[ANN]XDE II coin.NOW 300% POS for a few months. 4hr min stake, only 100k coins.

[filipwx]

I'll by some coins

[vegasguy]

@mObLOBScHAr I promise you if you post intelligently I will respond every time. There is one major issue with this. We will get around 53 coins each after its inflated 7 times from the premine. To get to 105 each after the swap, every member of my team has to hold over 7 coins they bought, and I can tell you for a fact they dont. In fact to the best of my knowledge I am the ONLY one that bought any coins, all my other team members have bought none. So if you want to calculate the 53 that we will certainly get, 5.3% of the money supply, then please by all means post your chart. But your chart is not realistic as its not even close to what will happen. Thank you, and "keep it real"

Also 200%-300% is where it starts. There is no way it will end this way, and if XDE2 can sustain 200%-300% for 3 years without the impact of inflation, we will all have millions of dollars even from 1 coin and a standard wallet. But that WONT happen, it would defeat the laws of inflation, and the laws of inflation are universal and unbeaten. We started it high so we can cut the pos% down multiple times, and still end up with a firm attractive pos rate. Also all wallets cut POS % evenly. So likely in 2-3 years wallets will be cut in 1/2 % pos at least 3-4 times as needed. So we DONT get to enjoy 300% , for 3 years. Maybe 6 months, and if we are VERY lucky , possibly 1 year. When it cuts once, its now down to 150% per year, then it cuts again to 75% a year. We WILL cut the POS% , WE HAVE TO , or inflation will kick in and then the coin will die a slow death, and that will NOT happen. I will be closely monitoring everything everyday.  Not so greedy now is it?

Vegas

[vegasguy]

Ok I stopped reading at:

I hold 15 old XDE coins. I won't participate in the swap

Are you serious?

You hold coins worth 6.5 BTC and you dont trade them in?!?!?!!? Who does that?!?!?! "Keep it real"

We also have stated that we will STILL trade coins 30 days AFTER the swap. Cannot be more fair than that.

Vegas

[metamorphin]

I promise you if you post intelligently I will respond every time. The is one major issue with this. We will get around 53 coins each after its inflated 7 times from the premine. To get to 105 post swap, every member of my team has to hold over 7 coins, and I can tell you for a fact they dont. In fact to the best of my knowledge I am the ONLY one that bought coins. So if you want to calculate the 53 that we will certainly get 5.3% of the money supply, then please by all means post your chart. But your chart is not realistic as its not even close to what will happen. Thank you, and "keep it real"
Vegas

ok. you may be right for now, but...
topic of this post: why I believe not-used-coins in the swap should be burned

A total of 1000 coins will be premined. Any unclaimed coins will be divided evenly among the 5 team members. If everyone turns in their coins, each team member will get 53 coins

now with that in mind we play the swap-game in our mind a bit further:

I hold 15 old XDE coins. I won't participate in the swap. so 15*7 = 105 coins are not used in the swap and they will move to your team.
divide it equally among each of your 5 member, and each will get additionally 21 new coins each.
And from the activity of other shareholders in this thread I believe it will be more than 15 old XDE coins that won't participate in the swap.

those additional XDE's bring total unbalance in the whole system. keep in mind that you not only get more XDEII, you will get better staking with them!

I can take your doubts. E.g. Flycoin:

We have ultrabig wallets with ultrabig total amounts of coins! But what we do with this huge stakingrewards? We stake into wallets, who help us in every FLYcoin related task!
We promised and claimed our names in the blockchain and every move can followed by all interested users!
We are not here, to make a quick profit and run. Our mission in XDE is, to bring back life in da house! And its an absolutely main FACT, that no DEV and no LEADERS wanna work for peanuts more. The cryptoworld changed! Scammers will be hard fighted and kicked out of the Ring! We have increase a nice community, which are very thankful for our help, we daily did. Instead of permanently staking for us to be richer than rich, we share the success to all!

Greetz
Meta

P.S.: I offer u following thing, to see, that I dont spread craps: PM me your Flycoinaddress and I wanna stake 3x into your wallet!

[vegasguy]

it will only change the overall inflation rate

Thats all we are doing. I think your overthinking this.

Vegas

[uki]

@mObLOBScHAr I promise you if you post intelligently I will respond every time. There is one major issue with this. We will get around 53 coins each after its inflated 7 times from the premine. To get to 105 each after the swap, every member of my team has to hold over 7 coins they bought, and I can tell you for a fact they dont. In fact to the best of my knowledge I am the ONLY one that bought any coins, all my other team members have bought none. So if you want to calculate the 53 that we will certainly get, 5.3% of the money supply, then please by all means post your chart. But your chart is not realistic as its not even close to what will happen. Thank you, and "keep it real"

Also 200%-300% is where it starts. There is no way it will end this way, and if XDE2 can sustain 200%-300% for 3 years without the impact of inflation, we will all have millions of dollars even from 1 coin and a standard wallet. But that WONT happen, it would defeat the laws of inflation, and the laws of inflation are universal and unbeaten. We started it high so we can cut the pos% down multiple times, and still end up with a firm attractive pos rate. Also all wallets cut POS % evenly. So likely in 2-3 years wallets will be cut in 1/2 % pos at least 3-4 times as needed. So we DONT get to enjoy 300% , for 3 years. Maybe 6 months, and if we are VERY lucky , possibly 1 year. When it cuts once, its now down to 150% per year, then it cuts again to 75% a year. We WILL cut the POS% , WE HAVE TO , or inflation will kick in and then the coin will die a slow death, and that will NOT happen. I will be closely monitoring everything everyday.  Not so greedy now is it?

Vegas

Vegas, just to bring you up-to-date. Few posts above yours, one of the members of your team is saying he is buying XDE:

I have been trying to get into XDE for a while.
But I (and apparently everyone else) were not willing to pay
   $200+ a coin.
Now that the coin looks like it has new life, I have been able to
  buy 3 XDE at an average of over $100 per coin.

[vegasguy]

Thank you Uki. I too am trying to acquire as much xde as possible before the swap. I would encourage everyone to. I already know this will be a massive success, so I want to be the most invested, to show everyone that Its not talk, I will put my own money in my own investment.

Vegas

[uki]

Vegas, you were asking major XDE stakeholders to raise their voice. Here comes, how I see the things.
I believe the dev team that is taking over XDE is bringing new life to the coin that was practically dead. I paid from my own pocket to avoid delisting XDE from c-cex in the last two rounds. I did it alone, as there was practically no interest in that, the community did not respond. The third time I gave up and we got delisted. So I agree with the argument that the overtaking may resurrect it. I don't agree with the argument that the coin had zero value (coin was traded in little volumes on c-cex before delisting for 0.03-0.06), and especially with the recent news there is some non-zero trading volume.

Now, for the overtaking conditions, I believe the team you command is asking too much from the community. Let's have a look:
- you get 30% of the premine of the starting amount of XDEII coins that is split evenly among team members. The remaining 70% is left for the swap.
- any unclaimed coins in the swap are also supposed to go to the team. Given the short time window of the swap, and the history of similar swaps of another altcoins, I may assure you that 100% of XDE won't be swapped. In fact I expect about 60% of coins to be swapped (depending on how much the overtaking dev team already holds).
- dev team gets also a much better PoS rate, which as already mentioned in this thread, gives you the exponential advantage over the other holders. In practice, I don't expect anybody from the public to pay for a better staking wallet upfront, without having anything delivered (in terms of code!).


Taking into account the three points above, I believe that this is an unfair takeover. Unfair, in the first place to the XDE bagholders (myself included). I am in favour of the takeover, but not in favour of a takeover at any price. (in case the current conditions are kept you may buy me out, just send me a pm).
Here is my suggestion on how to fix it:
1.) I agree that members of the dev team who previously didn't have XDE should get something to start with. Whether 30% of all coins is much or not we can discuss further, but in any case that should be the upper limit. That means, any coins unclaimed in the swap should be burned. That would make the initial distribution much more fair and it will avoid the situation where the dev team holds more the 50% of initial coinage having additionally huge advantage in the PoS rates.
2.) To further make more fair the PoS distribution, how about the following approach: the dev team gets the highest rate to get paid for their work. But how about rewarding the current major XDE stakeholders (say, if you hold at least 2.5 XDE) with the second highest staking wallet to reward their support up-to-date. That would also guarantee a higher value of XDE at the point of swapping (people will want to buy the XDE coins left on the exchanges to get better wallet) and provide a better starting point in terms of market cap.

[gregofdoom]

No uki, to żeś się rozpisał - muszę przyznać że nawet z sensem.
Myślę, że vegas weźmie pod uwagę twoje wątpliwości i dojdziecie razem do porozumienia.
Trzymam kciuki

[metamorphin]

No uki, to żeś się rozpisał - muszę przyznać że nawet z sensem.
Myślę, że vegas weźmie pod uwagę twoje wątpliwości i dojdziecie razem do porozumienia.
Trzymam kciuki

HEY GREG,

How are u?

Are u interested in a polish translation? Vegas, what do u think?

Greetz
Meta

[uki]

No uki, to żeś się rozpisał - muszę przyznać że nawet z sensem.
Myślę, że vegas weźmie pod uwagę twoje wątpliwości i dojdziecie razem do porozumienia.
Trzymam kciuki

A dziekuje, dziekuje, to taka noworoczna wena
We should however keep the discussion in English so that everybody can paricipate.
   
Meta raised actually another interesting point, bounties. That is somehow missing in the op, and would be definitely 'interesting to have' to attract new people.

[Woody20285]

Vegas, just to bring you up-to-date. Few posts above yours, one of the members of your team is saying he is buying XDE:

Uki:
Really - My buying XDE is an issue??
I am not sure - are you complaining that I am supporting the coin
or that I did not call Vegas to let him know I was buying the coins.
or that Vegas missed my post.

Do I owe you an apology for believing in XDE & spending my BTC to buy XDE?

[gregofdoom]

No uki, to żeś się rozpisał - muszę przyznać że nawet z sensem.
Myślę, że vegas weźmie pod uwagę twoje wątpliwości i dojdziecie razem do porozumienia.
Trzymam kciuki

HEY GREG,

How are u?

Are u interested in a polish translation? Vegas, what do u think?

Greetz
Meta

Hey metamorphin ...  I'm fine, thanks

Polish translation? If vegas agree, this is the way to go.

[vegasguy]

Actual holders have enormous power and influence. So I am good with burning unclaimed coins. As you are a major holder you can easily influence me. So I need to update and restructure it.

So the way it will look is 5 team members will get 53 XDE II coins each from the premine, and each get Platinum wallets. All unclaimed XDE2 shall be burned, ALL OLD XDE received shall be burned. It would be fair to give top 5 holders will get 1/2 price off any wallet. So does this sound more fair?

Updated this info on OP to make official.

Vegas

[Woody20285]

I agree 100% with burning the unclaimed XDE. It was one of the
        topics of discussion in the developers slack the past 3 days.
        We also discussed having a much longer redemption period
        but, that has many problems.

[metamorphin]

Actual holders have enormous power and influence. So I am good with burning unclaimed coins. As you are a major holder you can easily influence me. So I need to update and restructure it.

So the way it will look is 5 team members will get 53 XDE II coins each from the premine, and each get Platinum wallets. All unclaimed XDE2 shall be burned, ALL OLD XDE received shall be burned. It would be fair to give top 5 holders will get 1/2 price off any wallet. So does this sound more fair?

Updated this info on OP to make official.

Vegas

It's a start.
But you have to change a few more things to get this thing running good.

- Delay start of swap. So many unsolved questions / problems. no ready in 2 days.
- Consider changing wallet prices. Nobody pays 6 BTC for a wallet address. Or is there someone here who will buy that?
- Consider reducing wallet staking gap from 200-300 to 200-220 or even remove them (one wallet - same staking).

One wallet - same staking is not acceptable, because we have to be paid and dont work for peanuts! (its my personal opinion! )

Changing wallet prices: Vegas already did an offer...the top 5 holder pay 1/2 prices. You for sure a top 5 holder, so u benefit extremely!

Delay start of swap: PM vegas ur emailaddy, so we can discuss the "unsolved questions and problems" in a slack. Uki is also there

Greetz
Meta

[metamorphin]

will do it, but I don't really understand why we can't do that here in public.

We can do this of course, it was only an offer from us, to push the life in the community. We thought, we could reach many members from old XDE to discuss. :-)

[vegasguy]

One wallet - same staking is not acceptable, because we have to be paid and dont work for peanuts! (its my personal opinion! )

and why don't you just get your payments through regular payments?
I understand you want to be rewarded for your work, but a better staking wallet is an exponential reward as a explained in posts before, and this is for me not acceptable.

Changing wallet prices: Vegas already did an offer...the top 5 holder pay 1/2 prices. You for sure a top 5 holder, so u benefit extremely!

I don't to this for my personal benefits. I don't care if I only pay 1/2 price, when others have to pay too much. Fairness for all, not only top holder.
Why only top-holder? With that you will increase the gap between high- and low-roller.. why do you want that?

Delay start of swap: PM vegas ur emailaddy, so we can discuss the "unsolved questions and problems" in a slack. Uki is also there

will do it, but I don't really understand why we can't do that here in public.
edit: pm sent.

Ok so it takes more than one member to change things. Ive said it before and I stood by it. Those that hold even 3 coins have enormous influence on our decisions. What is your xde addy? I have posted mine already.

There will NOT be a delay, as there is no reason to. We have EVERYTHING finished except wallet graphics which are being worked on and near finished.  Swap will start January 7th 2015, and end January 23rd 2015 9am PST. I think through CAREFULLY my actions as they have good and bad consequences. As we burn whats unclaimed, per your request, late comers will not be able to swap. So when people show up late, wanting to claim, I will give them your name.

There is an old saying "Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it"

 

Vegas

[vegasguy]

Guys Im going to address the prices on wallets.

First I could care less about getting the btc, Im going to put it all into buy walls to hold the price. I will make public the after each sale, and you WILL see the buy wall stay up. I did it with fly, and everyone loved the protection it gave. The main reason the prices are high is to keep them exclusive and special and out of reach of everyone having them. IF everyone had them this coin would inflate so fast , I couldnt even control it. The inflation needs to be spread out as long as possible without it being painful. However, it DOES make a big difference if you get a special wallet day 1 or day 30.

Vegas

[incognitoworker]

One wallet - same staking is not acceptable, because we have to be paid and dont work for peanuts! (its my personal opinion! )

and why don't you just get your payments through regular payments?
I understand you want to be rewarded for your work, but a better staking wallet is an exponential reward as a explained in posts before, and this is for me not acceptable.

Changing wallet prices: Vegas already did an offer...the top 5 holder pay 1/2 prices. You for sure a top 5 holder, so u benefit extremely!

I don't to this for my personal benefits. I don't care if I only pay 1/2 price, when others have to pay too much. Fairness for all, not only top holder.
Why only top-holder? With that you will increase the gap between high- and low-roller.. why do you want that?

Delay start of swap: PM vegas ur emailaddy, so we can discuss the "unsolved questions and problems" in a slack. Uki is also there

will do it, but I don't really understand why we can't do that here in public.
edit: pm sent.

Ok so it takes more than one member to change things. Ive said it before and I stood by it. Those that hold even 3 coins have enormous influence on our decisions. What is your xde addy? I have posted mine already.

There will NOT be a delay, as there is no reason to. We have EVERYTHING finished except wallet graphics which are being worked on and near finished.  Swap will start January 7th 2015, and end January 23rd 2015 9am PST. I think through CAREFULLY my actions as they have good and bad consequences. As we burn whats unclaimed, per your request, late comers will not be able to swap. So when people show up late, wanting to claim, I will give them your name.

There is an old saying "Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it"

 

Vegas

A suggestion for fair usage of "super wallets"
What if it was only 1 of theese wallets, the one hosted on staisybit to reward ALL stakers.
Asuming this will get added to staisybit fairly fast, this option would benefit all from what i can see.

IW