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541  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Open Source Bitcoin ASIC miner project that uses 2x BM1387 (Antminer S9) on: October 22, 2022, 12:41:12 AM
~
Fuzzy! You legend! Thanks for all this information again.. Cheesy It makes total sense.

Due to limited time I may just quickly order some BitaxeMAX boards and probe around those with my scope; I feel like getting my breakout board to run is pointless after the insane progress lately, made by Skot.
Hopefully I can contribute more by analyzing his latest boards and checking what can be improved.
Just passing on the Ancient Wisdom accumulated over the many many decades of doing the Voodoo that I do so well...
They just do not teach that stuff in schools any more und unless one interns under the right mentors well...
542  Bitcoin / Pools / Re: Overview BTC Solo pools on: October 22, 2022, 12:05:43 AM
...
Does this mean that the operator of a solo pool has the technical possibility of manipulation, e.g. to redirect the reward to himself in case of a block find? And this although the user of his pool had entered his own Bitcoin address as user name when started the mining? I would be interested from a technical point of view whether this would be possible in general. That would be disastrous, of course, because a pool operator could be a scammer. Can you please explain this in more detail? Thanks.
Well, yes. That is why we raise the Warning Flags whenever some unknown newbie announces they've started a new pool be it solo, pplns, or pps. Trust must be earned!

Your BTC address is just being coded by the pool software as reward recipient vs the software pointing to a pool wallet to then be either sent to the solo miner or in the case of pplns, split up by the pool & distributed to the users. Where the reward is sent to and how much the pool takes as a fee are choices made by the operator when they set the pool..

In the case of -ck solo he coded the front end to take the address you provided and plug it into the block header to pay all but his 2% fee to you as the reward target instead of running through a pool wallet first. For Kano's solo pool you setup the payment address in your solo act, the pool wallet gets the reward and the accounting side of his software (KDB) transfers it (-0.5%) to your address on-file.

Either way the address you supply does *not* directly set where the block reward goes. The pool operator does and it all depends on how they code the pool.
543  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Help with the best Asic mining on: October 21, 2022, 04:10:12 PM
Anyway, the 1126 pro price is now dropped to $768 it's always the best time to buy ASIC units in the Bearish market.
Where can you find that price?
Um, at Canaan's offiical sales site...  Roll Eyes
https://shop.canaan.io/
544  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Re: [Help needed] Sha256 opencl kernel needed on: October 21, 2022, 12:31:55 PM
How about sprinkling a bit'o Fairy Dust on the PC to improve Luck? It would do just as much good Roll Eyes
Looking at previous results to try and find patterns is pointless because the process is totally random. What has occurred in the past has zero relation to what will happen in the future.

Folks have been trying to find flaws/cheats or other shortcuts in the BTC mining algo since 2009. Guess what - there aren't any...
545  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Investing in mining during a bear market on: October 20, 2022, 01:29:19 PM
Is it safe to invest in bitcoin mining right now, given that we are in a bear market? Is it safe to invest in anything other than bitcoin mining (tokens/nfts) if not? I intend to make a long-term investment with no plans to liquidate anytime soon, and I have the ability to purchase up to 20 S19 Pro 110T (just an estimate).
Why does almost no one provide us the most important bit of information needed when they ask this kind of question: What is the cost of electricity where they are thinking about mining? That is the single most important thing to factor into a decision to mine....

Only if you have low cost electricity does one move on to the next question: Do you have a place to setup and run these VERY noisy, hot miners? Do remember that all that power going in comes out as heat. A LOT of it...

Like most things in Life the answer to your vague question is not a clear cut, binary, yes or no. You need to think about all it entails.  Wink
546  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Open Source Bitcoin ASIC miner project that uses 2x BM1387 (Antminer S9) on: October 19, 2022, 10:31:21 PM
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Since you have experience with Mining chip power delivery systems , can you help skot and community with power delivery system so that all of us can benefit from your long-term experience.
Nope.
8 years ago when I 1st got into mining and joined here I might have but not these days. Going on 67 years old, just don't have the energy to do side projects anymore. After getting home from work (R&D Engineer at LaserMech) it's just eat dinner, go online for a couple hours and then bed time...

That said, those links to EDN articles about PDN design considerations pretty much cover everything giving valuable pointers about what to keep in mind when laying out the power traces to the chip(s), how to calculate the inductance of said traces, and calculate good ball-park values for the bypass caps (located as close as possible to the chips power pads) to minimize the Vcore bounce.

If anything, just take care with the layout and have a variety of bypass caps with different values you can tack onto the board and experiment with to produce the lowest amount of ripple seen at the chip power pads. Again it must be emphasized to not only place the 'scope probe on the Vcore pad but also attach the 'scope return lead to the chip power return pad. Um, I should add that the 'scope MUST have an ungrounded probe return! These days most do along with the multi-trace 'scopes having each channel return isolated from each other as well as from chassis ground. Connecting the return anywhere else introduces artifacts caused by the high frequency currents flowing through the power planes.

It's not difficult to get right or even 'good enough', it's just that it's too easy for folks to not give the matter a 2nd thought and just use a good ol' 0.1mfd cap stuck nearby the chip, leave it at that, then wonder why the circuit is glitchy. As a bonus it would be a good lab experiment for you to see the effects of looking at the voltages not only at the chip but also at various random points on the power planes. Tip: Use the 'scope set to AC input mode, it will let you turn up the gain to have a good view of the ripple voltages. Most newcomers to the high-speed power circuit design world are astonished at how different things look when probing at various locations on a solid power plane - as I've said elsewhere, this is not a simple DC bus feeding a static load or even one using devices with (in comparison) slow switching times. It acts like a DC-biased RF power circuit.

Edit: For a good in-depth look into the 'joys' of miner design, I highly recommend the Bitmine CoinCraft A1 28nm chip distribution / DIY support thread thread. It is about doing the exact same thing you are doing - a community -designed, open source miner - but using the A1 chip. That thread also drifts into a couple other community-miner design projects that were going on in the early days. That thread was of immense help when I did the forensics for AMT on the (Bitmine.ch) miner they were trying to produce. In short it covered everything that killed the Swiss design so I had a good idea what to look at. The lead designer in the thread even let Bitmine know what to do and the company ignored them. Oops...

Last edit: About the bypass caps. Note the plural. Best practice is to use several different value caps in parallel to get the final total capacitance needed. Usually 2 is fine with a small one 1/10th the size of a big one. 3 caps is even better. That allows each cap to target different parts of the wide range of harmonics the spike produce.
547  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: 2022 Diff thread. on: October 19, 2022, 01:58:35 AM
miner is released and should arrive on wednesday.

Heh, at least there are better odds of decent components (of all kinds) being used in it. It seems the Chinese have found a great market for um, questionable, grey-market chips & such...
https://www.theregister.com/2022/10/18/russia_china_semiconductro_failure_rates/
Probably a boomin' business for the dumpster divers & counterfeiters that supply said parts to the resellers  Cheesy
548  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Is lying now part of human nature? on: October 18, 2022, 08:18:10 PM
There is no 'Now a part of" about it. Lying has ALWAYS been part of the Human Psyche.
Certainly not an admirable one and certainly something to be discouraged but nonetheless it has always been there and no doubt always will be.
549  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Open Source Bitcoin ASIC miner project that uses 2x BM1387 (Antminer S9) on: October 18, 2022, 08:01:19 PM
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How close do you think an Antminer is to passing a Part 15 EMC test?
I'd be surprised if it does not pass as a Class-B device.

The main point about the RF design aspects of feeding these chips is not so much about cutting down EMI as it is about making sure that the Vcore at the IC pads stays within very tight limits as the clock cycles the gazillions of logic gates in the chip on/off all at the same time.

Remember, unlike a CPU or GPU chip whose various circuits are 'doing their own thing' which includes waiting for data to be passed to/from other areas, in a mining ASIC all of the logic gates in the chip operate in lock-step with every clock cycle. 1 cycle to load data into logic array (cores) from coms buffer (and present result from previous data to coms buffer), 1 cycle to push data through array, rinse & repeat with several thousand logic cores running at several hundred MHz. As a result, the PDN needs to be 'tuned' so to speak to smooth out the resulting current spikes and corresponding voltage dips. That said, since a mining ASIC has very predictable operations going on with no buffering or wait-states involved (aside from in the coms) on vs a CPU/GPU it is much simpler/easier to address the issue.

As pointed out in that 'simple circuit' article, even with the bypass cap located very close to the chip there is still a sizeable difference in ripple voltage seen at the cap vs at the chip's power pads. That test circuit gave them 89mv ripple at the cap but 1V ripple at the chip located just a few mm away from the cap. Even for a 5v device that is pushing things - 1v is 20% of 5v. Apply that potential 20% ripple to a circuit running at <1v will definitely cause problems because the switching thresholds are far tighter.

Edit: When I started in this Forum in early 2014 I did a fair bit of forensics on the CoinCraft miner from the Swiss company Bitmine.ch (now out of business) that used the A1 chip which Innosilicon designed for them, more precisely their "Made in USA" miner that they 'partnered' with AMT to make & sell here in the USA. Exact-same miner, just with parts sourced, PCB's (using Bitmine's gerber files & BOM's) made by and the miners assembled by the US company IMET. A very large part of their problem was due to absolutely clueless design of the PDN on their hash boards. 2nd issue was Bitmine having absolutely no idea about the proper thermal design that the chips required, 3rd was IMET's lack of experience in dealing with high power chips & the needed *very* thick power planes & thermal vias to move heat leading to innumerable issues...

Even Inno repeatedly pointed out the errors but the Powers-That-Be ignored their advice with disastrous consequences. OTOH, the company that did the famous DragonMiner (not to be confused with the far later DragonMint) that used the exact same A1 ASIC knew how to do things right and produced 1 damn fine miner.

A good start about the Bitmine.ch/AMT kerfuffle starts here and here I'll try to dig up more of those threads that in summary are Poster Child example of how to totally screw a miner design.

Last edit: I guess to summarize this, ja, you *can* use a separate Vcore PSU along with heavy bus cable to feed the hash board like the large miners do with bus bars but remember they are pushing much much higher voltages through long strings of chips. Pushing just a few hundred mv at up to 20A through the cables is not so forgiving. That said, just as the large miners do, the most important bit is to properly address the quality of power presented to each chip and not just to what is fed to the power input planes of the board.
550  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress] on: October 18, 2022, 06:54:44 PM
Heh heh... Seems that China is not being so 'friendly' to Russia after all... https://www.theregister.com/2022/10/18/russia_china_semiconductro_failure_rates/
Per that article around 40% of the semiconductors that Russia is getting from China are duds...  Cheesy
551  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Open Source Bitcoin ASIC miner project that uses 2x BM1387 (Antminer S9) on: October 17, 2022, 09:44:40 PM
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I definitely imagine the power supply being incorporated on the bitaxe PCB.
Um for god's sake yes!!!
I think I had posted a few links about feeding the chips earlier in the thread... How power is fed to an ASIC, FPGA, CPU, or any other high-power high-speed switching device is a critical design point that is easily overlooked. In short the PDN (Power Delivery Network) is NOT just a simple DC bus - it must be treated as a RF stripline due to the sub-microsecond high current spikes that happen with every clock cycle...

edit: It was in your thread in the Development & Technical area:
A good place to start for resources is TI.
https://www.ti.com/design-resources/design-tools-simulation/processor-fpga-power/overview.html
https://www.ti.com/design-resources/design-tools-simulation/power-stage-designer.html

New goodies:
A good paper on it available through ResearchGate

From the EDN archives: https://www.edn.com/debugging-approach-for-resolving-noise-issues-in-a-pdn/
 and very good presentation about it with a very simple test circuit https://www.edn.com/pdn-issues-occur-in-the-simplest-of-circuits/  In that article figures 3 & 4 along with accompanying text clearly shows the problem and that's using a 5v device. ASICs with their <1v Vcore, well...
Results from search of the EDN archives re: PDN's  
All are highly recommended reading.
552  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: problem of T17 IMPROVED on: October 15, 2022, 04:26:12 PM
For god's sake PLEASE use the code tag to reduce that text wall... The icon is #
553  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: 2022 Diff thread. on: October 14, 2022, 10:22:31 PM
Heh, along the lines of miners going online,  came across an interesting tidbit about tons of them sitting around
554  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Open Source Bitcoin ASIC miner project that uses 2x BM1387 (Antminer S9) on: October 14, 2022, 07:59:20 PM
Quote
I am a bit hesitant to work with the BM1398, because it's like $10 more per IC, but only a tiny tiny bit more efficient than the BM1397.
A bigger problem is that you need the driver for the BM1398 to use it with miner software. Cgminer only supports up to the s17 chip and that is because Kano wrote the driver and put it into his latest update of cgminer for Sidehack to use with his Compac-F.

Btw: bfgminer as well as -ck's much older version (and last he personally had a hand in) of cgminer do NOT have a driver for the BM1397 chip much less one for the BM1398.
555  Other / Off-topic / Re: Seriously, what are the best social channel to market a good NFT project? on: October 14, 2022, 05:16:56 PM
There is no such thing as "a good NFT project"... The vast majority of them are just another eventually worthless token/altcoin.
The fact that you want to rely on using social media to promote your project pretty much damns you from the start.
556  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: PSA: Get your Bitcoin off any exchange supporting "BSV" (due to insolvency risk) on: October 14, 2022, 01:18:11 PM
...
Yeah.  To say that puts a bit of a downer on festivities would be an understatement, heh.  I've heard of security-through-obscurity, but never security-through-abhorrence.  Messing with SV has definitely fallen into the category of "if you lower yourself to that level, there's no coming back".  Where's the puke emoji when you need it?  
Ya mean like these?
I really hope there is a special spot in Hell for CSW and his cronies...
557  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Speculation (Altcoins) / Re: Is Mining still worth it? on: October 14, 2022, 01:07:27 PM
I've recently gotten a graphic card for mining but i heard that currently mining is not worth it as all cryptos are currently in the downfall so its not worth mining. Can anybody give me an advice on it. Your insight is very much appreciated. Grin Grin
The is the Bitcoin section of the Forum and BTC cannot be mined using graphics cards as bitcoin difficulty is literally trillions of times higher than what even the most advance GPU's can handle. Mining Bitcoin requires using ASIC-based miners.

That said, please ask in the altcoin areas of the Forum where you can find the answers you are looking for. Many if not most altcoins can be mined using GPU's.
Requesting the mods to move this to the altcoin area.
558  Bitcoin / Mining / Re: Stratum v2: After 10 Years, The Most Used Bitcoin Mining Software Gets Facelift on: October 13, 2022, 12:40:55 PM
V2 has little to do with the original Stratum.
A miner should do only three things : get shares from a pool/node, process the work, report results.
Oh, and monitor itself & provide a GUI. Fine, that's 5 things. Period, end of story.

IMHO having the low power CPU's in a miner deal with more than the absolute minimum of work is a horrible idea. Then there is the matter of changing work w/o it being obvious to the owner of the hardware. Ya know - like the security hole known as extra-nonce aka XNSUB which allows the miner to change work on-the-fly to mine other coins (DevFee hashing is 1 example) -- as well as do other things in the background if it connected to a bad-actor pool.

Everything I've seen points to V2 being solely for the benefit of pool operators and not the miners themselves.
559  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Re: BTC Mining OS on: October 13, 2022, 12:15:39 PM
Monitoring software is not an Operating System. It is software that runs on whatever OS you run your PC with ('doze, Mac, Linux, etc.)
That said the best is Awesomeminer. Their Forum thread is here.
560  Bitcoin / Mining support / Re: T17+ doesn`t start mining! on: October 12, 2022, 10:50:12 PM
Quote
Or is there a specific part with this kind of PSU that always get broken?
I've been very curious about this also, not just Bitmain PSU's but also the ones made for Canaan and microBT.

These things are not that complex and are fairly easy to design to be bulletproof. Even cutting cost to a bare minimum is no excuse for the PSU's failing so often. Being more than a little familiar with multi-kw PSU design <cough> my gut feeling is that the problem area is the power-factor correction circuits... More specifically, the MOSFET Q4, the 3 diodes around it and the inductor used in the circuit shown in that repair guide.

Anyone ever have one of these repaired and gotten a report on what problem was and repair work done?
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