Bitcoin Forum

Hashnest (http://hashnest.com) website has been offline for scheduled maintenance and site upgrade between March 4 and March 5, 2015. This upgrade has significantly improved upon the Hashnest family of products. The new site boasts more features and an improved user experience. Users are able to access more powerful hashrate management tools and view more detailed and transparent statistics about their owned GH/s and payout information.

In order to continue being at the forefront of innovation in the cloud mining industry, Hashnest has launched its newest product from Hashnest, the Payout Accelerated Cloud Mining Contract, or PACMiC. PACMiC aims to lower the level of risk-exposure for the cloud mining user. PACMiCs do not have electricity or maintenance costs subtracted. In addition, Bitmain will pay 0.7 satoshis per second in profit for each 1 BTC contract owned. This works out to an estimated approximately 22% in annualized return of investment.



About PACMiCs

Each PACMiC represents one terahash of mining power, and is sold for 1 BTC. The contract goes into effect immediately upon completion of payment. Once the contract is in effect, users will immediately begin receiving mining revenues equivalent to owning 1TH/s of mining power; payouts made will be according to AntPool’s PPLNS method. Payment of electricity fees and machine maintenance costs will be assumed by Bitmain.
   
Each time a PPLNS payout will be prior to pay for the profit per the rate of 0.7 satoshis per BTC per second, the remaining will be paid back to the principal.
The contract expires automatically upon the repayment of the original 1BTC purchase price. Hashnest director Rob Zhang points out that with the payment of 0.7 satoshis per 1 BTC of capital remaining to be paid back, users can earn approximately 22% in annualized return of investment.

With the PACMiC, 100% of mined coins are given back to the contract owner, allowing users to earn their starting capital back quicker than traditional cloud mining products. Traditional cloud mining products will use between 40% and 90% of the mining revenue for the payment of electricity and maintenance costs, slowing the rate at which capital is earned back and leaving the user with net revenue of between 10 and 60 percent of the coins mined by their GH/s.

Additionally, a 1BTC PACMiC contract represents 1 terahash of mining power, making the PACMiC cheaper than traditional cloud mining contracts. Traditional cloud mining contracts generally prices one terahash of mining power between 1.5 and 2 BTC.

If a user were to buy 1000 BTC of PACMiCs, they would receive 1 petahash of mining power. At present bitcoin network difficulty, on the first day the user would receive approximately 11 BTC in mining revenues, which count towards paying back the 1000 BTC in capital, and an additional 0.604 BTC of profit. On the second day, assuming same difficulty and pool luck, the user will again receive the same amount, ~11 BTC, in mining revenue, but this time the profit paid will be slightly less than on day one, while the amount paid back to the principal will be greater than on day one.

With PACMiC, users no longer need to worry about high electricity fees or soaring difficulty. Mining can become a low-stress, low-risk activity.

https://i.imgur.com/PDSduTl.png

The introduction of the PACMiC from Hashnest contributes to the diversification of the bitcoin mining industry. Until now, there were only two ways to experience bitcoin mining: with physical hardware, or with traditional cloud mining contracts. The PACMiC introduces a third way.

Mining with actual hardware means holding fixed assets. During the life of the hardware, one is free to use them according to their own wishes (e.g., mining at a loss but because one wants to support the Bitcoin network). Mining with actual hardware also means one is responsible for electricity bills and requires manpower to deploy and maintain the machines.

With traditional cloud mining platforms, like Hashnest, a user merely needs to purchase a contract to expose himself to mining revenues. Users also save on shipping fees, purchasing PSUs, and the physical effort involved with deploying machines. In exchange for these conveniences, users must pay additional service fees, as well as accept that their contracts will be terminated due to difficulty increase or falling bitcoin price. Furthermore, the contracts will never be reactivated.

PACMiC’s unique selling point is that priority is placed on ensuring users earn back their initial principal, while remaining as simple as traditional cloud mining offerings. The reasons that earning back capital can be accelerated are firstly that the hashrate is cheaper than with traditional cloud mining contracts, and secondly that there is no maintenance fee involved; these reasons in addition to the additional profit payouts made. PACMiC is most suited for mining hobbyists looking primarily for stability and a predictable income stream from their cloud mining. If a user continually rolls over revenues into new contracts, they can estimate earning approximately 22% annualized ROI on their contract purchase. However, PACMiC holders may only enjoy mining benefits during the time that their contract is active; upon contract termination the hashing power reverts to Bitmain’s ownership.

Users may use the short URL hash.vc  (http://hashnest.com) to access the Hashnest platform.

PACMiC Terms
 

What is a Payout Accelerated Cloud Mining Contract (PACMiC)?
The PACMiC is a new value-added cloud mining service product from Hashnest. The PACMiC is an electronic contract structured in a new way. BITMAIN will pay all the maintaining cost of the mining rigs, and all the mining revenue will be used to pay back the PACMiC owners. When the principal is not fully paid back, it will share profit with buyers. When the principal is paid back, the mining rigs will belong to BITMAIN. Both principal and profit payments will be made to the contract holder based on the mining revenues of AntPool. Since PACMiC will not bear the maintenance cost, so the payout is accelerated.

Purchasing a PACMiC
In the initial sales open day, one PACMiC will be sold for one (1) bitcoin. Each PACMiC represents one terahash of hashing power. The contract will become active immediately upon receipt of full payment.

Computing principal and profit of an PACMiC
As soon as the PACMiC is activated, payouts will be made through Hashnest in accordance with the mining revenues generated by AntPool’s PPLNS payout method. Profit payments will be made beginning with the first block found by AntPool after the contract’s activation. From the first block until the contract’s expiry, profit will be accumulated every second.

Profit Calculation Method
Unpaid principal (BTC) * 0.7 (satoshis per BTC per second) * time to find a block (seconds).
For every block found, the remaining payout after the profit is paid will count towards the principal payment. After each principal payment is made, the amount is subtracted from the amount of remaining principal.
Please note: information on blocks found will only be transfered to Hashnest.com from AntPool after receiving six network confirmations. Because of this, profit and principal payments will be on a slight delay from the network.

Contract Suspension
If after 120 days, a PACMiC has still not recovered the initial capital for its user, and is not mining enough revenue to pay for its own electricity cost (fixed at 0.098 USD per kWh, calculated using an ideal AntMiner S5 hashing at 100% uptime per PPS payout), whether because of difficulty increase or BTC price decrease, the PACMiC will continue paying out for ten days as though it were running, even if the machine is turned off. If these conditions persist for ten continuous days, the contract will be considered temporarily suspended. During the suspension period, mining revenues and profit payments will also be temporarily stopped. If after the suspension period, difficulty has dropped or bitcoin price has risen, making mining possible again, the contract will be reinstated and pick up where it left off.

Contract Expiry
The contract expires at the moment that the principal has been paid back in full.
BITMAIN may pay extra Bitcoin to the owner of PACMiC before the principal has been paid back in full, which will accelerate the payout even more.


FAQ

Q: Can the PACMiC be sold or transferred to other users?
A: No, PACMiCs may not be traded on the exchange.

Q: Do PACMiCs deduct electricity and maintenance fees?
A: PACMiCs do not deduct electricity or maintenance fees, the payment of which is assumed by BITMAIN. All mining revenue from the contract is used in the repayment of principal and in making profit payments.

Q: Can I redeem my PACMiC before contract expiry?
A: No. The contract will be closed automatically at the time that the principal has been repaid in full. Contracts may not be terminated prior to this.

Q: What is the repayment period to profit ratio like?
A:  The repayment period is dependent on the difficulty level of the Bitcoin network. Assuming a stable network difficulty, the PACMiC initial cost can be paid back in approximately 105 days. Estimated annualized return on investment is 22%. ( (0.7*10^-8)*(365*24*3600)=22%).
However, due to the unpredictable nature of the network difficulty, it is impossible to accurately predict the exact length of time repayment will require.
Since releasing our first product in November of 2013, Bitmain has always concerned itself with ensuring that users are able to earn a profit and that payout amounts are accurate. Trustworthiness is a cornerstone of our reputation.
 
Q: If AntPool experiences bad luck, will this affect profit payments?
A: Profit payouts are calculated using the amount of unpaid initial cost, and are unrelated to the pool luck of AntPool. Changes in pool luck will affect the speed at which the cost is repaid.
 
Q:How does the user make profit?
A:Profit is calculated by the formula: unpaid principal (BTC) * 0.7 (satoshis per BTC per second) * time to find a block (seconds). Mining revenue will be prior to pay for the profit, the remaining of mining revenue will be paid for the principal.

Q:When does the user start to get the profit? Where does the profit go?
A:Profit begins accumulating when the first block is found after contract activation. Profit will be paid to user’s wallet on Hashnest.com
 
Q: How much the customer can get after the contract expires?
A: The principal plus the profit. However, the profit cannot be determined before the contract ends.You can find more info at Q: How does the customer make profit?
 
Q:When does the contract end?
A:When the principal is paid back in full.

Q: what is Auto-Rebuy feature ?
A：After enabling the Auto-Rebuy feature, your payout and profit payments will be used to automatically and incrementally purchase more PACMiC hashrate.
When you disable the feature, mining revenue and profit payments will continue accumulating inside your account balance as usual.
 
Q:Is the PACMiC really risk-free?
A: Like all forms of bitcoin mining, there is a certain level of risk involved. If network difficulty unforeseeably skyrockets, or if the price of bitcoin drops too much, the Antminer S5 units backing the PACMiC may not be profitable to run and be forced to go offline, in which case contracts would be suspended (possibly indefinitely) and the user may not recover the initial cost of the miner. However, the AntMiner S5 is currently the most power efficient bitcoin miner available on the market, and would be among the last to be forced to power down under unfavorable market circumstances. It is our comprehensive evaluation that the likelihood of PACMiC holders not recovering their initial cost is indeed quite low. We ask that all users please understand the risks inherent to any sort of bitcoin mining, and also to understand that there is no such thing as a risk-free product.

Dear Users,

Recently, maybe you can not login hashnest.com smothly due to DDoS attacking, however the miners are mining perfectly in the private network, so mining payouts as usual will not be affected.

Thanks for all your support and patience.

Janet

PACMiC is runnig backed by S5 (1155Gh/s, 590W), which is indicated in the 'PACMIC Terms of Service'

Hi DebitMe,
Excellent answer, you know how PACMiC works very well  8)

When your contract hashing at  1.00050000TH/s, but your cost/capital is 1.00010000BTC. Mining revenue per PPLNS payout is increasing along with your reinvest, so daily profit and and paid back are increasing too.

Some day, if you disable 'rebuy', Duration of ROI is further speeding up due to the only increasing of hashing power.

Not sure to understand the purpose of that.
I buy a contract and the contract end when the capital have been paid back.
So I buy a contract for 1 BTC and at they end I receive only 1 BTC. No profit??

Not sure to understand. Im sure I'm missing something but will like to understand.

Thanks

Keep innovating Bitmain!

Of course you profit, why would anyone even invest here if at best they would only get what they invested  ;D
look here:

Q:How does the user make profit?
A:Profit is calculated by the formula: unpaid principal (BTC) * 0.7 (satoshis per BTC per second) * time to find a block (seconds). Mining revenue will be prior to pay for the profit, the remaining of mining revenue will be paid for the principal.

Do you understand now?  ;)

Ok good! Yeah I knew I was not understanding it well this is why I ask. So they paid profit and after the paid back a part of capital.
Good

Thanks

Update:

Bought 3 Th/s (three contracts I guess?) almost 10 days ago. So far - so good :) Reinvest option OFF for now.

Are you considering to lower the minimum investment in the future?

Dear flyingplows,

User may freely invest with only 1 GH/s in the trading market if you are not referring to PACMiC  8)
However, we will continue thinking the possible oppurtunities to reach a win-win model.

Thanks!

Hi, I've bought pacmic and it was running for 5 days. You say estimated ROI is 22%. So far I've paid back almost 5% in principal and my profit is almost 0.003 BTC. Given that I'd continue at the same rate until the principal is paid in full I'd get 0.06 BTC. That would be only 6% of ROI. However, according to the formula, the closer to the end I am the less profit I will receive, so it'll likely be even less than 6%.

Can I ask some questions?
Why is it that the better the pool does (the quicker the blocks are found) the less profit I receive?
Should I therefore root that antpool would get stuck on blocks to accumulate profit?
Why is it that there had to be some special formula involved instead of, you know, just give like 10% ROI hardcoded?
Because if the principal is paid in 100 days, wouldn't it be simpler just to run 10 more measly days just for profit?
Because the way I see it I've paid 1BTC and I'll get 1BTC with some cents back and that'll be about it.

I was talking about PACMiC, I would like to try it, but after AMHash fiasco I don't feel very comfortable sending my money without trying it out with a smaller amount first... well, I guess I wil try umisoo and will jump in PACMiC at the next batch  ;)

You should get just over 5% at end of your contract which makes it about 22% a year. What are you saying, it does not deliver that?
Cause according to my calculation, if you keep getting 0.003 BTC every 5 days, u ll end up with 0.054 in 90 days, which is 5.4% on your 1 BTC invested. Since it ll probably take about 100+ days to get your principal back, it does not matter that you ll face diminishing profits towards the end, you should end up with above 5% at the end.

Yeah, I guess it is partially my fault for not fully reading into the posts and etc. but I think it's deceptive to say "It's 22% annually" because I'm pretty sure 99% of the people would think in terms of 1 contract not in one year. I might as well say that you'll receive 50% ROI in 10 years while ROI per contract would be 1.25%. I guess it's kinda ok then but I'd like sellers of the contract to be more straightforward, if it's 5.5% per three months I am smart enough to multiply it by four on my own.

I don't mean to disagree with you for the sake of disagreeing, but this is a common practice when speaking about interest.  I had to read through the terms about 20 times before I sorted it all in my head, but the practice is in no way deceptive.

why is this contract no longer offered? will it be back? i didn't manage to save that much crypto to be worth 1 btc to buy it, but i wanted to have it. plz put them back for sale in future when i have money :P
btw is it worth to buy that umisoo now cause i could buy that now and when PACMiC contract comes back then sell my umisoo and buy that?

I would not touch anything but S4 or S5 there. You need to have an option of selling back your hash and exiting in case you want to.

I feel the S3 is the best buy. It's not obsolete like s2 or umisoo. And nit as expensive as s4 or s5

I would be happy to review HashNest's new PACMiC cloud mining service on cloudminingdirectory.com (http://cloudminingdirectory.com/).  I reviewed HashNest's standard cloud mining contracts (http://cloudminingdirectory.com/hashnest/review/), but I haven't had a chance to buy any PACMiC contracts yet, as most of my BTC is tied up elsewhere.

Plus the fact that revenue from my farm of S4s hosted at Umisoo has been nonexistent for the past 10 days during the move to Bitmain's facility.

Perhaps you would consider opening up contracts for 100GHS or even 500GHS?  This would make it a lot easier to test out.  I know a few others have requested the same.

PM me or respond to this post to let me know if you're interested!

Just take a look at volumes. S4 and S5 are the only ones being traded.

I decided to buy this PACMiC contract if it is open for sale again any time soon.. Had enough of those scams already... Not a huge profit here, but at least I'll be safe. Or there will be no other PACMiC for S5 untill S6 release?  :)

if my calculations are correct, the contract will expire after ~96 days and profit is ~3%, right?

http://www.tutorialspoint.com/compile_cpp_online.php


or did I do something wrong?

https://i.imgur.com/s4M89Wc.jpg

can u   have negative roi   with pacmac or is it    guaurantee   +roi/even

not according to my tests - you actually start to make infinite money if the difficulty will get to 1000000000000

by every difficulty increase the profit will increase a little bit, but so does the return time

It is not guaranteed, if you read the ToS it states that under circumstances where the S5 is not profitable to run, then the contract is cancelled (There are more stipulations and timing issues, so please read them yourself for accurate information).  So if you haven't made the contract price back, you could lose whatever hasn't been paid back.

I don't know, this is fine but I m not so excited about it. 22% per year in ideal conditions s an excellent profit but investing that into miners can generate much more. True, it also brings higher risk.

if PACMiC is backed by S5 maybe it's better to just buy S5 hashing there? how does the risk compares that PACMiC is more reliable (lower risk) ?

If you get S5, you can sell those and exit at any moment. On the other hand, PACMiC contracts do not charge maintenance fees so its almost guaranteed ROI. Lower compared to other miners but almost guaranteed.

I want to buy 2 TH/s of Pacmic should I or will I be ripped off!

Hi.

This PACMiC contract pays you the 'total' you invest plus aprox. 5% per contract (100 days aprox.) but it could changed to a more profitable invest if 'btc world' gets 'better' results (you know, when the Whole scenario turn to something very positive the btc trading, mining, etc). So, as I'm testing this contracts, I'm cool with this kinda stuff. Bitmain seems pretty competitive and compromised --at least 'present'-- with btc businesses and little companies.

Hmmm, looks like the BTC DIFF IS GOING THROUGH THE ROOF but then again you never now. If it goes through the roof will pacmic really be worth it then ?

Its just a big gamble I want to buy 2 BTC worth in the worst way but I don't want to throw my coins to the birds either ?

I just don't know which way to go. I am running 2 TH/s already inside my house and cant add no more. OLD USA 50 amp "Main Breaker" 120v service and 120v 15 amp on sub breakers. "Electric is free I don't pay" that's why I wanted to add  2 TH/s more of pacmic with it.


also when you log on to antpool can you see it hashing on the same dashboard screen as your home miners ?

or just wait and save my coins for the S6 which should have new tech low power chips ?

what do you guys think I need ideas ?


 

5% per contract  ??? i think i better hold if thats the case... too little for an investment that could not roi cause of difficulty and other risks.

What are you talking about, this next diff growth s gonna be the usual trend, 3-5%, if not even lower.  I hardly consider that as going through the roof. Have you forgotten 40% per month we used to have.

hmmmm, I am new to mining I am only 6 months into it I am not a old VGA card miner were you guys made a fortune off of one card.

Ok, I can understand that. Anywaym diff growth of us to 15% per month (two adjustment of about 7.5% each) s considered moderate. However, we used to face these large spikes some time ago when the base was not that large as we have it now. As soon as the next gen of miners gets delivered, we ll see if these large jumps are gonna come back or not. This low BTC price s also a limiting factor, profit margins are quite thin.

You say 15% per month multiply that by 12 months if it keeps going up at that rate it will have gone up by 180 percent to me I think bitcoin market is crashing and soon to be dead. I see more people investing in other coins as well. Also I see bitmain trying to push the S5's Before there dead. They are pushing cloud mining so they don't have to make anymore hardware. The only hardware they will make is for there own farms which makes sense since they will save a lot of cash that way the make more profit. I don't see a S6 or S5 to S6 upgrade or Just a new chip S6.

Makes sense because that's what I would do if I were in the business. Remember there are two sides to the BITCOIN.

All I was asking if you think investing 2 BTC in pacmia is worth the risk ?

Is there anyone out there that has a pacmia contract already that has around 2 BTC not 20000 BTC ?

Thanks for every ones help.

Well yes, diff rises a lot. This is a very competitive industry. After all we all mine some magic digital money, you really think there are only few people on this planet who like that idea. BTC mining diff will continue to go up and if you cannot keep up the pace, I suggest you switch to something else. 2 BTC ll bring you 5% every 4 months or so. That s 0.1 BTC or currently about $25. You do the rest of the math.

I don't mind the pace at all that was your assumption. and like I said I am only six months old at this I like to invest wisely not foolishly.

 

Fair enough


um, then why do you own bitcoin?

There is no one who can tell you whether it is a good investment or not.  Read what the offering is and make your own conclusion.  I have done the math and determined that I think I can leave my reinvest feature on for another 40 days or so at current market conditions and make a good return.  If your looking for a return over 20% per year in bitcoin land, you will get scammed 99% of the time, if your looking for a 20% return in the stock market, your out of your mind.

Don't get greedy, take the very nice returns that are being offered and make some money on your investment.

I am just information gathering by reading and listening to many opinions "Sarcastic ones I don't need" and thoughts it was just a question that's all I don't need Bitcoins I do it for fun I have plenty of shares in stocks I live off my equity and dividends which I have in intel, AMD, Apple, Verizon Just to name a few. and that's over the past 20 years I kept buying and Investing. Now like I said I didn't get all that equity in stocks by being foolish but by reading asking questions and listening to different people investing and taking notes I never listen to one opinion I always listen to a large group that has the same opinion.

Trust me I can buy out a whole mining farm if I prefer or just buy bitcoin directly without any mining this is just a hobby for me. I don't have to work my bills are already paid I get way more equity and dividends than I need trust me.

I am new to this but I see already when some one asked a simple little harmless question everybody gets offended its the same way in the stock market I am used to it. Honestly that shows me the level of intelligence someone really has.


All I asked is a general question do you guys think its worth it Investing in Pacmia and all I got is a bunch of sarcastic answers which did not answer the question at all even though I pulled a little bit of good info out of it. and then it got worse when I said the BTC DIFF was going through the roof and other comments. You guys should invest in the stock market You guys sound stressed out over bitcoin mining.


I read everything there is to read I am just gathering many opinions foolish or otherwise that is all.

 

dog, i looked into this pac investment, i did not invest and probaly wont,  having ur investment locked up in the btc world for 3-4 months for a 5 % give or take   is terrible if u have some investment skills, on the flip side if  ur  new to the mining game thats a safer route.  since u have a backround in investing ,it doesnt make any sense for u to lock up ur coins.  if u even have some skills ur prob gonna make more than 5% in  3-4 months.

There`s a risk in this invest since you put your BTC in the hand of a company and you sign a contract with future values... but what`s bad ? Banks act like this. You just got a sign contract, that`s all. Hashnest doesn`t look like a scammer company... I`m always thinking about the legal side of BTC taking place over fiat currency... This profit modality (of contracts) looks less painful than the original way of mining (at least where electricity costs are very high).

ahh.. that`s true.

don`t put all you have into PACMiC. It`s terrible to invest in ONE thing ONLY. It`s a cool stuff but there`s risk, so think twice, don`t throw money away hhahaahah

People will buy piss in a bottle as long as the bottle looks nice. and they will sign the contract to. Then when they open it they get a nice aroma of piss up there nose when they smell it.

I learned that in the stock market buy watching asking general questions and listening to what's around me thousands of different opinions most of all patience.

And no for those of you I did not smell the piss or drink it because I was wise enough and smart enough to know there was piss in it.

If you think my post was sarcastic or foolish, then I highly doubt you are what you touted in your reply, not that it matters since we could both make up stuff from either side of this conversation until we are blue in the face and neither party would know, and to be honest, I don't care how much money you have or stocks you own, because it doesn't affect my position in the slightest.  A smart investor would listen to those who have done the research (as I have, probably more so than 99%+ of the other people in this thread), and hinted to you my position in my reply.  But as I also said, you have to do the research and not rely on strangers on the internet to give you direction, which seems to be the direction you are taking.

I would also recommend you not, "buy out a large mining farm", and realize I mean no offense, but you probably do not have the technical expertise or know how of how to run one.  There is a lot more work that goes into a mining farm than most people realize, and speaking from a position of running a decently large one, it isn't easy and you can't jump right in.

Reading your past posts, it didn't sound like you understood the concept of the PACMiC and how it worked, especially in relation to difficulty.  Also know, that anyone on here who gives you a difficulty prediction is blowing smoke out of their asses.  As I said before, per my research (and remember, it is quite extensive), I own many PACMiC's, currently have them set to reinvest, and am very happy with the stable returns that I am getting from them.

The fact is that.. you won`t lose BTC with PACMiC, even if BTC price hits the ground. You won`t lost IN BTC (`cause you`re trade with BTC currency) so, you could receive your BTC and lost money when you`re withdrawing next your fiat trade // ...then, abiut PACMiCs, it will just take more time to get your returning funds. If BTC your looking for a 90 days refund with profits, and BTC price gets lower, you will receive the same but maybe will be in 110 days. But the return will be the same (proportional to you deposit). It`s a very normal investment.

that is 100% false.  If bitcoin price goes down, then your contract may not complete if it costs more to run the units than the payout.  Read the ToS, they will shut off payments for the PACMiC if it costs more to run than it generates, same as buying any of their other hashing power.  At that point the contract is considered over.

Wong I clipped this from the Pacmic TOS agreement...


Like all forms of bitcoin mining, there is a certain level of risk involved. If network difficulty unforeseeably skyrockets, or if the price of bitcoin drops too much, the Antminer S5 units backing the PACMiC may not be profitable to run and be forced to go offline, in which case contracts would be suspended (possibly indefinitely) and the user may not recover the initial cost of the miner.

That sums that up.

The contract will be temporarially suspended if conditions were not favorable... so, let`s be less apocalyptic with BTC future. Since early days, everything within BTC world was risky... I bet this since I knew because it`s a nice idea. The return stills good for a first experience with it. Some people may want their coins to be underneath their arms, but, (at least in my case) it`s better than mining physically where electricity + diff, etc don`t help you get your coins. 

Ok. Let`s taking off the part of grounding prices. Indeed there`s a certain risk (like that one) or the skyrocket diff. So you`re right about the risk.

Yes, there are risks, I agree with you, but your statement that no matter what you would get a return of your principal is not right and could leave people high and dry if they read that and don't do any further research.  Also the, 'temporary" suspension is for 10 days, and if the conditions do not improve in time for your contract to again start working for you it is considered over, and no matter what happens in the future, your contract is done and will not start back up.

 
I get free electric.  ;D

Why do people Grab the shiny bottle but don't even bother to look to see if there is piss in it lol lol lol lol ;D ;D ;D

Hi

Have somebody calc the current ROI of Hashnest 's newest PACMiC Cloud Mining Contract ?

Q: Can I redeem my PACMiC before contract expiry?
A: No. The contract will be closed automatically at the time that the principal has been repaid in full. Contracts may not be terminated prior to this.

https://i.imgur.com/PDSduTl.png

Contract ends when the capital was been repaid. Personally i cant understand it.
An example if the current roi is 200 days (not real just for example)
i invest 1 btc and after 200 days i make a roi , means i have earn 1 btc
so the cotract expiry in 200 days ? aka not loosing but what about make a profit of that investment ?

can we have some more info about the end of the contract , please

Hi kapetan,

If you invest one bitcoin, get hashing power of one Th/s, mining revenue paid in PPLNS mode will be prior to pay your profit, then pay your unpaid capital.
Contract ends only when your one bitcoin is returned in full.

Profit is calculated by the formula: unpaid principal (BTC) * 0.7 (satoshis per BTC per second) * time to find a block (seconds).

So the end result is roughly 22% of profit per year under condition you re-buy your contracts during the entire year.  Principal returned in full.

So I am trying to understand this pacmic contract

I get the 22% annual return, and the repayment of principle etc etc.

what I don't understand is the perpetual buy back in option.

So, if I buy 1 contract for 1BTC and I immediately turn on the buy in option, and I leave it as is untouched for 100 days

what happens?  The contract hashing power increases,  but then what?

When a block is solved, you are rewarded with an increase in hashing power equal to the payout of the block and a increase in your principal equal to your profit amount.

I get that

but when does the contract unwind if I have buy back in turned on from the start?

does it go for ever until no longer profitable?   so 2 years from no on I have 1BTC principle and 2 THS of hashing power, but no longer profitable,  so I get my 1 BTC back?

no, you have to choose at some point to switch it off of buyback.  At that point, instead of continuously purchasing more hashpower and adding to your principal, it will start to put bitcoins into your wallet on the site.  The trick is to time the time it would take to pay back your principal amount to the time it is no longer profitable to run.

so lets ignore difficulty and price of BTC,  just mechanically speaking is my logic right?


I start off with 1btc = 1btc principle = 1.0th

reinvest until my 1btc = 1.2 principle = 1.5th, (so principle payback goes into more hashing and profit goes into more principle)

I turn off buy back, and and let the 1.5th pay back to 1.0 principle profit goes into wallet

I turn on buy back until I built up again for 1.btc = 1.2 principle = 2.0 th

I turn off buy back and my 2.0th gets me down to 1.0 principle again but quicker profit goes into wallet.

rinse and repeat, but the cycle gets quicker because my hashing power accumulates, as long as the contract is active.



 

The way you write makes sense, but it is actually better to continue to accumulate, since you will be earning interest on your interest.  If you let it pay you out, then you are not earning compounding interest.

The best way to handle the PACMiC is to find the exact time that it will take for you to earn your principal back and compare it to when the S5 is no longer profitable to hash.  As long as the time it will take for the S5 to no longer be profitable is longer than the days it will take to earn your principal back it is more worth it to keep your auto rebuy on and just continue to reinvest.

This sounds simple, but is much harder to figure due to difficulty and price changes in bitcoin than it seems.  I try to leave about a 40 to 50 day buffer where I would turn it off auto-rebuy.

I just turned my auto-rebuy back on a little while ago because the recovering bitcoin price has extended my thought process on how long these will remain profitable.

thank you for the discussion.

you are right, leave to rebuy and grow hashing power, as hashing power gets larger, it becomes easier to figure out when to start principle repayment which also take a shorter time.

difficulty seems to be holding steady which makes it even easier to decide.

we got some interesting offer here, really considering this kind of investment in this dark days where most of mining systems cant even make a ROI, safety with low earning rates seems the way.

Low earning interest rates?  This is still roughly 4 times better than anything in the stock market.

Im trying to understand PACMiC
Is I'm correct with explanation PACMiC profit earning??

Please see my excel attachment :

22% per year is a low interest rate for you? Where do you live, third world?

Don't forget all the risks involved, it's not bad, but mediocre given all involved risks (which are incomparably huge compared to stock market)... One of the better options these hard times though, I agree.

Probably the best option, considering fixed interest rate.

will there be a new round of PACMiC offered in the future?

I ask so I can plan to put the funds aside.

Why? You can get 100% ROI with their cloud mining and yet you choose 22%. Why?

Where are your numbers for this?

Well PACMiC is 22% a year max, it s fixed interest and it s in the official thread. Cloud is my own calculations based on this http://nextdifficulty.com/#roi
Cloud is a more risky option but it does generate more of potential returns. This is why I like to differentiate into PoS as well, DMD Diamond especially. Here is the link for this one as well: https://bit.diamonds/
Feel free to message me if I can help in any other way.

Right, but you stated that you can get 100% ROI with cloud mining, and it seemed pretty certain.  I am not arguing with you, I am just interested in how you got to that number.

Personally I find the PACMiC to be a safer option, and as such, the ROI is less.  I feel like a 100% positive ROI for the S5 is a tad too high, but to each his own.  I would rather take the less risky option on the PACMiC and get a lower return than the S5 potentially could be.

Of course, the option to sell your S5 at anytime is a great plus if you need the money, whereas my PACMiC's are tied up for a certain period of time (roughly 3 months).  So I think of the PACMiC sort of like a 3 month CD, but I would rather get 22% on the PACMiC than 1 or 2% on a normal CD through a bank.

Well, if you take a look at the table, current expected ROI for S5 is 257 days. Add a bit of difficulty increase to that and you ll get a year. Sell the miner and here it is. Yes, I agree, this is a risky option but in this industry, you can make money only on risk. PACMiC s Ok but only if you have a lot of funds at your disposal. If not, you invest 2 BTC and get 0.44 after a year. That s $100. Not worth of hassle and risk.

well

this is what I am doing

invested 1BTC and turned on reinvest all in at the start, it ran until the 8000TH sold out,  that took 20 days at which point the contract was mining at at 1.2THS

now all profit and investment that comes in I buy s5 contracts with. When paid out I will sell the s5 contracts and plow 1BTC back in,

rinse and repeat.

see what the net is after 12 months.

I cant even begin to figure out the math, but I think I am ahead at a rate greater than 22% a year......

Depends on what price you get for buying and selling your S5 contracts.

Even then, he might still end up with negative ROi rates I'd say

1 thing I don't get,so if i invest 220 dollars into this when will the contract expire and how long will it take for me to make my money back

You keep asking the same questions and I keep telling you the same answer. Nobody can tell you that, it depends on lots of variables. Roughly, your ROI ll be about 300 days at best.

I have a feeling you do not understand how mining difficulty works and you think this is some 100% secure investment. It s not. You can lose your money easily, if you do not know what to do.

How long does the contracts last for this then.It says "The contract expires at the moment that the principal has been paid back in full.
BITMAIN may pay extra Bitcoin to the owner of PACMiC before the principal has been paid back in full, which will accelerate the payout even more." but no one can tell me what this means,I don't get what it means by when the principal has been paid back in full

It means what you get back your initial investment. When you get back your 220 USD back, that s principal.

To avoid confusion, each day, they pay a little bit of your principal + your interest. When the sum all those small chunks of your principal which you get paid each day reaches your initial investment, the contract is terminated. You do get that interest as well.

If we are talking about PACMiC, interest is about 22% a year. So you ll get 220 USD back and 22% interest at the top of that. This is in ideal conditions.

If we are talking about S5 miner, ROI is about 300 days and after that, it s all profit. Again, in ideal conditions.

BUT, if it becomes less profitable to run an S5 than the payouts, then the contract will terminate.  So if difficulty spikes or $/btc exchange rate goes down, you can find yourself with a terminated contract before the principle is paid back (aka a loss).

Can someone from Hashnest confirm if more PACMiC's will be sold?

One last thing,is there any better cloud mining service other than this?I decided against investing in PACMiC and the S4 are all sold out so is there any other company that you would recommend?

You can check at Bit-x, but else.. there are no better, because those that are better (like scrypt.cc) are just scams. You can wait for Antminer S6 though, should be out this summer.

S4 are not sold out. Plenty of them on the Hashnest market. If S4 cloud mining is what you want to go with.

Is the S6 better than the S4 since the S4 was better than the S5 and whats the estimated price?

It hasn't been released or announced yet, so no one knows and for anyone to say anything otherwise is pure speculation.

It s going to be better then everything available so far. However, we have no details ATM.

S5 s a newer and more effective miner compared to S4. So it would be appropriate to say S5 is better then S4.

I too am wondering if there will be another round of pacmic.  Let us know please Bitmain.

Same as many here, when i decided i was ready and understood the contract it went out of order... shame i haven't seen it before it was too late...
Another round of Pacmic would be really nice, especially in those "stable" times of btc.

PACMIC seems good but remember it locks your btc in. Its one of the more safer investments but the ROI is not too high since it will take a while before you see that return. I think its better to just trade on the hashnest exchange since you can buy and sell freely.

How long has it been since the last PACMiC round was available?

There are pros and cons to each.  I have been buying hash there because the pacmic was not available and the results have been very good.  The nice thing is that if you buy at a price and later decide that you want out at the same price or higher, while you wait to see if it goes back up you collect mined coins.  It is a very nice way to go.

Pacmic v2 just opened.
I was tired of waiting and invested in some S5 and coins just yesterday.

Have to buy extra BTC now :D

Did you look though the formula is changed no longer .7 its .45

How many time it take to fully get back the value with the pacmic 1 ??

According to https://sites.google.com/site/freebitcoinsforall/ it will take 108 days to ROI (I don't own the site, i'm not sure how accurate it is either)

So the new one will take more than this since the bonus is lower!  :-\

No I think it should take the same amount of time, but you will make less since the profit portion was cut in half.  So they were advertising the original PACMiC was around 22% APR, but now it will be closer to 11%.  Not really worth it anymore IMO.

If I have auto buy turned on for for PACMiC v1, will it buy into PACMiC v2 with the reinvestment?

It doesn't appear to be doing that, no.

Missed that indeed. May buy it just for my curious side though.

I still like it,  stable and quiet.

I'm unclear on this PACMIC (v2) service...

It *looks* really good, and I'm keen to invest --

BUT, I'm not clear on the 'pay back' scheme... does this mean I only pay a deposit per TH rather than the full 1 BTC ?

It is the exact same this time around as before...

You pay 1 btc, which equates to 1 TH/s of mining power.  As blocks are found by Antpool, you get a payout equal to as if you had 1 TH/s of mining power pointed at the pool.  There are no electricity or maintenance fees taken out.  This amount goes back to you and reduces the amount that they owe you (which was 1 btc).  You get profit based on the length of time it took to find that block times 4.5 satoshis times your unpaid principal.

As for whether it is profitable and/or better than anything else.  There is no crystal ball.  If everyone knew the answer to that, there would be no question, but no one can predict what the future of mining will bring.  As with anything, there is a risk involved in buying a PACMiC, the thought is that the risk with these are lower, and therefor you will get less return on your money compared to other investments.  Do your own calculations and determine your risk level and what your looking for in an asset/return.

You pay 1 btc for 1 TH. To explain it very simple how it works is when you get your principle (1btc) back the contract ends and the miner is no longer yours. To make you a profit some of the coin they pay you does not count toward this principle so you end up with an ROI. the only way to actually lose money is if the S5 becomes unprofitable while you have the contract. As difficulty goes up it will take longer to pay you back but there is no timer on the contract. Essentially the estimated APY was around 22% I believe but with v2 its more around 14-16%.

Ah! Ok, I get it.... effectively I buy the miner at a reduced cost and HashNest buy it back from me with the interest being the (time * 4.5 Satoshi * amount owed) payment.

What are people's experiences of the 'v1' of this scheme ?

It worked out really well.  I have a couple of them that are about 86% paid back and some down to about 55% paid back.  They have brought in some income for a fairly safe investment.  Have been pretty happy so far.

I'm convinced... trying to raise funds via BTCJam to buy in.

That I would not do, in fact, your BTCJam loan will probably have higher interest than what you would earn by buying a PACMiC.  I highly discourage you from taking a loan to invest, that is a sure fire way to get in real big trouble real fast.

not sure how the interest rate you are going to pay on the BTCjam loan will be less that the return on PACMICv2, and even it is the net positive it will me miniscule,  but okay.........

You are quite right... I should have paid more attention to calculating things properly.

I still believe PACMiC looks like a good investment; just got to pull my coins together....

Can someone explain what is going on? I have autobuy on, but it only seems like it has autobought 3GHS over the past 3 days.
If my calculations are correct, shouldn't I be getting around 0.01 BTC per day with a 1THs contract? I had the impression that it said that there were no maintenance or hosting fees.

Do you mean 30 GH/S? I have had mine running for 3 days as well and am currently at 1.03458546 TH/S, which would be 34 GH/s added to my contract.

As for what is going on?  No idea.  I asked the other day a few posts up why blocks aren't being credited after 6 blocks, and it seems like they are just updating the V2 PACMiC's once a day.  IDK why, and the terms and FAQ don't explain anything as to why it is being done differently.

God, when I'm not in school, my brain just fails horribly and I can't do any maths.
Yes, that makes sense now. So I assume if we turn it off we would get like 0.01 BTC per day?

Okay, purchased some PACMiC v2 contracts.  I have enabled Auto-Rebuy for the time being and will monitor when to switch to off.

Yea I turned my autorebuy back on last night.  Really wish someone would comment from Bitmain and allow V1 contracts to become V2 contracts with autorebuy enabled.  Also wish they would update us on if they will increase the amount of hash we get for 1 btc.

Great service. I bought a Pacmic v2 contract a few days ago. Looks really promising :-)

I also very positive to these contracts of several reasons. We know they are backed by a real mining company. We do a little profit, while nothing extraordinary that would indicate that the company is desperate, they only want to lend money from us to expand. After the contract ended (when we have got our money back + a decent interest) they will of course sell these as regular S5, making more money, expanding even more and have funding to put out their S6s.

i made a profit on the pacmic v1 from 0.00313968 with an investment of 1 BTC. I don't understand it because my hashrate (TH) is  1.08345714 and my total payout after 100 days is 1.00313968 BTC

That is extremely low. The withdrawal fee is a little less than 1/3 of that.

Yeah, something isn't right with that.

Yep, I looked into it, comparing rates on BTCJam with the earnings of PACMIC, and you would end up losing if loaning there.

An opportunity to possibly make it work, would be with a fiat bank with great interest on their loans, like with a house backing it. That could be a viable option if you want to change your portfolio, from house investment to BTC though.

PACMiC v3 now available

Shoot, was just about to start working, now I have a whole new ToS to read and math to do. lol

Based on a quick spreadsheet, it looks like the V3 PACMiC will return less profit per contract, but because they are cheaper, will take shorter to pay off, which has an effect of providing a higher APR.

Should be around an 8.5% APR, will have to double check my spreadsheets though to make sure that is about right.

(This assumes no difficulty changes, will have to add that into my spreadsheet to see the effects of what a few percent increases will do.  Should make profits a little higher, but I doubt by much.)

It also seems with the lower price if you run it on autobuy it should compound much faster. Therefore increasing your payback principal, but also delaying your full payback.  That seems fairly attractive to me, but I haven't done any calcs on it.

I'm still satisfied with my v2 contracts that are running atm.  With price fluctuations, and increasing hashrate it has been a pretty safe & steady albeit small % return when compared with mining. 

Hashnest website says annualized ROI is 25.2288%, so either they are guilty of false advertising or your calcs are way off.

Hmm, I just saw that.  I will publish my calcs in a bit on google docs, but I don't see how I could be off by that far.  IDK though, it could be possible.

Here is my spreadsheet...
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zbKKyXtW0vcfGDufk_UIRg_gAi0JzjsFwvB7LGj8bOI/edit?usp=sharing

I am not getting to the 25% APR, perhaps I have an error?  Can anyone correct my calcs for the V2 and V3?

So your 7% is based on the 107 days your contract ran.  If it had ran for a full year, hence an "Annual Percentage Rate" it would be around 25%.

No, the 7% is the annualized rate for the V2, on the next tab for V3 the annualized is 12.73%.

I think the 25% comes from if the same amount of profit was paid as the first block of every contract, for every block.  That gets me to around 25% I believe, but that is not really a fair way to evaluate the asset.

As always, you've out-mathed me!  ;-)  Thanks for the analysis.

No no, please scrutinize.  I think my math is correct, but it just seems so far off from what Bitmain says that I am skeptical.  If I am right, then they are advertising way over what that asset should be showing as a APR.

My poor math skills besides, 12% APR is an amazing rate for a suitably benign risk.  We've become spoiled, perhaps, with the returns that can one can reap in the world of cryptocurrency.

I was pleased with the V1, so I'll give V3 a shot.

(I'll fire up a Google sheet this week and see what I come up with...)

I think they take the "auto-Rebuy" feature. If we can re-invest the proceeds, it may reach much higher APR than 12.73%, but I have not done the model yet.

Got a question, might had been answered already but if we buy on the market say an S5 or something for x amount of gh/s do we keep that until we sell it or becomes unprofitable, its not a contract is it? Not talking about the Pacmic contracts ..

Thanks

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   yes buying at market  when the order gets executed  it will appear in ur act . shop will take 3 days.  reguarding the market , yes u can buy it   and sell it as u please. when it becomes unprofitable  u can pay  for shipping and they will send u a machine for every 1155 ghs u have  of s5, it will be a different amt for other machines.

so whats with the maintenance to pps %
Does that mean if it has 85% means that 85% is used toward maintenance?

Humm

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example


https://www.hashnest.com/hash_currencies/24/income

  are u lord icon i see u at there chat haha ,  at any rate,    pps  means they pay u once a day one large sum.( umisoo, s2)
ppls ( the rest of the gear)  pays and charges fees block to block.  the longer the block takes the more it eats up ur block profit and yes it can be negative . fast blocks mean more for sats for us.  so yes pps 85 percent means it charges 85 percent fee,  and ppls mode  is just the overall maintee fee  avergage out.

Yea that was me :)  anyways here is a question for ya, how is it buying more hash rate (reinvest on) makes more btc? Seeing the contract stops at .666 btc, seems to me buying more hashrate just speeds up the time to hit the .666 btc and really blowing the earnings seeing we get paid to wait :) earning .08 sotisih per second mining.

Or does reinvesting add to the .666 debt? Meaning our reinvestment adds to what Bitman has to pay us back..



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Yes, all the profit that you earned from each block mined gets added to your principal amount, then the next block takes the amount of profit you earn times the outstanding principal amount, which is now higher than .666.  Basically you are compounding your profits.

Just to clarify, that means Bitman will owe me more then .666 btc back seeing i keep buying more gh/s from them?

Thanks

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Yes.

 I don't see where the specified 0.098 cent electric for the "optimal S5 miner" part is figured?

 I did a rough calculation last week, at 2% diff increase, and came up with ballpark 250ish days to pay back the initial .666 BTC and a small profit.

That spreadsheet doesn't care about electricity price.  All it does it figure out how long it will take to pay back .666 btc with 1 TH/s of mining power based on how many blocks Antpool should be finding per day.

As of right now, it will take roughly 80 days to pay back .666 btc on a PACMiC contract with a 5% difficulty increase.
A S5 will become unprofitable after roughly 120 days.

That is a 40 day difference, for me that is under the 50 day difference I try to keep it over and as such, I usually turn off the auto rebuy at this point.  But, I think the price will rebound and the difficulty adjustments will be low for another 2 or 3 rounds before we see some bigger growth, so I will leave my auto rebuy on for now.

You're missing the point.

 That 0.098 "electric/maintainance fee" appears to come right off the top of the "payback" part of the PACMIC contract, if I'm reading the bloody thing right. Therefore your estimate of 80 days for payback seems WILDLY optimistic, even at ZERO difficulty increase.

ICBW but...

The 0.098 does not come off anything, there is no maintenance fees on pacmic contracts.

That price is only relevant if difficulty jumps or btc falls and they would be unprofitable to run on 0.098 electric, that is when they suspend the contract.

As pointed out, every block found on a PACMiC contract pays the full amount that 1 TH/s of hashing speed would have generated on Antpool.  There is no electricity or maintenance fees taken out which is why first you calculate how quickly .666 btc will be paid back with 1 TH/s of hash with no electricity fee.  Then compare that to how long the S5 will remain profitable.

So got a question,  the .08 satoshis we are getting per second, is that getting counted toward our principal (.666 btc)? If so that's NOT profit, that's just getting our own btc back faster, IE no profit.

Also i already asked in chat, the iOS app is no longer working for me and a few others it seems... :(

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the .8 (not .08) satoshi/sec seems to be skimmed "off the top" of the payout and becomes the "profit", THEN the balance of the payout is applied to "payback of the principal".

 Ignore the 0.098 electric cost thing for a couple months, that was a misreading of the contract terms and should have no effect for a while. My best estimate is that a S5 will be profitable at 0.098 electric right up to the halfing - they might still be profitable AFTER the halfing at my "non-summer" 0.067 incrimental electric rate, if the halfing wasn't due to happen soon after the time my rates kick up for the summer (though I hope to be ELSEWHERE with cheap electric by then).

 I figure the V3 contracts won't hit "no more payout" status as of the halfing, if not then VERY VERY shortly thereafter, unless bitcoin prices kick up quite a bit before that or difficulty flattens back out to well under 2%/round on average (yeah, SURE it will..... NOT!).


 Based on what I'm seeing out of my "trial" contract, looks like payback will be ballpark 100ish days, possibly as high as 120 with the RECENT difficulty rate of increase.

Basically, as long as you have auto-rebuy ON you will never get your principal back? You aren't buying new contracts you are just increasing the hashrate of the contract you have thus increasing your principle amount.

Is that correct?

Yes, you are increasing your principal amount and your hashrate when you have auto rebuy turned on.

Anyone has Pacmic V2 and ROIed ?
I wish I can see real historical chart...

Trying to log in into my hashnest/pacmic account and instead was greeted with some gibberish about enabling 2FA.
Is it mandatory-no, but not enabling it would render my account to be stolen-what if it was already stolen?
I wonder why this was not a requirement from the get-go
Well, I figured out how it works.

I have a 1TH/s Pacmic V2 which I purchased on 26th June.

I set it to Autobuy until 12th August when autobuy was turned off and started getting payouts.
My total principal at this point was 1.02044364 BTC.

It is just over a month now since Autobuy was turned off and so far I have 49.21% back.
Total back so far is 0.50218312 BTC

Just thought I would post this incase you found it useful.

Cheers
Ian

i am a new user

after Sign up an account

what is the next step ?

What is the highest current roi at Hashnest?

So let me get this straight, hashnest turn off my auto reinvest and now i cant turn it back on?

Well it has its on but status has running and with pay back info...


The hashrate hash stoped growing as well

Also how are we suppose to hit that magic 25% ROI if hashnest forces us off auto reinvest?




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You can only continue to reinvest as long as there are contracts left to sell.  Once they run out, your auto reinvest is turned off and you start getting paid back.

Hashrate won't grow any further (unless new contracts are released which is unlikely for V3)

You cannot hit the 25% ROI, even with the auto reinvest, the contract would become unprofitable before being able to make that much.

Hi guys,

I just want to share my experience with Hashnest here. At the moment it is the only bitcoin mining service I trust as the mining machines really exist :)

I participated in PACMIC1 and now in PACMIC3.

These are my figures:
PACMIC 1:
Total Principal: 1.0 BTC
Hashrate: 1 TH/s
Profit: 0.02946627 BTC
ROI: 2.95 %
it was something like 3 months or so...

PACMIC 3:
Total Principal: 1.36166421 BTC
Hashrate: 3.056 TH/s
Profit: 0.03534406 BTC
ROI: 2.57 %
(still running though)

Good offer for me...

PACMiC v4 is now available at the cost of 1BTC per TH with a return of 0.45 satoshis per second and 20000 THS available.  I'm personally going to be passing in lieu of HAOBTC's longer term investing options.

Anyone plan on getting in on this action?  With 20 PHS available, early buyers can likely choose themselves when to turn off autobuy, so that may be something to consider as well.

Pacmic v4 is a shame.
The ROI is the same as the Pacmic v2 !
With the Antminer S7 (low electricity cost), it will be a lot better that Pacmic v3.

I am very disappointed !

In addition, with these unattractive conditions, the 20,000 contracts will take a very long time to sell (at least as long as Pacmic v2): no hope for Pacmic v5 before long time :-( !

Edit : at the curent rate, 80 daysminimum  to sell the 20,000 Pacmic v4 contracts (no Pacmic V5 before Noël).

I still don't believe my eyes when I see that people actually is buying the contracts. v4 is a joke!

Ehh only very few are buying, probably the same people who are going to come back in 120 days, when the S5 is no longer profitable to run, and complain that they are being screwed by Hashnest and its all a big scam instead of admitting that they made a bad investment.

I think they are still on holiday until tomorrow, so perhaps when people start getting back into the office and noticing that it either wasn't offered correctly or something, they will take another look at make a better offer for V4.

Maybe not many buyers, but still people buying! I was hoping that v4 would be the new miner so I could invest a larger amount. But won't purchase anything until the terms have changed ;P

Looks like the description of V4 has been changed to using the S7 for hashing.  Not a great return, but at least you can now get your money back before the unit becomes unprofitable to run.

I will now be buying a few.

With the S7, no need to get the money back because it will be profitable all the time of the contract...
CQFD (in french, sorry).

Has anyone worked out the Roi for the V4 ? I've tried to but i'm a bit confused with the % ROI on it. Do you think bitmain are likely to come out with a V5 before the 2000 has been used up ?

Right now the best deal at Hashnest is S5 hash. Price bottomed out last week and started an uptrend. You can buy and hold, get mining income, and as price increases sell your hash at a profit. At some point in a couple of months S7 will be the better deal but not now.

Is there a reason my 2 pac 3 contracts not made any btc for today? I have a 0 btc balance with only .6 of my 1 btc i paid in paid back..

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Pacmic v3 price was 0.666 btc, not 1 btc.