it seems that all the chinese exchangers will be closed for a while. it's a normal decision because they made so many illegalities (willy bot, market manipulation and so on).  http://m.finance.caixin.com/m/2017-09-08/101142797.htmlThat means Okcoin, BTC china, Huobi and many others will be closed. "the plague" begins to be cleaned  Caixin was the first one to report on the ICO ban before the official documents came out so, they should be credible This is FUD. There is no proof of this anywhere; the entire article is conjecture! And look at Okcoin or Huobi's ticker -- or any of the Chinese exchanges. Everywhere you look, it's business as usual. I think Caixin really screwed up here. Either that, or this was a planted story like the "China bans BTC" stories from a few years ago, which rocked the markets at the time. |
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Before the raid, I sent some money from coinbase to BTC-e. They asked if the money was going to another exchange and which one. I did not lie and told them the money was going to BTC-e. This information is obviously now in the hands of the Feds or soon will be. No, it won't be. Sending funds to BTC-e wasn't illegal. Coinbase has no legal requirement to inform the feds. And they have shown that they care about customer privacy. My question is this: How fucked am I for using an unlicensed exchange? I didn't even know it was illegal to US customers to use BTC-e. Not fucked at all. It's not illegal. It was illegal for them to serve you as a customer with inadequate AML/KYC and without money transmitting licenses. I have significant holdings of cryptocurrency that I will be cashing out at some point in the future. Is all of my money now guilty of a crime and therefore subject to civil asset forfeiture laws? I have no desire to launder the money or break any additional laws, I intend to pay my taxes at the end of the year. If I even have to pay a fine for using BTC-e I'd have no problem with that. But my real fear is that one day I wake up and my bank account is frozen and I am facing federal indictment for my ignorant mistake... What can I do to get right with the law and keep my hard earned fortune?
edit/follow-up question: Was it even illegal for me to use BTC-e? Or was it only illegal for BTC-e to serve me?
Stop freaking out. You're all good! If you have funds on BTC-e (or will have funds on the new site), just be very careful about not sending those coins directly back to a licensed exchange like Coinbase. Those coins could be subject to civil asset forfeiture. Get some clean coins through another exchange/service first. |
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I remain hopeful regarding the relaunch, and it seems that at least those that stay might recover more than 55%. But I still don't see how this new exchange will be viable. They have clear affiliation with an indicted exchange. How can their fiat processing be reliable? What if their coins are blacklisted at other exchanges? Might they just get seized again?
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So as an US resident, I understand that we can't send them FIAT. However, can we still send/withdraw in a form of BTC?
Seems like you answered your own question there already...  As Serpens stated, I kinda felt like they don't want us in any form. It seems like they are discontinuing services to their existing U.S customers. Anyone asked this to bitfinex by any chance? well it's pretty obvious why. Nobody wants to have feds on their toes. Better to get rid of minority of the users and serve rest of the planet than be seized by global policeman as btc-e was. I simply agree with that But, on the other hand, Btc-e had started payouts two days ago, and some folks confirmed that they have already received 55% of their of funds in crypto to their wallets (I mean those who decided to call it a day). The rest are given Btc-e tokens (just like Bitfinex did a year ago) for the remaining 45% of their total amount, and it looks like the exchange is going to resume its operation pretty soon despite all the efforts of the FBI and FinCEN. I guess it will be an interesting drama to see the FBI falling flat on their face. As they say, show must go on! It's definitely embarrassing for the Feds, we can see that much. Just the fact that they are doing 55% refunds currently is a huge blow to the image of US law enforcement. Relaunching the exchange will be that much more embarrassing. But that will also up the ante for the Feds. Give it 1-2 years of investigations, and they will bring the new exchange down much harder than before. So, hopefully, people get most of their money paid back and can reduce their holdings on the exchange by then. |
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So as an US resident, I understand that we can't send them FIAT. However, can we still send/withdraw in a form of BTC?
Seems like you answered your own question there already... As Serpens stated, I kinda felt like they don't want us in any form. It seems like they are discontinuing services to their existing U.S customers. Anyone asked this to bitfinex by any chance? well it's pretty obvious why. Nobody wants to have feds on their toes. Better to get rid of minority of the users and serve rest of the planet than be seized by global policeman as btc-e was. Indeed but it's too little too late. They've been an unlicensed MSB for 4 years now in the states, including offering fiat markets and fiat deposit/withdrawal. Plus, the BFX token thing was definitely issuing unregistered securities. They can't erase all that just by pulling out of the market now. The Feds are probably investigating them as we speak. |
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So as an US resident, I understand that we can't send them FIAT. However, can we still send/withdraw in a form of BTC?
Seems like you answered your own question there already... As Serpens stated, I kinda felt like they don't want us in any form. It seems like they are discontinuing services to their existing U.S customers. Anyone asked this to bitfinex by any chance? You might be able to make an account, but it will be closed in the next couple months. Just use a non-US VPN. It's not like they have fiat capabilities anyway. Just deposit/withdraw crypto and act like an unverified non-US customer. |
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I assume fiat balances will be converted to coin on 15th?
If the value of coin is higher on 15th than now the conversion will result in less coin.
This should be compensated by the increase in the 55% that they intimated, but it all seems a bit vague.
Currently for those optiong for a refund timing is quite important...
I don't think fiat balances will be converted. I think they plan to offer some limited fiat withdrawal options (even if only cash by courier or something). This is supported by the fact that they are offering USD/USDET markets. That's why staying until the 15th is unattractive for fiat folders. I'm not sure if their USD markets will reflect the real value of USD. |
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Would you think adding a second part with exchanges which only deal with cryptocurrencies would be of benefit?
Definitely. I think as long as the first section is dedicated to BTC/fiat exchanges, then another section with altcoins would be okay. Otherwise it might belong in altcoin service discussions. |
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Interestingly, the refund page for btc-e doesn't seem to work right now. Anyone know what's happening with this?
It shows an error page if you aren't logged in. If you are logged in, it lays out the terms and ask for 3 addresses (BTC, LTC, ETH): This page is made for an immediate return of funds for those who do not want to wait, or do not believe in us.
You can receive 55% of your funds immediately, without verification, provided by your consent to refuse to receive the other 45% of funds.
All funds will be returned in coins only. That is why if you had funds in fiat currencies (USD, RUR, EUR), first they will be converted into USD at the exchange rate of Central Bank of Russian Federation, after that USD will be converted into liquid coins(50% BTC, 25% LTC, 25% ETH) at the exchange rate of other cryptocurrency exchanges and returned to them. I'm still unsure what to do. I wish they would make clear what the terms of verification are on the new site. |
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Isn't btc-e going to release another FAQ regarding verification today so people can make a educated decision to withdraw today or not?
it's already there https://btc-e.nz/refundBeing in the US I opted for the refund. It seemed to be the safest thing to do. Hoping to see something within 72 hours.
Can you guys clarify what the terms are? What does it say when you log in and click the refund tab? I won't be at home for like 8 hours and I just get an error message when I click the refund link while not logged in. Could you copy/paste the terms? We have to wait 72 hours and we will get output based on the current market rates (at withdraw time)? Thanks in advance. |
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I read it if you withdraw the 55%, you accept the 45% as tokens (not you lose it).
Depends on when you withdraw. Tomorrow, on September 2, 2017, it will be possible to withdraw 55% of the funds from the account in koins on the condition that our debt obligations are abandoned to the remaining 45% of funds in the form of tokens. So if you cash out 55% tomorrow, BTC-e are not obliged to give you tokens for the remaining 45%, so you take a 45% hit. Look at it as the "withdrawal fee from hell" for those that are impatient. BTC-e is probably smart to do it this way. It is expected that there will be an exodus. The users that would immediately leave upon relaunch would crash all the markets trying to get BTC out otherwise. Now they can separate exiting users (including most US users), and give them less back. And they will give their "loyal" customers more back, showing goodwill and encouraging them to stay on the new platform. This should bring some stability to their markets upon relaunch. |
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This is a bit weird.
So our options are:
1) Get 55% now and write off anything more as losses
2)Wait for the new site where we will get more than 55% & Tokens for the rest.
This will of course allow them to mass funds from investors that would worry that the new platform is not going to happen.
However if it was a scam plan they would not even return 55%
I have approx. 2 BTC worth of LTC ETH and BTC in btc-e and I think I am going to stay and wait for the new platform.
What do you guys think;
Very interesting development. I'm not sure how I feel about this. On one hand, they repeat themselves about the AML/KYC and licenses etc. for the new exchange. We still don't know the details about verification. So, it sounds like you can write off the 45% loss now and take the 55% withdrawal with no verification. Whether you can exit the new exchange without verification is unclear. On the other hand, you will get more funds returned to your account if you stay and wait, due to the debts being written off. I think, for me, the biggest issue is how balance conversion will happen. Still no news on that. That will affect my decision. |
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Payments sent to those who qualified.
Its likely noone will rank up if member or higher since i only have jr member slots open.
Thanks for managing the campaign so well, yahoo. Since I can't rank up, I plan to find another campaign that's accepting Full Members. It's been a pleasure working with you! |
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1) Feds take fiat from BTC-e
2) Crypto holder have to bail out fiat holders yet again through socialised loss
Couldn't have written in better myself. Fiat is basically gone and crypto holders are basically bailing out fiat holders. I only had crypto there and while it sucks that a good chunk of my crypto is being used to help fiat holders I understand why. You guys are funny. You deposited coins to an exchange. That means they were not your coins. The centralized exchange you trusted lost a shitload of money, and the loss is being transferred to you. It doesn't matter what IOUs your balance showed. I get it, you want more money -- don't we all? Fiat holders wanted to BTC holders to take the full loss on Bitfinex, too, but of course that's not how it went. |
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Personally I say yes as our society becomes increasingly dependent upon technology, digital currency will become a more popular means of paying for different things and it is more effective and instant. I haven't used much physical money in the past 8 years and I rarely had any problems with that. What do you guys think? Do you include digital fiat money (like USD) under digital currencies? Because I do think we are heading towards a cashless society. I very rarely use cash myself. Countries like Sweden have already made quite a lot of progress on that front. But many bitcoiners also believe that BTC and other cryptocurrencies will replace fiat money. I have a hard time believing that. As long as governments exist, they will demand that their fiat money be accepted. |
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Uber just announced that the New CEO of the global ride service is going to be Expedia boss ,Chief Dara Khosrowshahi.
Khosrowshahi is a bitcoin investor and is always very inclined with the Crypto space, he is the CEO of Expedia inc a global travel agency and a hotel booking service.
It's not that simple. Uber is regulated in every jurisdiction where it operates (in some cases very tightly regulated). They can't just offer Bitcoin payments company-wide. If anything, they'll do some small pilot programs in very limited regions, and then roll out it from there. Assuming this is actually in the works, it could take years to fully roll out, and some jurisdictions may never have Bitcoin payments available. |
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Improving my backtesting code, I went on and analyzed some data. They do not offer historical OHLC so the only way is
to plug in their API and build your own bars. You do not have volume information though. Maybe it is because they are a fake
exchange, I do not know.
It's because (as someone mentioned above) it is a bucket shop. There is no real volume taking place; they are not hedging against your position on a real liquidity pool or another exchange. They are just betting that most traders will lose. If they are wrong, then they just steal from the winners. Yesterday I filed a bug report that their server sent a bunch of null characters after a gap, corrupting the time stamp field.
I made some suggestions in the mail and I also demanded that they treat me better, you know the usual stuff (read above).
Guess what they did ? Obviously they revoked my API keys and I get those messages now :
"No JSON object could be decoded"
"You've been blocked from making API requests"
Classic! These guys are a real class act.  !!! UPDATE !!!Actually they waited for me to exit the 0.0300 BTC deficit to remoke API keys. This means I can not make any trade in the webclient either. I can only withdraw what is now left of the balance. Less than half what I put in, not counting hours or worK... Let's record the withdrawal on video now and see how deep evil goes there.  If you can get it out, consider it tuition and move on to a real exchange. I doubt they will just steal your balance openly. They steal a bit more carefully than that. |
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I find it very surprising as well that they are issuing tokens for each individual crypto on the exchange. It just adds so much exchange rate risk for them. I'm really confused on why they don't just convert all crypto debt to USD debt at time-of-disruption exchange rates. They'd be saving money and reducing risk. It's what Bitfinex did, albeit the exchange rates didn't fluctuate as much as in the case of BTC-e.
They most likely think that people will want to trade tokens as if they were different coins. I think this is how it will be. The ratios between coins will reflect the other exchanges, and they believe they will generate decent fees through coin token trading. Also, what happens if they decide to launch without any USD coin pairs for safety?
I sure hope they don't launch USD pairs. From reading the Russian forum, it seems like they had a lot of customers who used them strictly for fiat money (especially using BTC-e codes). It seems that this crowd does not want repayment in crypto. It seems ridiculous...how do they not understand that crypto is their best chance of salvaging funds? Hell, the only reason they could have funds left at all is because of crypto! |
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Forking is same as printing $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
This is what repeated forks (where the network splits and both networks remain viable) will look like to the investing public. Two slightly different cryptocurrencies splitting, then minting coins on both forks at twice the original rate. That looks exactly like money printing. Granted, decentralized currencies don't have the authority of fiat, so the market could kill off unpopular forks. But it's possible that many, many forks resulting in many network splits could survive. And that means a lot more than 21 million "bitcoins" (depending how you choose to define them) in circulation. |
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The fees are not ideal, but to say it will crash is overstating things. You can wait until the network is less busy, which is when transaction fees will go down.
People want to more business to adopt BTC. People wants to buy things on the street with BTC. People wants to BTC to became popular. Easy like a pre-paid or post-paid card, even easier than paper. Do you will pay low fee and wait 8 hs to pay for you meal so you can leave the restaurant? You will check the network to see if it's a good day to eat with BTC? Or you will pay a tax that would be 25% of the total bill? They all looks bad. Paying a restaurant or any merchant for a relatively small amount isn't ideal. It might look bad now, but with payment channels, we won't need to wait for confirmations; payments will be instant. The first step towards getting there (at least regarding a scalable Lightning Network) was fixing transaction malleability with Segwit. Hopefully by the end of the year, we will start seeing LN transactions. |
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