal as it is connected to the religious belief.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Mamun74 on November 28, 2022, 05:08:40 AM
I think yes because many people are using bitcoin as there job now feeding there families and other stuffs.
And bitcoin isn't like gambling, betting etc
There's nothing dat is prohibited in bitcoin so I believe bitcoin is permissible.

I don’t find till where bitcoin permissible or not permissible. But i think, Muslim countries are different rules. But bitcoin is decentralization crypto currency It's not like gambling or casino. Many countries payment system bitcoin pay now and many countries government accepted bitcoin. And i don’t find also where Islam said about bitcoin negativity.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Tazzy4050 on November 28, 2022, 09:28:59 AM
I think investing in bitcoin is permissible as long as there is understanding of the risks and what is being bought, I don’t think there should be a green light for Muslims to invest in all cryptocurrencies. Personally, after talking with a friend about proof of work, I decided to sell all of my proof of work coins. And I don’t really regard them as halal, or legal, according to Islamic law. But neither is fiat currency, and yet we are forced by circumstances to use it. If I had to pick and choose using a fiat currency or a proof of work digital currency, I’m sure there is less harm and more benefit to a Proof of Work currency.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Yatsan on November 28, 2022, 09:44:32 AM
I think yes because many people are using bitcoin as there job now feeding there families and other stuffs.
And bitcoin isn't like gambling, betting etc
There's nothing dat is prohibited in bitcoin so I believe bitcoin is permissible.

I don’t find till where bitcoin permissible or not permissible. But i think, Muslim countries are different rules. But bitcoin is decentralization crypto currency It's not like gambling or casino. Many countries payment system bitcoin pay now and many countries government accepted bitcoin. And i don’t find also where Islam said about bitcoin negativity.
I'm not a muslim but I think there are no direct reason for our muslim brothers and sisters to ban or prohibit usage of this technology unless if it would be linked to gambling because you are somehow betting to something everytime you are investing in a token. But it is not really gambling if the idea of gambling is taking advantage of your opponent (well it depends on the game because sometimes it is the house which is your opponent) or simply you are not taking anything from your opponent(the idea of gambling in its broadest sense). It will only be between investor and the market which gave me the idea that they won't be prohibited from using it. But if I'm wrong please correct me.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Ucy on November 28, 2022, 10:05:01 AM
It's interesting to note that Bitcoin ideals actually do not violate any moral codes hence should be permitted by the national laws, as laws are not suppose to prevent people from using or doing what is right or good for them as long as the right/good things are not abused. .
List of Bitcoin Ideals: Decentralization, Transparency, Immutability, Privacy/anonymity, , Public Consensus, Proof of Work(don't trust but verify work done before rewarding the worker in trustless condition),  fair-rules, Trustlessness/Permissionless (just like in nature, Bitcoin require little to no Trust/Permission from people before it can be used), Deflation rather than debasing people's currency value via inflation, etc.


Unfortunately, altcoins like ethereum which has adopted a very corrupt consensus mechanism like proof of stake has become immoral hence should not be legalized or permitted. Anyone who does it is on its own.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Ryker1 on November 28, 2022, 10:15:16 AM
I think yes because many people are using bitcoin as there job now feeding there families and other stuffs.
And bitcoin isn't like gambling, betting etc
There's nothing dat is prohibited in bitcoin so I believe bitcoin is permissible.

I don’t find till where bitcoin permissible or not permissible. But i think, Muslim countries are different rules. But bitcoin is decentralization crypto currency It's not like gambling or casino. Many countries payment system bitcoin pay now and many countries government accepted bitcoin. And i don’t find also where Islam said about bitcoin negativity.
Well this has been discussed so many times if bitcoin halal or haram on our brothers and sisters in Islam country.
But expert shows that it is halal [legal] because it belongs to the property or asset when it comes to haram [illegal] when there is an object of buying and selling which is not allowed on their culture. I am not in that religion but I think everyone is free to use bitcoin and that is permissible, the thing that is prohibited to them when they are involved in trading is a sort of gambling to them.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: UmerIdrees on November 28, 2022, 10:25:17 AM
I think yes because many people are using bitcoin as there job now feeding there families and other stuffs.
And bitcoin isn't like gambling, betting etc
There's nothing dat is prohibited in bitcoin so I believe bitcoin is permissible.

I don’t find till where bitcoin permissible or not permissible. But i think, Muslim countries are different rules. But bitcoin is decentralization crypto currency It's not like gambling or casino. Many countries payment system bitcoin pay now and many countries government accepted bitcoin. And i don’t find also where Islam said about bitcoin negativity.
Well this has been discussed so many times if bitcoin halal or haram on our brothers and sisters in Islam country.
But expert shows that it is halal [legal] because it belongs to the property or asset when it comes to haram [illegal] when there is an object of buying and selling which is not allowed on their culture. I am not in that religion but I think everyone is free to use bitcoin and that is permissible, the thing that is prohibited to them when they are involved in trading is a sort of gambling to them.

I belong to a Muslim country and i can tell you that bitcoin is Halal. There is nothing in bitcoin that can make it Haram in Islam.

However, when it comes to trading bitcoin and altcoins, then Muslims should know that Future trading is not allowed in Islam and only Spot trading is allowed. Unfortunately, almost everyone is involved in future trading which directly deals with interest, but no one thinks in this sense. Anyways we can make a separate discussion topic on that if anyone needs to know in detail the reasons for this halal and haram concept in trading.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Vlad1977 on December 02, 2022, 08:24:32 AM
This means nothing. If Islamic people are in a country that prohibits the use of Bitcoin, there is no way. If they are in a country that allows Bitcoin, they will still use Bitcoin.

"According to Isl, no one is allowed to make money through any illegal activities, or lending interest is not allowed. Gambling or money earned from gambling is also holy in Islam."


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: slaman29 on December 02, 2022, 08:53:40 AM
Bitcoin actually is possibly the most Islamic form of money. No interest, no empty backing of the value, and equal share of risk ;)

There have been 4200 religions lived on this earth, religions can be our radar for morality, and spirituality.. apart from that our guiding principle should be well being of our family and society, in a moral way. So I guess pretty yes, you should go for bitcoin till you are earning it legitimately.

We're assuming all religions are moral, but I believe some are not. Either that or morals have changed. Some might say the modern immoral way of getting wealthy is also a religious way of life led by bankers and politicians ;) If you try to be moral, you fail their game.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: Hyphen(-) on December 02, 2022, 09:21:17 AM
This means nothing. If Islamic people are in a country that prohibits the use of Bitcoin, there is no way. If they are in a country that allows Bitcoin, they will still use Bitcoin.
How can a country that forbids the use of Bitcoin know who is using it if they are not using exchanges that require KYC, which may expose their personal information and lead to their arrest, as the case may be? However, it has nothing to do with religion because everyone has the right to buy whatever they want.

Quote
"According to Isl, no one is allowed to make money through any illegal activities, or lending interest is not allowed. Gambling or money earned from gambling is also holy in Islam."
Bitcoin is not an illegal way to make money, and it is not prohibited in Islam because it differs little from traditional marketing of goods, which was referred to as trading in the past. I see it as simply purchasing assets and holding them for an extended period of time, which I believe is legal.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: EarnOnVictor on December 02, 2022, 10:08:33 AM
For Muslims across the Islamic world, the question arises as to whether crypto payment platforms are deemed to be halal or haram in the eyes of Allah and in accordance with Shariah principles, and whether as a currency it prevents money laundering.
I was also sceptical of the money laundering aspect, but I can assure anyone that money laundering is everywhere, even with fiat. So, it should not be a basis to reject a project as good as crypto. However, I have Muslim friends dealing with it, so it might be about what they believe.

One of the defining aspects of cryptocurrency is that there is no central authority such as a Government that authorises it or records it.
This is the main reason I adopt it, and will always keep me increasing my dealing and stakes in it. The only people that should be concerned are the ones using it for illegality.

A comprehensive Islamic law interpretation, one that sparked a massive rise in Muslim investment in Bitcoin and Ethereum in 2018, was provided by Sharia advisor Mufti Muhammad Abu-Bakar (former advisor to Blossom Finance) who looked at the question of is cryptocurrency halal as a money supply. He argued that Bitcoin is permissible under Islamic principles.
I believe this person is more exposed.

Islamic banking laws are also anti-interest so the technology, pricing, and buying and selling of cryptocurrency money is deemed halal by many Islamic scholars who rely on the teachings of Prophet Muhammad PBUH when seeking guidance about permissibility (ultimately, only Allah knows best).
You have said it all, "only Allah knows best. Yet, cryptocurrency is a non-interest investment as I'm concerned, you only gain or lose if you hold it (investment). This is just like buying shares/stocks in any company, Islamic banks are doing this, so why not crypto? Who is paying the crypto interest? I believe it's about what you use your crypto for.


Title: Re: Bitcoin is permissable in Islam.
Post by: hZti on December 02, 2022, 10:17:18 AM
Nice to hear that bitcoin is consider it halal. I can only benefit bitcoin and also I think it is the right decision. Bitcoin can be used for non halal things for sure, but you can also use a rock or a knife to kill somebody and still the rock itself is not "bad" itself. So since bitcoin if for sure not advertising bad stuff, I like this point of view, even if I m not muslim.