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and finally, someone has cracked out their new secret rocket. i was beginning to think that the worlds stockpile of secret rockets was depleting.
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"If you are doing this triangular arbitrage how will you protect against slippage in the fiat currency exchange rate?"
We will not protect against slippage other than be relatively balanced in what we hold. Yen goes down dollars go up a small amount. The difference will be not noticeable.
If we do 2000 trades a day and make 50 cents a trade the 5$ we might lose in the currency slippage for the day wont really matter all that much.
This system is not perfectly efficient but it will be more efficient than what is in the wild now if funded fully.
Do you have your bot hooked into fiat trading exchanges so you can exchange USD for EUR or RMB, ect? At this time no. We can do this work by hand. No need to risk safety for speed in this case. OK. Triangular arbitration has a lot of potential with bitcoin. Looking at exchanges that are denominated in the minor and exotic currencies shows that there is a lot of inefficiency in those markets. The problem is the volume. Since you will be exchanging fiat currencies by hand I assume you will not be doing triangular arbitrage as all three currency exchanges need to occur simultaneously or else you have a risk of price change. It seems like you will be sticking with two-currency arbitrage and taking advantage of inefficiencies between bitcoin exchanges. For more information on three or multi currency arbitrage you can read this pdf on the subject. A way to hook in a bot is to use Interactive Brokers. I unfortunately do not have the capital to open up an account with them, but their API is really nice. stochastic, do you know of any other brokers who offer API's besides IB? I've been looking for a while but without much luck. Hope it goes well for you goat. A more efficient market created by arbitrage means spreads and price differences across brokers should reduce. |
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Anybody on here also members of Overclockers.com or [H]? Do they have Bitcoin subforums yet? Those guys are big fans of crunching projects so it'd be good to have them on board.
overclockers.com hates bitcoin. Why? Its been a while since I was active on there. |
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Anybody on here also members of Overclockers.com or [H]? Do they have Bitcoin subforums yet? Those guys are big fans of crunching projects so it'd be good to have them on board.
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I read this today on TechCrunch which also mentions bitcoin in passing.
... its totally opposite to bitcoin though, its not a currency, its not decentralized and its not anonymous.
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Hey stochastic, I was pointed this way from this post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=74384.20;topicseenI've written a handful of basic trading bots in PHP and am interested in learning something new that'll let me perform some kind of statistical analysis based upon the usual technical indicators. Sorry if this is a little off topic to your OP but as you seem to know, can you give us your two cents on R and how it compares to the other languages? Also is R powerful enough to automatically place trades or can it interface with some existing classes I have written in PHP to place the trades for me?*edit* I had a look at your code in GIT and it does place trades... ... I'm just trying to get an idea of the language as a whole as I have the intention to invest a serious amount of time and effort into developing a new trading bot. I want to pick the right language to learn from the start. |
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signed up and commented - did anyone else?  Looks like bitcoin is gonna gain a lot more momentum soon with all these mentions. +1 for the cause! |
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A few questions:
How much are you investing into this project?
Whats in it for you, personally?
Our current capital base is $23,000. BitAvenue has been number crunching and we believe it can cover the costs of building the website, our own mining Pool (My favourite part) paying for hosting costs, and doing some moderate advertising. We will also be accepting donations once our site is up and running. Personally, I have the satisfaction that I have created something useful. To some it sounds cliché, but our goal is to have people look at BitAvenue and develop a positive association towards it as many people do towards non-profit organizations. We aim to expand the userbase of Bitcoin. Mt. Gox and Intersango are not ideal in terms of 'user-friendliness'. 1) They charge fees 2) They are not completely transparent 3) They require verification of identity for certain transactions Fair play. I hope it works out, more brokers is never a bad thing, it'll help increase the bitcoin userbase and ultimately, liquidity. |
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Apologies for raising this thread from the dead. Can someone PM me the details for contacting ASIC (email addy?) in reference to a similar query I have. This time its the broker WorldBitcoinExchange, based and registered in Australia.
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Sorry for doubting you, but I recommend you look into it a lot more seriously. The last thing we need is another exchange set up who will go bust. Read up about chargebacks and the relevant bank accounts required. You will notice that their services for what you want to provide for your clients will not come cheap, or easily. Most of the exchanges that have gone bust, have done so because of chargebacks. This is one of the main reasons for brokers requiring verification.
Also, if you do get short-changed. Who will pay the price if you do not collect any fees? What if your BTC float (or worse, your offline wallet) is compromised, who will pay the price for that?
Most of us who have thought about setting up our own exchange have weighed the pro's and con's. Even with a 0.65% charge on each trade, the profit you will get on a moderate trade volume will not justify the effort required and the costs incurred.
A few questions:
How much are you investing into this project?
Whats in it for you, personally?
And a pointer: Intersango's code is open source, it contains a very powerful and capable trading engine which supports multiple currencys. If you are serious about this then you should consider using it.
(on a side note, you have a typo: you put down GBD as a supported currency)
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Are there any open source classes where you could add a data feed and it will spit out calcs on various technical indicators? The charting functions on Bitcoincharts is similar to what I'm after but I want to be able to programatically receive the chart outputs. The website says the charts are under creative commons licence, where can I find the source code? R has plenty, and writing a script to plot them all is quite easy. You just have to have the data from mtgox, and you can quickly split it into hi-lo-close and then have functions operate on the data. You want library(xts),library(quantmod) and library(TTR). TTR has about 35 or 40 technical trading rules, for example easy to vary SMA/EMA. Then if you want to do bootstrapping you can use (backtesting with variation) you can use library(quantstrat) (i think, this is all from memory). All of these can be applied within rgp to give you huge flexibility when it comes to evolving GAs. If you do bootstrapping right, you don't have problems with overfitting. Thanks organofcorti, I'm reading up about it now. I've been programming for a little while but have never heard of R, even for statistical analysis. How come it isnt more mainstream? I've heard of languages such as K and Q which seems to be used fairly widely for banks processing tick by tick data however trading strategies tend to be predominantly done in C. Do you have an overview of the pros/cons of R, and how it compares to the others. I wanna get a bit more of an idea what the language is like before investing serious time into learning it. Can it interface easily with PHP and/or the existing API's to automatically place trades? |
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I used to do this regularly...
Is that something you no longer do because there isn't much price delta between those exchanges and thus not as profitable to arbitrage anymore? There is a delta Stephen... and it is worthwhile, I no longer do it for various reasons, some technical and some personal: From a technical perspective - Profits only tend to be one way, eg converting USD -> GBP (check the currency pair yourself). If thats all you want to do then great
- Following on from the point above. To successfully make money from arbitrage you have to convert the GBP back into USD usually through the Fiat money markets. The difference in the BTC conversion exchange rate and the FIAT market exchange rate will be your profit.
- ...continuing from the point above. To initiate the trade involves a fairly complex process of placing the USD->BTC buy, placing the BTC->GBP sell and placing the opposing fiat GBP->USD arbitrage trade in the fiat market.
- on the plus side, if you're technically capable of handling the above, then I regularly saw 5% profit margins per trade (and still do)
Personally - One of the currencies I bought was AUD. Recently the broker I used to sell BTC for AUD got scammed and has shut down (WorldBitcoinExchange) taking with it some of my money
- I have a full time job and as much as I'd love carry on running forex arbitrage through bitcoin, I can't. I was 1/2 way towards implementing an automated system to do this but it isn't an easy or simple task.
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Are there any open source classes where you could add a data feed and it will spit out calcs on various technical indicators? The charting functions on Bitcoincharts is similar to what I'm after but I want to be able to programatically receive the chart outputs. The website says the charts are under creative commons licence, where can I find the source code? |
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Its been a while since I used irc. I think its time to get it running again, I'll be with you shortly. Whats the best client these days? It used to be mIRC.
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Trading activity on gox increased last night although its hard to say whether it was just down to being a weekend. Maybe we'll see a little more action this week.
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Great article...
Two questions:
1. Whos Naomi O'Leary?
2. "Zhou Tong, who is professionally advised by a forex trader and the head of a Singapore-based algorithmic trading firm, now lends his name to international slang."
Who is this head of Singapore-based algo trading firm or what is the firm?
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I know it's theoretically possible to do international money transfers with Bitcoin cheaper and faster by buying bitcoins locally, sending them and then cashing them out locally, avoiding the hassles of direct international money transfer, but has anyone managed to actually do this and save money?
I used to do this regularly... and as a means of making money. Essentially by doing what you've explained (and taking all costs into consideration) you can regularly transfer money in a very cheap way, a lot of times free... and occasionally in your favour. I had various scripts to monitor BTC prices within multiple exchanges, with some quick (fee adjusted) excel calcs you will notice that very frequently the exchange rate through BTC will beat the Forex rate. Place the right trades simultaneously and you'll have yourself a successful deal. Make sure you have BTC and Fiat in both brokers to ensure you don't have to wait for any money/btc transfers to happen to take advantage of a good rate. |
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My bot loves sideways! > 1% in less than a week makes me happy  Your bot sounds pretty interesting. He doesn't brag too loud, but sounds successful. I'd love to have a bitcoinica bot. He's successful when we go sideways. He could be successful on bigger moves too if I had more funds, but if he runs out of funds in one direction he's not so happy. Is your bot the one placing small but frequent trades of around 0.02btc? I've noticed one bot do this in what looks like a grid trading strategy. |
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Excellent post. I love the detail you put into it: the five exclamation marks clearly represent the price point we will reach soon Subtle and eloquent. The body of the post was an excellent satire of Speculation forum posts, and, surprisingly, makes a very deep point about life (I'll leave that to other readers to figure out). Sounds like a N. Korean praising Dear Leader Kim's farting sound. A very inspirational avatar btw. Where are the secret rockets? I'm surprised nobody has cracked them out lately. |
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Finally i got myself in this mess and thank you for offering to bailing me out,(I am no bank and thats exactly who got me into this mess) but id like to fix this myself it's how i work, mate i don't know where exactly you are digging this crap up!!!!!.... but please do some research before you decide to defame my already depleted reputation. Andre, I understand your predicament and am sorry you got scammed, however this doesn't detract from the fact that you have your clients money. You have the responsibility to pay it back regardless of the mess you're in. The whole situation is bad, everybody will agree. But it will get worse and you have authority to change this by simply arranging to pay back the disgruntled clients that you can for now, and assuring others that they will get their money back in due course. Many of us now have no further option the longer you make us wait then to raise lengthy and expensive legal action. The choice is yours. In the mean time I will be seeking legal advice. |
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