Tax system is necessary for human community, isn't it? I thought it was common knowledge.
Whether taxes are spent properly is a different issue, isn't it?
Those who survived without tax can not say other people do not need tax support. If they say so, they don't really need bitcoin as well, as they don't need community.
Humans are social, by nature. Bitcoin will have to go well with tax. But, it does not necessarily go well with fiat! Rape is necessary for human romantic relationships, isn't it? I though it was common knowledge. Whether the victims are chosen properly is a different issue, isn't is? Those who can obtain consensual sex without rape can not say that other people do not need to resort to rape. If they say so, they don't really need sex as well, as they don't need community. Humans are social, by nature, therefore rape is a necessary part of romantic relationships. Another ridiculous analogy.. tax is not the same as rape, and it is NOT even close to the same... so stop being inflammatory and devolving into misleading analogies. |
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interesting reading, I don't think our schools are bad to be honest, I agree that private schools can "offer" more than what public schools offer, but this doesn't mean that public schools have to be shitty...
Indeed. Mine was actually pretty good compared to many. The question really is whether it necessary for the government to fund them (given the way they obtain those funds) and the quality of education obtained vs that money spent elsewhere (or, conversely, whether a similar level of education can be obtained by spending/taking less money). However, many people live in areas with bad schools. And they can't go private because the government is confiscating too much of their income and they can't move to a better catchment area because the government is confiscating too much of their income. You are attempting to simplify and to blame the government... the problem is much more complicated, and the government is the people... so let's blame the people for allowing the education infrastructure to evolve into some baloney of complication. The solution involves putting more of the public back into education and allowing it to serve all aspects of society rather than merely rich and merely the various forms of profit making and divide and conquer that is allowed by the various forms of complicated funding. |
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When I was a kid, my mother could call the local doctor and he would COME TO OUR HOUSE and treat us (an unbelievable concept in America now), and he would charge us $10 for that service. Everyone I knew was about as poor as we were, but I cannot once remember hearing someone say "Oh my God, what will we do about the medical bills?". The mess that the American health care system is in now is another creation of our government - but again, that is a long argument that exceeds greatly the bounds of this thread.
The mess that is the American education system that mmitech is decrying is also the fault of the government. This is worth a read http://mises.org/daily/1425Yes. It seems that over the years, the government has allowed too much privatization (and money making) of the public good which is various aspects of the education infrastructure. |
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it is sad how most Americans have no clue about what is really going around the world, and still think that USA is the greatest country in the world and the land of "freedom", when most of their follow citizen still struggles and cant get the basics of a free education and health care.
Free education? How do the teachers feed and house themselves? The students don't have to pay all their lives for loans, their education comes from already paid taxes which goes to pay teachers and expenses of college... I for once paid annually 20 for registration fee in college and another 40 for my dorm room, then there is the student coupons (supported price from the government ) to use in restaurants. If I pay my tax they better use it to make my life and the life of my children better, most EU and north African countries have this system, but in the US they instead spend tax money exporting "democracy" and "freedom" around the world, billions of dollars spent on war while millions of Americans struggle in poverty and losing the basic human rights, things that even central Africans are improving at. You don't know squat about the 'poor' in America. I grew up dirt-poor, as we say on the south. My father was an uneducated, unskilled worker in a cotton mill, and my mother was a full-time mother to 7 kids. We never went hungry or without clothes because my father was both frugal enough and industrious enough to make sure we always had what we needed - without ANY government assistance - even though plenty of that was available to those who would take it. In America, there is always someone who will pay you to do useful work, and my father took advantage of that fact to supplement his income. On the weekends, he would grab me and/or one of my brothers and we would go do house painting or general handyman work, yard work, or whatever we could to make a little money. We also did plenty of hunting and fishing to supplement the food budget. When I left high school, my family didn't have the money to send me to college. I went to work in the same cotton mill where my father (and his father) had worked and EARNED the money to send myself to college. My siblings did exactly the same. One sister is a veterinarian, one is a nurse, I'm an engineer, one brother owns a construction company now, another is a CS geek - well you get the picture... All of us achieved what we have without the handouts you seem to believe are REQUIRED to escape 'poverty', and I never owed ANYBODY any student loans - because I went to college BEFORE government interference in the education market drove the prices through the roof. The only people in America I have ever seen "struggling in poverty" were doing so because they chose to depend on the government to support them. People like you would voluntarily make yourselves into livestock owned by your 'government'. Well, have fun with that. I agree that the US government spends what to much money on imperialistic endeavors, but that is another argument for another time... My wife grew up dirt poor. She was the first in her family to go to college. She was very smart and not lazy in the least. However the only way she could afford to go to college was to take out student loans. She had to take out loans to get her first year of college paid for. But because of her grades she applied for scholarships and managed to have most of her remaining years of college paid for. I met my wife while we were in college and we got married after we graduated and of course thats when her student loans come due. But because we went to college we managed to get pretty decent paying jobs and managed to pay off her student loan within a few years. So it goes to show you that just because some Americans go into debt to get things they need such as an education or whatever that we are not all lazy asses that have the debt hanging over our heads the rest of our lives. Both of the above posters deserve a pat on the back (well in the second case his wife). Both approaches are very admirable  I don't disagree with you. Yet, there are a lot of rags to riches stories that are going to involve a lot of variety of influential factors including whether government was a part of the equation may be a matter of degree. |
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Please leave your politics and your religion in your church and your bunker, respectively and respectfully.  Politics will never be far from Bitcoin. The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks Yep... politics are in lots of places, including bitcoin.. |
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it is sad how most Americans have no clue about what is really going around the world, and still think that USA is the greatest country in the world and the land of "freedom", when most of their follow citizen still struggles and cant get the basics of a free education and health care.
Free education? How do the teachers feed and house themselves? The students don't have to pay all their lives for loans, their education comes from already paid taxes which goes to pay teachers and expenses of college... I for once paid annually 20 for registration fee in college and another 40 for my dorm room, then there is the student coupons (supported price from the government ) to use in restaurants. If I pay my tax they better use it to make my life and the life of my children better, most EU and north African countries have this system, but in the US they instead spend tax money exporting "democracy" and "freedom" around the world, billions of dollars spent on war while millions of Americans struggle in poverty and losing the basic human rights, things that even central Africans are improving at. You don't know squat about the 'poor' in America. I grew up dirt-poor, as we say on the south. My father was an uneducated, unskilled worker in a cotton mill, and my mother was a full-time mother to 7 kids. We never went hungry or without clothes because my father was both frugal enough and industrious enough to make sure we always had what we needed - without ANY government assistance - even though plenty of that was available to those who would take it. In America, there is always someone who will pay you to do useful work, and my father took advantage of that fact to supplement his income. On the weekends, he would grab me and/or one of my brothers and we would go do house painting or general handyman work, yard work, or whatever we could to make a little money. We also did plenty of hunting and fishing to supplement the food budget. When I left high school, my family didn't have the money to send me to college. I went to work in the same cotton mill where my father (and his father) had worked and EARNED the money to send myself to college. My siblings did exactly the same. One sister is a veterinarian, one is a nurse, I'm an engineer, one brother owns a construction company now, another is a CS geek - well you get the picture... All of us achieved what we have without the handouts you seem to believe are REQUIRED to escape 'poverty', and I never owed ANYBODY any student loans - because I went to college BEFORE government interference in the education market drove the prices through the roof. The only people in America I have ever seen "struggling in poverty" were doing so because they chose to depend on the government to support them. People like you would voluntarily make yourselves into livestock owned by your 'government'. Well, have fun with that. I agree that the US government spends what to much money on imperialistic endeavors, but that is another argument for another time... My wife grew up dirt poor. She was the first in her family to go to college. She was very smart and not lazy in the least. However the only way she could afford to go to college was to take out student loans. She had to take out loans to get her first year of college paid for. But because of her grades she applied for scholarships and managed to have most of her remaining years of college paid for. I met my wife while we were in college and we got married after we graduated and of course thats when her student loans come due. But because we went to college we managed to get pretty decent paying jobs and managed to pay off her student loan within a few years. So it goes to show you that just because some Americans go into debt to get things they need such as an education or whatever that we are not all lazy asses that have the debt hanging over our heads the rest of our lives. Student loans are most-likely government subsidized a lot of ways. There are a lot of ways in which the poor can engage in various forms of hard work the profit from government provided infrastructure without turning into leaches, which seems to be implied by the earlier comment by xyzzy099, in which s/he is suggesting that the only legit way to work your way out of poverty is to work your ass off without any government assistance.. or some other nonsense like that. There are a lot of ways that we would NOT have various forms of infrastructure, if it were NOT for various governmental investments (including the roads) and possibly the internet... though much of these investments are mixed and the government's involvement in things such as policing and fire protection can sometimes be subtle. |
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it is sad how most Americans have no clue about what is really going around the world, and still think that USA is the greatest country in the world and the land of "freedom", when most of their follow citizen still struggles and cant get the basics of a free education and health care.
Free education? How do the teachers feed and house themselves? The students don't have to pay all their lives for loans, their education comes from already paid taxes which goes to pay teachers and expenses of college... I for once paid annually 20 for registration fee in college and another 40 for my dorm room, then there is the student coupons (supported price from the government ) to use in restaurants. If I pay my tax they better use it to make my life and the life of my children better, most EU and north African countries have this system, but in the US they instead spend tax money exporting "democracy" and "freedom" around the world, billions of dollars spent on war while millions of Americans struggle in poverty and losing the basic human rights, things that even central Africans are improving at. So not free. Good. Let's actually acknowledge those people who are going out there and working day after day to pay for this stuff and realize that this stuff doesn't just fall from the sky. well, we all pay taxes, same like you do in the US but we don't have to additionally take loans and be in debt all our lives to pay back what we should be entitled to in the first place, we all have the same equal chance for education here... it is just sad to see talented people in the US having to escape college because they cant afford it, this is all what I am saying. I pay taxes for one reason only: the gov has more guns than I do. It's not legit because it's involuntary. If anyone else forced you to give them money, it would be called what it is. ROBBERY! Yes we have had fairly long postings about this topic previously regarding your (and others) all too simplified view that the government is robbing the people... which is just a bunch of baloney simplification to suggest that getting rid of the government is the solution to all societal ills.. and probably NOT even worth getting into any deeper discussion of such extremist ideas that seem to have little or NO plan about how to get to the supposed ideal state of NO government and little or NO outline regarding what society will look like once we arrive at such a government -less state, if we were to arrive in some meaningful state of supposed survival of the fittest? |
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it is sad how most Americans have no clue about what is really going around the world, and still think that USA is the greatest country in the world and the land of "freedom", when most of their follow citizen still struggles and cant get the basics of a free education and health care.
Free education? How do the teachers feed and house themselves? The students don't have to pay all their lives for loans, their education comes from already paid taxes which goes to pay teachers and expenses of college... I for once paid annually 20 for registration fee in college and another 40 for my dorm room, then there is the student coupons (supported price from the government ) to use in restaurants. If I pay my tax they better use it to make my life and the life of my children better, most EU and north African countries have this system, but in the US they instead spend tax money exporting "democracy" and "freedom" around the world, billions of dollars spent on war while millions of Americans struggle in poverty and losing the basic human rights, things that even central Africans are improving at. You don't know squat about the 'poor' in America. I grew up dirt-poor, as we say on the south. My father was an uneducated, unskilled worker in a cotton mill, and my mother was a full-time mother to 7 kids. We never went hungry or without clothes because my father was both frugal enough and industrious enough to make sure we always had what we needed - without ANY government assistance - even though plenty of that was available to those who would take it. In America, there is always someone who will pay you to do useful work, and my father took advantage of that fact to supplement his income. On the weekends, he would grab me and/or one of my brothers and we would go do house painting or general handyman work, yard work, or whatever we could to make a little money. We also did plenty of hunting and fishing to supplement the food budget. When I left high school, my family didn't have the money to send me to college. I went to work in the same cotton mill where my father (and his father) had worked and EARNED the money to send myself to college. My siblings did exactly the same. One sister is a veterinarian, one is a nurse, I'm an engineer, one brother owns a construction company now, another is a CS geek - well you get the picture... All of us achieved what we have without the handouts you seem to believe are REQUIRED to escape 'poverty', and I never owed ANYBODY any student loans - because I went to college BEFORE government interference in the education market drove the prices through the roof. The only people in America I have ever seen "struggling in poverty" were doing so because they chose to depend on the government to support them. People like you would voluntarily make yourselves into livestock owned by your 'government'. Well, have fun with that. I agree that the US government spends what to much money on imperialistic endeavors, but that is another argument for another time... There is NOTHING wrong with working hard to get ahead, and it is laudable in many ways. However, your suggestion that we do NOT need government seems to be an oversimplification of social structures. Additionally, you seem to imply that various government assistance had made people too lazy and unwiling to work and those bad incentives are responsible for the devolving infrastructure in America, and I think that you are personally missing the big picture manipulation that goes on by a lot of wealthy people to undermine government and to undermine various governmental services in order that poor people do NOT benefit and that they can run away with more of the pie (or at least prevent regular people from getting any of it). Wealth disparity in this country has devolved to tragic lows b/c of lack of strength of government and lack of ability or willingness to keep some of the wealthy decision makers and movers in their place.. whether it is job creation or export of jobs or other ways that they leach off of the public infrastructure to run away with and to steal wealth from the public sphere... that has worsened in the last 30 years or so.... and little by little eroded the whole social fabric of the country... with stupid ass ideas that the only value is rugged individualism and lack of government as the solution to all social ills... |
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it is sad how most Americans have no clue about what is really going around the world, and still think that USA is the greatest country in the world and the land of "freedom", when most of their follow citizen still struggles and cant get the basics of a free education and health care.
Free education? How do the teachers feed and house themselves? The students don't have to pay all their lives for loans, their education comes from already paid taxes which goes to pay teachers and expenses of college... I for once paid annually 20 for registration fee in college and another 40 for my dorm room, then there is the student coupons (supported price from the government ) to use in restaurants. If I pay my tax they better use it to make my life and the life of my children better, most EU and north African countries have this system, but in the US they instead spend tax money exporting "democracy" and "freedom" around the world, billions of dollars spent on war while millions of Americans struggle in poverty and losing the basic human rights, things that even central Africans are improving at. So not free. Good. Let's actually acknowledge those people who are going out there and working day after day to pay for this stuff and realize that this stuff doesn't just fall from the sky. Education is one of those public goods that we should value, and realize that the free market does NOT accomplish the objectives the same as the public creation of various education institutions and infrastructure. Surely in the current system, there seems be a large array of institutions and infrastructure, including profit making ones, which may or may NOT contribute to the public goods. However since this is a public good, the people should be deciding their allocation priorities - including the elections and appointments of responsible persons to oversee such various allocation priorities. |
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I have been thinking that it has to be the clean, freshly made fiat dollars, but then again I don't know... In my country, professors are paid by the government and that's pretty much all you need to know.
I am paid by the taxpayers of the State of Sγo Paulo, to be more precise. You are payed by those who buy the bitcoins that you sell. That of course determines the opinion that you pretend to have about its future. Merely b/c almost all of us, in this thread, are invested in BTC (or trading it) does NOT mean that we are biased in our comment, and that our comments are less objective than yours. Actually, you, time after time, have demonstrated a considerable proclivity to skew your various renditions of relevant influences upon the price of bitcoin and relevant influences on the future successful application(s) of bitcoin. |
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I hope it is truly not the dirty fiat dollars that lead him to share his opinion in the way that he does.
I have been thinking that it has to be the clean, freshly made fiat dollars, but then again I don't know... In my country, professors are paid by the government and that's pretty much all you need to know. IMHBO, there is NOTHING wrong with professors, and there is nothing wrong with having governments pay professors to carry out professorial duties and to teach the public and to engage in research and to present various points of view that allow people to develop and engage their critical thinking skills in order to make better choices in their designing and structuring of communities and its various resources. On the other hand, there are problems with Jorge playing the role of professor and seeming to intentionally skew and mislead in this thread with his ongoing selective misrepresentations of the information in order to attempt to denigrate bitcoin. There are a lot of good things that professors do and that governments do in the service of public good and in the interest of the public, and Jorge's participation in these various bitcoin talk threads does NOT seem to be serving the public in that direction b/c it appears that he is purposefully engaging in tactics to misinform and to mislead people about reality. He's on some kind of mission to propagate the status of current banking institutions by spreading disinformation to undermine bitcoin and other crypto currencies, but mostly he seems to be focused on bitcoin, since bitcoin is the most threatening to status quo financial institutions. |
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So apparently, I'm not able to make a reasoned guess that buy and hold has a much greater than average chance of working out for me. Once I retire next year, I'll have more time to ponder my errors.
It's almost next year. ARE you still planning to retire? Does your retirement depend on the price of BTC or the ability to predict the price? If your retirement does depend on the price of BTC, what is that price, and is it realistic? In light of the topic of this thread, I am inclined towards buy and hold based on my thoughts that we can predict generally the upward trajectory of BTC prices, but we cannot really tell where they are going to be at any point in time.. but we seem to be able to predict with some degree of probability (and certainty) that BTC prices are going to be within a range of prices. Accordingly, I think that i can give some tentative plans towards my being able to include bitcoin prices in my investment portfolio, but since BTC prices are so volatile (which is also within the expectations), I cannot keep too much wealth in BTC in order to rely upon its appreciation for my plan... but if it does appreciate at the high end of the range, then I can act upon that in order to preserve some of the value of the gains... and accordingly to be able to remove some of the volatility from my whole investment planning package. |
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Listening to Jorge is like the logic behind this adv sometimes. https://i.imgur.com/5cbPWap.jpgTL:DR people buying deep fried Cheescake because it donates $1 dollar to type 1 diabetes research is a sure way to develop type II diabetes lol Not to mention Jorge isn't worried about the global media conglomerates force feeding us certain views..he's more worried about the bitcoin based business cause you know they run the big racket already. +1.... Jorge has a special knack for finding exceptional cases and then attempting to generalize the exceptional situation in order to totally obfuscate reality. |
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all i can say is, thank god im not Jorge
I hope you all are aware that bitcoin news sites like Coindesk are not supported by traders or individual bitcoiners, but by enterprises such as SMBIT, GABI, Bitpay, Bitstamp, etc.. Ditto for "advertorials" in newspapers. Have you ever seen those media print anything negative bout those enterprises? (They even defended Danny Brewster after he ran away...) You cannot take what they print as the Gospel. They will only print the pros; for the cons, you are on your own. OM F'n G..!!!!!!.. what a con... this is a con... OM F'n G !!!!!.... I am sure glad that you have a new scoop and you pointed out that new angle for our contemplation.  |
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I shouldn't have shorted LTC.  Should I back at a loss? Any opinions? If you are already out, and you already paid the transaction fees, then maybe it is just better to stay out. I have some LTC, but I really do NOT see it having a long term potential, and I am thinking that i am probably just going to need to "cut my loose" at some point... but who knows.. maybe there will be another upward bubble with LTC... there certainly remains very decent pump and dump potential with it... since it remains as second in the Crypto-market cap summary of more than 460 kinds of alt coins. |
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Everybody is expecting a bubble and a lot of people are waiting to sell at 680-700 and up to 1000, only to get the fuck out of bitcoin. I really dont see a bubble coming like last year.
any sources? is this ....confirmed? Nope, just my thoughts. I bought @780 and @680 and since then I am waiting that this sht goes back up to that level ( not that I want to sell). And I am not the only one. And you're not the only one too. YES... good bye together, and good luck.... we will see you at $1400-ish when you are buying back in... |
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Everybody is expecting a bubble and a lot of people are waiting to sell at 680-700 and up to 1000, only to get the fuck out of bitcoin. I really dont see a bubble coming like last year.
any sources? is this ....confirmed? Nope, just my thoughts. I bought @780 and @680 and since then I am waiting that this sht goes back up to that level (not that I want to sell). And I am not the only one. Yep... you make your personal feelings sound as if they apply to a lot of other "people," just because you are suffering from anxiety and probably because you are ill educated about various positive aspects of bitcoin fundamentals. Or, alternatively, you over-invested for your own risk tolerance. So, maybe you should cash out part of your roll in order that you feel more comfortable; however, you personally strike me as the whinny type who is just going to complain either way and then say that you wished you had invested more when the price is in the $3 to 5K range. I am NOT trying to be overly judgemental, but I am just going by what you have already written... .. and the punchline may be that you gotta cash out part of your stash in order that you feel more comfortable. |
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Everybody is expecting a bubble and a lot of people are waiting to sell at 680-700 and up to 1000, only to get the fuck out of bitcoin. I really dont see a bubble coming like last year.
And, good luck, and good bye, "people." By the way, you may be o.k. getting out between $680 and $850, so long as you are in the red; however, you are really gonna regret getting out between $850 and $1,000 b/c most likely once BTC prices pass $850, we are going to have a fast rise in prices past previous ATH... so sorry about that if you purported "people" so choose to get of bitcoin in the $850 to $1,000 price range. On the other hand, there is some possibilities (small but still possible) that BTC is NOT going to experience any more exponential growths, and is merely going to grow at a much lower speed. Still may be a good investment, even absent exponential growth - either way, I would NOT write off bitcoin so soon - b/c bitcoin has experienced considerably long lull periods and the past, and has made it to the next upward trajectory and has even surprised with decent returns for people who are NOT attempting to time trades too much and staying for longer term periods.... I think that it is worth hanging out with a certain portion of your wealth in BTC, to see how this bad boy plays out... in the next several years... we have NOT had much materially bad news regarding bitcoin.. of course there have been a few negative items, but they do NOT really rise in any way to neutralize a large amount of good news developments. |
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Bitshares X on a crazy pump, almost $ 100,000,000 marketcap
Can i short those somewhere ? Would like to know as well. All new scam-, er alt coins bubble within the first 2-3 months of launch. Then it's all down, down, down. But down slowly, so it looks like it will recover here and there on the way down, but never does as interest wanes and eventually falls off the map. you can always try to borrow some off individual users, easier said then done... i tried to get poeple to lend me their RDD, never got anyone to agree. poeple just love their cryptos What's RDD? |
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Can΄t wait for that LTC short squeeze on Finex, orderbook (3:1 bullish for 0,70$ difference) and shorts stats still look funny.
LTC is very dangerous right now. while a short squeeze is possible, i think it's more likely that the top is in for now. if 31~ CNY support falters, i could see a steep fall ahead... very true. actually, I have a feeling that this bitcoin bounce from 440 territory is ltc related. someone pumped some fresh fiat from btc-e and bitfinex bitcoin liquidations into highly illiquid ltc market, hoping for a major btc push. not going to happen. Yeah, right!!!! Your whole theory makes NO sense, also. There is a hell-uv-a lot more going on in the BTC price manipulation than its miniscule relationship to the lesser known but currently second in place market cap crypto currency, aka LTC. |
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