Ok, I've decided for the sake of expediency, to post each sale separately. Because I'm still waiting on an address from the second buyer. First buyer: Ninjarobot Trade: I hereby publicly state my binding intent to sell 102 shares of ASICMINER to bitcoin address 1D3nDnEZjTTQwgxMarh6ui5ALLqKcHZkSP (owned by user ninjarobot). The agreed upon price is 75BTC for 102 shares total. Signature of above message for ninjarobot trade, signed by address holding the shares (13rwPKskyATcAq3PpnCikfFG8989DQ8M3c) G8Q+j3HoNlu3QvprHC25Ie3Xsbw6nrVbHjCIuTwrcfvjLUIu5p/OEt7or8EGFhX+icQV0UjF+p0MdJ80Tjs1QUs= I agree that upon receipt of 75BTC payment in a transaction with at least 3 confirmations to bitcoin address 1BqCBBAasyCG9zqZaYU6MvjgXSgqGsng2 that the shares shall be transferred in full to the above named bitcoin address for ninjarobot. Including all voting rights, and rights to dividends. Ninjarobot has waived the option of Escrow for this transaction, so I will be sending notice of this transaction to Friedcat directly, to be executed on once said transaction is confirmed in the blockchain. Ninjarobot is to contact Friedcat directly via Private Message or Email, with a signed message from the bitcoin address 1D3nDnEZjTTQwgxMarh6ui5ALLqKcHZkSP (receiving address) in order to verify the email he wishes to have associated with share ownership (not posted here in the thread for obvious reasons) I would now like to request that Ninjarobot respond to the thread, quoting this post for public record. And confirming intent to buy. In addition please reach out to friedcat as outlined above in order to notify him privately of your email for receipt of the shares. I am now sending a copy of this message in it's entirety to friedcat. And referencing the thread directly to initiate the transaction. One down one to go! Quoted for public record. Sale agreed & BTC transfer made. Transaction ID: https://blockchain.info/tx/b0e37c3ed2c59eac4901644255748af48665531f856f8941ff864307c0e2733cUpdate: 3+ confirmations are in. |
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 Surely, they're not planning on playing the Hacked card. Chen Jianhai did it. |
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rGDRVy8KuYijqDDXpHhqitmFQQqj768cnR
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At this time, it appears that there is an overwhelming amount of evidence linking Zhou Tong personally to the Bitcoinica account hack at MtGox. Our legal department has advised us to freeze the funds for the exchange order mentioned above until further investigation by the authorities and/or legal proceedings are concluded.
Please understand that some information will not be released until all legal proceedings have been concluded.
Sorry to dig up an old thread, but was the anti money laundering investigation into the 40000 USD LR transaction by Zhou ever completed? If so, what was the outcome and where did the funds go? |
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This is when I learned a lesson I had never had first hand experience with until now: *never fuck with other people's money*.
Hear, hear! Bitcoinica take heed. |
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It's flabbergasting that people deposited serious amounts of money on a website, created by a teen in 4 days.
Actually I was under the impression that I deposited my money at a registered financial services provider in NZ, backed by reputable VC and operated by the respected Bitcoin Community that performed a thorough security audit beforehand. I also waited until they had a reasonable TOS in place. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://bitcoinmedia.com/first-licensed-advanced-trading-platform-for-bitcoin/&hl=en&tbo=d&strip=1Clearly I was wrong, so I give you that. I also assumed that: * Good user-facing security (enforcing strong passwords + OTP) suggested good security in the backend. Another mistake. They did not even bother making backups. * Businesses care about their customers. Wrong again. Needless to say, I learned a few lessons since then. Now I keep my coins in a paper wallet. Not too happy about that, but it will be some time before I trust my coins to any 3rd party again. |
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Notice how nobody from Amir, Donald, or Patrick Strateman has made any meaningful comment about Britannica fiasco in about 5 months.
That's because they had nothing to do with Bitcoinica. Remember; Zhou was *not* an employee and the Intersango trio where *not* partners. Everyone was just hanging out. They are all experts so don't worry, it's cool. |
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Just read the first liquidation report. Looks decent. A couple of things come to mind: - Is the term creditor and investor interchangeable or do they have different legal implications? Or are all the investors also unsecured creditors?
- The creditors (us) have 9 days to decide if we want to call a creditor meeting. Given the complexity of the case I think this might be a good idea. However the liquidator mentions that the associated costs is one of the reasons to forego this meeting. What would the costs be roughly?
- The 500K MtGox number seems very vague and rough. Considering bitcoins have appreciated a lot (5USD > 12USD) since. This number seems very low.
- Do the MtGox funds include the funds Patrick Murck was able to recover from Zhou from the MtGox theft?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=97272.msg1098303#msg1098303 - Also what is the status regarding the 40.000USD held by AurumXchange that Zhou said would be part of the recovery funds once AML would clear?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=95795.msg1062656#msg1062656
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=95795.msg1064858#msg1064858
Finally it is unclear if Tihan covered the linode and rackspace hacks. On 2012/04/24 Donald wrote the following: While Bitcoinica had some previous security concerns, namely where the attack on the Linode cloud hosting provider generated them a loss of 40k BTC, Bitcoinica has fully recovered from the loss and no longer depends so heavily on 3rd party platforms. The Bitcoinica reigns have been taken up by the recognized development group called the Bitcoin Consultancy which have a record of solid security in the tumultuous world of Bitcoin. http://bitcoinmedia.com/first-licensed-advanced-trading-platform-for-bitcoin/But according to Transisto: There was supposedly 62101 BTC of stolen fund to be covered by LP, 43554 BTC for Linode hack + RACKSPACE 18547 BTC = 62101,
Tihan confirmed he only paid 25000 of this, leaving another 37101 BTC missing. That was supposedly the reason why Patrick didn't wanted to pursue returning funds anymore (unless funds were covered).
Patrick say even that this 25k BTC return is complete BS. Tihan couldn't provide proof of transfer, stating there is no trace of inner Mtgox transfer.
Other things that come to mind: - Does the liquidator have records of all partial claim payouts made earlier & Is there a chance there will be clawbacks? Bitcoinica used 5USD as the number to settle claims and close positions. The liquidator is using almost 12USD.
- I understand that the creditors can call a meeting to set up a liquidation committee. How does this work?
- Can we get a list of all expenses made by Bitcoinica since they shut down the site in May? Are they significant & justified?
- Will there be intermittent updates from the liquidator or do we have to expect radio silence for another 6 months until the next official report comes out?
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I'm kind of baffled that they don't have the existing claimsDB that Bitcoinica worked on. After all isn't the liquidator supposed to take control of all Bitcoinica assets and IP (Including this database?). Are the previous operators unwilling to hand it over, if so why?
The existing claimsDB is key here as it should also contain records of which creditors have already been paid back and to what extend.
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Also, perhaps you could email Taslim back and advise him to ask the mods to be whitelisted. He won't be able to post outside Newbies otherwise.
Also, can I suggest copying your post with the liquidator's reply into a new thread with an attention-grabbing title which makes clear that the liquidator is seeking contact from Bitcoinica users (maybe "Bitcoinica liquidator wants to hear from users" or something similar). People have become jaded by these old threads going nowhere so they might not check them for updates.
Done and Done. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=126847.0 |
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Today I received the following email from Taslim Bhamji, a Senior Insolvency Administrator from PKF Corporate Recovery & Insolvency Ltd (the NZ Court appointed liquidator for Bitcoinica LP): We confirm that we have been appointed liquidators of the Bitcoinica Limited Partnership, which is registered in New Zealand. We are currently collecting information and our immediate priority is securing the investor funds (in both cash and Bitcoins) and determining investor balances. It is too early to know how long the liquidation process will take, but we would like to move as quickly as possible towards a distribution to investors/creditors.
With this in mind, we would be grateful if all investors and creditors could email us and provide their address and contact details, as well as details of any amounts owed to them and proof of the claim. Also the Liquidators’ first report is due to be sent to all creditors by 26 November 2012, but we are unable to do so if we do not have contact details for creditors or investors.
We would also appreciate feedback from investors on whether they would prefer to receive a distribution in the form of Bitcoins (where possible) or whether they would prefer a straightforward cash distribution. We are still seeking to determine what options are available to us at law, and will let investors know in due course.
Lastly, we are aware of legal proceedings underway in California against the Limited Partnership. The Liquidators have sought to have the Limited Partnership withdrawn from the proceedings on the basis that it is in liquidation. We urge creditors/investors to refrain from taking any legal action against Bitcoinica, as it will simply add to the plaintiffs costs with no benefit. Any legal claims against Bitcoinica would need to be made in the New Zealand Courts. Judgements against the Limited Partnership in any foreign jurisdiction will not be recognised by the liquidators.
Please contact me directly if you have any queries or wish to bring any matters to the liquidators’ attention. So if you happen to be a Bitcoinica creditor/investor - Now would be a good time to email Taslim at: Taslim[dot]Bhamji[at]pkfcr[dot]co[dot]nz
Note: I understand Bitcoinica got a few false claims during their claim period back in May. If you don't have a valid claim with Bitcoinica already then please realize that sending a false claim to a court appointed liquidator is probably not a very bright idea. |
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I finally got a reply from the Liquidator after a new attempt to contact them following the instructions posted by Repentance. I got permission to post it here: Thank you for contacting us. I apologise for the delay in responding to your email.
We confirm that we have been appointed liquidators of the Bitcoinica Limited Partnership, which is registered in New Zealand. We are currently collecting information and our immediate priority is securing the investor funds (in both cash and Bitcoins) and determining investor balances. It is too early to know how long the liquidation process will take, but we would like to move as quickly as possible towards a distribution to investors/creditors.
With this in mind, we would be grateful if all investors and creditors could email us and provide their address and contact details, as well as details of any amounts owed to them and proof of the claim. Also the Liquidators’ first report is due to be sent to all creditors by 26 November 2012, but we are unable to do so if we do not have contact details for creditors or investors.
We would also appreciate feedback from investors on whether they would prefer to receive a distribution in the form of Bitcoins (where possible) or whether they would prefer a straightforward cash distribution. We are still seeking to determine what options are available to us at law, and will let investors know in due course.
Lastly, we are aware of legal proceedings underway in California against the Limited Partnership. The Liquidators have sought to have the Limited Partnership withdrawn from the proceedings on the basis that it is in liquidation. We urge creditors/investors to refrain from taking any legal action against Bitcoinica, as it will simply add to the plaintiffs costs with no benefit. Any legal claims against Bitcoinica would need to be made in the New Zealand Courts. Judgements against the Limited Partnership in any foreign jurisdiction will not be recognised by the liquidators.
Please contact me directly if you have any queries or wish to bring any matters to the liquidators’ attention. and Hi,
We are attempting to post our response to the bitcoinica forum, however we are having difficulty in submitting a post at this stage. We are happy for you to forward this on to the forum until we are able to do so.
Thanks
Kind Regards
Taslim Bhamji
Senior Insolvency Administrator If you are a creditor you can contact Taslim directly at Taslim[dot]Bhamji[at]pkfcr[dot]co[dot]nz (please be civil) |
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Thanks Repentance. I really appreciate your continued support and insight in this affair! I also have not received any response yet from the Liquidator. As to the creditor report & claim form. Is this typically sent to creditors by regular mail? Or might they send it by email as well? I'm asking since I recently moved and am unable to update my records with Bitcoinica (for obvious reasons). |
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BTC will only take off once there is a killer use for it. Either mobile payments or electronic payment on the Internet. Before that, it will remain somewhat of a curiosity.
There several already: drugs, and asset protection (tax evading included). More than enough to back our funny money and then some. Agreed. Services that protect your privacy are another great match for bitcoin. In fact, yesterday I was shopping for a VPN service and settled on https://torguard.net/ - I was pleasantly surprised to see them offering Bit-Pay as an option. First time I ran into a site accepting bitcoin in the wild (without looking for it specifically). It is moments like that when you realize that bitcoin is here to stay. |
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Can't blame a guy for asking his money back.
However I can blame the custodians of our money for not acting in our best interest.
After Bitcoinica was sold and became a registered financial services provider Zhou (a minor) should have had his access to customer funds revoked. Backups should have been made. Reasonable security measures should have been in place. The ToS should have been respected. Thefts should have been reported and investigated. Efforts should have been made to recover funds. Customers should have been informed through proper channels. Promises should have been honored. None of this happened. The anger towards Donald, Patrick and Amir is justified. They might be victims in their own way but their actions have willingly victimized many more. Not a day goes by where I am not reminded of my unfortunate decision to put a large chunk of my savings in Bitcoinica.
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The original site was hit with a substantial DDoS attack while hosted at rackspace.
The news site has now been moved to linode as Bitcoinica has a fairly large credit there.
The list of no updates is genuinely an attempt to notice people that someone is still alive at bitcoinica but that there is actually nothing new to say.
We're all waiting on the proper legal process to go forward.
I see. thanks for the clarification Patrick. It looks like I have misinterpreted your intent here, my apologies. That said, I would prefer if the original statements made by Bitcoinica on bitcoinica.com would have remained available until this case is finally resolved. |
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Bitcoinica Liquidation Information
2012-10-03
No update.
2012-10-02
No update.
2012-10-01
No update.
2012-09-31
No update.
2012-09-30
No update.
2012-09-29
No update.
2012-09-28
No update.
2012-09-27
No update.
2012-09-26
No update. http://bitcoinica.com/Patrick being a smart-ass, I assume. Yeah, hilarious. Why is this guy so spiteful against his customers? The Google cache of the previous version is still up, just in case some of the statements made earlier on this domain can be used in court (e.g. 'all withdrawal requests will be honored', etc.): http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:bitcoinica.com&hl=en&prmd=imvns&strip=1 |
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It has been over 4 months since the SHTF and this has been 'worst case scenario' at every turn. I can honestly say that in the 35 years of my life I have never experienced such a royal mess as this.
Personally I have 23440 USD in my Bitcoinica account (as well as approx 2K BTC). Have received 0 back so far. Even though no USD has ever been stolen from Bitcoinica (The 40K USD has been returned by Chen) and my claim has been confirmed accurate 3 times. It is aggravating to see the Intersango guys not cooperating and forcing liquidation through high-court instead of voluntary.
They don't seem to care because it is not their money on the line. But the way I see it is they are taking money that could have been returned to creditors and handing it over to lawyers instead who charge 200 USD per hour. To me this is practically the same as stealing. Get your act together guys!
I asked Donald to sign the letter over IM. Instead, he accused me of having 'mental problems' and that he would not sign anything from a sociopath and proven liar because 'this shit runs way deeper' but he does not want to fight the 'FUD' or do anything immoral or illegal. He has now blocked me from contacting him again. If Donald agrees I would be happy to share the full chat logs of my communication with him here so the community can decide who has mental problems themselves.
It is good to see Patrick is at least supporting voluntary liquidation, however he should have gotten legal advice months ago. Amir better make up his mind and stop hiding behind the others. As an idealist/activist with strong opinions on what is wrong and what is right I think his behavior in this case is highly hypocritical. After WWII ended there were also a lot of people that said 'they were just following orders'. Please think for yourself and act accordingly.
That said, I don't hold any personal grudges against any of the Bitcoinica crew. (Except perhaps Zhou if it turns out he robbed his baby after selling it while deceiving the general public because his aim in life is to become a millionaire by the age of 21). In retrospect, clearly none of them should have been running a financial service such as Bitcoinica. Amir has been doing a great job with the Bitcoin conference and I respect him for that. (And looking forward to watching the talks online!)
Please sign the letter. If you don't like it because it comes from Tihan - draft your own and have Tihan sign it. Just don't stick your head in the sand and let those that trusted you suffer. Thank you.
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+1
Donald, Amir, Patrick, Please don't bankroll your internal feud with the captive funds of Bitcoinica customers.
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Lawrence Lessig
Niall Ferguson
Eric Schmidt
Elon Musk
Hugh Hendry
Nigel Farage
Steve Wozniak
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