Here is the most recent picture we've got:  Zorro: individual talent raising against collective force. |
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Just curious about your opinion about this website.
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It is not legally "money laundering" as Bitcoin is not legally recognised as money but virtual commodity tokens. How can it be?
They are in a chicken and egg until they decide to go whole hog and declare Bitcoin as a bonafide currency, by which point it will be too late.
Good point. |
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Buying/selling shares should be not possible at first place (it makes things more compilcated too). If bank grows stronger, shareholders (all bank clients) could decide if it is needed or not. Some voting system wolud be needed for that bank too
Well yeah, it wouldn't be different from the way most companies work, you know. |
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I am thinking of creating a co operative bank where all members will own an equal share in it and all digital currency issued would also be backed by silver.
Does that mean that buying shares from others would be forbidden?  |
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This is so cool.
Me and my friends have been talking about/following this and wondering how you solved the confirmations problem.
It is indeed an issue those guys will have to solve. One solution could consist in receiving a code instead of cash first. Wait a few minutes and then come back to the ATM to get the cash. So basically this: - go to the ATM - get the scan code displayed on the ATM. - send the requested amount of bitcoins for the desired amount of national currency - get a unique transaction code - leave the ATM - come back ten minutes later - send the transaction code - retrieve the cash. |
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That is what I thinked today also. An open, independent, non-profit bitcoins accsepting bank. A really good quality e-bank at first - that would attract people and almost free international transactions is a silver bullet.
I really don't mind if they try to make some profit. Bitcoin is all about free market, after all. |
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Excellent. Pretty much one of the bridge technologies I was talking about in this post. |
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I have already said it but I'd like to insist a bit and to repeat it. Bitcoin doesn't need to go mainstream to be efficient and to fullfill its purpose. Currently the bitcoin project only needs one thing: an efficient bridge towards the current financiary system.
We need a "bitcoin friendly" bank. Basically a conventional bank that would be aware of bitcoins and would offer automatic conversion via exchange market, using nothing but your VISA card (possibly in conjonction with a smartphone).
In such a bank you could, if you want, not store any significative amount of national currency, nor bitcoins. When you want to buy something in a store, you use your bank smartcard, and during the transaction process, your bank automatically converts some bitcoins you've just sent into the necessary amount of national currency you need.
With this, we don't even need to promote bitcoin and to convince millions of non-geeky people to use bitcoins. And it's a good thing, because otherwise it would be hopeless.
We should never rely on other people's smartness to do things.
IMHO
PS. I think the guys from MtGox are currently working on something like that.
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I actually thought about that quite a lot.
Assuming bitcoin takes off and 1 USD of today equivalates to 0.000001 BTC, then, as you say, some people are extremely rich (about 1000 people?).
My thought is: "So what, what will they do?". Who are these people? Should we envy them? I tend to think they are "good" people. So maybe these people will act as a kind of "Free Private Reserve", selflessly using some of their Bitcoins to do (maybe necessary) regulation of the money "supply" that is currently done by the central banks. Maybe these people are the Central Banks of the future (the FED is a private bank, too)... after all, they don't have to worry about their personal well-being and some of them own such humongous amounts of money that they can easily inject some into the world if needed.
What do you think about that?
Before bitcoin reaches 1,000,000$, those people would have been very very little greedy if they resisted selling their bitcoins. High prices are a huge incentive to sell. If someone is capable of resisting the temptation of selling and if he can wait until bitcoin reaches 1,000,000$, then I say he deserves to get rich. (damn it's annowiing as hell to constantly answer to the same stuffs. Anyone can put that in the FAQ?) |
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Thats a pretty good article, doesn't go too much into detail on the technical side (thus not getting bogged down).
I'm a little afraid now, this is the first step to bitcoin going mainstream. I feel like I'm in the first car in a rollercoaster, right at the top of the highest drop, looking down. I know it's going to be ok, and we've worked to get to this point, but it's still scary.
Personnaly, I just whish I had bought more bitcoins. |
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Bitcoin is at least as fair as any other currency out there.
Everybody enters the world with exactly 0 USD, 0 EUR, 0 BTC, and 0 of every other currency in circulation.
Well, some people would not agree on that, as they'll start talking to you about heritage, social status and stuff like that. But when people give wealth to their children, they do nothing but expressing their natural love for their offspring. Is it unfair that a mother loves her kid more than someone else's? If so, then I'd say communists don't really have a problem with money, they have a problem with life. |
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Still, court orders may be served to bitcoin exchanges, users and other operators, ordering them to "ban" specific bitcoins if needed, he said. This is a really bad thing for the overall bitcoin legitimate economy, not so much for the money launderers. I'm not sure it is really possible to ban a bitcoin address, at least not in any practicle way. Say I own a "bad" bitcoin address with 100 BTC on it. If my bitcoin software tries to use it in a transaction to a currency exchange or anything alike, then police will be called and I'll go to jail, or the transaction will be refused. I think the best solution for me is just to transfer it to several other bitcoin address, mix bitcoins in those address with "legitimate" bitcoins, do this again and again, and finally merge everything in a brand new address (or just leave everything in many different addresses, doesn't matter). Basically, it's what the bitcoin launderer service do, I think it is pretty much efficient enough, and I doubt anyone can do anything to prevent anyone from doing this. |
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Personally, I think that few of you have ever bothered to engage beyond name calling with people who have radically different opinions to you.
I'm sorry if we gave this impression. Just answer this question please: how do I convince someone to do something for me in a moneyless society? Say I want to go in a foreign country but I don't own a plane nor I can pilot one. Should I just find someone who do, and ask him to take me there? What if this person doesn't want to go there, for instance because he thinks he has more interesting things to do? How do I convince people to work so that I can eat something everyday? If I can't use money, does that mean that in order to have the right to receive some food, I would be required to work too? Does that mean that my economic activities would be planified by some central bureaucracy? Of course I have no problem with working to get some food, but I don't like the idea of people telling me what work exactly I must do and when. In a same way that you think that with capitalism free market eventually ends, I think that communism eventually ends up with forced labour. |
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Nice article. I'd like to mention one thing though. To me it is not true that bitcoin doesn't require a thrid party for transactions. It does. The thing is that this third party changes all the time, every ten minutes or so. It is elected in an opened, public process, and every node in the network can postulate. |
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Where did this article come from?
It's a news item at moneylaundering.com (right hand side, top). Registration required, hence (I assume) why it was posted here with permission. I feel like registering, in case there is a forum or a comment space associated to this article. Is there? |
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lol
I was googling bitcoin as I do every day and I saw that someone twitted Max Keiser about bitcoin. We all know Max and Stacy Herbert have been "bitcoin friendly" for some time now.
Maybe we could invite one of them to join us for this lunch? Who knows, they might accept...
I don't have any twitter account, but if you do, feel free to give them a link to this thread.
PS. Max Keiser lives and works in Paris (well, as far as I know...)
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In a perfectly rationnal world, people would sell currency A against currency B for one of these reasons:
- they want to buy something and the seller requires paiement in currency B ;
- they have just received currency A but they don't trust it as a store of value so they want to exchange against B ;
But in the real world most forex traders are just players who think they can fool all other traders by selling high and buying low and always increase their balance.
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I like it, too. It's well done. It tells 3 very common inaccuracies, though: - "all transactions are completely free"
- "transactions are instantaneous"
- "there's much higher security than with traditional online banking"
True, apart from your point #3 (I really think bitcoin is much more secure than traditional online banking). Still, it is a good exposé. |
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Well, after reading this email I have to say that it actually does make sense. An app that displays quotes as they are on bitcoinwatch.com is indeed a " website bundled as an app". Anyway, that doesn't change the fact that you should get rid of your iPhone.  |
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