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17861  Economy / Securities / THE TROLL THREAD on: September 30, 2012, 07:17:53 PM
I am confused about what one share represents, the Contract say that one share is a 20Mh/s?  Is that still the case or will one share be more?  The OP says 469GH and 6985 shares?  

So does this pay 469GH/6985 shares= 67 Mh/s  once the ASIC's arrive?

or does it pay 20 Mh/s?
The end goal is to provide or exceed 20MH/s per share.  It will require some management on my part to go from the current 1MH/s per share FPGA goal to the 20MH/s per share ASIC goal as we start massively increasing hashing power.  Investor demand will ultimately determine the rate at which the MH/s per share amount is adjusted.  There is no way to say exactly how many shares will be on the market when the ASICs arrive, but I will try to keep things orderly, and keep the share count down until the ASICs arrive.



So this is 20Mh/s per share, once ASIC's have arrived and 1 MH/s per share until then.
Those are the stated goals.  However, the MH/s per share could increase significantly while buyers are found for the additional shares hitting the market.  Dividends during this period should be extremely high due to being at the front of the line for ASIC miners, which should allow us to exploit a low difficulty, as well as a potentially higher MH/s per share while buyers are found.  That is the "intrinsic bet" MoinCoin mentioned.




So will you pay more then 20Mh/s per share?  or not?  
I will pay more than 20MH/s per share if we have more than 20MH/s per share operating.  I will not be dumping 18,000 shares on the market at once, so there will be a transitional period where it would be reasonable to assume that more than 20MH/s per share in dividends will be paid.  



How will you pay for electricity, if you pay 100% to the shareholders?
The quote below is from the thread FAQ.  Basically, the way I'm planning to implement it is like this...  Once we have our equipment in place and have exceeded the 20MH/s per share goal, shares still held by the company will begin being placed in a separate account, with dividends used to pay electricity costs and buy more shares on the open market.  This should allow NASTY to remain free of operator costs & electricity costs, while also providing an ongoing demand for shares and not dilluting the market.  

HOW CAN YOU PROVIDE FREE ELECTRICITY?
I intend to purchase more than 20MH/s in mining equipment for each share sold.  That surplus in power will provide an ongoing means to pay electricity costs for the operation.



So then the cap for dividend payments to shareholders is 20Mh/s per share.  The excess will be used for electricity and buybacks.
There is no "cap" and seeing as though there are only 25,000 shares and more than 500,000MH/s currently on order, without a motion passing with a 66% 'yes' shareholder vote to issue more shares, the MH/s per share is guaranteed to exceed 20MH/s.



I'm still completely confused as to how this works, could you please rewrite the OP to show how much you payout?  Do you payout 100% of your gear to 25,000 shares (with 18k of them held by the company)?  Do you payout 20Mh/s per share and keep the rest for electricity (as the OP states)?
You don't seem to understand how GLBSE works.  Dividends are paid out only to the Outstanding Shares (noted on the OP).  Currently there are "Shares Outstanding."  100% of the dividends generated by the "Currently Operating" equipment (also noted on the OP) is paid to the Outstanding Shares.



So when you get your ASIC's and its over 20Mh per share, you said that you would transfer shares to a private account until the payout was 20Mh per share and use the private account to pay for electricity and buybacks..  So the time it will be over 20Mh per share is very brief.  That seems to be in effect a 20Mh per share cap.  Until all of the gear is received and it will be slightly over 20Mh for the full 25,000 shares.
You are making assumptions about the rate at which shares would be transferred to a private account.  As the controller of the company, that makes me the single largest controller of NASTY shares at the present time.  That is a rather large incentive to keep dividends high, shareholders happy, and the share price elevated.  

Let me also repost this:
There is no "cap" and seeing as though there are only 25,000 shares and more than 500,000MH/s currently on order, without a motion passing with a 66% 'yes' shareholder vote to issue more shares, the MH/s per share is guaranteed to exceed 20MH/s.



So your saying you own all those unsold shares?  I thought the shareholders owned this company and the equipment?  Apparently they only own 7k and you own 18k?
As stated, I control them.  I do not own them.  Due to controlling them on behalf of the shareholder, I have an incentive to make sure they are valued highly and distributed in a way that maximizes shareholder value.  



why don't you change the OP to state that 100% of the hashing power of the gear will be returned to the shareholders with no 20Mh/s per share cap.
I have no plans to change the OP or contract at this time.  There is no cap.  

no such cap exists.
There is no "cap"



The OP clearly states 20Mh/s per share.  You won't change it.  That sure looks like a cap to me.
Then make your investment decisions based on your assumptions.  The imaginary cap has been addressed several times now and I don't think anyone appreciates your trolling using a sock puppet account.  As mentioned, with the current shares issued and the ordered equipment, it would be impossible not to exceed 20MH/s per share without either a shareholder motion to issue more shares, or the equipment providers falling short of their estimates.



Are you going to buy more equipment?  Or is the rest of the IPO pure profit for you?  
This was already answered.  Please re-read the FAQ section on how free electricity is provided and the above posts for clarification.
17862  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 30, 2012, 06:47:51 AM
I wish glbse let you reinvest automatically by letting you own portions of shares. Unless you get enough dividends to actually buy a new share each week you can be waiting  a long time to reinvest into the company.

Own more shares.  Cool  One of the biggest advantages of weekly dividend payouts is compounding your interest at a much faster rate than is available with typical investments.
17863  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 30, 2012, 06:19:00 AM
By growth fund I meant keeping  a portion of dividends to buy more equipment and growing the company. I didnt mean holding shares which is worse than just holding bitcoins. Besides, you would be better off buying back your own shares than investing in other companies.

I don't like the idea of keeping a portion of the dividends.  I would like to continue to pay out 100% of the coins mined by this operation to shareholders.  Each shareholder could choose to use their dividends to buy more shares on their own if they so please, thus putting this decision in their hands.
17864  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 30, 2012, 06:08:50 AM
Have you considered implementing a growth fund for new equipment purchases to offset rising difficulty and keep a stable dividend ?

I don't see why a portfolio held within the NASTY account couldn't be established if that is something shareholders would like to have.  That would put me in the position of a fund manager though, and would expose NASTY shareholders to other operations.  It would most definitely require a motion and further discussion.
17865  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 30, 2012, 05:18:46 AM
But did the new orders for the BASICs came out of your pocket and the company owes you?

The company doesn't owe me anything.  100% of all mining proceeds will continue being paid to shareholders.
17866  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 30, 2012, 05:00:03 AM
Agreed - OP needs an update on projected payouts (liabilities too?)

It is impossible to determine the projected payouts at this time.  Difficulty, outstanding share count, & hash rate are all going to change significantly in the coming months.  Trying to project exactly what our payouts will be is not something I want to speculate on.  Feel free to make your own assumptions.
17867  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] BLUECHIP Adds NASTY and Finalizes Rev. 2 of Contract on: September 29, 2012, 08:26:52 PM
I am proud to announce that we've added [GLBSE] NASTY to BLUECHIP at position 4 in the depth chart.

Thank you for adding NASTY to BLUECHIP.  Lots of great things on the way.
17868  Economy / Securities / Re: Gauging interest: PuppyBear bearish investment fund on: September 29, 2012, 06:56:47 PM
If OgNasty entered into either selling a short OR a PUT option then it would have no effect on number of outstanding shares.

Easiest way to think of it is that it's a bet (below is very simplified) -

OgNasty bets that NASTY shares hold their value, the other side bets that they lose value.
It's really nothing more than that.

This is a good explanation.  Me willing to sell PUT options is only a bet that the share price is currently undervalued, and it's a bet I would be making with my own funds.  The only effect it should have on shareholders, is to inspire confidence that I'm willing to bet the share price will go up.
17869  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: FPGAMINING scam ongoing on: September 29, 2012, 06:30:46 PM
There really should be some kind of bond that the issuer would lose in case they break their contract.

I've suggested this many times to Nefario.  It could be another level of verification (and the only one that would actually matter in my eyes).
"Bonded for X BTC against default" would go a long way in providing a bottom for shares and instilling confidence in GLBSE assets.
17870  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 29, 2012, 06:18:15 PM
A dividend of BTC14.16 has been paid.  


You might want to take a look at this  bASIC announcement. Sound like a good deal for expansion.
Thank you for bringing that to my attention.  I placed an order for 2x 54GH/s bASIC miners.  I also ordered another BitForce 'SC' 40GH/s miner and updated the "ordered" list on the OP.
17871  Economy / Securities / Re: Looking for holders willing to loan shares listed on GLBSE. on: September 29, 2012, 06:41:45 AM
I won't lend you anything, but I would be willing to sell you some put options on NASTY shares if you were interested in short exposure to my asset on GLBSE. 

Not really, but in any case it's meaningless to buy PUTs from the underlying issuer. If your asset goes bankrupt your PUTs pay how?

You'd be buying them from me, not the asset...  I would pay if the asset went bankrupt.  I understand your reasoning for trying to borrow shares, but if you want to put your money where your mouth is, I have a very established trading record and would be an honorable issuer of put options for NASTY. 

Sorry to burst your bubble, but as far as I can ascertain your very established track record is a 1 rating from Ignatius-otc. That's not much to go on.

Maybe your take on this entire thing is a little more emotional than financial.

Whatever excuse you need to use is fine.  Good luck getting people to loan you shares.

I'll just leave this here:

+1 to OgNasty, Excellent buyer, superb communication and sent payment right away! Will do business again!
OgNasty sold me a $100 Amazon Gift card. It worked perfectly!
+1 for OgNasty
+1 OgNasty - Sold $25 dollar ebay card
+1 to OgNasty he sold a $100 Amazon card for 8.5 BTC to me
Just did business with OgNasty and have received funds as promised. Nice!
+1 to OgNasty for a successful trade
+1 for OgNasty Sold me a 5970, easy to work with
+1 for OgNasty    sold him a gift card and he paid me after I sent him the card number and pin
Thanks for the orders and the reviews Maged and OgNasty!
+1 OgNasty, paid on receipt of items.
+1 OgNasty paid after I sent first Smiley
Received it, thanks! Great transaction with OgNasty Smiley
Thanks for a smooth process.
I wonder if he sleeps less than Pirate? Smiley
OgNasty was very helpful setting up my account, and he took care of me right away.  Thanks for the great service.
OgNasty has yet to fail in paying out consistently.
+1 OgNasty - Another honest bitcoiner!
17872  Economy / Securities / Re: Gauging interest: PuppyBear bearish investment fund on: September 29, 2012, 01:27:35 AM
I'd be willing to sell put options on NASTY shares at the IPO price if you were interested in taking a short position.
17873  Economy / Securities / Re: Looking for holders willing to loan shares listed on GLBSE. on: September 29, 2012, 12:57:54 AM
I won't lend you anything, but I would be willing to sell you some put options on NASTY shares if you were interested in short exposure to my asset on GLBSE. 

Not really, but in any case it's meaningless to buy PUTs from the underlying issuer. If your asset goes bankrupt your PUTs pay how?

You'd be buying them from me, not the asset...  I would pay if the asset went bankrupt.  I understand your reasoning for trying to borrow shares, but if you want to put your money where your mouth is, I have a very established trading record and would be an honorable issuer of put options for NASTY. 
17874  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: "Avalon" ASIC, announcement & pre-order. VERY important notice updated@9/24 on: September 29, 2012, 12:34:14 AM
So am I correct in seeing that preorders are suspended until the "next wave" of orders is ready?

Any idea when this will be?
17875  Economy / Securities / Re: Looking for holders willing to loan shares listed on GLBSE. on: September 28, 2012, 10:00:03 PM
I won't lend you anything, but I would be willing to sell you some put options on NASTY shares if you were interested in short exposure to my asset on GLBSE. 
17876  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 28, 2012, 04:49:47 PM
Nice - good news all around!   Just out of curiosity which non-BFL ASIC were you leaning toward?

I'm looking into preordering an Avalon, but it looks like it would need to be ordered next week to get the preorder pricing.  With our shares currently so heavily undervalued due to the BFL & Goat/Nefario situations, I cannot sell more at this time to raise funds for this purchase without harming current shareholder value.  For that reason, I may just use my own funds and plan to recoup my costs with future share sales at much higher than current prices.  I feel like that is the best option I have for balancing expansion and maintaining shareholder confidence.  I've also registered with #Bitcoin-OTC Web of Trust and added a link in my forum signature to my OTC ratings page, in an attempt to further elevate shareholder trust in my abilities and intentions as an asset issuer on GLBSE.
17877  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 28, 2012, 03:42:39 PM
Not sure if I'm missing something, but what's with the sudden drop in the share prices lately?  There really that much doubt in BFL delivering, or are shares being dumped for liquidity purposes?  I'm looking at it as a good opportunity to buy honestly, but maybe I'm missing something... Huh

The share price is definitely not reflecting a change in the company's fundamentals. Outstanding share count is down, looks like we're going to see another strong dividend this week, and I've ordered another 1.2GH/s in FPGAs that should arrive within a month. The weather is also cooling down, so I should be able to increase our bitstreams soon. All positive things. In addition, I'm looking at placing an order for a competitor's ASIC miner to diversify a bit from BFL.
17878  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 27, 2012, 09:54:55 PM
The Dividends Paid statistic is now automated.
Thank you for your effort - I simply love statistics Cheesy

You're welcome.  Thanks for pointing out the Outstanding Shares statistic is available in real time and not just through the dividend API from the previous week.  I'll have that updated soon.
17879  Economy / Securities / Re: [GLBSE] NASTY - No Operator Costs, Free Electricity, Free ASIC Upgrade! on: September 27, 2012, 09:43:13 PM
The Dividends Paid statistic is now automated.
17880  Economy / Computer hardware / Re: Selling Icarus on: September 27, 2012, 04:20:20 AM
Sold to me.   Grin
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