What is the best way to acquire 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins?

[kentrolla]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

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[kentrolla]

yea, that's what i meant by "spark a panic."

I guess I should have been more specific.

I meant a panic rally. Where speculators start to panic buy.

I'm not sure this would be the smartest option because it might cause another bubble.

[kentrolla]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Is that you Mitt?

lol i knew this was coming.

No, my whole reason for asking this is because that whole extortion hoax got me thinking about what I would do in this hypothetical situation.

Keep in mind it could also be someone who wants the tax returns to be released.  

Or maybe Romney would pay the "release" address just to call the hackers bluff to patch things up politically.

Also, this would make the Democrats look stupid because people would assume that it was the Democratic party that paid the release address only to fall for a hoax.

It could be a good move for Romney to pay the release address if the secret service determined it is indeed a hoax.

[proudhon]

I'd create a schedule for a month and try to stick to it.  It'd be a little tempting to do it in one buy.  Right now you could buy $1m worth of bitcoins without breaking $13.

[benjamindees]

In Mitt's case, it doesn't really matter how the purchase would be made, since the demand specified that only the USD value at the end must total at least $1 million.  In fact, it would be better for him if he caused the price to spike, since that would mean paying fewer USD in total.  So, if I were fulfilling the request in his case, I would probably make a few large, private transactions, followed by a series of increasing public purchases in order to drive up the price.

[kneim]

I would say to the investor:

1) Be a good guy and invest slowly while stabilizing the price. This includes selling small parts if the price raises too quick (sell the win)

2) Do not build own walls, but buy large parts of suddenly arising big ask walls (could be from a manipulator, that's even better).

3) Perhaps it is not possible for investing this large batches in one month. It it seldom a good idea invest or deinvest large batches at once (but for manipulating the market).

4) Mt.Gox as the market place, perhaps others in addition (for arbitraging and stabilization)

5) I wouldn't use bots

6) I don't know other market place then Mt.Gox for this large amount

[kneim]

I'd create a schedule for a month and try to stick to it.  It'd be a little tempting to do it in one buy.  Right now you could buy $1m worth of bitcoins without breaking $13.

History has shown that most of these walls are temporary and can vanish from one second to the other.

[hannesnaude]

Interesting question. Remember that the opposite question "What is the best way to dispose of 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins?" may be just as relevant for some. i.e. there are some early adopters around with access to huge amounts of coins. But they can't sell over too short a period on gox without crashing the market. Now if only there were a way for these parties to find one another without either party having to show his/her hand publicly first and sparking a panic. I suspect iceberg orders on gox will do a lot to enable large players to enter/exit the market non-disruptively. Still hoping for something like this.

I was also wondering what I would do in this situation under the assumption that the threat is real (highly unlikely) and that I really have something to hide (highly likely). My first thought was that I would send an encrypted message to the blackmailer requesting a new deposit address so that I could pay without it being widely known that I paid. I thought I could use the public key corresponding to the blackmailer's address to encrypt the message so that only the blackmailer could read the message.  I then realised that since bitcoin addresses are hashes of public keys rather than the public keys themselves, this key would be unknown until someone does a withdrawal from the address.

Does anyone know why this is? What benefits do we get from using the hash rather than the key itself? Obviously we save a few bits on address length, but since we are past the point where addresses can realistically be memorised or manually typed anyway, this seems somewhat irrelevant. Satoshi had good reasons for most every choice he made in this system. What was the reason for this one?

[elux]

Right now you could buy $1m worth of bitcoins without breaking $13.

Yes. Now would be a good time to start acquiring $1M worth of BTC.

Here's the argument:

Between June and mid-late August, the ask depth was so precariously thin that a 100K BTC market buy would quickly push the cost per additional BTC bought far beyond 30USD/BTC.

Obviously, this would be unacceptable, as the price would quickly crash after the big bid.

Acquiring any significant amount of BTC on the exchanges was simply not an option at the time.

The current situation is different:

With the ask depth that filled in after the BTCST Exit, one could load up on a decent amount of BTC,
without having to suffer entirely outrageous marginal cost toward the tail end.

[kentrolla]

5.5k btc slippage.  not bad.

[molecular]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

• Have account of reputable forum member ceised by friends at CIA/FBI/Police
• Use account to ask in forum "What's the best way to acquire 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins?"
• Execute best advice

In seriousness, though: contact Gavin and have him contact trustable people with lots of coins and buy them at a good price (+20%) so they keep quiet until you got all the deals closed.

[kentrolla]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

• Have account of reputable forum member ceised by friends at CIA/FBI/Police
• Use account to ask in forum "What's the best way to acquire 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins?"
• Execute best advice

In seriousness, though: contact Gavin and have him contact trustable people with lots of coins and buy them at a good price (+20%) so they keep quiet until you got all the deals closed.

lol. I'm not a "reputable forum member" though.

[bpd]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Despite the current state of the order book it will change if you push it and you will end up paying more of a premium than you expect if you plunk down $1m all at once. It is a maximum risk scenario.

Is that really true? It was my impression that once a large order is placed on MtGox that is executing against existing asks, no other orders can be cancelled (or placed) while that order is in the process of being filled.

[bpd]

I realize it takes time (way too much time, TBH). But during that time period, the state of the orderbook should be locked. Order execution should be fully atomic.

[malevolent]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Start a pozni a get free monies quickly.

[adamstgBit]

I realize it takes time (way too much time, TBH). But during that time period, the state of the orderbook should be locked. Order execution should be fully atomic.

agreed, why to they allow orders to be pulled out of the way of 1 major buy?

theirs no reason it should "take time" to lock the books and fill orders, for 1 big buy. its just a few numbers being moved around.

i dont get it....

[moni3z]

Start a corporation, offer to buy coins for various methods. Keep them.
Wouldn't even bother with exchangers, this method you could do it and avoid ID and fees

[adamstgBit]

i'd buy 1 million dollars worth of LSD and sell it on SR

lol!

[JoelKatz]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

I would talk to private individuals who hold large amounts of Bitcoin and try to make private purchases to keep the price from going up too much too quickly. I'd try to buy for spot price and I'd actually slowly sell Bitcoins on exchanges the whole time to try to keep the spot price down.

[kentrolla]

well. someone beat me to it.

bold move.

i think this guy has no intention of actually purchasing coins though.

160k btc bid wall is just obnoxious.

[kentrolla]

why would someone show their cards in this fashion?

I'm so confused right now.

Would the owner of this wall please PM me?

I have a few propositions for you.

[Technomage]

It's possible that the wall dude also has a large amount of bitcoins and wants a rally to dump them.

[Technomage]

Wow, ok. Welcome to the world of Bitcoin trading.

+1

[kentrolla]

well this is obviously not the best way to acquire 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins.

I have no clue what is going on.

[elux]

Doing it wrong  →

[kentrolla]

lol I just imagine some old noob with 1.7 million dollars trying to figure out how to use mtgox.  He probably called up geek squad to help him.

[sgravina]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Easy.  Deposit about 1.8 million dollars in a MtGox account.  Put in a buy order for 160,000 bitcoins at $10.7.  Sit back and watch the bitcoins pile up in your account.  You may end up with a few extra bitcoins but that's OK you can always sell them tomorrow.

[kentrolla]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Easy.  Deposit about 1.8 million dollars in a MtGox account.  Put in a buy order for 160,000 bitcoins at $10.7.  Sit back and watch the bitcoins pile up in your account.  You may end up with a few extra bitcoins but that's OK you can always sell them tomorrow.

lol that's probably what geek squad told this guy to do.

[byronbb]

Pretend like someone gave you 1 million dollars and told you to buy bitcoins with it in less than a months time. How would you go about doing this? Would you buy them all in one big market order in hopes to spark a panic? Would you accumulate the coins slowly throughout the month? Would you use a bot? Would you set up bid walls? Would you even use mtgox? If not, who would you contact to purchase coins from without using the exchange and what price would you offer to buy them at?

Buy 1 million in cocaine and sell it at cost on SR.

[smoothie]

Right now you could buy $1m worth of bitcoins without breaking $13.

Yes. Now would be a good time to start acquiring $1M worth of BTC.

Here's the argument:

Between June and mid-late August, the ask depth was so precariously thin that a 100K BTC market buy would quickly push the cost per additional BTC bought far beyond 30USD/BTC.

Obviously, this would be unacceptable, as the price would quickly crash after the big bid.

Acquiring any significant amount of BTC on the exchanges was simply not an option at the time.

The current situation is different:

With the ask depth that filled in after the BTCST Exit, one could load up on a decent amount of BTC,
without having to suffer entirely outrageous marginal cost toward the tail end.

Those jagged edges on the sell wall are mostly PussyAt40. He wants to keep the price down so he can buy cheap. What a loser.

[kjj]

I realize it takes time (way too much time, TBH). But during that time period, the state of the orderbook should be locked. Order execution should be fully atomic.

agreed, why to they allow orders to be pulled out of the way of 1 major buy?

theirs no reason it should "take time" to lock the books and fill orders, for 1 big buy. its just a few numbers being moved around.

i dont get it....

Exchanges are super easy, everyone knows exactly how they should work.  Until they actually have to write one and they find out that things can get strange quickly.

[thebaron]

I'd create a schedule for a month and try to stick to it.  It'd be a little tempting to do it in one buy.  Right now you could buy $1m worth of bitcoins without breaking $13.

The problem is transferring enough funds to exchanges or private dealers in order to buy them before people become wise that the supply of BTC are drying up.

[joshbb]

I'd do it hourly over a month... with bitcoinbuilder.com of course! 

[Seal]

I definitely would not make this public or you will get speculators trading against you to take a slice of your $1m (by artificially inflating prices).

[notme]

I definitely would not make this public or you will get speculators trading against you to take a slice of your $1m (by artificially inflating prices).

Or he could be lying and actually looking to sell.  People who speculate on forum rumors are asking to be bitten.

[kentrolla]

I definitely would not make this public or you will get speculators trading against you to take a slice of your $1m (by artificially inflating prices).

Or he could be lying and actually looking to sell.  People who speculate on forum rumors are asking to be bitten.

this. announcing your plans usually has no effect whatsoever. In fact, I would go as far to say that the majority of people would assume you're lying.

[tvbcof]

If one has national security apparatus at one's disposal, the easiest thing to do would be to pick up a "terrorist" who has control of a decent amount of BTC (say, an exchange operator) and waterboard the shit out of them until they give you what you want.

The strategy for someone without the nicety of usable state apparatus could take a similar form I suppose.

[lebing]

If time isnt an issue:

Buy 100k USD worth in a straight market order
Wait 2 years
Profit

[kentrolla]

If time isnt an issue:

Buy 100k USD worth in a straight market order
Wait 2 years
Profit

time is an issue. it has to be done by the end of october

[Elwar]

Buy half in a way that is as under the radar as possible...do some p2p buys with cash, hit the smaller exchanges, do some trading on mtGox catching any downward pressure.


Then take another million and jump on mtGox with it. Create a huge million dollar bid wall and spread the word that you are buying a buttload.

You will get a good rally going with your first $400k then start to remove some of your bids with the rest of the $500k as the market takes over the rally.

[Seal]

Buy half in a way that is as under the radar as possible...do some p2p buys with cash, hit the smaller exchanges, do some trading on mtGox catching any downward pressure.


Then take another million and jump on mtGox with it. Create a huge million dollar bid wall and spread the word that you are buying a buttload.

You will get a good rally going with your first $400k then start to remove some of your bids with the rest of the $500k as the market takes over the rally.

Your 888'th post and it sounds like a winning strategy *thumbsup* from me

[thezerg]

Buy 1000 btc.  Tell Bernanke to announce QE3.  Chill...

[lebing]

  Tell Bernanke to announce QE3. 

That happened already (today)

[adamstgBit]

Buy 1000 btc.  Tell Bernanke to announce QE3.  Chill...

yup it helps having friends in high places 

[jojo69]

buy a million dollars worth of ASICs??

[kentrolla]

it turns out pirate was able to fill my order.   

[lebing]

it turns out pirate was able to fill my order.   

Not funny =P

[Seal]

it turns out pirate was able to fill my order.   

Not funny =P

Loool, yea agreed, its not funny... its hilarious 

[mobodick]

"What is the best way to acquire 1 million dollars worth of bitcoins? "

1) Buy one bitcoin.
2) Inflate the dollar.
3) Profit.

[Spekulatius]

I definitely would not make this public or you will get speculators trading against you to take a slice of your $1m (by artificially inflating prices).

Or he could be lying and actually looking to sell.  People who speculate on forum rumors are asking to be bitten.

this. announcing your plans usually has no effect whatsoever. In fact, I would go as far to say that the majority of people would assume you're lying.

Depends on how trustworthy andlogical your claim is. Would you believe Benanke is lying to you when he announces QE3? You know he's got a good reason to do it, you know's got the recources and power to do so and he did it already in the past.

If No0B_user99 announces to buy 10M$ worth of bitcoin tomorrow, I would bet all my bitcoins it won't happen, but that's the other end of the spectrum.

To close the circle and come back to our case: If Mitt Romney or someone else in his name (like Donald Trump) announces to buy 1M$ worth of Bitcoin by October, I would be very tempted to believe it. Many people would be, so it would have a severe effect on price. If he really would wanna buy cheap, he wouldn't announce it though. Instead someone with good connections could announce a ruling to make bitcoin illegal or else, of believable enough, that would have a severe effect on bitcoin prices also, the other way.

[hazek]

Buy half in a way that is as under the radar as possible...do some p2p buys with cash, hit the smaller exchanges, do some trading on mtGox catching any downward pressure.


Then take another million and jump on mtGox with it. Create a huge million dollar bid wall and spread the word that you are buying a buttload.

You will get a good rally going with your first $400k then start to remove some of your bids with the rest of the $500k as the market takes over the rally.

You were close but what you say doesn't make a hole lot of sense.

Here's the thing, there are two goals one might have:
1) get $1 million dollars worth of value into BTC and hold BTC
2) pay someone BTC worth $1million dollars and have no intention of holding any value in BTC

As you can perhaps already see my point the best strategy to accomplish either of these two very different goals are also very different. With the first goal you'd want to pursue any strategy that would conceal as long as possible from the market the fact of your demand whether it be cost averaging or going to smaller markets first. With the second goal after you exchanged some bitcoins you actually want to spark a huge rally because you just want to pay someone an amount of BTC worth $1 million which can be any amount of BTC so the best strategy would be to buy as few as possible as openly as possible and flaunt your extra demand as much as possible in order to spark the biggest rally possible. With a strong enough rally you might not even need to spend half a million in order to pay someone a $1 million worth of Bitcoins.