@TanteStefana2
Regarding deflation; it is not the threat to DRK that it is to fiat for at least two reasons. First, the primary danger of deflation to a debt based economy is the aforementioned "pushing a rope" scenario. If your primary means of manipulating the economy is interest rates, you lose your ability to do so when rates reach zero, and have to resort to some form of "negative interest" such as QE. As deflation leads to an increase in the value of a currency (purchasing goods requires less currency) People hoard the currency knowing every delay will result in more purchasing power, and the economy stalls as sales slow. At the same time, borrowing slows as people must pay back loans with increasingly valuable currency, while the urgency to purchase is reduced by the knowledge that prices will go down. Since the interest to pay back loans was not created at the point of loan origination, the failure to loan more money into circulation guarantees an increase in defaults on loans which cascade through the system, ultimately destroying the system in any one of a number of possible end-game scenarios.
Since new DRK are not borrowed into existence and there is an expectation of greater demand for the utility of DRK; there are no significant loans denominated in DRK whose default could wreak havoc on the DRK economy. Add to this the fact that there is currently not much DRK denominated economy at all, and the risk is non-existent. In point of fact, the "hoarding" of DRK caused by MN formation has an effect somewhat akin to that of deflation, in that the reduction in available supply supports the value of DRK by limiting the pool available to meet demand.
The second risk of deflation in a debt based economy is that there is simply not enough currency to meet the needs of the economy, which results in starvation due to lack of monetary units. (Think the great depression.) In this regard we are in new theoretical territory, but I suspect that the infinintly divisible nature of DRK combined with its true fungibility, and ease of transport/distribution, will render such negative effects as at most, trivial.
As Oblox observed, in an absolute sense DRK might be considered as slightly inflationary during the current "mining phase." But it seems likely that continued upward pressure due to demand for MNs as well as growing utilitarian demand for DRK in commerce will greatly overcompensate the slight value reducing effect of the new coins.
Ultimately, the effect of deflation is to increase the value of monetary units relative to things exchanged for them, be they FERNs, BTCs, Au, Ag, bread, bullets, or whiskey. This is the precisely what we desire and expect in the case of DRK. It is not to be feared, but rather cheered.
I hope that makes some sense.
Peace...
Thank you for that, and I do understand what you're saying, but I'm having trouble with one aspect of cryptos and their deflationary character. If you borrow coins, like you said, the amount you have to pay back could be insurmountable, leading to people unable to borrow funds to start businesses and such. Or do I understand this incorrectly? I suspect the world will be run in a bizarre new way that I have trouble comprehending. I know greater minds have worked this out, and I've read some of the arguments that deflation is not a bad thing, but it's not sticking, yet, LOL. How would people in a crypto world fund start ups, buy homes, etc...? How would such things work? Tante, thanks for asking all these questions as it's facilitating many interesting points being discussed (and thanks Toknormal, Minotaur26 & Strix for your great explanations) In regards to borrowing coins, I think this aspect you don't understand re "the amount you have to pay back could be insurmountable, leading to people unable to borrow funds to start businesses and such" is true if the crypto coin appreciates greatly in value against another currency that it has to be converted into and this secondary currency is the main unit used for acquisition of the goods and services one needs. So, for example, we all expect DRK to appreciate dramatically against BTC and the USD. If you took out a loan in DRK, converted it to USD and then two years later had to pay the DRK back (so you had to then get USD and convert it back to DRK), yes you're likely to be seriously disadvantaged and find you have to payback way way more USD than you originally received when you converted your borrowed DRK. But, think about if things are far more progressed along in terms of adoption and you can buy many goods and services in DRK, then it's a different situation altogether because if you don't convert your borrowed DRK into anything else, but just keep it as DRK to use, then provided you're making money within the DRK economy (i.e. spending DRK, getting paid in DRK) any loan will only be subject to whatever interest you agreed on under the terms and what you pay back will just be the original DRK (principal) plus interest. The DRK may have appreciated enormously against BTC and/or the USD but it doesn't matter if you've kept your loan funds in DRK all along. It's very hard to think of these crypto currencies without constantly measuring them back against the reserve currency, but at some stage a tipping point will be arrived at where we're able to live and function without constant reference back to the USD (or AUD in my case) because the crypto we use has become "real" money. Till that point though, taking out loans in crypto and converting the funds to something else has considerable risk (in the same way as taking out a loan in a foreign currency carries considerable risk that your home currency might be devalued and because you've borrowed in the foreign currency you end up owing far more). |
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I don't think a few people saying publicly that they're all going to buy some DRK on a certain day really constitutes 'market rigging.'
It's a gesture of support, not an attempt to hoodwink or swindle anyone.
Okay, yes I understand what you're saying. Supporting DRK though suggesting everyone buy rather than sell is fine. But I think there are enough people on this thread openly suggesting "a bit of collusion isn't such a bad thing" to warrant raising greater awareness that this type of activity often backfires very badly and IMO should be discouraged. We should have a day where everyone goes into Cryptsy/Bitfinex/etc and doubles their sell orders price. Would that even work?  It's a pretty interesting thought experiment. yes! there's nothing wrong with some voluntary collusion to raise the price, that's fair to do and I like the idea. how about announcing a "suggested price" of 0.02 BTC, or $5.70? that would put Darkcoin ahead of Dogecoin, where it belongs. and it might get us some useful attention. value is whatever we decide it is, and DRK is obviously undervalued. those of us sellers who need the short-term $ and are regularly selling for below what we think our Darkcoins are worth should encourage each other to force the price up to a higher level, which will end up getting us paid more for our coins. how about it? -onetime Yes it is important. You guys are talking about collusion, price rigging, and market manipulation. Besides that this a silly idea that will never work, it is probably illegal and will only end badly with innocent people losing money. Anyways, I think it was started as a joke and should have never been taken seriously. DRK stands on its own merits in a free market. The end. I disagree. it's not illegal or wrong to voluntarily collude. DRK owners can sell or not sell at whatever price they want, and if buyers want DRK, they must pay the price a seller is willing to sell at. it's supply and demand, the market is free and fair. imo, voluntary collusion is fair game. -onetime I'm with KryptoFoo, this is not a good idea. Investors reading this thread will not take well to this kind of thing in the community. Please end this planning, now. This community is highly regarded, and I promote that fact all the time. Don't ruin our reputation, just have patience. DRK will rise organically over time with more merchant and customer adoption... All of this. Investors........ as well as every troll in Mordor that will have a field day.  ruin our reputation? because some people agree with each other (just take each other's advice) not to sell their Darkcoins at an undervalued price? that's ridiculous. this strategy is fair game and won't tarnish Darkcoin's reputation at all. if it succeeds? great! if it fails? oh well, no change. investors are anonymous buyers and sellers in a market, and they can base their decisions on whatever they want. intelligent people will make their valuations on Darkcoin's real value, which we know is great. if you want to discourage collusion, you're trying to regulate this free market. who are you to prohibit communicating or advising people? imho, it's you who want to force (non-voluntarily) a certain price. -onetime We all want the price of DRK to rise but it must happen naturally and without any sort of manipulation from the community. Then new people can confidently invest in DRK without worrying that something's being organised that could result in P&Ds. |
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We would hardly be demonstrating impeccable integrity would we?
I always like to ask..... WWED?
We'd neither be demonstrating "impeccable" integrity, mid range "sort-of" integrity or entry level "I-don't-really-understand-what-integrity-is" integrity. The word "integrity" simply cannot be used in relation to anything where people band together in collusion to organise coordinated price rigging. I'm a bit astounded that so many people think this is an entirely appropriate thing to do! So we have Darkcoin's birthday coming up and we're going to "celebrate" it by creating a false manipulation of Darkcoin's price by openly agreeing to all taking trading actions at the same time. Are you guys on drugs!!! There's a reason why people who do this in relation to publicly traded securities are breaking the law; it creates false market conditions that badly affect investors who are not in the know on what's occurring and creates enormous ill will when someone's come off second best because they weren't across the plan. Regardless of the fact that this is being discussed on an open and public forum like this, it's a very poor idea that's terribly lacking in fundamental fairness, decency and integrity. The price of DRK will go up when more people outside of the existing investors and supporters become aware of DRK's benefit's and its huge potential for growth. There's great work going on here by many committed people to get that message out. That's what we need to be focussing on; not a coordinated attempt to pump the price. |
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Thanks to everyone who supported me and Darkcoin! It's a great honor to receive an award like this for the work I've been doing, it really means a lot that all of my effort slaving away on this hasn't been wasted. Also thanks to all of you who are helping Darkcoin behind the scenes to become something greater, we couldn't have done it without you. I'd like to add my congratulations too Evan. Probably one of the fundamental attributes of Darkcoin that's been so assuring and confidence-building is your level headed commitment to an orderly representation of what you're thinking on DRK is, what you're planning for the tech's roadmap and what you know can actually be achieved. It's a stark contrast against so many other altcoins where the hype and hubris is all consuming and whips so many people up only to result in a disastrous collapse (there are too many to mention; most of us know some examples). I really appreciate this aspect of your nature and approach. Software development and IT projects are notorious for failing to deliver on expectations and documented features/capabilities. But you and the Darkcoin team have consistently set appropriate and achievable goals then followed through with delivery. That's what's brought such good people into the fold and facilitated the loyalty so many here demonstrate. I found out about DRK through the BTC-e troll-box (of all places....they use to call it Dork....jealousy I guess!) and although I bought in at levels far above where we're at, I've seen evidence all the way along that DRK has a very good chance of succeeding and making an enormous difference. |
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v11 works on mainnet and if you want to help testing, you could run it too. Just make sure you compile from source and run it in a debugger. (The protocol is backwards compatible so separate releases can survive side-by-side together) Of course, Evan knows the true risks. I can't say I agree with it though. It's essentially zero risk. Fair enough Ed. Apologies for sounding terse and assuming it was testing by devs. Obviously you can't stop people using test releases on main net if they want to. I work in environments with full on release management and obviously not the freedom of open source so tend to be on a hair trigger with this kind of thing! Same here! On most projects I work on if code was introduced into a production environment prior to its passing through formal SIT (systems integration testing) and UAT (user acceptance testing) there'd be a big red flag go up and a rollback would have to be instigated to maintain various certification levels. All very serious by comparison. Once DRK's beyond this beta stage and a 1.x system I'd expect something pretty similar. |
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impossible. I`ve seen that, probably monitoring have some issue. There are dozens of them appearing now. Are the monitoring daemons on Elbereth's site somehow picking this version number up incorrectly from the 10.17.26 code?  |
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Dont have access to my cold wallets today. Do we need to 'masternode start' for v.26 ?
No, I don't believe so. I just did the update on my VPS without needing to do a masternode restart in the wallet. Grep shows all working fine. |
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Thanks for rectifying this syncing issue Evan. Is this new version 10.17.25 or 10.17.26? I don't understand the two numbers mixed. Getinfo on the MN reports 10.17.25, as does the new wallet so how does .26 come into the picture? |
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My remote masternodes have become "unstable" lately, they randomly stop syncing the blockchain for some unknown reason. Recently all of them stopped updating, at the same block number. I have had to restart them repeatedly and sometimes that doesn't seem to work so I create a new wallet.dat and delete peers.dat on the remote server and that seems to fix it, at least for a while. Anyone else seeing similar?
Your post prompted me to login to my VPS and check (which I do every so often but hadn't for a few days). My MN was stuck on block 199711 whereas the current block (at the same moment) was 200686. I've never had this happen before. I do often though experience the v0.10.17.24-gee8174a-beta wallet hanging at a block during a network catch-up when the wallet's not been running for a while (on Win 8.1). I sometimes have to restart it a couple of times before it successfully catches up to the current block. I've stopped darkcoind and restarted it on the VPS. It seems to have caught up okay now. Will monitor. |
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After the halving Potcoin is up 250% hit a high on 700 with over 14k in trading in 24 hours and we are above CannabisCoin on coinmarketcap!
https://i.imgur.com/W7FwtvI.png You're kidding yourself if you think this is some sort of "news" to crow about (and frankly I'm embarrassed for you to be quoting such naive price stats that are only a flash-in-the-pan irregularity). As per versperwillow's detailed "let's actually look at the reality of Potcoin" post, this is but a burst of speculative activity, nothing that gives any long-term credibility to being in Potcoin. For anyone that's been around for a while and realised this thing's going nowhere fast, this sudden increase in price has been an opportunity to exit without too much loss. |
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saw this over on the Wall Observer thread, if true could be big news for darkcoin: https://twitter.com/AdamGuerbuez/status/553032557290586113 This is big news for DRK. The other news worth keeping an eye on is the USA showing signs of allowing sports betting online. Would be interested to see how the special interest groups (mainly casino operators) in the usa will be appeased.
Him:
@TaoOfSatoshi this is not an free advertise your alt coin post
Me:
@AdamGuerbuez You seem a nice guy, and a fellow Canadian! I will ask you, what does #Bitcoin have over #Darkcoin, other than network effect?
@AdamGuerbuez I contend that #Darkcoin, with it's superior technology and committed development team, will be a future rival to #Bitcoin.
@AdamGuerbuez Research the tech that they are working on, and I'm sure you will agree...
darkcointalk.org/threads/paper-…
or
darkcointalk.org/threads/featur…Lulz... EDIT: It gets even better! He blocked me! Sensitive much? Good work you got some mention of Darkcoin in front of him Tao. I wouldn't be too worried though. Just looking at his Twitter profile and reading through some of his tweets he appears to have a persona that's a mix of Kim Dotcom, Howard Stern and Cartman. |
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Has something happened to DRK on Cryptsy? There hasn't been a trade for 15 min and it's been almost completely flat for more than 2 hours now  Edit: a small one just happened in past minute but price still hasn't moved much for hours. Calm before storm or (US time) Monday morning blues? |
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Well there you go; someone just bought 1000 DRK on Cryptsy with more than half of it at 0.0061. Might be the first sign of it lifting away from the bottom? (or it could mean absolutely nothing whatsoever.....take your pick)  |
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Some reasonable green candles appearing on BTC-e. Maybe now the Bitstamp hack is well and truly out in the open and has been quantified, the BTC price will start recovering somewhat. Expect DRK will shoot up a bit now too.  |
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Potcoin algorithym was changed in June 2014 because it was giving crazy block reward if you considered the value of the coin. This is why it had more than 12 GH directed to mining and dumping potcoin. At the time, I could get more than 1.000 potcoins per day with only 10 mhs of scrypt power, that was a lot of money considering bitcoin was around 600 bucks.
Now, its hardly profitable to mine potcoin, with the same 10mhs you will be getting like 25 potcoins per day, I know because I still mine it, its unprofitable so I think the supply will be cut now and it wasnt cut then because even with the halving mining and dumping was still crazy profitable!
This of course, are only my 2 cents. I reckon demmand could still not be enough and the halving may only slow down the decrease in price, however the block halving its a factor that does help the price increase.
And yes, you are right, you still cant buy cannabis with potcoins, but with what coin can you buy it?.. 1 dispensary that accepts cannacoin that I know of. The weed industry is still young, its still not completly legal in all States. It will take time and patiente for weed coins to be where they deserve to be. Currently you can buy seeds (and lighthers too if you want) in a lot of places with potcoin and that is a big win if you consider the coin is not even 1 year old.
Hold your coins and expect an increase in price and acceptance or sell now for 8 times less your money, thats your choice.
hcf27, within the context of all you've highlighted here, what are the ramifications for continued performance of POT's blockchain? If it's so unprofitable to mine, will the corresponding reduction in difficulty be commensurate with improving returns to see enough miners maintain the network? Or is there are real possibility the network could start failing because there's just not enough miners? I'm a long term holder of POT and believe the dev team has been honest and reasonably committed, however I take all your points seriously versperwillow and see you're highlighting the major stumbling block of this thing being relevant, let alone successful. |
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Original post has been deleted. Looks like HammerStillHere is really HammerGone. How someone can post "Double your coin in 100 hours! Guaranteed!" in an intelligent community forum like this and expect anything other than being told they're a scammer is beyond me. |
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It's interesting that LTC seems to have stabilised around the 0.0076 to 77 mark for the past 10 or so hours while BTC has continued to drop. Probably doesn't mean too much and it could drop off the cliff any moment is a sudden "catch up" (or down) to BTC. But one wonders what sort of trading scenarios are playing out within the LTC world that cause a temporary reprieve like that.
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Anonymous and untraceable transactions are already being implemented by Bitcoin (like Coin Scrambler). So, are there any reason to still invest in Darkcoin? Why shouldn't I sell all my Darkcoins for Bitcoins now?
Here are a few reasons I posted a while ago... 1) Unlike Bitcoin, Darkcoin transactions are anonymous/private (off block-chain anonymity and quantum computing proof) 2) Darkcoins anonymity feature "DarkSend" has been carefully designed to ensure user’s anonymity isn't uncovered through known attack vectors. This cannot be said for other on block-chain anonymous coins 3) Darksend is far more advanced than the CoinJoin system it was originally based on. Mixing coins through Darksend is Safe, Secure, Decentralised and nobody can steal your money because the coins never leave their wallet. 4) Darkcoin Transaction Confirmations Are Lightening Fast* (20 - 30 seconds instead of Bitcoins 60 minutes) 5) Merchants don't have to worry about the double spend 0 confirmation risk that Bitcoin has* 6) Darkcoins are secure at the Protocol level**. This means even if somebody steals your wallet or your private keys, they still can't access your money. 7) Expansion proof... Unlike Bitcoin, Darkcoin's development and innovation won't slow down as the network grows due to the fear of the network failing. Darkcoin's revolutionary SPORK upgrade process ensures any problems can be quickly and safely fixed no matter how big the network gets.  Dual Network Protection - The masternode network enables the developers to innovate without fear as the standard network is always there to fall back on should the masternode network fail (which is unlikely) 9) Dual Network Protection - Should the Masternode network ever fail (even for a few minutes) transactions will still go through and they will still be anonymous because the coins will already have been through the Darksend process. 10) The X11 algorithm ensures Darkcoins miners are more environmentally friendly than Bitcoin miners. 11) The Dark gravity Wave difficulty Algorithm ensures mining is always fair 12) The Darkcoin Network Provides 2 forms of income generation - Mining and Masternode Hosting. You can invest and gain interest from the network while at the same time making the network stronger. 13) Because Darkcoin is based on the Bitcoin code and uses the same API it will be very easy for merchants that are currently accepting Bitcoin to also accept Darkcoin. 14) The Darkcoin team is growing weekly. Highly Skilled Developers, Security Experts and Economic Experts are giving up their spare time to be part of a project that will truly change the financial landscape 15) Darkcoin is the eCash people have been dreaming of for decades and it takes cryptocurrencies to the next level 16) Darkcoin has massive potential for innovation. We have only taken the first steps! 17) If you Wish you had invested in Bitcoin when it was worth $2.50, take a look at Darkcoin, It's what Bitcoin was supposed to be! * When InstantX is released (estimated January/February 2015) ** When Protocol level 2-Factor Authentication is released (estimated March/April 2015) That's a brilliant and very well considered list dazbarlby. Thanks for taking the time to prepare it and ensure accuracy via the footer notes on InstantX and the plan for 2FA. Great work! |
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Happy New Year DRKers! We're now in 2015 down here in Sydney (and we just had the most awesome fireworks display over Sydney Harbour to welcome it in). May the year bring much that's good and useful. The very best to you all.
Edit: added a couple of pictures
I'm just arriving at work (9AM) where I'm and you are already in 2015... So you are in the future : can you told them how DRK is in 2015?? Happy new year to Evan, Dev Team, foundation team, MN owner, all Darkcoiners, and all future Darkcoiners... DRK's looking very promising from over on this side of the 2015 fence. Yes it's lighting up and shining its "Dark"ness all around. can't wait to see what sort of amazing things happen this year. Have a great night all you folk still coming across into the new year. |
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