Wall Street Crash Begin

[Pab]

 Massive sell of on all major stocks,Nasdaq DowJones over 2%down why .Carl  Icahn explanation is. If you haven’t seen ‘Danger Ahead’ watch it on http://www.carlicahn.com . Unfortunately I believe the meltdown in High Yield is just beginning

Should read this, especially if you are in the market: “Like Icahn, SEC Sees 'Danger Ahead' in These Risky ETFs


http://www.thestreet.com/story/13394908/1/like-icahn-sec-sees-danger-ahead-in-these-risky-etfs.html

The rule would require the ETFs to "limit the amount of leverage the fund may obtain through derivatives," according to an SEC statement. They also would have to set aside cash or other assets to guarantee their trades and set up risk-management programs. The rule will be published on the agency's website and in the Federal Register, and the SEC will take feedback for 90 days afterward.

The proposal threatens to slow a fast-growing corner of the booming industry for ETFs, which have proliferated as a vehicle for investors to bet on everything from share prices to bonds -- including high-yield securities that rarely trade. Assets in U.S. ETFs have more than doubled in the past five years to $2.15 trillion, according to ETF.com.

Debt economy is going to crash

[1714042200]

1714042200

[1714042200]

1714042200

[1714042200]

1714042200

[Rubberduckie]

I have a lot of dividend plays and I sold some options against
my underlying stock to bank some profits in case we drop more.
I definitely can see a pullback but not as bearish as you but think
we could drop more.

[Pab]

I have a lot of dividend plays and I sold some options against
my underlying stock to bank some profits in case we drop more.
I definitely can see a pullback but not as bearish as you but think
we could drop more.

I can only say follow Carl  Icahn tweeter ,and  read  his personal site.Look today stock indexes

[johnyj]

There are many guys calling a bond bubble burst, in reality how is that going to play out?

Suppose that when interest rate rise, people all selling their bond for money, resulting a crash of the bond price, what would that impact economy? Which bond holder is going to be hurt most? Pension fund and social security fund?

[Amph]

there is a chance that some of those guys are now investing in bitcoin? or it's just pure dreaming?

usually if some other market fall another one should increase

[dloghwak]

I have a lot of dividend plays and I sold some options against
my underlying stock to bank some profits in case we drop more.
I definitely can see a pullback but not as bearish as you but think
we could drop more.

I can only say follow Carl  Icahn tweeter ,and  read  his personal site.Look today stock indexes

If you go batshit crazy for every 2 % drop, you will face a heart attack sooner than you might think.
Carl Icahn can't predict the future either and might be just talking his own book.
Just start investing and stop speculating and you should be way less worried about the future.

[Pab]

I have a lot of dividend plays and I sold some options against
my underlying stock to bank some profits in case we drop more.
I definitely can see a pullback but not as bearish as you but think
we could drop more.

I can only say follow Carl  Icahn tweeter ,and  read  his personal site.Look today stock indexes

If you go batshit crazy for every 2 % drop, you will face a heart attack sooner than you might think.
Carl Icahn can't predict the future either and might be just talking his own book.
Just start investing and stop speculating and you should be way less worried about the future.

Send your thoghts to Sec,becouse SECi s worry not only about USA but also world economy becouse of massive speculation on derivatives.2.5trilions$ dollarow owned by biggest USA bank notso much for USA citzensns to pay from hiso wn pockets.Youwill simply eat only Monsanto

[fachant]

The crash is caused by the dropping of commodity prices. That affect the commodity company. Those companies borrowed too much, it might affect the whole banking system.

[Sir_lagsalot]

I personally have seen this change too. Something big is afoot. I think, like you, we have another GFC on our hands. And I have a strong feeling it's related to China's fall. Maybe it'll be good for bitcoin, people will start trying to change their fiat into other assets like bitcoin, or keep all their money in cash. I've listened to a podcast where s man kept eight hundred thousand us dollars worth of euros underneath his fridge xD

[Denker]

there is a chance that some of those guy are now in vesting in bitcoin? or it's just pure dreaming?

usually if some other market fall another one should increase

This is how the game goes.
Wealth is never destroyed.It is merely transferred.And this means that at the opposite of every crisis (crashing markets) there is an opportunity. You just have to make sure to be on the right side.
Going to be interesting.
Wasn't this month planned to raise the rates by the FED? Let's see how this will play out.

[HeroCat]

If you mean main stock markets - they are global, not only in USA, but also in Europe and Asia. I do not think, that there can be global crash in stock market and also largest countries, like USA, UK have stable economy. 

[maku]

I don't care about stock market as much, as I don't invest in it. But I know everything is connected, so is this could it be the cause of bitcoin price suddenly stop rising and is reverting?

[The Sceptical Chymist]

People use fear to sell you everything,  don't buy into this crapola.  Stock market indexes were down less than 3%!  That not a hell of a lot.

[hunnaryb]

People use fear to sell you everything,  don't buy into this crapola.  Stock market indexes were down less than 3%!  That not a hell of a lot.

Not yet anyway.

[helloeverybody]

Even if they did crash,  what would this mean for btc?  Price go up?

[RenegadeMind]

Even if they did crash,  what would this mean for btc?  Price go up?

Yes. The price always goes up on bad economic news. Or rather, on really bad economic news, e.g. Cyprus.

People panic buy, and BTC is a great choice as it is highly liquid. Keep in mind that in some places during crises people have been buying ovens and refrigerators to keep their wealth. Those aren't very liquid.

[Pierre 2]

there is a chance that some of those guy are now in vesting in bitcoin? or it's just pure dreaming?

usually if some other market fall another one should increase

This is how the game goes.
Wealth is never destroyed.It is merely transferred.And this means that at the opposite of every crisis (crashing markets) there is an opportunity. You just have to make sure to be on the right side.
Going to be interesting.
Wasn't this month planned to raise the rates by the FED? Let's see how this will play out.

I completely agree with this. And wealthy people always will be on best side to stay wealthy.
Big crisis creates bigger opportunities

[USB-S]

there is a chance that some of those guy are now in vesting in bitcoin? or it's just pure dreaming?

usually if some other market fall another one should increase

This is how the game goes.
Wealth is never destroyed.It is merely transferred.And this means that at the opposite of every crisis (crashing markets) there is an opportunity. You just have to make sure to be on the right side.
Going to be interesting.
Wasn't this month planned to raise the rates by the FED? Let's see how this will play out.

I completely agree with this. And wealthy people always will be on best side to stay wealthy.
Big crisis creates bigger opportunities

But if the massive amounts of wealth are being transferred to bitcoin, then doesn't that mean... Oh my god.
Bitcoins speculators, how much time we've got left until the "crash" happens?

[NorrisK]

Even if they did crash,  what would this mean for btc?  Price go up?

Yes. The price always goes up on bad economic news. Or rather, on really bad economic news, e.g. Cyprus.

People panic buy, and BTC is a great choice as it is highly liquid. Keep in mind that in some places during crises people have been buying ovens and refrigerators to keep their wealth. Those aren't very liquid.

I don't think bitcoin is liquid enough to cover this types of panic buying.. Some 10-50 mil a day, of which it is likely that a lot is just being changed between the same hands on a daily basis would only result in a massive spike, up until people don't think it is worth it anymore.

Also, there will likely be some lagging phase as people figure out how to even buy bitcoins.

[tabnloz]

There are many guys calling a bond bubble burst, in reality how is that going to play out?

Suppose that when interest rate rise, people all selling their bond for money, resulting a crash of the bond price, what would that impact economy? Which bond holder is going to be hurt most? Pension fund and social security fund?

Nice post

The junk bond market has seen about 1T in energy junk bonds issuance since 08 iirc. The iShares HYG etf has spiked indicating increased risk of default (and decrease in selling price for bonds issued). I think it is at highest point since Lehman ? As a lot of junk is in energy/oil sector those exploratory companies who issued bonds to raise capital are at breaking point - many expect a rush of defaults in 16.

Memory is foggy but I remember Jim Rickards writing that if defaults were to hit total junk bond market (foggy guess is 4T??) @ 10% we have an event. Igger than sub prime which rippled through system ata few hundred billion. Where would $400bn ripple to ie, will a govt default?

We've already seen a mutual fund (Third whatever *its a bond fund*) "gate" its money from investors and also a hedge fund (StoneLion). So, the problem will be contagion into other classes. If this is a big big event, look for "gated" to be the buzz word!

And you're right, if it hits the wider bond market, everybody who has money in a pension fund / 401(k) / rrp may face hefty losses as contributions are by regulation. And anyone who bought a bond coupon at 0% interest rate loses when it rises to 0.25%. Herein lies the biggest quetion - who is going to buy all the bonds if people start selling? Does the market have the liquidity?