Greek referendum

[alani123]

BTW if you're looking for somewhat-objective coverage try the live updates from the guardian

http://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2015/jun/27/greek-crisis-mps-referendum-tsipras-eurogroup-ministers-live


I would avoid independent.co.uk and dailymail.co.uk as well as zerohedge.com

[Erdogan]

In the end (i cannot speak very good english)

the mosts money went to politicians (THEY GOD EVERYTHING). Every person that takes this country's leadership doen't take them to courts and jail. They are out playing with the rest of us. And we hav to pay for the money they got.. We, our children, and our childrens children...

in my oppinion if a few years(1 year maybe or less), we will be the worst economical country all over the planet. !!!

Start anew with free market and private property, food and everything will appear immediatedly. It's of no use to feed the politicans and the military.

[u9y42]

According to me that is not the right step, if he keep asking public opinion votes then they will become accustomed with these and Greek people will demand the same as in future when Greek will rise up economically and socially, I am still sad for Greece for their unstable state.

Wait... what exactly is the problem with the voters becoming accustomed with voicing their opinions, and more importantly, having them actually acted on? I understand "real" democracy is hard, and it requires an informed, educated and active public but, surely, this is going in the right direction? If anything, it seems to me that more consultations like this could help incentivize greater public participation and activity, and effectively revitalize their society - and indeed, most Western societies, as we all share the same "democracy" (for sale) problem.

[Eastwind]

I think calling for vote is a cheap and bad way to throw off responsibility for the situation to come. Almost every time people will vote against changes that will force them to lower their living standards. So Greek prime minister Alexis Tsipras is making an easy way out of this for himself, if people vote against and Greece will fall he will say "it's not my fault", if Greeks vote for and it will cause some sort of unrest he will say "you voted for those conditions so now don't complain"

Ya, he is not taking his responsibility.

[LiteCoinGuy]

[BillyBobZorton]

According to me that is not the right step, if he keep asking public opinion votes then they will become accustomed with these and Greek people will demand the same as in future when Greek will rise up economically and socially, I am still sad for Greece for their unstable state.

Wait... what exactly is the problem with the voters becoming accustomed with voicing their opinions, and more importantly, having them actually acted on? I understand "real" democracy is hard, and it requires an informed, educated and active public but, surely, this is going in the right direction? If anything, it seems to me that more consultations like this could help incentivize greater public participation and activity, and effectively revitalize their society - and indeed, most Western societies, as we all share the same "democracy" (for sale) problem.

I believe in democracy, but sometimes asking every other day what to do and doing referendums daily leads to a mess. You need some sort of solid plan to execute.
In this case I would agree for the referendum.

[ajareselde]

Well they did say how more than 500 ATM's are dried up, and people need to make withdraws, especially now when everything seams to be going down for them.
Given the fact that there is a 600EUR daily limit for cash withdraw,it being in the parliament doesn't enable wealthy ones to dry it up solo.
Not surprisingly, the price seams to be rising slowly over major exchanges; someones misfortune is another mans success i guess.

cheers

[countryfree]

The fool is just buying time. I'm very happy his request has been denied. The world has already been waiting far too long for Greece. If Greece expects to keep on receiving money from banks, it must accept what the banks are saying. I've seen a Greek family enjoying a vacation in Paris last month. You wonder how this is possible, when the government says the country is being strangled.

[LiteCoinGuy]

[RustyNomad]

Personally I think Greece will be better off to default.

Another bailout will just be kicking the can further down the road. Take the pain now, yes it will not be easy but neither will it be to take on even more debt.

Who knows, Greece might come back stronger in a couple of years time while most of the other countries are still battling with their debt.

[adzino]

Greece is going into bankruptcy. This referendum is not legal, and after the fact, window dressing.  The Eurozone will be stronger after Greece.

Now we can move on, there are big things to do to move the project forward. Eu is not standing still.

[ajareselde]

Greece is going into bankruptcy. This referendum is not legal, and after the fact, window dressing.  The Eurozone will be stronger after Greece.

Now we can move on, there are big things to do to move the project forward. Eu is not standing still.

EU will be stronger after cutting away dead weight (Greece), but how will they get their money back and who will enforce the payback ?
As far as i can tell, people are about to go frenzy over there, and it wont end well.

cheers

[bryant.coleman]

A final decision on the referendum hasn't been reached yet. The Greek MPs are still debating whether the planned referendum should go ahead, and which are the questions that should be asked. A final vote might happen a few hours from now, at approx. 10 pm Greek time (right now it is 8:45 pm there). So we will be knowing their decision within the next 90 minutes.

[adzino]

Greece is going into bankruptcy. This referendum is not legal, and after the fact, window dressing.  The Eurozone will be stronger after Greece.

Now we can move on, there are big things to do to move the project forward. Eu is not standing still.

EU will be stronger after cutting away dead weight (Greece), but how will they get their money back and who will enforce the payback ?
As far as i can tell, people are about to go frenzy over there, and it wont end well.

cheers

A principle of most societies is that if you borrow money, then you must repay it to the lender. The Greeks reject this principle.

That is the crux of the problem.

To fix this problem, Berlin and Paris should expel Athens from the Euro zone. The member states of the European Union should also expel Greece from that club.

Can't get the money back but atleast after a few decades in the wilderness (in which the Greeks live lives worse than, say, Belorussians), the Greeks will mend their ways.

[bryant.coleman]

A principle of most societies is that if you borrow money, then you must repay it to the lender. The Greeks reject this principle.

Wrong. The Greeks didn't rejected this principle. They never requested the troika to write off their debt. All they asked was for some more time and an extension of the deadlines. They promised the troika that they will make the payments once the economy picks up. It was the troika which refused to make the compromise.

[Erdogan]

A principle of most societies is that if you borrow money, then you must repay it to the lender. The Greeks reject this principle.

Wrong. The Greeks didn't rejected this principle. They never requested the troika to write off their debt. All they asked was for some more time and an extension of the deadlines. They promised the troika that they will make the payments once the economy picks up. It was the troika which refused to make the compromise.

Bollocks. They (the government of Greece) asked for money to pay back what they already owe, and then more. Every fucking day they needed more money. All they asked for was more money, repayment postponed into "the distant future" (Varoufakis).

[LiteCoinGuy]

Monday is going to be an interesting day...

[Erdogan]

All the debt is now imediately payable to the EU, the ECB and the IMF. So will the ELA, there is no liquidity assistance any more, and, as always have been known, the banks are insolvent, it was never only a liquidity issue.

And don't forget the TARGET2 imbalances, basically, it is money that should have been moved from greek businesses to their suppliers somewhere in EU, but the greek national bank basically stole it en route, to the detriment of the central bank in the country of the vendors. That's another hundred billion right there.

It is truly a tragedy, an absurd one too.

Someone just need to say it. It has still not been said.

[Xialla]

it seems that we had now impulse to kick bitcoin to the moon..local media are full of this greece finance issues and I'm just waiting for word bitcoin in related articles:)

[qiwoman2]

I have been watching the Greek Parliament all day till my eyes are square..I will give my view in depth tomorrow.. The fractional reserve Banking system that was concocted by a few dozen Jewish loansharks in 14th Century Venice is what has mushroomed out to the universal chaos we have today. LOANS AND INTEREST are what make the rich richer and the poor poorer. Greece was sucked in after WW2 into the western hemisphere of borrowing and debt .. The worst fiscal brainwashing on 3 generations of people. I remember in the olden days people lived within their means, humbly and with hard work. Now all we were taught is buy everything we can, bung it on a credit card and it doesn't matter who it will be paid later, as long as we wear the latest designer shoe and drive the latest german car.. We were idiots in the first place for allowing this yoke of fiscal oppression on us in the first place..Our ancestors believed in FREEDOM OR DEATH..WELL we are faced with the same choice today FREEDOM OR TROIKA.. So when you guys and gals go to the ballot box next Sunday your choice is FREEDOM OR DEATH (TROIKA)..I am Greek but I can't vote in Greece as I am a cypriot and british national..but I give Tsipras my vote of confidence because he has guts to challenge the Status Quo even though all the news channels have colluded with the greater powers that be to send the Greeks into panic mode.. One great thing Muslims have in their religion: NO INTEREST - RIBA IS HARAM..Now we wonder why there is a war waged against Muslims the world over..but that's another debate!

Greeks should be less scared and more confident of carving out their own future..They are not kids who should be sitting waiting to be spoon fed from the EU..They should stand up and be counted, rise and grind and make their own brilliant future, because THEY CAN.. Greeks were once pioneers not sheep..they should remember that and strive to make a new europe as they want it to be and a new Greece.. Jeroen Dijsselbloem is NOT your dad!