Why Socialism is the key

[craked5]

No there is none. Or at least nobody created another one. The violence of the system is here to compensate the greed and the individualism of humans.

Wow that is ignorance. So because there is none created that means that we should never try creating one, that is what you are basically saying.

Imagine if Edison or Tesla would have said that when they invented stuff. If a lightbulb doesnt exist, it means we should not try inventing one, lets all use candlesticks forever.

Meh? Don't you know how to read?
Or at least nobody created another one. != So because there is none created that means that we should never try creating one

But hey, you keep saying shit so that's not really a surprise ^^

[craked5]

Please explain me how a company with no need of huge profits and no greedy shareholders taking away on average 40% of the income is not able to produce a good or service for cheaper than a private company?

Lol. I love how you're so cocksure about this. Seems somewhat logical on the surface, I do agree. Socialism is a cute idea where those greedy capitalists aren't taking everything for themselves, right? Oddly, greed still exists even if you try and outlaw it. All you're doing in Socialism is restricting or completely banning competition with the state services. If the market (millions of individuals acting for their own self interests) isn't allowed to determine the natural price levels, then you're just giving that job to people who claim they know better than those individuals (centralizing the job of economic calculation). Being a person here discussing Bitcoin and decentralization, how the fuck do you not see that markets are decentralized and socialism is centralized? Communism just happens to be the most centralized form.

What? No! That's communism! Wtf are you talking about? Stop writing if you don't know what you're talking about!

[btcbug]

What? No! That's communism! Wtf are you talking about? Stop writing if you don't know what you're talking about!

Wrong. I'll clarify for you. I said: "...Socialism is restricting or completely banning competition with the state services"

Socialist economies are not all identical. In most, private enterprise is still allowed to compete, however people that opt for the private services are still forced to pay for the public services through taxes.

You're limiting the market when you tax for things like healthcare, schools, etc. because it is less likely that people will be willing to get private healthcare or education when they're already forced to pay for the public offerings through taxes. These private services then become only available to the wealthy who can justify paying twice.

You can have your Socialist oriented businesses in a free market and we won't force you to pay for anything else. Free markets respect individual choice. Socialists on the other hand, insist that everyone pay for their schemes because they are so well intentioned. The individual is demonized and made out to be an ignorant, greedy, fool with no concern for his fellow man. Socialists always no best!

[MedaR]

Ok so you care about people around you, fine. And you think there is no other way of doing that without violence and a system based on theft?

Because if you really care about people around you, you would not want them subjected to this violent system.

Socialism is by nature humane society. But those who become leaders soon establish themselves as dictators. Capitalism from start is unfair system, hidden dictatorship from certain power groups. Kapital don't like active participation only his purpose is gaining more value and in this task is merciless. This naturally lead to imperialism we called globalisation.
Capitalism and democracy have nothing common.
Democracy is a socialist game, totally furnished against freedom. The state always wins in every election.
Socialism is facing to the man and his progress and prosperity.
Capitalism only cares for money.

[phibay]

There is a very important distinction with socialism the economic model and socialism the governing model. I think a world of economic socialism to a certain degree is a good thing without the corrupt-able government given too much control.

[RealBitcoin]

Ok so you care about people around you, fine. And you think there is no other way of doing that without violence and a system based on theft?

Because if you really care about people around you, you would not want them subjected to this violent system.

Socialism is by nature humane society. But those who become leaders soon establish themselves as dictators. Capitalism from start is unfair system, hidden dictatorship from certain power groups. Kapital don't like active participation only his purpose is gaining more value and in this task is merciless. This naturally lead to imperialism we called globalisation.
Capitalism and democracy have nothing common.
Democracy is a socialist game, totally furnished against freedom. The state always wins in every election.
Socialism is facing to the man and his progress and prosperity.
Capitalism only cares for money.

So the socialists are not globalists?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_International


Besides capitalism  = evolution, human progress towards prosperity. If only socialists would let it happen, we would already be intergalactic.

[valta4065]

Besides capitalism  = evolution, human progress towards prosperity. If only socialists would let it happen, we would already be intergalactic.

Yeah sure. It's all thanks to capitalism only. Socialism countries never invent anything! Look at France: this country never invented anything!

[RealBitcoin]

Besides capitalism  = evolution, human progress towards prosperity. If only socialists would let it happen, we would already be intergalactic.

Yeah sure. It's all thanks to capitalism only. Socialism countries never invent anything! Look at France: this country never invented anything!

That is true, everythin in the soviet union that was invented, like half of the money was already stolen, so it could have been invented 10x faster in other places.

America kept up with many inventions since the 50's and there was 0 corruption because it was done from private money. But when it's done from public money, then usually half of it is stolen.

So that is a huge waste, and if you want to put watchdogs on the funds,then that costs you even more to police them.


So why not give up this whole silly socialist ideas, and embrace private property 100%.

[valta4065]

Besides capitalism  = evolution, human progress towards prosperity. If only socialists would let it happen, we would already be intergalactic.

Yeah sure. It's all thanks to capitalism only. Socialism countries never invent anything! Look at France: this country never invented anything!

That is true, everythin in the soviet union that was invented, like half of the money was already stolen, so it could have been invented 10x faster in other places.

Cause Soviet Union was socialist of course

America kept up with many inventions since the 50's and there was 0 corruption because it was done from private money. But when it's done from public money, then usually half of it is stolen.

So that is a huge waste, and if you want to put watchdogs on the funds,then that costs you even more to police them.


So why not give up this whole silly socialist ideas, and embrace private property 100%.

Don't know. Maybe because it doesn't work? In which area is USA the first exactly? Appart from number of prisonners (because your glorious free market transformed prisons in a market like any other) and number of people who believe in angels? (because your glorious freedom allows sects to operate freely in the USA)

[btcbug]

Cause Soviet Union was socialist of course

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union


Damnit some of you guys are very illiterate about your own beliefs, you should research it more before supporting it.

Let's also not forget the Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party aka NAZI

Two sides of the same coin. Two wings of the same bird. However you want to say it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party

Communism vs Nazism = Socialists with conflicting ideals. That's all.

[MedaR]

Socialism was response from mass of people, unemployed poor and without hope. Same story was with "NAZY" after WW1, yes this is also (national) socialism, right wing.
I wonder which system will be best for American people after great economic collapse? When history repeat itself.
You are not aware how socialist movement was strong in US before WW2.

[Fatman3001]

Cause Soviet Union was socialist of course

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union


Damnit some of you guys are very illiterate about your own beliefs, you should research it more before supporting it.

Let's also not forget the Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party aka NAZI

Two sides of the same coin. Two wings of the same bird. However you want to say it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party

Communism vs Nazism = Socialists with conflicting ideals. That's all.

The immensity of your ignorance is causing me physical pain.

[valta4065]

Cause Soviet Union was socialist of course

USSR = Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union


Damnit some of you guys are very illiterate about your own beliefs, you should research it more before supporting it.

Let's also not forget the Nationalist Socialist German Workers Party aka NAZI

Two sides of the same coin. Two wings of the same bird. However you want to say it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party

Communism vs Nazism = Socialists with conflicting ideals. That's all.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH xD

Stop that! You going to kill me xD

You can't seriously be thinking this are you?

You can't have that amount of ignorance!

I'll try to help you. Even if you clearly don't deserve it.

Oxford definition of socialism:
A political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Ok now try to explain me how USSR or Nazis were socialists.

[Laosai]

America kept up with many inventions since the 50's and there was 0 corruption because it was done from private money. But when it's done from public money, then usually half of it is stolen.

Of course there was no corruption in science. You can't corrupt people who are already corrupted.

But you can make your whole population pay for it that's for sure!

Anyway, as long as you don't care seeing 80% of the next generation enable to get an education, I suppose capitalism is the best thing that can happen to you. You'll have cheap tv and food. And your new Iphone. What a glorious invention! True symbol of capitalism success! A useless 4 years late phone that is sold to everyone for 8 times the fabrication price.

[RealBitcoin]

Oxford definition of socialism:
A political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Ok now try to explain me how USSR or Nazis were socialists.

Your oxford definition fits exactly to gulags. Sorry but socialism is a mental ilness , or just plain evil people support it.

All the gulags and genocide that happened under those evil regimes is exactly the fruit of it.

People are dumb and support every kind of crazy idea: from UFO idiots ,to believers in shapeshifters, to ghost hunters, all kind of crazy people.

Socialists are the same kind of people.

[RealBitcoin]

America kept up with many inventions since the 50's and there was 0 corruption because it was done from private money. But when it's done from public money, then usually half of it is stolen.

Of course there was no corruption in science. You can't corrupt people who are already corrupted.

But you can make your whole population pay for it that's for sure!

Anyway, as long as you don't care seeing 80% of the next generation enable to get an education, I suppose capitalism is the best thing that can happen to you. You'll have cheap tv and food. And your new Iphone. What a glorious invention! True symbol of capitalism success! A useless 4 years late phone that is sold to everyone for 8 times the fabrication price.

I`m not specifically a supporter of consumerism, that is just a byproduct of dumb people.

Yes i`m capitalist, but i havent changed my phone in 6 years, i dont give a crap about trends, those are only for dumb people.

So it's not my fault that a dumb person meets capitalism and reacts to it accordingly.

It's like if you get a caveman and send him into a supermarket, of course he will behave dumb.

So it doesnt matter what system you have if you have dumb people everywhere, but at least make sure that the system itself is not evil.

[Laosai]

America kept up with many inventions since the 50's and there was 0 corruption because it was done from private money. But when it's done from public money, then usually half of it is stolen.

Of course there was no corruption in science. You can't corrupt people who are already corrupted.

But you can make your whole population pay for it that's for sure!

Anyway, as long as you don't care seeing 80% of the next generation enable to get an education, I suppose capitalism is the best thing that can happen to you. You'll have cheap tv and food. And your new Iphone. What a glorious invention! True symbol of capitalism success! A useless 4 years late phone that is sold to everyone for 8 times the fabrication price.

I`m not specifically a supporter of consumerism, that is just a byproduct of dumb people.

Yes i`m capitalist, but i havent changed my phone in 6 years, i dont give a crap about trends, those are only for dumb people.

So it's not my fault that a dumb person meets capitalism and reacts to it accordingly.

It's like if you get a caveman and send him into a supermarket, of course he will behave dumb.

So it doesnt matter what system you have if you have dumb people everywhere, but at least make sure that the system itself is not evil.

Yes it does matter. Because your system can encourage consumerism or not. It can encourage people manipulation or not.
Free market without regulation encourages manipulation.

[valta4065]

Oxford definition of socialism:
A political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Ok now try to explain me how USSR or Nazis were socialists.

Your oxford definition fits exactly to gulags. Sorry but socialism is a mental ilness , or just plain evil people support it.

All the gulags and genocide that happened under those evil regimes is exactly the fruit of it.

People are dumb and support every kind of crazy idea: from UFO idiots ,to believers in shapeshifters, to ghost hunters, all kind of crazy people.

Socialists are the same kind of people.

No. Absolutely not. I don't even understand how you can say something like this. USSR was a dictatorship nothing else. the means of production weren't in the hand of the community but of a small elite!

[RealBitcoin]

Yes it does matter. Because your system can encourage consumerism or not. It can encourage people manipulation or not.
Free market without regulation encourages manipulation.

And with regulation it encourages bribery and special privileges for the elite that bribe them.

Which will be a detriment to all other folks who have to follow the regulations that the bribed regulators give out.

[RealBitcoin]

Yes it does matter. Because your system can encourage consumerism or not. It can encourage people manipulation or not.
Free market without regulation encourages manipulation.

Ok so which one is worse:

An unregulated bitcoin with a few scams here and there, probably not losing more than 1 million $ /week.

Or a heavily regulated fiat economy, that still manages to build up the largest central bank ponzi scheme ever, losing people trillions of $ /day.


Which one is more preferable?  Your very regulated ponzi pension scheme being wiped out in a few years after the next economic collapse, or having a few scam bitcoin investments that only lose a small % of money for investors.


I think it's obvious, an unregulated market is not perfect because humans are like that. But when you start regulating things, you are putting the same evil rules to be followed, just that now it becomes mandatory.


Sorry bur regulation is evil, things have to be free as they are, because wherever humans put their dirty hands on, it becomes more fucked up than before.