Turkey shoots down russian military plane on Syria border

[galdur]

Well, I don´t think acting like homicidal maniacs and running roughshod over country after country for freakin decades killing and maiming and displacing millions is indicative of any special peacefulness. Maybe I should post the list from say 1953.

Well, I wouldn't tag America to the description you just provided. But I completely respect your opinion and can understand (at most) that the view of the world from your eyes is different from the view from mine. (At least I'd love to see your list, maybe PM me.)

Aside from this specific talk, isn't the hardest thing about country politics is that the stories of the motivation or rationale for one decision or another, or one agreement that leads to another, can go on for decades? Look at Palestine and Israel. If you look at the last 60 days of action you may think "oh this one side is completely out of line!" But if you look at the last 60 years of action you could think "this other side started it all!"

(Israel and Palestine were just an example)

But once decades go by you have a new generation that has inherited a problem that for some reason is so serious it can't be forgotten by the new generation.

Maybe we all need just have a reset. Forget what happened before...let's start tomorrow trying to work with each other rather than against each other. What a different world that could be. Nice talking to you...

All right. It may be that when you talk about America and its supposed urge for world peace you mean more the population than the maniacs in charge. And if so I could probably agree with that. Yet; someone has to vote those people into power, assuming that the elections can be taken seriously.

[twn]

3- 2 russian aircraft pass inside turkish border and in 5 minutes 10 times warned by turkish army.but they didnt reply. Maybe they dont know english lol. Also turkey gave the radar pictures to media but nothing comes from russian side.

Have You listen the Turkish report??
They claim 17 seconds "inside Turkish territory", how they could warning for 5 minutes the Russian bomber and how fast they fly?
Flycontrol not registered interception from Turkish Aircrafts.
And US forces are still watching on radar registrations, with NO COMMENT.

First warn was 30miles away from border. 2 russian aircraft was coming tru the border. So they wait 5 minutes before attack.they attack after russian aircrafts enters the border, btw on turkish media also radio calls published. Also usa confirm the radio calls even usa radars listen that radio talk during that happening.No reply comes from russian aircrafts. On the border turkish jets all the time patrolling btw thats why they went there so quick.anyway diyarbakir airbase is so close to border. And that airbase full with aircrafts cause of syria.
Just for info im not supporting any act but turkey warns russia more than couple times about violations even last week russian embassy informed about these situation but they dont care. So instead of 2 they just attack on 1 aircraft as a warning.

[catch.me.if.you.can]

The Turkey people are uncivilized. Watch the movie "Midnight Express (1978)".

[Vika NSFW]

#First warn was 30miles away from border.

 2 russian aircraft was coming tru the border. So they wait 5 minutes before attack.they attack after russian aircrafts enters the border, btw on turkish media also radio calls published. Also usa confirm the radio calls even usa radars listen that radio talk during that happening.No reply comes from russian aircrafts. On the border turkish jets all the time patrolling btw thats why they went there so quick.anyway diyarbakir airbase is so close to border. And that airbase full with aircrafts cause of syria.
Just for info im not supporting any act but turkey warns russia more than couple times about violations even last week russian embassy informed about these situation but they dont care. So instead of 2 they just attack on 1 aircraft as a warning.

8:25 p.m.

Turkey says that two planes violated Turkish airspace before it shot down one of them, which crashed in Syrian territory.

In a letter to the U.N. Security Council and Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon, it said the jet it shot down disregarded 10 warnings to change course.

The letter from Turkey's U.N. Ambassador Halit Cevik said "two SU-24 planes, the nationality of which are unknown," approached Turkish airspace in the Yayladagi-Hatay region.

The letter, obtained Tuesday by The Associated Press, said both planes, at an altitude of 19,000 feet, disregarded warnings and violated Turkish airspace "to a depth of 1.36 miles and 1.15 miles in length for 17 seconds" just after 9:24 a.m.

"Following the violation, plane one left Turkish national airspace," the letter said. "Plane two was fired at while in Turkish national airspace by Turkish F-16s performing air combat patrolling in that area in accordance with the rules of engagement."

It said the second plane crashed on the Syrian side of the border.

---

This is called "no interception operations", no operations for visual contact.
And radar control show, that turkish aircraft shot Russian aircraft over Syrian territory.

What the fucking idea is "warning" Russian bombers on 50 km of distance?
There is a direct telephone line with Moscow build for such problems, why they give no calls, and how there was people with zoom cameras and internet connection?

[Balthazar]

1-i hate erdogan but today he is right maybe the first time

Yeah, right... Violation of sirian border and attack against your own (former) partner is a wise way of thinking, indeed. Especially when he has over $100 billion of investments in the joint projects of your country, and able to withdraw these funds.

2- nato will support of couse Turkey. Do you know what is ally meaning? Thats why Obama and nato will talk on the side for Turkey

NATO is just a mutual defence agreement. It obliges other members to provide military support in case if you're a victim of aggression. Nobody is obliged to do anything if you've committed an unprovoked act of aggression against the 3rd party. Nobody will come to save Erdogan's ass, he's alone this time.

3- 2 russian aircraft pass inside turkish border and in 5 minutes 10 times warned by turkish army.but they didnt reply. Maybe they dont know english lol. Also turkey gave the radar pictures to media but nothing comes from russian side.

4- after that turkish air forces attack but they just drop one russian warplane.

Could you give any evidence for this bullshit, please? Even NATO Secretary General stated that Turkish side didn't provide anything.

5- not even Russia will attack Turkey. Its not happening like that. Do you know how much does it cost to Russia if they try that? As economical they cant pay that.

That's not neccessary, they will simply take their money back and freeze all participation in the joint projects, including the Akkuyu Nuclear Power Plant. Then, after putting food embargo and buying some popcorn, they will sit down and enjoy watching your economic collapse. Congratulations are going to Erdogan & his ISIS friends.

6- of course Putin will talk with treats but nothing will be happen
7- in a week everything will turn back normal.
8- summer 2016 antalya will be fullof russians again

In fact, "something" already happens right now, while we're talking on this forum. Turkish budget have had more than $7 billion per year from russian tourists. Government is going to ban flights to Turkey, two major tour operators already have stopped selling the tickets. And this is just a beginning.

Cheers

Same for you, please keep dreaming and continue watching TV. Your dear ISIS president Erdogan will provide you with sufficient amount of reliable news.

[zenitzz]

ISIS is supported by the US, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Jordan and Kuwait. They're extremely butt hurt that the Russians are destroying their terrorists that they're using to try to achieve their political goals.

[Vika NSFW]

http://lifenews.ru/news/171620

Fly radar

red - su-24
green - F16

[Starin]

Sad to see racist idiots lives in year 2015. Wake up the fuck up you little prick, they are fucking washing your brain with all the race, religion bullshit.

You have no idea what a war is. A war has too many aspects, not just the military force. Economics, world politics are strongly involved. Anyway, I'm not gonna take my time to explain how the politics work to idiot racists like you. Someday there will be no nations, no races. You guys are just outdated idiots.

OK... I get it. Anyone who disagree with you is an idiot and a racist. How many times do you scream "racist" in a day? I have noticed that you have done it two times in a single post against two different users. I would admit that it is an intelligent method to run away from the arguments, when you don't have anything to reply.

You basically call a group of people animals because of their "race", "nationality". You are brainwashed as rest of the world and you have no idea what is really going on in Middle East. We are at the edge of finding new life forms in space and you still argue about races, religions. So intelligent!

Oh, Location: Thule
Do you even know what that means?

[galdur]

Well, since Turkey Day is just around the corner and Turkey just laid an egg it´s probably worth mentioning that a turkey is about as dumb as a bird can be. Terms such as turkey shoot and turkey trap exist for a very good reason.

[Balthazar]

[Ankara]

I have so much fun when I read this thread, especially for the comments from people who doesn't even know where Middle East is. Thanks for the laugh guys.

[Balthazar]

https://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/669204928984915968/photo/1

And still no real evidence, only empty claims.

[galdur]

I wonder how people, that hardly know where the Middle East is on the globe, figure 15-20,000 ISIS terrorists got from Europe to the sands of Iraq and Syria. Hint: no, there are no flights from Frankfurt, Paris and London to ISISland there in the desert. 

[connexus]

Whether the Russian fighter violated Turkish airspace remains to be seen. But Turkey has not been seriously interested in taking on the ISIS. Instead, it has been the conduit through which ISIS's oil is sold into the world market.

The Russian bombing campaign is propping up Assad government while seriously disrupting ISIS oil trade. It is in Turkey's interest to discourage the Russians. Turkey's overriding concern is the rise of the Kurds. Its recent air raids against ISIS are overwhelmingly aimed at the Kurds.

[frank0929]

It's not about Russia, Turkey have right to shoot any flying machine inside their borders. If it was another countries plane they still shoot it anyway. They didn't even know it was a Russian plane when they shot it.

[galdur]

Erdogan himself after Syria shot down a Turkish warplane violating Syrian airspace in 2012

"A short-term border violation can never be a pretext for an attack,"

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-18584872

What short and/or selective memories people have....

[frank0929]

Erdogan is well known for his exact opposite discourse. He do the same thing all the time. He's the worst hypocrite I've ever seen.

[pungopete468]

It's not about Russia, Turkey have right to shoot any flying machine inside their borders.

Not when that plane is exiting Turkish airspace and flying non-aggressively. They knew there was no threat, and it's coming out now that the plane was likely fired upon after leaving Turkish airspace. This is coming from US intel after reviewing the heat signature of the missile launch, the plane was fired upon after having already left Turkish airspace... Also, Turkey is claiming the plane was in Turkish airspace for 17 seconds. That equates to an air speed of 243 mph. Given the path claimed by the Turkish government, the plane would have been in Turkish airspace for roughly 5 seconds.

If it was another countries plane they still shoot it anyway. They didn't even know it was a Russian plane when they shot it.

You're joking right? Just because they "claim" not to know doesn't mean they don't actually know. Of course they do! The on-board radar systems identify planes, SAM sites, and other radar signals based on its waveform and emission characteristics... Both the tracking and spotting radar systems of an attacking plane will identify and compare the radar emissions from the target plane against a database of known waveforms, and it even displays the designation of the aircraft on the radar screen...

This was believed to be an infrared tracking missile, they call them "mad dogs" when fired without a radar lock, and will target any target within range having the highest heat signature. They fire these to avoid warning the target with a "missile lock". The pilots don't get all the warning lights and buzzers going off about that incoming missile when fired this way...

You believe they didn't know who they were firing on? Please... They knew exactly whose flag they were flying under, where they launched from, where they flew their mission, and what type of aircraft it was. You think they don't track these planes as they fly in the sky? Give me a break...

[galdur]

One of the Pilots of Downed Su-24 Saved by Syrian Army - Envoy


Sputnik International  7:56 am

One of the two pilots from the Russian Su-24 which was downed by two Turkish F-16s Tuesday morning has been rescued by the Syrian Army, according to Russia's envoy to France, as cited by Reuters.

[Balthazar]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/25/us-mideast-crisis-syria-turkey-impact-idUSKBN0TE04M20151125

So, Erdogan lied just as usual.