I have no clue how he made everything so cheap, and I actually don't believe that it's even possible to do so, no matter what quantity is ordered...

You can look for yourself, custom tamper proof holograms that are at least 800 dpi and secure enough to deter counterfeiting are easily 56 cents each, with about a $5000 minimum order investment. Plus, the cost of the coins which is more expensive per coin than the holograms.. somewhere around $2.50 a coin for about a 1000 of them, the less you order the more expensive per coin it is.

If you can find somewhere to make these this cheap, let me know. I can assure you I have/will shop around. If I charged an $0.80 mark up though, I would be out of business before I even manufactured anything.

Another thing I wanted to mention.

Everyone wants to measure the quality of my coin to the quality of Casascius' and it is not really fair. Casascius had been making physical Bitcoins for over 2 years and has a lot of experience manufacturing and assembling them... I have never even made a single one before. There will be a learning curve and growing pains that I will work out as things progress. I hope one day I can release a super high quality product like Casascius, but this may not be possible at first due to my inexperience (I hope that is not the case.)

Litecoin is at its core written in the code different than Bitcoin. It is okay IMO if our physical Litecoins are different from Bitcoins' version. The only reason I am making them is because he seems unwilling to make physical Litecoins. Otherwise, I would step back and let the pro do it. I will try to make the prices fair, and the loading process and private key destruction as transparent as possible.

So... I ask you all to please bear with me, I am trying my best.

No, I haven't spoken with him... I'm sure he has probably seen the thread, but has yet to comment. I'm curious how you know exactly how much it costs for him to make his coins? I think it probably costs him a similar amount to manufacture his coins as I have stated it will take me, but he can more easily mask the costs of manufacturing and the mark up, because each Bitcoin is worth about $100. Meanwhile each Litecoin is only worth $2.50, making the manufacturing costs and mark up more apparent (if you get what I'm saying.) He is charging a .25 BTC mark up per coin... this equates to $15+ profit for him assuming his costs of making them are the same. That is more than I would be charging in my example above ($10.62 profit in comparison.) But because a Bitcoin is worth much in USD than a Litecoin, it is not as apparent. So actually my coins would be cheaper than Casascius' if you do the math (maybe I should charge more    ). These numbers I posted are not final and subject to change, I am just thinking aloud.

Also, he is probably making his coins 1000s and 1000s at a time (maybe even 5000-10000+), which brings down costs quite a bit. I could ship without the clear plastic case that would take a dollar each off the cost, but I thought this would be nice to protect the coins and keep them in mint condition. No offense meant, but Casascius is what I call "Old Bitcoin" (IE. Old money)... he has a lot more resources and money than I do that bring down the cost of his product.

I don't think $4.06 manufacturing costs for each coin is really that expensive. Like I said, without the clear plastic case I could bring this down to $3.06, but this is not including the cost to load the LTC. Also the $4.06 costs per coin is not including any profit whatsoever, which is necessary to make this worth my time and for further expansion/offerings of different denominations and silver coins. This will take a lot of my time, I can't just do it for free... also, since my markup is actually lower per USD than Casascius, I think it is a reasonable price.

I will try to get the designs pegged down during the next week and get some solid quotes for the hologram and coin minting. Then, I will think about opening up pre orders including something along the lines of a "certificate of authenticity" or something about the coins being one of the first physical Litecoins made by us! I think this is a good idea, because the cost of minting is really the bottleneck at this point.

I am going to try and be as transparent as possible, similar to casascius, in the manufacturing of the coins, generating addresses, and private keys. An exact procedure has not yet been determined, but I assure you I will do everything in my power to make this very transparent.

Although, at the end of the day I will still need the community to trust me and know that I have the best intentions for Litecoin on my mind. My ultimate goal for this project is wanting to increase the value of Litecoins by making a novelty such as a physical Litecoin, and making a worthwhile contribution to the Litecoin community.

Yes, it is the cost of making them that is somewhat holding this project back. I will consider offering pre-orders to speed up the process, but this was something I was trying to avoid.

This is a very likely possibility that the value of LTC goes up a lot by the time they are actually made, allowing me to lower the mark up. The numbers I posted are in no way exact.  

But yes, I am leaning towards selling higher denominations than just a 1 LTC coin so that the mark up can be lowered and it can be made more affordable to customers.

I hadn't thought about this, thanks for the heads up!

First of all, to make a secure enough hologram, I will need to spend about $5000-$6000 to have them made. To have them designed and set up for printing is $5000 alone, not even counting the quantity I end up ordering. After this initial $5000 expense, I can have about 10,000 printed for $600. So, judging by those numbers, each hologram will cost about 56 cents. The coins will be much more expensive per unit. I am expecting to spend about $3.50 each for 1000 coins. This includes a nice clear protective plastic case for each coin.

So.. total cost of minting each coin and adding a hologram might be about $4.06. That is not including loading it with the Litecoins. When taking into account the current price of a Litecoin ($2.50), each coin will cost me 1.624 Litecoins to make. Add the 1 LTC that needs to be loaded on the coin and we are left with a total minimum cost of 2.624 LTC just to make one physical Litecoin. I was thinking about maybe putting a 100% mark up on the coins and including free shipping. This may seem like a really high mark up, but I need to recoup the $7000-$8000 investment it will take me just to make the first batch of 1000 coins and also pay myself for the time it takes to design, create, assemble, and load each coin. This would enable me to expand my offerings to other denominations of coins and also silver bullion in the future. This would make each physical Litecoin cost about 5.248 LTC.

I almost feel like this is too expensive, but due to the costs of making these coins there may be no other option. So, I ask you guys... is this too much? Would you be willing to spend this much for a physical Litecoin? Maybe it would be better to only have higher denominations so the mark up would not have to be so high? The higher denomination sold would further decrease the markup I need to charge. What are your opinions on prices of the coins?

It is a tough situation on which denomination to sell, what price would make this very time consuming project worth my time, and what would be worth it for people to buy. I really need some opinions on this as well.

Awesome   

Any other opinions? 

Ok, thanks!

Sorry for sending in early... I guess I got excited about ordering some Avalon chips and neglected to read all the guidelines.

Thanks for putting this together guys!

Ah, you reminded me of another problem with the project.

I've had a hard time with posting these designs for peer review... everyone seems to think they should be made a little bit differently.

At some point (very soon if I am to ever go into production) I am just going to have to choose a design and go with it, because it is impossible to please everyone.

Please keep in mind these are just rough drafts, the spacing/layout is not centered/straight, edges are rough, etc.

Thank you for your opinion though, I want as many people as possible to like them, and represent and promote the Litecoin community well.

Hello everyone,

I thought I would update you all on my status. I have not been sure if I was going to complete this project or not over the past week or so. Someone contacted me when I posted the OP that they are also working on a physical Litecoin. Due to the high cost of minting and making the holograms, I wasn't sure if I wanted to risk this much money (considering if everyone likes their physical Litecoins better, this could leave me deep in the hole and out a lot of money.) After mulling it over for a while, I have decided to continue on with the project anyways despite this.

Several designers contacted me wanting to collaborate with me on this project. I was put in an unfortunate situation where I did not really know who I should chose, as I wasn't completely sure who would do the best job on the design, provide a healthy business partnership, and what percentage of the company to give them while still make this worth my time. Also, I kind of felt like the team captain in high school dodge ball picking teams and did not want to leave anyone out. Another thing, the costs of making these coins is so large and the profit margins so small, that I am going to have to sell a lot of them just to break even. This doesn't leave me much wiggle room to give up a percentage of the company or even pay a designer. Even designing them myself it will take me selling many coins (maybe about a 1000) just to break even. It is because of these reasons that I have decided to do everything that I can possibly do myself, from design to assembly.

I came up with a simplified design that I hope most people will like using the KISS method (keep it simple stupid  .) I think one of the resounding opinions most people said ITT are that they want a simple coin design. So, I have listened to you guys and tried to come up with a simple design that still looks good. I hope you guys like it... please note that this is just a rough draft, also it is in black and white because I just do not have 3d capabilities, so this 2d rough draft will have to suffice. The coin itself will be 3d and all shiny and pretty like the other coins you have guys have posted.  



I will only be making a One and Ten Litecoin model at launch. If this first phase of the project is successful, my future goals are expanding the selection of physical Litecoins in multiple denominations and also one ounce silver bullion coins. It takes about 3 weeks just to make the hologram, so a possible release date is at least a month away, I'd say 2 months is more likely.

As always, I am interested in your opinions.

Thanks,

Ch

Whoops, I should pay more attention. 

I just sent in 12.168 BTC for 156 chips

BTC sent from: 1PeMQ6epzs9FWynK8ds7tAwJviAi9rLn9G
Transaction ID: c8947dbda88cacba5c8ff815afa518f182194263a4e43fbde5dc80227bbbcc90

Signed the transaction as CoinHoarder

Thanks

They will be delivering preorders for AT LEAST the next 6 months judging by the release of their FPGAs.

They haven't even finished the design for the Single or little Single yet.

Also, they aren't shipping yet.. these are prototypes shipped to developers and one PR guy.

I bet full scale shipping to actual customers is at least a week away if not more.

Cool video, thanks for sharing 

Lol... cheaper prices than Avalon themselves "Price: $8,000 USD / ~65 BTC"

Definitely a scam.

There's so much fail all over that site.. <facepalm>

I already said I was done in this thread, but he asked me a question so I answered.

I didn't know the UK public school system was so shitty, my apologies.

Like I said, I'm not going to drag this guy through the mud anymore than I already have.

So.. stop directing posts at me and I'll leave this guy and his scam alone.

He claims he is from the UK, so English should be his first language.