Great, that was brilliant, informative, and prompt!

I know Avalon, ASICMiner, and BFL have intimated that ASICs in the 28nm range weren't likely to appear until late next year. KNC is upping the bar considerably.

Thoughts?

It does seem awfully ambitious. Has Orsoc delivered 28 nm anything already?

Possibly. At some point someone bought back in 25,000 btc, but it didn't move the price to 120 again.

Why? Probably because the last two weeks the sunday whale-dumper has later bought back in, and thus people had sell walls ready to go to take advantage of him That's one theory anyway. Hopefully it prevents the dumping strategy from being profitable ultimately.

That's fine, fine. But I also contend that the amount of taxes one is supposed to pay, in terms of ethical considerations, is zero taxes. Just like one is not -supposed- to pay a robber holding a gun on you. One does it to avoid worst aggressions against their person, not because they have a moral obligation to do so. Quite the reverse, the moral obligation is on the robber not to rob you.

KNC had indicated that we would find out our true queue position today, monday, after the pre-order window closes.

That sounds optimistic to me. It's been a whole big mess and no one really knows how pre-orders are going to go down. I think most people simply ordered and hope for the best.

Furthermore, if pre-orders ahead of you ordered multiple units, your queue position could be 500 but you might be 1500th in line to receive an actual unit, due to the 3-unit order limit initially--though clearly that's not likely. And if you came in after the 1-500 queue, there's no limit on units ordered at all. And what about people who initially registered for 1 miner and then bought multiples?

I'm not saying this to be negative, this is just my understanding of everything that's happened. I think everyone who ordered early made a good decision thus far, and I'm interested to see how they resolve the queues.

Bitcoin would continue to grow because it offers the lowest possible transaction costs of all competing currencies for distanced and online transactions, and because the future will come to depend more heavily on those kinds of transactions as the world economy comes online and even in-person purchases begin to feature an online component.

In a world of ubiquitous internet, the digital transaction is king.

I would liken bitcoin today to the status of oil before the invention of the internal combustion engine--undervalued and largely off the world's radar. Oil was a curiosity and a nuisance before the ICEngine. As the ICE took off, oil became very important indeed. And as digital transactions take off, the compelling business proposition for bitcoin is its significantly lower transaction costs compared to credit transactions.

Bitcoin also offers turn-key infrastructure for developing economies. With a single cellphone and a bitcoin app, anyone can become a merchant, send or receive payments, or act as a bank for the whole neighborhood. While carrying cash has risks, a 3rd world bitcoin transaction can be done one-way, where the guy taking payments can be just a hired vendor without access to the private key, and thus can't be robbed of bitcoin. Nor does he need a bank to control his money.

And for the record, I don't think the US will take an outright oppositional stance to bitcoin, because they're smart enough to realize that bitcoin is a hydra with a hundred heads. They will instead try to tame it with regulation and slowly tighten the reins over time.

If there's a steady current, the this sort of steaming requires only minor course changes and no turning of 180. Let the current push you back a mile, steam forward a mile and back into center, power off, drift back a mile, correct course back to center, engine off, drift back a mile, etc.

Iirc, the current off California flows generally south, so assuming they'd faith a southerly current almost continually they'd be pointing the boat north permanently to do a figure-eight pattern.

That might preclude a traditional dock, but there may be ways around that too yet unthought of.

That's today. Situation could be entirely reversed tomorrow. Who knows.

You yourself admitted it's a GIT clone with a few changes.

Ie: copycoin.

Yes, it was all confirmed with Orsoc's CEO via email and phone-calls, also Orsoc confirmed involvement with KNC with a posting on their website, etc.

Ultimately bitcoin will succeed because of the failures of those managing national currencies, of which Argentina's is currently in crisis.

The rush to preserve value in an inflationary economy will produce a mad rush for any asset, including bitcoin. But at first very few people will know about bitcoin. But later, as info spreads, that will change, and people will realize that holding bitcoin is better than holding other hard assets that need to be converted later on to get value out of them, whereas bitcoin is a currency already.

The reason all fiat currencies must inevitably move into crisis is because the incentives on politicians always push them towards inflation. And inflation is counter to the welfare of the populace. Thus, under enough pressure, the government pursues a dramatically inflationary policy instead of the safe marginal one, resulting in an eventual repudiation of the currency.

The ability to inflate a currency constitutes an existential threat, or 3rd party risk, of using a managed currency. Bitcoin, as an unmanaged and unmanageable currency, is inherently safer for value store--which is one of the primary uses of money.

This is just one of the reasons why bitcoin is a better money than any fiat currency.

But when any fiat currency moves into crisis and the predictable and oft-repeated act of flight into capital goods occurs, in the past there was virtually no way out. You'd buy anything and everything and then convert back to fiat at a later date.

But now, today, in this century, there is a way out in the form of cryptocurrencies.

When people live through a national currency default, they lose typically an entire generation's worth of wealth, decades at a time. That sort of psychic-shock is not easily dismissed. Look at people from the Great Depression in the US who got in the habit of never throwing anything away, became hoarders, because of what they went through.

The idea that with bitcoin, one can never again have their wealth stolen from them by the mechanism of inflation will come to be seen as far better than stuffing bills under your mattress and the like.

The next two decades will be very interesting in financial terms to see if the US and other currencies hold onto stability, or we go into an all-out fiscal trade-war, of which on bitcoin can be the winner.

How many of these copycoins exist now? There's bound to be thousands a year no doubt.

Uhhhhh, what? I can't believe you're still trying to get this scam going.

Orsoc is always looking for ASIC engineers. They're an ASIC building company. That's like saying Microsoft can't ship Windows 9 because they're hiring developers right now.

I went through Orsocs site and found news of three ASIC specialists they'd hired going back to 2010 and 2011. It's not like Orsoc has never produced an ASIC before or didn't have any people already capable of producing them. This is just FUD and hardly seems a valid reason to doubt them.

Course; don't buy from them.

Indeed. They owe it to batch three to ship out before they ship chips :\

Apparently BFL are rank amateurs by comparison. Orsoc is about as professional as it comes for ASIC design. No way are they going to have the kind of power and heat problems BFL had. They know the pitfalls of ASIC design well, no doubt. They have several designers who are ASIC specialists and have worked as Orsoc for years now.

Seasteading, IMO.

While still completely controlled and closed, I doubt it constitutes a threat to bitcoin. Mining isn't such a 'waste' as the Ripple creators claim that we need to give an organization control of issuing currency. We already had that with fiat. No one should wield such power.

Open Transactions + Bitmessage + Bitcoin seems the holy trinity to me.

See it says 'Jupiter' then under it the number 250?

That means you're not a 1-500 pre-order. People with a sub-500 pre-order can see and buy a device titled "Jupiter 1-500" that also has a SKU number 249. I'm afraid you don't have an order for any 1-500 devices at all, and that your queue number will be entirely decided by when payment is confirmed. You admit none of these are paid for, so someone could literally register a new account on KNC right now and actually pay for a pre-order and get ahead of you in the non 1-500 queue. So, your accounts are, unfortunately, worthless for selling.

/r/meshnet?