I hope it was all worth the lives of the thousands of people killed in war since the twin towers came down. People dont hate you for your freedoms they hate you because you bomb their wedding and interfere in their own destiny. A bit of forgiveness would have gone a long way to save all this death and destruction.
 It's really depressing sometimes, trying to convince other Americans this is the case. They are so indoctrinated in the Righteousness of the Cause that they won't listen to any facts you present to them. It makes people like me unpopular because we don't blindly worship American Goodness and spout bullshit about spreading democracy and freedom. |
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SmokeTooMuch and Mewantbitcoins,
If this is a "joke" why did he say "this is not a joke". And if he didn't do it, why doesn't he come out and say "I didn't do it, I was just mad"? Did you read his posts? He said "Let's attack Mt. Gox! Here is a bitcoin address to donate to." Someone replied "This is bad joke if it is one. You are making me lose confidence in your business." Bitcoinex then said: "I'm sorry, but I am actually serious. It's worth it because I'm/you/someone is losing money because of Mt. Gox. I might even feel sorry, but this is what happens with autoregulation in anarchy. Say goodbye (to Mt. Gox) in advance 'just in case'." Then later he said something about quitting his DDoS attack which I seem to remember was about the time I was able to briefly access my Mt. Gox account again. Perhaps he's just an angry person trying to capitalize on someone else's attack and these are just a string of coincidences. But until there is proof otherwise, I'm going with the current facts and believing what he said. Either way I don't want to associate with him, because either he's attacking Mt. Gox, or pretending to and lying about it. Either way he's going to lose major respect.
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People do have the right to defend themselves with the minimum force needed to repel the attack, and only as a last resort.
When did I say that people doesn't have the right to live? Please stop putting words in my mouth.
No one is putting words in your mouth. Bitter Tea asked you five questions, you gave five answers. If you support the use of force against individuals that make use of your ideas against your will, you ultimately support killing them.
Do you think an individual has the right to defend himself against aggression?
Do you think you have the right to fine me for infringing on your copyright?
Do you think you have the right to send armed men to my house if I don't pay your fine?
Do you think those men have the right to kill me if I defend myself against them?
Can you answer my question regarding a world where physical goods are as easy to copy as intellectual goods? Does it make sense that the above escalation of force is justified if I copy your lawnmower?
No. Yes. Yes. No. No. First question: "Do you think an individual has the right to defend himself against aggression?" Your first answer: "No." If this is not what you meant then you need to be more clear when you write. We now live in the real world where there is IP.
You infringe, I find out, I send you a notice, you ignore it. You are now the agressor. I had a rightful claim that you ignored. If money can't be extracted by any other means police will show up at your door, as a last resort. If you start shooting at the police you have a problem, as they have the right to defend themselves. Again, with minimal force.
However if you are a normal member of society things will never go that far.
I think the point that Bitcoin2Cash and BitterTea have made is a good one. Namely that if you agree that the right to life and the right to property are the two fundamental rights, you have to prove how the "right" to IP is not superseding either of those. In your own example it is, because you are limiting their freedom to use their property (paper, ink, computer hard drives, etc.) in ways they choose. |
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Whoever said that DoS attacks do not violate the non-aggression principle, I disagree. Bitcoinex's attacks are preventing many people from accessing their property stored in Mt. Gox. This could be seen as an act of coercion. The fact that I still can't get on Mt. Gox to access my fucking account is really pissing me off. He's not only hurting his competitor (which is wrong in itself), he's also hurting all the community members who are customers and cannot access their property that is being stored at Mt. Gox. So FUCK YOU Bitcoinex, and I will do my part to ensure that you never get any business.
As others have already stated, the key to making sure Bitcoin has multiple strong exchanges is to work at making yours better and more efficient, not attack competitors. All you have done is drive more people to Mt. Gox and put yourself out of business. Now we have less exchanges, and therefore, less stability in the Bitcoin economy.
Also, as a personal note to the Russians/Eastern European members of the community: I want to say that the nationality of Bitcoinex has no bearing on my thoughts towards any people group. I judge individuals not races or ethnicities. I know several Russians and Eastern Europeans and get along great with them and have a lot of respect for them and their culture.
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My wife also called it "pretend money".  I then told her to go make me a sammich. Grr. |
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I'm glad that justice was served.
Revenge != justice Cheers, This is an interesting point. In your opinion, then, what would justice look like for this situation? If Osama was fairly tried and found guilty, what would be the best way to serve justice? Monetary compensation for families? Execution by drowning in pig's blood? Life sentence in jail? I'm curious to know what you think justice would look like. |
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Actually it is something I would do on a weekend...can you say nerd?  haha yea me too. The problem with this, though, is:who's economic theory? Austrian? Keynsiansim? Chicago school? The conclusions we'd come to would vary depending on which school we "followed". This is why it's better if you actually explain your stand on Bitter Tea's questions instead of making us guess. That way, too, we can start the name calling when we discover we don't agree on economic theories.  It's basic microeconomics 101. It's not advanced stuff, just took microecon two semesters ago and learned those concepts then, then came across those links as I researched my answers here. If you don't want to read them, that's OK. But I have already explained the concepts in a nutshell. The italicised words can be referenced via the links. I think it would be helpful if you read the links, but like I said if you don't want to then that's OK too. Oh hey, I guess I wasn't paying that close attention to what you meant. I'm familiar with those economic concepts (I took a basic microeconomics class too, and have done a fair amount of independent reading) but I'll take a look at those links later and get back to you. It's late and I'm on my iPad so it's hard to type long responses. |
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Is there anybody that can answer my two simple questions?
From where do you derive the right to intellectual property, and why does it supercede my right to liberty?
Well, to play the Devil's Advocate, where does your right to liberty come from and why does it supersede someone's IP rights? |
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What difference does it make? People who want to believe it's a fake will continue to believe it's a fake, or they will come up with some other conspiracy theory.
That's why birth certificates should be stored in a block chain. If not anything else, at least this would make the date of birth unforgeable.
That's an interested idea. At the minimum, hospitals should be using some type of public-key encryption with a signature so that birth dates and names can be independently verified and audited. Awesome.  |
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I'm glad that justice was served.
I'm not glad with how it happened (the thousands, possibly millions of people who needlessly died and the money spent) and I'm not glad that this won't be a reason to bring our troops home.
FYI, I have a separate thread discussing the cost and alternatives such as assassination markets here: "US kills Osama bin Laden at cost of > $400 billion". Kudos to The Script for beating me in pressing the POST button...I did wait until I actually heard it from the horse's mouth. But I actually got the news immediately when my regularly-scheduled TV show "CSI Miami" was in its conclusion and David Caruso finally figured out who done it, and I wanted to post to bitcoin forum, but I didn't have my labtop out and ready. Ha ha, well sorry for stealing your thunder. I did wait until I had read about it in several articles before I posted. I hope the good guys won in your show.... |
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I'm glad that justice was served.
I'm not glad with how it happened (the thousands, possibly millions of people who needlessly died and the money spent) and I'm not glad that this won't be a reason to bring our troops home.
I completely agree. |
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Basically the key to all this is whether or not you believe the initiation of coercion is an acceptable method of solving social problems. The only way people are going to own more capital than they can "use" is through coercion.
Bullshit. If someone has enough money to buy 10 houses and they engage in voluntary exchanges with people who'd rather have the money than their house, how is that coercion? If you have 1000 houses1, and I wish to live in one that you aren't using, there are a few things that can happen (here's two). I can agree that you are the "owner" (even though you don't use the house), and pay you a certain amount of rent for the privilege of living in "your" house. Or, I can say that you aren't the owner, the house doesn't have an owner because it isn't being used. I then move in and ignore your claims of ownership.
Again, while I might agree that 1000 houses is more than a single individual can use, who decides what that number is? Is it ten? Is it two? Also, do you have the same standard for all capital? Can you only own one computer, one house, one camera, etc. Surely not. But then how do you decide how many is "too many" for a person to own? What if people disagree on that number? Will you come and take my third camera because you've decided that I can't use more than two cameras? The problem with this type of system is you are essentially advocating theft and then attempting to justify it with abstract, subjective reasoning. As for the rest of your post, I think it's sufficient to say "I disagree".
Fair enough, and as you said earlier But, you know, I think we have different priorities, in which case arguing is pretty pointless.
I think you are probably right. I don't advocate a system where theft is acceptable based on someone's subjective opinion about how much capital an individual can "use". You do, apparently. So we'll have to agree to disagree. |
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I'm sure magical tux is working on it, so this is me subscribing to the thread so I get notified as things progress.
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Is anyone else having problems accessing Mt. Gox?
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Do you anticipate a major correction? This kind of growth, while wonderful, feels...unsustainable.
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I had to come up with this because Skynet from the Terminator television series is said to begin it's attack today  Seriously, optimization of massively parallel computation as in the bitcoin network could speed up artificial intelligence development. What do you say? Dammit, now we're going to have to go back in time and prevent the creation of the terminator films. Lol you knew it had to come to this... |
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Yes. Bitcoin's arm has grown long indeed. However, I've heard rumors that the NSA is designing an EXAflop super computer. That would be 1 MILLION teraflops.
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