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Author Topic: Not Bitcoin XT  (Read 19373 times)
chek2fire
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August 17, 2015, 12:42:25 AM
 #1

This is a special fork for those who do not agree with the blocksize scheduled increase as proposed by Gavin and Mike in their divisive altcoin fork, "Bitcoin XT".

This version can be used to protect the status quo until real technical consensus is formed about the blocksize.

This version is indistinguishable from Bitcoin XT 0.11A except that it will not actually hard fork to BIP101, yet appears on the p2p network as Bitcoin XT 0.11A replete with features, yet at a consensus level behaves just like Bitcoin Core 0.11. If it is used to mine, it will produce XT block versions without actually supporting >1MB blocks.

Running this version and/or mining with XT block versions will make it impossible for the Bitcoin XT network to detect the correct switchover and cause a premature fork of anyone foolish enough to support BIP101 without wide consensus from the technical community.

It prevents correct detection of Bitcoin XT adoption in the wild since usage will be known to have been tampered with and thus all statistical data gathered by getnodes can only be considered unreliable.

https://github.com/xtbit/notbitcoinxt#not-bitcoin-xt

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JorgeStolfi
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August 17, 2015, 01:28:10 AM
 #2

YESSS!!! Bitcoiners trying to hurt bitcoiners over some stupid political squabble!

The world has not seen such entertainment since Christians killed Christians over the right way to be a Christian in the Thirty Years' War

Academic interest in bitcoin only. Not owner, not trader, very skeptical of its longterm success.
jl2012
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August 17, 2015, 01:29:40 AM
 #3

getnodes is never reliable as people can always use a botnet to run whatever clients they want. All you are doing is to make XT looks stronger, thank you.

For mining, >90% miners are not anonymous, and >68% has already announced their supports to a block size increase. They may not adopt XT, but don't you believe they will sabotage XT with their real names?

Nice try and try harder.

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iCEBREAKER
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August 17, 2015, 01:34:29 AM
 #4

This is a special fork for those who do not agree with the blocksize scheduled increase as proposed by Gavin and Mike in their divisive altcoin fork, "Bitcoin XT".

This version can be used to protect the status quo until real technical consensus is formed about the blocksize.

This version is indistinguishable from Bitcoin XT 0.11A except that it will not actually hard fork to BIP101, yet appears on the p2p network as Bitcoin XT 0.11A replete with features, yet at a consensus level behaves just like Bitcoin Core 0.11. If it is used to mine, it will produce XT block versions without actually supporting >1MB blocks.

Running this version and/or mining with XT block versions will make it impossible for the Bitcoin XT network to detect the correct switchover and cause a premature fork of anyone foolish enough to support BIP101 without wide consensus from the technical community.

It prevents correct detection of Bitcoin XT adoption in the wild since usage will be known to have been tampered with and thus all statistical data gathered by getnodes can only be considered unreliable.

https://github.com/xtbit/notbitcoinxt#not-bitcoin-xt

OMG a spoof node?  Gimme!  Nobody could have possibly predicted this would happen!

BRB lighting up some data centers...

Heh, XT now has us right where we want it...  Wink

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004


Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't
iCEBREAKER
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August 17, 2015, 01:37:52 AM
 #5


All you are doing is to make XT looks stronger, thank you.


"All warfare is based on deception.  If your opponent is vain, flatter him."  - Sun Tzu

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004


Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't
achow101
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August 17, 2015, 01:53:25 AM
 #6

This is such a terrible idea. Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT, it will just cause the fork to happen before consensus occurs and if enough people were using that fork, you suddenly just screwed over Bitcoin. Please don't do this, it is such a bad idea. Have you actually considered the consequences of a premature fork? If you haven't, please do think about what could happen to the Bitcoin network if a premature hard fork occurs.

Are you the reason that it looks like Bitcoin XT is gaining traction on bitnodes?

jl2012
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August 17, 2015, 01:56:52 AM
 #7

This is such a terrible idea. Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT, it will just cause the fork to happen before consensus occurs and if enough people were using that fork, you suddenly just screwed over Bitcoin. Please don't do this, it is such a bad idea. Have you actually considered the consequences of a premature fork? If you haven't, please do think about what could happen to the Bitcoin network if a premature hard fork occurs.

Are you the reason that it looks like Bitcoin XT is gaining traction on bitnodes?

No worry, asking mining pools to run this crap is even harder than asking them to run the real XT.

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jl2012
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August 17, 2015, 02:02:23 AM
 #8

Think twice before you run this:

1. Have you reviewed the code?

2. This thing does no real harm unless you are really mining. With >90% of mining pools are not anonymous, do you think they will use their real name to run a spoof client?

3. Running XT means you support BIP101. Period.


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Bitcoin Wizards Wiki: https://8333.info/
achow101
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August 17, 2015, 02:31:22 AM
 #9

Think twice before you run this:

1. Have you reviewed the code?
I just looked at the code and it looks like the only things changed are two lines which change the date from 1452470400 (11 Jan 2016 00:00:00 UTC) to UINT_MAX which IIRC is 4294967295 (02/07/2106 @ 6:28am (UTC)). So he didn't actually stop the hard fork in those clients, but rather postponed it for another 91 years. OP, you should fix that.

2. This thing does no real harm unless you are really mining. With >90% of mining pools are not anonymous, do you think they will use their real name to run a spoof client?

3. Running XT means you support BIP101. Period.
Exactly. It has the same features (double spend relaying, etc.) and it uses the same block versions. The only difference is that it will not accept the forked block as valid for another 91 years.

iCEBREAKER
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August 17, 2015, 02:57:03 AM
 #10

This is such a terrible idea. Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT, it will just cause the fork to happen before consensus occurs and if enough people were using that fork, you suddenly just screwed over Bitcoin. Please don't do this, it is such a bad idea. Have you actually considered the consequences of a premature fork? If you haven't, please do think about what could happen to the Bitcoin network if a premature hard fork occurs.

This is such a wonderful idea.  It protects Bitcoin, at the necessary expense of XT viability.

"Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT?"  To cultivate a falsely exaggerated sense of security and encourage premature aggression.  It's a trap!

Are you the reason that it looks like Bitcoin XT is gaining traction on bitnodes?

There's no way for anyone to know.  That's the point!

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004


Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't
lottery248
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August 17, 2015, 03:02:51 AM
 #11

avoid from using the XT, unless you are sure that the XT would not break the bitcoin protocol.
XT would ever encourage the centralisation, they knew that they could attempt 51% attacks as we could not afford for the storage anymore,
XT node (BIP101 wallet) are not suitable to the newbies at all.

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August 17, 2015, 03:18:09 AM
 #12

This is such a terrible idea. Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT, it will just cause the fork to happen before consensus occurs and if enough people were using that fork, you suddenly just screwed over Bitcoin. Please don't do this, it is such a bad idea. Have you actually considered the consequences of a premature fork? If you haven't, please do think about what could happen to the Bitcoin network if a premature hard fork occurs.

This is such a wonderful idea.  It protects Bitcoin, at the necessary expense of XT viability.

"Why would you want to spoof Bitcoin XT?"  To cultivate a falsely exaggerated sense of security and encourage premature aggression.  It's a trap!

So what happens when a premature fork happens? What happens when some exchanges are using XT, some aren't. Some people are using XT and others aren't. Now you have exactly the situation which having the threshold in XT prevents, two separate blockchains operating with (possibly) equal power. Now there are two Bitcoins. What do we do then? This is what could happen if people start using this node fake XT node. Again, as I have said before, such a fork is a terrible idea, and this modified XT node will only make the likelihood of such a fork worse.

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August 17, 2015, 03:22:08 AM
 #13

I'll stand on record as saying that I am currently running either an actual XT node, or a non-XT node that is self-reporting as XT.

I'll leave it up to the reader to decide for themselves which of the two they believe I am actually running.

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August 17, 2015, 05:44:59 AM
 #14

Now there are two Bitcoins. What do we do then?

Taint and sell one of them in order to purchase more of the other with the proceeds.

If you aren't the sole controller of your private keys, you don't have any bitcoins.
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August 17, 2015, 06:19:39 AM
 #15

Can I use PseudoNode as a proxy for my Not Bitcoin XT nodes, to multiply their effect?

PseudoNode can now pretend to be Bitcoin XT.

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004


Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't
basil00
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August 17, 2015, 09:58:30 AM
 #16

Can I use PseudoNode as a proxy for my Not Bitcoin XT nodes, to multiply their effect?

PseudoNode can now pretend to be Bitcoin XT.

FYI:

PseudoNode is already a type of p2p proxy.  You can download it from here and spoof an XT node directly from a console:

Code:
pseudonode --stealth --coin=bitcoin-xt

or for Windows users:

Code:
PseudoNode.exe --stealth --coin=bitcoin-xt

from a CMD console.

Next go to getaddr.bitnodes.io and if everything is working your IP will show up an an XT node and be counted towards the total  (if not, then probably port 8333 is blocked).  Alternatively, you can pretend to be Bitcoin-core (Satoshi:0.11.0):

Code:
pseudonode --stealth

For those wondering: a PseudoNode is a type of cryptocurrency network node that uses network heuristics (rather than the normal validation method) to validate data.  To the network, a pseudo node appears to be the same as a normal full node, (a pseudonode will relay blocks and transactions just like a regular full node).  However, unlike a normal node, a pseudo node is very fast, and will "sync" with the network within seconds (no lengthy blockchain download is required).  For more information about what PseudoNode is, see here and here.  For those wondering: the network heuristics used by PseudoNode are quite strong in practice -- it is non-trivial to "trick" PseudoNode into relaying invalid data -- although it is theoretically possible.

The point of all this is that node votes-by-user-agent are, in principle, pretty much useless.  It is trivial for anyone to turn their IP address into a "node" at near-zero storage/memory/CPU cost.  This is also one of the reasons why incentivized full nodes don't work.

That all said, for obvious reasons it is better to run proper validating nodes (e.g. even Not Bitcoin XT) rather than pseudo nodes.  My post is provided for information reasons only...
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August 17, 2015, 01:32:47 PM
 #17

This is gentlemen:



 Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  David Chaum 1996
"Monero" : { Private - Auditable - 100% Fungible - Flexible Blocksize - Wild & Free® - Intro - Core GUI - Podcats - Roadmap - Dice - Blackjack - Github - Android }
MoneroForCash.com  |  Buy and sell XMR near you  |  Easymonero.com  |  Bitsquare.io - Decentralized XMR Exchange
Fungibility provides privacy as a side effect.  Adam Back 2014

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016
Blocks must necessarily be full for the Bitcoin network to be able to pay for its own security.  davout 2015
Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives.  Jeff Garzik 2013


"I believed @Dashpay instamine was a bug & not a feature but then read: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg13017231#msg13017231
I'm not against people making money, but can't support questionable origins."
https://twitter.com/Tone_LLT/status/717822927908024320


The raison d'être of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
It is an Engineering Requirement that Bitcoin be “Above the Law”  Paul Sztorc 2015
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015

Bitcoin is intentionally designed to be ungovernable and governance-free.  luke-jr 2016

Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013

The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004


Warning Dash is a planned instamine, it wasn't
forlackofabettername
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August 17, 2015, 06:44:35 PM
 #18

I think it's a great thing to have this BUT now you caused a spike in xt nodes that some might misinterpret. Probably xt is about to die off because nobody wants it but now you start hosting nodes for it and probably already own 50% or more of all xt nodes.

Now keep in mind there is the risk here to fork the network. I would prefer letting xt die off instead of forcing the fork with fake nodes. I think this program went public a little bit too soon.

Well, one thing's certain: after anti-xt people now own probably north of 50% of all xt nodes that Gavincoin-junk lies dead in the water.

Well done guys. Just don't fork her up now!

"If you see fraud and don't shout fraud, you are a fraud"
  -- Nassim Taleb
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August 17, 2015, 07:11:52 PM
 #19

I think the best way to protect the status quo until real technical consensus is formed about the blocksize is to run more Bitcoin Core "/Satoshi:0.11.0/ (70002)" Full Nodes. So if you can afford the cost install and run Bitcoin Core 0.11.0. ASAP.

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August 17, 2015, 07:15:11 PM
 #20

Well, people adopt this way quicker than they do xt...  Grin

"If you see fraud and don't shout fraud, you are a fraud"
  -- Nassim Taleb
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