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1521  Economy / Economics / Re: Are electric cars bad for the oil industry? on: January 10, 2018, 11:19:33 PM
Title.

So. Electric cars are gaining in popularity, therefore the popularity of gasoline will be going down. Won't the price go down, leaving the oil industry in trouble?

Maybe but the things is that it would not be around only until it is gone. Petroleum had been held by capitalists or entrepreneurs and is a good source of income for a country. Despite its effects on global warming petroleum could not be put to stop. Besides some of the powersupplies use petroleum as fuel before it could generate electricity. There had been inventions of using water as gasoline and it is more abundant maybe you can just urinate and separate hydrogen then you have the fuel. But i wonder where are these inventions? Are they banned? I was told that these inventions did not became popular because of the reason stated above. The Capitalists Control the economy. So approval to this invention is a big question.

It takes energy to separate hydrogen from water molecules, so it's not like you can just dump a bunch of water into a car and have it run on only the hydrogen. Also, a car that runs on hydrogen still burns the hydrogen to produce the power necessary to power the car, and water does not burn. Cars that run on "water" do not exist, it's science fiction. Cars that run on hydrogen require (that may have been stripped out of water molecules, which is not the same as running on water) must have the hydrogen isolated into fuel cells (most likely), which can then be utilized as a power source.
1522  Economy / Economics / Re: Why you should worry this is a bubble on: January 10, 2018, 11:11:29 PM
Let's get something straight here: Even if Bitcoin is in a bubble, it doesn't mean the altcoins are. And if BTC is in a bubble, it's its own fault for not being usable currently. There are plenty of great coins that have better and cheaper transfer speeds than BTC which could easily replace it and reach a higher market cap. This is the fault of BTC and not a bubble per se in my opinion. New people are coming into crypto every day.

It wouldn't be Bitcoin's fault for being a bubble, it would be all the people mindlessly buying it without respect for usability. The fact that it's a bubble isn't Bitcoin's fault, the fact that it has no utility is. It is essentially a bubble because it has low utility. Also, there's a pretty good indication that if Bitcoin is a bubble, all crypto assets are also in a bubble state. Perhaps not as big as Bitcoin, but nonetheless. Bitcoin is still the big one that tends to raise or lower other coins like the tide raising or lowering all boats.
1523  Economy / Economics / Re: When will more retailers accept Bitcoin on: January 09, 2018, 09:59:27 PM
Just like Japan of all other countries  start to legitimize crypto currencies then we can see more merchants accepting bitcoin as a payment method. Also the the confirmation times and transaction fee should come down,for bitcoin to become more popular with retailers

Don't expect either confirmation times or transaction fees to fall without significant changes to the Bitcoin ecosystem (either block size increases, reduction in the block times, or some alternative to on-chain transactions, like the Lightning Network). The confirmation time and transaction fees are related, and they're both currently prohibitive and there's no shortage of viable crypto alternatives. Without changes, people will eventually tire of the poor usability of the Bitcoin network and select cheaper and more nimble competitors.
1524  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin price fluctuation on: January 09, 2018, 09:55:52 PM
I am very sure, someday bitcoin will have a price that does not fluctuate (the stability in the price). I'm sure it will happen in the near future.

Hopefully.But for me,i'm afraid if it will get stable in a lower price,the essence of volatility will be lost.It might be the reason that some of the investors on bitcoin have to shift to some other progressive coins like for example into some good altcoins.I think the reason why investors have bitcoin as their first choice its because bitcoin have its volatile aspect.It's the only thing that gives thrill to the investors and traders especially when it pumps into the moon.So i chose to stick with its fluctuations therefore.

Volatility makes it useless as a currency or store of value though, so if you want Bitcoin to actually have utility and widespread acceptance, the loss of volatility will be the best possible thing for Bitcoin. If you're looking for a gambling instrument to risk those high returns that are possible with extremely volatile assets, then Bitcoin is currently the right vehicle. Just be advised that when the attention and mania dies down and the volatility dries up, you might be stuck with a depreciating asset with no buyers willing to gamble any longer at these crazy prices.
1525  Economy / Economics / Re: If USD falls on: January 08, 2018, 04:18:54 AM
As the saying goes, don't throw out the baby with the bathwater

But in this case this saying sort of works in reverse, i.e. instead of separating the baby from the water, you pour even more water unto it. Basically, you are equaling the world economic meltdown with the crash of the US dollar. While these two events are certainly intertwined (to a degree), I still wouldn't equal them. In other words, if the dollar slowly loses its grip on the world finances (just as it rose to prominence in the first place), it can ultimately disappear from the world economic arena altogether, and that would pass almost unnoticed. Obviously, no bitcoin will get hurt in the process

That's a fair distinction. If the dollar loses prominence over an extended period of time, it can disappear without much consequence at the end of the downward spiral. However, this would be a trend that plays out over decades. Any sudden fall would be too disruptive for bitcoin to survive. There has to be ample time for orderly transition in order for it not to be chaotic and disrupt the status quo.

Any sudden fall would be disruptive for the whole world

If we are to remain realists, there are not a lot of reasons why the dollar would crash all of a sudden, and most of these cases mean the meltdown of the American economy in the first place and the dollar going belly up due to that. Obviously, the collapse of the US economy will affect many countries, particularly those highly integrated with the US economy such as China and Japan. In short, Bitcoin's fate will be of no special interest to anyone if things start to develop this way

Well that's been my whole point the whole time. And there's no one reason why the dollar would crash suddenly, but there are a lot of reasons why it could given the right circumstances, which are always unexpected, otherwise they could be planned for. There are plenty of powerful nations that have failed unexpectedly throughout history, that despite their enormous wealth and power, couldn't foresee or avoid their own decline. I don't see why America would be any different. The debt is a known issue, and it appears for now the most likely failure point. Default on the debt would tank the dollar, and despite this, nothing is done to address it

And how do you imagine that?

How can the American government default on a debt which is denominated in the currency it happens to print? There is only one possible way, namely, via a deliberate act of sabotage. If we discard for a moment Bitcoin's internal issues that it currently faces and assume that it is pretty stable and consistent, then, as to me, in this very case specifically (i.e. intentional default) Bitcoin is set to rise monumentally against the dollar since people will massively dump the latter in favor of anything even remotely valuable (Bitcoin included)

I'd start by correcting the misconception that the American government prints the dollar. It doesn't. The Federal Reserve prints the dollar, and it's a quasi-governmental entity, yet outside of the control of the government for good reason. The Fed's mandate is stability, and necessarily attempts to remain apolitical. The government only has the revenue from taxes and debt auctions by the Treasury, it doesn't print dollars to pay old debts. It rolls over old debts constantly, literally on a weekly basis, if not a daily basis. Old debt expires continually and the Treasury holds new auctions to issue new debt instruments to fund the government. The value of the dollar comes from the (illogical) assumption that the US government cannot default on its debt. That's why US Treasury bills are (again illogically) considered "zero risk" investments. To this end, the government depends on buyers of the debt to function. The Fed acted as a buyer of last resort during the financial crisis, but if that action would have shot confidence in the value of the dollar, it may not have been a technical default but the outcome would have been the same.
1526  Economy / Economics / Re: Is Bitcoin the next big thing? on: January 08, 2018, 03:47:24 AM
Once the hard cap has already reached, the price will become stable. Volatility will never be an issue since the supply has been distributed. Its price is not a big deal since people do not support Bitcoin just because it increases in value. Bitcoin has supported by many because of its features that could really help our world to become free and better.

I don't see a reason volatility will decrease when all the coins are mined. It's not the change in supply that's driving the volatility, it's speculation by buyers, and there's no reason to expect speculation to abate once all the coins are mined. The speculation is a type of mania, and the more volatile it is, the more volatile it is likely to become. It's a feedback loop. Have a stable supply and that doesn't do anything to the mania necessarily.
1527  Economy / Economics / Re: When will more retailers accept Bitcoin on: January 08, 2018, 03:39:37 AM
I think more retailers will accept bitcoin if its value will be more stabilized. Especially now that the value is deflating every day. So maybe more retailers are still waiting on what will happen after the hard fork. Retailers are businessmen who are not ready to risk when it comes to transacting with bitcoins. They will need more time to be convinced to accept btc. It's good to invest in bitcoin if you are investing for long term but retailers need cash to run their business.
Hmm. I think this is of normal occurence. Even paper fiat becomes volatile when it comes to price. It has undergone series of inflation and dlation as time passes by. For bitcoin to be accepted in the retail world, the retailers themselves must be open for it. They must experience how bitcoin works and earns so that they will not be hesitant to use bitcoin as medium for trading.

Not so much. Fiat is remarkably stable as a general rule compared to crypto. The value changes over very long periods of time and generally goes in one direction, that is it's generally inflationary, not deflationary. Crypto goes in both directions, by many orders of magnitudes more than fiat. The volatility makes it useless as a medium of exchange or store of value. It is correct that for Bitcoin to be more useful, it must be accepted by retailers. But in order to be accepted by retailers, it needs to be more stable.
1528  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin price fluctuation on: January 08, 2018, 03:31:13 AM
I think this fluctuation will never stop, even the mining finishes. Because the investors always changing. People who gets a little profit, only thinking to sell their coins. So it will never end.
I think the fluctuation might reduce when all Bitcoins have been mined, but for now, it will be too much… when it rises, it goes way too high, and when it’s time to fall, it takes a heavy fall. We just have to learn to deal with it, cause it’s normal, the only thing is that Bitcoin’s too much.

I don't see a reason volatility will decrease when all the coins are mined. It's not the change in supply that's driving the volatility, it's speculation by buyers, and there's no reason to expect speculation to abate once all the coins are mined. Mania over trying to profit off the price rise is what amplifies the speculation, so in a sense the volatility drives the volatility. Have a stable supply and that doesn't do anything to the mania necessarily.
1529  Economy / Economics / Re: Largest bubble ever? Only the fourth so far! on: January 07, 2018, 09:25:42 PM
If it's a buble i just hope i can sold it in time to not lose money, but i think once we will need 1 currency for all world, so why not btc

The first part of your statement is classic bubble mentality. As for why not btc for 1 world currency, the simple answer is because bitcoin doesn't have the capacity to handle the very small fraction of transactions it currently has, let alone being scaled up to handle transactions on a worldwide level. Transaction fees make bitcoin a terrible way to transmit value, and the volatility makes it a terrible store of value. These two things make it essentially worthless, but speculation and irrationality explains the price we have. That's not something I would feel confident about investing in, let alone long term.
1530  Economy / Economics / Re: Is Bitcoin now the biggest bubble of all time? on: January 07, 2018, 09:22:18 PM
Bitcoin in my opinion is one of the greatest assets if it is for one's investment Because price movements often change so that it is possible to earn an income in a fairly fast time.To be able to meet all the economic needs at any time.

People confusing "income" with price appreciation are showing they don't really understand investing.  Bitcoin does not produce income, and it has no inherent value. Stocks that pay a dividend, by comparison, produce income and have an inherent value because stocks represent a legal ownership of the business that produces the income. Bitcoin doesn't produce income, it's merely an asset that has value because many people think it does. Going up in value does not mean producing income.
1531  Economy / Economics / Re: Are electric cars bad for the oil industry? on: January 07, 2018, 09:00:14 PM
I believe so, but the question is, is electricity cheaper than oil. Thank you

Absolutely it is. There are a lot of ways to answer this question, but in almost every case it would be yes. Oil is pretty expensive to produce and transport compared to electricity generation. It's almost expensive in the toll it takes on the environment to produce oil, and burning it creates undesirable effects on the atmosphere and environment. Electricity as a power source is superior in almost every way. The only oil might come out ahead is energy storage. Oil can be stored pretty effectively and used as needed, where electricity can be stored in batteries that degrade over time and become less efficient in power delivery and capacity.
1532  Economy / Economics / Re: Why you should worry this is a bubble on: January 07, 2018, 08:35:36 PM
I don't know why people think that bitcoin will go down, all I can see is more investors joining the community which makes cryptocurrency more solid.
I will only listen to people providing reosonable arguments and not to those spreading predictions.
The cryptocurrency market will remain for long time, and the wise thing is to profit from it not just wait for it to vanish.

More people are getting into crypto, but not necessarily Bitcoin. Bitcoin's percent dominance has been on a steady decline for some time now. That means more money is coming into crypto as a whole but going to other alts more than it is to Bitcoin. Bitcoin's network has become a joke. Transactions are slow and expensive. It is increasingly obvious that a flippening will happen. There are many alts that are better at being Bitcoin than Bitcoin is, so it really seems it's only a matter of time. ETH, XRP, BCH and LTC are the most likely alts to pass Bitcoin in market cap, and it may come as soon as 2018.

Bitcoin is the most popular among the cryptos and a lot of investors want to get involved even when they only have minimal knowledge on bitcoin or cryptos. A lot of altcoins have potential such as bitcoin does and investors should consider to expand their investments.

Even those who claim that bitcoin is a bubble don't even know or fully understand it, and just see it for it's increasing price. They compare it to the previous crashes and bubbles without even considering how bitcoin is different and has surpassed boundaries.

Then go ahead and explain how people buying Bitcoin as a speculative investment is any different from people who were buying houses in the early 2000s as a speculative investment, or .coms in the late 1990s as a speculative investment. In all cases, people who aren't sophisticated investors were rushing into markets they don't understand because they have the perception that everyone was making easy money with the speculative investments and the value could only go up. Naturally, you have to believe a crypto bubble is different than any other type of bubble, otherwise you're faced with the very uncomfortable reality that you're making a very foolish decision.
1533  Economy / Economics / Re: 18% of Investors Buy Bitcoin With Borrowed Money on: January 07, 2018, 04:26:19 PM
Quote
With cryptocurrencies trending in popularity, it seems that many investors are purchasing bitcoin on borrowed money — credit cards and loans that bear interest. The consumer group Lendedu released a report on bitcoin investors who use credit to purchase digital currencies

Which of the following best describes how you funded your account to purchase Bitcoin?




After purchasing Bitcoin on your credit card, have you paid off your credit card balance?




Are you comfortable paying interest on your credit card as a result of your Bitcoin purchase?




Are you planning to pay off your credit card balance, accumulated by purchasing Bitcoin, by using the proceeds from the sale of your Bitcoin investment?





Between people who used a credit card to fund and purchase (Question 1)  Do you plan on buying additional Bitcoin using your credit card?

a. 76.23% of Bitcoin investors answered "Yes."

b. 23.77% of Bitcoin investors answered "No."

Source 1
Source 2


People are so crazy, really...So, 18% used a credit card, 22% of them haven't pay off their credit card balance. 1/3 are worried about the interest expense.... and 23% will continue buying additional Bitcoin using your credit card?...
the average annual percentage rate (APR) on a credit card is 15.07 percent



This is terrifying. People are so desperate with their FOMO that they're taking on high interest rate loans to buy a highly speculative and inherently worthless asset. Taking on a high degree of risk to roll it into an even higher degree of risk is just the epitome of stupidity. Risk doesn't just add in this case, it compounds. I don't wish ill on these people, but I will not feel bad if their risky behavior burns them exceptionally hard. This is a potential problem that is entirely avoidable and foreseeable. First rule of investing is not to risk anything you can't afford to lose. If you're taking out high risk loans to invest, you've completely lost focus of what you're doing, or you never understood it in the first place. People resorting to credit card loans obviously shouldn't be investing in the first place, because there are more suitable ways to get an investment loan, so it seems to indicate these people don't have access to those channels because they're not well off enough or sophisticated enough as investors.
1534  Economy / Economics / Re: How to Earn Interest on Bitcoin with Low Risk – Trusted Service since 2013! on: January 07, 2018, 04:16:44 PM
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I like freebitco.in, the owner of the site has always been a standup guy. The only thing I don't understand, and the thing that makes me cautious about anyone offering to pay "interest" on btc holdings, is that in order to pay interest on btc holdings, the payer of the interest has to be making more than the interest he is paying with your btc holdings. Otherwise, paying someone interest costs that person money. Four percent is a pretty generous rate on a USD basis for interest, so that leads to the question: What is Wetsuit doing with the bitcoin holdings that is generating income that allows him to pay 4% interest to the website users. I don't know the answer to this, and that along keeps me from putting any outside funds on his site. I'm fine keeping whatever I had generated there on the site, it's not a significant amount and it was "free money" anyway.

But as a starting point with investing, always understand how the investment generates value, otherwise it's not safe for you to put money into it.
1535  Economy / Economics / Re: What if hard limit on bitcoin had been 21 Billion instead of 21 Million? on: January 07, 2018, 04:11:16 PM
Hello Peeps,

Here is a game theory question to question the rush and rash in bitcoin world.

The number of bitcoins is limited to 21 millions with 8 zeros in fractions. What if the fractional places would have been 5 instead of 8 and total coins in circulation would have been 21 billion coins with same generation span, do you believe that price would be same as now? By same generation span, I mean that generation per block would be 1000 times more than the actual so that the world get 21 billion bitcoins in same span as actual.

What if the fractional places would be still 8 with 21 billion coins in circulation in same generation span? Would the price be still the same as now?

Is number a problem?
Hypothetically, To correct the market behavior of mad rush towards sustainability, shall we create a new taxonomy say "TheCoin" which is 1000th of Bitcoin and convert  all exchanges and conversations in new taxonomy?

I think number is a problem.

What do you think?





---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Disclaimer: I hold bitcoins. And working on new coins. I hate ICOs. I think privacy is overrated. I believe privacy is necessary but not always.

Affecting the decimal place shouldn't have an impact on the price. It limits the extent that a bitcoin can be divided into smaller pieces, but it doesn't change the supply. A 1000x increase in the number of coins should theoretically see a 1000x decrease in the price, but since people speculating don't take into consideration any mathematical or financial valuation when making purchase and share of BTC, I actually don't expect that it would logically follow. When Doge abandoned it's hard cap, the price went up over time, which doesn't make economic sense since the value of each coin is inflated away with the production of every new coin.
1536  Economy / Economics / Re: How would Bitcoin react to a global financial crisis? on: January 07, 2018, 04:06:14 PM
It has been 10 years since the 2008 financial crisis and there are a number of financial experts out there predicting doom and gloom to hit the financial world this year. To be fair, every new year brings new crazy predictions, so, although I am not reading too much into it, It did get me thinking - how would bitcoin hold up during a financial crisis.

We know gold is able to withstand a crisis, but with the price of gold very much being controlled nowadays, it might not be a good idea to use them as a comparison.

Interested to know peoples thoughts on the matter, what do you think would happen to bitcoin during a financial crisis?


First, those prognosticators making those statements do so every year, and the more outlandish the claim of catastrophe, the more eyeballs and clicks they get because fear sells attention, and attention generates revenue. So doom and gloom should be taken with a grain of salt. It's much more noteworthy when economists issue warnings because it's supported by research and not designed to sell attention or generate revenue, but to inspire policy.

Second, Bitcoin has very little utility, so it's value comes from speculation, or the mass perception that someone in the future will value the coins more than you did when you purchased them and you will therefore be able to sell them at a profit. Because the value is made up primarily of speculators, the wealth poured into sustaining the price comes from people who feel financially secure and able to risk losing the investment. Essentially, the confidence created by the current robust economy creates the confidence for people to speculate. In an economic downturn, confidence will disappear and people will not tolerate such risky asset holdings any longer, so all assets supported by speculators and risk-takers will suffer greatly. The riskier the asset, the more it will decline in price. As the king of speculative assets, I expect in an economic downturn that crypto will suffer outsized losses to things with inherent value, like stock equities and assets that generate income like real estate or REITs.

In short, everything will go down in value, but crypto will fall harder.

1537  Economy / Economics / Re: Can we totally eliminate all the banks in this world? on: January 07, 2018, 03:59:03 PM
This is an illusion! we cannot absolutely eradicate banks in the world, even if bitcoin's price reaches $100,000 this will never be enough to gold deposit of our planet which means if bitcoin's price increases and so the gold too! the fiat money will also increase and the need for that is much important than cryptocurrency. Banks are centralized system with the control of government and big named personalities, like Rothschild.

Money is just a representation of all the value that is created in the world. When you create a good or perform a service, that has a value to someone who will consume it. Money is a medium of exchange to allow people to trade whatever it is they produce that creates value for the goods or services created by other people. The value that is created in the world is how much wealth there is, and money is just a representation of that, an easy way to quantify it. Because value comes from goods/services (not money), the amount of value divided by the amount of money in existence determines how much money is worth. When goods/services expand faster than the money supply, money is worth more. This is not typical though, generally the money supply grows faster than the value of goods/services created in an economy, which is called inflation and the reason money loses value over time.
1538  Economy / Economics / Re: Is Bitcoin Volatility A Bad Thing? on: January 07, 2018, 03:50:37 PM
Steam dropped bitcoin support citing "high volatility" as a motive.

When amazon stock jumped from $18 to $1,200 over a period of years, was this high volatility a bad thing?

If bitcoin's value increases from $6,000 to $16,000 over a period of months, and HODL'ers benefit, this high volatility is bad?

Where does the idea of high volatility being an unnecessary evil come from?

Are there good arguments or evidence which support the concept of high volatility being a negative circumstance?

In a sense, volatility simply means the price of something moves a lot, its not that bad if the vast majority of motion is in an upward direction?

 Huh Huh Huh

Amazon's stock is not a medium of exchange, so it being volatile doesn't affect the company's business operations. When Bitcoin is volatile as a medium of exchange, it makes it impossible to conduct business in that medium because profitability it volatile. No business can survive the inability to predict what its assets are worth. If you transact at a bunch of business with 5% margins but the currency you just accepted could be up or down 20% in the next few days, you could be conducting your business at huge losses. Businesses can't function reliably in this environment. The most important aspect of a currency is stability, because the other important attributes (medium of exchange, store of value) arise from the stability. That's where the idea of volatility making Bitcoin an unsuitable currency comes from.
1539  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin price fluctuation on: December 31, 2017, 08:00:40 PM
Okay again with this bubble.

Let's assume that bubble has already burst,people that are thinking that it isn't popping yet. Do you realize that bitcoin has fell down at $19,000 - $12,000.



That's not a bubble bursting, that's just a correction of an overvalued asset. I'm not aware of a technical definition of a burst bubble, but I would argue that anything that hasn't lost at least 75% of its value in a short period of time is not a burst bubble. I would say that the bubble on Bitcoin hasn't burst until it's below $5,000, and it might even have to be lower than that considering it it started the 2017 year far lower than that (about $1000). So a "burst" of the bubble down to $5000 would still be a 5x increase on the price in the past year.
1540  Economy / Economics / Re: 26,000 blockchain projects launched in 2016, 92 percent are now dead on: December 31, 2017, 07:56:47 PM
Hmm...
Sorry to shatter your dreams and all but... No that's not true ^^
92% failure rate is pretty normal rate for anything not just for crypto.
Most companies and projects fail in the first two years. That's not specific to crypto. In fact I'm pretty amazed by the success rate! 8% of the projects succeed? That's awesome! It means we got 2000 more crypto projects than 2 years ago Cheesy
Still 92% a little steep, think of all the funds which were wasted on dead projects

That's just how capital markets work. There's a high failure rate because ideas are rather cheap and easy and anyone can come up with one, but ideas the market values are another thing entirely. Once you have an idea the market values, you can still go bust because you as an operator are not efficient or particularly good at operating. The few percent of ideas that make it to market successfully are ideas that the market values and can operate efficiently. This is also where wealth concentration comes from, as it is only the few people who can clear these hurdles that become rich of their efforts.
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