trust disappearing?

[Ejarwan]

Why did a LOT of the trust recently disappear from more than one member's profile?

[mexxer-2]

It was due to the removal of escrow.ms from the DT, you too are removed from DT 2 so everyone will view your feedbacks as 'untrusted' unless they have manually added you to their trust list.

[Ejarwan]

It was due to the removal of escrow.ms from the DT, you too are removed from DT 2 so everyone will view your feedbacks as 'untrusted' unless they have manually added you to their trust list.

can you explain further please? what is escrow.ms? why was I removed? system is bit complicated

[Zeke2345]

Here is a link to the issue and I am not some one that can explain the trust other then it is above my pay grade.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1359877.0;topicseen

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Ugh.  I'm not affected by this but that sucks for the members whose trust got bumped down.  This whole situation is crappy.

[mark coins]

It was due to the removal of escrow.ms from the DT, you too are removed from DT 2 so everyone will view your feedbacks as 'untrusted' unless they have manually added you to their trust list.

can you explain further please? what is escrow.ms? why was I removed? system is bit complicated

escrow.ms happens to be in DT depth 1, he added you on his trust list so you become a member of DT depth 2, since escrow.ms is removed from default trust users then all users added to his trust list including you are removed from depth 2.

[Amph]

It was due to the removal of escrow.ms from the DT, you too are removed from DT 2 so everyone will view your feedbacks as 'untrusted' unless they have manually added you to their trust list.

can you explain further please? what is escrow.ms? why was I removed? system is bit complicated

escrow.ms is a member, in a defaul trust, so if he give trust to soemone and that someone give it to you, you gain your precious trust, otherwise if he is not in the default trust anymore none of his sub trusted member will get anything

[mexxer-2]

Ok here's a no-brainer explanation:

Everyone has a "trust list" , which consists of people whose feedback you trust, so that their feedbacks actually affect a person's rating and shows up under "Trusted feedback" when viewing a person's trust page. If you haven't modified it, it will have "DefaultTrust" by default on it which consists of members who either theymos personally trusts or people who have been valued members of the community and are widely trusted. Now DefaultTrust is also an account, which has its own trust list. Now there are so called depth-levels, on Depth 0 are the people you have manually added to your trust list. On Depth 1 are people under Depth 0 users' trust list, considering you have a unchanged trust list, that would be people who are under DefaultTrust's trust list. On Depth 2 are the people under trust list of people on Depth 1. By default , you view only users from Depth 2 as "Trusted" , which can be changed up to a maximum of 4. Now coming to escrow.ms , he was added to DT 1 as he was an active member of the community and was a widely trusted escrow while also having a well maintained trust list.

Recently escrow.ms f*cked up, he was arrested for card cloning and illegal money transfer fraud which is possibly the reason for his removal from DT(abbreviation for DefaultTrust) . Now escrow.ms had you and many other individuals on his trust list, because of which you(and others) appeared on DT 2 of everyone who had DefaultTrust under their trust list or people who had escrow.ms under their trust list. Because of escrow.ms' removal from DT 1, he is currently at DT 2 as BadBear(Admin) and Tomatocage(another long time member and a trusted escrow) which means you are downgraded to DT 3. Now because nearly no one has selected level 3 under their trust page, no one would view your(or individuals who were only on escrow.ms' trust list) feedbacks as "Trusted" and the feedbacks won't affect one's ratings. For you however, your feedbacks will still be viewed as Trusted because you "trust yourself" by default(which cannot be changed lol)

Didn't create this just for the purpose of just explaining it to one member, I don't like repeating myself so I will use this as a reference whenever a member asks me/publicly as to what DT is. And from what I know, the least knowledgeable are the individuals which already are on DT.

[Ejarwan]

Ok here's a no-brainer explanation:

Everyone has a "trust list" , which consists of people whose feedback you trust, so that their feedbacks actually affect a person's rating and shows up under "Trusted feedback" when viewing a person's trust page. If you haven't modified it, it will have "DefaultTrust" by default on it which consists of members who either theymos personally trusts or people who have been valued members of the community and are widely trusted. Now DefaultTrust is also an account, which has its own trust list. Now there are so called depth-levels, on Depth 0 are the people you have manually added to your trust list. On Depth 1 are people under Depth 1 users' trust list, considering you have a unchanged trust list, that would be people who are under DefaultTrust's trust list. On Depth 2 are the people under trust list of people on Depth 1. By default , you view only users from Depth 2 as "Trusted" , which can be changed up to a maximum of 4. Now coming to escrow.ms , he was added to DT 1 as he was an active member of the community and was a widely trusted escrow while also having a well maintained trust list.

Recently escrow.ms f*cked up, he was arrested for card cloning and illegal money transfer fraud which is possibly the reason for his removal from DT(abbreviation for DefaultTrust) . Now escrow.ms had you and many other individuals on his trust list, because of which you(and others) appeared on DT 2 of everyone who had DefaultTrust under their trust list or people who had escrow.ms under their trust list. Because of escrow.ms' removal from DT 1, he is currently at DT 2 as BadBear(Admin) and Tomatocage(another long time member and a trusted escrow) which means you are downgraded to DT 3. Now because nearly no one has selected level 3 under their trust page, no one would view your(or individuals who were only on escrow.ms' trust list) feedbacks as "Trusted" and the feedbacks won't affect one's ratings. For you however, your feedbacks will still be viewed as Trusted because you "trust yourself" by default(which cannot be changed lol)

Didn't create this just for the purpose of just explaining it to one member, I don't like repeating myself so I will use this as a reference whenever a member asks me/publicly as to what DT is. And from what I know, the least knowledgeable are the individuals which already are on DT.

It kinda makes sense now, I'd like to thank you for putting time into explaining this.
Thanks again.

[enhu]

Ok here's a no-brainer explanation:

Everyone has a "trust list" , which consists of people whose feedback you trust, so that their feedbacks actually affect a person's rating and shows up under "Trusted feedback" when viewing a person's trust page. If you haven't modified it, it will have "DefaultTrust" by default on it which consists of members who either theymos personally trusts or people who have been valued members of the community and are widely trusted. Now DefaultTrust is also an account, which has its own trust list. Now there are so called depth-levels, on Depth 0 are the people you have manually added to your trust list. On Depth 1 are people under Depth 1 users' trust list, considering you have a unchanged trust list, that would be people who are under DefaultTrust's trust list. On Depth 2 are the people under trust list of people on Depth 1. By default , you view only users from Depth 2 as "Trusted" , which can be changed up to a maximum of 4. Now coming to escrow.ms , he was added to DT 1 as he was an active member of the community and was a widely trusted escrow while also having a well maintained trust list.

Recently escrow.ms f*cked up, he was arrested for card cloning and illegal money transfer fraud which is possibly the reason for his removal from DT(abbreviation for DefaultTrust) . Now escrow.ms had you and many other individuals on his trust list, because of which you(and others) appeared on DT 2 of everyone who had DefaultTrust under their trust list or people who had escrow.ms under their trust list. Because of escrow.ms' removal from DT 1, he is currently at DT 2 as BadBear(Admin) and Tomatocage(another long time member and a trusted escrow) which means you are downgraded to DT 3. Now because nearly no one has selected level 3 under their trust page, no one would view your(or individuals who were only on escrow.ms' trust list) feedbacks as "Trusted" and the feedbacks won't affect one's ratings. For you however, your feedbacks will still be viewed as Trusted because you "trust yourself" by default(which cannot be changed lol)

Didn't create this just for the purpose of just explaining it to one member, I don't like repeating myself so I will use this as a reference whenever a member asks me/publicly as to what DT is. And from what I know, the least knowledgeable are the individuals which already are on DT.

Wow, I never really tried understanding how this DT works until I saw this post. I tried manipulate to make me look like a trusted one and so i added a list in my account but it seem not working.
So now I have to find someone on DT to give me a positive feedback.

[mexxer-2]

Wow, I never really tried understanding how this DT works until I saw this post. I tried manipulate to make me look like a trusted one and so i added a list in my account but it seem not working.
So now I have to find someone on DT to give me a positive feedback.

Others won't be affected by your trust list changes as long as you are not on their trust list, directly or via DefaultTrust level 1 member.

[aakashsangwan]

Ok here's a no-brainer explanation:

Everyone has a "trust list" , which consists of people whose feedback you trust, so that their feedbacks actually affect a person's rating and shows up under "Trusted feedback" when viewing a person's trust page. If you haven't modified it, it will have "DefaultTrust" by default on it which consists of members who either theymos personally trusts or people who have been valued members of the community and are widely trusted. Now DefaultTrust is also an account, which has its own trust list. Now there are so called depth-levels, on Depth 0 are the people you have manually added to your trust list. On Depth 1 are people under Depth 1 users' trust list, considering you have a unchanged trust list, that would be people who are under DefaultTrust's trust list. On Depth 2 are the people under trust list of people on Depth 1. By default , you view only users from Depth 2 as "Trusted" , which can be changed up to a maximum of 4. Now coming to escrow.ms , he was added to DT 1 as he was an active member of the community and was a widely trusted escrow while also having a well maintained trust list.

Recently escrow.ms f*cked up, he was arrested for card cloning and illegal money transfer fraud which is possibly the reason for his removal from DT(abbreviation for DefaultTrust) . Now escrow.ms had you and many other individuals on his trust list, because of which you(and others) appeared on DT 2 of everyone who had DefaultTrust under their trust list or people who had escrow.ms under their trust list. Because of escrow.ms' removal from DT 1, he is currently at DT 2 as BadBear(Admin) and Tomatocage(another long time member and a trusted escrow) which means you are downgraded to DT 3. Now because nearly no one has selected level 3 under their trust page, no one would view your(or individuals who were only on escrow.ms' trust list) feedbacks as "Trusted" and the feedbacks won't affect one's ratings. For you however, your feedbacks will still be viewed as Trusted because you "trust yourself" by default(which cannot be changed lol)

Didn't create this just for the purpose of just explaining it to one member, I don't like repeating myself so I will use this as a reference whenever a member asks me/publicly as to what DT is. And from what I know, the least knowledgeable are the individuals which already are on DT.

It is very good way of giving the details of DT and how the Trust works here , till date i was wondering that how it works, The way you explained it is very clear. and how if anyone wants to cheat can be using the DT level.

[whywefight]

Ok here's a no-brainer explanation:

Everyone has a "trust list" , which consists of people whose feedback you trust, so that their feedbacks actually affect a person's rating and shows up under "Trusted feedback" when viewing a person's trust page. If you haven't modified it, it will have "DefaultTrust" by default on it which consists of members who either theymos personally trusts or people who have been valued members of the community and are widely trusted. Now DefaultTrust is also an account, which has its own trust list. Now there are so called depth-levels, on Depth 0 are the people you have manually added to your trust list. On Depth 1 are people under Depth 1 users' trust list, considering you have a unchanged trust list, that would be people who are under DefaultTrust's trust list. On Depth 2 are the people under trust list of people on Depth 1. By default , you view only users from Depth 2 as "Trusted" , which can be changed up to a maximum of 4. Now coming to escrow.ms , he was added to DT 1 as he was an active member of the community and was a widely trusted escrow while also having a well maintained trust list.

Recently escrow.ms f*cked up, he was arrested for card cloning and illegal money transfer fraud which is possibly the reason for his removal from DT(abbreviation for DefaultTrust) . Now escrow.ms had you and many other individuals on his trust list, because of which you(and others) appeared on DT 2 of everyone who had DefaultTrust under their trust list or people who had escrow.ms under their trust list. Because of escrow.ms' removal from DT 1, he is currently at DT 2 as BadBear(Admin) and Tomatocage(another long time member and a trusted escrow) which means you are downgraded to DT 3. Now because nearly no one has selected level 3 under their trust page, no one would view your(or individuals who were only on escrow.ms' trust list) feedbacks as "Trusted" and the feedbacks won't affect one's ratings. For you however, your feedbacks will still be viewed as Trusted because you "trust yourself" by default(which cannot be changed lol)

Didn't create this just for the purpose of just explaining it to one member, I don't like repeating myself so I will use this as a reference whenever a member asks me/publicly as to what DT is. And from what I know, the least knowledgeable are the individuals which already are on DT.

Good one. Now add how ratings gain weight over time xD

[mexxer-2]

Good one. Now add how ratings gain weight over time xD

Ah right, but the lazy me is back again so thats gonna take some time. JK, thats a pretty no-brainer itself:

When someone gets a feedback from someone in your trust list, their rating doesn't automatically increase.  The rating "system" is as follows
15: -0 / +7
15(Rating): -0(Negative feedbacks from users in your trust list) / +7(Positive feedbacks from users in your trust list)

When someone gets a feedback from someone in your trust list, it needs to "age" for the rating to increase. One feedback can amount to maximum of 10 ratings, with increase in 1 rating every month(after the feedback was given). However it has been observed(by me, so don't take it as a fact) that after 2-3 weeks of a feedback being  given, the rating increases by one. Now coming to negative feedbacks and rating, negative feedbacks as its obvious decrease your trust rating. But one thing to note here is, negative has more "power" than positive. It goes like this: Take negative feedback as X , positive feedback as Y, and rating as Z . Now you can calculate the rating as Z= Y-(2^X). Taking an example of one negative and one positive it goes like - Rating= 1-(2¹) => 1-2 => -1 . There you have it.

And something that I forgot to add before, say there is an individual who is on the trust list of an user who is on your trust list. It follows that he will be on your trust ist, if you have the default setting of depth as 1 . Now if for some reason, you don't trust that individual's feedbacks/opinions , you can exclude him(and as a result anyone under him, unless you manually add them) by using "~" before his name and then adding him. And if you want to trust someone whose name begins with a tilde, prefix(add before) their name with a backslash.

[Timelord2067]

It was due to the removal of escrow.ms from the DT, you too are removed from DT 2 so everyone will view your feedbacks as 'untrusted' unless they have manually added you to their trust list.

can you explain further please? what is escrow.ms? why was I removed? system is bit complicated

escrow.ms happens to be in DT depth 1, he added you on his trust list so you become a member of DT depth 2, since escrow.ms is removed from default trust users then all users added to his trust list including you are removed from depth 2.

@Ejarwan:

You are showing as  20: -0 / +2 on my pages - so, either two users I trust have given you positive trust, or two on the DT1 have given you trust (or one of each)...  I didn't notice what your trust was like previously, but if any sub set of the whole gives each other positive trust, then they will all show green to each other, but neutral or even negative to others.

That's why the scammers all dish out trust to other scammers so rapidly.

lazlopanaflex 10: -0 / +1   2015-04-24   0.01300000      Bought some more keys, smooth deal!
lazlopanaflex 10: -0 / +1   2014-11-21   0.00000000      Bought some Steam keys, great seller here
NLNico 22: -0 / +3   2014-06-02   0.03400000   Reference   I bought a Steam game of him. His Steam profile looked trustworthy so I sent first. Transaction went smooth, got game quick. TY.

Either these two are DT1, *OR* I trust someone who trusts them who trusts you.

One person I thought was DT1/2 has taken a huge hit and dropped about 100 from what they were before.

1st edit

The obvious one on your trust was master-p - his trust is gone, so who he trusted is also gone.

2nd edit

similarly, all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again.  (Something the scammers themselves seem to be mercifully unaware of)

[Quickseller]

similarly, all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again.  (Something the scammers themselves seem to be mercifully unaware of)

I have actually been off of the default trust network for several months now.

In the days after I was officially removed there were a very high number of scammer accounts that logged in after several months of inactivity, many of which made additional scam attempts

[mexxer-2]

similarly, all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again.  (Something the scammers themselves seem to be mercifully unaware of)

QS has been out of DT 2 since September   BTW not to be a douchebag but I believe this explanation suffices: here

[Winalunt]

all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and

why are they untrusted ? because the community didn't said Normal to what he thinks is normal.It means that there was an abuse going on in the name of scam busting etc...So that is fake.Exceptions aside.

all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again. 

It is pretty normal if the user's are removed from DT cause the person's ratings are unique and made according to his judgments ,which might be crap to others.

No-one can stop all the scams.The current DT guy's are doing very good.

[Timelord2067]

all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and

why are they untrusted ? because the community didn't said Normal to what he thinks is normal.It means that there was an abuse going on in the name of scam busting etc...So that is fake.Exceptions aside.

all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again. 

It is pretty normal if the user's are removed from DT cause the person's ratings are unique and made according to his judgments ,which might be crap to others.

No-one can stop all the scams.The current DT guy's are doing very good.

While the feedback was from a DT the trust at left ( left is that way <---- ) showed as red, it discouraged all but the most new, or fool hardy.  With the red no longer there, a greater percentage of not so new get enticed and we end up reading about it in the scam accusation pages.

[Timelord2067]

similarly, all the scammer notations made by *just* Quickseller are now un-trusted and all the scammer's accounts are now showing neutral again.  (Something the scammers themselves seem to be mercifully unaware of)

QS has been out of DT 2 since September   BTW not to be a douchebag but I believe this explanation suffices: here

Oh yes... That reminds me...

   |   Quickseller, Panthers52, ACCTseller, QS banned   |   Red trust.   |   here and here   |   Athertle   |   None.

I should get a nod for pointing out QS banned is a self admitted Alt of Panthers52, ACCTseller etc https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1206112.msg13732759#msg13732759