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Author Topic: Should I Buy used or new miners?  (Read 4014 times)
Flabbier
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January 03, 2016, 07:52:44 AM
 #1

Hi, Have been browsing the forums and learnt alot about bitcoins here.

So, firstly, I would like to thank everyone who shares their experiences in this forum, and also you, who is reading this  Smiley

Second, I am thinking of purchasing some miners, Avalon A6 or antminer S7.

Wondering if it would be better to purchasing new ones, or would it be better off purchasing used ones? Also, where should i go searching for used miners?

I have recently read about BitFury's new chips, and some speculated that it would reach end users by Q2 2016. Should i be waiting, or should i purchase some miners right now?

Thirdly, I visited a mining farm of my friend's. I was thinking of installing air conditioning in my farm but he shared with me that he used to do that. but now, he simply suck out the hot air using exhaust fan. Can i ask for some opinions on cooling?

Thanks for all the help!

PS: I'm running on very cheap electricity, almost negligible to our costs.
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adaseb
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January 03, 2016, 08:19:18 AM
 #2

Right now you are better off purchasing new miners since new miners come with warranty and are cheaper then that is on the used market.

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Flabbier
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January 03, 2016, 09:52:50 AM
 #3

Thanks for the recommendation.

Why am i considering used miners?

Our ROI is basically Earnings/$$ used to buy hardware. Since our electricity costs are negligible, our only costs is the initial cost for the hardware. Thus, it would be best for us to purchase the lowest $$/TH hardware.

Also, If i'm not wrong, i believe warranty is only for first 3 months, and i've read through this forum that the miners should be working most of the time. So I'm thinking of saving costs and achieving ROI A.S.A.P instead of paying a additional premium for the warranty and being "first owner".

Am I right to think about it this way?
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January 03, 2016, 12:18:07 PM
 #4

Thanks for the recommendation.

Why am i considering used miners?

Our ROI is basically Earnings/$$ used to buy hardware. Since our electricity costs are negligible, our only costs is the initial cost for the hardware. Thus, it would be best for us to purchase the lowest $$/TH hardware.

Also, If i'm not wrong, i believe warranty is only for first 3 months, and i've read through this forum that the miners should be working most of the time. So I'm thinking of saving costs and achieving ROI A.S.A.P instead of paying a additional premium for the warranty and being "first owner".

Am I right to think about it this way?

Yeah but like the previous user told you, the used S7's are going for the same price or higher than the new S7's. So thats something to check.

And yes you are otherwise right and also, if you buy used hardware that ran for a long time, it will probably last for a while longer. When you buy new, maybe its a bad batch.
The only thing to keep in mind is, if you buy let say 100 S1's instead of 2 S7's you're going to need a shit ton more wire, a shit ton more power cables, etc.

So paying a bit more for higher hashrate density is also worth considering in your $$/TH.

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January 03, 2016, 12:24:40 PM
 #5

first off what country are you in?  or if in usa what state?

second how cheap is cheap power?

third how much power do you have?

fourth how much room do you have?

fifth 120 volt or 240 volt?

lastly what is you ability to handle noise?


if your power is 2 cents or less  and you have lots of room s-3's are okay  but 9   s-3s = 1 s-7

and 9 s-3's would use 3 antminer psu's

while and s-7 would use 1 antminer psu   so   if you pay 90 usd for an s-3 9 x 90 = 810 and 420 for psu's = 1230

while 1 s-7 is 1200 + 140 = 1340   that is not a lot of savings for the 9 s-3's


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Oh My Rig!
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January 03, 2016, 03:13:31 PM
 #6

Here in the CIS countries sometimes old miners selling much cheaper after few months of mining. Also sometimes they changing power supplies for the more reliable, then overclocking boards to get additional hashes. So if after few months these boards didn't grilled yet - that's mean they ready checked and worth to buy... with care;-)..

All above i talking about 2-4-6 TH devices of course... not the old crap:-).
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January 03, 2016, 04:03:36 PM
 #7

Buying a new mining rig is always better because it comes with warranty and you get directly from the seller/company so in case you get in trouble you can contact them and maybe they can fix it. But if you are in a country that should pay import tax etc, in this case maybe it should be buying a used one.

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January 03, 2016, 04:39:01 PM
 #8

PLEASE use a calculator & some common sense sometimes in regardless of new or used miners. just don't get too excited to jump into the water.

objective is ALWAYS

LOWEST setup cost

LOWEST POWER

CHEAPEST miner (working ones)

Shortest time to achieve ROI then PROFIT !

even with warranty, EXTRA costs DOES apply such as sending the board back to manufacturer & downtime or manufacturer might even charge you EXTRA to repair the board & says it's NOT covered under warranty for various reasons.

New & Shiny does NOT always means good

Old & Dusty does NOT always mean economical

some basic math with a calc & a calm mind would help out alot.
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January 03, 2016, 05:33:20 PM
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PLEASE use a calculator & some common sense sometimes in regardless of new or used miners. just don't get too excited to jump into the water.

objective is ALWAYS

LOWEST setup cost

LOWEST POWER

CHEAPEST miner (working ones)

Shortest time to achieve ROI then PROFIT !

even with warranty, EXTRA costs DOES apply such as sending the board back to manufacturer & downtime or manufacturer might even charge you EXTRA to repair the board & says it's NOT covered under warranty for various reasons.

New & Shiny does NOT always means good

Old & Dusty does NOT always mean economical

some basic math with a calc & a calm mind would help out alot.

Listen to him.  We can't answer that question for you. You have to do it yourself.  You may find that new is cheaper over used.  Maybe you find that used is cheaper depending on your overall goal (how much hash, how much profit, etc).

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January 03, 2016, 07:22:02 PM
 #10

first off what country are you in?  or if in usa what state?

second how cheap is cheap power?

third how much power do you have?

fourth how much room do you have?

fifth 120 volt or 240 volt?

lastly what is you ability to handle noise?


if your power is 2 cents or less  and you have lots of room s-3's are okay  but 9   s-3s = 1 s-7

and 9 s-3's would use 3 antminer psu's

while and s-7 would use 1 antminer psu   so   if you pay 90 usd for an s-3 9 x 90 = 810 and 420 for psu's = 1230

while 1 s-7 is 1200 + 140 = 1340   that is not a lot of savings for the 9 s-3's

I bolded Phil's question's as they really are something you need.  I would also add make for sure you get correct electricity price with taxes and fees.   If you get off website and not real bill you might not get it right.

Others saying ROI math is important is very true.  The best I think is on bitwisdom: https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator it allows difficulty change which is far more realistic then ones that just do current period and times it out.

But as far as one to do it with I would go batch 8 or 9 of S7.   It is currently lowest price.  If noise is a issue then I would look at Avalon A6 there is a huge difference in noise levels.  Also S7 with server PSU's adds even more noise.   
yslyung
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January 03, 2016, 08:21:44 PM
 #11

first off what country are you in?  or if in usa what state?

second how cheap is cheap power?

third how much power do you have?

fourth how much room do you have?

fifth 120 volt or 240 volt?

lastly what is you ability to handle noise?


if your power is 2 cents or less  and you have lots of room s-3's are okay  but 9   s-3s = 1 s-7

and 9 s-3's would use 3 antminer psu's

while and s-7 would use 1 antminer psu   so   if you pay 90 usd for an s-3 9 x 90 = 810 and 420 for psu's = 1230

while 1 s-7 is 1200 + 140 = 1340   that is not a lot of savings for the 9 s-3's

I bolded Phil's question's as they really are something you need.  I would also add make for sure you get correct electricity price with taxes and fees.   If you get off website and not real bill you might not get it right.

Others saying ROI math is important is very true.  The best I think is on bitwisdom: https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator it allows difficulty change which is far more realistic then ones that just do current period and times it out.

But as far as one to do it with I would go batch 8 or 9 of S7.   It is currently lowest price.  If noise is a issue then I would look at Avalon A6 there is a huge difference in noise levels.  Also S7 with server PSU's adds even more noise.   

yes but many get caught when it comes to PSU, PCIE's, Noise, Heat, prolly upgrading the wires/sockets/pdu's, DB box, CB's, so on & so forth, it just goes deeper that many that might have "missed" it.

all the listed above are EXTRA added to the "missed" cost !

cost = $ = more time needed to ROI before even mentioning PROFIT & by the time PROFIT hits = yay but it will be pretty thin by then.

but one will get a spanking brand new s7 b8/b9 whooops, sorry it might fail too as there are many reports about failure.

think couple of times, piece of paper + pen + calc helps = smart miner/investor.

ahhhh & lastly diff changes every 2 weeks or so, don't tell me you did NOT see it COMING !

home mining is tough, really tough now.
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January 06, 2016, 01:10:56 PM
 #12

first off what country are you in?  or if in usa what state? We are intending on operating our miners in China

second how cheap is cheap power? We are actually in the middle of negotiating with our investor. One of them is the owner of hydro plant, thus we might be getting free electricity in exchange for shares

third how much power do you have? Still at initial stage, have not deciding on our place of operation

fourth how much room do you have? Same as third.

fifth 120 volt or 240 volt? I supposed its 240 volt

lastly what is you ability to handle noise? Not a problem!  Smiley


if your power is 2 cents or less  and you have lots of room s-3's are okay  but 9   s-3s = 1 s-7

and 9 s-3's would use 3 antminer psu's

while and s-7 would use 1 antminer psu   so   if you pay 90 usd for an s-3 9 x 90 = 810 and 420 for psu's = 1230

while 1 s-7 is 1200 + 140 = 1340   that is not a lot of savings for the 9 s-3's

I appreciate your help and this has showed me regarding the extra costs of PSUs!



I would like to thank all of you for the experienced and helpful tips.

There's one question that i would require some advice on. I have recently read about BitFury's new chips, and some speculated that it would reach end users by Q2 2016. Should i be waiting, or should i purchase some miners right now?

Also, I am considering of buying alternative PSUs from Ebay. Should i be doing that? Or should i be buying PSUs from the manufacturer of the ASICs?

Some newbie questions too :

1) Should i be buying raspberry pi if i were to go for avalon 6 / antminer s7? I've seen that they have built in controller.
2) Would i require fast internet connection? As there will be alot of miners using the same connection.

We will be placing 10~20 units for a test, before we really go full scale on it.
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January 06, 2016, 02:27:13 PM
 #13

I would like to thank all of you for the experienced and helpful tips.

There's one question that i would require some advice on. I have recently read about BitFury's new chips, and some speculated that it would reach end users by Q2 2016. Should i be waiting, or should i purchase some miners right now?

Also, I am considering of buying alternative PSUs from Ebay. Should i be doing that? Or should i be buying PSUs from the manufacturer of the ASICs?

Some newbie questions too :

1) Should i be buying raspberry pi if i were to go for avalon 6 / antminer s7? I've seen that they have built in controller.
2) Would i require fast internet connection? As there will be alot of miners using the same connection.

We will be placing 10~20 units for a test, before we really go full scale on it.

-This is mostly speculative, its very hard to say, also the new gen chip might barely make it in time before the halving, which honestly throws all prevision out of whack. So you could ignore Bitfury for now and simply see if you can ROI easily before halving, even with 8%+ diff per step;
https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator

1) Maybe/No;
You can get a preflashed pi from Avalon or you can flash one yourself. S7 does not make use of raspi since as you said, they have built in controller (which is a BBB, very similar to a raspi)
2)No. Just stable good ping.

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January 06, 2016, 05:08:29 PM
 #14

Hi, Have been browsing the forums and learnt alot about bitcoins here.

So, firstly, I would like to thank everyone who shares their experiences in this forum, and also you, who is reading this  Smiley

Second, I am thinking of purchasing some miners, Avalon A6 or antminer S7.

Wondering if it would be better to purchasing new ones, or would it be better off purchasing used ones? Also, where should i go searching for used miners?

I have recently read about BitFury's new chips, and some speculated that it would reach end users by Q2 2016. Should i be waiting, or should i purchase some miners right now?

Thirdly, I visited a mining farm of my friend's. I was thinking of installing air conditioning in my farm but he shared with me that he used to do that. but now, he simply suck out the hot air using exhaust fan. Can i ask for some opinions on cooling?

Thanks for all the help!

PS: I'm running on very cheap electricity, almost negligible to our costs.

Right now I would wait for the next generation of miners.

The difficullty will make the current one go useless (in terms of getting ROI) within months.

But buying 1 or 2 used miners would be a good idea so you can learn about it.

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January 06, 2016, 07:14:54 PM
 #15

Hi, Have been browsing the forums and learnt alot about bitcoins here.

So, firstly, I would like to thank everyone who shares their experiences in this forum, and also you, who is reading this  Smiley

Second, I am thinking of purchasing some miners, Avalon A6 or antminer S7.

Wondering if it would be better to purchasing new ones, or would it be better off purchasing used ones? Also, where should i go searching for used miners?

I have recently read about BitFury's new chips, and some speculated that it would reach end users by Q2 2016. Should i be waiting, or should i purchase some miners right now?

Thirdly, I visited a mining farm of my friend's. I was thinking of installing air conditioning in my farm but he shared with me that he used to do that. but now, he simply suck out the hot air using exhaust fan. Can i ask for some opinions on cooling?

Thanks for all the help!

PS: I'm running on very cheap electricity, almost negligible to our costs.

Right now I would wait for the next generation of miners.

The difficullty will make the current one go useless (in terms of getting ROI) within months.

But buying 1 or 2 used miners would be a good idea so you can learn about it.

He said very cheap electricity we really need that defined by a amount before we can give good advice.  We also don't know when next gen miners will be out for general public.   A lot say "I'm waiting on next gen" and never pull the trigger as there is always going to be a next gen.

But OP what is you price of "cheap electricity, almost negligible to our costs".  If we know that we can help much more without that it's kinda hard to help.
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January 06, 2016, 08:57:38 PM
 #16

like i said new is NOT always good, for your viewing pleasure

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1165628.msg13466880#msg13466880
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January 06, 2016, 09:07:14 PM
 #17

I would advice you to buy a new Antminer.The cons of buying a used miner would be either consumption of extra electricity or getting really heated up at room temperature.However the new miner would come with warranty as well so its always a good deal.The price won't make a huge difference.

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notlist3d
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January 07, 2016, 04:31:10 AM
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like i said new is NOT always good, for your viewing pleasure

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1165628.msg13466880#msg13466880

Did they try to power it with only 2 pcie cords?  I only see 2 in pictures that they cut out.  I would be interested to know if they did not follow the 3 rule.

Bitcoin did do pretty well today it's currently on a up swing as we speak... so that is nice for those holding BTC.
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January 07, 2016, 10:11:29 AM
 #19

3rd pcie melted

3 connected
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January 07, 2016, 07:42:07 PM
 #20

It is better to buy S7. It might still be useful after the difficulty rise and block halving. It is more efficient than old generations.

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