Why is Bitcoin still a slave of Fiat?

[techgeek]

Why is Bitcoin tied to Fiat? Why is Bitcoin value moving like a stock? satoshi said the value will be derived by the limit of total coins. But we are seeing the opposite. Why dont we mathematically calculate the value of bitcoin according to the amount of bitcoin mined?

Like

Agreed Value * Bitcoins Mined = New Value

0.0010 * 1 = 0.0010
0.0010 * 2 = 0.0020

Everyone is a slave of fiat as long as that person has to pay for things in fiat and has to get paid in fiat. This means you can actually live outside the system, if you get paid in Bitcoin, and pay everything in Bitcoin.

Using your own example, wouldn't you then just become a slave of bitcoin?

Youre basically exchanging the ideas of money.

Its just in a different form, so yes you become a slave for bitcoin, in a simple concept.

[ernestdezoe]

We need more adopter to bring bitcoin to more mainstream.

Its not about more adopter to be honest, in the end most of use who use and accept BTC will still cash it out into FIAT, therefore BTC will still be a slave of FIAT. Another thing would be that, you can buy mostly everything with FIAT but you cant buy mostly everything with BTC (which ofcourse another reason on why BTC is a slave of FIAT)

Logically that's right. Maybe bitcoin is decentralization? And digital currency?

And the other reason is that there are many alternatives available for bitcoin as a currency or a payment system like fiat, credit card etc. And fiat has ruled the world since so many years so people follow fiat more.

You need fiat to buy bitcoin and you don't need bitcoin to buy a fiat. It is as simple as that. And I don't see in coming years that bitcoin will replace fiat. It is simply to impossible.

Fiat is a traditional currency and every one follows the same since years and it is more trustworthy as compared to bitcoins. Whereas Bitcoins are new to many people and would not attract instantly until they start to know it technically.

actually no, you produce bitcoin without the need of fiat, with mining(one could argue that you need to buy the miners, but you do it one time only), with signature campaign(this is a better example) or with anything that require you to invest your time and not your money

and last but not least with bitcoin itself, with trading on stocks

What broker accepts btc to invest in the stock market??

1broker, and i'm using it to do some trading, there are other, but i find this to be the best one

dude there are only 12 stocks..

yeah, but it's better than nothing, there is also forex, and commodities, you have already a good table of choice

what about the others?? Is there any chance to build a decent stock portfolio??

[cellard]

I would love a way to choose ANY stock and operate it with BTC. Hopefully the Winklevoss level take it to the next level when they are done with Gemini, and create a way to interact with forex and the big stock markets to choose any stock we want without the need of depositing fiat, doing it with BTC directly. That would be amazing.

[Amph]

We need more adopter to bring bitcoin to more mainstream.

Its not about more adopter to be honest, in the end most of use who use and accept BTC will still cash it out into FIAT, therefore BTC will still be a slave of FIAT. Another thing would be that, you can buy mostly everything with FIAT but you cant buy mostly everything with BTC (which ofcourse another reason on why BTC is a slave of FIAT)

Logically that's right. Maybe bitcoin is decentralization? And digital currency?

And the other reason is that there are many alternatives available for bitcoin as a currency or a payment system like fiat, credit card etc. And fiat has ruled the world since so many years so people follow fiat more.

You need fiat to buy bitcoin and you don't need bitcoin to buy a fiat. It is as simple as that. And I don't see in coming years that bitcoin will replace fiat. It is simply to impossible.

Fiat is a traditional currency and every one follows the same since years and it is more trustworthy as compared to bitcoins. Whereas Bitcoins are new to many people and would not attract instantly until they start to know it technically.

actually no, you produce bitcoin without the need of fiat, with mining(one could argue that you need to buy the miners, but you do it one time only), with signature campaign(this is a better example) or with anything that require you to invest your time and not your money

and last but not least with bitcoin itself, with trading on stocks

What broker accepts btc to invest in the stock market??

1broker, and i'm using it to do some trading, there are other, but i find this to be the best one

dude there are only 12 stocks..

yeah, but it's better than nothing, there is also forex, and commodities, you have already a good table of choice

what about the others?? Is there any chance to build a decent stock portfolio??

yeah there is, personally i think closing and opening a position is better than opening and closing an order, i'm more suited for this kind of trading

[bitnanigans]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other. Personally, I'm just looking forward to a point where conversion between bitcoin and fiat is fast and easy, instead of having to do identify verification and wait days for wire transfers.

[arallmuus]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other.

Although people started to mass adopt it. It is still not a guarantee that it will be free from FIAT, the reason that BTC is a slave of FIAT would be much more to that it has no dependant value because you will need to keep on converting to FIAT to purchase something using it. Another reason would be that at some point not everyone will keep their BTC forever and will cash them out in form of FIAT, kinda like an endless cycle that everything in the end at some point will be converted into FIAT

[Bit-Gods]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other. Personally, I'm just looking forward to a point where conversion between bitcoin and fiat is fast and easy, instead of having to do identify verification and wait days for wire transfers.

You can get the debit card from BIT-X found in my signature to cashout btc anytime you want wherever mastercard is accepted. It will take time for bitcoin to break the boundries that bureaucrats have set in every country for hundreds of years in form of fiat but it is bound to happen with the adoption of bitcoin, remember Rome was not build in a day  

[hunnaryb]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other. Personally, I'm just looking forward to a point where conversion between bitcoin and fiat is fast and easy, instead of having to do identify verification and wait days for wire transfers.

Wire transfers are very time consuming and the charges are too high as compared to bitcoins. The bitcoins can be transferred to fiat currency into your bank accounts within fractions of minutes and yes till the more and more people start adopting bitcoin then only bitcoin would replace fiat.

[Dotakels]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other. Personally, I'm just looking forward to a point where conversion between bitcoin and fiat is fast and easy, instead of having to do identify verification and wait days for wire transfers.

Wire transfers are very time consuming and the charges are too high as compared to bitcoins. The bitcoins can be transferred to fiat currency into your bank accounts within fractions of minutes and yes till the more and more people start adopting bitcoin then only bitcoin would replace fiat.

But if bitcoin replace fiat, theres so many rules or law that should make that bitcoins user will not outweigh with the government. And also i think we all died before it happened.

[jayce]

I think until people who hold Bitcoin start to spend it as normal currency and more establishments start to accept it, it'll always be tied to fiat one way or the other. Personally, I'm just looking forward to a point where conversion between bitcoin and fiat is fast and easy, instead of having to do identify verification and wait days for wire transfers.

Wire transfers are very time consuming and the charges are too high as compared to bitcoins. The bitcoins can be transferred to fiat currency into your bank accounts within fractions of minutes and yes till the more and more people start adopting bitcoin then only bitcoin would replace fiat.

I think bitcoin can't replace fiat since it is different and more complex than fiat. Bitcoin has style and method itself, with futuristic technology and can be used easier and more efficient than fiat

[dblink]

Why is Bitcoin tied to Fiat? Why is Bitcoin value moving like a stock? satoshi said the value will be derived by the limit of total coins. But we are seeing the opposite. Why dont we mathematically calculate the value of bitcoin according to the amount of bitcoin mined?
Like, Agreed Value * Bitcoins Mined = New Value

0.0010 * 1 = 0.0010
0.0010 * 2 = 0.0020

I would love to see Bitcoins Value challenging the physical commodities such as gold or silver, since physical commodities are reliable, whereas fiat currencies may have risks at sometimes during bad inflation. Still more work to be done to educate about bitcoins to many business people about its value, security and transparency. I am afraid half of the business people will dislike the term "Transparency"

[dollarneed]

i think as long as goverment accepted bitcoin as national curency officially and replace their national curency it would be great and bitcoin still not slave fiat anymore actually iam pretty sure that would be happen not now maybe 100 years latter and fiat's gonna converted to cryptocurency

[Dotakels]

i think as long as goverment accepted bitcoin as national curency officially and replace their national curency it would be great and bitcoin still not slave fiat anymore actually iam pretty sure that would be happen not now maybe 100 years latter and fiat's gonna converted to cryptocurency

Yes but we all know that, we can saw that day because its so very long time. the things that we can do right now is to introduce to people and recommended to them so that they can used it as a payment.

[arallmuus]

i think as long as goverment accepted bitcoin as national curency officially and replace their national curency it

There will be no chance for a government to adopt BTC as a national currency unless a country is suffering from the super inflation which in this case will be Zimbabwe but also I doubt that Zimbabwe would start to use BTC because most people are suffering there and you need an internet connection to use BTC which I doubt that most Zimbabwean even have this

more complex than fiat, with futuristic technology and can be used easier and more efficient than fiat

It is actually much more simpler than FIAT although I would say depending on who uses it. If you are explaining it to a 20+ year old guy it will be much easier for him rather than you are explaining it to a 60+ year old grandpa.

On the other hand judging from the efficiency of using it than FIAT it will depends on where you are using it. Basically sending money from 1 country to another country will be much more efficient by using BTC , while on the other hands if you are buying daily necessities with BTC if will be much more less innefficient due to the time needed for 1 confirmation (much efficient to pay with cash directly)

I think bitcoin can't replace fiat

Partially right, read above about the super inflation

[Harry Hood]

Bitcoin is tied to fiat because that's what people have to use to buy bitcoin with. Once people are getting paid in bitcoin (which likely will never happen) or using bitcoin exclusively (could very well happen) you'll see lest talk about bitcoin tied to fiat and more about what bitcoin can buy in goods and services.

[Dotakels]

Bitcoin is tied to fiat because that's what people have to use to buy bitcoin with. Once people are getting paid in bitcoin (which likely will never happen) or using bitcoin exclusively (could very well happen) you'll see lest talk about bitcoin tied to fiat and more about what bitcoin can buy in goods and services.

Yes they should focus on what bitcoin can do and not what bitcoin still slave with fiat money. They should be a positive thinker or maybe we can say that they more focus on how bitcoin will be a world currency.

[n2004al]

Why is Bitcoin tied to Fiat? Why is Bitcoin value moving like a stock? satoshi said the value will be derived by the limit of total coins. But we are seeing the opposite. Why dont we mathematically calculate the value of bitcoin according to the amount of bitcoin mined?

Like

Agreed Value * Bitcoins Mined = New Value

0.0010 * 1 = 0.0010
0.0010 * 2 = 0.0020

First: Why the agreed value is 0.0010?

Two: Who have decided the agree value?

Three: Bitcoin is connected closely to the fiat money because is the fiat money that people have (that money they take from their work) and that fiat serve that bitcoin be bought by the most of the people (not everyone can mine - especially in our days when cannot be mined with the computer in your home).

Four: Bitcoin is a currency and as a currency must be quoted and changed with the other currencies. For this needed the rate of exchange.

The limit of total coins bring other things (one of the most important quality of those is the possibility to not be inflated as a currency). Then the security that its value, compared to the other currencies, will be increased in time (but which can be made true only if it will be known and regulated as a currency by all the countries).

[pitham1]

Bitcoin is tied to fiat because that's what people have to use to buy bitcoin with. Once people are getting paid in bitcoin (which likely will never happen) or using bitcoin exclusively (could very well happen) you'll see lest talk about bitcoin tied to fiat and more about what bitcoin can buy in goods and services.

Again it all boils down to Bitcoin adoption. This is something which cannot be sorted out in a hurry.

[Onews1990]

Well, if you will ask me. I will think right that bitcoin is only pioneering and it is still have a good potential and perspectives to be more usable in close future.

[PSL]

I completely disagree with the position that bitcoin is completely dependent on conventional currencies. It surpasses them in its properties. That is why for a long period of time bitcoin is growing in price.