Virgin Coins

[jamesg]

Hello Bitcoin Community,

I would like to discuss the topic of "virgin" bitcoins. Specifically, I would like to discuss the possibilities of being able to purchase a private key to coins mined directly to paper wallets.

• Is this a niche market that only a few zealots would be interested in or this is more appealing to a broad range of Bitcoiners?
• What kind of premium, if any, could be associated with virgin coins?
• Would you consider a service that sells virgin coins for non-virgin bitcoins a laundering service?
• Is a service like this appealing for payment via meat space methods including wire and cash?

I've always found this topic to be interesting and I look forward to your responses.

Best,
James

[1715115822]

1715115822

[1715115822]

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[1715115822]

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[Largo]

Can you mine bitcoins to an address where you only got the public key?
If only i had the private key i would maybe pay like 101 BTC for 100 BTC mined to my address.
So yes there could be a market  

[FreeMoney]

It seems kind of cool to me, but I wouldn't pay much of anything, and probably only be interested in like one block if I even wanted to bother.

I could see the tiny fraction of people caring become a lot more people than there are fresh blocks eventually so the premium could go up, so there is some speculative value. However, while you can buy a virgin block you can't safely sell it once you buy it. You pay people to mine to your key, but then once you've got it if you give the key to someone they have to trust you forever or else move it and destroy it's virginity. So... I'm thinking overall it's mostly a no go.

[jamesg]

Can you mine bitcoins to an address where you only got the public key?

Indeed you can.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Can you mine bitcoins to an address where you only got the public key?

Indeed you can.

With very little creative marketing, I envision this endeavor viable.

~Bruno K~

[Stephen Gornick]

Can you mine bitcoins to an address where you only got the public key?

Eligius and P2Pool do this now.

[Lethn]

I get the feeling if I took this seriously I'd be trolled LOL

[Yankee (BitInstant)]

I'd get 1 for the novelty of it

[Garr255]

I'm also interested in whether there would be a market for such a thing.

Giga, while I wouldn't call it laundering, it certainly would be used for that.

[siggy]

I've pondered this question on an off for a good year now...   My thinking is that at the moment, a 50 or 25 virgin block is worth about 50.1 / 25 coins ..  in 20 years however, the Numismic value of a virgin block (technically the private key for said block) will be off the charts ...This is simply because of the rarity and the fact that from now till the end of eternity, nevermore will a 50 virgin coin block be minted. 

Just take a look here:  http://cointrackers.com/blog/13/most-valuable-pennies/  ... there a lowly pennies out there worth $100,000

Soo.. anyone out there with virgin 50 coin keys they wanna sell?

Sigg

[SAC]

I've pondered this question on an off for a good year now...   My thinking is that at the moment, a 50 or 25 virgin block is worth about 50.1 / 25 coins ..  in 20 years however, the Numismic value of a virgin block (technically the private key for said block) will be off the charts ...This is simply because of the rarity and the fact that from now till the end of eternity, nevermore will a 50 virgin coin block be minted. 

Just take a look here:  http://cointrackers.com/blog/13/most-valuable-pennies/  ... there a lowly pennies out there worth $100,000

Soo.. anyone out there with virgin 50 coin keys they wanna sell?

Sigg

Oh baby that makes a virgin block worth what $5m, yeah right so begins the latest scam lets see where the shills come from like you proclaiming how this is yet again the best thing since sliced bread. A virgin coin is worth the same as any other damn coin out there it is all bits on a computer.

[Stephen Gornick]

My thinking is that at the moment, a 50 or 25 virgin block is worth about 50.1 / 25 coins ..  in 20 years however, the Numismic value of a virgin block (technically the private key for said block) will be off the charts ...This is simply because of the rarity and the fact that from now till the end of eternity, nevermore will a 50 virgin coin block be minted. 

The problem is that any buyer would need to trust that the seller wouldn't spend the funds after the sale.

Sending the coins to a new address will still have numismatic value but it is not the same as what existed previously.

But yes, there have been buyers who have paid a premium:

The auction is now closed, the block is sold. The premium paid will remain undisclosed.

[kjlimo]

How much does the Fed charge for freshly minted coins?

Pretty sure it's nothing above face value... not sure why bitcoins would be different.

[zero3112]

These are not newly minted coins.  These are old coins minted in the past just like minted old US coins.  But like old US coins they are worth more if the coins are in uncirculated conduction.

[jamesg]

The problem is that any buyer would need to trust that the seller wouldn't spend the funds after the sale.

Correct. This is why I've stated that the coins would be mined to paper wallets (most likely laminated) or mine directly to the buyers address.

Sending the coins to a new address will still have numismatic value but it is not the same as what existed previously.

Sending the coins to an address is not the idea here. Only a generation transaction to an address.

But yes, there have been buyers who have paid a premium:

The auction is now closed, the block is sold. The premium paid will remain undisclosed.

Thanks for the link.

[jamesg]

A virgin coin is worth the same as any other damn coin out there it is all bits on a computer.

Thanks SAC.

[BkkCoins]

If I ran a pool, or had a big solo rig, I'd have an ongoing auction for each block to see what premium can be raised.

Each bidder would send a requested address and (25btc + premium) to an address provided. This is the only way you could guarantee the block is paid. They can request a refund at any time and if they don't win the bid is held over to the next block.

At block discovery the highest bid is used for generation address and the bidders deposit is used for pool payout.

Of course, with many virgin blocks like this, the specialness factor would go way down quickly and presumably the premium.  

[jamesg]

If I ran a pool, or had a big solo rig, I'd have an ongoing auction for each block to see what premium can be raised.

I've seen an idea like this before somewhere, I think there would need to be a lot of transparency around the bidding process and current bids. This does add the element of competition though which is always interesting.

Of course, with many virgin blocks like this, the specialness factor would go way down quickly and presumably the premium.  

At first I was thinking the same as you here, but the numbers quickly change if you wanted 500 or 1000 coins (aka multiple blocks) generated to a single address.

[matthewh3]

You might want to use waterproof and tear-proof paper like this - http://toughprint.com/ - and make them into kind of a banknote maybe?

[Yankee (BitInstant)]

I'll still take 1 for novelty....let me know your BTC address and how much you want.