firstly segwit does not actually offer 4mb true open utility. thats the fake promise of a 2015 scaling debate

secondly if your thinking of keeping the same computer for 10 years. then i feel sorry for your computer in regards to future other software from microsoft, apple and any other software available (unrelated to bitcoin) that wont work well on a computer thats over 10 years.(most people upgrade their pc's every 4-6 years on average

thirdly having millions of people running a full node would actually cause more of a bottleneck than having ~10k-100k used by merchants that NEED to monitor funds of thousands of people paying them each day. rather than home users that may only get paid once a month.

those only getting paid once a month and only wanting to use bitcoin just to buy groceries to be delivered next day, can just use spv wallets. not everyone needs to be a full node and monitor ~2000 tx every 10 minutes if they are only personally involved in 1 tx a day/week

if you are a business NEEDING to be monitoring more than just a couple addresses. then you probably for other business purposes have your computers on a 4 year tax deductibles set-up where you replace equipment. and you probably hav a business internet plan. rather than a home user plan

..
lastly LN is a separate network to be used for multiple coins. meaning it will require once established properly. masternodes that monitor multiple chains. thus making LN hardware requirements to be a "full node"(factory/hub/watchtower) compared to just using bitcoin and only using a bitcoin node to make transaction on the bitcoin network.
or you can just use a cellphone app and not be a full node like 99% of most people

LN is the separate network with channels.
segwit is a tx format... its a bitcoin tx format.. when its used on the bitcoin network
it can be used to lock bitcoin up should people want to use the tx format as a gateway into LN.
so segwit is part of bitcoin. but its utility opens users up to something thats not bitcoin

segwit is a tx format... its a bitcoin tx format.. when its used on the litecoin network
it can be used to lock bitcoin up should people want to use the tx format as a gateway into LN.
so segwit is part of litecoin. but its utility opens users up to something thats not litecoin

referencing the kardasians is about the social drama distraction going on within the "dev state" of dcg.co/portfolio
to which doomad and windfury and any core loyalist are fans of.

yet the devs themselves have something different to say than what windfury and doomad believe.
windfury i take with a pinch of salt, as he is still learning.
but doomad has an obvious issue, which makes me wonder what his end agenda is with all his flip flopping and even going against the mantra of the very team he tries to defend.
i still wonder what some fanboys are even doing defending something that even the devs dont try denying.

but hey if your rebuttals only end up being insults. then many yawns and facepalms would be heard.. and thats about it

imagining bitcoin being where 1 bit (100 sat) is $1 then bitcoin would go upto $1m
but that is more of a extreme.
id say bitcoin could not go up exponentially forever. especially if tx fee's start costing $2.50+ a tx (250byte+) people wont want to use bitcoin

so $100k (25cent tx fee minimum) seems just about the level that utility and desire will start to tail off like an S curve.

so dont aim for a $1m area. aim for $100k and then just treat anything higher as a bonus

show me my undermining code that will make unilateral changes..

also read my footnote
"Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at"

im not the dictator here. but your anger, hostility, swearing, curcing and trying to say i should leave the community. and your desire to REKT anything not core.. are very very revealing of what your desires are.

if you dont like what people discuss. then maybe you should b the one that avoids a discussion forum.. or atleast

if you dont like what i have to say. hit the ignore button

yawn


google can show you the rules/laws they made.
should you care to eventually want to independently research.

also, should you care to read my footnote

"Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at"

i would also like to emphasize opinions on a discussion forum.. are discussions. not rules, not laws. not dictating or and not binding.. unlike the actions of the "dev state" in august 2017

if you dont like what i have to say. hit the ignore button

so show me the dictating code i wrote?

oh wait. there is none. because i am not dictating. im just stating what occured IN THE PAST
no one can dictate the past.. thus im just informing people that august 1st 2017 actually occured because you wish people to not be aware of it.

i know its a negative hit against your dev state. but it happened. and funnily enough they are proud of it. they are the ones PROMOTING mandated upgrades and upgrades that dont need consensus

which keps me wondering why your denying the actions occured when the guys you wish to defend are promoting their involvement and joy of it happening

again you are misguided.
1. im not dictating crap. thats what the "dev state" done in august 2017
2. consensus of majority means just that. majority.. by the "dev state" wanting a lower threshold is a contentious fork
3. by making nodes get banned and blocks getting rejected is also a different scenario than consensus.
the old consensus mechanism would not ban old nodes and would not ban old block formats..
but the dev state you support have and did..
4. by promoting such threatening contentious fork which occured on august 1st. was not consensus

but atleast your starting to admit that core are running code that activates at a lower threshold...
you finally tripped over your own flip flop which goes against your previous flips of 100% loyalty

anyway my argument is not about the %. its about the fact that it was not a clear majority accrued via full community count. due to the tricks of NYA/UASF/"compatibility" etc...
i already told you in many topics "mandatory" "mandatory" "mandatory" "mandatory" is what i am against.

you keep saying how users get to choose by them upgrading to a feature they want. yet segwit wasnt not activated by the method you flip.. you even admit the "compatibility. and the no vote and the other stuff that users dont get to dictate what core should do... so no point you flopping by suddenly saying users do get a vote

now may you go in peace and watch some eastenders. because i know you love your soap opera/drama more so that reality

your so stuck in a propaganda myth
try researching the truth.. heres a keyword
chainhash

it allows the LN network to know what chain (network/coin) the payment/channel is involved in. its what allows litecoin, vertcoin and others to use LN.

its why LN lets litecoin use it and also allows atomic swaps to occur
LN is not a bitcoin layer. its a separate network for multiple coins to use.

the "off-chain" is the mis information.. its a way to be subtle that LN is a non blockchain network

if you are next going to argue that LN is not its own network.. simply ask yourself what does N stand for in LN
ill give you a hint 'network'
ask yourself why is it not called a LBF
lightning bitcoin feature

more proof?
https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/blob/master/chainregistry.go#L570

if lightning NETWORK was not for multi coin usage, it would not even want to register/acknowledge the existence of other coins and would only want to accept bitcoin...
.. but thats not the case.
its a open network for any coin that is compatible. (its why litecoin done segwit too. to have a tx format that is a gateway format into LN)

also...
the reason they misguide you with "bitcoin layer" is just the fundraiser/sponsorship advert to get some investment for devs by playing off the separate network as something "relevant" to bitcoin.
its much like coinbase buzzwording bitcoin service even though they also accept other coins. and mainly a fiat service.. but by mentioning bitcoin. creates the hype and gets them better investors

anyway putting aside mr meanders personal attacks yet again.

back to the topic at hand
summary of my opinion
1. not bloating the blockchains with smart contracts aimed to push people off network will strengthen utility on network because it keeps people on network.(pushing people offnetwork is not scaling bitcoin. its like telling americans to use canada's payment system due to american system limitations is not increasing USD usage)

2. making transactions lean (hard drive real byte storage for full validatable tx data) would allow the transaction count to not decline (making smart transaction formats more popular REDUCES tx count byte per byte as they are heavier)

3. not having wishy washy code that forgets to count bytes in code, to bypass hard drive byte storage rule, (witness scale factor is just partly it)
or
4. simply remove the rule if the hard drive ends up storing more bytes than the rule imposed is meant to prevent.(because the rule is then redundant anyways)

5. removing the witness scale factor allows full 4mb utility, and removes the fake tx fee promotion. as witness scale factors doesnt actually discount segwit users. it actually just makes legacy 4x more expensive.(code shows legacy fee as *4... it does not show segwit fee / 4)

6. make transactors who wish to bloat/spam the blockchain be the ones punished by costing that bloater/spammer more. rather than making the average transactor pay more due to one persons actions

yes i do expect a certain meander object that any idea's of change not advocated by "dev state" are wrong/bad/should not be allowed to even be discussed because it doesnt fit the "dev state" roadmap
but there lays issue which number 6 should address.

7. have a network of independant teams that dont get rekt for opposing a "dev state" by there not being a "dev state". instead have it so anyone can propose anything. and it only activates if there is true consensus (2009-2013 consensus)

as for your UNRESEARCHED fake beliefs that 95% are core loyal

https://bitnodes.earn.com/nodes/?q=1037
only 65% are full nodes
majority of that are actually not run by humans at home independantly but are sybil nodes on amazon, hertsner, digital ocean

and as you keep on promoting people dont vote, people dont need to upgrade as they are "compatible"
so people are not 95% loyal.

now have a coffee relax for a while, destress yourself and self rview if your foing to flip or flop.
or you can just ignore my opinion and hit the ignore button

again for emphasis. i have not and have have nor ever will be trying to sway people into a authoritarian regime. i simple desire to wake people up to the one that already exists since 2013. so that people can see how things have changed since 2013

i have made no code demands of people. nor have i mandated change. i just openly offer my opinion and tell people to go do some independant research

you dont like it? hit the ignore button.

and stop telling people if they dont like the authoritarian regime they can simply "f**k off".. as thats just soo anti freedom

users have a choice :: there is no voting
                        flip :: flop

make up your mind
your confusing people running a node because there its the only way to not use a custodian for coin storage.. with the consensus vote of being able to activate/object to activating new features(which has slowly been diluted and lost)

people dont run core to have a free will independant choice of what features the network should/shouldnt have.
people run core just to not have to use a custodian for their coins

core are very much in control of the features and rules of the network. not by user choice. but by actions done by the "dev state" over the years

as for your personal attacks.. you make me laugh.
i dont want people to follow me.. show me some code i made that people should follow
show me some code that has mandated activations.

its also why. i say to people to do their own research. i even say that its best not to just be spoonfed from their social buddy/chum groups but do independent research
but you have been adamant you would prefer to argue and tell me i should leave the community, rather than actually recognise what independant thoughts, opinions and open community are really about.

if you dont like my open thoughts and opinions. hit the ignore button. its simple

now, how about you look passed your love and adoration of "dev state" and notice their actions which you keep trying to deny, even when they fully admit it. as that is the biggest flaw in your rebuttals. they are happy with their "dev state" status.
im not sure why you defend them by denying the actions they are happy to admit

as for saying the community run the code that enforces their will.
you yourself have been promoting the non vote/ compatibility of where users dont get to tell devs what devs can and should do

maybe best you really did take some time and research.. or atleast have a coffee and think about are you flipping or flopping. choose one and stick with it.

you are soo in the authoritarian mindset of wanting "dev state" to reign supreme. you have even admitted that even before i write any code for anyone to review/use you will REKT it.. simply because it opposes "dev state"

also your soo stuck in the authoritarian mindset that you believe that those not wanting core to be the "dev state" authoritarian, must mean the opposer wants to be an authoritarian
yet you cannot actually understand a system of multiple teams on an equal level play ground that all dont use mandated crap, and instead let consensus play out.

you only reside leadership, a dominant brand. where they set their agenda and no one can tell them what to do or not do.
its like you dont understand true freedom. but only recognise a tory/monarch empire as being "freedom"

you call that being "open to freedom"... pfft

its not a "user speculating"
its an exchange organising its cold store

the only speculating i see is the social drama of the reddit poster and this topic creator

exchanges have always been organising its coldstore daily for years
so many examples.. heres one
https://www.blockchain.com/btc/tx/33b2d09f26364cde78982079f99ae585688c7f96fc6497ef9e59a0fa2f434dae
this is an exchange re-accumilating its cold stores into one main address after reorganising

there are many other examples.. just the other week people were screaming about "6k moved" "66k moved" "8k moved"
which were all the same thing

so relax its not user movements. its just exchanges doing what they do regularly

1. users will have to think about it becaus users (99% of people) will be using cellphone apps.. thus trusting the 'significant nodes(factories)/hubs (who is the app creator)*
2. quickly outed? the significant nodes/ will be the ones holding users funds. and needing their signature.*
3. by a user trying to broadcast a tx from a cellphone app. guess who they API send it through... yep the server (app company) who are the factory/significant node of concern*
 
its like having a payment dispute over an applepay tx. but your using apples app. and they have 2 signature authority vs your 1 signature in a 2-of-3 signature scheme, which under schnorr you will not realise its a 2-of-3, you will be optimistic that its a 2-of-2, and have to trust that is the case.. until its too late


your link is an example concept where a blockchain confirmed tx used as the peg for a inchannel open session.. thats like an outdated concept from 2017.
the concept is now you blockchain confirm and lock with a factory.
the factory then sends out unconfirmed non blockchain 'balance' to your wallet. and then you use that balance to open channels
making you 2 hops separated away from the blockchain proven tx

seems you trust things too much.. optimism about utopia vs critical thinking is where optimism is the flaw of trust
LN does not use bitcoin for byzantine fault tolerance. bitcoin does not stop a factory from altering its code at a whim.
users cellphone app is at the mercy of the factories whim

what your saying about LN is like saying bitcoin solves the issues of coinbase.com
oh and if you do manage to get a raw tx and broadcast it without cellphone API to your factory(because they wont relay if they are malicious)
they will simply treat you as the one in the wrong and thus send out their own tx revoking you.
yes its possible..
.. and yes you end up having to trust that they wont. and trust that because there isnt any scam accusation posts about certain factories that the factory/cellphone app company you use is trustable*

i guess you really havnt used/testd LN. or if you have you only used it under th limited 'ill stay in the only use as intended' remit.. and not been critical to bug test it via the 'play around swing a bat around and see what breaks' remit

sometimes optimism(trust and dreams) are not good. yes they feel good. but when it comes to securing funds. not good

*i know what you are thinking.. the old 2017 concept (pre factory) of be your own node.
well you do realise that LN concepts are now master nodes monitoring multiple chains like vertcoin, lightcoin and bitcoin..
which if you were a critical thinker rather than an optimist of trust. will make you realise this:
1. when your at a coffee shop will you be bringing your laptop/desktop with you running a masternode to buy coffee?
2. if your computer is ok to run a masternode of several blockchains. then its man enough to just run one blockchain of larger scale, so why debate that bitcoin cant scale due to home computer limitations if your home computer isnt as limited as you care to admit by saying you can run a masternode for several blockchains
3. 99% of people wont be masternodes.

now that the social drama of insults is put aside.

letss concentrate on the topic.

how would a rebirth of bitcoin look if the community got all the things they wanted.
1. multiple dev groups of independence who could all offer new features without REKT/mandated dilution efforts, but instead true consensus
2. concentrating on lean thin transactions of pushing funds to others without bloating via smart contracts(visa doesnt do smart contracts after all)
3. the limitation of transactions per block would be more of a demand/growth dynamic. rather than a reduce usage by moving offnetwork
4. not letting users have so much tx bloat that they could fill any block/sig limit with just 5 transactions
5. a fee mechanism that does not cause network wide increase in fee's for everyone due to one person spamming..
but instead causes the spammer to spend more if the spammer wants to bloat a block or spend every 10 minutes

the silly thing is the whole "cant buy coffee with bitcoin"
using the LN network involves locking funds . opening several channels, thereby splitting up the value into different channels just to HOPE for good connectivity. then HOPE the channel partners are online to authorise the funds hops. and hope other people dont route through you and take your balance before you get to spend it yourself.
OR
if you plan to deposit $60 worth of btc to cover a fortnight of coffee and a few sandwiches in LN.. just use BTC to buy $60 of giftcards

describing the easy solution to coffee and also raising point 2.. over complicating and adding bloated features doesnt help. its easier to just keep things lean and simple and just have a open payment network that just openly pays.

the silly thing about the whole "energy consumption"
more energy is wasted keeping bottles of coca-cola chilled, than bitcoin. bitcoin miners have already made the watts per hash very very efficient.
if w were to CPU mine bitcoin at todays hashrate. it would require TRILLIONS of cpu's, billions of GPU but only a few million ASICS. and the power consumption of an ASIC is only ~3pc's
millions*3 is better than trillions
i can guarantee you that the number of computers in bank cashier counters, ATMS, bank call centres, Visa warehouses, bank HQ, wall street surpasses bitcoins electric utility

so instead you prefer having one puppet.. ok got that
so instead you prefer no choice... ok got that
so instead you prefer that no one can put their hand up that puppets ass and make it dance.. ok got that

again your advocating tyranny where you just want that sngle puppet to do what it wants and not have to listen to the community..
.. yep i got that

i know your mindset. i understood your mindset months ago.
the thing is.. your flip flops show you have not yet either:
admitted your own desire to yourself consciously
or you really do want tyranny but you dont want the sheep waking up and uprising

well goodluck

if you dont understand then you have no clue about what blockchains solved in regards to decentralised money.
by not understanding the importance of byzantine generals theory in regards to bitcoin. then your other topic about "what bitcoin gave us".. is a hollow topic you started, because it seems you have not grasped it enough

by your preference of control and centralised groups, and non blockchain networks. its pretty clear you have not really looked into what bitcoin and blockchain is really about.

but i guess your chums never wanted to tell you about the whole history of bitcoin/blockchain and what bitcoin solved.. because your chums wanted you to concentrate on the centralising move people off the network mindset of recent years

and by the way before you have your predictable rebuttal.. distribution of compatible loyalty is not the same as decentralised consensus

but if you really at all care about bitcoins security. you will find doing some independent research outside of your buddy group will benefit you.

and the reason i kep saying do your own research is purely so that you cant claim i am spoon-feeding you biases..
its up to you to decide if you care/desire want to know whats real.
and best way to do that is do your own research independently without buddies with spoons feeding you

there is a market:mining dynamic of 'whats the cheapest way to get bitcoins'

right now using a constant of 104*exa hashrate has been a good baseline value for cheapest mining cost. and the market during this low speculative period has been playing along with it.

now today is the final day of difficulty 'play' before the final difficulty change of 2018. and next week next gen asics get delivered to people. so expect hashrates to rise.

2019 will not only see a rise of hashrates. but begin a new financial year for many investors in certain off shore area's
2019 will also be where the first ETF will be granted (now that institutions have cleared off their 2018 tax deductibles)
2019 will also be where multiple ETF's get launched using the first mover success as a template model.

so prepare wisely. its all about to happen

merry christmas

for me, yep

i done calculations on mining costs. as people will always be trying to find the cheapest way to get bitcoin. so there is always a dynamic at play between mining and buying.. or flip side profiting/selling

from my opinion of my maths i use a constant which is 104 multiple of mining exahash rate to get mining cost of majority
right now seems good, as there is slim speculative low froth(lowbubble) above the dynamic waterline.

hint:
next gen asics are in delivery and people will be getting them online around christmas/new year. so expect hashrate rises and the market/mining of which is cheapest way to get bitcoin play out (buying it will be = price rise when hashrate rises)


what people need to think more about is not to mortgage the house and buy in for just a one time hit, hoping for a one time double up within a short period.
but to instead take any disposable income. EG money they would waste on fast food, or a item of gucci shoes they wear once. or a lambo they dont mind crashing into a tree (depending on wealth level) and just use that to buy in regularly when there is low speculation/low value.
that way its not missed and not really life changing

EG if you buy bitcoin with funds that would have just bought yo fast food each week. then just buying fast food is literally flushing money down the toilet the next day. so buying bitcoin is a smart decision

FTFY: a commodity is a raw material used to create products.. bitcoin is a asset currency.

what i view as occuring was 2009-2013 bitcoin was a open free choice asset currency to be the opposite of what fiat is.
what i view as occuring of 2013-2018 bitcoin is closing off as a free choice asset currency to become just another "new state" fiat.