Bitcoin halving to be canceled?

[sidhujag]

This is what is called "exploring conditional or imaginary situations". It is not a matter of whether I believe in that or not, absolutely. I'm just saying that a thing like that would be like "a bolt out of the blue (sky)", that is, something completely unexpected. Or, in other words, a total Black Swan event (in Nassim Taleb's terms). If you, nevertheless, still insist on a yes/no answer, then no, I don't believe that it will happen...

But this is not to say that I would be quite surprised if the cancellation (or an attempt thereat) does happen after all

Not only I would be extremely surprised, but I would immediately dump all my coins before Bitcoin is destroyed.
But, it won't happen, so I will happily keep my bitcoins 

Earlier, in the thread, I have given the reasons why I think the cancellation of halving is a must-do thing (that is, the cap on the number of coins mined should be removed). In fact, Dogecoin had also been initially capped at some limit (100B coins if I'm not mistaken), but later they wisely removed the cap, and now it has a constant monetary inflation rate in terms of new coins, and, consequently, a constantly diminishing monetary inflation rate in relative terms...

If they don't do something like that with Bitcoin, it will implode sooner or later

Have you ever read Satoshi's white paper? You can find it here: https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
He says: Once a predetermined number of coins have entered circulation, the incentive can transition entirely to transaction fees and be completely inflation free

I don't quite understand what this quote refers too. Bitcoin will implode just like all financial pyramids do in due course, not because there will be no more coins to mine and miners would power off...

If that was your point, of course

Unless 1 btc was 1 million and going up.. even a few satoshi would be enough to mine a tx

[deisik]

Earlier, in the thread, I have given the reasons why I think the cancellation of halving is a must-do thing (that is, the cap on the number of coins mined should be removed). In fact, Dogecoin had also been initially capped at some limit (100B coins if I'm not mistaken), but later they wisely removed the cap, and now it has a constant monetary inflation rate in terms of new coins, and, consequently, a constantly diminishing monetary inflation rate in relative terms...

If they don't do something like that with Bitcoin, it will implode sooner or later

Have you ever read Satoshi's white paper? You can find it here: https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
He says: Once a predetermined number of coins have entered circulation, the incentive can transition entirely to transaction fees and be completely inflation free

I don't quite understand what this quote refers too. Bitcoin will implode just like all financial pyramids do in due course, not because there will be no more coins mined and miners would power off...

If that was your point, of course

Being inflation free is the best benefit we can have with bitcoins, apparently we are all investors here and why we patronize bitcoins because we expect that it could give us a good benefits and maybe make a fortune out of it.

But there is always a limit to such growth

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

[Dell.India]

Why canceling the halving, i think it is programmed on that way that when the next 210,000 blocks are reached (on this halving it will happen on the 420,000th block), miners can not decide to approve or vote to cancel or not the halving. Let's see what will happen in less than 2 days.

Technically they can (if the majority wants to). On the other hand, they will never do something that would destroy their business. So, don't worry!

I'm sure that at least the canceling of halving is not going to happen in the next two days, but if they have the power it does not mean that they should cancel this. But if they cancel what will happen next? Will the next halving be 12.5 or less than that!! I understand the miners, they would be happy if this will happen!

As of now mining reduction would 12.5 only however will wait and watch the future halving. I could say this halving provides good value of bitcoins now. It's almost double the value now.

[Redrose]

Earlier, in the thread, I have given the reasons why I think the cancellation of halving is a must-do thing (that is, the cap on the number of coins mined should be removed). In fact, Dogecoin had also been initially capped at some limit (100B coins if I'm not mistaken), but later they wisely removed the cap, and now it has a constant monetary inflation rate in terms of new coins, and, consequently, a constantly diminishing monetary inflation rate in relative terms...

If they don't do something like that with Bitcoin, it will implode sooner or later

Have you ever read Satoshi's white paper? You can find it here: https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
He says: Once a predetermined number of coins have entered circulation, the incentive can transition entirely to transaction fees and be completely inflation free

I don't quite understand what this quote refers too. Bitcoin will implode just like all financial pyramids do in due course, not because there will be no more coins mined and miners would power off...

If that was your point, of course

Being inflation free is the best benefit we can have with bitcoins, apparently we are all investors here and why we patronize bitcoins because we expect that it could give us a good benefits and maybe make a fortune out of it.

But there is always a limit to such growth

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

Your reply is kinda caricatural. Long-term holders will probably never sell their bitcoins. As for exemple, I will never sell mine, since the purpose of Bitcoin is to be the money, not to be traded for money once its value compared to fiat will have grown to a certain point. I don't count in fiat money, but only in Bitcoin. For me the biggest problem in a global Bitcoin acceptance if that people are counting their money, even when in Bitcoin, in fiat. For me 0,01BTC is 0,01BTC, not 9,274$.

[deisik]

Being inflation free is the best benefit we can have with bitcoins, apparently we are all investors here and why we patronize bitcoins because we expect that it could give us a good benefits and maybe make a fortune out of it.

But there is always a limit to such growth

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

Your reply is kinda caricatural. Long-term holders will probably never sell their bitcoins. As for exemple, I will never sell mine, since the purpose of Bitcoin is to be the money, not to be traded for money once its value compared to fiat will have grown to a certain point. I don't count in fiat money, but only in Bitcoin. For me the biggest problem in a global Bitcoin acceptance if that people are counting their money, even when in Bitcoin, in fiat. For me 0,01BTC is 0,01BTC, not 9,274$

Really, I'm quite happy that there are people who are willing to hold the bag for us, opportunistic traders and short-term holders. But, to be honest, I don't typically believe when people start claiming similar things, that they will hold no matter how small or high the price might be. Not that I'm saying that they are deliberately lying, they may definitely think so when they say something to that tune. But as the saying goes, when money talks bullshit walks. People are not very reliable in this aspect, given how many things can affect their opinion...

Any sane person would exchange his bitcoins for fiat if he was in urgent need for money (e.g. due to contingency or other adverse events)

[Redrose]

Being inflation free is the best benefit we can have with bitcoins, apparently we are all investors here and why we patronize bitcoins because we expect that it could give us a good benefits and maybe make a fortune out of it.

But there is always a limit to such growth

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

Your reply is kinda caricatural. Long-term holders will probably never sell their bitcoins. As for exemple, I will never sell mine, since the purpose of Bitcoin is to be the money, not to be traded for money once its value compared to fiat will have grown to a certain point. I don't count in fiat money, but only in Bitcoin. For me the biggest problem in a global Bitcoin acceptance if that people are counting their money, even when in Bitcoin, in fiat. For me 0,01BTC is 0,01BTC, not 9,274$

Really, I'm quite happy that there are people who are willing to hold the bag for us, opportunistic traders and short-term holders. But, to be honest, I don't typically believe when people start claiming similar things, that they will hold no matter how small or high the price might be. Not that I'm saying that they are deliberately lying, they may definitely think so when they say something to that tune. But as the saying goes, when money talks bullshit walks. People are not very reliable in this aspect, given how many things can affect their opinion...

Any sane person would exchange his bitcoins for fiat if he was in urgent need for money (e.g. due to contingency or other adverse events)

Except if we talk about no-life nerds, everyone has "normally" a job that gives him a regular paycheck in fiat money. With that, you don't need to sell your precious bitcoins in case something goes wrong. It seems that you don't believe in Bitcoin if you claim such statements. For me Bitcoin is the money to be of the Internet, so there will always people to "hold the bag", expression that I don't like since that means that they're left alone (is this even possible considering the amount of people there is actually and to come ?) with worthless things.

[deisik]

Really, I'm quite happy that there are people who are willing to hold the bag for us, opportunistic traders and short-term holders. But, to be honest, I don't typically believe when people start claiming similar things, that they will hold no matter how small or high the price might be. Not that I'm saying that they are deliberately lying, they may definitely think so when they say something to that tune. But as the saying goes, when money talks bullshit walks. People are not very reliable in this aspect, given how many things can affect their opinion...

Any sane person would exchange his bitcoins for fiat if he was in urgent need for money (e.g. due to contingency or other adverse events)

Except if we talk about no-life nerds, everyone has "normally" a job that gives him a regular paycheck in fiat money. With that, you don't need to sell your precious bitcoins in case something goes wrong. It seems that you don't believe in Bitcoin if you claim such statements. For me Bitcoin is the money to be of the Internet, so there will always people to "hold the bag", expression that I don't like since that means that they're left alone (is this even possible considering the amount of people there is actually and to come ?) with worthless things.

It is nice to have a good well-paid and satisfying job. Nevertheless, you don't know what expenditures you may have to incur in the future. And they may well burn through not only your fiat reserves but through your Bitcoin stash as well. You don't need to trust me, just read about what happened to Hal Finney, and how his early mined bitcoins helped him...

Even though he himself at first seemed to have abandoned Bitcoin as left for dead



In respect to my own attitude toward Bitcoin, I'm not particularly married to Bitcoin, there is life out there

[criptix]

You guys are just feeding a sig spamming clown.

In respect to my own attitude toward Bitcoin, I'm not particularly married to Bitcoin, there is life out there

Says the guy who has 11+ k posts  

Deisiks job is to spam on this forum for sig pennies. On top of that edit majoritymost of the time he doesnt even know what he is talking about...^^"

[Supercrypt]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon.

[deisik]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

[sidhujag]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

You sound like a good candidate for my 15kusd contest tom.

Whitepaper.syscoin.org

[deisik]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

You sound like a good candidate for my 15kusd contest tom.

Whitepaper.syscoin.org

There is too little time left to get prepared for the contest

But if you still think that I'm a good candidate, you can just give me a consolation prize of sorts, I don't mind. Other than that, what are the real benefits of Syscoin before Bitcoin? Does it provide a working implementation of distributed decentralized exchange, at least, for these two cryptocurrencies? I perused the white paper and caught a glimpse of something like that. As I got it, Syscoin is a spin-off of Bitcoin, so there shouldn't be insurmountable difficulties in implementing this feature, right?

Deisiks job is to spam on this forum for sig pennies. On top of that majority of time he doesnt even know what he is talking about...^^"

Go learn basic grammar as I told you. Majority is used with reference to people or a number of things. You can't say majority of time, you should say most of time, or just most time. And stop making clown of yourself finally

[carlerha]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

You sound like a good candidate for my 15kusd contest tom.

Whitepaper.syscoin.org

There is too little time left to get prepared for the contest

But if you still think that I'm a good candidate, you can just give me a consolation prize of sorts, I don't mind. Other than that, what are the real benefits of Syscoin before Bitcoin? Does it provide a working implementation of distributed decentralized exchange, at least, for these two cryptocurrencies? I perused the white paper and caught a glimpse of something like that. As I got it, Syscoin is a spin-off of Bitcoin, so there shouldn't be insurmountable difficulties in implementing this feature, right?

Deisiks job is to spam on this forum for sig pennies. On top of that majority of time he doesnt even know what he is talking about...^^"

Go learn basic grammar as I told you. Majority is used with reference to people or a number of things. You can't say majority of time, you should say most of time, or just most time. And stop making clown of yourself finally

i think you see people in this form from all over the world. and there are many people how first language is not English, They are using English as their secondary language therefore they may not be too good in English, i think you should appreciate their effort and should ignore their mistake related to grammar, i think it is enough for you if you understand what he want to tell.

[criptix]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

Bitcoin is the biggest decentralised open-source and most secure computational and financial network.
How can you possibly say that it has no intrinsic value?
Alone the infrastructure (i.e. asics) are worth hundreds of millions $.

Bitcoin is 7 years old now and we are still at the beginning of the adoption curve (much less then 10 million user).

The reason is that people want to be independent and bitcoin gives them the power to be so.



Btw. Correct would be: most of the time. Learn some grammar! 

[deisik]

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

Bitcoin is the biggest decentralised open-source and most secure computational and financial network.
How can you possibly say that it has no intrinsic value?
Alone the infrastructure (i.e. asics) are worth hundreds of millions $.

Bitcoin is 7 years old now and we are still at the beginning of the adoption curve (much less then 10 million user).

The reason is that people want to be independent and bitcoin gives them the power to be so

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

If Bitcoin lost a utility for speculation (as well as transactional utility as a currency, however small it might be), it would be worthless despite all the millions invested in mining equipment. When railroads quickly evolved in the 19th century, inland navigation declined as fast, and all those expensive ships and boats became mostly worthless. So how can this utility or value be possibly called intrinsic at all if it can be taken away so easily?

Btw. Correct would be: most of the time. Learn some grammar!

Google is your friend indeed, but you still don't have a clue what you are talking about. Most of time basically means almost always (just what you actually meant to say, though incorrectly), while most of the time refers to a specific period of time which should be understood from the context. Below is a real example from which you may try to comprehend the difference (you can also do some google-fu, there are plenty of such examples out there):

It’s not about you talking most of time [i.e. always talking] but it’s about you listening the most of the time[i.e. listening when you are being talked to]

If you still fail to get it, the difference is essentially the same as between most people (i.e. people collectively) and most of the people (i.e. a specific group of people). Thus, instead of claiming that you know 30 languages, you'd better master at least one

[criptix]

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

Bitcoin is the biggest decentralised open-source and most secure computational and financial network.
How can you possibly say that it has no intrinsic value?
Alone the infrastructure (i.e. asics) are worth hundreds of millions $.

Bitcoin is 7 years old now and we are still at the beginning of the adoption curve (much less then 10 million user).

The reason is that people want to be independent and bitcoin gives them the power to be so

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

If Bitcoin lost a utility for speculation (as well as transactional utility as a currency, however small it might be), it would be worthless despite all the millions invested in mining equipment. When railroads quickly evolved in the 19th century, inland navigation declined as fast, and all those expensive ships and boats became mostly worthless. So how can this utility or value be possibly called intrinsic at all if it can be taken away so easily?

Nonsense again. In your context the intrinsic value of boats and ships are the means of transportation which it still has until today and will have (atleast) in the next coming 50 years.
That is why majority of goods are transported via ultra large cargo ships.
Even if we would just talk about inland transport: dependent on nation, water transportation is still widely used.

Also how can bitcoin lose its transactional utility? We had backlogs of 50+ mb several times this year and the price more the doubled since january.

Btw. Correct would be: most of the time. Learn some grammar!

Google is your friend indeed, but you still don't have a clue what you are talking about. Most of time basically means almost always (just what you actually meant to say, though incorrectly), while most of the time refers to a specific period of time which should be understood from the context. Below is a real example from which you may try to comprehend the difference (you can also do some google-fu, there are plenty of such examples out there):

It’s not about you talking most of time [i.e. always talking] but it’s about you listening the most of the time[i.e. listening when you are being talked to]

If you still fail to get it, the difference is essentially the same as between most people (i.e. people collectively) and most of the people (i.e. a specific group of people). Thus, instead of claiming that you know 30 languages, you'd better master at least one

Most of the time is correct because it means on most occasions - hard to believe but there are times you arent spreading bs.
(Everyone can just look this up in an english dictionary)

Let me paraphrase:

You are spreading bullshit on most occassions.

Btw. I asked a fellow who is a graduate in anglistics and he said it is correct what i said (re: most of the time)

Tell me which google page said you were correct? 

[sidhujag]

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

It is true that at some point that the bitcoin will go down eventually but even if the price begins to stagnate people who are holding may not start selling, I mean they have supported and heled bitcoin for a long time why should they start selling when the price starts dropping, and from I see it many merchants and service providers are starting to accept it as a payment method so we shouldn’t be afraid of it going down soon

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

You sound like a good candidate for my 15kusd contest tom.

Whitepaper.syscoin.org

There is too little time left to get prepared for the contest

But if you still think that I'm a good candidate, you can just give me a consolation prize of sorts, I don't mind. Other than that, what are the real benefits of Syscoin before Bitcoin? Does it provide a working implementation of distributed decentralized exchange, at least, for these two cryptocurrencies? I perused the white paper and caught a glimpse of something like that. As I got it, Syscoin is a spin-off of Bitcoin, so there shouldn't be insurmountable difficulties in implementing this feature, right?

Deisiks job is to spam on this forum for sig pennies. On top of that majority of time he doesnt even know what he is talking about...^^"

Go learn basic grammar as I told you. Majority is used with reference to people or a number of things. You can't say majority of time, you should say most of time, or just most time. And stop making clown of yourself finally

A decentralized marketplace not exchange. Yes it exists, its commercial-grade quality used by real people right now. It's just starting to kind of slow we need nicer web UIs for average joes but you can get the wallet and try it out now. Its what Satoshi had in his original reference design but was taken out due to lack of resources at the time. There is a section on mechanism design that allows Syscoin to flourish even in the face of mining rewards ending (not susceptible to mining incentive attacks such as Selfish-mining and undercutting).

Too bad you missed out.. was some good fun!

[Amph]

Being inflation free is the best benefit we can have with bitcoins, apparently we are all investors here and why we patronize bitcoins because we expect that it could give us a good benefits and maybe make a fortune out of it.

But there is always a limit to such growth

Really, trees don't grow to the sky. When Bitcoin price begins to stagnate, many long-term holders will like to cash out and call it a day. If Bitcoin doesn't get traction as a means of payment among merchants and service providers till then (which would render speculation inconsequential), it may suffer heavy losses and its price will decline. Obviously, we are still far from that point of saturation and can safely continue to speculate with bitcoins without risking to turn into the only ones left standing and holding the bag

Your reply is kinda caricatural. Long-term holders will probably never sell their bitcoins. As for exemple, I will never sell mine, since the purpose of Bitcoin is to be the money, not to be traded for money once its value compared to fiat will have grown to a certain point. I don't count in fiat money, but only in Bitcoin. For me the biggest problem in a global Bitcoin acceptance if that people are counting their money, even when in Bitcoin, in fiat. For me 0,01BTC is 0,01BTC, not 9,274$

Really, I'm quite happy that there are people who are willing to hold the bag for us, opportunistic traders and short-term holders. But, to be honest, I don't typically believe when people start claiming similar things, that they will hold no matter how small or high the price might be. Not that I'm saying that they are deliberately lying, they may definitely think so when they say something to that tune. But as the saying goes, when money talks bullshit walks. People are not very reliable in this aspect, given how many things can affect their opinion...

Any sane person would exchange his bitcoins for fiat if he was in urgent need for money (e.g. due to contingency or other adverse events)

and why? you can go ahead and simply use your coin instead of wasting fee on exchanging them for fiat, there are many service that accept bitcoin

when bitcoin will reach a very large scale and almost everyone will accept it, it's there that you will not need fiat anymore

it's all about merchants acceptance, if for example amazon or any real supermarket that deliver foods where already accepting bitcoin nowadays, why i should exchange them for fiat? no sense

another thing to help this is that we need employers that pay you in bitcoin directly, because buying it to use it like fiat, it's also no-sense to me, this is another reason why many are not bothering with bitcoin for now...

[deisik]

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

Bitcoin is the biggest decentralised open-source and most secure computational and financial network.
How can you possibly say that it has no intrinsic value?
Alone the infrastructure (i.e. asics) are worth hundreds of millions $.

Bitcoin is 7 years old now and we are still at the beginning of the adoption curve (much less then 10 million user).

The reason is that people want to be independent and bitcoin gives them the power to be so

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

If Bitcoin lost a utility for speculation (as well as transactional utility as a currency, however small it might be), it would be worthless despite all the millions invested in mining equipment. When railroads quickly evolved in the 19th century, inland navigation declined as fast, and all those expensive ships and boats became mostly worthless. So how can this utility or value be possibly called intrinsic at all if it can be taken away so easily?

Nonsense again. In your context the intrinsic value of boats and ships are the means of transportation which it still has until today and will have (atleast) in the next coming 50 years.
That is why majority of goods are transported via ultra large cargo ships.
Even if we would just talk about inland transport: dependent on nation, water transportation is still widely used.

Also how can bitcoin lose its transactional utility? We had backlogs of 50+ mb several times this year and the price more the doubled since january

Transactional utility is a utility which is intrinsic to money, but not money token. In other words, money cannot exist without it. It just wouldn't be money without it, that's why it is intrinsic to it (conceptually), but money tokens (bitcoins, gold coins, paper bills) possess this utility only as long as they are used as money (as a means of payment specifically). If money tokens are no longer used as money (and stop being money tokens at that), they evidently lose this utility. So how can transactional utility be intrinsic to Bitcoin if it can easily lose it?

Strictly speaking, there is no intrinsic value or utility in the realm of real things

Let me paraphrase:

Consult a dictionary and your linguist every time you post here

[criptix]

Because holding doesn't make much sense

Especially, if we are talking about an asset which has no intrinsic value of its own and could easily lose all its speculative worthiness which it has right now. I don't mean today or tomorrow, I'm trying to look further into the future. Could Bitcoin price remain the same over, say, a ten-year time span? As I see it, this is hardly possible. It is basically neck or nothing in the long run for Bitcoin, either win or get nowhere. Indeed, some people may want to hold till the end, but it simply doesn't make sense in the latter case

Bitcoin is the biggest decentralised open-source and most secure computational and financial network.
How can you possibly say that it has no intrinsic value?
Alone the infrastructure (i.e. asics) are worth hundreds of millions $.

Bitcoin is 7 years old now and we are still at the beginning of the adoption curve (much less then 10 million user).

The reason is that people want to be independent and bitcoin gives them the power to be so

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

If Bitcoin lost a utility for speculation (as well as transactional utility as a currency, however small it might be), it would be worthless despite all the millions invested in mining equipment. When railroads quickly evolved in the 19th century, inland navigation declined as fast, and all those expensive ships and boats became mostly worthless. So how can this utility or value be possibly called intrinsic at all if it can be taken away so easily?

Nonsense again. In your context the intrinsic value of boats and ships are the means of transportation which it still has until today and will have (atleast) in the next coming 50 years.
That is why majority of goods are transported via ultra large cargo ships.
Even if we would just talk about inland transport: dependent on nation, water transportation is still widely used.

Also how can bitcoin lose its transactional utility? We had backlogs of 50+ mb several times this year and the price more the doubled since january

Transactional utility is a utility which is intrinsic to money, but not money token. In other words, money cannot exist without it. It wouldn't be money without it, that's why it is intrinsic to it, but not money token (bitcoins, gold coins, paper bills) possess this utility only as long as they are used as money (as a means of payment specifically). If money tokens are no longer used as money, they evidently lose this utility. So how can transactional utility be intrinsic to Bitcoin if it can easily lose it?

Strictly speaking, there is no intrinsic value or utility in the realm of real things

Are you on meth or any other drugs?

Dont you feel embrassed talking about grammar?
Not even talking about the meaning, which tops pretty much everything i read so far on this board.