Admins -- Sort out this investor based game section once and for all. [POLL]

[vigory]

It needs to be sorted. "Investor Based Game" is halfway between "play these games" and "do not play these games" and the havoc is going to far.
I have made a poll, this is a serious thread to end the drama in this section.
I want to note I do not support either side, it is not fair for thieves to run these sites but at the same time it is not fair if our opinion is censored by red trust. Lets end it once and for all...

three options:
1. trashcan all HYIP/Ponzi/Investor based games that are posted ...
this means completely disallow all of these games, preventing any discussion and topics for them
2. leave as it is ...
this means give cryptodevil his duty to tag everyone who even posts in this section and posts big red warnings in every site. which is stupid because if this is the case then why have this section in the first place.
3. rename the board and update board description + add a sticky describing that these games are almost always fraud and always take caution
this means name it to something more obvious, my suggestion:
"HYIP/Pyramids"
Description: "Programs that are more than often fraud in the form of a ponzi, pyramid, mlm etc scheme. Returns are never guaranteed and will most likely result in loss of your "investment""
Also add a sticky, just like "Cloudmining 101" preferrably made by someone of NEUTRAL position, not biased like cryptodevil or a ponzi player.

I think this can end the problem once and for all and improve the quality in that section and also prevent people from losing money, and also let people who want to play not suffer for their posts.

[snipie]

"Games where the main factor is whether or not new "investors" join the game"  itself is a clear warning message

so "Leave it how it is, no real position on whether it's allowed or not" and tag everyone every pathetic obvious scammy site's admin with a cute negative trust.
need to mention that not every project is a scam but it may turn in the dark side in the future!

[European Central Bank]

surely everyone knows what the score is even if they can't bring themselves to admit to themselves?

I agree that it's a stain on this forum but it seems to be what the users want and it's hidden away in its own dirty little corner. if it was infecting the main areas then that would be a major problem.

[vigory]

"Games where the main factor is whether or not new "investors" join the game"  itself is a clear warning message

so "Leave it how it is, no real position on whether it's allowed or not" and tag everyone every pathetic obvious scammy site's admin with a cute negative trust.
need to mention that not every project is a scam but it may turn in the dark side in the future!

You know that people who play these games and know the risks (like me) get negative trust?
I do not intend to harm people, but I want to play them. That's why I think we either disallow them, or we make it more explicit how risky these sites are.
The section would be fine if every single poster did not get negative trust just for posting their deposits/payouts on sites that are currently paying.

surely everyone knows what the score is even if they can't bring themselves to admit to themselves?

I agree that it's a stain on this forum but it seems to be what the users want and it's hidden away in its own dirty little corner. if it was infecting the main areas then that would be a major problem.

im not sure what your position is based on this post, remove them or leave it or change it? its hard to see.

[SaltySpitoon]

The section was added to separate "investor based games" and the more traditional gambling types like dice/cards, etc. Both gambling communities were complaining because they were constantly fighting over the main gambling section, and it just became a bump war. Its not that Bitcointalk supports investor based games in particular, its just that it needed its own section to solve that dispute.

Trashing them all is an option I suppose, but trashing all forms of gambling is also an option. I can't fathom why this discussion comes up every day. If you don't want to gamble, stay out of the gambling section. Trust being unmoderated is a good and bad thing (mostly good in my opinion) people can go around marking whoever they want for whatever reason. Bitcoin mining is a gamble, so maybe I'll give negative trust to anyone involved with Bitcoin mining! If I did that, everyone would just ignore my feedback, and the problem solves itself.

Everything is just someone's point of view. If you are someone who doesn't care about "investor based games" and any of their implications, just ignore cryptodevil's feedback. If you are someone who finds them wrong and don't wish to do business with anyone involved, then heed their warning and don't. Its not really a big deal.

[vigory]

The section was added to separate "investor based games" and the more traditional gambling types like dice/cards, etc. Both gambling communities were complaining because they were constantly fighting over the main gambling section, and it just became a bump war. Its not that Bitcointalk supports investor based games in particular, its just that it needed its own section to solve that dispute.

Trashing them all is an option I suppose, but trashing all forms of gambling is also an option. I can't fathom why this discussion comes up every day. If you don't want to gamble, stay out of the gambling section. Trust being unmoderated is a good and bad thing (mostly good in my opinion) people can go around marking whoever they want for whatever reason. Bitcoin mining is a gamble, so maybe I'll give negative trust to anyone involved with Bitcoin mining! If I did that, everyone would just ignore my feedback, and the problem solves itself.

Everything is just someone's point of view. If you are someone who doesn't care about "investor based games" and any of their implications, just ignore cryptodevil's feedback. If you are someone who finds them wrong and don't wish to do business with anyone involved, then heed their warning and don't. Its not really a big deal.

but isn't it logical to either allow or disallow people posting in that section? everyone, every single post, gets tarnished with red trust unless they are negatively posting about the "game" or "program"...why not just make the board info more clear for people who find it hard to understand that way cryptodevil and other members do not need to do this and those that actually want to play, can play without their profile being destroyed?

[SaltySpitoon]

but isn't it logical to either allow or disallow people posting in that section? everyone, every single post, gets tarnished with red trust unless they are negatively posting about the "game" or "program"...why not just make the board info more clear for people who find it hard to understand that way cryptodevil and other members do not need to do this and those that actually want to play, can play without their profile being destroyed?

Its allowed, otherwise all of the threads would have been trashed already. As I just finished saying, red trust is completely subjective. Cryptodevil could give negative trust to anyone who sells socks if they wanted. That doesn't mean its the forum's policy to disallow the sale of socks.

Forum Policy has no connection to the feedback system. Those who wish to play only have their profile destroyed only in the eyes of those who will no longer due business with them because of their affiliation to investor based games. Negative feedback does not all have equal weight.

If you are going to buy socks with Bitcoins here on Bitcointalk, and there are two traders. Both have 1 red trust. The first trader got their negative trust because they support Russia's involvement in Crimea. The second trader's negative trust is because they scammed someone out of 5 BTC. Which trader are you going to go with?

[noone000]

The section was added to separate "investor based games" and the more traditional gambling types like dice/cards, etc. Both gambling communities were complaining because they were constantly fighting over the main gambling section, and it just became a bump war. Its not that Bitcointalk supports investor based games in particular, its just that it needed its own section to solve that dispute.

Trashing them all is an option I suppose, but trashing all forms of gambling is also an option. I can't fathom why this discussion comes up every day. If you don't want to gamble, stay out of the gambling section. Trust being unmoderated is a good and bad thing (mostly good in my opinion) people can go around marking whoever they want for whatever reason. Bitcoin mining is a gamble, so maybe I'll give negative trust to anyone involved with Bitcoin mining! If I did that, everyone would just ignore my feedback, and the problem solves itself.

Everything is just someone's point of view. If you are someone who doesn't care about "investor based games" and any of their implications, just ignore cryptodevil's feedback. If you are someone who finds them wrong and don't wish to do business with anyone involved, then heed their warning and don't. Its not really a big deal.

but isn't it logical to either allow or disallow people posting in that section? everyone, every single post, gets tarnished with red trust unless they are negatively posting about the "game" or "program"...why not just make the board info more clear for people who find it hard to understand that way cryptodevil and other members do not need to do this and those that actually want to play, can play without their profile being destroyed?

It's in the gambling section and it's called an Investor-based game, so you should realize that you have a risk of losing money. The red trust lets players see that it's not a positive thing to support but cryptodevil doesn't speak on behalf of the forum

[Lauda]

It's in the gambling section and it's called an Investor-based game, so you should realize that you have a risk of losing money.

I don't think that many people realize this, and by supporting such games, you end up indirectly supporting those that end up scamming with their 'investor based games'.

The red trust lets players see that it's not a positive thing to support but cryptodevil doesn't speak on behalf of the forum

No, cryptodevil is not, and can not speak on behalf of the forum.

[cryptodevil]

why not just make the board info more clear for people who find it hard to understand that way cryptodevil and other members do not need to do this and those that actually want to play, can play without their profile being destroyed?

So all this incessant butt-hurt from you is basically that you don't want other people to know you're the kind of person who doesn't care if other people have their money stolen as long as he gets a share of it from the ponzi operators? You resent other people having this information to hand in order to better evaluate your post content? Because that's all it is doing, the negative rating, alerting other people to pertinent facts about you.

What's so special about you that would warrant this information being withheld from other forum users?

[Fortify]

Why do you feel the need to tell the Admins what to do? If you don't like that part of the forum, just ignore it and move on with your day. It is clear to anyone who is not being greedy that the majority of those threads have no credible business plan and should be avoided, but you cannot babysit everyone all the time.