cryptotipz scammed on Just-Dice

[dooglus]

1. On June 27th, Just-Dice player tasha borrowed 800 CLAMs from v1rtu0so and never paid them back. The 800 CLAMs were lost playing dice. v1 didn't go public about the scam, hoping that tasha would return and he could somehow get his coins back.

2. On July 3rd, Just-Dice player psygambler was approached by cryptotipz calling themselves KingDice and talked into lending him 1000 CLAMs to gamble with. KingDice claimed to be able to win, and said he would return the winnings.

KingDice managed to turn the 1000 CLAMs into 1400 CLAMs, and was trying to use the /tip command to return them but accidentally sent the coins to the wrong userid.

The CLAMs were immediately withdrawn from the site by the wrongful recipient, and so there was no way the tip could be reversed.

Much discussion followed with people arguing about whether it was a genuine mistake or not.

3. About a week ago, 'tasha' was seen on bitdice.me bragging about how she had stolen from v1rtu0so:



Shortly after that she lost heavily:



After talking with v1rtu0so and Alex (owner of bitdice.me) it turned out that the tasha on bitdice had the same IP address as KingDice at Just-Dice, and blockchain analysis show that she was playing with the same 1400 CLAMs that belonged to psygambler but had been 'accidentally' tipped to a third party by KingDice.

4. Yesterday, a new player arrived on Just-Dice, calling themselves BabyDice. BabyDice told v1rtu0so about how he had recently lost 1300 CLAMs at bitdice, giving details that only tasha@bitdice would know. Careful analysis of the JD logs showed me that this was KingDice. He won a bunch of CLAMs and I froze his account. I challenged him about his scamming. He claimed twice to have no connection to KingDice, but finally admitted that he was the same person. Then he denied having ever played at bitdice, that he had made up the story he told v1 based on things he had heard.

5. And now, BabyDice made this statement on Just-Dice:

<babyDice> I have a confession to make everyone
<babyDice> * I am KingDice, I am responsible for PSY's 1400 MISTIP, I am fully responsible. My Full statement here: http://privatepaste.com/96c3226416
<babyDice> CLAM INDEX, doog has my account with 3000 CLAMs under his lock. He will tip psy back his 1.4K , I am not if he will give me the rest of my money though
<babyDice> Please read my full statement: I am truly sorry: http://privatepaste.com/96c3226416
<babyDice> I'm truly sorry v1, and just because I said it, although I didn't do it, if Doog decides to give you a 1000 from me just because I was rude and played on it, I am fine with it

http://privatepaste.com/96c3226416

I have a confession I need to make. I’ll try to make it simple to not
spam the chat. 1). I am KingDice, 2). I am fully and wholly
responsible for psy’s 1400 CLAM “misstip” which really was nothing
but. A few weeks ago I won a lot of CLAMs on KingDice, and then lost a
lot, near 4.1k. In the midst of that, I let my greed get to me and I
decided the fastest way to get some bankroll again would be to take
investments, so I took 1000 CLAMs from psy, and turned it into
1400. After I got to 1400, I became even more selfish and decided that
I would fake a misstip so i could go and dice it into more and keep
the majority of the profits to myself. I was wrong, and I was greedy,
and I stand fully condemned. I moved those CLAMs over to bit dice and
I started dicing, I made it to 1900, but then I quickly lost 600 and
came down to 1300, then in one bet at 66% I lost it all. I also said
some things in the chat about scamming people such as v1 which I
didn’t, but I got full of myself and pretended to be tasha who took a
loan from v1 for 1000 CLAMs. IDK why I did this, I guess thats what
pride can do to you. Anyways, after this I only had 5 BTC worth of USD
left in the bank so I bought and created a new account, now babyDice,
with 667 CLAms purchased from v1, I made it to 3500+ profit. Right now
the account has 3000 CLAMs and is under lock and control by dooglus. I
suspect he will soon tip 1.4K CLAM back to psy as he rightly
deserves. I let my greed get ahead of me and I hurt a lot of people, I
sincerely apologize to Bluewaffle and all the others who rightly
called me out and for lying to them and everyone else that I didn’t
misstip the 1400. I am very sorry and I know my trust will never be
rebuilt, I don’t even deserve forgiveness, but for my own conscious
sake, I am coming clean. I am truly sorry to everyone here who
supports me for failing you and being such a terrible example. I am
really deeply sorry.

So I've returned the 1400 CLAMs to psygambler, since that is undoubtedly the correct thing to do.

It is unclear to me what to do with the remaining 1600 CLAMs. KingDice has said to v1 "if Doog decides to give you a 1000 from me just because I was rude and played on it, I am fine with it" - so I figure I should return the 800 CLAMs v1 is out. That leaves 800 more CLAMs.

I need to check the logs and see if there's anyone else KingDice has defrauded.

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[dooglus]

Suggestions for what to do with the other 800 CLAMs:

1. 14:29:32 (1148325) <psygambler> → (1) <@dooglus> If theres was 3000 clams looked on baby dice account, he should pay my other loss of 800 clams in the desperation on getting my scammed money back

[cryptospout]

Personally I would give a chunk to v1 and psy and tip the rest as the winnings don't technically belong to him. You could argue that it should go back into the bankroll except he was gambling on two sites it would be hard to defend who gets what.

[psy112]

Suggestions for what to do with the other 800 CLAMs:

1. 14:29:32 (1148325) <psygambler> → (1) <@dooglus> If theres was 3000 clams looked on baby dice account, he should pay my other loss of 800 clams in the desperation on getting my scammed money back

I think the splitting part between me and V1 would be the right one, then we can tip the one we want to give some extra clams.

[dooglus]

Personally I would give a chunk to v1 and psy and tip the rest as the winnings don't technically belong to him. You could argue that it should go back into the bankroll except he was gambling on two sites it would be hard to defend who gets what.

It would be fun to give the left over coins to a bot to gamble with until they were gone. But they're not mine to do that with.

I've given v1 his 800 back, since KingDice said he would be OK with it even if I gave him 1000. So there's 827.68994335 left.

If I don't find evidence of any other scamming by KingDice I figure I give those back to him.

I hesitate to ask if anyone else was scammed by KingDice, because I worry it will bring forth a horde of people trying it on. But - well, were you?

I think the splitting part between me and V1 would be the right one, then we can tip the one we want to give some extra clams.

I can see how that would work for you, but would it really be right? I don't see it.

You can claim that you only gambled because he took your coins, but that doesn't make it right to take back your losses from him.

[psy112]

I can see how that would work for you, but would it really be right? I don't see it.

You can claim that you only gambled because he took your coins, but that doesn't make it right to take back your losses from him.

But I have logs on my Skype talking to Kinddice about my losses during the desperation of gotten scammed! How i emptied my all btc saving to try to win it back. (stupid as it sounds) Blue know it too, talked to him during that time thru msg in chat

So the loss was all because of King, lost another 6 on Fortune jack, so emptied every btc i owned.

I'm not begging or anything, just think that would be the right thing to do!

If you do a crime, you pay the victim for the mess caused! That's how it's done in court!

But ok if you got another better solution. Because I'm still happy for you saving my ass with the 1400

[dogedice.me]

Well, Dooglus described it in full there's not much I can add to this story.

I do like the tendency that we can stop scammers and I appreciate Dooglus's cooperation on this and his willingness to help. However it was more like I was helping Dooglus with it and he did all the hard work.

Regards,
Alex

[cryptospout]

Personally I would give a chunk to v1 and psy and tip the rest as the winnings don't technically belong to him. You could argue that it should go back into the bankroll except he was gambling on two sites it would be hard to defend who gets what.

It would be fun to give the left over coins to a bot to gamble with until they were gone. But they're not mine to do that with.

I've given v1 his 800 back, since KingDice said he would be OK with it even if I gave him 1000. So there's 827.68994335 left.

If I don't find evidence of any other scamming by KingDice I figure I give those back to him.

I hesitate to ask if anyone else was scammed by KingDice, because I worry it will bring forth a horde of people trying it on. But - well, were you?

I think the splitting part between me and V1 would be the right one, then we can tip the one we want to give some extra clams.

I can see how that would work for you, but would it really be right? I don't see it.

You can claim that you only gambled because he took your coins, but that doesn't make it right to take back your losses from him.

but can you really say they are his? I see what you are saying about returning the others but the fact is if he did not steal those coins he would not have them. You could argue that he came clean and deserves to keep the winnings but I don't believe a thief gets to keep the things he has stolen even if he has plead guilty. My opinion however is hes getting off very easy hes not being prosecuted, but if you let him walk away with almost 2k usd earned from stolen money it would numb the sting of his actions surely.

[Cyrax89721]

Keep the coins as "raffle coins" to use for any upcoming giveaways that would happen.

[dooglus]

but can you really say they are his? I see what you are saying about returning the others but the fact is if he did not steal those coins he would not have them. You could argue that he came clean and deserves to keep the winnings but I don't believe a thief gets to keep the things he has stolen even if he has plead guilty. My opinion however is hes getting off very easy hes not being prosecuted, but if you let him walk away with almost 2k usd earned from stolen money it would numb the sting of his actions surely.

As I understand it, the 800 coins that were stolen from v1 were lost almost immediately (and may not even have been stolen by KingDice, although he said he was OK with me repaying v1 with his coins) and the 1400 stolen from psygambler were lost on bitdice already. The 3000 coins I froze were mostly new winnings made by the "BadyDice" account. It seems to me like KingDice had debts of 1400 (plus maybe 800) which have now been paid off. I understand the "he's a scammer, take all his coins as punishment" point of view, but don't agree with it.

[Cyrax89721]

but can you really say they are his? I see what you are saying about returning the others but the fact is if he did not steal those coins he would not have them. You could argue that he came clean and deserves to keep the winnings but I don't believe a thief gets to keep the things he has stolen even if he has plead guilty. My opinion however is hes getting off very easy hes not being prosecuted, but if you let him walk away with almost 2k usd earned from stolen money it would numb the sting of his actions surely.

As I understand it, the 800 coins that were stolen from v1 were lost almost immediately (and may not even have been stolen by KingDice, although he said he was OK with me repaying v1 with his coins) and the 1400 stolen from psygambler were lost on bitdice already. The 3000 coins I froze were mostly new winnings made by the "BadyDice" account. It seems to me like KingDice had debts of 1400 (plus maybe 800) which have now been paid off. I understand the "he's a scammer, take all his coins as punishment" point of view, but don't agree with it.

I remember you mentioning that the 'charles ray' account was on the same IP as the bittrex-richie account.   Not too sure how that would tie into any of this, but there it is.

[dooglus]

I remember you mentioning that the 'charles ray' account was on the same IP as the bittrex-richie account.   Not too sure how that would tie into any of this, but there it is.

After scamming KingDice, the 'richie' scammer gained access to KD's password, due to KD posting it on IRC. I saw that KD had logged in from the same address as 'charles ray' and figured that meant that richie and charles were the same person. But in fact it meant that KD and charles were the same person.

Of course, maybe KD faked posting his password in IRC and is in fact richie too, and is responsible for all of richie's scams too. I don't know any more - that's just wild speculation. KD swears he didn't scam anyone except psygambler, but KD has shown him self over and over again to be dishonest and so that claim is not worth anything.

Edit:

richie ranting on QD's account:

2015-06-19 04:04:16 (1155785) <QueenDice> fuck u guys
2015-06-19 04:04:22 (1155785) <QueenDice> fuck u king
2015-06-19 04:04:32 (1155785) <QueenDice> i got u earlier for the 360
2015-06-19 04:04:38 (1155785) <QueenDice> and you dumbfuck put ur pw in irc wrong
2015-06-19 04:04:55 (1155785) <QueenDice> i.imgur.com/U8lAo5f.png
2015-06-19 04:06:31 (1155785) <QueenDice> i'll be b ack
2015-06-19 04:06:40 (1155785) <QueenDice> under richie or someone else
2015-06-19 04:06:47 (1155785) <QueenDice> done this tons times overs
2015-06-19 04:07:22 (1155785) <QueenDice> i'll cu in a week, thx for the 360, i be back for mores

KingDice talking to himself before faking the mistip:

2015-07-03 18:06:54 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] u do good
2015-07-03 18:07:05 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] thx for tip btw
2015-07-03 18:07:09 (1153598) [ (1153598) <KingDice> → (1166572) <charles ray> ]  what tip?
2015-07-03 18:07:33 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] u gav 0.01 tip to scabby > me but u no respond to that account no more so i make new
2015-07-03 18:09:21 (1166572) <charles ray> gl king member me in ur kingdom
2015-07-03 18:10:31 (1166572) <charles ray> he win easy
2015-07-03 18:10:37 (1166572) <charles ray> has he play b 4
2015-07-03 18:12:23 (1166572) <charles ray> lol
2015-07-03 18:13:49 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] gg
2015-07-03 18:15:19 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] gg
2015-07-03 18:26:44 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] nice hits
2015-07-03 18:28:59 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] nice nice nice!
2015-07-03 18:29:28 (1166572) <charles ray> amazng hits
2015-07-03 18:30:13 (1166572) <charles ray> cool
2015-07-03 18:30:27 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] yay!
2015-07-03 18:30:49 (1166572) [ (1166572) <charles ray> → (1153598) <KingDice> ] k
2015-07-03 18:31:08 (1153598) ACTION (tip, "104.238.169.87") success: public tip sent 1401 CLAM from (1153598) KingDice to (1166572) charles ray
2015-07-03 18:31:29 (1166572) ACTION (withdraw, "176.53.21.219") success: 1399.99900000 to xXQLJvdtfnQm5LAuXfMumN2G6t7cSZGMDT txid 4aa2be3e88c72d446eb0675e2b2aee5e466bb7f460fb501e02c413cff792a6d3
2015-07-03 18:32:01 (1166572) <charles ray> u fucking idiot
2015-07-03 18:32:04 (1166572) <charles ray>
2015-07-03 18:32:08 (1166572) <charles ray> i fuck you over
2015-07-03 18:32:12 (1166572) <charles ray> and more ass holes
2015-07-03 18:32:30 (1166572) <charles ray> fuck you all
2015-07-03 18:32:36 (1166572) <charles ray> fuck you king, v1, warren
2015-07-03 18:32:39 (1166572) <charles ray> u ass holes

[BitcoinDistributor]

He should never have won anything Dooglus. I would gift it out to the victims of the scam in all honesty. Hes a degenerate who will never stop, hes shown us that at least 5 times and I called him out for def being a future scammer about 2-3 weeks ago - oh look turns out I was right...

[TigerTatas]

I'm not a lawyer, but as a citizen and so-far so-fair member of the world, I do know that grand larceny is punishable by large fines and possible jail sentence. Cryptotipz has admittedly stolen 1400CLAM/11.19587BTC (at time of writing). That is not petty.

As a generally trusting and non-violent human, I'd like to see his coins returned to him and for him to be a productive member of the crypto community. He appears intelligent, so this is another example of a good mind wasted.

However, I feel if his coins are returned, it will red alert the rest of the scammers to an easy target. If stealing and getting caught carries a punishment of simply a "reset", then why would a scammer go anywhere else to try and steal?

Keep his remaining 800 balance. Find any balances he has on any other associated accounts.

If we have to be nice about it, let him decide what to do with it, but returning it to himself shouldn't be an option.

KingDice, you are better than this. Get your shit together and do positive in the community, or get out. In the real world, you'd go to jail. Consider how peaceful and kind most everyone has been to you even when it was a bit obvious that they shouldn't be. We are somewhat a family, don't stab us in the back.

Dooglus, thanks for proving every day (for the most part) why playing at just-dice.com is the safest place to play.

Alex, I don't know you, but thanks for your help as well. I will check your site out now due to your efforts in keeping the players safe.

-TigerTatas

[Arrogantx]

Very interesting how everything turned out, and I'm overjoyed to see that the funds were returned to Psy and V1rt alike. Regarding the remaining Clam I believe they should be split between the detectives You (Dooglus) and V1rt. Without v1rt this would have most likely never come to light at all and without your follow up it would have been at a stand still.  Great job v1rt and doog for taking action against people that try to scam.

[shitaifan2013]

justice has been served, at least a little, which is very nice to see 

if you can't decide what to do with the leftover clams, what about some kind of promo/prize? the way I understand it, it was investor money KD won with his scam money, and those investors would surely agree to some additional traffic to get it back.

[Quickseller]

There are people on Just Dice who are willing to lend out ~7.7BTC without collateral and to top that off it was a gambling loan I don't think I have seen anyone even try to take out that large of a loan without collateral by anyone with any kind of reputation.

I would also think that those types of loans would be banned on JD as they would only cause problems (as evidenced by this thread), and there is probably not any kind of reputation system on JD.

The obvious solution to this would be to return any excess CLAMs that are not used to repay any loans he took out. Anything else would be scamming him, which is not a good thing to do, even if he is a scammer.

[BayAreaCoins]

I vote pay v1rt back his loan and give the guy back the CLAMS he won.

Next time he fucks around in JD like that his shit gets taken.

Everyone walks away happy that way.

Can't really scam the scammer sadly .

[Cyrax89721]

I would also think that those types of loans would be banned on JD as they would only cause problems (as evidenced by this thread), and there is probably not any kind of reputation system on JD.

Loans aren't allowed on JD and everybody there is reminded of it constantly.  More-so recently because of KingDice.  Can't really help it when the JD chat room is used more as a proxy for people that PM each other organizing these ridiculous gambling loans.

On another note, I suppose we can thank KingDice for pushing Dooglus to implement the new Tip Confirmation and Escrow systems?

[andulolika]

There are people on Just Dice who are willing to lend out ~7.7BTC without collateral and to top that off it was a gambling loan I don't think I have seen anyone even try to take out that large of a loan without collateral by anyone with any kind of reputation.

I would also think that those types of loans would be banned on JD as they would only cause problems (as evidenced by this thread), and there is probably not any kind of reputation system on JD.

The obvious solution to this would be to return any excess CLAMs that are not used to repay any loans he took out. Anything else would be scamming him, which is not a good thing to do, even if he is a scammer.

Psy didnt lend to him, Psy gave coins to him to gamble with and both to get profits off it. Eitherway everything got fixed now and as Cyrax said, we got tip confirmation and escrow system,.