My female friend (also a mother of a 4 yo girl) acted as a medium aswell , the deal was ~5 grams of weed, and she served 2 god damn years in jail. The girl lost her job, and probably any chance for a good future just because she was a medium for a 5 gram weed deal. I know the law is different per country, but just try to compare this case with Ross Ulbricht; they're gonna skin him alive, trust me This is just insane. Entire life destroyed for possessing just 5 grams of cannabis? Was she involved in selling weed for a profit? At least be happy that this incident didn't happened in Indonesia, Singapore or Saudi Arabia. Had this occurred in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, then the following would have been the end result.  USA is not too far away from the countries you named in terms of punishment. |
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I have read it and my opinion is clear, even without that cryptographic proof. OKCoin is acting just like a company that 1. has a fully incompetent management and 2. has liquidity problems due to 1.
I don't think you'll get your money, Roger.
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That's a very interesting read. I'm not even sure how they can justify arresting someone for merely being a moderator of a message board, especially one that was as far as I'm aware separate from the actual site. He didn't commit any crimes or was involved in the drug dealing aspect of it. What was he actually arrested for? The article doesn't seem to say. Yeah, I find it bizarre in general, how some computer related crimes are treated by the US judiciary system. DDos attack=10 years??? |
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That's pretty ironic you would make that comparison. As far as I'm aware Manson didn't kill anyone either, just allegedly ordered or influenced others to do so, much like what allegedly Ross did.
Only that 6 people were really dead after beeing killed. There are no dead people in Ross' case. That's besides the point. He still arranged the hits so his intent was clear even if it was a sting operation. As long as it wasn't entrapment then he's essentially attempted to have someone murdered of his own volition (though even if it was entrapment he still should have known better and was still willing to have someone killed to protect his interests). Problem is: When you take LE out of the game, there would be no murder story. Even this murder wasn't intended by Ross at the start. It was his mentor Variety Jones ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=935434.0 ) , who convinced him to order the hit, after Ross wanted only his money back. I agree with you in the point of his intentions at the time of his decision to actually "kill" people (if it was really proven it was him ---> Maryland indictment still to come ). He should get a bonus round for that one, like 5 extra years on top of 5 ys for the drug dealing. 10 years is a very long time in prison If you have 6 people dead and someone is responsible: life (or even death sentence). If noone is killed: Give him a few years in a cell together with some tough guys and he will learn some important things about life in general, hrhrhr. |
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I think the thing isn't so simple. There's no way OKcoin will act the way they are if they thought they were 100% wrong, and there's no way roger ver would act this way if he thought he was wrong. There could be some sort of a misunderstanding or something deeper behind all this. In all likelihood, it's probably a 50/50, some right and some wrong on both sides.
As they say, any publicity is good publicity. But maybe bitcoin already has enough bad publicity. Maybe some people will claim that roger ver "owns" bitcoin now, since he has the domain.
When one side fakes a contract and the other site has a 100% mathematical proof, that it was indeed manipulated it is not 50/50, but 0/100. Avoiding to give lawyer details is just another thing thats making them even more shady. I would avoid them in a wide circle. I think the thing isn't so simple. There's no way OKcoin will act the way they are if they thought they were 100% wrong
It's called scare tactics; you try to intimidate the opposing side by bluffing, which in this case failed miserably. There was no honesty in OKcoin from their start, even the market volume was/is faked cheers +1 Roger simply went all in and is letting OKCoin to decide whether to call or fold. Honestly: they should fold. |
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He did nothing wrong, he never handled drugs directly, he just acted as a medium for the crime to happen, the US government allows for hundreds of people to die each year, do we see Obama being thrown into jail?
but honestly, he is probably gonna get life in prison
Not entirely true. In fact, Ross was actually the first drug seller on there. He grew some Magic Mushrooms and used them to get the Silk Road going as detailed in his writings found on his computer. But they need proof, not only some letters in his computer.. How much proof do you want? (not to mention him admitting it) There is mountains of evidence against him. Even the LE said the evidence they had and then found on his computer was as good as they ever could get. Open and shut case. Still he didn't hurt anyone and shouldn't get a life sentence just because he sold drugs. The guy on my avatar surely is a candidate for a life sentence, but a guy like Ross? Cmon... That's pretty ironic you would make that comparison. As far as I'm aware Manson didn't kill anyone either, just allegedly ordered or influenced others to do so, much like what allegedly Ross did. Only that 6 people were really dead after beeing killed. There are no dead people in Ross' case. |
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He did nothing wrong, he never handled drugs directly, he just acted as a medium for the crime to happen, the US government allows for hundreds of people to die each year, do we see Obama being thrown into jail?
but honestly, he is probably gonna get life in prison
Not entirely true. In fact, Ross was actually the first drug seller on there. He grew some Magic Mushrooms and used them to get the Silk Road going as detailed in his writings found on his computer. But they need proof, not only some letters in his computer.. How much proof do you want? (not to mention him admitting it) There is mountains of evidence against him. Even the LE said the evidence they had and then found on his computer was as good as they ever could get. Open and shut case. Still he didn't hurt anyone and shouldn't get a life sentence just because he sold drugs. The guy on my avatar surely is a candidate for a life sentence, but a guy like Ross? Cmon... |
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In my moral understanding it is wrong to fake a contract.
Roger is not adressing the 1 Mio. to the people that doesn't understand about digital signatures. If there would be anyone able to catch the price, he would've done it already. There are a lot of experts out there.
It is simple as that: The OKCoin guys thought, they would make millions with bitcoin.com in short term, but they had no concept and no experts to work on this. When they realized, that they were wrong, they quit paying. Obv. (not proven) because they are insolvent or they are short before an insolvency due to mismanagement.
If okcoin did indeed forge the contract, then yes, that action is wrong. That does not equate to Roger Ver being on the righteous side of things, and being "right". There may have been many other events prior and after where Roger Ver was completely in the wrong. We simply have no idea what went on, and to say OKcoin was wrong, Roger Ver is right is too early, and not something we can make a judgement on, IMO. True, but we can have an opinion and we can talk about it. Thats is what forums are made for. It might help one to develop an opinion or help others to strengthen or even change theirs. You don't have necessarily have to be involved personally with a topic to simply state your opinion about it. |
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Now lets VJ talk for himself: http://ia801506.us.archive.org/27/items/gov.uscourts.nysd.422824/gov.uscourts.nysd.422824.256.0.pdfUlbricht was aware of this practice, as reflected in Exhibit F, which is an excerpt of a chat with a co-conspirator found on Ulbricht’s computer: (2011-12-19 17:12) vj: so vendors that mention a buyer’s handle to bitch about fucking feedback should be fed to the sharks (2011-12-19 17:13) vj: ones that do that AND keep records of the addresses should be fed to ants, and then to sharks (2011-12-19 17:13) vj: lttm keeps addressess (2011-12-19 17:13) vj: Paperchasing keeps addressses and threatens to spread names of anyone who dares give him a 4/5 (2011-12-19 17:13) myself: how do you know all of this? (2011-12-19 17:14) vj: I read the forums (2011-12-19 17:14) myself: I should probably do that  |
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In this case his lawer was no help at all.
He's a lawyer not a miracle worker or magician. No lawyer would have been able to get Ross off his charges. He was caught red handed at his computer with a diary journal on how he created Silk Road. Gut was foolish. Had he not got caught red handed and managed to encrypt or destroy his laptop successfully he might have had a leg to stand on but he shouldn't have been operating it from the United States as well. He should have used his bitcoins and gone live in some exotic country that the US can't touch so even if it all went tits up he'd be safe or much more so than he was. I agree about the dumb idea to safe all files and logs. Without these, there would be no case. Like I already said: In Germany he would have got 5-7 years with these proven counts. With good behaviour he would have been out in 2/3 of the time. There is something really wrong with the current US judiciary, if a man is punished with a life sentence, when the only wrongdoings were to gain a commission in a (at that time not even considered "money") digital currency for providing a web service where people can sell and buy anything. He didn't sell or touch any of the drugs and buyer like seller were responsable of their use of the service. Now if I find an entry of a child porn site at Google, is the CEO of Google responsible and can be accused for distributing CP? Why should Ross be sentenced just like a mass murderer who was lucky to live in the right state? |
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In this case his lawer was no help at all.
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I think the thing isn't so simple. There's no way OKcoin will act the way they are if they thought they were 100% wrong, and there's no way roger ver would act this way if he thought he was wrong. There could be some sort of a misunderstanding or something deeper behind all this. In all likelihood, it's probably a 50/50, some right and some wrong on both sides.
As they say, any publicity is good publicity. But maybe bitcoin already has enough bad publicity. Maybe some people will claim that roger ver "owns" bitcoin now, since he has the domain.
When one side fakes a contract and the other site has a 100% mathematical proof, that it was indeed manipulated it is not 50/50, but 0/100. I don't understand the encryption behind it, I can't tell how real that 100% proof is. Maybe you can. Either way, just because one party faked a contract, assuming they did, does not mean they are 100% in the wrong. You don't know anything else that went on before this. In my moral understanding it is wrong to fake a contract .Roger is not adressing the 1 Mio. to the people that doesn't understand about digital signatures. If there would be anyone able to catch the price, he would've done it already. There are a lot of experts out there. It is simple as that: The OKCoin guys thought, they would make millions with bitcoin.com in short term, but they had no concept and no experts to work on this. When they realized, that they were wrong, they quit paying. Obv. (not proven) because they are insolvent or they are short before an insolvency due to mismanagement. |
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Just want to thank everyone in this thread for being so diligent about finding info. As someone who finds every little twist and turn in the Silk Road Saga interesting, there's nothing better than the work that lamoustache/gwern/AGD/etc do. Seriously, bravo.
You are welcome to post additional info, which I guess you have, based on the date of your last posting before this one. |
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Is it just a coincidence, that one random dude (OP) asks about bitcoin.com and at about the same time there starts a fight Roger Ver vs. OKCoin for this domain?
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I think the thing isn't so simple. There's no way OKcoin will act the way they are if they thought they were 100% wrong, and there's no way roger ver would act this way if he thought he was wrong. There could be some sort of a misunderstanding or something deeper behind all this. In all likelihood, it's probably a 50/50, some right and some wrong on both sides.
As they say, any publicity is good publicity. But maybe bitcoin already has enough bad publicity. Maybe some people will claim that roger ver "owns" bitcoin now, since he has the domain.
When one side fakes a contract and the other site has a 100% mathematical proof, that it was indeed manipulated it is not 50/50, but 0/100. |
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It wasn't the forum's fault but the hosting. Theymos claims it was the hosting. That's what you meant to say. He openly states, in this very thread, that before any of the alleged social engineering took place, "... The attacker was able to acquire KVM access credentials for the server. The investigation into how this was possible is still ongoing, so I don't know everything ..." Not sure why everyone is acting like lax DC security is the issue, It is still not clear how attacker gained access and why. Where did you see this? People here are still under the impression it was Social Engineering.... I don't remember where it was. It was one of the crypto news sites. They wrote, they have called NFOrce about the incident and they denied beeing attacked with SE. |
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Life in prison
That's what he deserves.
Who was harmed that much, that he deserves a life sentence? |
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just look at my handle... i think strongly that pom is vj  maybe it's just hope lol It's practically proven, that POM is VJ is Thomas Clark. It's still unknown if he was a mole at OG/SR/SR2 or not. I am already pretty much convinced, that he was at least at SR. What was your handle at OG btw? edit: grammar |
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I didn't vote. Even if all the counts were proven, he doesn't deserve more than 5 years in Jail. I mean, what will you give for murder, when a guy gets life for a non violent crime. This is completely ridicolous! What makes his crime so awful, that he deserves a life sentence? He didn't kill someone! Heck, he didn't even beat someone! All the "murder charges" were not part of the sentence, so what has he done to deserve a life in jail?
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