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its funny how things get hijacked and questions that people want from KNC get lost in the noise :/
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Guys Really? Are we all back in school again on the playground fighting? If I had to guess the age of this forum based upon some of the posting and responses I would say somewhere between 10-15 years old.
As someone who already paid and sent my money to KNC, its not about IF, but when is my question and always has been.
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you guys should also play with this, I have been using it for guestimates, and changing power costs doesn't really change the roi much..
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just a fyi to all.. If they deliver in sept.. but who knows sept could be sept 31st still  the longer we wait as a community for stuff the harder it is to make an ROI.. not impossible, esp people who pay for power.. So what ever company Knc, company b, c or d.. so prices need to come down on hardware.. I know boxes dont cost 7k to make anyhow.. On one side you say the hardware is already over priced but then you predict the mining lemmings to continue the next year at breakneck speed with everyone throwing ROI out the window Eventually only long term players will bother to mine which will taper the diff curve. Unless AM, et all just want to take all their profits and hand it to the chip makers again and again... These are not my calculations, its more of a hey, company A get off your ass and make sure your going to deliver in sept cause well diff is only going to get out of control, and yes most people will stop start to drop off but when 1 or 5Th/s is common next year only the big players who spent the cash will be mining.. anyhow more of a can we get some updates on the hardware KNC question than anything. |
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just a fyi to all..  If they deliver in sept.. but who knows sept could be sept 31st still the longer we wait as a community for stuff the harder it is to make an ROI.. not impossible, esp people who pay for power.. So what ever company Knc, company b, c or d.. so prices need to come down on hardware.. I know boxes dont cost 7k to make anyhow.. |
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I don't care about what company is doing it or the name a simple answer to a tapeout might just completely satisfy everyone here!
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hmm going to http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/ this morning and selecting knc Jupiter and sept with all the defaults.. well you can see doesn't look so good right now to the guestimate of diff increase. I hope we dont see 62% increases.. time will tell since diff is currently changing around every 11 days or so thats about 3 more diff changes before sept 1 give or take. The 62% is the rise the difficulty took in the last 30 days, the stats for this is in the upper left. And i fear it might get even worse. I mean avalon batch 3 miners will ship in the next weeks for sure, the hundred thousand of avalon chips will be shipped in the next weeks, those chips can be overclocked from 282mhz to 450 mhz with burnin's design, which means an even greater rise of difficulty. And then there are all the new chips that should come out. Im not even remembering all the new companies claiming to bring out chips in the next months. It might become hard. Pretty soon its where you will need 1Th/s to make revenue and well that all depends on the price of the hardware which will have to really really start to come down for ROI or people will not buy these products. I truly hope people are not buying bfl mini's at 22k still.. |
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hmm going to http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/ this morning and selecting knc Jupiter and sept with all the defaults.. well you can see doesn't look so good right now to the guestimate of diff increase. I hope we dont see 62% increases.. time will tell since diff is currently changing around every 11 days or so thats about 3 more diff changes before sept 1 give or take. So yes my questions yesterday about tape-out or more transparency of progress is quite important, I know their stance seems to be limited updates here and their and well nothing in the last few emails going out has made me feel any better about my purchase and with less than 5-6 weeks till sept well you might start to understand my concern, esp if you switch the month to oct using the calculator above. Of course I do understand we have few variables we do not have much control over, increase in hash to the network, diff % change every 11 or so days and price of btc. So yes someone from KNC start to shed some info, you already announced that you are shipping in sept, so their is no secret to hide unless time delays which then would cause mass issues and quite a bit of refund requests. sorry I dont mean to sound grim just look at some numbers as an investor like I do with my stocks and sharing my opinion (which I hope isn't right) |
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My 2 cents... None of the calculators, or mining forcasters seem to take in the fact/factor that in order for the difficulty changes to maintain a 20% increase every diffchange, that it will take 20% more hashing power delivered to customers to maintain that increase level. In other words, if the diff increases, so does the need amount of delivered hash power to make the same result. With that in mind, there will be a leveling, or slowly getting smaller & smaller % increase as the cloud grows, again, because it will take more & more units delivered to effect the same result. But there will be a few larger ones soon, surely with all the massive deliveries pending, but all I'm saying is that there eventually will be a smaller and smaller rise in the difflevel , and sometimes go down, as happened in the past. Your ability to mine for profit will depend on your willingness to re-invest in bigger, better, faster, and MORE EFFICIENT machines as they become available. Choose wisely Grasshopper  Youre right... paying the half price for the same hashrate but getting it some time later will turn out a worse buy. My new best liked calculator is this one: http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/At the moment time is an even bigger factor one thinks. 66% rising difficulty per month. That is huge. Ya nice tool to calculate with btw select the BFF mini rig which costs 22k and see how much your roi .. |
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Intel and nvidia have shipped many products and in this industry with all the scams and such I thinks it's important for people to be informed of such info .. Wouldn't you want to know what's up with your 14k you spent with such nonsense going on in thus industry esp with the amount of scammers out?
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Unfortunately, as far as I know we are still waiting to find out the tape-out date.  That's their business, I would be surprised if the bothered to tell you. I would think paying customers would get some updates.. So far all I heard about was a hosting plan and you can spend more money to upgrade .. |
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Anyone have any idea if Knc has reached tapeout yet? With 5 weeks till September time is ticking...
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what I don't get is why anyone so experienced would build such a massive chip for something like btc mining. With big chips you get worse yields, usually lower clock potential and more thermal issues. I can only really think of getting slightly better performance/area from going big but then you might not gain anything due to smaller chips normally clocking higher/better yield.
A bitcoin chip does not suffer from nearly the same level of yield issues that regular ICs do. With regular ICs if there is the slightest imperfection anywhere on the chip, then the whole chip becomes useless. E.G. A CPU that executes one particular instruction wrong is pretty much useless to anyone. A bitcoin chip is composed of many replicas of a single mining core or engine. A tiny defect is very likely to only affect a single core or engine, so reduce the chips performance by only a tiny fraction. In a normal chip it's necessary to build a clock tree to maintain clock synchronization over much of the chip. This is because there are lots of dependencies and connections between logic in one part of the chip and logic somewhere else. In a bitcoin chip each engine or core is mostly independent from the others, so the clock only needs to be synchronous within one engine - much smaller than the whole chip. Effectively it's lots of small chips in a big chip. What's important in designing and optimizing a bitcoin chip to produce this sort of result is a very different set of skills from what's important in the normal process of SOC design (system on a chip design), and takes a highly experienced team. +1 |
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+1 |
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Cheers all for the feedback. I also thought maybe I could just sell my order .. Anyhow thanks
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Has anyone gotten any clarification of what the refund policy is.. not talking returns but getting a refund if I wanted to today?
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Anyone heard from burnin lately ? After my order and zefir announced he got his first batch and shipped them (my chips to burning) I'm unable to get a reply of verification he has the chips and my order will be filled. Sent two emails no reply yet  I know he's busy but since the chips have been sent from batch one I would like to get clarification I wouldn't expect him to verify that he recieved your chips, he might post that he got some from Zefir but other than that i would skip those emails and focus on emails that needed to be taken care of. As I understand it from Zefir's thread the chips are still on their way to Burnin. I'm sure Burnin will announce the arrival of the first batch but I think it's a bit much to send every chip-holder a personal email. You might see a change in the status of your order but lets let him do his work for a few days, which will get the boards in our hands faster Fair enough just excited |
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You smart guys should unite with Mtrlt for the good cause +1 Yea he's usually on irc ch #eligius-prime working with a few others or kicking ideas around. Developers feel free to join and maybe provide some feedback. Please no is it done questions or you will prob get kicked |
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Anyone heard from burnin lately ? After my order and zefir announced he got his first batch and shipped them (my chips to burning) I'm unable to get a reply of verification he has the chips and my order will be filled. Sent two emails no reply yet I know he's busy but since the chips have been sent from batch one I would like to get clarification |
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Are you saying that you have a 400 GH/s chip?
If they do that would change the current paradigm of what's kicking ass and taking names in the mining industry  |
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