If you go by my 1st logic: Selling accounts SHOULD NOT be permitted. If you sell your account even on other site then also you are held responsible for anything that happens with this account. Lets say if your account is hacked then forum admin can drop an e-mail to your registered e-mail id & inform you to login ASAP and see what's wrong with the account. Similarly if hacker did any scam using your a/c then you should repay for the losses.
So I get a mail, how does that hold me responsible for a scam with the account I just sold off-site? You will have scam accusation thread against YOU. In any case, if you have sold the account then you won't care about what's happening with your account BUT if we had this POLICY that accounts can not be sold then YOU would have been held responsible for this & YOUR account should have been banned. |
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the difference b/w sig spamming & placing referral link as part of OP being considered as spam on this forum
The difference doesn't matters anymore.There are rules and you need to follow them cause you can't change it until you have found a solution where more than half of the community members agree with it and i don't see that happening. Yep, I saw that. Priority of this forum administration is to control spam by implementing as many rules & policies as possible BUT not even try to control scam by implementing any rules or policies. No one is coming up with suggestions, all of them are just opposing whatever has been proposed to control scams here. Funny party: As mentioned by you most of the forum agrees to it. |
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forum spamming by allowing users to post referral link as part of their OP is bigger issue than innocent users who get scammed here & loose their hard earned money.
as soon as you play the sig spam card, its more or less apparent you dont have anything as a rebuttal. im starting to think youre just trolling at this point. well whatever. Please use your eyes & read properly. If you cant understand then it's not my moral responsibility to make you understand the difference b/w sig spamming & placing referral link as part of OP being considered as spam on this forum and you argue with me thinking that you got sound head and using it..such a pity dude... |
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Just ask yourself & analyze the amount of scams happen here which involve newbie dealing with a newbie.
Don't you think if Junior member restriction is applied then scams would reduce?
not necessarily. it might reduce the number of scam attempts, (ex newbie member, first post saying 'my million dollars papal for your btc you send first'), but imo members that would have gotten scammed by a new account will probably have gotten scammed regardless of weather or not the scammer was using a newbie or junior account. worded kinda badly, hope it made sense. -
For me your answers look like as if you have given up and there is no hope to rectify the current situation of this forum.
Shouldn't it be moral responsibility of administration of this forum to control scams here? If not then why do they send note in red for PMs sent by Newbies?
no, you should be able to look out for yourself and identify a scam and avoid it. how many threads involving trades do you think there are on this thread? you cannot leave the active monitoring and judgement of all of those trades to the two admins of the forum. they have better things to do, better admin-y things. its also not the job of the moderators either. their job is to clean up the forum in terms fo moving posts where they belong, banning spammers, deleting off topic stuff, yada yada. these people arent the police and have no obligation to be. -
If you have openly created a thread that you sold your a/c then you should not be held responsible for scams.
If you go by my 1st logic: Selling accounts SHOULD NOT be permitted. If you sell your account even on other site then also you are held responsible for anything that happens with this account. Lets say if your account is hacked then forum admin can drop an e-mail to your registered e-mail id & inform you to login ASAP and see what's wrong with the account. Similarly if hacker did any scam using your a/c then you should repay for the losses.
permitted or not, account trades will happen. its more or less safer for account traders (sellers and buyers likewise) if account trading is allowed and allowed to be taken on the forum. if they were banned, account trades would happen regardless offsite, and multiple problems would arise, not limited to but including repossession scams by the seller, straight up scamming without the presence of escrow, etc. to clarify what i mean by 'repossession scam,' in the event that account trades were forbidden, the forum admins would have no choice but to return the sold (offsite) account to the seller (since account trades are forbidden, the ruling would automatically become 'the account was hacked') potentially abetting the seller in scamming the account buyer out of whatever he paid for the account. Another mexxer-2. Why even have moderators on the forum at all? Don't they have better things in the real life to do ? Illogical arguments at its best given by so called Hero & Legendary members of this forum who think that forum spamming by allowing users to post referral link as part of their OP is bigger issue than innocent users who get scammed here & loose their hard earned money. |
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Accounts can be bought/sold here.
Imagine a situation where xyz sells his account to someone then is it possible to recognize that the person behind the account is real xyz or the one who bought it?
Important point to note here is xyz has got fairly good trust score. So, the new person can even misuse the account.
It depends from the style of writing and from many other thing. But I think that an IP control would be great in way to check some man who has more than one account. They don't have issues with creating multiple accounts on this forum. |
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You missed the point. If account sales are no longer allowed here, it does not mean that accounts are not sold. They will be sold elsewhere, but still used here.
Agreed but then knowingly we are not digging holes for ourselves. Yes, its happening in the dark where its difficult to see. What in your personal opinion is the better way to make this a less prone to scams forum?
One where staff tries the impossible, to prevent all scams or one where each user learns about the way of the scammers and is able to protect themself?
something, something, fish, feed him for a lifetime.
Implement proper & effective rules to access market place rather than implementing worthless rule of not having referral link as part of OP. Staff does not have to do anything if there is a rule to access market place. For Example: Account less than Junior Member & registered for 30 days should not have access to deal. But for a scammer its easy to just farm accounts for 30 days and use them for scams later. They haven an incentive to do this, because they can possible come out ahead, esp. if the majority of users consider Jr. accounts trustworthy. Someone that just wants to make deals might be driven away because they dont bother with the grinding. It would be an automated process and no staff involvement once this feature is coded.
Lets just put the above aside and lets assume somehow account sales do not happen. Do you honestly consider someone trustworthy just because they have been here for 30 days? 60 days? 180 days? 770 days? You should not. You should no one here consider trustworthy because of time. If anything you can trust someone because they have something to lose. E.g. I have 770 days I put into this account to lose. What you cant know is how much in BTC that is worth to me. Some escrows and services have shown they can be trusted with 1000's of BTC. How do you know its them? Verify the PGP signed message they provide. Its more beneficial for them to stay honest than it is to run away with 2-3 btc. For anyone to learn how to protect themselves against scams, it need time. They would learn in the 30 days period that how does scammers work & would become more capable of protecting themselves from scam if the above mentioned rule is implemented.
People dont read stickies, they ask the same questions - answered in those stickies - over and over and over and over again. There are at least 2-3 posts a week that ask how activity works. Do you honestly think you can just make a marketplace sticky and people will be educated? It does not only need time it also needs a strong motivation and the best motivation is: no one can help you if you fuck up. Bitcoin can not be reversed. If you are willing to take the risk to trade it for paypal that can be reversed for 180 days, be aware of the risk. Once the scam happened your coins are gone and there is nothing you can do about it. This is the strongest motivation I can think of for someone to learn and understand how trading with bitcoin works. What exactly do you mean with "responsible"? Lets say I sell my account and it is used to steal 1 BTC from you. What now?
You sell your a/c anywhere other than the forum then it means you no longer want to keep that account and then you should probably create a thread on this forum that you are about to sell your account and you would not be responsible for any deals done after that date. Yes, but you suggested I will be held responsible for the actions of the acount even after I sold it. I ask you how you will be able to make me responsible. Just ask yourself & analyze the amount of scams happen here which involve newbie dealing with a newbie. Don't you think if Junior member restriction is applied then scams would reduce? For me your answers look like as if you have given up and there is no hope to rectify the current situation of this forum. Shouldn't it be moral responsibility of administration of this forum to control scams here? If not then why do they send note in red for PMs sent by Newbies? If you have openly created a thread that you sold your a/c then you should not be held responsible for scams. If you go by my 1st logic: Selling accounts SHOULD NOT be permitted. If you sell your account even on other site then also you are held responsible for anything that happens with this account. Lets say if your account is hacked then forum admin can drop an e-mail to your registered e-mail id & inform you to login ASAP and see what's wrong with the account. Similarly if hacker did any scam using your a/c then you should repay for the losses. |
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you can deal with hedgy73 and ghibly79, they are most trusted guys who buy btc for paypal , try contacting them or post in their exchange thread.
ghibly79 and monbux both turned their noses up at trades with me recently, so I wouldn't go getting stars in your eyes just because someone is (or was) on the default trust list. Some have fallen from their perches recently. Just recalled I wouldn't worry too much @ sardasa turned his nose up at trading with me, now he fawns over an Activity: 2 member. (Sometimes outting a scammer is just a waiting game) Hi.
I accept PayPal as payment for bitcoin , I even sell accept bitcoin for PayPal.
Have stock 0.3 btc
Paypal:310 usd
I can buy BTC for PayPal @ 1:1 benchmarked at preev.com. Let me know if interested Why on earth do you keep posting shit? I didn't deal with you because you did not offer me even the rate that was at preev.com at that time whereas I was asking for +14%. Get your head straight dude. Don't blame anyone w/o any proofs. You gonna face hell on this earth for mentally harassing users who have not even a single intention of scamming. |
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Anyway, I know you're going to be annoyed by my comment, so
Peace out!
Agreed because you are always giving your opinion against the topic which I raise. My thought process is completely opposite than yours. |
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You missed the point. If account sales are no longer allowed here, it does not mean that accounts are not sold. They will be sold elsewhere, but still used here.
Agreed but then knowingly we are not digging holes for ourselves. What in your personal opinion is the better way to make this a less prone to scams forum?
One where staff tries the impossible, to prevent all scams or one where each user learns about the way of the scammers and is able to protect themself?
something, something, fish, feed him for a lifetime.
Implement proper & effective rules to access market place rather than implementing worthless rule of not having referral link as part of OP. Staff does not have to do anything if there is a rule to access market place. For Example: Account less than Junior Member & registered for 30 days should not have access to deal. It would be an automated process and no staff involvement once this feature is coded. For anyone to learn how to protect themselves against scams, it need time. They would learn in the 30 days period that how does scammers work & would become more capable of protecting themselves from scam if the above mentioned rule is implemented. What exactly do you mean with "responsible"? Lets say I sell my account and it is used to steal 1 BTC from you. What now?
You sell your a/c then it means you no longer want to keep that account. You should probably create a thread on this forum that you are about to sell your account and you would not be responsible for any deals/scams done after that date using your account. |
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No wonder why so many scams happen on this forum.
1. No rules to access Market Place.
2. No credibility of the account. Anyone can sell their account & other user can scam & run away.
3. Scam section is not moderated.
4. Scammers/Alts are not banned.
Even if we disallowed account sales, there is no way of preventing them. People could do it on another website. Scam are not moderated because it would be hard for each moderator to decide what is and what isn't truly a scam. Sorry but why would you care if scammer scams on another website? Should we not focus on making https://bitcointalk.org a better/less prone to scam forum? By banning a/c sales and making user who registered with that a/c responsible for any/all scam that happens with that account would prevent at least 0.01% of the scams? In most of the cases looking at the evidences it should not be that difficult to decide who scammed. |
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don't deal with reversible method of payment from members, more than what their account costs.
How do I know the price of the account with which I am dealing rather how is the worth measured of any account? Whats the worth of let's say your & my account(s) ? |
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No wonder why so many scams happen on this forum.
1. No rules to access Market Place.
2. No credibility of the account. Anyone can sell their account & other user can scam & run away.
3. Scam section is not moderated.
4. Scammers/Alts are not banned.
5.
6.
7.
8.
............
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1st thing that'd tip you off is a changed password, but the "Warning" is only showed for a month
2nd thing, a change in style of writing
3rd , change in use of address.
And many more, you are asking this for "Educational purposes" right?
Yes, it's for educational purposes only. Its more to protect myself from such account users as I am into the riskiest trade possible using bitcoin. Change is style of writing: What if I am not even aware about his real style of writing? How would I know that his writing is the same as it used to be? Is it suggested to ask user to point the BTC address which they posted on the day they joined this forum before making any deal with them? |
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If the person behind the account has not posted an address or something that can be related to them, then it might be pretty hard to tell. However, most of these accounts get recognized after a while.
Is it not possible for the new account user to commit a big scam during this transit period? |
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Accounts can be bought/sold here.
Imagine a situation where xyz sells his account to someone then is it possible to recognize that the person behind the account is real xyz or the one who bought it?
Important point to note here is xyz has got fairly good trust score. So, the new person can even misuse the account.
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Got 0.229 BTC more to sell  |
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the time on BTC talk is different and is weird sometimes I can show screenshots of our skype convo. The time there differs.
I don't need any screenshots. Just create a thread under scam accusation with all proofs and link it as reference for giving him -ve rep. Even highly trusted members would need you to do the same in order for them to give this person -ve trust. |
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Can do this trade for you.
Sent you a PM.
BEWARE!
BTC-Fanatic is a scammer.
OP asked me to do small trades, $20 at a time.
After doing multiple $20 trades, I accidentally sent him PM before he sent me the BTC.
He told me to keep going, and I told him that I did not receive the BTC for the previous trade of PM. When I told him this he said the transaction is not confirmed and that is why I'm not seeing it in my wallet. (YEAH RIGHT! I should see it as an unconfirmed transaction in my wallet.) Even so, I waited for 1hr...nothing. Its been about 24 hours since our trade and still nothing.
Anyways, I do not want to waste my time starting a scam accusation over $20.
Could a highly trusted member leave him neg rep.
Peace.
How come 24 hours passed when your 1st comment on this thread was 1 hour 37 minutes before? If you already dealt with him on any other thread & he did not send you BTC for let's 22 hours then why would you want to trade with him again ? |
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please pm sent
PM Sent. Please check & take action |
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