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No. He was talking about not having the option of trading BTC directly for TAO so that you could only trade it against USD or alts, which should have the effect of decoupling it from the BTC price. This has nothing to do with being able to deposit BTC or ETH to purchase ODB, which is what I was talking about above.
OK, so you're supposed to be able to trade BTC/alt and alt/TAO, but not BTC/TAO? How does that make sense? USD/TAO TAO/alts Makes sense to me. BTC being the base for trading pairs only makes sense because it's familiar, not because it's the only way to do things. He's already said that it's an experiment and he can always add a TAO/BTC pair later if he sees fit to. Just to clarify, also BTC/USD and BTC/alts? And ETH/USD and ETC/alts? Because that's how it's been now? Crowdsale of ODB for ETH/BTC, _not_ for TAO or fiat? Let me restate in full to clarify. Hopefully this will make sense to you. Currently ODBcoin can be purchased during the sale by anyone with an account on AltMarket. Deposits are currently limited to ETH, BTC, and USD, with TAO coming shortly. This is just for the purpose of purchasing ODBcoin for the duration of the sale which ends in February. I believe Tao gives you a 5% discount, the same as what you get if you signed up to the pre-sale notification email opt-in that was up on the site before Dec 1st when the sale began. After the sale is over, there will be the audit which will be concluded sometime between mid February and March 1st to my understanding. I'm not sure if trading will become available to the public before or after the end of the audit, but at the latest it sounds like it should be very soon after the end of the audit. Once full trading is open to everyone, Tao will be the base for trading pairs for either most or for all alts on the market, and definitely will be the exclusive base for ODBcoin and all future icon token trading pairs. I believe BTC will be a base for some alts, but it will not be for any of the icon tokens, and would also not be a base for Tao in the proposed scenario. I'm not sure if BTC would be traded with TAO as the base, but I'm assuming most likely not in this scenario. ETH will be the base for some alts but none of the icon tokens. I'm not sure if Bryce is considering decoupling from ETH, so possibly you might have it as the base for TAO. So if you want to buy Tao on the market once it's open you'll be able to hook up your bank account, deposit USD and buy Tao directly, or you'll be able to deposit BTC and trade to an alt and buy with the alt, possibly including ETH. If you want to buy ODBcoin you will have to buy Tao first, no other option once the sale ends. Same with future initial artist token offerings. Should be interesting to see it. In the mean time, I'm hearing electrum servers are up and running and one of the community members is working on an android wallet to be released soon. Uh huh. So you can't currently even use TAO for it's ostensible main purpose, is that right? But "in the future", altmarket won't be offering icon token sales with anything but TAO, but obviously there's no way to stop other platforms from doing so, or from OTC sales to happen? Or, if this isn't possible, what's the difference from said tokens just being stored in a centralised database at altmarket? Just the blockchain buzzword? It just seems weird to me that if the point of TAO is to be the single point of entry for icon tokens, that it, well, isn't. Instead TAO/OBD is, at launch, not even an option. It also seems weird to me how often and how many times the ostensible plan, deadlines, goals etc. have changed since the original launch of TAO. And I mean they haven't been small changes, but pretty radical differences. |
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No. He was talking about not having the option of trading BTC directly for TAO so that you could only trade it against USD or alts, which should have the effect of decoupling it from the BTC price. This has nothing to do with being able to deposit BTC or ETH to purchase ODB, which is what I was talking about above.
OK, so you're supposed to be able to trade BTC/alt and alt/TAO, but not BTC/TAO? How does that make sense? USD/TAO TAO/alts Makes sense to me. BTC being the base for trading pairs only makes sense because it's familiar, not because it's the only way to do things. He's already said that it's an experiment and he can always add a TAO/BTC pair later if he sees fit to. Just to clarify, also BTC/USD and BTC/alts? And ETH/USD and ETC/alts? Because that's how it's been now? Crowdsale of ODB for ETH/BTC, _not_ for TAO or fiat? |
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Just because you don't have access to trading on AltMarket doesn't mean it's not there. Just because you haven't created an account and used it to participate in the ongoing ODBcoin sale doesn't mean they don't have a product. You've been able to deposit BTC or ETH since the beginning of December to buy ODB, and you've been able to link your bank account to deposit USD for ODBcoin for at least a couple of weeks now too. So what are you even talking about?  Hang on, didn't Bryce disable all kinds of BTC/ETH trading on alt.market to make sure that TAO would be "decoupled" from the rest of crypto? No. He was talking about not having the option of trading BTC directly for TAO so that you could only trade it against USD or alts, which should have the effect of decoupling it from the BTC price. This has nothing to do with being able to deposit BTC or ETH to purchase ODB, which is what I was talking about above. OK, so you're supposed to be able to trade BTC/alt and alt/TAO, but not BTC/TAO? How does that make sense? |
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I think a lot of people miss the fact that Tao is a full blockchain with mature Bitcoin-derived technology, not just some ERC-20 token. Here's a handy reference guide to how the Tao features stack up compared to some of the most popular cryptos:  Wow! Those green dots must mean that Tao is truly the superior tech. Now if only I could buy it without using a discord moderator to be an escrow... now if only alt market launched an actual product. If only. If only Just because you don't have access to trading on AltMarket doesn't mean it's not there.  Just because you haven't created an account and used it to participate in the ongoing ODBcoin sale doesn't mean they don't have a product. You've been able to deposit BTC or ETH since the beginning of December to buy ODB, and you've been able to link your bank account to deposit USD for ODBcoin for at least a couple of weeks now too. So what are you even talking about? Hang on, didn't Bryce disable all kinds of BTC/ETH trading on alt.market to make sure that TAO would be "decoupled" from the rest of crypto? |
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Dick Wingate has posted this tweet confirming the announcement that he's joined the AltMarket board, as mentioned in my previous post quoted below  https://twitter.com/dwingate/status/1074417397216542722AltMarket Exchange Adds Three Music Industry Veterans To Its Board https://blocktribune.com/altmarket-exchange-adds-three-music-industry-veterans-to-its-board/https://icoholder.com/en/press-releases/altmarket-creator-of-the-odbcoin-announces-addition-of-music-industry-luminaries-to-its-boardDavid Lotwin and Dick Wingate are new additions to AltMarket’s board. Peter Rafelson, one of AltMarket’s co-founders, is also joining.
Lotwin is one of the founders of D&D Studios, a Bronx recording studio that initially focused on freestyle and dance music. A veritable who’s who of hip-hop royalty passed through Lotwin’s studio, from KRS-One to Nas and Jay-Z.
Wingate boasts over 40 years of experience in the music and interactive industries and is the principal of DEV Advisors, an entertainment consulting firm that provides expertise to service providers, app developers, content owners and investors.
Rafelson has written and produced songs for Madonna, Jackson Brown, Stevie Nicks, Elton John and Britney Spears. His work over the years helped sell over 300 million records worldwide. Rafelson also produces and consults for various technology and media entities with his company, Rafelson Media Company. He counts Microsoft, Apple, Toshiba and Compaq among his clients.Wiki entry on Lotwin's D&D Studios: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%26D_StudiosWiki on Wingate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_WingateWeren't both of those already on the old 'team' page something like half a year back at least? I know Lotwin was. Edit: Also, isn't "board" a distinctly different thing from "advisory board"? |
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OK, since you didn't answer my question to you that I asked right before the post you're replying to, I'll ask again, what premine? I'm going to assume you mean the money mined at the start that was publicly announced before hand and that was used for the crowd sale in 2016. Is that what you're referring to?
If that's what you mean, it does not violate securities laws.
There is an exemption for the Howey Test if you cap fundraising at $100,000. Bryce did exactly that. He's worked with regulators from the start. There's photographic evidence. There's evidence on the SEC website.
If you have access to some other information I'm not aware of, do tell.
The TAO Network has made 30 million TAO tokens available for the ongoing month-long crowdsale. Rest of the tokens are allocated for development, marketing and community building exercises. The platform has announced that the value a TAO token will not be more than $1.00 during the crowdsale. Participants in the crowdsale shall receive a 25% bonus on their deposit if the deposit is made prior to Friday, August 5th. You might want to re-read that a little more carefully. "Not be more than $1.00" isn't the same as setting it specifically to $1 the way you're representing it. The amount paid per Tao was proportional to the amount raised, and it ended up at approximately $0.003 per Tao, which is a long way from $1.00 Whether it was capped or only raised ~$100K is irrelevant to the question of whether it qualifies as a security. It does not. Am I understanding you correctly that it was dumb luck that made him not break the law, then? Or did he deliberately not market things as well as he could have? Based on comments he's made, yes actually I'm pretty sure he fudded himself on purpose to keep most of crypto at arms length and get people to ignore what he was doing. I think he also intentionally let it languish on small exchanges nobody uses for the same reason, and to keep the shady ICO money away from the network so it stayed clean. For what he has been doing it was much more important for him to appeal to the people in the music industry than to the crypto industry. And to people in the music industry, most of the rest of crypto looks like a huge scam. That seems deliberately misleading and hardly the conduct of an honest agent.
Which regulation are you referring to, by the way?
The discussion was whether the Tao ICO needed to be registered as a security and whether it was done legally. Only raising ~$100,000 puts it well under the minimum for it to be exempt. I believe this is covered by Reg D - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_D_(SEC)#Rule_504I don't see where it would apply, as the sale was for up to 30 million dollars, which puts it significantly over the limit. Moreover, the SEC filing was done much much later. |
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You never answered my question upthread: what specifically do you think is in violation of US securities law?
THE PREMINE?  LOL OK, since you didn't answer my question to you that I asked right before the post you're replying to, I'll ask again, what premine? I'm going to assume you mean the money mined at the start that was publicly announced before hand and that was used for the crowd sale in 2016. Is that what you're referring to? If that's what you mean, it does not violate securities laws. There is an exemption for the Howey Test if you cap fundraising at $100,000. Bryce did exactly that. He's worked with regulators from the start. There's photographic evidence. There's evidence on the SEC website. If you have access to some other information I'm not aware of, do tell. Making a throwaway to point out that this is, in fact, a lie. Bryce did put a cap on the fundraiser, but at 30 million (1USD = 1TAO), not $100 000. The latter is just what he managed to raise (in fact, he raised slightly more than that, according to contemporaneous PR material). See e.g. https://bitcoinprbuzz.com/tao-network-announces-the-crowdsale-of-its-cryptocurrency-and-the-tao-of-music-project/The TAO Network has made 30 million TAO tokens available for the ongoing month-long crowdsale. Rest of the tokens are allocated for development, marketing and community building exercises. The platform has announced that the value a TAO token will not be more than $1.00 during the crowdsale. Participants in the crowdsale shall receive a 25% bonus on their deposit if the deposit is made prior to Friday, August 5th. You might want to re-read that a little more carefully. "Not be more than $1.00" isn't the same as setting it specifically to $1 the way you're representing it. The amount paid per Tao was proportional to the amount raised, and it ended up at approximately $0.003 per Tao, which is a long way from $1.00 Whether it was capped or only raised ~$100K is irrelevant to the question of whether it qualifies as a security. It does not. Am I understanding you correctly that it was dumb luck that made him not break the law, then? Or did he deliberately not market things as well as he could have? Because the sale was capped at 30 million USD, not 100k USD, and ran for the full period. Which regulation are you referring to, by the way? |
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You never answered my question upthread: what specifically do you think is in violation of US securities law?
THE PREMINE? LOL OK, since you didn't answer my question to you that I asked right before the post you're replying to, I'll ask again, what premine? I'm going to assume you mean the money mined at the start that was publicly announced before hand and that was used for the crowd sale in 2016. Is that what you're referring to? If that's what you mean, it does not violate securities laws. There is an exemption for the Howey Test if you cap fundraising at $100,000. Bryce did exactly that. He's worked with regulators from the start. There's photographic evidence. There's evidence on the SEC website. If you have access to some other information I'm not aware of, do tell. Making a throwaway to point out that this is, in fact, a lie. Bryce did put a cap on the fundraiser, but at 30 million (1USD = 1TAO), not $100 000. The latter is just what he managed to raise (in fact, he raised slightly more than that, according to contemporaneous PR material). See e.g. https://bitcoinprbuzz.com/tao-network-announces-the-crowdsale-of-its-cryptocurrency-and-the-tao-of-music-project/The TAO Network has made 30 million TAO tokens available for the ongoing month-long crowdsale. Rest of the tokens are allocated for development, marketing and community building exercises. The platform has announced that the value a TAO token will not be more than $1.00 during the crowdsale. Participants in the crowdsale shall receive a 25% bonus on their deposit if the deposit is made prior to Friday, August 5th. |
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