Hi, my name is Sonny Vleisides

[Chong Ciao]

I'm surprised no one has asked for his birth certificate to be posted. I know I'd feel a lot better about the company if we saw his birth record.

Seriously, the man shows incredible transparency here and some of you are grasping at straws to keep on bitching. Would this forum cease to exist if it was a discussion of ideas rather than a place to make up stories out of your head?

as long as you don´t post his birth certificate, your idea is a bitch of which you make up a story...sorry

[1714899330]

1714899330

[newMeat1]

It's interesting to watch the dirty laundry come out... BFL always gets it worst cause they're the clear leader.

An inside story about somebody who hates BFL -- this is fizzisist. He's pretty well-respected around here, at this point. He has been a strong BFL opponent from the beginning (for obvious $ reasons). When I started the X6500 with Li and fpgaminer, I invited fizzisist onboard. From my dealings with him, the guy came off as a real scumbag. The backstabbings came quickly. At one point he tried to drop the heatsinks off our boards to gain a few bucks profit off each, when heatsinks had clearly been promised. Anyways, I soon found myself on the outside of the group I had started. And the X6500 launch was delayed for a few months due to incompetence and bickering...

What's the moral of the story? Take your pick:
-Nothing whatsoever
-A public persona isn't always what it seems
-Scumbags can still sell good hardware
-It's always interesting to watch the pot call the kettle black.

All of that being said, my opinion is that BFL is probably safe to buy from. Personal identities are known, they've been visited in person, and they have a track record that's as good as any hardware maker (except maybe Ztex, his rep seems to be flawless). Clearly they're going to get rich either way... why wouldn't they choose the route that doesn't involve jailtime?

[finway]

Good response.

[Bitcoin Oz]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Abagnale
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Mitnick
I think everyone deserves a second chance. Sometimes they even make movies about them 

The fact Sonny can make a lot of money legitimately and bfl has an understandable business model makes me lean toward giving him the benefit of the doubt. Its not like hes offering 7% returns with no visible business model.

[blakdawg]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Abagnale
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Mitnick

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Minkow

[vampire]

In the US, I was preparing for my case.  It had been a long slog. My finances had dwindled to zero, leaving me with a free court appointed lawyer from the legal pool.  He showed me that the US federal system had a 97% conviction rate...  higher than the Russian courts under Stalin.  He calmly informed me that I was facing full life without possibility of parole as a first time white collar defendant.

I hope you know that comparing Stalin to Feds is beyond retarded?

[bitarrow]

I want to say to Sonny, that you and your company kind of deserved all this negative attention. The facts are, you lack any updates, no photos of equipment, no real specs, unknown location, and the best one, you hire (IMO) a jackass for public relations whose responses lack any good customer service skills and only add fuel to the fire for your company.

However, I am also satisfied with your response and I feel a little better about my money invested with you. People deserve second chances in life. Your older now, have a family, and I assume you realize that a longterm business is far more rewarding than a long con. Good luck to you and BFL !!!

[Severian]

I hope you know that comparing Stalin to Feds is beyond retarded?

Stalin would have been envious of what the NSA and other agencies setup in the Federal system. Hell, the president even has the legal power now to kill American citizens without due process. Not even Stalin had that.

[MrTeal]

I hope you know that comparing Stalin to Feds is beyond retarded?

Stalin would have been envious of what the NSA and other agencies setup in the Federal system. Hell, the president even has the legal power now to kill American citizens without due process. Not even Stalin had that.

Not sure if serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge

[Severian]

Not sure if serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge

Stalin's crimes against humanity were a result of his abuse of extra-legal power. The Executive Branch's abuses of power are utterly "legal" under US law.

[sgravina]

Hello, my name is Sonny Vleisides.

...

Kind regards,
Sonny Vleisides

This is exactly the kind of thing somebody pretending to be Sonny would say.

Prove it or you don't exist.

And, when my super computer arrives next week I expect it to power itself.

[MrTeal]

Not sure if serious...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge

Stalin's crimes against humanity were a result of his abuse of extra-legal power. The Executive Branch's abuses of power are utterly "legal" under US law.

The concept of extra-legal power is rather meaningless in a dictatorship, whether it is in communist Russia or any of the "Democratic Republics" out there. While I won't speak to whatever points you might think give the president the legal power to kill US citizens without due process of law, saying that Stalin would be envious of the powers of the POTUS is laughable. Call back when term limits are revoked, the entirety of the GOP is wiped out, the Clinton, Kennedys and other prominent democratic figures disappear or are executed on trumped up charges.

[fizzisist]

It's interesting to watch the dirty laundry come out... BFL always gets it worst cause they're the clear leader.

An inside story about somebody who hates BFL -- this is fizzisist. He's pretty well-respected around here, at this point. He has been a strong BFL opponent from the beginning (for obvious $ reasons). When I started the X6500 with Li and fpgaminer, I invited fizzisist onboard. From my dealings with him, the guy came off as a real scumbag. The backstabbings came quickly. At one point he tried to drop the heatsinks off our boards to gain a few bucks profit off each, when heatsinks had clearly been promised. Anyways, I soon found myself on the outside of the group I had started. And the X6500 launch was delayed for a few months due to incompetence and bickering...

What's the moral of the story? Take your pick:
-Nothing whatsoever
-A public persona isn't always what it seems
-Scumbags can still sell good hardware
-It's always interesting to watch the pot call the kettle black.

All of that being said, my opinion is that BFL is probably safe to buy from. Personal identities are known, they've been visited in person, and they have a track record that's as good as any hardware maker (except maybe Ztex, his rep seems to be flawless). Clearly they're going to get rich either way... why wouldn't they choose the route that doesn't involve jailtime?

I love it! Comparing me to a convicted felon that stole at least $19 million dollars from little old ladies in an elaborate international scheme. Instead of signing my emails under a false name, I always use my full name. Our company is registered under my name. All public information is freely available to anyone that looks for it. We have never represented our company as anything other than exactly what it is. Furthermore, I have never been convicted of a crime.

On the other hand, I understand that it might appear my motives are tainted by the fact that our company is a competitor. The truth is simply that I am appalled by this crime and even more appalled that very few people on this forum seem to have the reading comprehension to see that it does not match Mr. Vleisides' description in the least. If this turns out to be a scam, I would like to know that I did what little I could to help the community make an informed decision. The same goes for my early posts in the 1 GH/s, 20W, $499, is it for real? thread, when I made the case that their claims were outlandish and their website seems to represent themselves as something they are not. In the end, I and many others were correct, because they ended up delivering a markedly different product than they had promised, and still haven't delivered those "medical imaging" drivers for the Bitforce Single.

I truly hope that Butterfly Labs isn't running a long con here. The impact it would have on the bitcoin community, especially right after the Pirate fiasco, would be devastating. I care much more about that than our little business of selling mining hardware.

[mem]

Let's go easy on the witch hunting. Even though the Pirate thing is fresh on our minds, and BFL is kind of a sketchy company...even if this guy involved did actually intentionally defraud people in his past, they *are* delivering products at this time.

Your the type of person that lets a convicted child molester babysit their kids arent you.
Its ok, he learnt his lesson - its all in the past - why would he ever do the same thing again ?

[Lethos]

Guess the only thing I was hoping to hear is my parole office knows all what I'm doing in this new business, and is fine with the business or something to that extent, with some proof we could believe. Fact is regardless of the story, he does still have rules he is suppose to be abiding by, right? With how he operating a business right now, doing pre-orders on a large scale for products would count as going against those.

I could go into, not all of his story adds up, I imagine since he left some important details out, but that has already been discussed.

I am admit I've spoken out against BFL a few times, Mostly on the aspect of poor factual errors and shipping times, promises broken etc. But they still delivered in large amounts eventually so they weren't all bad.
I didn't suspect it as a scam, maybe a poorly run company as any could be as first getting into the business it is understandable they wouldn't get it right first time round.

This story has not made feel any better about BFL as a company.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

12 MF hours I've been researching this, and nobody let me in on that this thread was a goin'. Hell, I found everything on page one of this thread within the first 30 minutes of hunting, but felt it didn't warrant a mention. I've even started another thread, which I wouldn't have done if this thread was mentioned at least once in that the thread.

Damn, I'm the one who bought up the Laissez Faire City connection which, BTW, I've only begun with that. Speaking of which, Sonny was the editor of Laissez Faire City Newsletter. Johann Gevers (CEO Monetas, building Open Transactions) also played a major roll concerning Laissez Faire City, and he's partners with fellowtraveler. The investors of said entity have been trying for over a decade to recover lost funds due that fiasco.

Hello, my name is Sonny Vleisides.

...

Kind regards,
Sonny Vleisides

This is exactly the kind of thing somebody pretending to be Sonny would say.

Prove it or you don't exist.

And, when my super computer arrives next week I expect it to power itself.

But...he posted a picture taken in China Missouri on Christmas 2010!  What more proof do you need?

Edit: unsigned numbers in EXIF parsers are bad!

+1

Remains of Mark Kendall Bingham calling his mom on 911:

Hello, mom. This is Mark Bingham. You believe me don't you?

Don't get me wrong, I truly believe in second chances. But the onus is squarely on Sonny to provide most everything requested of him (within reason, of course). proving to this community that the only thing we have to fear is what's in our fucked up minds, otherwise BFL is nothing but a Big Fuckin' Lie.

~Bruno~

[thebaron]

Let's go easy on the witch hunting. Even though the Pirate thing is fresh on our minds, and BFL is kind of a sketchy company...even if this guy involved did actually intentionally defraud people in his past, they *are* delivering products at this time.

Your the type of person that lets a convicted child molester babysit their kids arent you.
Its ok, he learnt his lesson - its all in the past - why would he ever do the same thing again ?

We are either animals who spend our lives making excuses for ourselves not to act like one, or we just need to learn to be able to love and be loved by others. I'd like to believe at least some of us who have made mistakes that have hurt others are finally able to make peace with ourselves.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Laissez Faire City:  Queue forms for capitalist utopia 2 July 1995

"It is an amazing adventure, aimed at freeing the potential of the
world's entrepreneurs from the vice of collectivism," said Sonny Vleisides,
a computing consultant who is among the founders. "If you want to dig a well
on your property and provide yourself with water, then you dig a well.
There's nobody to tell you your well is too deep, too wide, or interferes
with the water table."

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Clearly, the following shows that the lottery scheme was going on during the Laissez Faire City scheme.

Lottery scam indictment dismissed against California man

The company misrepresented itself as a government-backed or legitimate lottery company affiliate. Victims of the scheme lost approximately $20 million.

The scheme itself lasted for more than 15 years before federal agents shut it down in July 2006 according to an A.M. Costa Rica article published about the case on March 14, 2007.

[RoloTonyBrownTown]

Meh, this community is full of an amazing amount of dicks.

In Sonnys case I can only go by my own experience.   When BFL first came on the scene and the same wannabe detectives were crucifying them for "definitely being a scam", Sonny was never anything more than professional to me in our email dealings.    He got my singles out when he said he would and went out of his way to specifically upgrade my unit with extra heatsinks to account for the Australian summer.

No scamming in sight, and he seemed like a nice enough guy.   He even referenced his father passing away during that time, and that was by way of apologising for not responding promptly for a week or so.  I honestly couldn't care less about his past, though I understand how it would turn people off.  If that's the case, simply don't give him your money.

I'm well and truly over this community, it's horrible.  Bitcoin has no chance while this place remains the way it is.  Shame on you all.